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5770 RMA, switch to GTS 250, 9800 GTX+?

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March 21, 2010 4:27:58 PM

Hey all,

So last week I bought all the parts for a new build for the wife:

Antec 900
ASUS 790X AM3 EVO
PII x4 955 BE 3.2ghz
OCZ modXstream 600w PSU
G.Skill ripjaws ddr3 1600 9-9-9-24

and

MSI HD 5770

I put the build together yesterday, and the fan on the MSI 5770 is the loudest thing in the case. Actually it's the loudest thing in the house. I can hear the 5770 fan over this entire build AND the other gaming rig in the room... while I'm in the kitchen. Anyways you get the idea.

So i need to RMA it I guess (a process i've never done... and I just hope newegg doesn't try to hit me with shipping costs or a restocking fee...). I have only ever owned 2 ATI cards now, and both have given me problems with drivers and fans. making me want to stick with nVidia again (currently running a gtx 260 core 216 in my rig, upgraded from an 8800GT, both work flawlessly)

Poking around for other options (instead of just replacing the MSI as I've had another MSI video card fan crap out on me I think I'll just pass on that brand now...) I saw the PNY 9800 GTX+ on newegg for $85 after rebate. Eighty-five fricken dollars.

MSI 5770 - $149 after rebate
PNY 9800gtx+ - $85 after rebate.

From the tests I've read and seen, the 5770 is not 75% better than the 9800gtx+. But it is 75% more expensive.

Also available for only $99-$119 is the 1gb GTS 250.

So basically I have a few options and I'd really like some assistence. from what I've been reading here, it seems like ALOT of you forum regular are big ATI fans, but I really want to get as unbiased on an opinion as possible.

Option 1.) Exchange the MSI 5770 for another MSI 5770
Option 2.) Exchange the MSI 5770 for a different brand 5770, even though it will cost 10-20$ more...
Option 3.) Return the MSI 5770 and buy a 9800gtx+ for only $85 total.
Option 4.) Return the MSI 5770 and buy a GTS 250 for only $100 total.
Option 5.) Return the MSI 5770 and wait a week to see how the fermi release changes the market pricing (price drop on GTX 260?)

Spending the $149 was already at the top of the budget, so please do not tell me to get a 5830 or something. Please tell me which option I listed makes the most sense and why. THANKS!

~xRome
a c 84 U Graphics card
March 21, 2010 4:32:09 PM

so is the fan running @100% all the time?
there should be some fan profile controls in the CCC...
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March 21, 2010 4:33:02 PM

No the fan is running at 35%...

when i use MSI afterburner and increase the fan to say... 70%, it sounds like the computer is litterally going to take off like a jet
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March 21, 2010 4:34:24 PM

I've been around computer gaming enough to know a defective fan when I hear it ^_^

This MSI is getting exchanged or returned one way or another, but I don't know what to do after that.
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a b U Graphics card
March 21, 2010 4:39:08 PM

If I were you, I'd RMA it and get my money back, then wait till Fermi is released and everything drops in price. You could just buy another 5770 after that and save some money.
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a b U Graphics card
March 21, 2010 4:39:11 PM

Is the MSI version the one with the huge fan and exposed PCB board? Get another manufacturer's card - some manufacturers have better fans/better cooling than others.
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a b U Graphics card
March 21, 2010 4:56:02 PM

So noise aside, are you not impressed with the performance ? Performance for the price ?
You could always go cheaper , like you suggested and go gts 250, gtx+, or even the xfx 4770.
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March 21, 2010 5:07:55 PM

This is the MSI i got, sorry i should have linked it earlier...

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

To be honest I havent even figured out the performance... The system is for the wife, who as of now tries to steal my rig every day to play dragon age. She intends to play through dragon age, the DA expansion, and get into guild wars 2 when it finally releases.

I hooked it up to my gear to make sure everything was working and install windows, just threw DA:o  on it but was forced to use the 720p TV as a monitor to check out the game on the new system (don't ask).

