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Thinkpads: T42 or R51?

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August 24, 2004 12:41:01 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

In the IBM Thinkpad configuration maze, I found that I can get the T42
(2373JXU) for practically the same price as the R51 (1829LHU). All other
features being equal (1 GB RAM, DVD burner, warranty) the main differences
are in:

the video card: T42 à ATI 9600 64 MB versus R51 à ATI 9000 32 MB;

the hard drive size: T42 à 40 GB versus T51 à 80 GB;

the hard drive speed: T42 à 5400 versus T51 à 4200 (although according to
specs, HD average seek time, Average latency, Cache size and Sustained data
transfer rates are identical).



Considering that my main use will be Photoshop 7 and that I don’t intent to
play games, should I go with the T42 or the R51? Why?

More about : thinkpads t42 r51

August 24, 2004 12:41:02 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

T42 faster HD and better over-all build quality.

Bob
"Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:xDsWc.9166$izj1.336@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
| In the IBM Thinkpad configuration maze, I found that I can get the T42
| (2373JXU) for practically the same price as the R51 (1829LHU). All other
| features being equal (1 GB RAM, DVD burner, warranty) the main differences
| are in:
|
| the video card: T42 à ATI 9600 64 MB versus R51 à ATI 9000 32 MB;
|
| the hard drive size: T42 à 40 GB versus T51 à 80 GB;
|
| the hard drive speed: T42 à 5400 versus T51 à 4200 (although according to
| specs, HD average seek time, Average latency, Cache size and Sustained
data
| transfer rates are identical).
|
|
|
| Considering that my main use will be Photoshop 7 and that I don’t intent
to
| play games, should I go with the T42 or the R51? Why?
|
|
|
|
August 24, 2004 4:53:16 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:D Nedne-cre7dFbfcRVn-jA@comcast.com...
> T42 faster HD and better over-all build quality.
>
> Bob

Better Over-all built quality is what the IBM salesperson told me.
However, regarding speed, my logical and poorly informed mind wonders: If
the T42 HD is faster, why are its seek time, Average latency, Cache size and
Sustained
data transfer rate identical to those of the Thinkpad R51?

Gilbert





> "Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
> news:xDsWc.9166$izj1.336@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
> | In the IBM Thinkpad configuration maze, I found that I can get the T42
> | (2373JXU) for practically the same price as the R51 (1829LHU). All other
> | features being equal (1 GB RAM, DVD burner, warranty) the main
differences
> | are in:
> |
> | the video card: T42 à ATI 9600 64 MB versus R51 à ATI 9000 32 MB;
> |
> | the hard drive size: T42 à 40 GB versus T51 à 80 GB;
> |
> | the hard drive speed: T42 à 5400 versus T51 à 4200 (although according
to
> | specs, HD average seek time, Average latency, Cache size and Sustained
> data
> | transfer rates are identical).
> |
> |
> |
> | Considering that my main use will be Photoshop 7 and that I don’t intent
> to
> | play games, should I go with the T42 or the R51? Why?
> |
> |
> |
> |
>
>
Related resources
August 24, 2004 4:53:17 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Gilbert, I can't answer your question concerning the HD, I'd still be
inclined towards the better build Quality. I have both a T41p 2373-GEU and
T42p 2373-KXU both excellent machines.

Bob
"Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:0kwWc.55104$UYx.30749@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
| news:D Nedne-cre7dFbfcRVn-jA@comcast.com...
| > T42 faster HD and better over-all build quality.
| >
| > Bob
|
| Better Over-all built quality is what the IBM salesperson told me.
| However, regarding speed, my logical and poorly informed mind wonders: If
| the T42 HD is faster, why are its seek time, Average latency, Cache size
and
| Sustained
| data transfer rate identical to those of the Thinkpad R51?
|
| Gilbert
|
|
|
|
|
| > "Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
| > news:xDsWc.9166$izj1.336@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
| > | In the IBM Thinkpad configuration maze, I found that I can get the T42
| > | (2373JXU) for practically the same price as the R51 (1829LHU). All
other
| > | features being equal (1 GB RAM, DVD burner, warranty) the main
| differences
| > | are in:
| > |
| > | the video card: T42 à ATI 9600 64 MB versus R51 à ATI 9000 32 MB;
| > |
| > | the hard drive size: T42 à 40 GB versus T51 à 80 GB;
| > |
| > | the hard drive speed: T42 à 5400 versus T51 à 4200 (although according
| to
| > | specs, HD average seek time, Average latency, Cache size and Sustained
| > data
| > | transfer rates are identical).
| > |
| > |
| > |
| > | Considering that my main use will be Photoshop 7 and that I don’t
intent
| > to
| > | play games, should I go with the T42 or the R51? Why?
| > |
| > |
| > |
| > |
| >
| >
|
|
August 24, 2004 4:53:18 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Gilbert, you might be well served to check out the IBM forum, many questions
answered. www.thinkpads.com/index.php
Bill Morrow the host of that board is also a IBM reseller and can usually
get you an excellent price. Check out his web site as well www.thinkpads.com

