What first? Headphones or a card?

[someguynamedmatt]

This should be an easy question for some of you sound card experts here.

I've got a pair of Bose Around-Ear TriPort Headphones right now, and they seem to be pretty good. In fact, they're the best I've ever listened to.

I'm running them off of an integrated Realtek audio chip on my MSI 790FX-GD70 motherboard, though, and I've been thinking of getting a better sound card. The Asus Xonar Essence to be more specific.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829132010

My question here is this: What is going to be holding me back more... my headphones or my integrated audio chip? I'm aware that those Bose cans aren't the most expensive around, but that's probably because of their relatively cheap build... the sound quality from them is spectacular.

Any thoughts?

 

[Emperus]

I'll definitely recommend you get the card.. Headphones can be upgraded at any point later.. I won't say your integrated sound chip is holding you back though if you can listen to the audio very cleanly without any hiss.. BTW which headphones are you using??

 

[someguynamedmatt]

http://www.bose.com/controller?url=/shop_online/headphones/audio_headphones/around_ear_headphones/index.jsp
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826627003&Tpk=bose%20around-ear

Actually, I don't know what's causing it, but when my PC goes into standby, there's an extremely loud hiss coming from my headphones. It's loud to the point that I can hear it half way across my room. Of course, they're plugged into the front panel audio jack, so I've never really taken the time to unplug everything and pinpoint the source.

They were $30 more when I bought them from Bose, too...

 

[Emperus]

The large hiss is caused by the back current mostly.. This happens since the sound chip is not isolated and shares the power structure.. A dedicated sound card will solve this.. However, sometimes the ability of the drivers to pick up the noise structure also causes it but i doubt that in your case..

P.S. - Hope you don't mind but personally, i find BOSE products not worth the cost
they charge..

 

[someguynamedmatt]

It's fine... I know what you mean about BOSE's prices...
They were actually my first pair of 'good' headphones over the $30 things you can buy at WalMart, so I decided to go to their walk-in store in Pennsylvania and try out a pair first. Sure, I could have gone to the Egg and found something built a lot better for the same amount of money, but it was kind of like buying a monitor or office chair... I'd rather go and try them out first.

In defense of my Bose phones, they're extremely comfortable, and as long as you're careful with them, they shouldn't fall apart like most people are saying they do... just don't stand on them and you'll be fine.

 

[saaiello]

I would say get a sound card first the ASUS Essence or an HT Omega Claro Halo both have excellent headphone AMPS and will make any headphones sound great and when you do get a quality headphones on one of those cards it will blow you away.

 

[someguynamedmatt]

Another quick question then...
What exactly do you call a 'quality' set of headphones? Any links or suggestions?

 

[saaiello]

Sennheiser are known to be some of the best headphones you can buy.

 

[Collie147]

Ditto on on the Sennheiser, the asus card is probably the most highly recommened card around, but I wouldnt shy away from the new Creative x-fi that's just been confirmed http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/Sound-Blaster-X-Fi-THX,news-33448.html
I have an x-fi Fatal1ty and a MOTU 828 and the x-fi holds its own with the best of them, and if it's coming out at the $100 range, it's not to be sniffed at. OF course it's not an audiophile's dream card but if it's as good as it sounds it'll defo give as much for the money.

 

[Kewlx25]

I've heard of nothing but driver issues with Creative. If you got one, great, but I wouldn't buy one.

 

[Emperus]

The baseline here is audio over headphones and so creative automatically goes out of contention.. Atleast till you don't decide to get an external headphone amp.. Sennheiser is a good brand but I'll never bother with their cheaper stuff.. They are just not that good enough.. Its best to get a quality headset which though little expensive, will serve for a long period of time.. Grado is an excellent brand you can look into.. Also take a look around www.avforums.com for more precise recommendations..

 

[saaiello]

I've heard of nothing but driver issues with Creative. If you got one, great, but I wouldn't buy one.

