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Best drive cloner?

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October 4, 2004 5:51:26 AM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

I'm upgrading to a bigger drive in my laptop, and would like to just
dupe over the whole thing. What I'm getting with what I've tried so far,
however, are "NTLDR is missing" errors when I try to boot off the new
drive. (This is a WinXP system.) None of the advice I found online
regards repairing or copying files off the XP install CD has done the
trick.

What works out there?

--
Reply to mike1@@@usfamily.net sans two @@, or your reply won't reach me.

More about : drive cloner

Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 4, 2004 12:13:18 PM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Mike1" <mike1_shoot.them.shoot.them.both@usfamily.net> wrote in message
news:mike1_shoot.them.shoot.them.both-56A0F5.01512604102004@news.usfamily.net...
>
> I'm upgrading to a bigger drive in my laptop, and would like to just
> dupe over the whole thing. What I'm getting with what I've tried so far,
> however, are "NTLDR is missing" errors when I try to boot off the new
> drive. (This is a WinXP system.) None of the advice I found online
> regards repairing or copying files off the XP install CD has done the
> trick.
>
> What works out there?
>

By the way, NTLDR is the boot loader for the NT family OS.
Typically, it is only correctly installed with a basic install of the
OS.
Copy software such as Norton's Ghost is iffy about how well it copies NTLDR

For a better chance of getting a specific answer go to:
The Microsoft news server is
msnews.microsoft.com
For the group choices type windowsxp
You'll find the appropriate group where someone can answer your
question.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 4, 2004 12:51:41 PM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

D.A. Tsenuf wrote:
> By the way, NTLDR is the boot loader for the NT family OS.
> Typically, it is only correctly installed with a basic install of the
> OS.

Not true...you can fix the boot loader by using "recovery console" mode
on the XP cd.
Related resources
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 4, 2004 12:51:56 PM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

D.A. Tsenuf wrote:
> By the way, NTLDR is the boot loader for the NT family OS.
> Typically, it is only correctly installed with a basic install of the
> OS.

Not true...you can fix the boot loader by using "recovery console" mode
on the XP cd.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 4, 2004 5:33:30 PM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Jef Norton" <jefn_REMOVE_YOUR_SHORTS_@sbcglobal.net> wrote in
news:%8d8d.4424$JG2.3212@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com:

> "Mike1" <mike1_shoot.them.shoot.them.both@usfamily.net> wrote in
> message
> news:mike1_shoot.them.shoot.them.both-56A0F5.01512604102004@news.usfami
> ly.net...
>|
>| I'm upgrading to a bigger drive in my laptop, and would like to just
>| dupe over the whole thing. What I'm getting with what I've tried so
>| far, however, are "NTLDR is missing" errors when I try to boot off
>| the new drive. (This is a WinXP system.) None of the advice I found
>| online regards repairing or copying files off the XP install CD has
>| done the trick.
>|
>| What works out there?
>|
>| --
>| Reply to mike1@@@usfamily.net sans two @@, or your reply won't reach
>| me.
>
>
> Hi Mike -
>
> I recently went through this exercise, putting a 7200 RPM drive in my
> computer.
>
> I picked up a USB 2.0 drive caddy for a little over US$20 and
> downloaded a trial copy of Acronis True Image
> (http://www.acronis.com).
>
> I installed True Image on the computer and put the new disk in the
> caddy. I ran True Image's Disk Clone function, which took me step by
> step through the process of cloning my existing drive to the new drive
> (both partitions, resizing them on the fly). The cloning process ran
> from within Windows (recommend Disk Cleanup and Defrag in advance to
> minimize the time this takes... though it didn't take all that long).

This is interesting because previous version (7.0) of TrueImage did not
support external drives (I know for sure - I bought it, it worked drive-
to-drive in desktop but refused with external drives on desktop and
laptop). And I have not seen a note of any change in that department for
the new version. That IS the reason I have not upgraded to 8.0.

Ghost, while a bit harder to work with, handled USB/FireWire external
drives for a while now.

Regarding the NTLDR and such, if you do drive to drive copying with Ghost
and reboot to the original drive with the copy still connected,
partitions on the second drive get assigned drive letters. And that is
stored on the drive. So, when you then swap drives and try to boot from
the copy you are likely to have a problem. The boot drive letter is NOT
C: Another thing to watch in this case is that if you played with your
PATH settings and replaced %SystemDrive% with C: or such, Windows is not
gonna load.

There you go. Hope that is helpful in some way.

