To me FPS is overrated. I have 5870s in crossfire and to me the more fps means ALOT more heat and to me you can't tell the difference over 60fps. For instance I was playing fear 2 with vsync off and getting over 200 fps with temps well in the 80s. I turned vsync on where I was getting 60fps and temps never got over 70C. I couldn't tell the difference in gameplay either. I have a ASUS VH242 23.6" monitor 1920x1080 60hz refresh rate. I turn vsync on in every game I play now. Also I probably have overkill too with 2 5870s in crossfire for now but I should be in pretty good shape as far as future proof goes. Does anybody agree??
- Apr 29, 2006
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They should have looked exactly the same. 200FPS means diddly when you have it hooked up to your monitor. This is because if your monitor can only show 60FPS, it doesn't matter if your computer can render more then that. If your computer can render 180FPS, you'll only see every third frame in the game. In this case, Vsync on or off shouldn't change what you see.
I agree with WA1. Running a single 5870 at 1080 is fine. I doubt you'd need more then that right now.
I agree with WA1. Running a single 5870 at 1080 is fine. I doubt you'd need more then that right now.
Waited too long to return it back to newegg. I'm new at this, it's first build. Learning as I go. I'm just gonna keep it I reckon for the future (just paid alot more now than I would have later on!). Are there even any computer monitors that have over 60hz refresh rate at there recommended resolution?
Also does every monitor get bad flicker when you run way over 60fps with 60hz refresh rate?
Also does every monitor get bad flicker when you run way over 60fps with 60hz refresh rate?
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I'm not sure of any LCDs that do. There should be some 75 and possibly 120Hz monitors but they will be expensive.
I also don't know of any flicker like you mention. I've never seen it. Any chance your talking about tearing? If you don't know what I'm talking about, either read a guide or just leave Vsync on.
I also don't know of any flicker like you mention. I've never seen it. Any chance your talking about tearing? If you don't know what I'm talking about, either read a guide or just leave Vsync on.
Ok. It's flicker. Not tearing. I see it before the game even starts but It no issue with vsync on. It happens because my monitor can't render over 60fps.
But to another issue what is up with crysis and crysis warhead (the 2 games I cant max out with my 5870 crossfire). I get worse fps in crossfire than with 1 card???
But to another issue what is up with crysis and crysis warhead (the 2 games I cant max out with my 5870 crossfire). I get worse fps in crossfire than with 1 card???
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jyjjy
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30 fps is usually considered the goal for smooth gaming, anything above your refresh rate is entirely meaningless. Even if you get a monitor with a refresh above 60hz I doubt you will notice a real difference on frame rates over 60 anyway. If you don't need 2 HD5870s(and you shouldn't) just put the second up on Ebay. You can probably get $400ish for it.
- Jul 24, 2006
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That's still not right. 60FPS is noticeably smoother than 30FPS, and most certainly 24FPS as well, unless you have vision impairment.
MagicPants
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- Jun 16, 2006
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Old issue but basically film and tv can get away with 24 fps because of motion blur. The camera actually records everything that happened during that 1/24th of a second.
In a game each frame only shows what is happening at a single point in time. In order to do motion blur in games you'd need to re render each frame. I don't see why nvidia or ati doesn't do this though as it seems like your video card is three times faster than it needs to to be.
In a game each frame only shows what is happening at a single point in time. In order to do motion blur in games you'd need to re render each frame. I don't see why nvidia or ati doesn't do this though as it seems like your video card is three times faster than it needs to to be.
warmon6
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I certainly dont notice a difference between 30 and 60 FPS.
Although i fine this site very interesting on this matter
http://www.100fps.com/how_many_frames_can_humans_see.htm
sayantan
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all the movies whether on a dvd or BR produces video at 30fps,25fps,24fps depending upon the format but not more than 30fps...besides xbox360 also locks the fps at 30...so why lock fps to 30 if you can really see whats happening within 1/60 th of a second?????????????????I hope you guys won't tell xbox doesn't offers smoth gaming experience!!!
Kari
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whether you can tell a difference between 30 and 60fps or not, has alot to do with the monitor you are using. 2ms gtg means absolutely nothing when the real world transitions take like 20-30ms... try it with crt and see the difference (and have the refresh rate at 85Hz or 100Hz so it won't flicker)
edit: xbox feels 'smooth' because it's constant 30, but try playing a game which drops from over 60 to 30 and you should feel the difference...
(and have the refresh rate at 85Hz or 100Hz so it won't flicker)edit: xbox feels 'smooth' because it's constant 30, but try playing a game which drops from over 60 to 30 and you should feel the difference...
Pailin
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Everyone is a little different...
Most people assume they are all the same as they see themselves.
Most people are Very happy believing all are equal. It makes the World a very easy safe place to live, peacefully I hope.
We all watch our TV's that refresh the Screen at 60Hz (or at least remember the older tech ones we used to have) and find it works just great right...???
It was not so for me when I saw them for the 1st time.
I grew up on a boat with no TV in Malta
Then later moved to the Isle of Man when I was 6 where we got a TV...
I clearly remember watching this thing, or trying to - It had Such a terrible flicker to me, I mean REALLY bad, almost like when you are tuning a TV and the "frames" start cycling up or down!!! It was painful to watch...
Now there was nothing wrong with the TV, same on others for me - as everyone else accepted it without complaint, I assumed it was just how things were and took them for what they were.
