Best pump for radiator in separate room

[rich0]

I'm contemplating water cooling for the purpose of moving the heat from my PCs to another room. I'm also looking to improve cooling of my CPUs, though if that were my only goal I'd likely do it in another way (current cooling is not adequate - the one CPU ends up throttling to 80% fairly often).

I'm interested in opinions on what pump would be best for this purpose.

Some preferences:
1. Would prefer something that runs on 120V - otherwise I have to buy an adapter. The pump won't be in the same room as the PCs. One of the PCs is powered 24x7 anyway, but I don't care if the pump runs when the PCs are both off.
2. Would prefer less power use if possible, and less noise (though that matters less - it is going in a basement storage room).

The setup:
My plan is to run the loop through two CPU blocks (two separate computers). Then it will run into a reservoir and down through the floor into the basement. There it would run into the pump and then into the radiator and back up into the office. The reservoir needs to be at the highest point I believe (otherwise it can't be filled and I'd need a T), but having it right before the pump should make it easy to fill that line and prime the pump.

I'm not quite sure what I'll use for a radiator - I might see if I can find a heater core, and if not I'll probably pick a decent 2-3 fan unit, improvise a shroud, and stick a 120V cabinet fan on it (again, trying to avoid 12V adapters, but if I end up having 12V power to spare I'll use it). I have two Phenom II's to cool, and one runs fairly loaded, so I figure that means 400W peak. From what I've been reading the radiator should be adequate with maybe 10-15 delta-T.

Any suggestions? Most of the recommended pumps are all 12V and of course things like noise/size/etc are big concerns in their design. I could care less if the pump is 2 ft^3 in size if it doesn't waste power. Most of the AC pumps tend to be immersion, and that would mean improvising a reservoir and putting it at the top of the loop in the office. I'd prefer to avoid that.

I may just bite the bullet and get one of the well-rated pumps and a 12V AC adapter, but I figured I'd see if anybody had any alternative suggestions. The only real differences from a standard setup as I see it should be the preference for 120V, the lack of constraints around size, and perhaps some consideration for flow resistance in the much longer tubing run (probably upwards of 20 feet of tubing in the loop - with about 8 ft being vertical not that this should matter).

 

[manofchalk]

You could just buy a low wattage PSU for ~$40 and leave it jumpered permanently. That would allow you to stick with mainstream components and leave the pump constantly running.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139026&Tpk=CX430W

Not sure how the additional size will impact your pump choice, but something tells me you will definitely be wanting to run more than one. Having two D5 pumps in series would do the trick I think, but I admit I'm not the best source for this kind of information.
4Ryan6 might be able to help, he runs a fairly large (space-wise) loop and will know a thing or two about how it affects pump needs.

The reservoir doesnt need to be at the highest point, though as you said it does make filling the loop easy. Otherwise all you have to do is keep power cycling, the res will drain and you just keep topping it up until the water flows smoothly.
You might want to get a large reservoir, otherwise that will take a fair bit of time with a loop of this size.

A triple rad should be enough for what your after, though more radiator is never a bad thing.

 

[wdmfiber]

That's ridiculous... thanks for sharing it with us!

I recommend a fish tank water pump, they just plug into an outlet. There are many ways you can do the plumbing, since you didn't say much about line size and adapters, I guess you have a plan. (20ft loop all the same size? or bigger line and then step down near the CPU blocks? with a T?) And I have the reservoir at the highest point.

You must be somewhere hot. As you also didn't say anything about mounting a rad outside (in the freezing cold) and running an antifreeze mix.

 

[MMXMonster]

The only real differences from a standard setup as I see it should be the preference for 120V, the lack of constraints around size, and perhaps some consideration for flow resistance in the much longer tubing run (probably upwards of 20 feet of tubing in the loop - with about 8 ft being vertical not that this should matter).

Wouldn't this actually be a big issue... 8 feet of vertical lift would create a massive amount of head pressure on a pump, also for every 90deg bend add another foot of HP. For every ten feet of horizontal tubing add 1ft of HP. Only pumps I think that would come close would be something used in the sump of an aquarium or a pond pump. Also would this be a submersible pump or external? I would think this would make the costs a bit prohibitive.
If your still persistent in doing this try an Iwaki, very reliable pumps but you will pay for its quality and power. Find them online at aquarium supply houses.