Alexei
October 4, 2004 5:39:24 PM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"D.A. Tsenuf" <DA@Tsenuf.com> wrote in message
news:10m2jhmfqp3cl13@corp.supernews.com...
>
> "Mike1" <mike1_shoot.them.shoot.them.both@usfamily.net> wrote in message
> news:mike1_shoot.them.shoot.them.both-56A0F5.01512604102004@news.usfamily.net...
>>
>> I'm upgrading to a bigger drive in my laptop, and would like to just
>> dupe over the whole thing. What I'm getting with what I've tried so far,
>> however, are "NTLDR is missing" errors when I try to boot off the new
>> drive. (This is a WinXP system.) None of the advice I found online
>> regards repairing or copying files off the XP install CD has done the
>> trick.
>>
>> What works out there?
>>
>
> By the way, NTLDR is the boot loader for the NT family OS.
> Typically, it is only correctly installed with a basic install of the
> OS.
> Copy software such as Norton's Ghost is iffy about how well it copies
> NTLDR
>
> For a better chance of getting a specific answer go to:
> The Microsoft news server is
> msnews.microsoft.com
> For the group choices type windowsxp
> You'll find the appropriate group where someone can answer your
> question.

These might help:
Microsoft KB article: Q318728
Microsoft KB article: Q314057
Microsoft KB article: Q255220
Bob
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 4, 2004 6:02:25 PM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

I'm pretty much a rube, but I use CasperXP, quite idiot-proof. A
couple of mouse clicks, and I go for coffee. When I come back, it's
all done. I have two HDDs in my ThinkPad, and clone about once/week.



|
|I'm upgrading to a bigger drive in my laptop, and would like to just
|dupe over the whole thing. What I'm getting with what I've tried so far,
|however, are "NTLDR is missing" errors when I try to boot off the new
|drive. (This is a WinXP system.) None of the advice I found online
|regards repairing or copying files off the XP install CD has done the
|trick.
|
|What works out there?
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 4, 2004 6:02:51 PM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Erik Anderson" <anderiv@spam.me.not.bethel.edu> wrote in message
news:4161556D.4030502@spam.me.not.bethel.edu...
> D.A. Tsenuf wrote:
>> By the way, NTLDR is the boot loader for the NT family OS.
>> Typically, it is only correctly installed with a basic install of the
>> OS.
>
> Not true...you can fix the boot loader by using "recovery console" mode on
> the XP cd.

At keast, that's the theory.
Too bad that it's pretty iffy to make it work.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 5, 2004 12:38:40 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 01:51:26 -0500, Mike1
<mike1_shoot.them.shoot.them.both@usfamily.net> wrote:

>
>I'm upgrading to a bigger drive in my laptop, and would like to just
>dupe over the whole thing. What I'm getting with what I've tried so far,
>however, are "NTLDR is missing" errors when I try to boot off the new
>drive. (This is a WinXP system.) None of the advice I found online
>regards repairing or copying files off the XP install CD has done the
>trick.
>
>What works out there?

I second the recommendation for Acronis True Image. I have used it
many times to "clone" disks for recovery and upgrade and it even works
well with NTFS disks. Version 8.0 is now available and the price is
reasonable.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 5, 2004 3:25:22 AM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Alexei Boukirev" <aboukirev@blah.ameritech.net> wrote in message
news:Xns95788A1705F94aboukirevblahamerite@216.196.97.131...
|
| This is interesting because previous version (7.0) of TrueImage did not
| support external drives (I know for sure - I bought it, it worked drive-
| to-drive in desktop but refused with external drives on desktop and
| laptop). And I have not seen a note of any change in that department for
| the new version. That IS the reason I have not upgraded to 8.0.
|
| Ghost, while a bit harder to work with, handled USB/FireWire external
| drives for a while now.
|
| Regarding the NTLDR and such, if you do drive to drive copying with Ghost
| and reboot to the original drive with the copy still connected,
| partitions on the second drive get assigned drive letters. And that is
| stored on the drive. So, when you then swap drives and try to boot from
| the copy you are likely to have a problem. The boot drive letter is NOT
| C: Another thing to watch in this case is that if you played with your
| PATH settings and replaced %SystemDrive% with C: or such, Windows is not
| gonna load.
|
| There you go. Hope that is helpful in some way.
|
| Alexei


Hi Alexi -

Download the free trial of True Image 8.0 and give it a go. It works
beautifully on external drives. The computer I'm typing on now was cloned
very easily using the program.

