Linux UT Server Issues

Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

Hi all, I recently found this newsgroup and was quite pleased to see
it exists.

I admin a UT server (I have for years now, so assume a high level of
skills on my part, plus I'm an electrical engineer, so I know what I'm
doing, designed lots of Intel based puters and have programmed in 10
or so languages, including for windows, so I'm no dummy). Anyway, we
are running on Linux Redhat 9 and I continue to struggle with why the
UT server is sending such huge amounts of data compared to other Linux
UT servers. In particular, the server is setup with a tick of 30-35
(server provider does not care what tick rate we run) and data rates
from the server become large, approaching 10k bytes/sec when there is
lots of action in a 12 man game (open map btw) and the client netspeed
is set to 10000. I think this data rate is inundating the clients and
perhaps the server. Interestingly, the packets/sec rate tracks the
tick rate, if I set tick to 35, my client machine receives 35
packets/sec. When I play on windows based UT servers, I never see
data rates this large.

I setup a Linux server on my local machine with the same ipdrv
settings (running Mandrake 9.2) and I can set the tick rate up to 50
and do not see the packets/sec rate exceed 25 until tick is set to 50
or higher. If I set tick rate to 35, I receive 25 packets/sec. This
is really odd. Now, I connected to my local Linux machine via the
internet by running the Linux machine on my DSL connection, then
connecting to it via my Comcast connection, to simulate a true
"internet connection" for comparative purposes. The odd thing is with
all the ipdrv settings the same in both servers, my local Linux UT
server never outputs the same amount of data to clients as the server
my clan uses for UT described above.

If anyone has some insights, thoughts, comments, they would be greatly
appreciated.

Here is the IP of out team server if anyone cares to have a look:
unreal://69.13.248.161

--
Best regards,
The_Rifleman
55 answers Last reply
More about linux server issues
  1. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    On Mon, 03 May 2004 11:53:55 -0500, Kylesb wrote:

    > If anyone has some insights, thoughts, comments, they would be greatly
    > appreciated.

    You might find some information that'll help you at

    <http://www.unrealadmin.org/modules.php?name=Sections&op=printpage&artid=15#Introduction>
    <http://www.unrealadmin.org/modules.php?name=Sections&op=printpage&artid=15#Addendum>

    ps. Watch the line wrap.

    --
    {AGUT}DeadMan
  2. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote in news:c75tf2$2vfi$1@ID-57815.news.uni-
    berlin.de:

    > Hi all, I recently found this newsgroup and was quite pleased to see
    > it exists.

    I've also been collecting some server resource links at my site:

    <http://matureasskickers.net/m/links/category.php?did=6
    &lid=&linkcategoryid=18>

    I'd be interested in hearing what you find. I'm running a Linux UT2004
    server, private at the moment. What do you use to measure your packet rate?
  3. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    Pressing F6 on the UT client displays packets/sec (in and out) on UT
    and UT2k4.

    Our clan also has a 2k4 server up and running, guess we gonna be a
    "crossover" clan, lol.

    I've been all over the net and searched UT resources til I'm blue in
    the face, I really think the differing packet rate issue is Linux
    specific, and I'm not a top notch penguin-head (yet) to identify what
    the difference in the 2 systems might be.

    I passed one of your mod links along to our 2k4 "head" admin. thanks
    for the links.

    And yes, I top post, as I've always been a bit of a rebel, hehe. I
    hate scrolling to the bottom of a 100 line post to see "yup, I agree".

    --
    Best regards,
    Kyle
    "ScratchMonkey" <ScratchMonkey.blacklist@sewingwitch.com> wrote in
    message news:Xns94DE838C02467scratchmonkey@216.196.97.136...
    | "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote in
    news:c75tf2$2vfi$1@ID-57815.news.uni-
    | berlin.de:
    |
    | > Hi all, I recently found this newsgroup and was quite pleased to
    see
    | > it exists.
    |
    | I've also been collecting some server resource links at my site:
    |
    | <http://matureasskickers.net/m/links/category.php?did=6
    | &lid=&linkcategoryid=18>
    |
    | I'd be interested in hearing what you find. I'm running a Linux
    UT2004
    | server, private at the moment. What do you use to measure your
    packet rate?
  4. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    On Mon, 3 May 2004 17:30:55 -0500, "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote:

    >Pressing F6 on the UT client displays packets/sec (in and out) on UT
    >and UT2k4.
    >
    >Our clan also has a 2k4 server up and running, guess we gonna be a
    >"crossover" clan, lol.
    >
    >I've been all over the net and searched UT resources til I'm blue in
    >the face, I really think the differing packet rate issue is Linux
    >specific, and I'm not a top notch penguin-head (yet) to identify what
    >the difference in the 2 systems might be.
    >
    >I passed one of your mod links along to our 2k4 "head" admin. thanks
    >for the links.
    >
    >And yes, I top post, as I've always been a bit of a rebel, hehe. I
    >hate scrolling to the bottom of a 100 line post to see "yup, I agree".