I am so tired of people dissing creative about driver issues they had a little problem when vista came out and changed its whole audio configuration if anything its Microsoft fault that creatives cards had problems. Since then creative has come back and has fixed all their issues I hate people like you that bash good companies for one flaw that happened Please do some research before posting some nonsense about a problem that has been fixed over a year ago. I have been using an X-Fi Titanium for awhile now and the sound quality is spectacular and I have not had 1 problem with it. It runs perfect on Win 7 64bit without issue so please take your uninformed comment somewhere else.

For a soundcard to use with audiophile headphones you want a card with a good headphone amp like the 2 cards I suggest in a previous post.

 

[Kewlx25]

I am so tired of people dissing creative about driver issues they had a little problem when vista came out and changed its whole audio configuration if anything its Microsoft fault that creatives cards had problems. Since then creative has come back and has fixed all their issues I hate people like you that bash good companies for one flaw that happened Please do some research before posting some nonsense about a problem that has been fixed over a year ago. I have been using an X-Fi Titanium for awhile now and the sound quality is spectacular and I have not had 1 problem with it. It runs perfect on Win 7 64bit without issue so please take your uninformed comment somewhere else.

For a soundcard to use with audiophile headphones you want a card with a good headphone amp like the 2 cards I suggest in a previous post.

"[...]They had a little problem when vista came out[...]"
ROFL. BSODs continued into Win7 and that's a few years AFTER Vista came out. In the WoW forums, almost all people complaining about WoW crashing their comps had Creative cards, rest were bad/old video drivers. Always fixed when they removed/disabled their Creative cards. This was an on going issue for almost 2 years. No other sound card company had issues BSOD'n on a regular basis. Made you wanna use onboard.

Creative is good? They falsely sued Aureal into bankruptcy and even now Creative's top sound cards still can't do 3D sound near as good as my $20 A3D card from the late 90s.

edit: Creative makes good hardware, just not drivers. Well, they may be good now.

 

[gamerk316]

Creative cards still have tons of issues; they STILL haven't permanatlly fixed the SCP issue...Nevermind that quality wise (measured in SnR), Creative is only on part with the best Realtek chipsets (108 SnR) compared to ASUS/HT Omega/Auzentech (at least 116 SnR). Throw in out of the box DDL/DTS-C, replacable O-amps (select models at least), and stable drivers, and its a no brainer. ASUS in particular has better cards then Creative at every price point.

 

[someguynamedmatt]

I agree on Creative... yes, I've heard good things about them too, and I'm sure there are people who would stick up for Creative, but there are just too many cases of things just not working with them. I've never had a single problem with Asus, and the Xonar Essence is supposedly one of the best headphone cards in its class.

I agree on Sennheiser, too, but I just don't have that kind of money to spend for a pair of headphones. If I just kept my pair of Bose cans I'm using now, would I notice a difference if I'd buy the Essence, or would I be better off getting a pair of Sennheisers instead, and just use onboard audio?

 

[sportsfanboy]

I had a pair of sound isolating Shure head phones that sounded really nice. They make some pretty decent pro gear.

 

[AMW1011]

Alright, I've spent over $800 on headphones myself (I returned most though). Let me tell you this, Bose is not that good. They are very colored and very overpriced for the sound quality they give.

If you are a bass head:
Beyerdynamic DT770, the most comfortable I've ever used: http://www.amazon.com/beyerdynamic-DT-770-Stereo-Headphones/dp/B000F2BLTC

Cheaper: Audio Technica ATH-M50: http://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-Studio-Monitor-Headphones/dp/B000P62ND6

The DT770s have more bass, but the ATH-M50s are much more neutral and balanced. I would give the DT770s the nod for bass and detail and give the ATH-M50s the nod for neutrality, guitar reproduction, and treble.

For gaming:
Audio Technica AD700s: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16826402014&nm_mc=OTC-Froogle&cm_mmc=OTC-Froogle-_-Headphones+and+Accessories-_-Audio-Technica-_-26402014

The AD700s don't have much bass, but what they do have is pleasantly detailed. The detail, clarity, and quality of reproduction is unmatched by any headphone under $250. They also have great imaging, meaning you can exactly pin point the location of the sounds in your head. For jazz and classical this is an amazing quality. For gaming, these will give you the edge in combat, they helped immensely in BFBC2 and MW2.

