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i-TTL and closed eyes

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Anonymous
December 6, 2004 7:38:30 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I frequently run into a problem and wonder what other people do to solve
it. It seems that the delay between the i-TTL preflash and the flash
itself is long enough such that many people manage to close their eyes
in between (if only half-way, enough to ruin the picture). I usually
run into this problem when doing snapshots in poorly lit rooms, so there
is little point in "training" the model to avoid this.

I'm using a D70 with the SB-800 flash. I thought about several methods
to avoid this:

1. Setting the flash to "M": Too complicated, I don't want several tries
to get the exposure right or longish calculations.
2. Using the GN mode and estimating the distance to the subject. Still
requires setting a value on the flash, but this seems easy and the
exposure will automatically be recalculated when I change the
aperture or ISO speed rating.
This seems to be the best method right now.

But what I actually would like to do is this:

3. Set the flash to AA (auto aperture). The flash will get the settings
from the camera, but will do the exposure calculation itself. No
preflash needed!?
BUT: For some strange reason I don't understand the SB-800 will still
use a preflash. Why?
Can someone say anything about the timing for this preflash? Maybe
the preflash-flash delay is shorter in this mode. I didn't test this.

What works is this:

4. Set the flash to A mode. No aperture or ISO data is sent to the
flash. Works without preflash, but is inconvenient as I have to set
the aperture manually on the flash.

Any ideas?

Walter

More about : ttl closed eyes

Anonymous
December 6, 2004 7:38:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I don't remember the exact setting, but there is a way to set a "hold"
(that's not what it's technically called, but just how I describe it)
between the preflash and the actual exposure. The process involves
composing and metering the shot, which fires the preflash, but stops
just short of capturing the actual exposure. All the right meter data,
flash settings, etc. is stored until you continue the sequence by
snapping the picture itself. Sorry, I don't have an external
speedlight, so I haven't done this myself. But I did read about just
recently, probably in the user manaual but I don't remember for sure.
Hope that helps.
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 2:01:50 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

bmclaurin <bmclaurin@bellsouth.net> schrieb:
> I don't remember the exact setting, but there is a way to set a "hold"
> (that's not what it's technically called, but just how I describe it)
> between the preflash and the actual exposure. The process involves
> composing and metering the shot, which fires the preflash, but stops
> just short of capturing the actual exposure. All the right meter data,
> flash settings, etc. is stored until you continue the sequence by
> snapping the picture itself. Sorry, I don't have an external
> speedlight, so I haven't done this myself. But I did read about just
> recently, probably in the user manaual but I don't remember for sure.
> Hope that helps.

Ah, yes. You can set the exposure lock button to flash exposure lock in
the customs settings. If the situation allows for two flashes and a
little delay in between, this works.

Walter
Anonymous
December 7, 2004 4:27:39 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 6 Dec 2004 16:38:30 GMT, Walter Hofmann <abe201@mx2.homelinux.com>
wrote:

>I frequently run into a problem and wonder what other people do to solve
>it. It seems that the delay between the i-TTL preflash and the flash
>itself is long enough such that many people manage to close their eyes
>in between (if only half-way, enough to ruin the picture). I usually
>run into this problem when doing snapshots in poorly lit rooms, so there
>is little point in "training" the model to avoid this.
>
>I'm using a D70 with the SB-800 flash. I thought about several methods
>to avoid this:
>
>1. Setting the flash to "M": Too complicated, I don't want several tries
> to get the exposure right or longish calculations.
>2. Using the GN mode and estimating the distance to the subject. Still
> requires setting a value on the flash, but this seems easy and the
> exposure will automatically be recalculated when I change the
> aperture or ISO speed rating.
> This seems to be the best method right now.
>
>But what I actually would like to do is this:
>
>3. Set the flash to AA (auto aperture). The flash will get the settings
> from the camera, but will do the exposure calculation itself. No
> preflash needed!?
> BUT: For some strange reason I don't understand the SB-800 will still
> use a preflash. Why?
> Can someone say anything about the timing for this preflash? Maybe
> the preflash-flash delay is shorter in this mode. I didn't test this.
>
>What works is this:
>
>4. Set the flash to A mode. No aperture or ISO data is sent to the
> flash. Works without preflash, but is inconvenient as I have to set
> the aperture manually on the flash.
>
>Any ideas?
>
>Walter

Custom setting: CSM#15, AE-L/AF-L > FV Lock OK (it's off the bottom of
the #15 submenu)

Now use the AE-L button to fire the pre-flash (and the camera locks
the metering information). The viewfinder will show 'EV' to the left
of the shutter speed when the EV lock has been performed.

Take as many photos as you need - no preflash will be performed. The
flash value is locked until you hit the AE-L again to dismiss the
lock, so each time you re-frame you'd want to hit AE-L twice, once to
clear the lock and again to pre-flash and re-meter.

