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Graphics Card Recommendation (Cooling)

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January 9, 2010 6:44:53 PM

Okay so i bought an XFX 4870 and that was overheating along with the CPU when gaming hardcore. In the end the fan wasn't spinning at all.

Now I'm looking for something with a good performance and better cooling than i had with the 4870. My personal choice is the Nvidia GeForce GTX275 as i don't really want to go over £150...

Any Advice or recommendations?

Thanks

My system Specs:

MSI K9A2VM-FD 780V Socket AM2+
AMD Athlon 64 X2 6000 Dual Core AM2 1MB 3.1GHz
Coolermaster 700W Power Supply
4 GB Geil RAM DDR2 800
Inno3D 9500GT 1GB
X FI Xtreme Gamer
Soprano Thermal take Case
a b U Graphics card
January 9, 2010 8:02:27 PM

So, your 4870 and CPU were overheating during hardcore gaming. You say "In the end the fan wasn't spinning at all" but which fan are you speaking of? I have to assume the GPU fan, in which case you either had a faulty fan on your card or have very poor ventilation in your case, and by the time you got around to opening the case to take a look, already killed your card with the heat accumulation.

Heat has to go somewhere, and if you don't have proper case ventilation (obvious if BOTH your GPU and CPU are overheating during gaming) any card you purchase will repeat the experience you had with the 4870. Even if you get a good rear venting video card, improper ventilation will cause the same issue as heat still radiates from the back of your card, and straight up into your CPU HSF. You have an XFX video card, do you not also have a double lifetime warranty? I was under the impression (from your currency) that you are in England, and AFAIK the double lifetime warranty applies there, too.

Your card wasn't the problem, it was a symptom. You will repeat this issue until you improve your case ventilation. Add a couple 120mm fans (try to balance intake/exhaust pressure) to your case, make good on the XFX warranty, and you shouldn't have to spend very much to return to consistent gaming.

Cooling on a specific device is MEANINGLESS if you have a case that holds in the heat. Good case ventilation will make even devices with poor cooling systems run fine, but the best cooling solution for a videocard will do NOTHING if your case is enveloping it in hot air.
January 9, 2010 8:20:09 PM

JofaMang said:
So, your 4870 and CPU were overheating during hardcore gaming. You say "In the end the fan wasn't spinning at all" but which fan are you speaking of? I have to assume the GPU fan, in which case you either had a faulty fan on your card or have very poor ventilation in your case, and by the time you got around to opening the case to take a look, already killed your card with the heat accumulation.

Heat has to go somewhere, and if you don't have proper case ventilation (obvious if BOTH your GPU and CPU are overheating during gaming) any card you purchase will repeat the experience you had with the 4870. Even if you get a good rear venting video card, improper ventilation will cause the same issue as heat still radiates from the back of your card, and straight up into your CPU HSF. You have an XFX video card, do you not also have a double lifetime warranty? I was under the impression (from your currency) that you are in England, and AFAIK the double lifetime warranty applies there, too.

Your card wasn't the problem, it was a symptom. You will repeat this issue until you improve your case ventilation. Add a couple 120mm fans (try to balance intake/exhaust pressure) to your case, make good on the XFX warranty, and you shouldn't have to spend very much to return to consistent gaming.

Cooling on a specific device is MEANINGLESS if you have a case that holds in the heat. Good case ventilation will make even devices with poor cooling systems run fine, but the best cooling solution for a videocard will do NOTHING if your case is enveloping it in hot air.


Alrite here's the full story...
I have 2 120 mm fans in my case one at the front and back and one 80mm fan on the side of the case. When i first started using the 4870 it would run to about 80 degrees and would cause the CPU to overheat ending in a shutdown from the alarm alerting me that the temperature of the CPU had hit 80 degrees. I decided to get another heatsink and went with the Zalman CNPS 9500 LED. Of course that made no difference. i then updated the power supply from an AKASA 500W to a 700W. Again that made little difference. I even bought a separate VGA cooler which took up 2 slots. My CPU was still overheating after 1 hour of gameplay. The final thing i did was to apply thermal arctic silver paste to the GPU. When i plugged the card back in. The fan wasnt spinning. So yea i'll definitely RMA the card. What i was told on another thread is that my particular model which is an XFX 4870 doesnt blow air at the back efficiently which is the probable cause of the overheat. To tell you the truth i've spent so much money on trying to solve the problem that im looking for something new altogether...
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a c 376 U Graphics card
January 9, 2010 8:37:13 PM

