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Sandy Bridge 1155 MB SATA controller bug current state

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  • Motherboards
  • SATA
  • Controller
  • Bug
  • Sandy Bridge
  • Product
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February 27, 2011 11:23:44 AM

What is the current state of the SB motherboards, are the current boards on sale still affected by the SATA controller bug and if so how long till non defect boards are available.

I have plenty of HDDs so just no using the 3Gb/s ports is not a solution

Thank you

More about : sandy bridge 1155 sata controller bug current state

February 27, 2011 12:35:53 PM

The mobo w/ the fixed chipset will be arriving this week! Yes, some sellers are still selling the boards w/ the problem. You can tell the difference by seeing if the packaging have a "B3" logo on it. IMO, I will not buy the fixed boards, as I think the quality of those boards are questionable. They are not even talking about it on "how" did they go on fixing the boards. Did they just removed the problem chipset & replaced it w/ the new one or did they manufacture it as an absolutely, completely "new" board? I'll wait for the Z68 chipset arriving this May/June!
a b V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 1:21:14 PM

binoyski said:
The mobo w/ the fixed chipset will be arriving this week! Yes, some sellers are still selling the boards w/ the problem. You can tell the difference by seeing if the packaging have a "B3" logo on it. IMO, I will not buy the fixed boards, as I think the quality of those boards are questionable. They are not even talking about it on "how" did they go on fixing the boards. Did they just removed the problem chipset & replaced it w/ the new one or did they manufacture it as an absolutely, completely "new" board? I'll wait for the Z68 chipset arriving this May/June!


all you have to do is look for Rev. on the MB,as far as i know they all brand new
a c 107 V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 1:26:28 PM

binoyski said:
The mobo w/ the fixed chipset will be arriving this week! Yes, some sellers are still selling the boards w/ the problem. You can tell the difference by seeing if the packaging have a "B3" logo on it. IMO, I will not buy the fixed boards, as I think the quality of those boards are questionable. They are not even talking about it on "how" did they go on fixing the boards. Did they just removed the problem chipset & replaced it w/ the new one or did they manufacture it as an absolutely, completely "new" board? I'll wait for the Z68 chipset arriving this May/June!

This is an overly-paranoid response to a normal problem that has been dealt with in an above-board fashion by all companies involved. Please don't allow it to sway you.

The boards will be available in limited quantities starting this week or the week after. It will be mid-March before mass quantities are available. They will be clearly marked as having the new B3-stepping chip on the package and on the board itself. The UEFI/BIOS will likely have a confirmation as well.
February 27, 2011 2:02:15 PM

Thanks for the info, glad to hear it wont be to long until the fix. I think I will jump on the band wagon and get an early boards from the new series, I don't like leaving CPU technologies (IE Sandy Bridge) to long as to get the most out of it whilst it is 'top spec' I'll just be sure give the board a bios update in a couple monthd.

is it both the P and H boards that are effected?
February 27, 2011 2:52:13 PM

Leaps-from-Shadows said:
This is an overly-paranoid response to a normal problem that has been dealt with in an above-board fashion by all companies involved. Please don't allow it to sway you.

The boards will be available in limited quantities starting this week or the week after. It will be mid-March before mass quantities are available. They will be clearly marked as having the new B3-stepping chip on the package and on the board itself. The UEFI/BIOS will likely have a confirmation as well.


You're too quick to point out that what I wrote is, as you said, "overly-paranoid response to a normal problem that has been dealt with in an above-board fashion by all companies involved". How would you know that? Do you work for them? Were you there when they were fixing the board? Did you see it w/ your own two eyes? I have no ultimate agenda by writing that statement, it's only, & I mean only "my" opinion, & I have a right to that. Where in my statement did you read that I was swaying costumers so they would'nt buy the fixed boards? So "please" don't label whatever I have written as "overly-paranoid". And if anything is suspicious about any statements written here, it is "your" statements that have a bias/agenda towards convincing consumers to "just" buy the boards w/out question!
a c 107 V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 3:43:06 PM

It HAS been dealt with in an above-board fashion, at every step of the way.

1. Intel admitted they had the problem.
2. Intel stopped production immediately.
3. Intel designed a fix for the problem.
4. Intel produced the fixed version quickly.

Board manufacturers have all gone out of their way to assure customers that they will get new boards using the fixed chips with minimal fuss, even going so far as to offer extended warranties and such. Most quality resellers like NewEgg have done this as well, automatically extending the RMA period so users could keep their boards until the new fixed ones are available.

I don't see a problem with echoing that assurance to other users here. As far as I know there hasn't been anything under-handed in regards to this situation.

IN MY OPINION, saying what you did in your first post was in fact an overly-paranoid response, given how this whole situation has been handled by Intel and the board manufacturers.
a b V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 4:08:04 PM

binoyski said:
You're too quick to point out that what I wrote is, as you said, "overly-paranoid response to a normal problem that has been dealt with in an above-board fashion by all companies involved". How would you know that? Do you work for them? Were you there when they were fixing the board? Did you see it w/ your own two eyes? I have no ultimate agenda by writing that statement, it's only, & I mean only "my" opinion, & I have a right to that. Where in my statement did you read that I was swaying costumers so they would'nt buy the fixed boards? So "please" don't label whatever I have written as "overly-paranoid". And if anything is suspicious about any statements written here, it is "your" statements that have a bias/agenda towards convincing consumers to "just" buy the boards w/out question!


I'm not here to argue....but honestly, your statement did in fact appear as an attempt to push people away from Sandy Bridge based systems.

Quote:
I think the quality of those boards are questionable.


If you immediately trust the quality of any product from it's intial release, without any testing, you're rather naive. But, in this case, a flaw was publicly announced and steps were taken to correct the issue before it effects the public. The involved companies have reputations to maintain. In the current economy, if it were determined that manufacturers took shortcuts that could impact product quality, it could potentially be detrimental to the manufacturers involved.
February 27, 2011 4:34:51 PM

Please, don't state "your opinions" as an "undeniable" "fact". Everybody is entitled to their own opinions, but "never" to their own "facts". As I've said, you were never there!