 

[rich0]

I'm not living anywhere that hot, but the house is old and the central air isn't terribly efficient. If the office door is closed it can get rather warm, even in the winter, when you have 200W of heat being dumped in there.

The Iwaki's are expensive, but that might just be the best solution (though that makes the whole thing a bit pricier than I was hoping).

Vertical runs of tubing are essentially the same as horizontal ones, as long as you can get downward run of tubing filled (which is why I put the reservoir right before the pump). The head required to force the water back upstairs is supplied by the water coming down the return side of the loop. If water and air had zero viscosity and surface tension you could just fill the reservoir at the top and it would fill both sides of the loop as the water made its way down both sides of the loop. That won't quite work out, but If I filled the reservoir, flipped on the pump, and then kept topping it up even a small pump should have enough prime to get all the air worked out.

For the tubing I haven't fully thought things through. I planned on disconnects around each of the major components. That does give me the opportunity to switch sizes. I'd prefer not to make huge holes in the floor, but if I did use larger tubing for as much of the length as possible that would cut down on the flow resistance.

If I just ended up getting an Iwaki then I'd probably just run 1/2" everywhere. The only thing that makes me a bit nervous about the Iwaki is leaks. Another reason for lots of disconnects is so that I can just assemble the whole thing and run it for a day or two before I put it anywhere near my PC.

 

[manofchalk]

:lol:
200W in an office is nothing, chances are your lights or monitor/s are consuming more power than your PC is at any given time.

A good pump might be the Koolance PMP-500, among the commonly used water-cooling pumps its one of the stronger in terms of head pressure.
http://martinsliquidlab.org/2012/12/13/koolance-pmp-500-pump/
Apparently the inner workings are similar to an Iwaki pump, despite looking like an Eheim.

I would just use 1/2" tubing the whole way through, and its not like the size of the hole you have to drill will change much if you go down to say 1/4". Most tubing has a 3/4" OD anyway, so no reason to lower the ID.

 

[rich0]

200W in an office is nothing, chances are your lights or monitor/s are consuming more power than your PC is at any given time.

True, but it seems like the PCs are really what are pushing things past what the HVAC can handle - you can just feel the heat under the desk, especially when MythTV is busy transcoding.

A good pump might be the Koolance PMP-500, among the commonly used water-cooling pumps its one of the stronger in terms of head pressure.
http://martinsliquidlab.org/2012/12/13/koolance-pmp-500-pump/
Apparently the inner workings are similar to an Iwaki pump, despite looking like an Eheim.

My only concern is that once you add in an AC adapter that puts out 40W you're maybe $20-40 cheaper than an Iwaki. When I was originally conceiving this in my mind I was hoping to find some pump for $30 that you could just plug into the wall, but that just might not be an option.

I would just use 1/2" tubing the whole way through, and its not like the size of the hole you have to drill will change much if you go down to say 1/4". Most tubing has a 3/4" OD anyway, so no reason to lower the ID.

Oh, if I changed tubing sizes it would be only to make it bigger. I'd only reduce to 1/2" either to go through the floor or into the PCs. I'm not sure I'll bother with that though - it might apply to 5-10 ft of tubing at most and probably isn't worth the hassle and extra connectors. If I were running the tubing halfway across my house it might be more of a concern.

If there isn't a silver bullet then it just is what it is. Thanks for the suggestions all the same and giving me a chance to bounce this stuff off of somebody.

 

[corky1000]

Hi.
As a long time aquarium keeper, I've experimented a bit with some powerhead pumps used in various ways. I'd bet on the inexpensive Aquaclear line against any other. Eheim is good but in general their simpler old classic models are usually the better.

For cheap tough reliability, the Aquaclear powerhead is a winner. They can run dry and be abused horrendously and last forever - something the more expensive pumps often enough don't match.
But taking an example of one which pumps about 400 gph...it can return only weakly at 5' of head in an open sump system, i.e. no sealed canister - so it's just the pump itself working - it returns maybe 100 gph though a garden hose - which is what I wanted to return to the tank from the floor level.

I also use them to force tank water through densely packed filter material wadded into the hose, in order to clear up cloudy water in a couple of hours.

Pumps of this size also heat the water a bit.

I dont think I want to mix water with computer though. The reason I am able to keep my fish alive a long time is primarily due, I think, to enforced simplicity due to economic constraints!
And I keep a monster Sears Craftsman shop vac nearby.