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D70 vs Nikon 8800

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Anonymous
December 6, 2004 3:40:54 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Apples and Oranges be damned. Here are my thoughts on both after spending a
whole day with my new D70.

After a disappointing experience with the coolpix 8800 from Nikon I decided to
return the 8800 in favor of the D70 DSLR from Nikon with the Nikkor 18-70mm
lens kit. Like some people, I was under the (silly!) impression that the 8800
could deliver near DSLR like shooting in a more compact camera. Not even
close…especially if you shoot with challenging lighting conditions (low
contrast).
The D70 camera comes packed in a single box with the lens. There is also:
Camera strap, eyepiece cap, body and lens caps, lens hood, LCD protective
cover, battery & Charger, batter tray for spare store-bought batteries. I added
a UV filter of course. The difference in price after rebate was approximately
250.00.
I charged the battery and read the manual, not a careful read, but enough to
get started. On the VERY FIRST SHOT, the D70 was able to photograph by
13-week-old son against a background that gave the 8800 fits. In fact, the 8800
often missed these shots entirely. The D70 focused SO FAST, I was shocked.
There was no hunting. I zoomed in fully and tried again. Another tack sharp
shot. Wonderful. Back at the computer those shots showed an image sharper and
more balanced than the 8800 ever managed and this was on the D70's supposedly
poor AUTO mode.
Encouraged, I switched the camera to manual focus mode and fired off a group of
shots. Again, tack sharp results. The camera will even tell you when it thinks
focus is correct, though you can defeat this if you wish. It seems very
reliable and consistent.
After my first few moments with the camera I noticed something else. As my
son's expressions changed I was able to get those fleeting moments because the
camera had no lag! My wife won't let me open the SB600 until Xmas, but I'm very
excited about how it will expand the flash and focus abilities of the D70. I
love the manual focus. In itself it places the D70 in another league, making
for a truly manual camera. Image quality is superior across the board. Unless
the size of the D70 is too much for you, the D70 is the camera to buy. And
let's face facts here, the 8800 is no lightweight. I simply can't recommend the
8800 for indoor shooting. The 8800 is also a dead end. When the D70 grows old,
you can sell the body and still be ready with lenses!
So far the D70 has addressed all of the 8800's weaknesses and then some. It's
focus is nothing short of amazing. With three poor contrast objects (a bouncer,
gray sneakers on gray carpet, silver tripod folded on gray carpet), the camera
shifted focus instantly and perfectly as I nudged the lens from one item to the
next under poor indirect lighting.
ISO up to 1600…and it's usable through most of the range.
It feels like a real camera and is easier to hold as well. If the Nikkor
18-70mm was the ONLY lens you ever had, it would stand head and shoulders above
the 8800. Some folks with chatter on about comparing apples and oranges. But
these are both expensive cameras (quite close in price really), both fairly
heavy and both for the more advanced shooter. Quite a few folks will look at
the D70 and wonder if the 8800 will keep them just as happy. If you have ANY
doubts, please test the 8800 before buying. If the D70 is a possible
alternative, go for it! You won't be sorry. It's the real deal.

Capt RB

More about : d70 nikon 8800

Anonymous
December 6, 2004 4:22:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bobsprit wrote:
> I simply can't recommend the 8800 for indoor shooting.

I would have thought that the 8400 would have been a more suitable camera
for indoor work with its fast auto-focus and 24mm wide-angle.

David
Anonymous
December 6, 2004 5:14:45 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

> I simply can't recommend the 8800 for indoor shooting.

I would have thought that the 8400 would have been a more suitable camera
for indoor work with its fast auto-focus and 24mm wide-angle.>>>


You're correct, but I've read that the whole Coolpix series has inferior AF
compared to other cameras. It seems most of the folks who own the 8800 don't
have a Minolta Z3 to test against it. The Z1 even did better on AF. I'm pro
Nikon, but pretty saddened by the 8800.