-Yes, they've admitted it
-Yes, they've stopped it
-Yes, they've designed a fix for it
-Yes, they've produced the fixed version quickly

Still, how about the "QUALITY" of the "fixed boards", which is the question I want to be answered? Don't keep stating that the whole situation has been handled in an above fashion by Intel & the boards makers, then w/out question, the quality of the boards are beyond questions as "you" & "only you" have written! I ask asked you if you worked for them, were you there when they were fixing the boards or did you see it w/ your own two eyes? No answer from you, as I've read your post. Again, it's just my query of the boards' quality, since, I don't know "if" they've just replaced the chipset on the boards that have the problem that existed before & after launch of the P67, or did they make new boards from the ground up. In order for me to make a sound decision if I buy the re-released P67 boards. Labeling me as paranoid & stating as a fact while writing it as your own opinion makes your statement inconsistent! So did you see it?
a b V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 4:51:28 PM

Yes sykozis, but the product should have been thoroughly tested prior to release on Jan 09. Besides the failed Cougar Point control chips, my mobo had three BIOS revision in 3 weeks. This shows that the mobo maker did not completely test the product before release or multiple BIOS revisions would not be necessary. There is no excuse for this kind of thing...these companies have the resourses and ability and IMO, the duty to properly test before release. So, I think everyone, including poster binoyski, has every reason to be concerned and be reluctant to jump on the band wagon the minute the overhauled boards hit the market. I understand his concerns and completely agree with him. I know some of the players on this site will not....there attitudes have already been displayed many times lately. Some posters on this site seem to think it is perfectly okay to have mulitple BIOS revisions and lots of compatability issues with ram and so on. They might like being used as BETA testers but many of us do not. At least if a person downloads a software program labeled BETA, they know it does not have all the bugs out and can expect issues. These boards were released without adequate testing (the Cougar Point recall fiacso clearly shows that) and anyone that isn't concerned about the replacements needs to be. Oh yeah, I forgot, SB goes very fast so that makes everything okay. NOT.
February 27, 2011 5:00:26 PM

Eagle Eye_54 said:
Yes sykozis, but the product should have been thoroughly tested prior to release on Jan 09. Besides the failed Cougar Point control chips, my mobo had three BIOS revision in 3 weeks. This shows that the mobo maker did not completely test the product before release or multiple BIOS revisions would not be necessary. There is no excuse for this kind of thing...these companies have the resourses and ability and IMO, the duty to properly test before release. So, I think everyone, including poster binoyski, has every reason to be concerned and be reluctant to jump on the band wagon the minute the overhauled boards hit the market. I understand his concerns and completely agree with him. I know some of the players on this site will not....there attitudes have already been displayed many times lately. Some posters on this site seem to think it is perfectly okay to have mulitple BIOS revisions and lots of compatability issues with ram and so on. They might like being used as BETA testers but many of us do not. At least if a person downloads a software program labeled BETA, they know it does not have all the bugs out and can expect issues. These boards were released without adequate testing (the Cougar Point recall fiacso clearly shows that) and anyone that isn't concerned about the replacements needs to be. Oh yeah, I forgot, SB goes very fast so that makes everything okay. NOT.



Thank you, Eagle Eye_54!
February 27, 2011 6:31:21 PM

Gigabyte have already started shipping their fixed B3 revision boards ;) 
a b V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 6:34:22 PM

Eagle Eye_54 said:
Yes sykozis, but the product should have been thoroughly tested prior to release on Jan 09. Besides the failed Cougar Point control chips, my mobo had three BIOS revision in 3 weeks. This shows that the mobo maker did not completely test the product before release or multiple BIOS revisions would not be necessary. There is no excuse for this kind of thing...these companies have the resourses and ability and IMO, the duty to properly test before release. So, I think everyone, including poster binoyski, has every reason to be concerned and be reluctant to jump on the band wagon the minute the overhauled boards hit the market. I understand his concerns and completely agree with him. I know some of the players on this site will not....there attitudes have already been displayed many times lately. Some posters on this site seem to think it is perfectly okay to have mulitple BIOS revisions and lots of compatability issues with ram and so on. They might like being used as BETA testers but many of us do not. At least if a person downloads a software program labeled BETA, they know it does not have all the bugs out and can expect issues. These boards were released without adequate testing (the Cougar Point recall fiacso clearly shows that) and anyone that isn't concerned about the replacements needs to be. Oh yeah, I forgot, SB goes very fast so that makes everything okay. NOT.


Products should be thoroughly tested, yes. But, the Cougar Point chipsets did in fact pass Intel's standard quality control tests and later showed a possibility of problems within a time-frame of 3-5 years under heavy I/O loads using the SATA 3.0GB/sec connectors. The typical user won't apply the necessary I/O to be effected by this issue within that 3-5 YEAR time frame. Unfortuntely, it's impossible to get a flawless product to market regardless of the extent of testing. This isn't the first time Intel has issued a recall. In fact, they recalled processors in the past for security related concerns involving the CPUID being broadcast. That was a far further reaching issue than this one is.
February 27, 2011 6:38:52 PM

sykozis said:
I'm not here to argue....but honestly, your statement did in fact appear as an attempt to push people away from Sandy Bridge based systems.

Quote:
I think the quality of those boards are questionable.


If you immediately trust the quality of any product from it's intial release, without any testing, you're rather naive. But, in this case, a flaw was publicly announced and steps were taken to correct the issue before it effects the public. The involved companies have reputations to maintain. In the current economy, if it were determined that manufacturers took shortcuts that could impact product quality, it could potentially be detrimental to the manufacturers involved.


Quote:
did in fact appear


As I've stated, It's only "my" opinion. That's why I wrote
Quote:
IMO, I will not buy the fixed boards, as I think the quality of those boards are questionable.
. If I wrote it differently, for example, "IMO, & it should be yours too",I will not buy the fixed boards, as I think the quality of those boards are questionable", then you can safely "assume"("wrong", by the way") that my
Quote:
statement did in fact appear as an attempt to push people away from Sandy Bridge based systems
.

