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5850 or gtx 470

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April 7, 2010 6:34:21 PM

the prices are not important(they are pretty equal actually)

which performs better? PLEASE DO NOT BE A FANBOY OF ANY COMPANY!! PLEASE BE HONEST!!!

games i might play are crysis/warhead , crysis 2, bad company 2,

it should run on ANTEC EA650 watt

More about : 5850 gtx 470

a c 130 U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 6:37:49 PM

An OC'd HD5850 will outperform the GTX470 whilst using less heat and power. OC'ing takes about 5 seconds.
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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 6:38:55 PM

the only plus with GTX 470 is its tesselation performance i would beleive
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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 6:47:12 PM

Definitely the 5850. Its cheaper, and will run all of those games just about as well as the 470, plus use less power, are cooler, and can handle 3 displays without needing a second card.
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April 7, 2010 6:58:45 PM

but i saw some benchmarks , and 470 beat even 5870 in some cases . PLus it has physX and cuda.I don't mind the power consumtion as long as it runs FINE (completely like it should) on ea650. I don't mind heat either as long the card work like it should
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a c 130 U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 7:00:17 PM

Correct, but it has to use more power to do so. If we wanted to use power equal to the amount of a GTX470, the HD5870/HD5850 would win. Both cards use less power.
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April 7, 2010 7:06:52 PM

demonnn said:
but i saw some benchmarks , and 470 beat even 5870 in some cases


Shadow was talking about an overclocked HD 5850, not a stock 5850. Because it uses less heat and power, it likely has more headroom for overclocking compared with the GTX 470. I believe that overall, the two cards are going to be fairly close to one another performance-wise, and so you'll have to consider other factors. They've both got DX11 support. ATI has advantages in terms of price, power, heat, availability, and eyefinity support. NVidia has PhysX and improved tesselation - I'm not sure I buy into the value of tesselation yet, considering that only a handful of games are making use of it, and even those games only employ it to a limited extent. That is probably going to change over the next couple of years, but by that time, there will be other new cards that do it better than what we've got today.

At this point in time, I have a hard time supporting the GTX 470 or 480, unless the *only* thing you're concerned with is FPS. As far as price for performance goes, I think the HD 5850 is the clear winner for the foreseeable future. That's just my $.02, though. Take from it what you will.
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April 7, 2010 7:09:41 PM

demonnn said:
but i saw some benchmarks , and 470 beat even 5870 in some cases . PLus it has physX and cuda.I don't mind the power consumtion as long as it runs FINE (completely like it should) on ea650. I don't mind heat either as long the card work like it should


Honestly, I'm a little confused as to the point of this thread - it sounds like you've made up your mind. If price, heat, and power consumption are non-issues, and PhysX and Cuda are appealing to you, why ask for opinions? All you've done so far is respond to each person supporting the HD 5850 with reasons why the GTX 470 seems better.
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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 8:03:14 PM

Honestly, the 470 is very close in performance to the 5850. There are situations where its faster, and some where its slower. Also, the 5850 overclocks extremely well, still using less power and creating less heat than the 470. You can overclock it to the extent that it will consistently beat the 470, and still do that for $50 less, and still be able to support 3 displays without having to get a second card. So really, if you think about it, with similar performance, you look at other things. Lets compare
Performance: tie- very slight nod to 470 at stock, but probably a nod to 5850 OCed.
Power: 5850 (matters in your electric bill and PSU)
Heat: 5850 (also matters in your electric bill and longevity of system/components)
# of displays: 5850 (something I'm trying to save for)
Price: 5850 (always important)
PhysX: 470 (IMO- PhysX is a gimmick and not worth spending extra money for, but your opinion may be different)
Cuda: 470 (doesn't matter for gaming)
Folding @ Home: 470 (also doesn't matter for gaming)
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Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 8:19:30 PM

5850 All around Kick Ass. If you have water cooling, maybe the 470.

OC the 5850 and it would compete with the 480 ;) 
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a c 106 U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 8:45:39 PM

If you don't care about Price, Heat, or Power Consumption, then yeah the GTX 470 is generally faster than the 5850. Not all the time, but enough of the time. The GTX 470 also has PhysX, which is great for the few games that actually use it, but since so few games really utilize it I don't see it as much of a selling point. It's your money, do what you want.
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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 8:49:35 PM

Megamanx- you forgot about eyefinity and the overclockability of the 5850:-)
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a c 130 U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 8:58:47 PM

Smaller and more efficient = better overclocking.
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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 10:02:55 PM

Ok so let me get this strait, the 470 has no overclocking headroom compared to the 5850?

http://www.guru3d.com/article/geforce-gtx-470-480-revie...