    I used to rent a server from a hosting company that specializes in UT
    hosting on Linux. They are nice guys, so even though you are not a
    customer, they would probably still answer your question. They have a
    lot of expertise and may know the answer. Contact them here:
    admin@fragism.com
  5. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    On Mon, 3 May 2004 17:30:55 -0500, "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote:

    >And yes, I top post, as I've always been a bit of a rebel, hehe. I
    >hate scrolling to the bottom of a 100 line post to see "yup, I agree".

    That is bottom posting done badly.
    --
    Andrew. To email unscramble nrc@gurjevgrzrboivbhf.pbz & remove spamtrap.
    Help make Usenet a better place: English is read downwards,
    please don't top post. Trim messages to quote only relevant text.
    Check groups.google.com before asking a question.
  6. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    yea, maybe I should contact, um, what's his name. . . oh yes,
    Bus_error, does that sound right?

    --
    Best regards,
    Kyle
    "Folk" <Folk@folk.com> wrote in message
    news:5hgf90ph3ds2l1q52ie2iiv6qvijjujqma@4ax.com...
    | On Mon, 3 May 2004 17:30:55 -0500, "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote:
    |
    | >Pressing F6 on the UT client displays packets/sec (in and out) on
    UT
    | >and UT2k4.
    | >
    | >Our clan also has a 2k4 server up and running, guess we gonna be a
    | >"crossover" clan, lol.
    | >
    | >I've been all over the net and searched UT resources til I'm blue
    in
    | >the face, I really think the differing packet rate issue is Linux
    | >specific, and I'm not a top notch penguin-head (yet) to identify
    what
    | >the difference in the 2 systems might be.
    | >
    | >I passed one of your mod links along to our 2k4 "head" admin.
    thanks
    | >for the links.
    | >
    | >And yes, I top post, as I've always been a bit of a rebel, hehe. I
    | >hate scrolling to the bottom of a 100 line post to see "yup, I
    agree".
    |
    | I used to rent a server from a hosting company that specializes in
    UT
    | hosting on Linux. They are nice guys, so even though you are not a
    | customer, they would probably still answer your question. They have
    a
    | lot of expertise and may know the answer. Contact them here:
    | admin@fragism.com
    |
  7. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote in news:c76h6t$brnk$1@ID-57815.news.uni-
    berlin.de:

    > I passed one of your mod links along to our 2k4 "head" admin. thanks
    > for the links.

    Visit the Atari Community forums (link is in the MOTD inside the game).
    There's a forum just for server administration.

    > And yes, I top post, as I've always been a bit of a rebel, hehe. I
    > hate scrolling to the bottom of a 100 line post to see "yup, I agree".

    Here's a good article addressing this:

    http://mailformat.dan.info/quoting/bottom-posting.html

    Lemme know what you think!
  8. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    Heh, the web site you linked to reveals the other reason top posting
    occurs, MS OE and Outlook stick your signature at the top, promoting
    top posting. I knew I had another good excuse for top posting, :-).
    Other than that item, it's a decent read for beginners, but I gave up
    on cutting/pasting my sig to the bottom of the post and editing posts
    for the interleaved approach. I'll have a look at the Atari forums,
    been there recently to read about the "apparent death" of the UT
    master server (and it's actual scheduled demise date).

    --
    Best regards,
    Kyle
    "ScratchMonkey" <ScratchMonkey.blacklist@sewingwitch.com> wrote in
    message news:Xns94E37744D7A2scratchmonkey@216.196.97.136...
    | "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote in
    news:c76h6t$brnk$1@ID-57815.news.uni-
    | berlin.de:
    |
    | > I passed one of your mod links along to our 2k4 "head" admin.
    thanks
    | > for the links.
    |
    | Visit the Atari Community forums (link is in the MOTD inside the
    game).
    | There's a forum just for server administration.
    |
    | > And yes, I top post, as I've always been a bit of a rebel, hehe.
    I
    | > hate scrolling to the bottom of a 100 line post to see "yup, I
    agree".
    |
    | Here's a good article addressing this:
    |
    | http://mailformat.dan.info/quoting/bottom-posting.html
    |
    | Lemme know what you think!
  9. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote in news:2gbfc6FrpsjU1@uni-berlin.de:

    > Heh, the web site you linked to reveals the other reason top posting
    > occurs, MS OE and Outlook stick your signature at the top, promoting
    > top posting. I knew I had another good excuse for top posting, :-).