For heavy metal and hard rock:
Grado SR125i: http://www.amazon.com/Grado-Prestige-Series-SR125i-Headphones/dp/B0006GCCWW

They don't have the most bass, but their guitar reproduction and the "in your face" presentation is simply second to none. This is the signature Grado sound, and it is very nice. Be aware that the treble can be a bit harsh at times.

Now, if you want to go the in-ear monitor route I can help you there too. In-ear monitors tend to sound as good or better at the same prices as full sized headphones, but they manage to isolate more sound, and take less to push.

Now for sound cards:
Cheap:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829132006

Expensive:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829271004
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829132010

 

[someguynamedmatt]

As someone already suggested, I'll probably go with the Asus Xonar Essence (Looks better than the Omega, has shielding, and everyone says it just sounds better), and wait a while for a good pair of Sennheisers. I'm going to get flamed at for this, but I just can't see a pair of $89 headphones being noticeably better than these Bose ones. I just can't. If I'm going to buy a better set of cans, then I might as well save up money and get something that I'll never have to upgrade again, instead of spending another hundred bucks on something that's basically the same as what I have now.

 

[AMW1011]

The Asus Xonar Essence and the Omega use the same sound processing chip, but they come with slightly different components so they sound only *slightly* difference, but have different software. You can't go wrong with either.

I understand your difficulty, it's hard to imagine how overpriced Bose are at times. You must remember that all those headphones I posted are by brands you likely have never heard of, so they have to be competitve. In honesty, a par of $30 JVC RX700s with some dynamat put in the cup, sound better than your Bose and are up there with all the ones I mentioned. It all comes down to subjectivity. I hate the colored sound of Bose, meaning I hate the exaggeration employed to make people who have only heard really crappy equipment think Bose is so amazing, its all about marketing and not the actual product. You can use a digital equilizer to get any form of coloration you want with any headphone, not just the sound Bose sticks you with.

The thing with sound is that, everyone likes something different, this is why I gave you a broad range of phones to choose from.

What do you listen to? What are you looking for in a headphone? Wht do you like in a headphone, deep bass, punchy bass, boomy bass, exaggerated midrange, ect.

Tell me this and I will find you plenty of good options. You may like Sennheiser, but you may not too, you need to match these phones to your needs and forget the brand. The only Sennheiser headphones I recommend are the HD 595, HD 600, and the HD 650, I find the rest not worth the money over similar sounding headpones. Also if you are looking into in-ear monitors, the Sennheiser IE7s and IE8s are excellent, both sound very different from the other so the IE8 isn't just better despite the price.

 

[someguynamedmatt]

I know what you're saying about Bose's sound quality... I wish I could say that I agree, and I probably would if I had actually ever heard a pair of high-quality phones on a dedicated card. I'm really not a big fan of Bose right now, either. Once I got these to my house, that's when it dawned on me that they weren't exactly what I had paid for. Really, after about an hour of wearing them, they start to hurt the top of my head because all that's up there is a 1/2 inch wide sharp metal strip covered in some thin fabric.

This isn't going to help much, but I listen to pretty much everything through these. More specifically, just about every type of music imaginable and gaming. Yes, I know that the Essence isn't the best 'gaming card', but that isn't my priority. I'd like a pair of phones that are as precise as possible in playback - if I want it to sound any warmer or have more bass, then I can always use the EQ to do that.

Oh, and I was looking at a pair of Sennheiser 595's on NewEgg earlier today. And I'd only buy in-ear headphones as a last resort.

Any thoughts?

 

[MEgamer]

if you buy in-ears, yes its last resort, but you may be internest in sennheisers new IE range

sennheiser IE 6,7,8

 

[MEgamer]

the sound stage is huge on the IEs

and i have the IE7 which good treble, good bass, very warm (instruments also cut nicely), but mostly of all it has a huge soundstageand its very cormforting to listen to.

 

[AMW1011]

I know what you're saying about Bose's sound quality... I wish I could say that I agree, and I probably would if I had actually ever heard a pair of high-quality phones on a dedicated card. I'm really not a big fan of Bose right now, either. Once I got these to my house, that's when it dawned on me that they weren't exactly what I had paid for. Really, after about an hour of wearing them, they start to hurt the top of my head because all that's up there is a 1/2 inch wide sharp metal strip covered in some thin fabric.

