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Why are CLC not liquid cooling.

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December 7, 2012 3:01:56 AM

They use a liquid to cool a CPU do they not?

More about : clc liquid cooling

a c 202 à CPUs
a c 129 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 3:05:25 AM

LOL word perfect its liquid cooling. TRADITIONALLY its not...

Personally I still call it liquid cooling but NOT a custom loop liquid cooler...
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December 7, 2012 3:27:15 AM

I agree that it is not a custom cooling loop and wont work as well most of the time. To put it another way, if they aren't water cooling what are they?
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a c 78 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 10:09:20 AM

ever bother reading the watercooling sticky found just at the top of this section? what they are, is detailed in the closed loop cooler section of the sticky.
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December 7, 2012 12:38:11 PM

It's not exactly water cooling, but more liquid cooling since technically a coolant is used and not water...but closed loop liquid cooler denotes these from normal water loops. The principles are the same as normal watercooling, but in a scaled down sense and in a package that isn't user serviceable. The biggest difference is a weaker-flowing pump, smaller diameter tubing and small radiator.

Saying that watercooling loops and closed loop liquid coolers are both watercooling would be similar to saying a high-end Mercedes SLK and an entry level Kia Sonata are both cars. Same purpose, same concepts, different levels of performance and expectations.
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December 7, 2012 12:51:23 PM

apparently I've noticed how so many people understand don't that analogy with cars. They are both cars with 4 wheels. It gets them places and it needs fuel to run on.

if only posters realized how much heat 1 or even 2 120 rads can throw from the loop...
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a c 324 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 1:39:41 PM

It's an example that a lot of people can understand.
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December 7, 2012 2:50:57 PM

Lutfij said:


if only posters realized how much heat 1 or even 2 120 rads can throw from the loop...


Most CLCs have atleast one 120mm radiator. I am not disputing that a custom loop will work better I am disputing the seemingly blanket statement of:
Quote:
H60=bad :p 

Quote:
How so? It's not for overclocking its because of a lack of space and ventalation for a standard cooler.

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Because those all in one closed loop water kits really aren't that great. In terms of performance they perform about as good as high-end air cooling like a Noctua D14. IMO they aren't worth the money, if you really want to do water cooling do a custom water loop.

and
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I prefer real water to 'Fisher-Price' all in ones


Some people use coolant in their loops as well. Otherwise, coolant would not be made.
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December 7, 2012 3:02:51 PM

Rubix hit the nail on the head. Doesn't matter what anyone says. THEY ARE LIQUID COOLING. A car is a car. A liquid cooler is a liquid cooler.

Closed loops just aren't as efficient . His analogy is spot on. Don't expect a Kia to hang with a Ferrari.
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a c 324 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 3:31:35 PM

Quote:
Some people use coolant in their loops as well. Otherwise, coolant would not be made.

If this is the basis of the argument then it really isn't an argument. Coolant is still primarily 'water', anyway. My point is that while they are similar in principle and operation, there are some differences and that is how we typically denote them as not being exactly 1:1.
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December 7, 2012 3:44:11 PM

rubix_1011 said:
Quote:
Some people use coolant in their loops as well. Otherwise, coolant would not be made.

If this is the basis of the argument then it really isn't an argument. Coolant is still primarily 'water', anyway. My point is that while they are similar in principle and operation, there are some differences and that is how we typically denote them as not being exactly 1:1.


I was making the point that the all-in-one's use of coolant making it not water cooling was an invalid point, so we agree.
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December 7, 2012 4:20:19 PM

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Seems like a kia optima beats a ferrari 308

308 was one of the slowest cars Ferrari made...not exactly performance by their standards. But, you are correct...and I should have been more clear and specified cars of somewhere within the same decade of production.