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-r...

20% overclock increase w/o raising voltages... nuff said..

Now the OP must understand that if he does not care about heat/power/price then the 470 is the card he wants, if not the 5850 is what he should be looking at.. There is nothing else to explain here =)
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April 7, 2010 10:23:33 PM

OvrClkr said:
Ok so let me get this strait, the 470 has no overclocking headroom compared to the 5850?

http://www.guru3d.com/article/geforce-gtx-470-480-revie...

http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-r...

20% overclock increase w/o raising voltages... nuff said..

Now the OP must understand that if he does not care about heat/power/price then the 470 is the card he wants, if not the 5850 is what he should be looking at.. There is nothing else to explain here =)


I don't recall anyone saying that the GTX 470 has no overclocking headroom, compared to the HD 5850 or any other card. What several of us pointed out is that the relatively lower heat and power draw of the stock HD 5850 creates a lot of headroom to overclock. You've responded to a claim no one made.
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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 10:35:21 PM

Never said it didn't OC at all, just that the 5850 has very good OC headroom, and will be able to easily surpass a stock 470 and still have less heat and use less power.
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a c 262 U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 10:43:43 PM

demonnn said:
the prices are not important(they are pretty equal actually)

which performs better? PLEASE DO NOT BE A FANBOY OF ANY COMPANY!! PLEASE BE HONEST!!!

games i might play are crysis/warhead , crysis 2, bad company 2,

it should run on ANTEC EA650 watt


If you have a favorite game, base your decision on benchmarks for that game and your resolution. Other than that, take your pick, there is apparently not a significant difference between them. I say apparently because there are not so many benchmarks for the GTX480.
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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 10:50:39 PM

Thats a big plus for a lot of gamers. Nvidia has a program "the way its meant to be played" its advertisement that Nvidia has worked with the developer to make the game better. Nvidia also has PhysX. PhysX is included with the new game Metro 2033.
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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 10:54:11 PM

PhysX is a gimmick IMO. Not worth the money.
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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 11:24:15 PM



flyinfinni said:
PhysX is a gimmick IMO. Not worth the money.


I think eyefinity is a gimmick, especially with underpowered cards. But you know what, only trolls go around calling another companies features gimmicks whenever they are mentioned.
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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 11:28:37 PM

restatement3dofted said:
I don't recall anyone saying that the GTX 470 has no overclocking headroom, compared to the HD 5850 or any other card. What several of us pointed out is that the relatively lower heat and power draw of the stock HD 5850 creates a lot of headroom to overclock. You've responded to a claim no one made.


I never said it wouldn't overclock at all, I don't know where you get that from, I said compared to the 5850.

Elie3000 says : "OC the 5850 and it would compete with the 480"

That's the same as me saying OC the 470 and compete with the 5870 especially when it can hit a 20% OC at stock volts.

Shadow says : "An OC'd HD5850 will outperform the GTX470 whilst using less heat and power"

I cannot argue the power issue but if I overclock the 470 it will trounce the 5850.

Quote:
A claim nobody made?


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a b U Graphics card
April 7, 2010 11:37:20 PM

Nvidia has 3dVision. Heres a very cool thing going down right now if you had the setup.
2010 Masters Tournament in 3D - Are You 3D Vision Ready? http://blogs.nvidia.com/ntersect/2010/04/masters-golf-s...
Its being streamed on the internet, Master's Golf 3d, and also Direct TV has a 3d channel exclusive for 3d. Of course if you have the glasses you have the 120mhz TV or monitor it takes to make the magic happen. I won't be going 3D anytime soon, but with big promotions like this, the tech might take off.

edit: I don't know if you can use nvidia's 3d glasses with Directv's broadcast. Thats a technical aspect that would make the cost of the glasses, a better value. I would hate to have to have various 150 dollar 3d shades :) .
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a c 130 U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 12:10:03 AM

OvrClkr said:

Shadow says : "An OC'd HD5850 will outperform the GTX470 whilst using less heat and power"

I cannot argue the power issue but if I overclock the 470 it will trounce the 5850.


