MMO/RTS Gaming rig "VS"

[baumer2k]

Greets all,

I have a problem, first week of july I will either be overhauling my current system or building brand new with about $1200-$1400 budget if I have to. Right a way I think newer would be better but I want to post my ideas here because I could be wrong. I want to save money but I also want to handle the new gen of MMO/RTS games.

My play style. I am deeply into MMORPG's and RTS games. Ive tired doing some research, some helpful some confusing. When I search this topic most the replies I find are the FPS crowd saying MMO' dont need much as they are not FPS based. I am hoping here at TH forums I can find some other MMO payers input. Technically yes they are not FPS based but they require a TON of rendering and ability to handle TONS of particals. that being said I can see the video card bieng most important, then ram, then CPU, lastly HDD. fan noise is not really a issue for me as either I have good insualted headphones on, or for movies the audio is always loud .

Only other thing I with to use this rig for is HTPC capibility, nice smooth bluyray playback on a 40-60" LCD.

Here are the things I think I know MMO's need haha

Lots of Ram
Huge/fast video card
decent CPU, dosent need to be top end
high speed HD helps

Things I dont know about

Cpu Bus speeds
motherboard memory, bus speeds
Ram mhz, and timings
effect of overclocking on somthing you could play on 10 hrs strait.


The MMO's I play are World of Warcraft, Aion, Age of Conan, soon Starcraft 2. I play them all at 1680x1050 on my 22" widescreen lcd

I can play WoW rather decent quality, although even at lowest settings I cant do 25man raids as I go to like 2 fps. outside of raiding I do enjoy multiboxing with two 22" LCD Monitors both at 1680x1050. 2 accts are rough, 4 is brutally low fps

Both Aion and AoC I have at lowest settings, it playable but still low fps and jerky for simple questing and stuff but dungeons and raids are out of the questions. AoC is the best graphics I have ever seen todate but it seems to need a monster computer or somthing.


Ok here is the first option "The Upgrade"

Parts reused:
M2N7-Sli (AM2 board)
Antec 900 case
650w PS
Optical Drive
3 HDD's total 1TB
Mouse/keyboard/Monitor
4gb DDR2 ( 2gb @ 266mhz, 2gb @333mhz

Parts replaced:
(AMD Athlon 64 3500+) replaced with (AMD Athlon X2 7550 Dual Core)
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=39938#CustomerReviews

(Geforce 8800GTS) Replaced with (XFX Radeon HD 5850 Black Edition 765MHZ 1GB GDDR5 4.5GHZ)
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=46788&vpn=HD585AZNBC&manufacture=XFX

Parts Added:

Nice CPU cooler say $75 range
Intel X25-M 80GB 34NM Postville 2.5IN SSD
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=41732&vpn=SSDSA2MH080G2C1&manufacture=Intel

The AM2 line is ofcourse discontinued mostly but some stuff is still available to buy. System upgrade cost roughly $770

The NEW build, kinda:

Parts reused:

Antec 900 case
650w PS
Mouse/kebord
22" Monitor
Optical drive

Parts to be bought:

Intel X25-M 80GB 34NM Postville 2.5IN SSD
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=41732&vpn=SSDSA2MH080G2C1&manufacture=Intel

XFX Radeon HD 5850 Black Edition 765MHZ 1GB GDDR5
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=46788&vpn=HD585AZNBC&manufacture=XFX


ASUS P7P55D Pro LGA1156 P55 DDR3 3PCI-E16 2PCI-E1 PCI SLI CrossFireX 6SATA GBLAN 1394 Motherboard
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=43120

Western Digital WD10EARS Caviar Green 1TB SATA 64MB Cache 3.5IN Hard Drive OEM ( to replace my 3 smaller HDD's )

Corsair XMS3 CMX4GX3M2A1600C9 4GB DDR3 2X2GB DDR3-1600 CL 9-9-9-24 Core i5 Dual Channel Memory Kit
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=42530

Noctua NH-U12P SE2 LGA775/1156/1366 AM2/AM3 I7/I5/PHENOM Heatpipe Cooler W/ 2XNH-P12 120MM Fans
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=42819

Intel Core i5 750 Quad Core Processor Lynnfield LGA1156 2.66GHZ 8MB Cache Retail Box
http://www.ncix.com/products/index.php?sku=42499

Total cost with out any warranty yet... $1,425.89. Twice the price of upgrade, but It probably blows the crap out of the "upgrade". Also I am considering Nvidia card instead of the ATI but dont know which would be better for MMO's and Blueray video playback. Its funny after laying all this out from what I have and what I could upgrade too I am realizing how gimp my current computer is lol, it is 4 years old after all I geuss. lol just thinking now... putting that $400 vid card in my old comp would be like putting new drag car tires on a stock 1972 Ford Pinto ? But I am still open to opinion.