RB
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Anonymous
December 6, 2004 5:37:10 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bobsprit wrote:
>> I simply can't recommend the 8800 for indoor shooting.
>
> I would have thought that the 8400 would have been a more suitable
> camera for indoor work with its fast auto-focus and 24mm
> wide-angle.>>>
>
>
> You're correct, but I've read that the whole Coolpix series has
> inferior AF compared to other cameras. It seems most of the folks who
> own the 8800 don't have a Minolta Z3 to test against it. The Z1 even
> did better on AF. I'm pro Nikon, but pretty saddened by the 8800.
>
> RB

Well, my tests would have been against the Panasonic FZ20, but I do agree
that the 8800 does not stand up well against some of today's competition.
All my /other/ cameras are Nikon!

Cheers,
David
Anonymous
December 6, 2004 6:44:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Actually, the apples and oranges analogy is a good one, since your initial
purchase was an apple, but you really needed an orange...
I believe the 8800 has a focus assist light...did it not work in the
situations you described?
cheers...MTB


"Bobsprit" <bobsprit@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20041206074054.08096.00001633@mb-m07.aol.com...
> Apples and Oranges be damned. Here are my thoughts on both after spending
a
> whole day with my new D70.
>
> After a disappointing experience with the coolpix 8800 from Nikon I
decided to
> return the 8800 in favor of the D70 DSLR from Nikon with the Nikkor
18-70mm
> lens kit. Like some people, I was under the (silly!) impression that the
8800
> could deliver near DSLR like shooting in a more compact camera. Not even
> close.especially if you shoot with challenging lighting conditions (low
> contrast).
> The D70 camera comes packed in a single box with the lens. There is also:
> Camera strap, eyepiece cap, body and lens caps, lens hood, LCD protective
> cover, battery & Charger, batter tray for spare store-bought batteries. I
added
> a UV filter of course. The difference in price after rebate was
approximately
> 250.00.
> I charged the battery and read the manual, not a careful read, but enough
to
> get started. On the VERY FIRST SHOT, the D70 was able to photograph by
> 13-week-old son against a background that gave the 8800 fits. In fact, the
8800
> often missed these shots entirely. The D70 focused SO FAST, I was shocked.
> There was no hunting. I zoomed in fully and tried again. Another tack
sharp
> shot. Wonderful. Back at the computer those shots showed an image sharper
and
> more balanced than the 8800 ever managed and this was on the D70's
supposedly
> poor AUTO mode.
> Encouraged, I switched the camera to manual focus mode and fired off a
group of
> shots. Again, tack sharp results. The camera will even tell you when it
thinks
> focus is correct, though you can defeat this if you wish. It seems very
> reliable and consistent.
> After my first few moments with the camera I noticed something else. As my
> son's expressions changed I was able to get those fleeting moments because
the
> camera had no lag! My wife won't let me open the SB600 until Xmas, but I'm
very
> excited about how it will expand the flash and focus abilities of the D70.
I
> love the manual focus. In itself it places the D70 in another league,
making
> for a truly manual camera. Image quality is superior across the board.
Unless
> the size of the D70 is too much for you, the D70 is the camera to buy. And
> let's face facts here, the 8800 is no lightweight. I simply can't
recommend the
> 8800 for indoor shooting. The 8800 is also a dead end. When the D70 grows
old,
> you can sell the body and still be ready with lenses!
> So far the D70 has addressed all of the 8800's weaknesses and then some.
It's
> focus is nothing short of amazing. With three poor contrast objects (a
bouncer,
> gray sneakers on gray carpet, silver tripod folded on gray carpet), the
camera
> shifted focus instantly and perfectly as I nudged the lens from one item
to the
> next under poor indirect lighting.
> ISO up to 1600.and it's usable through most of the range.
> It feels like a real camera and is easier to hold as well. If the Nikkor
> 18-70mm was the ONLY lens you ever had, it would stand head and shoulders
above
> the 8800. Some folks with chatter on about comparing apples and oranges.
But
> these are both expensive cameras (quite close in price really), both
fairly
> heavy and both for the more advanced shooter. Quite a few folks will look
at
> the D70 and wonder if the 8800 will keep them just as happy. If you have
ANY
> doubts, please test the 8800 before buying. If the D70 is a possible
> alternative, go for it! You won't be sorry. It's the real deal.
>
> Capt RB
Anonymous
December 6, 2004 8:59:09 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Well, my tests would have been against the Panasonic FZ20, but I do agree
that the 8800 does not stand up well against some of today's competition. >>

Let me add that it DOES stand up well in situations that don't challenge it's
AF system.