When I also stated
Quote:
I'll wait for the Z68 chipset arriving this May/June!
. Is the Z68 "not" a Sandy Bridge based platform, & to write that my "statement did in fact appear as an attempt to push people away from Sandy Bridge based systems", well, that make you "appear" you're the one who don't know what you're talking about!

And for the record, the flaw was announced "after" people already bought it, "not" as you've written
Quote:
a flaw was publicly announced and steps were taken to correct the issue "before" it effects the public
. If that happened, as you've stated, board makers will not be issuing instructions to people on how to exchange their boards for a fixed one!

The state of the current economy should have no bearing on how people should receive a "quality" product, just because"if it were determined that manufacturers took shortcuts that could impact product quality, it could potentially be detrimental to the manufacturers involved". And again, I'm not saying the product sucks, I just want "to know" on "how" did they go about on fixing the boards(that's it) & "I" & "me only", for me it seems to be questionable they're not saying something about it! This is so I can make a sound decision "if" "I" buy a re-released P67 boards or wait for the Z68! I JUST WANT "TO KNOW"! I have a right to ask that question, state "my" opinion & to have a "choice. Stating that I'm "overly-paranoid", and "appearing" to sway people away from SB platform, well, if i can do what you & Leaps-from-Shadows seemed to be doing, it "appears" that Leaps-from-Shadows don't know the "FACTUAL" answer to my question, then you're just too "dumb". To sykozis, it "appears" you don't know what you're talking about, then don't you think "silence" would have been more appropriate!
a b V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 6:50:34 PM

podolski said:
And for the record, the flaw was announced "after" people already bought it, "not" as you've written
Quote:
a flaw was publicly announced and steps were taken to correct the issue "before" it effects the public
. If that happened, as you've stated, board makers will not be issuing instructions to people on how to exchange their boards for a fixed one!

The state of the current economy should have no bearing on how people should receive a "quality" product, just because"if it were determined that manufacturers took shortcuts that could impact product quality, it could potentially be detrimental to the manufacturers involved". And again, I'm not saying the product sucks, I just want "to know" on "how" did they go about on fixing the boards(that's it) & "I" & "me only", for me it seems to be questionable they're not saying something about it! This is so I can make a sound decision "if" "I" buy a re-released P67 boards or wait for the Z68! I JUST WANT "TO KNOW"! I have a right to ask that question, state "my" opinion & to have a "choice. Stating that I'm "overly-paranoid", and "appearing" to sway people away from SB platform, well, if i can do what you & Leaps-from-Shadows seemed to be doing, it "appears" that Leaps-from-Shadows don't know the "FACTUAL" answer to my question, then you're just too "dumb". To sykozis, it "appears" you don't know what you're talking about, then don't you think "silence" would have been more appropriate!


Yes, people bought the motherboards using these chipsets. Exactly how many have been effected by the I/O issue? None. Noone has had enough time to put such a load on the SATA 3.0GB/sec ports to reproduce Intel's internal tests. Again, in the past Intel had to recall processors due to the CPUID being broadcast resulting in security issues.

If you're in the US.....law dictates that if the products were modified/repaired AFTER production, they must be marketed as refurbished products. <--Seems to speak of "how" these products were "fixed"... Guess it helps to know the laws. Can't imagine the laws are much different in other countries.
February 27, 2011 7:08:01 PM

It's not important that "none" was affected by the I/O issue! What's important that it "will" affect someone regardless if "no one has had enough time to put such a load on the SATA 2 port or not.

And you're wrong, the "big buyers/partners" of the chipset/board are the ones who "told" them that there is something wrong w/ the chipset! So to say that no one was affected was not really true, Intel just confirmed it.

"Intel mentioned that after it had built over 100,000 chipsets it started to get some complaints from its customers about failures. Early last week Intel duplicated and confirmed the failure in house"

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4142/intel-discovers-bug-...
a b V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 9:00:13 PM

Your source is from January 31.....that's hardly last week. There's 7 days in a week, not 27....
a b V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 9:37:06 PM

sykozis, Sorry but the written evidence put forward previously in press releases appears to show your statement that no one was affected by this issue is incorrect. From what I read, Intel was notified by motherboard makers that numerous customers had experienced problems and that started Intel investigating the situation. They very quickly confirmed the problem, developed a fix and then issued a recall. So it was the customers (us) not Intel that first noticed an issue. So, I disagree that people were NOT affected as you state. Furthermore, many thousands of SB owners have been affected by the recall, be it from wasted time to perhaps even stress caused by the hassle. I was so concerned by this issue that I returned my board. That caused me hassle and money. I live 140km from my retail store so it cost me gas and wear and tear on my vehicle, not to mention travel time and hours to remove the board and re-install the replacement, set it up, etc. So, regardless of who uncovered the issue, the issue HAS AFFECTED PEOPLE.

In a post directed to myself in this very thread, you state it is impossible to get a flawless product to market. How outrageous a statement is that! We can put robots on Mars that are only designed to last 3 months in that hostile environment yet two years later, those same robots are still working. If we can do that, we can make a printed circuit board that works flawlessly. Gigabtye makes 300,000 motherboards a year. (Sorry, I don't know the number that ASUS makes but it is considerably more than that). Maybe they need to make a few less and do a better job or checking that they work flawlessly before shipping them to us mortals. Since we buy their product and not the Intel SATA chips set specifically (we have no control over where a board maker gets its' products from), it is the motherboard makers' duty to ensure that the parts work to spec and properly.

I
a b V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 10:36:22 PM

Eagle Eye_54 said:
sykozis, Sorry but the written evidence put forward previously in press releases appears to show your statement that no one was affected by this issue is incorrect. From what I read, Intel was notified by motherboard makers that numerous customers had experienced problems and that started Intel investigating the situation. They very quickly confirmed the problem, developed a fix and then issued a recall. So it was the customers (us) not Intel that first noticed an issue. So, I disagree that people were NOT affected as you state. Furthermore, many thousands of SB owners have been affected by the recall, be it from wasted time to perhaps even stress caused by the hassle. I was so concerned by this issue that I returned my board. That caused me hassle and money. I live 140km from my retail store so it cost me gas and wear and tear on my vehicle, not to mention travel time and hours to remove the board and re-install the replacement, set it up, etc. So, regardless of who uncovered the issue, the issue HAS AFFECTED PEOPLE.