I am satisfied with the performance of my GTX 260 216, and from what i have hear the 5770 performs in between the 9800 gtx+ and the GTX 260, which seemed fine for $150. haven't gotten to try the thing out really. HDMI worked to output audio and video on first try which is nice.

jryan: That's whats floating around in my head as the best idea so far, but wouldn't price drops only come in the 5850 and 5870 level? And even if they dropped across the board, it wouldn't be for another month or so right?

After reading 100 1-egg revews about grey screens and vertical lines on the XFX 5770, I'm pretty scared of the 5770 now lol. But the price/performance seems right... bah i dunno. Maybe after fermi the 5830 will drop to $150! haha
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March 21, 2010 5:50:36 PM

Any other thoughts?
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March 21, 2010 5:58:07 PM

I wouldn't waste my money on outdated tech. Fermi is coming out in a week or so. Get your money and wait, or get another 5770. I know when Fermi comes out, it'll be the higher end cars first, but I'm sure the middle range will follow very soon.

As far as the problems with the 5770. They are all/mostly driver related. The newest drivers are pretty stable. I haven't had any problems with my 5770 since. Mine is an xfx and it's been up to 85c with the fan going no higher than 53% and I can not hear it over my other fans, which are all on 100%.
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March 21, 2010 6:31:32 PM

And yeah fermi cards are high high end in the price range. There isn't even any official word about mid range and low range models being made right? Therefore, if and when they are made we are still talking months later?

$150. Thats basically what i got. I can't imagine in the next couple weeks to a month there will be a new nVidia anywhere near that range. Plus if it releases at $150 it will likely be outperformed by the 5770 anyways which is discounted to $150.

Bah, if the stupid fan just didn't sound like a lawnmower I wouldn't have to still be figuring this out!

(which xfx 5770 do you have?)
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March 21, 2010 6:35:21 PM

Mid end Fermi models will start coming out in Summer.
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March 21, 2010 6:44:29 PM

I'm not sure. I've heard the Sapphire Vapor-X has the best cooling and is the quietest of the 5770 cards. I liked the reference design, so that's why I went with the 5770 I have. I don't really like that design.

Which MSI do you have? The one with dual fans?
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March 21, 2010 7:17:39 PM

mr2shim said:
I'm not sure. I've heard the Sapphire Vapor-X has the best cooling and is the quietest of the 5770 cards. I liked the reference design, so that's why I went with the 5770 I have. I don't really like that design.

Which MSI do you have? The one with dual fans?


ASUS Dark Knight cooler>Vapor X.

I don't know if they made a 5770 one yet.
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March 21, 2010 8:11:00 PM

So, no one thinks a 9800 GTX+ for $85 is a good plan?
No one thinks $99 for a GTS 250 1GB is a good idea?

I've tried to make the gaming usage clear. She will probably be playing 1 game at a time, and keeps coming back to saying "If it will play dragon age maxed, then thats great."

Think there will be any immediate response from ATI in terms of price cuts big rebates on 5770's?
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March 21, 2010 8:13:30 PM

Just stick to the 5770 like everyone in the thread said.
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March 21, 2010 9:42:16 PM

Yea, just stick to the 5770. The other cards are so old. It would be a waste of money, the difference will probably make you regret not sticking with the 5770. I was just playing dirt 2 with everything maxed out x8 AA on my 19" widescreen lowest frame I seen with FRAPS was 48, highest was around 65. That's plenty enough for most people. Unless you're insane and think you can see more than 35 frames per second.
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March 21, 2010 9:57:32 PM

Absolutely wouldn't consider the step down to either of the Nvidia based models you mentioned.
I don't think you'd be impressed after the 5770, they'd be too close to the performance of your original video card.
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March 21, 2010 9:59:23 PM

mr2shim said:
Yea, just stick to the 5770. The other cards are so old. It would be a waste of money, the difference will probably make you regret not sticking with the 5770. I was just playing dirt 2 with everything maxed out x8 AA on my 19" widescreen lowest frame I seen with FRAPS was 48, highest was around 65. That's plenty enough for most people. Unless you're insane and think you can see more than 35 frames per second.


The human eye can detect only 24 frames per second. However, even up to 60, more frames reduces jitters, and lessen the distance things move per frame, so even at 30+ you can sometimes see a difference in the distance things move per frame.
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March 21, 2010 11:55:34 PM

builderbobftw said:
Just stick to the 5770 like everyone in the thread said.