RB
December 7, 2004 12:34:19 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

bobsprit@aol.com (Bobsprit) wrote in
news:20041206074054.08096.00001633@mb-m07.aol.com:

> Apples and Oranges be damned. Here are my thoughts on both after
> spending a whole day with my new D70.
>
>

Thanks for your thoughts. I'm currently using a CP 5000, which is capable
of nice results, but it gives me fits with moving subjects. I was pretty
excited by the prospects of the 8400, but then I saw the D70 was nearly the
same price.

I have been trying to make a decision about that (although I'm not buying
anything any time soon). I tried out a D70 in the store for a few minutes,
and I was pretty impressed, and your thoughts seem to give weight to my
speculations.

In my case, I could buy the D70, and keep the 5000 as a smaller lighter
alternative for those situations where I don't want to carry around an SLR.

Bob

--
Delete the inverse SPAM to reply
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 1:34:25 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I believe the 8800 has a focus assist light...did it not work in the
situations you described?>>>

I bought a rotten apple. The Assist light range is pretty weak.

RB
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 1:44:04 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I have the CP5000 and I recently bought the D70. NIGHT and DAY difference.
After getting fustrated with the CP5000 - which otherwise was a fine camera
that accompanied me to a few vacations and took many great pictures - taking
pictures of my cousin's 17mths old running around, I tried my hand on my
uncle's Canon 10D, and I was hooked. I was convinced that the added weight
is worth it. Compare to the CP5000, the D70 has much better picture
quality, much faster AF performance (day or night), much larger buffer, no
shutter lag... on and on and on...


"bob" <usenetMAPS@2fiddles.com> wrote in message
news:Xns95B7DB89F77C9bobatcarolnet@216.196.97.142...
> bobsprit@aol.com (Bobsprit) wrote in
> news:20041206074054.08096.00001633@mb-m07.aol.com:
>
> > Apples and Oranges be damned. Here are my thoughts on both after
> > spending a whole day with my new D70.
> >
> >
>
> Thanks for your thoughts. I'm currently using a CP 5000, which is capable
> of nice results, but it gives me fits with moving subjects. I was pretty
> excited by the prospects of the 8400, but then I saw the D70 was nearly
the
> same price.
>
> I have been trying to make a decision about that (although I'm not buying
> anything any time soon). I tried out a D70 in the store for a few minutes,
> and I was pretty impressed, and your thoughts seem to give weight to my
> speculations.
>
> In my case, I could buy the D70, and keep the 5000 as a smaller lighter
> alternative for those situations where I don't want to carry around an
SLR.
>
> Bob
>
> --
> Delete the inverse SPAM to reply
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 7:13:15 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

And if there is any doubt, Steve's Digital just reviewed the 8800 fully:

He liked the camera, but....And I quote:

"With the 8800's 10x lens you need a high power AF-assist lamp, the builtin one
barely covers to five feet at telephoto focal lengths. It took several years of
complaining before the top-end Coolpix cameras controlled the zoom head so I
guess it will be another couple of years before they can use the AF
illuminator. I sure wish the 35mm film, dSLR and Coolpix engineering and design
people at Nikon were all on the same page."

And still more reasons for the D70...

"Autofocus performance drops off in low ambient lighting at moderate to
telephoto focal lengths where the aperture is slower; it frequently hunts for
focus through its entire range, and sometimes fails to focus. The 8800 can be
focused manually, but it offers only an ungraduated distance scale, and it does
not magnify the viewfinder image so that critical focus can be observed. This
is a major mistake for a prosumer level camera of this caliber to lack an
essential feature that is found on many lesser cameras."

End of Story for the 8800 unless you like buying Sharper Image type cameras!