In a post directed to myself in this very thread, you state it is impossible to get a flawless product to market. How outrageous a statement is that! We can put robots on Mars that are only designed to last 3 months in that hostile environment yet two years later, those same robots are still working. If we can do that, we can make a printed circuit board that works flawlessly. Gigabtye makes 300,000 motherboards a year. (Sorry, I don't know the number that ASUS makes but it is considerably more than that). Maybe they need to make a few less and do a better job or checking that they work flawlessly before shipping them to us mortals. Since we buy their product and not the Intel SATA chips set specifically (we have no control over where a board maker gets its' products from), it is the motherboard makers' duty to ensure that the parts work to spec and properly.

I


Well, lets see you test 1000+ different possible configurations for "flawless operation". The nature of the products makes it impossible to guarrantee every aspect of every product. Look at the number of low quality power supplies sold every day under various brands....Diablotek, AGI, Ultra, Cougar, Apex, Apevia, Rosewill. But nobody seems to have an issue with these products, though their failure can result in complete system failure. These companies make no attempt what so ever to improve their products, but instead take every possible step to decrease production cost at the cost of quality. Some of these companies will go out of their way to avoid honoring their own warranties....but, in this instances, the motherboard makers are in some cases increasing their warranty periods to ensure customer satisfaction. Production of the early H67/P67 chipsets was stopped and the necessary steps to correct the issue have been taken. Intel publicly admitted there was a problem instead of trying to hide it, unlike other companies....i.e. nVidia and Toyota. nVidia knew there was a problem with the G84m and G86m prior to release....but denied it for several months. Toyota denied that there was a problem with their "fly-by-wire" system on their cars even after deaths were reportedly caused by the problem. I'm guessing neither of these issues has stopped people on this site from buying from there 2 dishonest companies.... I doubt these incidents even incited near the comments/opinions either. Electronic components fail....period. Unless you put every single device produced through numerous years of testing prior to putting it on a store shelf, you're not going to avoid it. The testing necessary to ensure no faulty product ever hits the market, would prevent companies from ever releasing anything. The bios for my motherboard has had 6 total revisions.... 1 fixed an overclocking feature....3 added support for new processor steppings and 1 updated the lan boot rom. The latest bios update simply changes how harddrives appear on the POST screen.... My last board had 3 bios updates simply for memory compatibility....2 for cpu micro-code updates, 1 for hanging at POST and 1 for an app called "Instant Boot".... The manufacturer even requested, based on presented issues, that my board be returned for testing for a possible new bios release due to compatibility issues with a BFG GTX275. *** happens...if you can't accept that, give up on electronics...it's impossible to guarrantee life-span or overall product quality when multiple vendors are involved.
a c 107 V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 11:33:29 PM

Whee!

Dayum ... boy am I sorry I didn't put on my flame-proof suit!

<fire & brimstone preacher voice>You shall be shown the error of your ways, and you will see the light ... or you will be cast down into the eternal hellfire!</fire & brimstone preacher voice>

Keep it up with the flames and rants ... it's fun seeing the back-and-forth going on!
a b V Motherboard
February 27, 2011 11:50:01 PM

My concern would be if they fixed the motherboards by removing and fitting new chips to the old motherboards. This can be problematic if the removed chips are BGA types as replacements can be unreliable.
a b V Motherboard
February 28, 2011 12:33:52 AM

sykozis said:
Well, lets see you test 1000+ different possible configurations for "flawless operation". The nature of the products makes it impossible to guarrantee every aspect of every product. Look at the number of low quality power supplies sold every day under various brands....Diablotek, AGI, Ultra, Cougar, Apex, Apevia, Rosewill. But nobody seems to have an issue with these products, though their failure can result in complete system failure. These companies make no attempt what so ever to improve their products, but instead take every possible step to decrease production cost at the cost of quality. Some of these companies will go out of their way to avoid honoring their own warranties....but, in this instances, the motherboard makers are in some cases increasing their warranty periods to ensure customer satisfaction. Production of the early H67/P67 chipsets was stopped and the necessary steps to correct the issue have been taken. Intel publicly admitted there was a problem instead of trying to hide it, unlike other companies....i.e. nVidia and Toyota. nVidia knew there was a problem with the G84m and G86m prior to release....but denied it for several months. Toyota denied that there was a problem with their "fly-by-wire" system on their cars even after deaths were reportedly caused by the problem. I'm guessing neither of these issues has stopped people on this site from buying from there 2 dishonest companies.... I doubt these incidents even incited near the comments/opinions either. Electronic components fail....period. Unless you put every single device produced through numerous years of testing prior to putting it on a store shelf, you're not going to avoid it. The testing necessary to ensure no faulty product ever hits the market, would prevent companies from ever releasing anything. The bios for my motherboard has had 6 total revisions.... 1 fixed an overclocking feature....3 added support for new processor steppings and 1 updated the lan boot rom. The latest bios update simply changes how harddrives appear on the POST screen.... My last board had 3 bios updates simply for memory compatibility....2 for cpu micro-code updates, 1 for hanging at POST and 1 for an app called "Instant Boot".... The manufacturer even requested, based on presented issues, that my board be returned for testing for a possible new bios release due to compatibility issues with a BFG GTX275. *** happens...if you can't accept that, give up on electronics...it's impossible to guarrantee life-span or overall product quality when multiple vendors are involved.


I am willing to concede one or even two BIOS updates for unforeseen issues but the SB release has been a dog. With yours having six, I would be complaining all the way to CEO!!!!! That is plainly outrageous and the fact that you seem okay with that makes me wonder. :non: 

As for PSU makers, they are required to meet minimum UL (CSA) standards and if they do that, they are in compliance. If tighter rules are needed, then it is up to UL to set the new standards. The motherboard makers don't seem to be screaming about that, I have never seen a recommendation about PSU's (beyond the wattage output). I use a Corsair AX-850 so I have never experienced concerns in that area....I don't buy cheap....neither should anyone else. If they did stop buying the cheap stuff, then they'd stop making them. Let us also not forget that the power system in North America sucks big time. It is over stretched, over used and in need of a major overhaul. So I don't think the PSU makers are the only bad guys in this issue.