And for the record, my example was an SLK Mercedes...it was more the big, powerful and luxurious vs the small, compact and 'barely gets the job done' ranks. :) 
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a c 78 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 4:58:22 PM

lets see if I can take a bite at this piece of cake :) 

@ OP
1| the base flaw in all of these all-in-one coolers is the pump and chamber in which its housed in. Its weak and cramped into a tight space. Might want to check out your friends CLC and see how warm the chamber is, not a good thing for something with a lil heart.
2| the second flaw would be the use of and aluminium rad along with a copper base plate thas in contact with the cpu/heatsource. corrosion does happen. In fact coolant inside that all-in-one loop doesn't prevent corrosion.

you do the math, after warranty expires on these units, you won't have anything to say to the manufacturer when it'll leak.

3|
Quote:
Some people use coolant in their loops as well. Otherwise, coolant would not be made.
coolants were made for specific reasons for specific climatic conditions. Everything in life has it compromises, that is trading in stocks can give you huge dividends but the risk involved is high. So high that people loose sleep trying to make those ends meet. Like wise, coolants add restriction to your loop.

If you're referring to the coolants made by watercooling manufacturers...then put plainly, its just another money making scheme. Whereas the "distil+killcoil" route is similar and far cheaper. Tested, proven and recommended by so many watercoolers than ourselves.

4| as stated previously, all-in-one units have a segment in the market, just that, that segment is full of uniformed buyers.
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December 7, 2012 5:57:03 PM

Uninformed buyers or people who do not want to hassle with a full loop or people who are space constrained (height mainly) and want better cooling, or people who do not have the budget for a full loop. I fall into the last two on my current build only an A10; for my main desktop I am going to do a full loop with 7970 and an i7.
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a b à CPUs
a c 78 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 6:05:37 PM

given that the A10 can't be thrown outside the low~mid end gaming scene, you won't need to overclock it, no need for heat dump thus no need to go that route, good air cooler does the job just fine.

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Uninformed buyers
those would be people who are too stubborn to feed themselves with info.
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people who do not want to hassle with a full loop
:)  oh I've seen alot of that. Its not rocket science. Just some time and patience - kinda like taking your car to the car wash and giving it some loving with a waxpolish afterwards.
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people who are space constrained
overclocking in a flat style desktop case?

if you need to cool in a space constrained case, there are a lot of top down blowing coolers available.
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a c 103 à CPUs
a c 190 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 8:02:29 PM

Allinones, or Fisherprice cooling as I coined it often serves to get people into 'real' watercooling, because they are disappointed with the performance from their 'liquid-cooled' Pc,
and they move onto a custom loop,
using Rubix' analogy I'd compare them as h50=skateboard, custom water= any car with an engine, the more money you put into a loop, the better it can perform, but the allinones do serve a purpose,
Moto
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a b K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 10:36:36 PM

I am a convert and the temperature dropped noise dropped and in my opinion the cool factor went way up.
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December 7, 2012 10:37:22 PM

I wouldn't say skateboard but can you find an air cooler that preforms as well as an h50 or 60 in less then 53mm that does't need a vent directly above it or cover the ram slots on a mini itx board I would like to see it.
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a b à CPUs
a c 78 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 10:50:21 PM

[:lutfij:2]
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December 7, 2012 11:03:27 PM

Can you build a loop that cools as well as the h50 or 60 for 50-60$.
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a c 78 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 11:17:23 PM

mobo model and make please, actually add your whole system(planned) that you want to stuff inside that prodigy.
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a c 185 à CPUs
a c 150 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 11:19:55 PM

No, but why would you even pay $50-60 for a H60? Get a Hyper 212 EVO that costs half the price to get the same performance.
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a c 78 K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 11:22:15 PM

easy there amuffin, lets see how this pans out, we've been chasing a thread that was only about why and now its take me shopping
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a b K Overclocking
December 7, 2012 11:30:19 PM

amuffin said:
No, but why would you even pay $50-60 for a H60? Get a Hyper 212 EVO that costs half the price to get the same performance.


This will contine forever.

"Those convinced against their will are of the same opinion still"


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December 7, 2012 11:32:23 PM

hmm point, set and match there mate!
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December 8, 2012 12:24:25 AM

Lutfij said:
mobo model and make please, actually add your whole system(planned) that you want to stuff inside that prodigy.