Capt RB
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 7:34:07 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Archived from bobsprit@aol.com (Bobsprit) on 06 Dec 2004 12:40:54 GMT:

>Apples and Oranges be damned. Here are my thoughts on both after spending a
>whole day with my new D70.

Ignoring the differences between apples and oranges lowers your credibility.
Here's a credible review, which does account for the differences between the
Nikon 8800 and the Nikon D70.

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/CP8800/CP88A2.HTM

vm
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 12:28:54 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bob....this is an interesting thread you started since I'm currently looking
at the Nikon 8800, 8400 the Canon G6, and waiting for the KM A200 to
appear.... I presently have a Canon G2...
I just read the Steve's Digicam review...and you're quoting specific
comments but ignoring some others...and this gets back to the apple vs
oranges analogy..specifically Steve wrote....

"Bottom line - the Coolpix 8800's combination of image quality, resolution,
zoom range and Vibration Reduction are unmatched at the time of this review
(December 2004). With an MSRP of about $1,000, the Coolpix 8800 competes
with consumer-class dSLR's like the D70 and Canon Digital Rebel. If it's
digicam features you crave, the family-friendly 8800 is your answer; you'll
not find a dSLR that captures smooth VGA-sized 30fps movies, built-in macro
capability, Best Shot Selector, or flexible vari-angle LCD viewfinder. On
the other hand if you need the versatility of interchangeable lenses,
shooting performance, optical TTL viewfinder and superior image quality
(especially at higher ISOs) then you'll want a digital SLR. The value
equation tilts favorably to the 8800 if you need Vibration Reduction. Most
dSLR's implement VR or Image Stabilization in the lens, and in it costs
dearly; the Nikon 70-200 f/2.8D Autofocus Lens with VR lists for about
$1,500, while you can get the entire Coolpix 8800 camera and its VR lens for
under $1,000. It's great to have choices, but sometimes the decision is
difficult; have a look at our Sample Photos to help your decision making
process...."

No doubt the 8800 doesn't work well on manual focus or in dim
lighting....there is no one camera that will perform well under all
situations, nor is there a single camera that has every feature/convenience
imaginable....you have to know your needs before making any purchase....
cheers...MTB



"Bobsprit" <bobsprit@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20041206231315.06251.00000882@mb-m27.aol.com...
> And if there is any doubt, Steve's Digital just reviewed the 8800 fully:
>
> He liked the camera, but....And I quote:
>
> "With the 8800's 10x lens you need a high power AF-assist lamp, the
builtin one
> barely covers to five feet at telephoto focal lengths. It took several
years of
> complaining before the top-end Coolpix cameras controlled the zoom head so
I
> guess it will be another couple of years before they can use the AF
> illuminator. I sure wish the 35mm film, dSLR and Coolpix engineering and
design
> people at Nikon were all on the same page."
>
> And still more reasons for the D70...
>
> "Autofocus performance drops off in low ambient lighting at moderate to
> telephoto focal lengths where the aperture is slower; it frequently hunts
for
> focus through its entire range, and sometimes fails to focus. The 8800 can
be
> focused manually, but it offers only an ungraduated distance scale, and it
does
> not magnify the viewfinder image so that critical focus can be observed.
This
> is a major mistake for a prosumer level camera of this caliber to lack an
> essential feature that is found on many lesser cameras."
>
> End of Story for the 8800 unless you like buying Sharper Image type
cameras!
>
> Capt RB
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 1:40:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Ignoring the differences between apples and oranges lowers your credibility.
Here's a credible review, which does account for the differences between the
Nikon 8800 and the Nikon D70.>>>

Apples amd Oranges are no excuse for the what is clearly a flawed product.
Forget the D70 and consider that a lowly Minolta Z1 does better on focus.
People need to stop making excused based on brand loyalty.

RB
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 3:48:13 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Apples amd Oranges are no excuse for the what is clearly a flawed product.
Forget the D70 and consider that a lowly Minolta Z1 does better on focus.
People need to stop making excused based on brand loyalty.>>>

I mean to say that the Z1 does better on focus than the 8800. The D70 AF is
nothing short of a miracle.