I would really appreciate any input, thanks

 

[Userremoved]

What brand is that PSU from? Instead of going with Intel for the new one why dont you go AMD and save money.

 

[Userremoved]

heres a nice CPU cooler:
http://www.amazon.com/Cooler-Master-RR-B10-212P-G1-Universal-Heat-Pipe/dp/B002G1YPH0

 

[ScoobyJooby-Jew]

a ssd is only going to reduce load times. IF being first off the boat to Northrend is important, than it is totally worth it. Otherwise, I haven't seen anything worth the price yet. Others however feel they are totally worth it. UP to you. I think you should consider the i5-655. WoW likes faster processors. And an unlocked multiplier+32nm cores=super fast OC. A 5770 would get the job done on one monitor. I can't comment on multiboxing, other than its super retarded when i get hit by 4 mages (sally, sallyq, sallyw, and sallye) using that life bomb thing. Or 5 shamans (supershaman, supershamanq, supershamanw, supershamane, supershamanr) dropping totems and hitting me with 5 lava bursts. Spell reflect only does so much. Oh, and WoW, at this current juncture, doesn't work with crossfire/sli. Just something to think about when looking at motherboards.

 

[4745454b]

Yes you need a GPU, but the CPU often matters more in MMO and certainly RTS games. (can have a lot of little units running around shooting. They need their fire calculated.) Seeing as you don't do "twitch" shooting you don't need the high FPS either. 30FPS would suck for FPS, but can be acceptable for RTS games.

I don't think much of your upgrade, and your new build seems like to much as well. I think I agree with scooby, why not an AMD build? Grab a good X3 CPU, 4GBs of ram, and a 5770/5850. Reuse what you can from your current build and you should be ok. I bet you could do it for less then $1k.

 

[Jacks_85]

ok here is what i think....with your budget i would go for a new rig as most of your parts are coming to an end soon and your system needs to be replaced

so i would look for a new build

Phenom X4 955 CPU
Mobo (Asus or gigabyte)
Ram 4g is more then enough with your build (Gskill or corsair)
PSU depends on the brand but newer PSU runs more efficently and more reliable (Corsair or Seasonic)
5850 is a good pick (more future proof)
SDD i personally think is worth it not just in gaming but in load speed

look at some combos...looks like you use ncix but also look at newegg (i don't know where you live so either .com or .ca)

hope this helps

 

[baumer2k]

Many good points. Yes I think I will drop the SSD untill I got some spare cash. I have built 4 rigs in past ten years all AMD. But in my recent research I fond the i5 to be the best bang for the buck and has good OC ability. Amd's comparable CPU cost fair bit more. Or is there an advantage amd has for mmo I don't know of.

 

[Userremoved]

I wiped up something off a store called Best Direct it's Canadian and it's also part of NCIX parent company (http://www.bestdirect.ca/):

Antec Earthwatts 650W Power Supply ATX12V V2.2 EPS12V Active PFC 80PLUS 120MM Fan
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $82.73


AMD Athlon II X3 440 Triple Core Processor AM3 3.0GHZ 1.5MB L2 Cache 95W 45NM Retail Box
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $84.72


A-DATA Gaming Series AX3U1600GB2G9-2G 4GB 2X2GB DDR3-1600 CL9-9-9-24 Dual Channel Memory Kit
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $107.11


ASRock 890GX EXTREME3 AM3 DDR3 2PCI-E16 1PCI-E4 1PCI-E1 2PCI SATA3 USB3 Video 8CH Audio Mainboard
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $141.90


XFX Radeon HD 5770 850MHZ 1GB 4.8GHZ GDDR5 2XDVI HDMI Display Port DIRECTX11 PCI-E Video CARD-
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $173.32


LG 16X DVD-ROM Optical Drive SATA Black OEM
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $15.16


Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 500GB SATA2 3.5IN 8.5MS 7200RPM 16MB Hard Drive OEM *3YR MFR Warranty*
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $55.38


Coolermaster Hyper 212 Plus Direct Touch 4 Heatpipe Heatsink AM2 AM3 LGA1366 LGA775 LGA1156 120MM
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $22.00

Subtotal $682.31

Free shipping!

