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System Builder Marathon, December 2010: $500 PC

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Anonymous
December 17, 2010 4:00:03 AM

We've already seen results from Thomas' $2000 PC and Don's $1000 build. Now it's time for Paul's $500 machine to take the stage, showing what an Athlon II X3 can do when it's matched up to a GeForce GTX 460. Can it deliver better value than the others?

System Builder Marathon, December 2010: $500 PC : Read more

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December 17, 2010 4:25:19 AM

And this is really the only PC build that will stay relevant come January- it will remain the only budget platform that can be overclocked, after all.

Incidentally, this would be the only PC you'd want to contemplate building right now (since the new Core i3s don't come out immediately like the i5s and i7s do- and the Pentium G8XX series doesn't allow overclocking of its platform.)
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December 17, 2010 4:27:43 AM

Ah, much better than the previous build!
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December 17, 2010 4:55:18 AM

Great job squeezing everything into a very small budget.
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December 17, 2010 4:59:55 AM

Good build - but again it would be good to see old spec on test system page.
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December 17, 2010 4:59:56 AM

That is a great combination for that budget. Balanced.
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December 17, 2010 5:04:38 AM

I wouldn't be very comfortable using a 380 watt PSU for a long time for GTX 460 even if it is good quality. Perhaps, I would put in something of 450 watt or higher.
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December 17, 2010 5:48:58 AM

LuckyDucky7And this is really the only PC build that will stay relevant come January- it will remain the only budget platform that can be overclocked, after all.Incidentally, this would be the only PC you'd want to contemplate building right now (since the new Core i3s don't come out immediately like the i5s and i7s do- and the Pentium G8XX series doesn't allow overclocking of its platform.)
So you think there's going to be a replacement platform for the $2000 PC in January? That's not going to happen for a while. Or are you suggesting the next $2000 PC should be downgraded to P67?
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December 17, 2010 6:21:26 AM

I haven't been keeping up with the system marathon much, but what's the reasoning for choosing nVidia card over AMD's? Just wondering since I'm thinking about upgrading my computer soon.
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December 17, 2010 6:44:19 AM

A really nice build this time.However the price of the case and power supply has gone up in price over at newegg.I haven't checked the prices of the other components though.This build seems to perform quite well especially in the gaming benchmarks.Good job!
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December 17, 2010 6:45:17 AM

I would've gone with a 6850 instead of the 460. It's a tad cheaper, not at all slower if you don't start cranckin' up the tesselation, and should fit the 380W psu a lot better. But a solid build by all means.
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December 17, 2010 6:49:09 AM

I just noticed you guys used a 768mb 460. Oops. So it's a very good build, the 6850 would go over buget I guess. My bad.
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December 17, 2010 7:04:16 AM

yyk71200I wouldn't be very comfortable using a 380 watt PSU for a long time for GTX 460 even if it is good quality. Perhaps, I would put in something of 450 watt or higher.

No fears here. Keep in mind, this 380W has a higher +12V rating than many 500W units. And, the 280W peak output draw in Prime 95+Furmark is far higher than would ever be seen during normal use.

On the down side it could limit multiple (simultaneous)upgrades such as a hexa-core CPU + additional storage drives. But the EarthWatts 380D has plenty reserve for this system as built.
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December 17, 2010 7:11:55 AM

There are a lot of RAM kits which do include heat spreaders, have higher frequencies, lower CL, and are can be had for less than $65. Was there any particular reason for choosing that set of Mushkin's?
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December 17, 2010 7:18:28 AM

dragoon190I haven't been keeping up with the system marathon much, but what's the reasoning for choosing nVidia card over AMD's? Just wondering since I'm thinking about upgrading my computer
soon.

Basically it was the best available option within budget, trumping the cheaper/less powerful Radeon HD 5770 used back in the June $550 PC: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/cpu-gpu-overclock,2...

If you compare those past results to the current rig, you may notice less CPU limitations and higher framerates at low resolutions for the Radeon HD 5770, but more headroom to push higher resolutions (1080P) with the GeForce GTX 460. Both are fine choices, depending on budget and needs.
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December 17, 2010 7:35:17 AM

karma831There are a lot of RAM kits which do include heat spreaders, have higher frequencies, lower CL, and are can be had for less than $65. Was there any particular reason for choosing that set of Mushkin's?

Purely timing Karma. RAM has dropped significantly since we ordered our components. Ours was $65 at order time which was then the starting point for 4GB kits. Currently, this same kit is $42 on Newegg, and there are a slew of options under $50. Not bad considering prior to September a 4GB kit was $100 or more.