As for your remarks regarding Toyota, I have owned Toyota vehicles since the mid 80's. They have all been superb. If they were like a Chrysler, Ford or GM product, then that would be a better analogy. There are plenty of instances of bad behavior in the auto manufacturer area, and Toyota is only a small part of that. Toyota has received the superb label from me because I have direct experience with them and there is statistical data to support that label. I should add that the term superb would never be used in the same sentence by me with the likes of any American label auto maker. I have direct experience to back that feeling up as well. And just to get the record straight, there was nothing wrong with the Toyota "fly-by-wire" system. That has been proven in the recently released DOT investigation report (that included input from NASA engineers). Remember, airplanes have been using that same type of system for about 30 years or so and if they were bad, there would have been a lot more plane crashes than we have had.

I realize there are issues with electronic products, always has been, always will be. But, a reasonable level is tolerable, a large level is not. According to the latest Consumer Magazine report on the matter, Sony LCD TV's have a very low failure rate and are therefore a better risk than some other TV makers. They are superb in my opinion. I have owned many of them over the last 40 or more years and keep buying them cause they work and stay working for years. I want the mobo makers to work towards that goal. :sol: 

Lastly, I would also like to see veteran posters on this site to be more balanced in their comments, instead of defending these computer part makers as though they were paid by them. This site is intended to help people, not to soft sell problems. If that means Leaps needs to wear a flame proof suit, then so be it. As the saying goes, if the shoe fits..... :p 
a c 107 V Motherboard
February 28, 2011 12:46:58 AM

pjmelect said:
My concern would be if they fixed the motherboards by removing and fitting new chips to the old motherboards. This can be problematic if the removed chips are BGA types as replacements can be unreliable.

Apparently, by law (in the US anyway), if they did that they would have to sell the boards as refurbished or reconditioned.

The new boards coming out are brand new boards with new revisions. The traces and such most likely haven't changed -- the new revision simply denotes the presence of at B3-stepping Cougar Point PCH.
February 28, 2011 4:05:29 AM

Before entering the fray please make sure you have your protective gear.
-Flamer Mask
-spam deterring suit
-anti ban gloves
-crap resilient boots
-Cod piece of .......

Well now that thats out of the way honestly binoyski your points are half baked at best.

Quote:
"I ask asked you if you worked for them, were you there when they were fixing the boards or did you see it w/ your own two eyes? No answer from you, as I've read your post. Again, it's just my query of the boards' quality, since, I don't know "if" they've just replaced the chipset on the boards that have the problem that existed before & after launch of the P67, or did they make new boards from the ground up."


^What in the blazes are you talking about? Thats like saying I am not going to get that pace maker because I wasnt there when it was built in the factory and it might be faulty.

The boards will be reversions of the old ones. Wether that means they take boards that had the sata problem and fix them and ship them off, or they build brand new ones that dont have the problem. Either way you will receive a mobo that will be in pristine condition. They will not be shipping boards that where mailed back to them by customers I can guaranty that, because that is what refurbished is for.

Also the state of the economy does matter. Because these mobo companies are competing for our dollars, and that means that doing dishonest things like sending out used mobos that are boxed as new is seriously out of the question. You have 1 slip up like that and the entire company goes under. Not sure how long you have been part of the computer building community but one thing you need to understand is that true builders are willing to pay that little extra for the name brand they trust. We as customers value this and because of that the companies value it.

My advice for new sandy bridge users is to wait a few days for the dust to settle and read some reviews, then go out and pick yourself up one of the mobos. Waiting for the Z series isnt worth it, I dont understand really why they are making all of these series. Asus already has 12+ mobos that will be available. They are straight up cannibalizing sales.

Hope some of this helps
>>Preolt

ps. please dont put bloody "quotes" around every word you are trying to put voice inflections on because it doesnt work and it just makes you look unprofessional, as well as writing large brick like paragraphs. They are a struggle to read. Thanks have a great day.
February 28, 2011 6:08:40 AM

preolt said:
Before entering the fray please make sure you have your protective gear.
-Flamer Mask
-spam deterring suit
-anti ban gloves
-crap resilient boots
-Cod piece of .......

Well now that thats out of the way honestly binoyski your points are half baked at best.

Quote:
"I ask asked you if you worked for them, were you there when they were fixing the boards or did you see it w/ your own two eyes? No answer from you, as I've read your post. Again, it's just my query of the boards' quality, since, I don't know "if" they've just replaced the chipset on the boards that have the problem that existed before & after launch of the P67, or did they make new boards from the ground up."


^What in the blazes are you talking about? Thats like saying I am not going to get that pace maker because I wasnt there when it was built in the factory and it might be faulty.^What in the blazes are you talking about? Thats like saying I am not going to get that pace maker because I wasnt there when it was built in the factory and it might be faulty.

The boards will be reversions of the old ones. Wether that means they take boards that had the sata problem and fix them and ship them off, or they build brand new ones that dont have the problem. Either way you will receive a mobo that will be in pristine condition. They will not be shipping boards that where mailed back to them by customers I can guaranty that, because that is what refurbished is for.

Also the state of the economy does matter. Because these mobo companies are competing for our dollars, and that means that doing dishonest things like sending out used mobos that are boxed as new is seriously out of the question. You have 1 slip up like that and the entire company goes under. Not sure how long you have been part of the computer building community but one thing you need to understand is that true builders are willing to pay that little extra for the name brand they trust. We as customers value this and because of that the companies value it.

My advice for new sandy bridge users is to wait a few days for the dust to settle and read some reviews, then go out and pick yourself up one of the mobos. Waiting for the Z series isnt worth it, I dont understand really why they are making all of these series. Asus already has 12+ mobos that will be available. They are straight up cannibalizing sales.