The only "gotcha" I've experienced in the entire cloning/external drive
process (which has absolutely nothing to do with True Image) is that I
cannot boot my Vaio V505EX with the external drive connected - it hangs at
the POST screen until I unplug the drive. I suppose the problem has
something to do with code in the BIOS to support booting from a USB floppy.

Jef
October 5, 2004 10:25:06 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

True Image 6.0 works with Firewire, I use it all the time.



On Mon, 04 Oct 2004 13:33:30 -0500, Alexei Boukirev
<aboukirev@blah.ameritech.net> wrote:

>"Jef Norton" <jefn_REMOVE_YOUR_SHORTS_@sbcglobal.net> wrote in
>news:%8d8d.4424$JG2.3212@newssvr14.news.prodigy.com:
>
>> "Mike1" <mike1_shoot.them.shoot.them.both@usfamily.net> wrote in
>> message
>> news:mike1_shoot.them.shoot.them.both-56A0F5.01512604102004@news.usfami
>> ly.net...
>>|
>>| I'm upgrading to a bigger drive in my laptop, and would like to just
>>| dupe over the whole thing. What I'm getting with what I've tried so
>>| far, however, are "NTLDR is missing" errors when I try to boot off
>>| the new drive. (This is a WinXP system.) None of the advice I found
>>| online regards repairing or copying files off the XP install CD has
>>| done the trick.
>>|
>>| What works out there?
>>|
>>| --
>>| Reply to mike1@@@usfamily.net sans two @@, or your reply won't reach
>>| me.
>>
>>
>> Hi Mike -
>>
>> I recently went through this exercise, putting a 7200 RPM drive in my
>> computer.
>>
>> I picked up a USB 2.0 drive caddy for a little over US$20 and
>> downloaded a trial copy of Acronis True Image
>> (http://www.acronis.com).
>>
>> I installed True Image on the computer and put the new disk in the
>> caddy. I ran True Image's Disk Clone function, which took me step by
>> step through the process of cloning my existing drive to the new drive
>> (both partitions, resizing them on the fly). The cloning process ran
>> from within Windows (recommend Disk Cleanup and Defrag in advance to
>> minimize the time this takes... though it didn't take all that long).
>
>This is interesting because previous version (7.0) of TrueImage did not
>support external drives (I know for sure - I bought it, it worked drive-
>to-drive in desktop but refused with external drives on desktop and
>laptop). And I have not seen a note of any change in that department for
>the new version. That IS the reason I have not upgraded to 8.0.
>
>Ghost, while a bit harder to work with, handled USB/FireWire external
>drives for a while now.
>
>Regarding the NTLDR and such, if you do drive to drive copying with Ghost
>and reboot to the original drive with the copy still connected,
>partitions on the second drive get assigned drive letters. And that is
>stored on the drive. So, when you then swap drives and try to boot from
>the copy you are likely to have a problem. The boot drive letter is NOT
>C: Another thing to watch in this case is that if you played with your
>PATH settings and replaced %SystemDrive% with C: or such, Windows is not
>gonna load.
>
>There you go. Hope that is helpful in some way.
>
>Alexei
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 7, 2004 3:41:58 PM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Jef Norton wrote in message
> "Mike1" <mike1 wrote in message
>
> | I'm upgrading to a bigger drive in my laptop, and would like to just
> | dupe over the whole thing. What I'm getting with what I've tried so far,
> | however, are "NTLDR is missing" errors when I try to boot off the new
> | drive. (This is a WinXP system.) None of the advice I found online
> | regards repairing or copying files off the XP install CD has done the
> |
> | What works out there?
>
> I picked up a USB 2.0 drive caddy for a little over US$20 and > |downloaded a trial copy of Acronis True Image


Still not having any luck: I took the old laptop drive and the new
own, and, with some plug adapters, added them both to the chain of a
tower machine. Neither TrueImage's drive-duplication feature nor
save-to-image feature resulted in a transfer that didn't result in
"NTLDR is missing" upon restart.

(TrueImage oddity: straight drive-to-drive duplication took about 50%
longer than drive-to-compressed-archive-and then back-to-drive. WITH
compression. Go figure.)
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 7, 2004 10:53:59 PM

Archived from groups: mn.general,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Mike Schneider" <mike18xx@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1613aab0.0410071041.223d065f@posting.google.com...
|
| Still not having any luck: I took the old laptop drive and the new
| own, and, with some plug adapters, added them both to the chain of a
| tower machine. Neither TrueImage's drive-duplication feature nor
| save-to-image feature resulted in a transfer that didn't result in
| "NTLDR is missing" upon restart.
|
| (TrueImage oddity: straight drive-to-drive duplication took about 50%
| longer than drive-to-compressed-archive-and then back-to-drive. WITH
| compression. Go figure.)