You could replace that 5770 with a 5850.

 

[baumer2k]

Ok I see I was mistaken on the price of AMD. That or the price just dropped again. I know 99% of mmo's only use 1 core of a CPU that being said, would a 6 core hinder proformance aine the game only needs 1 core? I have no idea how multiple core CPU's work. I thought I read somewhere that dual cores run mmo's better then Quads. But I could be mistaken. Any care to educate me on how multiple cores relate to mmo preformance I would greatly appreciate it.

 

[Userremoved]

What happens is when a program uses more than one core the load is divided on the cores it's programmed to use.

 

[samdsox]

Didn't the op say they had 1400 to work with? wats with all these cheap ass builds? heres what you want.

cpu: amd 955 or the i5 750
gpu: for gods sake you have 1400 get the 5870
mobo: a well know brand with new tech.
ram: at least 4 gig
hard drives: if the drives are ide get new SATA ones. Ide will bottle neck
cd/dvd drive: watevers cheapest
Monitor: New 1080x1020 monitor.
caseersonally i like haf 922 but the antec 900 is the equivelent
psu: some good one like corsair use a well know brand

i will post you a good build once i search new egg

 

[Userremoved]

Were trying to save him money.

 

[Userremoved]

Ok if you want to spend the whole 1400$ heres the build from Best Direct;


XFX Radeon HD 5850 HD585XZNFV 725MHZ 1GB GDDR5 2XDVI HDMI DP DIRECTX11 PCI-E Video Card W/ Avp Game
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $324.94


Coolermaster Hyper 212 Plus Direct Touch 4 Heatpipe Heatsink AM2 AM3 LGA1366 LGA775 LGA1156 120MM
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $22.00


G.SKILL F3-12800CL9T-6GBNQ 6GB DDR3 3X2GB DDR3-1600 CL 9-9-9-24 Triple Channel Memory Kit
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $170.48


Corsair Professional HX750W 750W ATX 12V 62A 24PIN ATX Modular Power Supply Active PFC 140MM Fan
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $150.87
Free Shipping!


Coolermaster Haf 922 Mid Tower ATX Case Black 5X5.25 5X3.5INT Front Audio USB eSATA No PSU
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $92.40


Gigabyte X58A-UD3R ATX LGA1366 X58 DDR3 4PCI-E SATA3 USB3.0 Sound GLAN CrossFireX SLI Motherboard

1 per customer. In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $219.79


Intel Core i7 930 Quad Core Processor LGA1366 2.8GHZ 8MB L3 Cache 130W 45NM Retail Box

10 per customer. In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $298.49


Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium Edition 64BIT DVD OEM

1 per customer. In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $93.79


Seagate Barracuda 7200.12 500GB SATA2 3.5IN 8.5MS 7200RPM 16MB Hard Drive OEM *3YR MFR Warranty*
In Stock
usually ships in 1-2 business days $55.38

Subtotal $1,428.13
Free shipping!

This will kick every MMO/RTS butt.

 

[Userremoved]

I liked Userremoved's "wipe up" build up there. And yes, there is absolutely no reason to spend more money just because it's there. Look for benefits for the money though. If you don't mind spending a little more, for your games you'll benefit from a faster CPU (e.g. 955BE) and perhaps the SSD. I had to remove my SSD due to space problems, and it really hurt to go back to a 7200.12; I need to reformat the SSD with Win7 Home Premium instead of Ultimate, that should do it...

thank you for pointing that out MMOS and RTSs dont need a super computer.

 

[Onus]

I liked Userremoved's "wipe up" build up there. And yes, there is absolutely no reason to spend more money just because it's there. Look for benefits for the money though. If you don't mind spending a little more, for your games you'll benefit from a faster CPU (e.g. 955BE) and perhaps the SSD. I had to remove my SSD due to space problems, and it really hurt to go back to a 7200.12; I need to reformat the SSD with Win7 Home Premium instead of Ultimate, that should do it...

