Lara Croft: Legend, thoughts on the Flash anim

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.tombraider (More info?)

Well. At first I thought they did a pretty good job. After watching it
a few times, then zooming in and watching it, pausing where things
showed up... I see that if the actual game engine and models used to
make this Flash animation are used in the final game, there are
problems.

The Lara model mesh itself is lower poly than the Lara model in AoD
apparently. The mesh deforms poorly, knees, elbows and shoulders show
it even though it isn't much of an anim. But it's the entire "mid"
section (crotch/hips/backside) where joining the legs that problems are
the most visible.

If CD gives us what we're looking at in the anim, then they're giving us
a DX6 or 7 level game. TRTLR was a match to this. We're a few years
down the road now from where this is.

They think they have this spiffy new idea, show the goods Lara is
carrying around, so it's more realistic. Oh hell, THAT is where all the
polygons went. They did a pretty job with texturing (skinning) the
world mesh, Lara and the stuff she's carrying. This leaves Lara more
than a little 'light'. They're going to bog down the low to mid range
end users systems with this stuff.

I'd much rather see more realistic models and animations both in world
items and in the Lara model. The Tombraider 3 world looks as good or
better than what they showed us.

Yep. Some of us old Tombies are gonna be real picky about this stuff.
for Eidos to claim better is on the way and show us worse? Bad omen.

McG.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.tombraider (More info?)

Maybe it's just because of Flash? Guess we'll have to wait and see...

Chris

McGrandpa wrote:
> Well. At first I thought they did a pretty good job. After watching it
> a few times, then zooming in and watching it, pausing where things
> showed up... I see that if the actual game engine and models used to
> make this Flash animation are used in the final game, there are
> problems.
>
> The Lara model mesh itself is lower poly than the Lara model in AoD
> apparently. The mesh deforms poorly, knees, elbows and shoulders show
> it even though it isn't much of an anim. But it's the entire "mid"
> section (crotch/hips/backside) where joining the legs that problems are
> the most visible.
>
> If CD gives us what we're looking at in the anim, then they're giving us
> a DX6 or 7 level game. TRTLR was a match to this. We're a few years
> down the road now from where this is.
>
> They think they have this spiffy new idea, show the goods Lara is
> carrying around, so it's more realistic. Oh hell, THAT is where all the
> polygons went. They did a pretty job with texturing (skinning) the
> world mesh, Lara and the stuff she's carrying. This leaves Lara more
> than a little 'light'. They're going to bog down the low to mid range
> end users systems with this stuff.
>
> I'd much rather see more realistic models and animations both in world
> items and in the Lara model. The Tombraider 3 world looks as good or
> better than what they showed us.
>
> Yep. Some of us old Tombies are gonna be real picky about this stuff.
> for Eidos to claim better is on the way and show us worse? Bad omen.
>
> McG.
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.tombraider (More info?)

Yeah, we'll have to it seems :\

"Chris Spencer" <chris.spencer93@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:4Mw8e.6817$443.2240@newsfe3-gui.ntli.net
> Maybe it's just because of Flash? Guess we'll have to wait and see...
>
> Chris
>
> McGrandpa wrote:
>> Well. At first I thought they did a pretty good job. After
>> watching it a few times, then zooming in and watching it, pausing
>> where things showed up... I see that if the actual game engine and
>> models used to make this Flash animation are used in the final game,
>> there are problems.
>>
>> The Lara model mesh itself is lower poly than the Lara model in AoD
>> apparently. The mesh deforms poorly, knees, elbows and shoulders
>> show it even though it isn't much of an anim. But it's the entire
>> "mid" section (crotch/hips/backside) where joining the legs that
>> problems are the most visible.
>>
>> If CD gives us what we're looking at in the anim, then they're
>> giving us a DX6 or 7 level game. TRTLR was a match to this. We're
>> a few years down the road now from where this is.
>>
>> They think they have this spiffy new idea, show the goods Lara is
>> carrying around, so it's more realistic. Oh hell, THAT is where all
>> the polygons went. They did a pretty job with texturing (skinning)
>> the world mesh, Lara and the stuff she's carrying. This leaves Lara
>> more than a little 'light'. They're going to bog down the low to
>> mid range end users systems with this stuff.
>>
>> I'd much rather see more realistic models and animations both in
>> world items and in the Lara model. The Tombraider 3 world looks as
>> good or better than what they showed us.
>>
>> Yep. Some of us old Tombies are gonna be real picky about this
>> stuff. for Eidos to claim better is on the way and show us worse? Bad
>> omen. McG.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.tombraider (More info?)