    Even better, switch to a newsreader *designed* for newsgroups. For
    instance, I like the free Xnews, but you'll find a ton of readers at
    http://www.newsreaders.com/ and support in news:news.software.readers .

    (I like Xnews' scoring system, which lets me indicate keywords to look for
    in headers and color-codes the article list to show what I should read, and
    hides the articles I never want to see. For instance, I have a score for
    Linux in this group, so your post popped right out amidst the clutter. I
    read a lot of groups, so quickly finding the wheat amidst the chaff is very
    important to me.)
  10. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    Kylesb enlightened us with:
    > Heh, the web site you linked to reveals the other reason top posting
    > occurs, MS OE and Outlook stick your signature at the top, promoting
    > top posting. I knew I had another good excuse for top posting, :-).

    Broken software isn't an excuse.

    > Other than that item, it's a decent read for beginners, but I gave up
    > on cutting/pasting my sig to the bottom of the post and editing posts
    > for the interleaved approach.

    Then use "Quotefix" for OE, and you'll be a happy man. You can
    bottom-post no worries (just remember to snip all unneeded quoted text),
    you get nice colors, nice smileys, and the broken quoting is fixed :)

    MeltDown
    --
    !For all your UT99/2k3/2k4 questions visit UnrealTower's FAQ section:
    ! http://www.unrealtower.org/faq
    !Home of the FAQs for agut and agut2003.
  11. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    As always, there are adherents to many causes, old time customs and
    religions. As I'm a Usenet atheist (refusing to subscribe to any
    particular beliefs about usenet or the internet), the fervor over top
    or bottom posting is neither here nor there to me, but since you've
    gone to the trouble to find a web site with a bottom-post religious
    zealot's commentary and analysis, I've located for your review, some
    comments from top-posting zealots.

    http://www.lionsgrove.com/topposting.html
    http://www.newsservers.co.uk/thugs.php
    http://www.abpsp.fsworld.co.uk/umb/

    As a person who currently makes a living participating in arguments
    and disputes on behalf of others, I find generally the best approach
    is to accept the practices and habits of others that do not cause harm
    or substantially interfere with one's existence or experiences on this
    planet.

    My history with computers and networked systems dates back to the late
    1970's when I first designed industrial applications of Intel
    processor based systems, and also programmed those systems. Given my
    near ancient exposure to such systems (my design work began within a
    few years of Intel's introduction of the first general purpose 8-bit
    8080 processor), it is my impression that unenforceable human
    behavioral standards advocated with respect to the use and application
    of computers are typically set forth by those who seek to assert
    control in an arena in which such persons or organizations, in
    reality, have no control. As long as posters are not rude, crude, or
    socially unacceptable in their language, I find most any style of
    understandably formatted communication acceptable.

    Preferences are just that, preferences, and I strive to accept and
    accommodate the preferences of others. Were I to have a say, I'd
    eliminate interleaved posts, as a few layers of interleaving can
    render a post such a mess that sorting out "who" said "what" can be a
    large waste of time.

    Your assertion that certain software is "broken" because it does not
    function as you believe it should is an opinion you are entitled to,
    but not necessarily the opinion of others. I rather get a kick out
    the statement that any program is "broken software" to support an
    argument regarding a style or practice that is advocated as a
    "concrete standard" but in reality is merely a request for conformity.
    I see the operational functionality of OE as useful yet merely an
    example of software that functions in a certain fashion, not
    necessarily functioning in the "best" fashion (the best design would
    be an email/usenet client that is fully configurable to create a reply
    with optional top or bottom posting at the click of a button). There
    is no real standard, or those posting in alternative styles, contrary
    to the style you advocate, would have their accounts blocked from
    usenet access. What exists are multiple styles of formatting, and any
    reasonable person should realize there are valid bases why both camps
    have sound reasons for advocating top posting or bottom posting. In
    the end, any advocated custom or standard that is not adhered to by
    the masses is no longer a standard, but rather an "old" or "outdated"
    standard or custom.