Actually, until you typed that, no one said definitively to stick to the 5770 :p 

Thanks for the thoughts all.

Last 2 things then:

1.) Does NewEgg actually charge the 15% restocking fee? I'd never even heard of it so I assume they don't actually charge it?
2.) Worth waiting an extra week or so then?... in hopes of some type of price cut on the 5770 because of NVidia finally getting back in the game?
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March 22, 2010 12:01:47 AM

1.) No, they try not to piss of customer's.

2.) RMA is a replacement, not a refund right?
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March 22, 2010 12:33:29 AM

I'd prefer a refund at this point. 2 MSI products ever used, both video cards, both have malfunctioning fans. I don't want to support that.

More strict on refund than replacement I assume, based on your question...

maybe a store credit then? I don't know.
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March 22, 2010 12:33:51 AM

Oh misread your statement. RMA is needed for replacement or refund at newegg.
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March 22, 2010 12:49:26 AM

You can get around it it you get in contact with a higher dept in newegg customer service. If you go into chat. Just ask for 2 tier or 3 tier. there is a guy I talked to who got my package next day aired to me for free because of a screw up newegg made. The lower tier workers wouldn't do anything for me.

Like I said before. Screw MSI, Get XFX 5770. Double lifetime warranty if you decide to sell it.

When you do online chat, immediately ask for the Escalations department. Just skip over those idiots completely. The guys name was Joshua L Key. Do a Google search on him and he is very helpful.

Just a little fyi, my situation was really complicated compared to yours. Someone forgot a shipping label so my package was brought back to newegg warehouse by ups, they were going to issue me an RMA and I had to wait for the refund and all that hoopla before I could reorder my parts. It was insane and stupid, but he fixed me up and next day aired me another package without waiting for a refund, and I got 50 bucks back.
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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 1:25:31 AM

Just be sure to let Newegg know it is defective and they should waive any restocking fees and also usually will give you a shipping label or account # to list on the UPS invoice - so they cover the Shipping it back to them. (of course they may not offer it until you raise a bit of a fuss over getting a defective product )

As far as the 5770 - I've got the Sapphire version with the egg shaped cooler and it is very quite running at 60% speed (the card idles at 38C and gets to the high 60s while gaming with the fan at that speed - compared to my old 7800GS that could heat the room even with the fan running at full speed) - So i'd suggest getting it swapped to another version instead of sticking with MSI.

Right now the XFX seems to be the best deal - ( Newegg Link ) - And I've always liked their double limetime warranty (lets you resell the card and the buyer still gets a lifetime warranty on the card so helps the resale value)
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March 22, 2010 1:56:31 AM

Thanks guys.

Newegg has been RIDICULOUSLY amazing with customer service for me so far, so i couldn't imagine even having to raise a stink, but i dont mind doing it either if necessary.

Seriously though, I put an item in my cart, and it increased in price $15 overnight. I went into chat, and they has no problem, after you complete your order contact us and we'll refund that $15, which they did. pretty cool. They always seem to want to help out. They must get paid based on those customer surveys when you end chat lol.

Anyways, I guess I'll wait til fermi's drop in 5 days and then buy an XFX 5770. Hopefully this: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

will have a rebate or something when the fermi drops. hey a guy can hope right?

I got the MSI because it had the full cooler on it. Bah.
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March 22, 2010 4:16:06 AM

Hmm any thoughts between these two cards? The sapphire price dropped to make both the sapphire and xfx 5770 $159.

Sapphire: ~ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
XFX: ~ http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

And hey it's only $139 I have to throw it into the mix...

Powercolor: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Just curious, I've never owned a product from any of the three manufacturers. I know the XFX has this special warranty apparently, but they also seems to have a lot of negative reviews. I know NOTHING of powercolor... just curious on your guys thoughts!

^_^
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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 6:32:45 AM

Powercolor sucks the big Gonzalez from anyone I've ever heard who has something to say about it.

If you're lucky and it works out of the box, great, you saved $15. But somewhere along the line, you're pretty likely to get the best of the Xinhua Province Experience, if you know what I mean.