Unlike Thomas, who sought performance for the $2000 build but was duped by receiving different RAM chips than expected, my choice here was purely based on the cheapest option and I hadn't noticed the Easter Egg in the photo. Like him, unfortunately, I received the same "nameless" chips with little headroom for higher frequency.
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Anonymous
December 17, 2010 7:35:50 AM

What about GTS 450? Is it a good choice for this CPU? As it seems that GTX460 is an overkill for lower resolutions :) 
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December 17, 2010 7:49:51 AM

jj463rdA really nice build this time.However the price of the case and power supply has gone up in price over at newegg.I haven't checked the prices of the other components though.This build seems to perform quite well especially in the gaming benchmarks.Good job!

Price fluctuations are bound to happen and for a bit the case was even cheaper yet. The current cost of this system is $512 on Newegg as the cheaper RAM helps balance out.
The bargain shopper would seek substitutions; One option is the EA380D PSU for $45 and a different case. Ex: the Rosewill Blackbone (used in the $400 build) is $40. Alternate GTX 460's could save an additional $20 and get the cost well under $500.
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December 17, 2010 7:52:58 AM

Thank you - Now I have something to compare and recommend - It helps a lot.
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December 17, 2010 7:59:38 AM

tstngI just noticed you guys used a 768mb 460. Oops. So it's a very good build, the 6850 would go over buget I guess. My bad.

Yes true, but more importantly the HD 6850 was not yet available when we ordered, so it wasn't even an option. Thanks to that release, there are now less expensive GTX 460's also than the lone option we had at $160.

Moving forward, you bet I'll have my sights set on 6850 if possible. But it will depend on the budget and street prices vs the competition. It's not about brand, but rather the best/most bang for the buck.

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December 17, 2010 8:49:44 AM

I want to build something based on this, if I replaced the 460 with a 570/580 what kind of PSU should I buy to go along with it?
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December 17, 2010 9:16:44 AM

Outstanding build. It's a real shame about the failure to unlock, but like you, I'm among those who say "if you need four cores, buy four cores."

Edit: I'd love to win this one; very suitable.
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December 17, 2010 9:25:01 AM

teddy weddyI want to build something based on this, if I replaced the 460 with a 570/580 what kind of PSU should I buy to go along with it?

With those beasts? You'd need a kick ass psu which would cost a lot, plus the 570/580 cost a lot, plus you'd want a better cpu to avoid huge bottlenecks which would also cost a lot. So it's not really the same build anymore now is it? Nor is it budget oriented. But to answer you're question, I guess a 700W? or a reeeealy beefy 600W.
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December 17, 2010 10:31:47 AM

That's a killer build for the price but a better PSU would increase its value for allowing a more powerful processor and SLI.
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December 17, 2010 11:27:17 AM

For reasons given, the PSU is perfectly adequate for the system, even overclocked, or with a 125W CPU. SLI is not an option on the chosen mobo. Whether or not Crossfire at 16x,4x is a good idea is rather moot, because by then you're way out of the budget segment this machine targets. I think this machine demonstrates quite well that it is NOT necessary to spend lots of money to get a perfectly competent gamer.
I almost bought a[nother] Phenom II X3 740BE when they were discounted to only $68 recently, but such deals can't be counted on for these SBM machines.
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Anonymous
December 17, 2010 11:50:51 AM

How much would be the gain, in the CPU-bottlenecked games and resolutions, for using an Athlon II X4 processor instead?
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December 17, 2010 1:22:59 PM

Just for grins, I tweaked this build for current prices, and came up with this. I made the wishlist public, called "Tweaked SBM500" for those interested:

MSI 870-G45 AM3 AMD 770 ATX AMD Motherboard
Model #:870-G45
Item #:N82E16813130290
$69.99 -$15.00 Instant $54.99
Although I have become somewhat of a fan of ASRock, I didn't see a loss of quality going to this version of the 770; same solid caps and ferrite chokes, but a little cheaper.

AMD Athlon II X3 450 Rana 3.2GHz Socket AM3 95W Triple-Core Desktop Processor ADX450WFGMBOX
Model #:ADX450WFGMBOX
Item #:N82E16819103886
$79.00 $79.00
Time has given us a little speed bump, but that's it.

Mushkin Enhanced Essentials 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Dual Channel Kit Desktop Memory Model ...
Model #:996586
Item #:N82E16820146748
$41.99 $41.99
Same RAM.

Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 ST3320418AS 320GB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive
Model #:ST3320418AS
Item #:N82E16822148469
$44.99 $44.99
With the disappointing results from the F4, I thought I'd use this instead.

SAMSUNG DVD Burner Black SATA Model SH-S223L LightScribe Support - OEM
Model #:SH-S223L
Item #:N82E16827151188
$17.99 $17.99
This burner supports Lightscribe.

EVGA 01G-P3-1366-TR GeForce GTX 460 SE (Fermi) 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card
Model #:01G-P3-1366-TR
Item #:N82E16814130591
$199.99 -$40.00 Instant $159.99
Price drops put this 1GB version of the GTX460 within reach. I believe there's a MIR on it too.