Bob

"Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:KoidnU6vwL4RAbfcRVn-hQ@comcast.com...
| Gilbert, I can't answer your question concerning the HD, I'd still be
| inclined towards the better build Quality. I have both a T41p 2373-GEU and
| T42p 2373-KXU both excellent machines.
|
| Bob
| "Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
| news:0kwWc.55104$UYx.30749@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
|| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
|| news:D Nedne-cre7dFbfcRVn-jA@comcast.com...
|| > T42 faster HD and better over-all build quality.
|| >
|| > Bob
||
|| Better Over-all built quality is what the IBM salesperson told me.
|| However, regarding speed, my logical and poorly informed mind wonders: If
|| the T42 HD is faster, why are its seek time, Average latency, Cache size
| and
|| Sustained
|| data transfer rate identical to those of the Thinkpad R51?
||
|| Gilbert
||
||
||
||
||
|| > "Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
|| > news:xDsWc.9166$izj1.336@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
|| > | In the IBM Thinkpad configuration maze, I found that I can get the
T42
|| > | (2373JXU) for practically the same price as the R51 (1829LHU). All
| other
|| > | features being equal (1 GB RAM, DVD burner, warranty) the main
|| differences
|| > | are in:
|| > |
|| > | the video card: T42 à ATI 9600 64 MB versus R51 à ATI 9000 32 MB;
|| > |
|| > | the hard drive size: T42 à 40 GB versus T51 à 80 GB;
|| > |
|| > | the hard drive speed: T42 à 5400 versus T51 à 4200 (although
according
|| to
|| > | specs, HD average seek time, Average latency, Cache size and
Sustained
|| > data
|| > | transfer rates are identical).
|| > |
|| > |
|| > |
|| > | Considering that my main use will be Photoshop 7 and that I don’t
| intent
|| > to
|| > | play games, should I go with the T42 or the R51? Why?
|| > |
|| > |
|| > |
|| > |
|| >
|| >
||
||
|
|
August 24, 2004 4:53:19 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Should be www.forums.thinkpads.com/index.php
Bob
"Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:o 4qdnWdsoNdkALfcRVn-ig@comcast.com...
| Gilbert, you might be well served to check out the IBM forum, many
questions
| answered. www.thinkpads.com/index.php
| Bill Morrow the host of that board is also a IBM reseller and can usually
| get you an excellent price. Check out his web site as well
www.thinkpads.com
|
| Bob
|
| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
| news:KoidnU6vwL4RAbfcRVn-hQ@comcast.com...
|| Gilbert, I can't answer your question concerning the HD, I'd still be
|| inclined towards the better build Quality. I have both a T41p 2373-GEU
and
|| T42p 2373-KXU both excellent machines.
||
|| Bob
|| "Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
|| news:0kwWc.55104$UYx.30749@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
||| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
||| news:D Nedne-cre7dFbfcRVn-jA@comcast.com...
||| > T42 faster HD and better over-all build quality.
||| >
||| > Bob
|||
||| Better Over-all built quality is what the IBM salesperson told me.
||| However, regarding speed, my logical and poorly informed mind wonders:
If
||| the T42 HD is faster, why are its seek time, Average latency, Cache size
|| and
||| Sustained
||| data transfer rate identical to those of the Thinkpad R51?
|||
||| Gilbert
|||
|||
|||
|||
|||
||| > "Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
||| > news:xDsWc.9166$izj1.336@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
||| > | In the IBM Thinkpad configuration maze, I found that I can get the
| T42
||| > | (2373JXU) for practically the same price as the R51 (1829LHU). All
|| other