    I hope you take my comments with a grain of salt, they are not meant
    to be taken in any fashion other than "here's my perspective". I'm
    guilty of top and bottom posting, so you see, I am, in reality, one
    who practices both religions, and also one who finds it difficult to
    accept all the tenets of either religion as gospel.

    There, I've spoke my peace, so lets get on with the UT discussions.
    --
    Best regards,
    Kyle

    "MeltDown" <meltdownUSE@YOURunrealtower.imagination.org> wrote in
    message news:slrnca12bj.4je.meltdownUSE@sybren.thirdtower.com...
    | Kylesb enlightened us with:
    | > Heh, the web site you linked to reveals the other reason top
    posting
    | > occurs, MS OE and Outlook stick your signature at the top,
    promoting
    | > top posting. I knew I had another good excuse for top posting,
    :-).
    |
    | Broken software isn't an excuse.
    |
    | > Other than that item, it's a decent read for beginners, but I gave
    up
    | > on cutting/pasting my sig to the bottom of the post and editing
    posts
    | > for the interleaved approach.
    |
    | Then use "Quotefix" for OE, and you'll be a happy man. You can
    | bottom-post no worries (just remember to snip all unneeded quoted
    text),
    | you get nice colors, nice smileys, and the broken quoting is fixed
    :)
    |
    | MeltDown
    | --
    | !For all your UT99/2k3/2k4 questions visit UnrealTower's FAQ
    section:
    | ! http://www.unrealtower.org/faq
    | !Home of the FAQs for agut and agut2003.
  12. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    ScratchMonkey enlightened us with:
    > (I like Xnews' scoring system, which lets me indicate keywords to look for
    > in headers and color-codes the article list to show what I should read, and
    > hides the articles I never want to see.

    Same goes for slrn

    > For instance, I have a score for Linux in this group, so your post
    > popped right out amidst the clutter. I read a lot of groups, so
    > quickly finding the wheat amidst the chaff is very important to me.)

    I usually give people I like a +100 score, so the threads they post in
    automatically float to the top of the list. Nice feature ;-)

    MeltDown
    --
    !For all your UT99/2k3/2k4 questions visit UnrealTower's FAQ section:
    ! http://www.unrealtower.org/faq
    !Home of the FAQs for agut and agut2003.
  13. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    MeltDown <meltdownUSE@YOURunrealtower.imagination.org> schrieb:

    >ScratchMonkey enlightened us with:
    >> (I like Xnews' scoring system, which lets me indicate keywords to look for
    >> in headers and color-codes the article list to show what I should read, and
    >> hides the articles I never want to see.
    >
    >Same goes for slrn
    >
    >> For instance, I have a score for Linux in this group, so your post
    >> popped right out amidst the clutter. I read a lot of groups, so
    >> quickly finding the wheat amidst the chaff is very important to me.)
    >
    >I usually give people I like a +100 score, so the threads they post in
    >automatically float to the top of the list. Nice feature ;-)
    >
    >MeltDown
    uhm, u just lost 50 points doing a re- as a top post... ;-)
  14. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    On Tue, 11 May 2004 13:54:17 -0500, Kylesb wrote:

    > Preferences are just that, preferences,

    .... and it's my preference to use that "Reply-to" header of yours.

    > and I strive to accept and accommodate the preferences of others.

    You're a real hero.

    > Were I to have a say, I'd eliminate interleaved posts

    Like this, y'mean?

    > , as a few layers of interleaving can render a post such a mess that
    > sorting out "who" said "what" can be a large waste of time.

    Cool.

    > Your assertion that certain software is "broken" because it does not
    > function as you believe it should is an opinion you are entitled to,
    > but not necessarily the opinion of others.

    Oh really?
    http://www.xs4all.nl/~js/gnksa/gnksa-evaluations.html
    http://tinyurl.com/6x0f

    > I rather get a kick out
    > the statement that any program is "broken software" to support an
    > argument regarding a style or practice that is advocated as a
    > "concrete standard" but in reality is merely a request for conformity.

    Stop by news://news.software.readers sometime.

    > I see the operational functionality of OE as useful yet merely an
    > example of software that functions in a certain fashion, not
    > necessarily functioning in the "best" fashion (the best design would
    > be an email/usenet client that is fully configurable to create a reply
    > with optional top or bottom posting at the click of a button).

    You must adore MICROS~1's other features. Take time out to read up on them
    all. There was a belting one that started like this:

    begin JDSS433L.EXE.VBS

    .... but I'm pretty sure that Micro$oft have that nailed. After all, it was
    only in Outhouse Excuse for a number of years.