Rosewill R218-P-BK Black SECC Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case
Model #:R218-P-BK
Item #:N82E16811147073
$39.99 -$15.00 Instant $24.99
I didn't see the value of the NSK case over this cheap Rosewill. I've used this case, and the rear fan is quiet but does a decent job. I did just use a similar VSK case, and was sorely disappointed.

SeaSonic SS-500ET Bronze 500W ATX12V v2.31 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active PFC Power Supply - OEM
Model #:SS-500ET Bronze
Item #:N82E16817151080
$59.99 -$4.00 Instant $55.99

Antec NEO ECO 520C 520W Continuous Power ATX12V v2.3 / EPS12V 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply
Model #:NEO ECO 520C
Item #:N82E16817371030
$69.99 -$15.00 Instant $54.99

Updated due to availability. The 500W Neo Eco offers a pair of PCIE power connectors and a little more capacity, in case YOUR tweaks to this build call for a GTX580 and/or 125W X4 CPU.

Rosewill RCX-ZAIO-92 92mm Sleeve CPU Cooler
Model #:RCX-ZAIO-92
Item #:N82E16835200056
$19.99 $19.99
Same cooler. Seems adequate, and hard to argue with the price.

Subtotal: $498.92
This just shows how much things can change on prices. More tweaks are always possible; some may want more or bigger drives, or care more about the CPU and will take a weaker GPU.
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December 17, 2010 1:33:29 PM

Now this system is close to what I was suggesting for quite some time. I do agree that other GPU's would possibly be better, but at the time of the build they went with what was available (which seems to always be before new technology is released). I would've probably picked an item or 2 different, but this is about what I would get (CPU, PSU, Case, & Mobo). The GPU and Memory I might've bought differently, but that is my preference. This build shows you that you don't need to spend $1k - $2k on a system to have a decent gaming machine on a budget (which was started by Tom's several years back.).
The Case/PSU combo, that Antec puts together, is a nice one for the $ (when on sale, of coarse). When the PSU/Case combo falls into the ~$100 range, than there are other options to consider. I've built at least 2 builds, based on this same PSU/Case combo (maybe a bit older now) but they both came with Antec's 380w PSU with the same Antec case design. I like the build quality and ease of entry (2 thumbscrews and your in). I would prefer to have the PSU at the bottom and also an option for a 120mm intake fan on the front, but besides that, the Case/PSU combo is pretty good.
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December 17, 2010 2:04:21 PM

Quote:
But to answer you're question, I guess a 700W? or a reeeealy beefy 600W.


There goes the usual overestimation of power usage. Did you not read the 570/580 articles? You can easily get by with a quality 500W psu for this build if you were to replace the 460 with a 580 - if you have the right power connectors.
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December 17, 2010 2:06:53 PM

So if you move to a Phenom chip with L3 cache, which would would give you the most bang for the buck for gaming? Phenom II X3 BE 720/740 (can you even buy one of these)? Phenom II X2 560/555 BE? Or do you have to go all the way up to the Phenom X4 955/960?
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December 17, 2010 2:13:08 PM

Onus said:


...EVGA 01G-P3-1366-TR GeForce GTX 460 SE (Fermi) 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card
Model #:01G-P3-1366-TR
Item #:N82E16814130591
$199.99 -$40.00 Instant $159.99
Price drops put this 1GB version of the GTX460 within reach. I believe there's a MIR on it too...


I thought the SE versions were the slower of 460 series? Other than that, looks like a solid build.
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December 17, 2010 2:29:16 PM

@edhalsim, the only chip of those I wouldn't buy is the X2; if it doesn't unlock, you'd be rather hosed. The X3 is no longer available on Newegg, but may be elsewhere. Even if that one doesn't unlock (mine did!), you've still got three cores AND an unlocked multiplier AND the L3.
@bourgeoisdude, I'd hope the added buss width (256 vs. 192) makes it worthwhile, but I did miss that one, including the loss of some cores. Fortunately, with free shipping and if you play the rebate game and win, there are a few non-SE versions available that also come to $159 (but you need that rebate to get it, otherwise it is $20 more).
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December 17, 2010 3:21:03 PM

On topic: this build is looking very solid. Seeing how the other 2 were more experimental than improvements over we-know-it-works builds this one might take the medal for this quarter's marathon.

Out of topic:
CrashmanSo you think there's going to be a replacement platform for the $2000 PC in January? That's not going to happen for a while. Or are you suggesting the next $2000 PC should be downgraded to P67?