If we make the GTX470 and the HD5850 consume 250Watts of power, the HD5850 will probably win. Performance/Power is with the HD5850.
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April 8, 2010 12:14:29 AM

OvrClkr said:
I never said it wouldn't overclock at all, I don't know where you get that from, I said compared to the 5850.

Elie3000 says : "OC the 5850 and it would compete with the 480"

That's the same as me saying OC the 470 and compete with the 5870 especially when it can hit a 20% OC at stock volts.

Shadow says : "An OC'd HD5850 will outperform the GTX470 whilst using less heat and power"

I cannot argue the power issue but if I overclock the 470 it will trounce the 5850.



Let's see if I can clear this up for you. In your original post, you said, "Ok so let me get this strait, the 470 has no overclocking headroom compared to the 5850?" To that, I responded, "I don't recall anyone saying that the GTX 470 has no overclocking headroom, compared to the HD 5850 or any other card."

My claim is still 100% accurate: no one in this thread but you, at any time, has made any claims about the relative abilities of the HD 5850 and GTX 470 to be overclocked. In fact, no one had made any claims about the ability of the GTX 470 to be overclocked, whether good or bad, at all. Again, you are the only person that has brought that up. It might be a valid point for the OP to consider in choosing a card, but that doesn't change the fact that originally, you were just throwing out data in response to claims that no one had made, instead of just offering information. It wasn't until your second post that you actually added anything in response to a claim that had been made in the thread. :heink: 
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 12:14:41 AM

I wouldn't use the 3D as a choice-breaker, in that case I would take Eye-finity. The 3D will be useless to the hardcore gamer. We want high FPS/candy not some glasses that cost 199.99$ + 120Hz screen... I can see the average e-peener buying such a setup but not the real gamer that is looking for raw performance.

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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 12:16:42 AM

shadow187 said:
If we make the GTX470 and the HD5850 consume 250Watts of power, the HD5850 will probably win. Performance/Power is with the HD5850.


You are comparing performance/power, we know already that the 5850 and 5870 trounce the 470/480 in that arena, that is why I said this :

Quote:
Now the OP must understand that if he does not care about heat/power/price then the 470 is the card he wants, if not the 5850 is what he should be looking at..



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a c 130 U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 12:19:59 AM

Right right. I'm just saying like, whatever OC the GTX470 can do, the HD5850 can beat it. At least theoretically.

Depends on his PSU/Overclocking Capabilities then.
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 12:32:48 AM

restatement3dofted said:
Let's see if I can clear this up for you. In your original post, you said, "Ok so let me get this strait, the 470 has no overclocking headroom compared to the 5850?" To that, I responded, "I don't recall anyone saying that the GTX 470 has no overclocking headroom, compared to the HD 5850 or any other card."

My claim is still 100% accurate: no one in this thread but you, at any time, has . In fact, no one had made any claims about the ability of the GTX 470 to be overclocked, whether good or bad, at all. Again, you are the only person that has brought that up. It might be a valid point for the OP to consider in choosing a card, but that doesn't change the fact that originally, you were just throwing out data in response to claims that no one had made, instead of just offering information. It wasn't until your second post that you actually added anything in response to a claim that had been made in the thread. :heink: 


What?? Have you read this thread starting from the first post???

The only TRUE post here is the fact that the 470 runs warmer / consumes more power / costs a bit more.

The irrelevant posts are the fact that you cannot say that the 5850 overclocks better, that is not a fact as of yet so YES that is a valid point.

If someone says an overclocked 5850 will beat a 470, then I can also say that an overclocked 470 will beat a 5850. END OF STORY you cannot use that as a valid point to convince the OP that the 5850 is better. One will always beat the other when overclocked :pfff: 

So don't give me that "You've responded to a claim no one made"

Edited :

I didn't mean it in those exact words, ahhhh!!! This is what sucks when you are not a native US citizen.