A GTX 275 will give off more heat than the HD4870. It's also quite overpriced. Can you even find one for the £150 you mentioned? They seem to start around £180.
For something actually within your budget that is on par with the GTX 275 but much cheaper an HD4890 would be a good choice;
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX...
Another card worth looking at is the HD5770. It's as powerful as the HD4870 but unlike all the other cards mentioned it is both DX11 compatible and very power efficient/cool;
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/186468
a c 1385 U Graphics card
January 9, 2010 8:42:41 PM

ChrissyMidnite said:
Alrite here's the full story...
I have 2 120 mm fans in my case one at the front and back and one 80mm fan on the side of the case. When i first started using the 4870 it would run to about 80 degrees and would cause the CPU to overheat ending in a shutdown from the alarm alerting me that the temperature of the CPU had hit 80 degrees. I decided to get another heatsink and went with the Zalman CNPS 9500 LED. Of course that made no difference. i then updated the power supply from an AKASA 500W to a 700W. Again that made little difference. I even bought a separate VGA cooler which took up 2 slots. My CPU was still overheating after 1 hour of gameplay. The final thing i did was to apply thermal arctic silver paste to the GPU. When i plugged the card back in. The fan wasnt spinning. So yea i'll definitely RMA the card. What i was told on another thread is that my particular model which is an XFX 4870 doesnt blow air at the back efficiently which is the probable cause of the overheat. To tell you the truth i've spent so much money on trying to solve the problem that im looking for something new altogether...

With all these fans you should not have an heating issue unless they are all blowing the same way!
January 9, 2010 8:44:31 PM

jyjjy said:
A GTX 275 will give off more heat than the HD4870. It's also quite overpriced. Can you even find one for the £150 you mentioned? They seem to start around £180.
For something actually within your budget that is on par with the GTX 275 but much cheaper an HD4890 would be a good choice;
http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=GX...
Another card worth looking at is the HD5770. It's as powerful as the HD4870 but unlike all the other cards mentioned it is both DX11 compatible and very power efficient/cool;
http://www.ebuyer.com/product/186468


yea your right i had a look earlier the GTX 275 is about £197 way overpriced. The HD5770 you mentioned does sound interesting but what troubles me is that the cooler fitted on looks the EXACT same as the XFX 4870. I'll definately check out the reviews and see what they say about the cooling on that one. Thanks for pointing me in the right direction
January 9, 2010 8:52:10 PM

rolli59 said:
With all these fans you should not have an heating issue unless they are all blowing the same way!


haha yea you would think it would cool things down. And the thing is my CPU sometimes used to hit as low as 27 degrees upon startup with the 4870 and idled around 37degrees. Its just as soon as u run Dirt 2 or Modern Warfare 2 at 1920x1080 it hits to 80 degrees after about 45 minutes...
a c 376 U Graphics card
January 9, 2010 8:53:17 PM

Even if the cooler is the same the HD5770 uses approximately half the power of the HD4870 which translates directly into how much heat is given off by the card.
a c 230 U Graphics card
January 9, 2010 9:52:54 PM

The 275 doesn't have a good price performance ratio. Plug ya budget into the list below:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-310-5970,24...

Here's the "winners" from THG's latest (December) GFX Roundup
Best Graphics Cards For The Money: December '09

$50 - HD 4650
$65 - HD 4670 / 9600 GSO
$85 - 9600 GT
$95 - 9600 GT / HD 4830
$110 - GTS 250 512 MB
$120 - GTS 250 1 GB
$155 - HD 5770 / GTX 260
$200 - HD 4890
$240 - 2 x GTS 250
$310 - No winner (HD 5850 Honorable Mention)
$330 - 2 x GTX 260 / 2 x HD 5770
$400 - 2 x HD 4890
$410 - No winner (HD 5870 Honorable Mention)
$465 - No winner (GTX 295 Honorable Mention)
$625 - No winner (HD 5970 Honorable Mention)

However, I gotta add that the 5770's price has bumped up the cost of the competition. Instead of $155, the 260 and 4870 are now selling for $170-$180 US making all 3 of them rather poor choices for the money, the 5770 most of all as it's beat handily by both the 260 and 4870. I'd look at the 4890, GTS 250 and 5850.

Here's a good read on the subject ....

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3658&p=14

January 9, 2010 9:56:00 PM

JackNaylorPE said:
The 275 doesn't have a good price performance ratio. Plug ya budget into the list below:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/geforce-310-5970,24...