    > There is no real standard, or those posting in alternative styles,
    > contrary to the style you advocate, would have their accounts blocked
    > from usenet access.

    Heh right.

    > What exists are multiple styles of formatting, and any reasonable person
    > should realize there are valid bases why both camps have sound reasons
    > for advocating top posting or bottom posting.

    You missed out "interleaved posting".

    > In the end, any advocated custom or standard that is not adhered to by
    > the masses is no longer a standard, but rather an "old" or "outdated"
    > standard or custom.

    MICROS~1 know all about standards, don't they?

    > I hope you take my comments with a grain of salt, they are not meant
    > to be taken in any fashion other than "here's my perspective".

    Likewise.

    > I'm guilty of top and bottom posting

    Likewise:
    http://tinyurl.com/3cp9s

    > , so you see, I am, in reality, one who practices both religions, and
    > also one who finds it difficult to accept all the tenets of either
    > religion as gospel.

    Yep, a real hero.

    > There, I've spoke my peace, so lets get on with the UT discussions.

    Likewise.

    --
    "A riot is unt ugly thing, unt it's about time we had one!"
    R.L.U. #300033, running WM 0.80.1 under MDK9.1
  15. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Mr K" <duffstuff@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:c7r916$fkm$1@inews.gazeta.pl...
    | On Tue, 11 May 2004 13:54:17 -0500, Kylesb wrote:
    |
    | > Preferences are just that, preferences,
    |
    | ... and it's my preference to use that "Reply-to" header of yours.
    |
    | > and I strive to accept and accommodate the preferences of others.
    |
    | You're a real hero.
    |
    | > Were I to have a say, I'd eliminate interleaved posts
    |
    | Like this, y'mean?
    |
    | > , as a few layers of interleaving can render a post such a mess
    that
    | > sorting out "who" said "what" can be a large waste of time.
    |
    | Cool.
    |
    | > Your assertion that certain software is "broken" because it does
    not
    | > function as you believe it should is an opinion you are entitled
    to,
    | > but not necessarily the opinion of others.
    |
    | Oh really?
    | http://www.xs4all.nl/~js/gnksa/gnksa-evaluations.html
    | http://tinyurl.com/6x0f
    |
    | > I rather get a kick out
    | > the statement that any program is "broken software" to support an
    | > argument regarding a style or practice that is advocated as a
    | > "concrete standard" but in reality is merely a request for
    conformity.
    |
    | Stop by news://news.software.readers sometime.
    |
    | > I see the operational functionality of OE as useful yet merely an
    | > example of software that functions in a certain fashion, not
    | > necessarily functioning in the "best" fashion (the best design
    would
    | > be an email/usenet client that is fully configurable to create a
    reply
    | > with optional top or bottom posting at the click of a button).
    |
    | You must adore MICROS~1's other features. Take time out to read up
    on them
    | all. There was a belting one that started like this:
    |
    |

    LMAO

    This was the end of your worthless reply post in my newsreader client.
    I did not see any more of your less than polite comments until I
    examined the actual message source.

    But, I guess you are a real god of computers, and already know how
    your lil VBS script failed to achieve its intended purpose.

    --
    Without regards,
    Kyle
  16. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    Mr K <duffstuff@hotmail.com> wrote in news:c7r916$fkm$1@inews.gazeta.pl:

    > Stop by news://news.software.readers sometime.

    Technical error. The double-slash introduces a host name, but you've not
    supplied a host, just the newsgroup name on a host (which would go after
    another slash following the hostname). If you don't want to specify a host,
    the newsgroup should immediately follow the colon delimiting the protocol
    field.

    Examples:

    news://news.lokigames.com

    Connects to a news server that used to be operated by Loki. No newsgroup
    specified.

    news://news.lokigames.com/loki.games.tribes2

    Connects to the loki.games.tribes2 group on the aforementioned server.

    news:alt.games.unreal.tournament

    Connects to this group on the default server.
  17. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    JHall <jhall@playmlec.net> wrote in
    news:Xns94E6ACCDCF4DFuppariscopeDiveDive.@199.171.54.214:

    > Do you know how many times I had to rewrap and
    > reformat the text in this message to this point?

    Manually?! With Xnews I can select a block of badly-formatted text
    (including quoted paragraphs), right-click, and select Rewrap and Join
    Lines, and it gets automagically reformatted. I won't consider any
    replacement that lacks this feature.
  18. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote in news:2gclqlF16s1sU1@uni-berlin.de:

    > since you've gone to the trouble to find a web site with a bottom-post
    > religious zealot's commentary and analysis, I've located for your
    > review, some comments from top-posting zealots.