Well, I dont agree on this I guess, as:

First of all, that view we see in Flash movie, has more than 1000
polygons (I can say that from my 3D experience), whereas TR4 had not
more than 100 (I heard it had 50, when they were comparing it to AOD's
5000).Plus, those model details are very high quality as well: knees,
even back of knees you can see double bones there, a muscle layer which
look very realistic. Her arms: seen sth shadow-like at the back side of
arms? Muscles they are, if you zoomin and rotate, it will be more
noticable. Her back, especially spine is designed very good as well.
These are just her body structure - her clothes, hair are pretty cool
as well, IMHO.

But I agree when it comes to surrounding area. I doubt its a final
product, coz they put TRLE-quality graphics there, merged with some
medium quality graphic-elements like waterfall etc. But this also can
be wrong coz, for example, when Vietcong was released, its reinforest
effects were looking bad in screenshots, but when I played the game, I
was just shocked how realistic they were.

Btw, when she faces the right-most side of waterfall, at the top of
summit you can see some construction - cottage or building? Any ideas
what is it?

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.tombraider (More info?)

On 18 Apr 2005 06:51:13 -0700, "Shehi" <shehriyari@trcomm.net> wrote:

>Well, I dont agree on this I guess, as:
>
>First of all, that view we see in Flash movie, has more than 1000
>polygons (I can say that from my 3D experience), whereas TR4 had not
>more than 100 (I heard it had 50, when they were comparing it to AOD's
>5000).

Lara in TR 2-3 was about 500 polys, I believe. TR4 Lara had more -
it's pretty much the same basic model as in TR2-3, but there are extra
pieces of the mesh covering the major joints.

- AG

Knowlege Is Power.
Power Corrupts.
Study Hard.
Be Evil.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.tombraider (More info?)

"Shehi" <shehriyari@trcomm.net> wrote in message
news:1113832273.588607.294640@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com
> Well, I dont agree on this I guess, as:
>
> First of all, that view we see in Flash movie, has more than 1000
> polygons (I can say that from my 3D experience), whereas TR4 had not
> more than 100 (I heard it had 50, when they were comparing it to AOD's
> 5000).Plus, those model details are very high quality as well: knees,
> even back of knees you can see double bones there, a muscle layer
> which look very realistic. Her arms: seen sth shadow-like at the back
> side of arms? Muscles they are, if you zoomin and rotate, it will be
> more noticable. Her back, especially spine is designed very good as
> well. These are just her body structure - her clothes, hair are
> pretty cool as well, IMHO.
>
> But I agree when it comes to surrounding area. I doubt its a final
> product, coz they put TRLE-quality graphics there, merged with some
> medium quality graphic-elements like waterfall etc. But this also can
> be wrong coz, for example, when Vietcong was released, its reinforest
> effects were looking bad in screenshots, but when I played the game, I
> was just shocked how realistic they were.
>
> Btw, when she faces the right-most side of waterfall, at the top of
> summit you can see some construction - cottage or building? Any ideas
> what is it?

TR4 Lara has some 1200 polys and AoD Lara didn't reach 5000 polys quite.
The BASIC thighs crossection of the FLASH Lara shows about 6 to 8
segments. This is considerably lower than the AoD Lara and about what
we have in TR4/Chronicles Lara. This Flash Lara also has mesh
deformation problems. IF they use LOD with the mesh (?) it isn't
working. They might have used LOD's with textures.
Come to think of it, the animator for AoD didn't use much finesse with
some of Laras anims and didn't correct some of the mesh deformation
problems there either.
The Lara in TR1 has around 80 polys. Talk about low poly Thing is,
they made it WORK.
McG.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: alt.games.tombraider (More info?)

In the dead of night, a faint whisper from Shehi was heard, at about
04/18/2005 09:51 AM, and I could have sworn it said ...
<snip>

>
> Btw, when she faces the right-most side of waterfall, at the top of
> summit you can see some construction - cottage or building? Any ideas
> what is it?
>

I got the impression it was a cart of some kind. Mining cart? My be
mistaken because the scale did not look right ...

---
PW

 

[Kieran]

Archived from groups: alt.games.tombraider (More info?)

"Pistol Whipped" <pwhipped@NOtampabaySPAM.rr.com> wrote in message
news:7L%8e.6655$_t3.5114@tornado.tampabay.rr.com...
> In the dead of night, a faint whisper from Shehi was heard, at about
> 04/18/2005 09:51 AM, and I could have sworn it said ...
> <snip>
>
>>
>> Btw, when she faces the right-most side of waterfall, at the top of
>> summit you can see some construction - cottage or building? Any ideas
>> what is it?
>>
>
> I got the impression it was a cart of some kind. Mining cart? My be
> mistaken because the scale did not look right ...
>
> ---
> PW

I wondered about this too, but couldn't make head nor tail of what it
was.... it did look like something you might be able to "get inside" though,
also it seems like it is overhanging from the edge of the falls, like on
some kind of stilts etc. Interesting what you can spot in such a small flash
animation

Did anyone spot that sort of alcove with some kind of carvings in the stone
behind lara when she is facing the falls?

Kieran