When someone says that one card will overclock better than the other because it consumes less power or runs cooler I used the question "the 470 has no overclocking headroom compared to the 5850"? So my bad, I thought you would understand my point but i guess you didn't. I was just trying to explain the the 470 has excellent overclocking capabilities.

I was using that term as an example, i didn't mean to say that it came from someones mouth, it's hard to explain myself, I apologize :( 
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 12:53:27 AM

OvrClkr said:
I wouldn't use the 3D as a choice-breaker, in that case I would take Eye-finity. The 3D will be useless to the hardcore gamer. We want high FPS/candy not some glasses that cost 199.99$ + 120Hz screen... I can see the average e-peener buying such a setup but not the real gamer that is looking for raw performance.


Wait a second :) , watching 3d content is associated with a 'e-peener', I thought real gamers said worrying about 3dmark scores was a e-peen thingie? I don't know, this whole e-peen thing sounds kinda dirty, lol.
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April 8, 2010 1:07:53 AM

OvrClkr said:
What?? Have you read this thread starting from the first post???

The only TRUE post here is the fact that the 470 runs warmer / consumes more power / costs a bit more.

The irrelevant posts are the fact that you cannot say that the 5850 overclocks better, that is not a fact as of yet so YES that is a valid point.

If someone says an overclocked 5850 will beat a 470, then I can also say that an overclocked 470 will beat a 5850. END OF STORY you cannot use that as a valid point to convince the OP that the 5850 is better. One will always beat the other when overclocked :pfff: 

So don't give me that "You've responded to a claim no one made"

Edited :

I didn't mean it in those exact words, ahhhh!!! This is what sucks when you are not a native US citizen.

When someone says that one card will overclock better than the other because it consumes less power or runs cooler I used the question "the 470 has no overclocking headroom compared to the 5850"? So my bad, I thought you would understand my point but i guess you didn't. I was just trying to explain the the 470 has excellent overclocking capabilities.

I was using that term as an example, i didn't mean to say that it came from someones mouth, it's hard to explain myself, I apologize :( 


No hard feelings, it looks like we were both confusing each other. I'm sorry if I was a bit rude in my posts.

Cheers!
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 1:15:28 AM

restatement3dofted said:
No hard feelings, it looks like we were both confusing each other. I'm sorry if I was a bit rude in my posts.

Cheers!


Naa, my posts looked like I was screaming at you so it was actually my fault :lol: 

Trust me I am more confused than you ATM. Its hard for me sometimes to get my point across sometimes that's all..
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Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 3:38:19 AM

Lets make it fair, 470 OC Vs 5850 OC :D 

On water the 470 will probably win, the 5850 will probably win on air.

Edit: Waiting on retail water OCd versions ...

Ya, its sucks not to be native US lol especially with American chicks :lol: 
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 4:55:50 PM

notty22 said:
I think eyefinity is a gimmick, especially with underpowered cards. But you know what, only trolls go around calling another companies features gimmicks whenever they are mentioned.

Nice way to call yourself a troll. I don't go around calling "other" companies features gimmicks. I personally think PhysX is a gimmick. I've used it and felt there was really nothing significant added to my gaming experience. Eyefinity is a totally different thing as its actually an added feature that can seriously change the way you experience a game. It adds something that can actually make you feel more like you are in the game- how is that a gimmick?
Also- I really don't appreciate being called a troll. You can look around and see what I'm contributing to this community. I'm no fanboy, and I give my honest opinion. Right now, at the prices and performances we have from the latest cards, I see very little reason to recommend an Nvidia card in general. I have recommended them in a few situations. Maybe you just need to relax and realize that our opinions can differ, and that its OK for me to think PhysX is a gimmick, and you to think its the best thing since sliced bread.
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a c 130 U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 5:05:58 PM

That, and the fact that through the months I've been here (and I'm sure you've noticed too), Notty will immediately refute any statements against nVidia. This is the same for all fanboys. There's good fanboys who support one company due to personal preference, but aren't afraid of recommending another company due to superiority. Then there's the numbskulls who just recommend their company on the grounds of their preference.
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Anonymous
a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 5:08:43 PM