This isn't going to help much, but I listen to pretty much everything through these. More specifically, just about every type of music imaginable and gaming. Yes, I know that the Essence isn't the best 'gaming card', but that isn't my priority. I'd like a pair of phones that are as precise as possible in playback - if I want it to sound any warmer or have more bass, then I can always use the EQ to do that.

Oh, and I was looking at a pair of Sennheiser 595's on NewEgg earlier today. And I'd only buy in-ear headphones as a last resort.

Any thoughts?

The days of "gaming" sound cards making any difference at all are long, long gone.

Precise as possible playback! Your talking like an audiophile!

The AKG 701 has a nice amount of base and is extremely precise and musical:
http://www.amazon.com/AKG-K-701-WHITE-HEADPHONES/dp/B000EBBJ6Y

The Audio Technica AD700s, don't have much bass, but their soundstage and imaging is second to none:
http://www.amazon.com/Technica-ATH-AD700-Audiophile-Headphones-Neodymium/dp/B000CMS0XU/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=electronics&qid=1274018149&sr=1-1

The Audio Technica ATH-M50, it is very neutral and precise with a decent, fun bass, but it has very little soundstage, still better than Alessandro or Grado though. These are what I have connected to my PC 24/7:
http://www.amazon.com/Audio-Technica-Studio-Monitor-Headphones-Standard/dp/B000UVGI6O

The Alessandro MS-1 and MS-2 are modified Grado headphones for a more neutral sound and are quite precise, though the sound stage is small and "in your face":
http://www.alessandro-products.com/headphones.html

The Beyerdynamic DT880 are extremely comfortable and are neutral and precise, though the bass will be slightly less powerful than the K701, but it will go deeper.
http://www.amazon.com/beyerdynamic-DT-880-Premium-Headphones/dp/B000F2BLTM

Note that for the Beyerdynamic DT880 and the AKG K701, you will need an amplifier.

The K701 loves tube amps, and this is a great, affordable one: http://cgi.ebay.com/Little-Dot-MK-II-SKU93-Portable-Headphone-Amplifier-MK2-/160389842138?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2557fac4da

The DT880 needs a full amplifier, not a portable one, so it is only an option if you can provide that.

There are a lot of good recommendations for certain price ranges. Hope it helps.

 

[francoba22]

This should be an easy question for some of you sound card experts here.

I've got a pair of Bose Around-Ear TriPort Headphones right now, and they seem to be pretty good. In fact, they're the best I've ever listened to.

I'm running them off of an integrated Realtek audio chip on my MSI 790FX-GD70 motherboard, though, and I've been thinking of getting a better sound card. The Asus Xonar Essence to be more specific.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16829132010

My question here is this: What is going to be holding me back more... my headphones or my integrated audio chip? I'm aware that those Bose cans aren't the most expensive around, but that's probably because of their relatively cheap build... the sound quality from them is spectacular.

Any thoughts?

I think first you should buy a sound card. Because if you have a nice sound system with a crappy sound card you wont get a "crystal clear" sound. I always recommend SoundBlaster X-Fi Sound Cards (specially the fatal1ty series or something like that), but that Asus card u showed there seemed to be very good.

For the headphones, I DONT like headphones at all, but bose IS a fantastic brand . I prefer to buy some 2.1 +1 speaker set. I'll recommend you a Edifier X3, which has a nice subwoofer with sum nice speakers . I dont like 5.1 at all.

Speakers: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3SvD2Y1Gks

Sound Card (Creative X-Fi): http://us.store.creative.com/PCI-Express-Sound-Blaster-XFi-Titanium/M/B001BDPLJA.htm

Good luck and sorry for my bad english, lol!

 

[someguynamedmatt]

<Huge List>

Those are all some pretty nice phones, but I've still got a few questions. I see you didn't mention those Sennheisers in there anywhere... did you just leave them out or do they have a different sound quality to them?

Also, as long as they're accurate, I'd prefer to stay on the bass-ey side of things... I like phones that can hit hard if it's called for, but not to the point that they're like the Bose ones I have that hit hard all the time.