Why do you assume it is prodigy that would be to easy and unoriginal. Its going in a laptop carrying case I would post a link but the case has already been discontinued and mine is still enroute.
It has 2.5" of vertical clearance.
Planned system-
PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant / Benchmarks

CPU: AMD A10-5800K 3.8GHz Quad-Core Processor ($119.99 @ Amazon)
CPU Cooler: Corsair H55 57.0 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($64.99 @ Amazon)
Motherboard: ASRock FM2A75M-DGS Micro ATX FM2 Motherboard ($60.98 @ Newegg)
Memory: Mushkin Redline 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3-2133 Memory ($59.99 @ Newegg)
Storage: Seagate Momentus 750GB 2.5" 7200RPM Internal Hard Drive ($74.99 @ SuperBiiz)
Monitor: LG E1942S-BN 18.5" Monitor ($86.98 @ NCIX US)
Keyboard: Cooler Master Storm QuickFire Rapid Wired Gaming Keyboard ($51.99 @ Newegg)
Total: $519.91
(Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available.)
(Generated by PCPartPicker 2012-12-07 21:21 EST-0500)
Lutfij said:
easy there amuffin, lets see how this pans out, we've been chasing a thread that was only about why and now its take me shopping

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a b à CPUs
a c 78 K Overclocking
December 8, 2012 12:32:58 AM

so your case has no name?
*matx mobo in an mitx case? very original indeedy
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December 8, 2012 12:49:56 AM

Matx in a Laptop carrying case orginal indeed,
Case- mezzi muscle d-performance

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a b à CPUs
a c 78 K Overclocking
December 8, 2012 12:53:07 AM

:lol:  good luck getting a clc in there
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December 8, 2012 1:44:23 AM

giltyler said:
This will contine forever.

"Those convinced against their will are of the same opinion still"

If you can find me an air cooler that performs as good as the h60 that is less then 53 mm tall and does not need a vent directly above it or find me a loop for less then 60$ I will be convinced. Until then I stand by me opinion that CLCs have a purpose beyond the gateway to water-cooling, cheap cooling in a height constrained case, and those that do not want to deal with full custom loop.
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a b K Overclocking
December 8, 2012 2:38:43 AM

What is the plan for cooling the other components in the RIG
I have had 2 CLC in the last 6 months that had pumps that started grinding a well documented Corsair problem and the stock fans are beyond loud.
The guys who post here frequently are passionate on their cooling opinions so while your set-up may work for you most opinions on CLC will not be changed.
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December 8, 2012 4:03:00 AM

For everything else 8 50 mm fans cross flow, the radiator in a seperate chamber on the right of the case in the front, 3 50mm intake fans on the same side toward the back. Then the mobo front and center, then the PSU in front on the left, may be in a separate chamber, on the left side the exhast, 5 50mm fans. Monitor in the top half, with a quartet of 77w/hr batteries.
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December 8, 2012 6:24:56 AM

Oh please. If someone doesn't want to reply further to a thread they can always unflag it. Asking me to close a thread just because you don't want to participate in a conversation any more is silly.
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a c 185 à CPUs
a c 150 K Overclocking
December 8, 2012 12:02:10 PM

William_White said:
For everything else 8 50 mm fans cross flow, the radiator in a seperate chamber on the right of the case in the front, 3 50mm intake fans on the same side toward the back. Then the mobo front and center, then the PSU in front on the left, may be in a separate chamber, on the left side the exhast, 5 50mm fans. Monitor in the top half, with a quartet of 77w/hr batteries.

I don't think all of that will fit inside of that case, you'd have to go with a REALLY small aircooler.
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December 8, 2012 4:31:47 PM

It should all fit I am using a 250 watt pico psu so it can use the battery power and they aren't very big. The fan on the radiator is getting replaced with a pair of the scythe 12x120 push pull. There is only 8 case fans total, the 3 on the right and the five on the left.
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a b K Overclocking
December 9, 2012 12:46:25 PM

Hi William could you do a build log for this? i think this is a really cool Idia.
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December 9, 2012 4:26:27 PM

When I get more parts together I will.
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!