I've bought a couple of Sapphire cards recently and been pretty happy with both, but honestly, XFX has a pretty decent reputation as well and you get the double warranty. You probably won't go wrong with either.

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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 12:42:50 PM

Also the PowerColor you linked is the 512MB version so only get it if you use a lwer res monitor and do not plan on upgrading or using much AA, etc. (is a good choice for someone on a small monitor and tight budget but otherwise ??)

The sapphire card is good also between the XFX and it is a coin flip - Sapphire normally has really good cooling and XFX has better warranty but again like the PowerColors and HIS card has only 1 Xfire connector on the board (only a problem if you plan on using triple or quad cards (so rarely a problem but worth mentioning when looking for a card just in case !) - at least it does still have the 2 DVI connectors unlike the other 2 brands so will rarely be an issue.

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March 22, 2010 2:59:07 PM

the powercolor i linked is a 1GB version. And at most ever I would like the option to run 2 cards. if that...

but a top end brand is worth the $15 I suppose.
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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 3:06:27 PM

xrome said:
the powercolor i linked is a 1GB version. And at most ever I would like the option to run 2 cards. if that...

but a top end brand is worth the $15 I suppose.

Oops - sorry was thinking it was this one - ( Linkie ) at the same price !! - though $7 cheaper since they throw in free shipping.
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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 3:21:49 PM

For those of you who don't know, with Neweggs RMA process, the best thing is to just call them on the phone. If you try and RMA online, you pay for shipping and the restocking fee, etc. If you just call them, they'll issue you an RMA, waive the restocking fee, AND issue you a shipping label. Much easier to do a 5 min phone call and have them do everything for you and just have to pack it up and take it to UPS than to fill all the info in yourself and pay for it:-)
Also- I would definitely go for a 5770 still- its generally very close to the performance of the GTX260. XFX with their double lifetime warranty is great as well, and sapphire is fine. Skip the powercolor though.
Also- the XFX is the only one that has a single Crossfire connector- like you said, its not a problem, but its interesting as my XFX 5750 has 2 of them!
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March 22, 2010 5:57:26 PM

JDFan said:
Oops - sorry was thinking it was this one - ( Linkie ) at the same price !! - though $7 cheaper since they throw in free shipping.


that used to be quite a good deal when it was 120$.
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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 6:21:57 PM

builderbobftw said:
The human eye can detect only 24 frames per second. However, even up to 60, more frames reduces jitters, and lessen the distance things move per frame, so even at 30+ you can sometimes see a difference in the distance things move per frame.


Human eye can notice very minute differences in movement (consciously or unconsciously).

He is somewhat right.

When you watch a movie, you notice it is all fluid but it is actually playing at 18 FPS, 24 FPS, 29fps etc. Why does it look smooth and fluid? Because of the motion blur implemented in movies. Games do not have this motion blur thus may appear lag at lower FPS.

The eye is not measured in FPS either but if one had to guess it's 24 frames per second, and jumping to 30 fps per second during moments of adrenaline/some other endorphin (thus giving you super human time warping abilities, jk). These numbers are variable as the eye does adjust to light. For example during bright places, things seem to flow smoother then in dark places.

If I remember correctly the maximum FPS in games the eye can sense difference in is 60~... After that it becomes impossible to tell a difference. This is of course was not taken from a scientific article or research paper so don't take it as fact.
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March 22, 2010 6:24:40 PM

AsAnAtheist said:
Human eye can notice very minute differences in movement (consciously or unconsciously).

Games do not have this motion blur thus may appear lag at lower FPS.



Soem games, (Crysis warhead, MW2 for starters) have motion blur effects.
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March 22, 2010 8:40:26 PM

flyinfinni said:
For those of you who don't know, with Neweggs RMA process, the best thing is to just call them on the phone. If you try and RMA online, you pay for shipping and the restocking fee, etc. If you just call them, they'll issue you an RMA, waive the restocking fee, AND issue you a shipping label. Much easier to do a 5 min phone call and have them do everything for you and just have to pack it up and take it to UPS than to fill all the info in yourself and pay for it:-)
Also- I would definitely go for a 5770 still- its generally very close to the performance of the GTX260. XFX with their double lifetime warranty is great as well, and sapphire is fine. Skip the powercolor though.
Also- the XFX is the only one that has a single Crossfire connector- like you said, its not a problem, but its interesting as my XFX 5750 has 2 of them!