Hi Mike -

I still recommend putting the original drive back in the computer and get a
USB drive caddy to perform the clone. It's very likely that you're causing
issues with NTLDR and the MBR when you install both the original drive and
the new drive in a desktop system. It's also possible you've corrupted the
MBR on the original disk (which can be corrected by putting the drive back
in the original system, booting to the Recovery Console on a Windows XP CD
and typing "FIXMBR" and, possibly "FIXBOOT").

If your notebook computer only has USB 1.1 ports this process will still
work -- though it will run very slowly.

And, of course, a clone of the drive will take longer than a compressed
archive. This is because the program must format the new disk as well as
transfer data to it.

Jef
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 9, 2004 11:51:41 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

On 7 Oct 2004 11:41:58 -0700, mike18xx@yahoo.com (Mike Schneider)
wrote:

>Still not having any luck: I took the old laptop drive and the new
>own, and, with some plug adapters, added them both to the chain of a
>tower machine. Neither TrueImage's drive-duplication feature nor
>save-to-image feature resulted in a transfer that didn't result in
>"NTLDR is missing" upon restart.

What make/model notebook do you have? I ask this because I have had
issues with cloning drives from IBM notebooks using computers other
than IBM. I strongly suspect that it has something to do with IBM's
hidden partition on the drive to allow their "Rapid Restore" to work.
They keep the original system image in a hidden partition on the
drive, and the only way I have seen that can access it is actually
accessing the drive in the system.

I had cloned drives in my Dell notebooks for years with no issues.
About a year ago, I was working on a ThinkPad for a VP, and had
issues with cloning the drive, and just a few months ago, I finally
got a ThinkPad of my own, and had similar problems. I resolved my
problems by making an image of my drive while it was in the primary
bay of the ThinkPad (using Ghost v8 and True Image v8) onto an
external USB2 attached drive. Next, I replaced the drive in the
drive bay, and restored the image onto the drive. On one of the
systems I seem to recall needing to use FDISK /MBR to replace the
master boot record on the drive once it was in the system.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
October 10, 2004 4:39:34 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

> mike18xx@yahoo.com (Mike Schneider) wrote:
> > Still not having any luck: I took the old laptop drive and the new
> > own, and, with some plug adapters, added them both to the chain of a
> > tower machine. Neither TrueImage's drive-duplication feature nor
> > save-to-image feature resulted in a transfer that didn't result in
> > "NTLDR is missing" upon restart.


"Jerry Bloomfield" <jbloomfi@SheltieLovers.net> wrote:
> What make/model notebook do you have? I ask this because I have had
> issues with cloning drives from IBM notebooks using computers other
> than IBM. I strongly suspect that it has something to do with IBM's
> hidden partition on the drive to allow their "Rapid Restore" to work.
> They keep the original system image in a hidden partition on the
> drive, and the only way I have seen that can access it is actually
> accessing the drive in the system.
>
> I had cloned drives in my Dell notebooks for years with no issues.
> About a year ago, I was working on a ThinkPad for a VP, and had
> issues with cloning the drive, and just a few months ago, I finally
> got a ThinkPad of my own, and had similar problems.

Mike, I had the same thought as Jerry. I've also had problems cloning
a Thinkpad hard disk outside of the laptop, so was also going to ask
if you were using an IBM.

Jerry, in my case I had already eliminated the hidden partition from
my Thinkpads and still had the same problem, so I don't think it had
anything to do with IBM's hidden partition. My troubleshooting leads
me to suspect the manner in which the bios "autodetects" the disk
parameters. As you may be aware, with modern IDE drives the disk
parameters (cyls/heads/sectors per track) are essentially made up
numbers -- practically anything will do as long as the total number of
sectors doesn't add up to more than the drive actually has. Many
computer bios's seem to use 254-256 for number of heads. My Dells use
255. My Thinkpads, though, use 240. IOW, a formatted, error-free
hard disk in my Dell will appear to have 240 heads and errors when put
in my IBM. It ups the cylinder count to compensate for the lower head
count, but maybe the difference causes partitions to map out
incorrectly in the wrong machine, and thus cause the machine to have
trouble finding the boot file.
!