Thanks again for your responses. I'm going with the CM 212+ as it's in my price range (microcenter, thx ct1615). Thx saint19 for the informative link, exactly what I was looking for. Psychosaysdie is probably right but if you look at my system it's easy to see that it's a budget computer. So far I've got 380$ into it as I found a pretty good deal on the CPU & MB for $105. All total it'll be a $400 system after upgrading the cooler...just where I wanted to be on this build that's replacing my 100% reliable & running P4 2.4ghz from 2002. The Antec 300 seems to be respectable and I'm happy with only dropping $50 on it. This computer should tide me over for another year before I retire it to HTPC status and build something a little higher end. Again thanks for your advice and Information.