RB
December 7, 2004 6:11:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I.Reject.Spam@my.isp wrote in
news:3patd.5729$nP1.5130@twister.socal.rr.com:

> Ignoring the differences between apples and oranges lowers your
> credibility. Here's a credible review, which does account for the
> differences between the Nikon 8800 and the Nikon D70.
>
>

I don't think he was ignoring the differences as much as discussing them.
How can one choose between an apple and an orange if one doesn't know how
each tastes?

The review you cited is interesting, and helps explain some of the other
differences: If one's primary interest is hand holding long focal lengths
then the 8800 has a clear advantage.

(other) Bob
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 7:45:52 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Archived from bob <Jwx1.nothing@bellsouth.net> on Tue, 07 Dec 2004 15:11:38
GMT:

>I.Reject.Spam@my.isp wrote in
>news:3patd.5729$nP1.5130@twister.socal.rr.com:
>
>> Ignoring the differences between apples and oranges lowers your
>> credibility. Here's a credible review, which does account for the
>> differences between the Nikon 8800 and the Nikon D70.
>>
>>
>
>I don't think he was ignoring the differences as much as discussing them.
>How can one choose between an apple and an orange if one doesn't know how
>each tastes?


>(other) Bob

I agree that both apples and oranges should be tasted to understand the
differences, although my effort to shoot a landscape with an orange was not
as successful as doing so with an apple. :) 

I could be wrong, it didn't read like a discussion, but more like a
one-sided rant. Folks should not make buying decisions based upon a rant or
one person's jaundiced opinion. They really should take the time to
research the issue for themselves. Granted, the jaundiced opinion has its
place and factoring it into the overall equation can be part of the process.
Caveat Emptor. Cheers.

vm
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 7:54:47 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

<I.Reject.Spam@my.isp> wrote in message
news:VZktd.6825$nP1.6360@twister.socal.rr.com...
> Archived from bobsprit@aol.com (Bobsprit) on 07 Dec 2004 12:48:13 GMT:
>
> After repeatedly sending them back to Nikon for adjustment (D70 under
> warranty, D100 cost me) these cameras were still not satisfactory. Do I
> think they are flawed? Not flawed, just unsuitable for my purposes. I
> have
> this month given them both away to friends.

Can I be your friend when you want to give the next generation of Nikon
dSLRs away ?
December 7, 2004 9:20:19 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I.Reject.Spam@my.isp wrote in
news:47ltd.3368$hd.1538@twister.socal.rr.com:

> Granted, the jaundiced opinion has its
> place and factoring it into the overall
> equation can be part of the process.
> Caveat Emptor. Cheers.
>

Yes, exactly. Several people have commented on the 8x00 v. D70 recently.
I think the comparison is natural, because they are in the same price
range. If other people seem to have similar needs and desires (to me) and
if they find one camera particularly better suited for thier situation,
then I can investige along those lines to see if I reach the same
conclusions they did.

Bob
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 9:42:24 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 06 Dec 2004 12:40:54 GMT, in rec.photo.digital bobsprit@aol.com
(Bobsprit) wrote:

>Apples and Oranges be damned. Here are my thoughts on both after spending a
>whole day with my new D70.

You just don't get it. It has nothing to do with whether or not the 8800 is
a good or bad camera. In fact I think it's a bad one and have recommended
the Panasonic FZs just in the past week to coworker instead, based on what
I know, what I've read and comments here by David Taylor, given our similar
history with Nikon CPs. I myself have upgraded from a CP-990 to a CP-5700
and now to a to the D70. I've been quite vocal here in regard to how I
found the whole 5700 package (converter lenses included) to the 990
package. So, I'm not a Nikon uber alles lover.