||| > | features being equal (1 GB RAM, DVD burner, warranty) the main
||| differences
||| > | are in:
||| > |
||| > | the video card: T42 à ATI 9600 64 MB versus R51 à ATI 9000 32 MB;
||| > |
||| > | the hard drive size: T42 à 40 GB versus T51 à 80 GB;
||| > |
||| > | the hard drive speed: T42 à 5400 versus T51 à 4200 (although
| according
||| to
||| > | specs, HD average seek time, Average latency, Cache size and
| Sustained
||| > data
||| > | transfer rates are identical).
||| > |
||| > |
||| > |
||| > | Considering that my main use will be Photoshop 7 and that I don’t
|| intent
||| > to
||| > | play games, should I go with the T42 or the R51? Why?
||| > |
||| > |
||| > |
||| > |
||| >
||| >
|||
|||
||
||
|
|
August 24, 2004 4:53:20 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Maybe http//forum.thinkpads.com/index.php
Sorry should really cut'n paste
"Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:NoWdnVZ-vfbyA7fcRVn-uQ@comcast.com...
| Should be www.forums.thinkpads.com/index.php
| Bob
| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
| news:o 4qdnWdsoNdkALfcRVn-ig@comcast.com...
|| Gilbert, you might be well served to check out the IBM forum, many
| questions
|| answered. www.thinkpads.com/index.php
|| Bill Morrow the host of that board is also a IBM reseller and can usually
|| get you an excellent price. Check out his web site as well
| www.thinkpads.com
||
|| Bob
||
|| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
|| news:KoidnU6vwL4RAbfcRVn-hQ@comcast.com...
||| Gilbert, I can't answer your question concerning the HD, I'd still be
||| inclined towards the better build Quality. I have both a T41p 2373-GEU
| and
||| T42p 2373-KXU both excellent machines.
|||
||| Bob
||| "Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
||| news:0kwWc.55104$UYx.30749@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
|||| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
|||| news:D Nedne-cre7dFbfcRVn-jA@comcast.com...
|||| > T42 faster HD and better over-all build quality.
|||| >
|||| > Bob
||||
|||| Better Over-all built quality is what the IBM salesperson told me.
|||| However, regarding speed, my logical and poorly informed mind wonders:
| If
|||| the T42 HD is faster, why are its seek time, Average latency, Cache
size
||| and
|||| Sustained
|||| data transfer rate identical to those of the Thinkpad R51?
||||
|||| Gilbert
||||
||||
||||
||||
||||
|||| > "Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
|||| > news:xDsWc.9166$izj1.336@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
|||| > | In the IBM Thinkpad configuration maze, I found that I can get the
|| T42
|||| > | (2373JXU) for practically the same price as the R51 (1829LHU). All
||| other
|||| > | features being equal (1 GB RAM, DVD burner, warranty) the main
|||| differences
|||| > | are in:
|||| > |
|||| > | the video card: T42 à ATI 9600 64 MB versus R51 à ATI 9000 32 MB;
|||| > |
|||| > | the hard drive size: T42 à 40 GB versus T51 à 80 GB;
|||| > |
|||| > | the hard drive speed: T42 à 5400 versus T51 à 4200 (although
|| according
|||| to
|||| > | specs, HD average seek time, Average latency, Cache size and
|| Sustained
|||| > data
|||| > | transfer rates are identical).
|||| > |
|||| > |
|||| > |
|||| > | Considering that my main use will be Photoshop 7 and that I don’t
||| intent
|||| > to
|||| > | play games, should I go with the T42 or the R51? Why?
|||| > |
|||| > |
|||| > |
|||| > |
|||| >
|||| >
||||
||||
|||
|||
||
||
|
|
August 24, 2004 4:53:21 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Really feeling stupid now... www.forum.thinkpads.com If this is wrong you
can get to the forums through Bill's website www.thinkpads.com

"Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:_sidndMqkMO9ArfcRVn-hA@comcast.com...
| Maybe http//forum.thinkpads.com/index.php
| Sorry should really cut'n paste
| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
| news:NoWdnVZ-vfbyA7fcRVn-uQ@comcast.com...
|| Should be www.forums.thinkpads.com/index.php
|| Bob
|| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
|| news:o 4qdnWdsoNdkALfcRVn-ig@comcast.com...
||| Gilbert, you might be well served to check out the IBM forum, many
|| questions
||| answered. www.thinkpads.com/index.php
||| Bill Morrow the host of that board is also a IBM reseller and can
usually
||| get you an excellent price. Check out his web site as well
|| www.thinkpads.com
|||
||| Bob
|||
||| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
||| news:KoidnU6vwL4RAbfcRVn-hQ@comcast.com...
|||| Gilbert, I can't answer your question concerning the HD, I'd still be
|||| inclined towards the better build Quality. I have both a T41p 2373-GEU
|| and
|||| T42p 2373-KXU both excellent machines.
||||
|||| Bob
|||| "Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
|||| news:0kwWc.55104$UYx.30749@twister01.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
||||| "Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
||||| news:D Nedne-cre7dFbfcRVn-jA@comcast.com...
||||| > T42 faster HD and better over-all build quality.
||||| >
||||| > Bob
|||||
||||| Better Over-all built quality is what the IBM salesperson told me.
||||| However, regarding speed, my logical and poorly informed mind wonders:
|| If
||||| the T42 HD is faster, why are its seek time, Average latency, Cache
| size
|||| and
||||| Sustained
||||| data transfer rate identical to those of the Thinkpad R51?
|||||
||||| Gilbert
|||||
|||||
|||||
|||||
|||||
||||| > "Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
||||| > news:xDsWc.9166$izj1.336@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
||||| > | In the IBM Thinkpad configuration maze, I found that I can get the
||| T42
||||| > | (2373JXU) for practically the same price as the R51 (1829LHU). All
|||| other
||||| > | features being equal (1 GB RAM, DVD burner, warranty) the main
||||| differences
||||| > | are in:
||||| > |
||||| > | the video card: T42 à ATI 9600 64 MB versus R51 à ATI 9000 32 MB;
||||| > |
||||| > | the hard drive size: T42 à 40 GB versus T51 à 80 GB;
||||| > |
||||| > | the hard drive speed: T42 à 5400 versus T51 à 4200 (although
||| according
||||| to
||||| > | specs, HD average seek time, Average latency, Cache size and
||| Sustained
||||| > data
||||| > | transfer rates are identical).
||||| > |
||||| > |
||||| > |
||||| > | Considering that my main use will be Photoshop 7 and that I don’t
|||| intent
||||| > to
||||| > | play games, should I go with the T42 or the R51? Why?
||||| > |
||||| > |
||||| > |
||||| > |
||||| >
||||| >
|||||
|||||
||||
||||
|||
|||
||
||
|
|
August 24, 2004 6:39:51 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Bob" <mrbjr@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:47qdnUjJ_vjfPbfcRVn-qA@comcast.com...
> Really feeling stupid now... www.forum.thinkpads.com If this is wrong you
> can get to the forums through Bill's website www.thinkpads.com

Bob: There is no need to "feel stupid" about having a hard time at posting
the right link. Thank you for your input. Prior to posting here, I had
consulted the thinkpads.com forum but did not find the answer I wanted. I
registered with that Forum but for some reason I could not log in to post my
question although my registration was accepted. I tend to agree with you
that probably the T42 is a better model. Thank you.

Gilbert
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
August 24, 2004 11:44:57 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Are their screens the same size? Same resolution? If so, I think I'd
choose the T42 as I have the impression they're more rugged (and I think
they have a longer warranty because of this).

Unfortunately, I don't own either so can't help you directly, but I do own
an A series, which is roughly equivalent to the R series (I thought). It
has a large 15" screen with FlexView viewing display (my wife wanted to be
able to see it clearly through a wide angle of positions).

As I said, I had the impression that the displays were generally better, but
larger and heavier, in the R series (and also, more power hungry).

Check out the weight difference, my impression is that it's 2 pounds or so.
If that's the case, try to find out why? What's in the R series to account
for those extra pounds?

Please let us know.