 

[samdsox]

Qty. Product Description Savings Total Price


ASUS DRW-24B1ST/BLK/B/AS Black SATA 24X DVD Burner - Bulk - OEM
Item #: N82E16827135204
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
-$3.00 Instant
$25.99
$22.99


COOLER MASTER HAF 922 RC-922M-KKN1-GP Black Steel + Plastic and Mesh Bezel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case
Item #: N82E16811119197
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
-$20.00 Instant
$109.98
$89.98


SAMSUNG Spinpoint F3 HD103SJ 1TB 7200 RPM SATA 3.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive
Item #: N82E16822152185
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
$79.99


Acer X213HBbd Black 21.5" 5ms Widescreen LCD Monitor
Item #: N82E16824009219
Return Policy: Monitor Replacement Only Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
-$20.00 Instant
$179.99
$159.99


GIGABYTE GA-890GPA-UD3H AM3 AMD 890GX SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 HDMI ATX AMD Motherboard
Item #: N82E16813128435
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
$139.99


CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V / EPS12V SLI Ready CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power ...
Item #: N82E16817139006
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
CORSAIR XMS3 4GB (2 x 2GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model CMX4GX3M2A1600C7
Item #: N82E16820145285
Return Policy: Memory Standard Return Policy
-$30.00 Instant
-$30.00 Combo
$20.00 Mail-in Rebate Card
$25.00 Mail-in Rebate Card
$274.98
$214.98


XFX HD-587X-ZNFV Radeon HD 5870 (Cypress XT) 1GB 256-bit DDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card
Item #: N82E16814150490
Return Policy: VGA Replacement Only Return Policy
AMD Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition Deneb 3.2GHz Socket AM3 125W Quad-Core Processor Model HDZ955FBGMBOX
Item #: N82E16819103808
Return Policy: CPU Replacement Only Return Policy
Protect Your Investment (expand for options)
AMD Gift Coupon - S.T.A.L.K.E.R.: Call of Pripyat PC Game VIVA MEDIA Free with purchase!
Item #: N82E16800995095
Return Policy: Downloadable Software Return Policy
-$20.00 Instant
-$25.99 Combo
$595.97
$549.98
1

Rosewill - A/V High Speed HDMI Cable - 6 FEET
Item #: N82E16882021096
Return Policy: Standard Return Policy
-$10.00 Instant
-$14.99 Saving
$24.99
$0.00
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this here will kick ass in anything, any new game. The psu is good enough for xfire in the future. You have enough money to throw in a ssd if you want.You could save some money by reusing case but down't reuse psu.It is only rated for a certain amount of hours power usage, then it will burn out. so good luck and have fun building this absolute monster. If you need windows 7 its cheaper from colleges.

 

[samdsox]

ps threw in an a monitor so the 5870 is brought to its full potential.

 

[Userremoved]

^He already has a monitor that build is overkill he wants to save money hes in Canda and Newegg.ca prices are bloated and why would you use the 890GX over the 890FX (because you have a 5870).

 

[Onus]

A PSU does not automatically burn out after so many hours, although its life will be shortened by abuse (e.g. frequent high temps, loads kept at or near maximum capacity, bad spikes/variances on the input). Even capacitor aging is insignificant if temps stay low and load is kept reasonable.

 

[Jacks_85]

i say go with a AMD 955 BE build as you don't need core i7 for gaming...don't think is worth the money and 5870 would be nice if that fits in your budget

 

[Userremoved]

Rally a 955 and 5870 is sooooo overkill for MMOs and RTSs.

 

[Onus]

I agree about the GPU, but there may be some value in the faster CPU; or maybe get an Athon II X4.

 

[Userremoved]

Or the X3 720.

 

[baumer2k]

Ok so, how many cores it has does not effect gaming. I was under the assumtion that say a 4 core 3ghz CPU had it cores split evenly so that my games would run of one core at 750mhz....this is not true right? Lol.

Also what With CPU and MB's is there a cache and bus speed I Need to look for?

 

[Onus]

Not counting the effect of Intel's Turbo-boost, essentially each core of a CPU runs at the stated GHz speed; there's no "total GHz" for the CPU that is divided among the cores. Because of background tasks and other programs that are typically running, adding cores tends to help, with the benefit declining as cores are added. Two are vastly superior to one, three notably better than two, and four perhaps only a little better than three. There are some articles on Tom's with some benchmarks.
Bus speed typically describes how quickly the CPU communicates with system memory, and to a lesser extent other components (there are different "bus speeds" inside a computer, e.g. the PCI bus typically should remain at 100MHz). A good tutorial article on overclocking will cover topics like that pretty well. Even if you don't intend to overclock, or very little, such an article would probably be very informative. There are stickies in the forums on topics like this. Some would say that learning how your computer works can be half the fun of this hobby; I'd rather play ON my PC than play WITH it, but if you really get into the technical details, there are others here who can give you more specific information. They will have expected you to do some basic research first though, so do not expect to be spoon-fed.