Here's the "winners" from THG's latest (December) GFX Roundup
Best Graphics Cards For The Money: December '09

$50 - HD 4650
$65 - HD 4670 / 9600 GSO
$85 - 9600 GT
$95 - 9600 GT / HD 4830
$110 - GTS 250 512 MB
$120 - GTS 250 1 GB
$155 - HD 5770 / GTX 260
$200 - HD 4890
$240 - 2 x GTS 250
$310 - No winner (HD 5850 Honorable Mention)
$330 - 2 x GTX 260 / 2 x HD 5770
$400 - 2 x HD 4890
$410 - No winner (HD 5870 Honorable Mention)
$465 - No winner (GTX 295 Honorable Mention)
$625 - No winner (HD 5970 Honorable Mention)

However, I gotta add that the 5770's price has bumped up the cost of the competition. Instead of $155, the 260 and 4870 are now selling for $170-$180 US making all 3 of them rather poor choices for the money, the 5770 most of all as it's beat handily by both the 260 and 4870. I'd look at the 4890, GTS 250 and 5850.

Here's a good read on the subject ....

http://www.anandtech.com/video/showdoc.aspx?i=3658&p=14


Thanks
Which one would you say has the best cooling with performance equal to the 4870?
a b U Graphics card
January 9, 2010 10:10:29 PM

the new 5 series cards run MUCH cooler than the 4 series cards. the fan is similar, but it has to disspiate much less heat, so you get a much cooler rig.

if you are still concerned, grab a card with an aftermarket cooler on it. such as the vapor-x series.
a c 376 U Graphics card
January 9, 2010 11:00:23 PM

Don't just look at jack's link, almost every other tech site loved the card and the initial reviews are based upon beta drivers compared to fully mature drivers for the other two card. With the price increases of its direct competition(which he bafflingly claims was caused by the HD5770) and it's DX11 support/great power efficiency the card is the obvious choice in its price/performance area.
January 9, 2010 11:04:26 PM

jyjjy said:
Don't just look at jack's link, almost every other tech site loved the card and the initial reviews are based upon beta drivers compared to fully mature drivers for the other two card. With the price increases of its direct competition(which he bafflingly claims was caused by the HD5770) and it's DX11 support/great power efficiency the card is the obvious choice in its price/performance area.


Yeah so far i'm definitely leaning towards a 5000 series because of the cooling... Although performance for the 5770 isn't as good as the 4870 but I can live with that.
a c 376 U Graphics card
January 9, 2010 11:10:48 PM

Keep in mind the card does easily OC to performance levels well above the HD4870 at stock.
January 9, 2010 11:12:48 PM

jyjjy said:
Keep in mind the card does easily OC to performance levels well above the HD4870 at stock.


I'm completely new to Overclocking... Is that using ATI overdrive?
a c 376 U Graphics card
January 9, 2010 11:14:58 PM

Yeah, you can use overdrive which makes it exceedingly easy. You may get better results using something else but it should still give a nice OC.
a c 230 U Graphics card
January 10, 2010 2:58:09 PM

jyjjy said:
Don't just look at jack's link, almost every other tech site loved the card and the initial reviews are based upon beta drivers compared to fully mature drivers for the other two card. With the price increases of its direct competition(which he bafflingly claims was caused by the HD5770) and it's DX11 support/great power efficiency the card is the obvious choice in its price/performance area.


Driver's won't solve the bandwidth problem. Anandtech and others liked the 5750 but the 5770's proce point puts it in no man's land:

"Our jobs would be made much easier if AMD had either made the 5770 perform at parity with the 4870, or made the 5770 cheaper. Right now on a good deal we can swing a 4870 for $140, while the 5770 will be sticking to $160. That’s 14% more for a card that performs 10% worse. If we take a linear extrapolation, the 5770 needs to be at around $130 to win on performance alone, or at the very least $140 so that we can talk solely about the 10% performance loss versus the extra functionality of the 5770."

The 5770 has climbed even higher in price now, pulling the 4870 and 260 along with it. For that reason, it's hard to recommend any of the cards least of all the slowest performer the 5770. I'd either bump up or down 1 category to get away from the gouging.


a c 376 U Graphics card
January 10, 2010 7:28:36 PM

Drivers of course do not increase memory bandwidth but they should still increase performance. Once again your quote is based on outdated prices from months ago. The HD5770 is now cheaper, not more expensive and far from "gouging" at $150. It's the HD4870 and GTX 260 that have gone up in price and no longer make sense really. If the HD4870 was still $140-150 then you would have a point but those prices don't help anyone looking to buy a card now.
January 10, 2010 7:35:43 PM

The key feature I'm looking for is cooling and the 5770 looks like its definitely a winner for that even if the it lacks a little behind the 4870 on performance. But I'll take a difference in 20 fps over a CPU overheating and with the Sapphire model with the hot air coming from the back it really looks like it could make a difference. I've tried everything to cool down the CPU with the 4000 series so i'll give the 5770 a shot :) 
Thanks for all the help
!