Chip


"Gilbert" <fr2@rogers.com> wrote in message
news:xDsWc.9166$izj1.336@news04.bloor.is.net.cable.rogers.com...
> In the IBM Thinkpad configuration maze, I found that I can get the T42
> (2373JXU) for practically the same price as the R51 (1829LHU). All other
> features being equal (1 GB RAM, DVD burner, warranty) the main differences
> are in:
>
> the video card: T42 à ATI 9600 64 MB versus R51 à ATI 9000 32 MB;
>
> the hard drive size: T42 à 40 GB versus T51 à 80 GB;
>
> the hard drive speed: T42 à 5400 versus T51 à 4200 (although according to
> specs, HD average seek time, Average latency, Cache size and Sustained
> data
> transfer rates are identical).
>
>
>
> Considering that my main use will be Photoshop 7 and that I don't intent
> to
> play games, should I go with the T42 or the R51? Why?
>
>
>
>
August 25, 2004 5:10:00 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Chip Orange" <acorange@comcast.net> wrote in message
news:kL2dneF5QZdmT7bcRVn-hQ@comcast.com...
> Are their screens the same size? Same resolution? If so, I think I'd
> choose the T42 as I have the impression they're more rugged (and I think
> they have a longer warranty because of this).
>
>> Check out the weight difference, my impression is that it's 2 pounds or
so.
> If that's the case, try to find out why? What's in the R series to
account
> for those extra pounds?
>
> Please let us know.
>
> Chip
>
Chip: The T42 and R51 that I had in mind have identical screens. As for
weight: the T42 is 2.7 Kg and the R51 is 3 Kg according to specs. A
difference of 300 g which is about 2/3 of than a pound.
According to IBM, the T42 is better. I decided to go ahead and order it.
August 25, 2004 5:10:01 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Welcome to the club Gilbert.I think you will be quite happy. Have you tried
to access the thinkpad forums lately? If you continue to have problems you
might want to re-register with a different user name, be sure that you are
using a valid email address otherwise it will reject it.

Bob
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
August 25, 2004 9:07:51 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Bob wrote:

> Welcome to the club Gilbert.I think you will be quite happy. Have you tried
> to access the thinkpad forums lately? If you continue to have problems you
> might want to re-register with a different user name, be sure that you are
> using a valid email address otherwise it will reject it.
>
> Bob
>
>
I suddenly find myself having to consider the replacement of my nearly 4
year old laptop. I have so far not been attracted to IBM laptops
because, in spite of their undisputed quality, I do not like the layout
of the keyboard (having to go all the way to the bottom of the screen to
find such a frequently used key as the delete key is hardly convenient),
I do not want to pay for restore and security functions I won't use
(first thing I do on a machine is reformat and reinstall with my own OS
disk) and I feel those machines are too business oriented at the expense
of sound and overall attractiveness.

Furthermore, the reports I read about fan noise on those machine (a very
important point for me) have further put me in doubt.

Still, I could not pass IBM without further investigation and I tried to
make sense from the IBM product line by visiting its site extensively. I
have especially tried to compare machines and to discover what
differences justified different prices.

Someone here recently mentioned "maze" and this is exactly how feel. I
am so surprised to find that a company like IBM does not feel the need
to make its products more "palatable" online and to better differentiate
them.

Can anyone point me to a site where it is possible to make sense of
this, and for instance, to support a choice between a T42 and a T51.
Saying that one is a better choice than the other does not cut it.

Regards

--
John Doue
August 25, 2004 9:38:45 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"John Doue" <notwobe@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:HH3Xc.245$Ig1.148@read3.inet.fi...
> Still, I could not pass IBM without further investigation and I tried to
> make sense from the IBM product line by visiting its site extensively. I
> have especially tried to compare machines and to discover what
> differences justified different prices.
>
> Someone here recently mentioned "maze" and this is exactly how feel. I
> am so surprised to find that a company like IBM does not feel the need
> to make its products more "palatable" online and to better differentiate
> them.
>
> Can anyone point me to a site where it is possible to make sense of
> this, and for instance, to support a choice between a T42 and a T51.
> Saying that one is a better choice than the other does not cut it.
>
> Regards
>
> --
> John Doue

Hi John, I am the one who got caught in IBM's maze. There is no site that
will help you make sense of IBM's mess, and certainly not their TAbook,
which is full of "some with" references. With hundreds of Thinkpad
configurations with confusing info, IBM's customers think that they have a
choice when in fact they don't. For example, if I wanted a bigger HD in the
T42 I liked, I could not have it, unless I went for another T42 with a
different video card for almost twice the price. In other words IBM ends up
selling what it wants, not what the customer really wants.



According to IBM, the T42 is better/sturdier than the R5. I decided to try
IBM because of their Flexview screen (which I have not seen) on some models
and also because if you order directly through them, you have 30 days to
return the laptop with no questions asked. Although all my friends told me
to forget IBM because the way they go about selling their stuff is awful,
yesterday, I ordered the T42 2373JXU. Needless to say, if I am not satisfied
with the unit, it will be returned promptly.



Good luck with you purchase decision.
!