Hope some of this helps
>>Preolt

ps. please dont put bloody "quotes" around every word you are trying to put voice inflections on because it doesnt work and it just makes you look unprofessional, as well as writing large brick like paragraphs. They are a struggle to read. Thanks have a great day.


Well, that's your opinion & that's great. Mine, I'll wait for Z68. Other people can make their own. Stop telling other people to just buy the re-released P67 boards because you said so, & stating that Z68 isn't worth it.

The quotes as you've noted, well I was just hammering on my point. Calling me out on that then labeling me unprofessional just makes you judgmental. It didn't prevent you replying(even though struggling, hehe), right? You have some misspellings yourself.

Quote:
^What in the blazes are you talking about? Thats like saying I am not going to get that pace maker because I wasnt there when it was built in the factory and it might be faulty.


I truly doubt you'll not be worried if a pacemaker was recalled due to the device malfunctioning that will result in people dying. Well, if that happened, & you need a pacemaker, film yourself saying you're not worried at all that you will not die due to the device malfunctioning(that'll surely be a first). You have to admit you're at least a little bit worried & make sure the tech behind it is solid. Really? It will not make you worry? LMAO :lol:  .
February 28, 2011 6:09:39 AM

preolt said:
Before entering the fray please make sure you have your protective gear.
-Flamer Mask
-spam deterring suit
-anti ban gloves
-crap resilient boots
-Cod piece of .......

Well now that thats out of the way honestly binoyski your points are half baked at best.

Quote:
"I ask asked you if you worked for them, were you there when they were fixing the boards or did you see it w/ your own two eyes? No answer from you, as I've read your post. Again, it's just my query of the boards' quality, since, I don't know "if" they've just replaced the chipset on the boards that have the problem that existed before & after launch of the P67, or did they make new boards from the ground up."


^What in the blazes are you talking about? Thats like saying I am not going to get that pace maker because I wasnt there when it was built in the factory and it might be faulty.^What in the blazes are you talking about? Thats like saying I am not going to get that pace maker because I wasnt there when it was built in the factory and it might be faulty.

The boards will be reversions of the old ones. Wether that means they take boards that had the sata problem and fix them and ship them off, or they build brand new ones that dont have the problem. Either way you will receive a mobo that will be in pristine condition. They will not be shipping boards that where mailed back to them by customers I can guaranty that, because that is what refurbished is for.

Also the state of the economy does matter. Because these mobo companies are competing for our dollars, and that means that doing dishonest things like sending out used mobos that are boxed as new is seriously out of the question. You have 1 slip up like that and the entire company goes under. Not sure how long you have been part of the computer building community but one thing you need to understand is that true builders are willing to pay that little extra for the name brand they trust. We as customers value this and because of that the companies value it.

My advice for new sandy bridge users is to wait a few days for the dust to settle and read some reviews, then go out and pick yourself up one of the mobos. Waiting for the Z series isnt worth it, I dont understand really why they are making all of these series. Asus already has 12+ mobos that will be available. They are straight up cannibalizing sales.

Hope some of this helps
>>Preolt

ps. please dont put bloody "quotes" around every word you are trying to put voice inflections on because it doesnt work and it just makes you look unprofessional, as well as writing large brick like paragraphs. They are a struggle to read. Thanks have a great day.


Well, that's your opinion & that's great. Mine, I'll wait for Z68. Other people can make their own. Stop telling other people to just buy the re-released P67 boards because you said so, & stating that Z68 isn't worth it.

The quotes as you've noted, well I was just hammering on my point. Calling me out on that then labeling me unprofessional just makes you judgmental. It didn't prevent you replying(even though struggling, hehe), right? You have some misspellings yourself.

Quote:
^What in the blazes are you talking about? Thats like saying I am not going to get that pace maker because I wasnt there when it was built in the factory and it might be faulty.


I truly doubt you'll not be worried if a pacemaker was recalled due to the device malfunctioning that will result in people dying. Well, if that happened, & you need a pacemaker, film yourself saying you're not worried at all that you will not die due to the device malfunctioning(that'll surely be a first). You have to admit you're at least a little bit worried & make sure the tech behind it is solid. Really? It will not make you worry? LMAO :lol:  .
February 28, 2011 6:10:09 AM

preolt said:
Before entering the fray please make sure you have your protective gear.
-Flamer Mask
-spam deterring suit
-anti ban gloves
-crap resilient boots
-Cod piece of .......

Well now that thats out of the way honestly binoyski your points are half baked at best.

Quote:
"I ask asked you if you worked for them, were you there when they were fixing the boards or did you see it w/ your own two eyes? No answer from you, as I've read your post. Again, it's just my query of the boards' quality, since, I don't know "if" they've just replaced the chipset on the boards that have the problem that existed before & after launch of the P67, or did they make new boards from the ground up."


^What in the blazes are you talking about? Thats like saying I am not going to get that pace maker because I wasnt there when it was built in the factory and it might be faulty.^What in the blazes are you talking about? Thats like saying I am not going to get that pace maker because I wasnt there when it was built in the factory and it might be faulty.

The boards will be reversions of the old ones. Wether that means they take boards that had the sata problem and fix them and ship them off, or they build brand new ones that dont have the problem. Either way you will receive a mobo that will be in pristine condition. They will not be shipping boards that where mailed back to them by customers I can guaranty that, because that is what refurbished is for.

Also the state of the economy does matter. Because these mobo companies are competing for our dollars, and that means that doing dishonest things like sending out used mobos that are boxed as new is seriously out of the question. You have 1 slip up like that and the entire company goes under. Not sure how long you have been part of the computer building community but one thing you need to understand is that true builders are willing to pay that little extra for the name brand they trust. We as customers value this and because of that the companies value it.

My advice for new sandy bridge users is to wait a few days for the dust to settle and read some reviews, then go out and pick yourself up one of the mobos. Waiting for the Z series isnt worth it, I dont understand really why they are making all of these series. Asus already has 12+ mobos that will be available. They are straight up cannibalizing sales.