You can still adjust the flash value (hold the flash button and give
the front wheel a spin) on-camera without needing to re-perform an
AE-L pre-flash.

This is still iTTL, just with a long gap between the metering stage
and the photo.

In this mode of operation, with multi-flash setup, simple cheap
(non-digital) slave flashes can be used because when you take the
photo, no further pre-flashes are made that could cause premature
eflashulation.

Of course, any multi-flash setup without using a SB-800 or SB-600 will
not be iTTL, the slaves in this case would need to me manually
adjusted for power output and the whole balancing act soon becomes
very boring, physically draining and I'll have another beer please.

For the rest of the time, my preference for this menu #15 is:
AE Lock Hold

This is easier than trying to keep your thumb jammed on that AE-L
button during framing. Focus lock is assigned to the trigger button.

--
Owamanga!
Anonymous
December 9, 2004 2:01:45 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Owamanga <nomail@hotmail.com> schrieb:
>
> Custom setting: CSM#15, AE-L/AF-L > FV Lock OK (it's off the bottom of
> the #15 submenu)
>
> Now use the AE-L button to fire the pre-flash (and the camera locks
> the metering information). The viewfinder will show 'EV' to the left
> of the shutter speed when the EV lock has been performed.
>
> This is still iTTL, just with a long gap between the metering stage
> and the photo.

I'm not so sure if this is i-TTL. When I photograph a black object with
a white (near) background the matrix meter will correctly expose w/o
flash-lock, but the white background will be overexposed when I use
flash-lock (everything else unchanged).

Walter
Anonymous
December 9, 2004 2:03:52 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Kibo informs me that Walter Hofmann <abe201@mx2.homelinux.com> stated
that:

>I frequently run into a problem and wonder what other people do to solve
>it. It seems that the delay between the i-TTL preflash and the flash
>itself is long enough such that many people manage to close their eyes
>in between (if only half-way, enough to ruin the picture). I usually
>run into this problem when doing snapshots in poorly lit rooms, so there
>is little point in "training" the model to avoid this.

I do lots of event photogrpahy (mostly nightclubs) & this is a standard
problem in dimly lit situations.
My solution is very simple - I just fire off a two or three shot burst
instead of taking a single shot. Even if the subject blinks, one of the
shots will catch them after their eyes have opened again. This technique
would be a bit expensive with film, but with digital, it's a no-brainer.

--
W
. | ,. w , "Some people are alive only because
\|/ \|/ it is illegal to kill them." Perna condita delenda est
---^----^---------------------------------------------------------------
Anonymous
December 16, 2004 1:56:55 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Or...
just hit the FE lock button with your thumb.
That will fire the preflash and lock the exposure.
Then (after a second or two) squeeze the shutter button and your subject
won't have time to blink!

Sometimes this is a good technique for getting more natural smiles.
People often stiffen up for pictures. Right after hitting the FE lock, many
subjects (thinking that the picture has been taken) loosen up and give a
more natural smile. If you fire the shutter within a few seconds or so of
firing the FE lock preflash, you might have more relaxed subjects with a
nicer smiles.

<usenet@imagenoir.com> wrote in message
news:ib5fr0937gnd8oh0m2vmuj1kvs3a4tmgrg@4ax.com...
> Kibo informs me that Walter Hofmann <abe201@mx2.homelinux.com> stated
> that:
>
> >I frequently run into a problem and wonder what other people do to solve
> >it. It seems that the delay between the i-TTL preflash and the flash
> >itself is long enough such that many people manage to close their eyes
> >in between (if only half-way, enough to ruin the picture). I usually
> >run into this problem when doing snapshots in poorly lit rooms, so there
> >is little point in "training" the model to avoid this.
>
> I do lots of event photogrpahy (mostly nightclubs) & this is a standard
> problem in dimly lit situations.
> My solution is very simple - I just fire off a two or three shot burst
> instead of taking a single shot. Even if the subject blinks, one of the
> shots will catch them after their eyes have opened again. This technique
> would be a bit expensive with film, but with digital, it's a no-brainer.
>
> --
> W
> . | ,. w , "Some people are alive only because
> \|/ \|/ it is illegal to kill them." Perna condita delenda est
> ---^----^---------------------------------------------------------------
Anonymous
December 25, 2004 7:55:28 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Kibo informs me that "David Bindle" <david.bindle@usask.ca> stated that:

>Or...
>just hit the FE lock button with your thumb.
>That will fire the preflash and lock the exposure.
>Then (after a second or two) squeeze the shutter button and your subject
>won't have time to blink!

Good idea, David, I'll have to give it a try.

--
W
. | ,. w , "Some people are alive only because
\|/ \|/ it is illegal to kill them." Perna condita delenda est
---^----^---------------------------------------------------------------
!