The key point I'm trying to make is I believe you could substitute ANY P&S
camera for the 8800 and any dslr and make similar judgements with regard to
focus. Does this man that the lower light focusing performance of the 8800
is not lacking, imo no. By design the start up A/F performance and recycles
times of all dslrs are far and above those of any P&S. There may be better
P&S cameras, but this performance distinction between the two classes
exists. Had you just posted you second round of comments on using the 8800
without any comparison to the D70 and I would be quick to agree. Your first
"review" wasn't as critical. Probably since you were just getting around to
using it under these situations. As you yourself have said the CPs have
long had some issues with low level light focusing. So why did you buy it
knowing this?

Why do I wish to belabor this? The reason is a dslr is not for everyone. In
fact you will see at least two prolific contributors to this forum (David
and Frank) who are former slr shooters who have moved to the prosumer class
for specific reasons. And yes, you give up something moving to a dslr, what
you get in return you pay for in other aspects. I still use my 990 for
things neither the 5700, nor the D70 can do as well, if at all. It all
depends upon the type of photos you nee to take and how important certain
aspects of a camera's performance are important to you. Everyone's needs
are different. I still have the fisheye for the 5700 and just used it
recently to take photos in our local control room during the Hyper-X Mach
10 scramjet powered flight. Am I ever going to buy a fisheye for my D70, I
seriously doubt it. There's a capability of the 8800 you've dismissed, the
relatively cheap ability to have a fisheye. Is this important to you,
probably not, but that's one of the many trades one has to make between the
two classes of cameras. Frankly right now, I'd still recommend the 5700 for
many uses given it's price if the additional capability provided by match
converter lenses is important. Other than that the FZ seem the way to go,
imo.

I agree with your conclusions, just not the argument you make to get there.

....Much other stuff snipped.
________________________________________________________
Ed Ruf Lifetime AMA# 344007 (Usenet@EdwardG.Ruf.com)
http://EdwardGRuf.com
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 9:46:06 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 07 Dec 2004 12:48:13 GMT, in rec.photo.digital bobsprit@aol.com
(Bobsprit) wrote:

>The D70 AF is
>nothing short of a miracle.

This is exactly what I mean when I say you are comparing apples and
oranges. By dslr standards the D70 is not a miracle. If you don't
understand that then you are failing to recognize what is expected of even
the lowest dslr.
________________________________________________________
Ed Ruf Lifetime AMA# 344007 (Usenet@EdwardG.Ruf.com)
http://EdwardGRuf.com
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 10:16:17 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

No doubt the 8800 doesn't work well on manual focus or in dim
lighting....there is no one camera that will perform well under all
situations, >>

Please keep in mind that Steve's reviews tend to work hard at being positive
most of the time. He has to if he wants to keep his site going. It's very tough
at all to find really negative reviews. But Steve DOES mention problems and
informed readers take notice. The AF problem for the 8800 is pretty bad,
coupled with the weak AF assist light and dead manual focus feature. Steve's
happy endings are always the same. You have to absorb the whole review to get
the real story.
When cameras from Minolta, Sony, Panasoni or Pentax avoid these issues, I see
no reason to let Nikon off the hook. The 8800 is simply not state of the art in
its AF system and that's a dealbreaker for me at that price point. If the
camera had some hue issues, or just the lag or even some fringing, I'd say
"what the heck." But we're talking about FOCUS here. It's a big problem. And
all I'm doing is inviting folks to check it out for themselves. I don't care
about apples and oranges. I want cameras that get sharp shots most or all of
the time. The Nikon 8800 and Canon G2 Failed. The Nikon D70, Minolta Z1, Pentax
Optio S5I, Sony 828 and others succeeded. I won't trade focus ability for VR,
no way, no how.

Capt RB
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 10:17:12 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

If one's primary interest is hand holding long focal lengths
then the 8800 has a clear advantage. >>>


Easy to say unless the AF system is hunting and missing focus again and again.

RB
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 10:19:09 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Can I be your friend when you want to give the next generation of Nikon
dSLRs away ?>>>


Me too!!! Me Too!!!


Capt RB
Anonymous
December 8, 2004 7:40:42 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

This is exactly what I mean when I say you are comparing apples and
oranges. By dslr standards the D70 is not a miracle.>>>

Thanks for your comments. How does the entry level D70 fall short in focus
compared to higher end units???