Hope some of this helps
>>Preolt

ps. please dont put bloody "quotes" around every word you are trying to put voice inflections on because it doesnt work and it just makes you look unprofessional, as well as writing large brick like paragraphs. They are a struggle to read. Thanks have a great day.


Well, that's your opinion & that's great. Mine, I'll wait for Z68. Other people can make their own. Stop telling other people to just buy the re-released P67 boards because you said so, & stating that Z68 isn't worth it.

The quotes as you've noted, well I was just hammering on my point. Calling me out on that then labeling me unprofessional just makes you judgmental. It didn't prevent you replying(even though struggling, hehe), right? You have some misspellings yourself.

Quote:
^What in the blazes are you talking about? Thats like saying I am not going to get that pace maker because I wasnt there when it was built in the factory and it might be faulty.


I truly doubt you'll not be worried if a pacemaker was recalled due to the device malfunctioning that will result in people dying. Well, if that happened, & you need a pacemaker, film yourself saying you're not worried at all that you will not die due to the device malfunctioning(that'll surely be a first). You have to admit you're at least a little bit worried & make sure the tech behind it is solid. Really? It will not make you worry? LMAO :lol:  .
February 28, 2011 6:59:33 AM

Anyone know who is selling them yet? I've been searching and found nothing so far. Maybe some manufacturers selling on their own sites? I know evga isn't yet, but don't know who else sells from their site.

Hopefully someone knows so I don't have to get an old one off ebay or something.
-=Mark=-
a c 107 V Motherboard
February 28, 2011 7:47:12 AM

No one yet. Possibly later this week or next week.
February 28, 2011 4:23:31 PM

Yeah they will be available in short supply this week. After that your probably going to need to wait till mid march.
February 28, 2011 6:59:08 PM

FWIW

I'm buying a P67 board as soon as they are again available.

Intel has always stood TALL behind their product ever since Andy Grove made sure they took care of the 'divide-by' CPU error recall back in the, what was it, the `80's? I had one of those, they sent me a new one, and I have ALWAYS bought nothing but Intel since then.

I'm not at all worried about the boards about to be shipped.

Just my 2ยข.

Tim
February 28, 2011 7:17:05 PM

binoyski said:
I truly doubt you'll not be worried if a pacemaker was recalled due to the device malfunctioning that will result in people dying. Well, if that happened, & you need a pacemaker, film yourself saying you're not worried at all that you will not die due to the device malfunctioning(that'll surely be a first). You have to admit you're at least a little bit worried & make sure the tech behind it is solid. Really? It will not make you worry? LMAO :lol:  .


Now you are talking about something close to my heart. LOL

Yes, I have a pacemaker/defibrillator. It is my second one. I had my first one for 5 years, and yes, it was recalled as defective after it had been in my chest for about 2 years. The leads that go down to the heart were defective and prone to breaking and fraying. (Google "Medtronic Sprint Fidelis lead recall," or see here: http://wwwp.medtronic.com/Newsroom/NewsReleaseDetails.d... )

I had the defective leads that were installed on August 19, 2005 extracted on September 22, 2010, when they put in my new pacemaker. (When the batteries get old, they replace the whole box.)

So, yes, I was more than a little bit worried since people DID die due to the defective leads. There was about a 2% mortality rate after 2 years that could be contributed to the leads. However, there was a 7% mortality rate at first for trying to extract the leads -- which they got down to less than 1% when I had mine taken out in September.

But, I'm still buying one of the new P67 motherboards. LOL

Tim
March 1, 2011 9:34:02 PM

On Newegg I was able to put it into my cart no problem, not going to buy it but it seems like you can get it now. *shrug*
March 1, 2011 9:43:38 PM

therealdeal723 said:
On Newegg I was able to put it into my cart no problem, not going to buy it but it seems like you can get it now. *shrug*


Oh ok. When I first clicked you link, they had a message stating "protect your blah blah blah" with no price available.

Now that I check again, I see that it's $129.99


IMO, I'd never buy Biostar. For that price, I'd stick with Gigabyte. Much better quality board with Gigabyte over Biostar - just look at the on board cooler setup (or lack there of on the Biostar).

Edit -

Correction, for that price you could also get the setup from MSI and ASUS (as well as Gigabyte). So if cost was a deciding factor, IMO, Biostar would still be the last option.
March 1, 2011 10:36:59 PM

Quote:
Yeah Tim I hear you, but remember that Intel isn't the only maker of mobos and chances are, you won't buy an Intel made board. ASUS and Gigabyte have the lion's share of board sales in the world. They are the ones to blame here....they are responsible for buying parts that work and do the job. They are the ones that didn't test them throughly enough to figure out how they worked with the new CPU/chipsets and that the parts wouldn't destroy your hard drive data. The mobo makers buy their chipset sets and components from various suppliers. If you still feel the Sandy Bridge setup is worth a shot, go for it....after all, it is a free country (last I heard anyway). Just understand what you are buying into first. Like my signature says: "Caveat Emptor", which means buyer beware.


Yeah, Eagle Eye. I wasn't clear. I stick with Intel CPU's. The mobo will be an Asus Maximus IV Extreme.

Tim
a b V Motherboard
March 1, 2011 10:56:42 PM

Good choice.
March 2, 2011 3:26:14 AM

Asus boards are coming back onto the market as well on newegg. They sold out almost 30 minutes after going up. They where all open box mobos, which makes me believe they where boards that had the fix applied and that the brand new boards will be available at some point this month.