I called Newegg and they took care of me. RMA accepted, paid shipping label emailed to me, full refund back to my credit card. I fricken love that company.

I guess at this point I might as well wait 1 week and see if ATI throws some rebates out when the nVidia cards release. $25 rebate on all 5770's sounds about right ^_^. Soo not going to happen, but whats waiting one more week just in case...
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March 22, 2010 8:42:27 PM

Yes, I'm hoping/dreaming about a 200$ 5850.
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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 8:50:53 PM

builderbobftw said:
Soem games, (Crysis warhead, MW2 for starters) have motion blur effects.


Your right but that motion blur is not what I was talking about. What I was talking about is actual motion blur from cameras/the eye not being able to capture movement at that speed. Something which can be considered similar to the effect of motion blur could be LCD lag also known as ghosting.

$200 HD 5850 is still a few years into the future.

Anyways it is unlikely that the fermi will impact the lower- mid range cards. The 470 will compete with the HD 5850~, and the 480 will compete with the HD 5870. There is no competition for the HD 5700's and lower therefore would not be wise to lower the price.. At the very best they will lower the HD 5850/HD 5870 back to original release price tags..
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March 22, 2010 8:52:58 PM

AsAnAtheist said:
Your right but that motion blur is not what I was talking about. What I was talking about is actual motion blur from cameras/the eye not being able to capture movement at that speed. Something which can be considered similar to the effect of motion blur could be LCD lag also known as ghosting.

$200 HD 5850 is still a few years into the future.

Anyways it is unlikely that the fermi will impact the lower- mid range cards. The 470 will compete with the HD 5850~, and the 480 will compete with the HD 5870. There is no competition for the HD 5700's and lower therefore would not be wise to lower the price.. At the very best they will lower the HD 5850/HD 5870 back to original release price tags..


What about a 260$ 5850 :( 

Maybe I could get one used for 200$ :wahoo: 
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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 9:22:11 PM

builderbobftw said:
What about a 260$ 5850 :( 

Maybe I could get one used for 200$ :wahoo: 


I smell $260-$270~ once fermi comes out but we'll see.

I doubt you'll get one for $200 used but you never know you might luck out.

Anyways at $260-$270 I can sell my 2x HD 4850's put in extra $$ and get my HD 5850. I will reach the 1ghz GPU club... One day..
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March 22, 2010 9:25:43 PM

I got my 4870 1gb used for 93$, I thoght I lucked out there....
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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 9:39:27 PM

Thats nice Bob- I'd actually be pretty happy if I could sell my 4870 for that these days, but its only the 512mb version of the Dark Knight. I could probably sell my 2x5750s for a couple hundred, but I just got them, so it wouldn't be worth it.
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March 22, 2010 9:42:15 PM

Try selling you're 4870 512mb on Ebay.

I actualy got 2 cards, a 1gb and a 4870 512mb for 190$, I was able to sell the 4870 512mb for 117$ and keep the 1gb for meself.
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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 9:46:40 PM

Well, I actually put it into my wife's computer, so I don't need to sell it yet, more of a hypothetical situation where it would be a good value for me:-)
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March 22, 2010 10:00:44 PM

Ah,OK.

Also, Can you explain what convinced you to buy a 5750Cf as opposed to a 5850 or a 5770Cf, or a 4850 1gb CF? Or even a GTs 250 Sli, or a 4890?

Not trying to question you, simply curious.
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a b U Graphics card
March 22, 2010 10:16:57 PM

builderbobftw said:
Ah,OK.

Also, Can you explain what convinced you to buy a 5750Cf as opposed to a 5850 or a 5770Cf, or a 4850 1gb CF? Or even a GTs 250 Sli, or a 4890?

Not trying to question you, simply curious.

You haven't been paying attention, this isn't the first time his 5750 crossfire has perplexed you. He told you before , he received one as a gift (for nothing), and got a good deal on a 2nd to crossfire.
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!