Meanwhile, on the 8800, Let me quantify things a bit...

In low light, my lowly Minolta Z1 could focus at moderate telephoto. The 8800
had trouble with this. In VERY dim light my Pentax Optio S5I can focus VERY
well. The 8800 had no prayer if the AF assist short range was expired.
Now...the D70 has not missed a focus for me yet. Sure 3 days of shooting isn't
a lot, but I've also shot a lot. I wasn;t sure how well the D70 would focus.
Coming from the world of regular digicams I'm understandibly impressed. But the
8800 was a step BACKWARD among most of the cameras I've had. That's the long
and short of it.

Capt RB
Anonymous
December 8, 2004 7:40:43 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 08 Dec 2004 04:40:42 GMT, in rec.photo.digital bobsprit@aol.com
(Bobsprit) wrote:

>This is exactly what I mean when I say you are comparing apples and
>oranges. By dslr standards the D70 is not a miracle.>>>
>
>Thanks for your comments. How does the entry level D70 fall short in focus
>compared to higher end units???


Who said it falls short. I simply stated it's AF performance wasn't a
miracle as you classified it. This type of performance is what is to be
expected.
________________________________________________________
Ed Ruf Lifetime AMA# 344007 (Usenet@EdwardG.Ruf.com)
http://EdwardGRuf.com
Anonymous
January 7, 2005 11:30:51 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

For some reason Bobsprit or Capt RB like to slam the 8800. He is one
multiple sites posting negative comment after negative comment. I'm
not sure why. He shoulb be careful because I've seen companies come
after posters like this. Anyway, Bobsprit didn't have the 8800 long
enough to understand how the camera works or how to overcome any
shortfalls it has. The 8800 is not in the same league as the D70. The
D70 is a much larger camera that requires multiple lenses to get the
same focal length as what you get with the 8800. Price out a D70 body
and the Nikkor lenses, and VF. Besides the extra bulk you also have to
deal with swapping out lenses, etc. That being said the D70 is an
excellent camera and does a lot of things right. The only real gripes
I have is that the D70 has a plastic body, no swivel out LCD and the
build quality seems to be on the light side. The lack of a swivel out
LCD could be a deal breaker for some. I wrote a mini review about the
8800 so I'm not going to get into all the things is does great and all
the bells and whistles. However, I will tell you that the AF system on
this camera is very quick. The only problem that arise is when you try
to focus in a very dim lit room. Turn on a light and the camera will
focus fine or even with light from another room. Put the lens in the
wide position and you can focus in very low light. The zoom will
decrease the light coming into the camera and will make it so the
camera can't lock onto your subject when there is very little light.
How many times do you shoot in these conditions? Now lets talk speed.
In Fine mode the camera rates in at under 2.5 seconds per shoot. Not
in the same league as the D70 but for what the camera does these are
very respectable numbers and plenty fast for 90% of all situations.
There is also multi shot mode if you need to take several shots in a
row. Fine mode is excellent and I've compared many shots to RAW images
and there is not that much of a difference. A Raw shot has a lag of
about 9 seconds per shot and after 5 shoots the camera slows down some
more. If you're a pro and want RAW shots then the D70 may be the way
to go. All else said the 8800 is an excellent camera, has a robust AF
system that will work in 95% of all situations and is a very fast
camera in Fine mode. So don't let anyone sway you. Go to your local
camera store and try the different cameras out yourself. If you have
the bucks and don't mind the bulk or lugging around lenses then the D70
is the way to go - no question. If you want an all-in-one camera that
takes incredible shots and is compact then the 8800 is the ticket.
This debate is not black and white.
Anonymous
January 8, 2005 11:32:37 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I am in the market for a digital camera and the Nikon 8800 is in my top
5 list. I tried a few demo models 8800 at my local camera stores and its
seems the 8800 is very slow focusing. Can someone who owns this camera
give me their opinion on this. What other digital camera 7/8 megapixal
would have a faster focus time, non-SLR.