To make it watchable I had to adjust my consciousness to slow down temporarily my perception of the world to make the flicker go away LOL
Now I know better and worry that the old 60Hz TV has been damaging the consciousness of the human race - where some may have permanently "slowed" they consciousnesses at a very young age and never recovered or realised what they did to themselves
I won't be buying a 60Hz flat screen, put it this way. Even my 85Hz 22" CRT requires me to "adjust" to not see the flicker. 100Hz is better, but still flickers if I a not careful
Most people assume they are all the same as they see themselves.
Most people are Very happy believing all are equal. It makes the World a very easy safe place to live, peacefully I hope.
We all watch our TV's that refresh the Screen at 60Hz (or at least remember the older tech ones we used to have) and find it works just great right...???
It was not so for me when I saw them for the 1st time.
I grew up on a boat with no TV in Malta
Then later moved to the Isle of Man when I was 6 where we got a TV...
I clearly remember watching this thing, or trying to - It had Such a terrible flicker to me, I mean REALLY bad, almost like when you are tuning a TV and the "frames" start cycling up or down!!! It was painful to watch...
Now there was nothing wrong with the TV, same on others for me - as everyone else accepted it without complaint, I assumed it was just how things were and took them for what they were.
To make it watchable I had to adjust my consciousness to slow down temporarily my perception of the world to make the flicker go away LOL
Now I know better and worry that the old 60Hz TV has been damaging the consciousness of the human race - where some may have permanently "slowed" they consciousnesses at a very young age and never recovered or realised what they did to themselves
I won't be buying a 60Hz flat screen, put it this way. Even my 85Hz 22" CRT requires me to "adjust" to not see the flicker. 100Hz is better, but still flickers if I a not careful
Pailin
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or sell one now while people are still price hiking them over recomeded retail - or at least here in the UK they are still £50 ($81 at current exchange rate) over their initial starting prices
Then buy another again later when they are cheaper when you get a game that needs it and save yourself a bunch of cash
Is a sound plan unless you have games you like that have min FPS dropping too low - in an ideal world I would not want my FPS dropping below 40fps as a min.
Then buy another again later when they are cheaper when you get a game that needs it and save yourself a bunch of cash
Is a sound plan unless you have games you like that have min FPS dropping too low - in an ideal world I would not want my FPS dropping below 40fps as a min.
- Apr 29, 2006
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Interesting argument, but wrong from what I know. MS said you had to program for 720P minimum, so thats 60FPS not 30. In addition, as a closed system we have no idea what they may have done to compensate for low frame rates.
- Jul 24, 2006
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It sure does. I've been trying to upload a mere 70MB youtube video comparing 50FPS and 24FPS (because 24FPS has been mentioned as "smooth" and my HDD gets slaughtered recording 60FPS) but my Internet is so unstable at the moment that after 4 attempts I've still not been able to upload the whole thing.
EDIT: Finally got it, but forgot that youtube transcodes the video to 24FPS anyway, which means I got nowhere...
We covered that already. Movies have motion blur, they aren't comparable to games (which generally have no motion blur or very poor motion blur that ends up making it worse).
Well for starters, you can't make fast movements on a console anyway. Thumbsticks restrict you to turning like a sloth.
That's debatable. I've seen games bring an xbox down below 20FPS many times.
sayantan
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Bitchin' Fast! 3D 2000 :"Well for starters, you can't make fast movements on a console anyway. Thumbsticks restrict you to turning like a sloth."
well it maybe,you should also know that reflex of our brain lies somewhere in between 0.15s to 0.2s ,so an fps of10 is also bit high for our brain if you want to react exactly at the 5th frame or 6th or 7th frame or any of the given n th frame.
Lets take an example,you are a sniper and your enemy will appear exactly at the 5th frame and vanishes at next frame ,where each frame exists on screen for 0.1 s...I bet you wont be able to shoot him unless you use an automatic assault rifle....
so 10 fps is more than enough for your reflexes.....but certainly not enough for the visual perception....
therefore fast movement or reflex has nothing to do with visual perception.....don't mix them up....thats all..
well it maybe,you should also know that reflex of our brain lies somewhere in between 0.15s to 0.2s ,so an fps of10 is also bit high for our brain if you want to react exactly at the 5th frame or 6th or 7th frame or any of the given n th frame.
Lets take an example,you are a sniper and your enemy will appear exactly at the 5th frame and vanishes at next frame ,where each frame exists on screen for 0.1 s...I bet you wont be able to shoot him unless you use an automatic assault rifle....
so 10 fps is more than enough for your reflexes.....but certainly not enough for the visual perception....
therefore fast movement or reflex has nothing to do with visual perception.....don't mix them up....thats all..
- Jul 24, 2006
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I'm not talking about reflexes. I'm talking about smoothness of motion (or lack thereof) as a result of speed of motion. If you pan a camcorder that records at 10FPS very slowly, it will appear to be smooth. If you increase the speed that you pan the camera, it will no longer be smooth unless you increase the framerate or add motion blur. The reason is because the brain can't interpolate what happened in between each frame and persistence of vision isn't adequate either, as the frames are too infrequent.
I personally find anything below 40 fps to be very difficult on me. I usually get motion sickness below 40 fps. 30 fps may be smooth, but it is much harder on constitution than 40+ fps.
The human eye can detect a difference up to 1000 fps in the right situations. Anyways, here is an artical that explains some of the things you are refering to: http://www.100fps.com/how_many_frames_can_humans_see.htm
The human eye can detect a difference up to 1000 fps in the right situations. Anyways, here is an artical that explains some of the things you are refering to: http://www.100fps.com/how_many_frames_can_humans_see.htm
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