Though I am still holding out for an EVGA option... Though its not looking like that will happen for a while sadly. Sigh
March 3, 2011 2:13:52 AM

Notice though that they are putting the old boards back on the market. Normally we would see brand new boards put out and for sale and it would be about a week or so before we would see "open box" products. They are putting out the older ones right away, with the new fixes of course.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
March 7, 2011 4:16:03 AM

binoyski said:
The mobo w/ the fixed chipset will be arriving this week! Yes, some sellers are still selling the boards w/ the problem. You can tell the difference by seeing if the packaging have a "B3" logo on it. IMO, I will not buy the fixed boards, as I think the quality of those boards are questionable. They are not even talking about it on "how" did they go on fixing the boards. Did they just removed the problem chipset & replaced it w/ the new one or did they manufacture it as an absolutely, completely "new" board? I'll wait for the Z68 chipset arriving this May/June!

what does "B3" logo mean. Does it mean that motherboard has been fixed?
a c 107 V Motherboard
March 7, 2011 4:46:07 AM

It means it's a new mainboard with the fixed chipset on it.
March 7, 2011 9:05:22 AM

just went down to fry's and got a MSI P67A-GD65 (b3) yesterday... keep your eyes pealed
March 7, 2011 4:48:08 PM

The new boards that have B3 on it or the reversion tag are brand new boards. They where created with the fix in mind, not old boards having the chipset fix added on. There are multiple ways to check to make sure the board you buy is truly a reversion and new, I will have to find the link and post it, I believe ASUS might have some thing about it on heir website as well.
March 7, 2011 5:32:09 PM

Talked to a Rep at Microcenter in Rockville yesterday and he says they get their shipments on Tuesday Morning. He fully expects to see some more P67 boards on that truck. If your local.. Jump on it!
March 7, 2011 10:39:38 PM

Well I want more than just a peel-off sticker saying B3 to assure me I have a brand new manufactured product.
Hope you find that link.

a c 107 V Motherboard
March 7, 2011 11:17:16 PM

Manufacturers are not allowed to sell boards that have been taken apart as new. They can sell them as refurbished or open box though.

The BIOS/UEFI screens will show that they have the new B3 stepping. Plus, all of the boards have a new revision number reflecting the change. MSI's for instance have "P67A-GD65 (B3)" printed right on the board. And you'll be able to tell in CPU-Z as well, as the program will be able to tell which revision of the chipset you have.

Believe me, Intel and the board manufacturers don't want to risk losing any more money than they already have by screwing us over.

Hope that helps relieve peoples' paranoia...
March 9, 2011 3:39:33 AM

Here is the link to ASUS' site. Not sure if all companies have these measures but they have gone to full lengths to make sure customers are getting brand new boards and dont have to worry about stores and other people selling them old lga 1155 socket boards.

http://event.asus.com/2011/mb/Identify_B3_Motherboards/
a b V Motherboard
March 26, 2011 1:40:58 PM

Eagle Eye_54 said:
I am willing to concede one or even two BIOS updates for unforeseen issues but the SB release has been a dog. With yours having six, I would be complaining all the way to CEO!!!!! That is plainly outrageous and the fact that you seem okay with that makes me wonder. :non: 

As for PSU makers, they are required to meet minimum UL (CSA) standards and if they do that, they are in compliance. If tighter rules are needed, then it is up to UL to set the new standards. The motherboard makers don't seem to be screaming about that, I have never seen a recommendation about PSU's (beyond the wattage output). I use a Corsair AX-850 so I have never experienced concerns in that area....I don't buy cheap....neither should anyone else. If they did stop buying the cheap stuff, then they'd stop making them. Let us also not forget that the power system in North America sucks big time. It is over stretched, over used and in need of a major overhaul. So I don't think the PSU makers are the only bad guys in this issue.

As for your remarks regarding Toyota, I have owned Toyota vehicles since the mid 80's. They have all been superb. If they were like a Chrysler, Ford or GM product, then that would be a better analogy. There are plenty of instances of bad behavior in the auto manufacturer area, and Toyota is only a small part of that. Toyota has received the superb label from me because I have direct experience with them and there is statistical data to support that label. I should add that the term superb would never be used in the same sentence by me with the likes of any American label auto maker. I have direct experience to back that feeling up as well. And just to get the record straight, there was nothing wrong with the Toyota "fly-by-wire" system. That has been proven in the recently released DOT investigation report (that included input from NASA engineers). Remember, airplanes have been using that same type of system for about 30 years or so and if they were bad, there would have been a lot more plane crashes than we have had.

I realize there are issues with electronic products, always has been, always will be. But, a reasonable level is tolerable, a large level is not. According to the latest Consumer Magazine report on the matter, Sony LCD TV's have a very low failure rate and are therefore a better risk than some other TV makers. They are superb in my opinion. I have owned many of them over the last 40 or more years and keep buying them cause they work and stay working for years. I want the mobo makers to work towards that goal. :sol: 

Lastly, I would also like to see veteran posters on this site to be more balanced in their comments, instead of defending these computer part makers as though they were paid by them. This site is intended to help people, not to soft sell problems. If that means Leaps needs to wear a flame proof suit, then so be it. As the saying goes, if the shoe fits..... :p 


I have personal issues with the "fly-by-wire" system as well as the USDOT. The "fly-by-wire" system used in cars, is not the same as that used on aircraft. There are major quality and price differences involved. Automakers look for the lowest bidder to manufacture the components in use....whereas Aircraft makers look specifically for quality/reliability. The testing that aircraft components go through is far more complex and rarely takes into account the amount of time to get the product to market. Safety comes before all else. Recalling an aircraft can put a company like Boeing or Lockhead-Martin out of business. In the case of automakers, time to market is a big issue as they rely on yearly sales to survive. The longer a product is in development/testing, the lower the profit from sales. I don't know your issues/history with Ford products.....but I've never had an issue with their quality. Contrary to these findings from the USDOT....Toyota admitted to issues with their throttle control and has taken steps to correct what they found. Chrysler LLC and General Motors....I can understand a distaste for as in 2007, both companies were rated as having the 2 least reliable products on the road (referring to their entire product lines). Chrysler having a long history (dating back to the 60's) of engine and transmission failures....and GM having a long history of engine failures.

As for electronics companies. All of my bios updates actually added something to the board. 1 improved overclocking features, 3 added CPU support (1 of which contained a lan boot rom update), 1 simply changed how the harddrive appears on the POST screen...and then the "original bios".... 1 of the bios updates also added a new power mode for "Instant Boot" as well as improving a power saving feature known as "Intelligent Energy Saver". Not exactly anything to get upset about.... The last bios update is rather pointless though, so I haven't bothered with it.
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