Probably not for the 2k build, but I think it might make an interesting 1k game field. Probably for the budget one as well (not sure on that, though).
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December 17, 2010 3:31:25 PM

Why didn't you get the X3 455.......................?
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December 17, 2010 3:50:54 PM

If they would have waited a weeeeee bit longer they would have better options for a sub $500 build with the price drops of the 460 and teh release of the 6950. O well though great little build.
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December 17, 2010 3:52:48 PM

If you had the 1GB version of the GTX 460 wouldn't that remove the Crysis failure in 1080p?
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December 17, 2010 3:59:04 PM

gidgiddonihahIf you had the 1GB version of the GTX 460 wouldn't that remove the Crysis failure in 1080p?

It would defenately help
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December 17, 2010 4:02:20 PM

What they need to do is compare this one to the 1000$ and the 2000$ build.
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December 17, 2010 4:23:51 PM

I don't understand why you don't include microcomputer's deals which have been going on for what, a year? You have to buy at store but ... so what? Why is the standard all world shipping?
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December 17, 2010 4:31:52 PM

it's a great build, but how about the best value build you can make? this may be close, but is it $500, $600 or $782? An ATI 5850/AMD 460 1 GB with a Althon 645 and a nice set of cheap $50 memory ... you come close here but what is the sweet spot for performance in gaming computers and yes, I think you throw in the extra $30 for a BluRay reader. Certainly that offers more value than a CPU cooler and a few extra MHz of performance.

Where is the sweet spot?
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December 17, 2010 4:36:25 PM

I think this is the best $500 build ever. for the people in Egypt, this is the most common budget for a gaming PC. $1000 is very rare and $2000 PCs are a dream that can't be reached for 99% of the gamers here (not that anybody has a 30" monitor at their disposal)
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December 17, 2010 4:43:48 PM

gidgiddonihah said:
What they need to do is compare this one to the 1000$ and the 2000$ build.

They're going to. I fully expect this one to win in the final value analysis.
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December 17, 2010 5:03:14 PM

QuoteAs we’ve stated many times in the past, core unlocking is based on luck of the draw, and shouldn’t be assumed when it comes time to buy. If you really need that fourth core, spring for the X4 model. In our SBM series, we're batting just a 50% success rate with AMD’s Athlon II.

Then why include it in an article of this nature? The numbers for September's build are hard to compare to this month because you "got lucky" then, but not now. The stronger performance (for some benchmarks) that the September PC had over December's was not based on any rational, informed, or experienced decision making. It was based on pure dumb luck. Maybe it would be more informative to treat any unlocked cores the same way as you treat overclocking, that is, as an optional bonus rather than a baseline for comparison.
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December 17, 2010 6:02:15 PM

I like the build... looks like a pretty good lil system. I'd probably go with a cheaper Video card and beef the CPU to a true quad. (After all, not all of them unlock) But that's just due to my usage type.

I think something that needs to be highlighted is that while this build is decent, the additional "bang" that can be had for dumping another ~$100 on top is enormous.

More into photo editing and the like? That extra $100 can take you to 8 gigs of memory and a much better CPU. More a Gamer? That same cash can take the CPU to almost the best AMD quad core and give you a 6850 to boot. More an all around user? Upgrade the motherboard to one with usb 3 on it, with a bigger case for more storage drives, etc.

That final $100 can take a decent little box and change it into an amazingly powerful one for the money.

You did mention a bit of that in the conclusion... but it would be interesting if you could throw up a benchmark to show. I'm sure you have an Phenom II quad knocking around... and maybe that 6850 too. Slam them in for laughs and show what that upgrade would give you.
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December 17, 2010 6:15:50 PM

gidgiddonihahWhat they need to do is compare this one to the 1000$ and the 2000$ build.


They will in the next article. :)  That's how they do these articles.
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December 17, 2010 6:34:00 PM

My recent build is similar:
Phenom II X4 955 Black @ 3.6 Ghz
SAME MOTHERBOARD
OCZ 8-8-8-24 1600MHz DDR3 4GB (2 X 2GB)
Sapphire HD 4870
Antec 300 Case
PC Power and Cooling 610 Watt
(Basic hard drives and DVD burner)

So my build is very similar but the video card isn't as powerful. I just can't bring myself to spend a lot on a video card since they loose value so quickly. The other components will be fine still when I upgrade to a new video card in the future. But my next upgrade will actually be a Solid State Hard Drive then a new video card.
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December 17, 2010 7:39:01 PM

jerreeceThey will in the next article. That's how they do these articles.



Cool :) . I'll be waiting in anticipation :) .

I'm building a similar rig (So im waiting to see how it compares to the 2000$ :lol:  ):

Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit
Cooler Master Elite 430 Case
MSI GTX 460 Cyclone 1GB
AMD Athlon II x3 445
MSI 870-G45 Motherboard
4GB G. Skill DDR3 1600 RAM
Corsiar Builder Series 500 Watt
Kingston 64 GB SSD
1TB HDD (2 Old Drives)
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December 17, 2010 7:47:39 PM

I would of separate the case and PSU and get a ANTEC 300 case even if it adds 50 over the budget.
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