Thanks,

JR
traderfjp@yahoo.com wrote:
> For some reason Bobsprit or Capt RB like to slam the 8800. He is one
> multiple sites posting negative comment after negative comment. I'm
> not sure why. He shoulb be careful because I've seen companies come
> after posters like this. Anyway, Bobsprit didn't have the 8800 long
> enough to understand how the camera works or how to overcome any
> shortfalls it has. The 8800 is not in the same league as the D70. The
> D70 is a much larger camera that requires multiple lenses to get the
> same focal length as what you get with the 8800. Price out a D70 body
> and the Nikkor lenses, and VF. Besides the extra bulk you also have to
> deal with swapping out lenses, etc. That being said the D70 is an
> excellent camera and does a lot of things right. The only real gripes
> I have is that the D70 has a plastic body, no swivel out LCD and the
> build quality seems to be on the light side. The lack of a swivel out
> LCD could be a deal breaker for some. I wrote a mini review about the
> 8800 so I'm not going to get into all the things is does great and all
> the bells and whistles. However, I will tell you that the AF system on
> this camera is very quick. The only problem that arise is when you try
> to focus in a very dim lit room. Turn on a light and the camera will
> focus fine or even with light from another room. Put the lens in the
> wide position and you can focus in very low light. The zoom will
> decrease the light coming into the camera and will make it so the
> camera can't lock onto your subject when there is very little light.
> How many times do you shoot in these conditions? Now lets talk speed.
> In Fine mode the camera rates in at under 2.5 seconds per shoot. Not
> in the same league as the D70 but for what the camera does these are
> very respectable numbers and plenty fast for 90% of all situations.
> There is also multi shot mode if you need to take several shots in a
> row. Fine mode is excellent and I've compared many shots to RAW images
> and there is not that much of a difference. A Raw shot has a lag of
> about 9 seconds per shot and after 5 shoots the camera slows down some
> more. If you're a pro and want RAW shots then the D70 may be the way
> to go. All else said the 8800 is an excellent camera, has a robust AF
> system that will work in 95% of all situations and is a very fast
> camera in Fine mode. So don't let anyone sway you. Go to your local
> camera store and try the different cameras out yourself. If you have
> the bucks and don't mind the bulk or lugging around lenses then the D70
> is the way to go - no question. If you want an all-in-one camera that
> takes incredible shots and is compact then the 8800 is the ticket.
> This debate is not black and white.
>


--
Joel Rubinstein
HM: 503-579-4169
Cell: 503-504-4700
Anonymous
January 8, 2005 2:19:00 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I have had one for a month coupled to a Nikon SB80DX Speedlight for
basketball games.
A 45 year no-picture taking span inmy life, so I am a raw novice at the
very best.
You can see the results I got last night by looking here:
http://imageevent.com/dvds4bmx/metepboys
You can see the progress or lack of it by looking here:
http://imageevent.com/dvds4bmx

You always find what you seek. Be it good or bad. I like the Coolpix
8800. Hope it is just my first good digital.


Regards,
Novice BobSam
January 8, 2005 10:22:26 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

The debate is just that, a debate.

Whether Nikon likes it or not, people are entitled to express
their opinions. Maybe not in Japan but certainly in the US.
Anything or anyone who would abridge free speech should
be looked at carefully.

--
Wolf (a happy Nikon dslr owner)
----------------------------------------------------------------
Please post all responses to UseNet. All email cheerfully and automagically
routed to Dave Null
Anonymous
January 9, 2005 1:15:17 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Wolf- I agree but I couldn't call you a criminal or take out ads about
you and not get sued and prosecuted. RB is on a quest with countless
posts knocking their flagship product. He would have to prove his
assertions if they decided to prosecute. You can't make things up
about someone or a product without reprise. He seems to have a hard on
for Nikon. I won the camera and it's a great little camera. It's not
suppose to have the same performace as the D70. Just as a Buick will
not have the same luxury as a Cadillac yet both are made by GM.
Anonymous
January 9, 2005 5:04:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

<< You can see the progress or lack of it >>

Hi Bob,

Very nice job. Great pics.

Best,

Conrad


Conrad Weiler
Camp Sherman, Oregon
!