Im always with the better all around, and this time is ATi, nVidia was with the 8800 series.
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a c 130 U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 5:14:47 PM

Right. I only got into tech when ATI unveiled their 4000 series, and so all I've known is that ATI leads in price/perf since I've started. I haven't lived through the G80 or the HD2XXX series.
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 5:19:03 PM

Ive been through a few generations. I had an ATI- 3d RAGE back in the day, then I was Nvidia for a while until I got my 4870 (upgraded from a 7300GT once I actually had a real job and money lol:-P). I go with whichever has the best performance/features in my price range.
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 5:20:39 PM

shadow187 said:
That, and the fact that through the months I've been here (and I'm sure you've noticed too), Notty will immediately refute any statements against nVidia. This is the same for all fanboys. There's good fanboys who support one company due to personal preference, but aren't afraid of recommending another company due to superiority. Then there's the numbskulls who just recommend their company on the grounds of their preference.

OK,lol , Pot meet Kettle.
Go look at your post history in the Fermi thread, your a regular troll.
I may defend nvidia, I don't spend half my day, writing trollish anecdotes, to every positive post to the competeing company I'm a fanboy of, LIKE YOU>
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 5:23:05 PM

Ok guys- lets just chill. No one is adding anything of use to the forum with this kind of arguing. Lets let it drop and move on.
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 6:35:47 PM

yea back to the topic.

Anyways have you guys seen the prices on the 470/480 over at e-bay?

Yesterday I spoke with a user that already has a few units in stock and he showed me two 470's that were sold for 550.00$ a pop. The dam card is not even here yet and people are paying mad cash for them.

Last night I was messing around in one of the auctions and saw a single 480 sell for 749.99$ (EVGA)
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 6:45:14 PM

Here comes Fermi:-) lol. I bet they'll be sold out and on their way to skyrocketing prices in the coming days:-)
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 6:47:17 PM

It wasnt on sale, that was a screenie that was taken when the site glitched. Sometimes you see products that show "add to cart" but when its time for the checkout you get the "auto notify" screen. I have a buddy that works in the RMA dept and the cards are not arriving till tomorow noon.
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 6:50:40 PM

A person in that thread mentioned he recieved a notify notice as well that , that model was in stock. Though when he went to link it had changed. We'll know when the first guinea pigs tell us their experiences in the forums.
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 6:51:42 PM

I thought they mostly said that the ETA was tomorrow, but didn't know about the sight glitches- not see it myself:-) good to know though.
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April 8, 2010 6:51:44 PM

flyinfinni said:
Here comes Fermi:-) lol. I bet they'll be sold out and on their way to skyrocketing prices in the coming days:-)


If the rumored supply shortage is anywhere near as bad as people have suggested, then the price of the Fermi cards is going go sky high, just like the HD 5xxx cards. New technology with high demand and low supply - those cards are not likely to come cheap to early adapters (not to mention the length of the wait most people will have to bear just to get their hands on one). Really getting tired of new technology being shoved out before they have supply to go around.
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April 8, 2010 6:54:16 PM

notty22 said:
A person in that thread mentioned he recieved a notify notice as well that , that model was in stock. Though when he went to link it had changed. We'll know when the first guinea pigs tell us their experiences in the forums.


That's not unusual - back at the launch of the PS3 people were camping websites like mad waiting for presale buttons to go active, and every now and then a site would bug out and accidentally put up a link to purchase/preorder, and every time, people would get emails later in the day informing them that it was an accident and their orders were cancelled. I'd expect something similar to happen here.
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 6:54:58 PM

When I pucrhased my board it also showed "add to cart" when in fact it was back-ordered. I clicked "add to cart" and the next page that came up was one notifying me that it would be available a few days later. Newegg's site does that every now n then..
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 7:04:47 PM

Looks like those might have been legit pages though- looks like a number of people actually ordered them and got the orders through and charged. Though maybe the real stock is hitting tomorrow.
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a b U Graphics card
April 8, 2010 7:15:22 PM

The user would have had the option for next-day delivery so I doubt it was legit unless the "next day" was greyed out, and I have never seen that option unavailable.

I wouldnt go for the PNY even if it was available, it's EVGA or nothing for me. Fermi is too hot to have a crappy warranty...
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