    Funny, he didn't seem like a zealot. It looked to me like he was making
    valid arguments about how interleaved posting with proper trimming helped
    all involved in expediting communication, which I think is our objective
    here. Can you point out the zealot part? I musta missed it.

    > http://www.lionsgrove.com/topposting.html
    > http://www.newsservers.co.uk/thugs.php
    > http://www.abpsp.fsworld.co.uk/umb/

    I checked these out. The 3rd has some cartoons that make ad-hominems but
    no arguments. The 2nd whines about bottom-posting bullies, but still
    makes no argument explaining why anyone would want to top-post. The 1st
    tries to claim that interleaved posting is bad by showing a poor attempt
    by people who don't seem to understand the point, and also whines that
    bottom posters don't trim, totally missing the point. (I think we all
    agree that trimming is good, but top-posting makes it easy to not do it.
    Xnews will properly bitch at me if my post is more than 60% quoted
    material.)

    > There is no real standard, or those posting in alternative styles,
    > contrary to the style you advocate, would have their accounts blocked
    > from usenet access.

    Laws can dictate conformance with standards, but standards are not laws.
    They are simply agreements to facilitate interoperability. If you violate
    a standard, thugs don't come knocking on your door to take you away, but
    the services you seek may not be able to respond to you.

    Similarly, top-posting on Usenet works in groups where that's the norm
    (usually because the group is dominated by people ignorant of the value-
    add of interleaved posting). More technical groups tend to recognize the
    value of combining good trimming with interleaved responses, and may find
    a top-poster too painful to reply to and provide help. (Had you not
    "juiced up" your post with a mention of Linux, I probably would have
    ignored any question you asked, and so would most here.)

    Note that my objective is not to berate you or drive you out of the
    group, but to try to help you make your communication more effective and
    improve the likelihood of a good response. If you can point me to
    resources that show how top-posting can accomplish the same, we'll all
    rush to them with open arms. It's all about getting good value, esp. from
    limited time to read many groups and lists.
  19. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote in news:2gdkcmF1mi0pU1@uni-berlin.de:

    > This was the end of your worthless reply post in my newsreader client.
    > I did not see any more of your less than polite comments until I
    > examined the actual message source.

    Ouch, I didn't think OE was that broken. I had to compare your quote to his
    message to see what OE was seeing. Xnews was smart enough (or perhaps dumb
    enough) not to try to parse and run a broken uuencoded attachment.

    > But, I guess you are a real god of computers, and already know how
    > your lil VBS script failed to achieve its intended purpose.

    I didn't see any hostile script, just the header for one that OE tried to
    parse and run. Yet another reason I avoid OE, as it's just too willing to
    run any hostile content one gives it. We no longer live in the age of the
    "scientific" Internet, when malicious traffic was almost unheard of and
    programs did their best to deal with broken input. It's now necessary to
    treat all input as hostile and act accordingly, but MS seems to find that
    hard to grasp. And when it does fix the gaping holes, users don't apply the
    patches, leading to a rise in infected "zombies" that malicious users
    (notably spammers) use to attack the rest of the Net.

    Please consider using an alternative, for all our sakes. There are several
    free alternatives (Mozilla, Opera, and Eudora come to mind) and several
    low-priced commercial ones. I like Mulberry for IMAP mail, Xnews for news,
    and Mozilla for web. Try them all. I'm betting you'll find that OE is *not*
    the best thing out there, even if what you settle on isn't the same mix
    that I chose.

    (Oh, and since this started as a Linux thread, take note that Mulberry,
    Mozilla, and Opera are all available for both Win32 and Linux. I use
    Mulberry and Moz on both platforms.)
  20. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    MeltDown <meltdownUSE@YOURunrealtower.imagination.org> Blessed us
    with news:slrnca12bj.4je.meltdownUSE@sybren.thirdtower.com:

    > Then use "Quotefix" for OE, and you'll be a happy man. You can
    > bottom-post no worries (just remember to snip all unneeded
    > quoted text), you get nice colors, nice smileys, and the broken
    > quoting is fixed :)

    I really do miss those cute little smiley face emoticons that came
    with the OE Quotefix after switching to Xnews. Maybe someone
    could make a request to Luu Tran the creator of Xnews to add the
    emoticons it. Shouldn't be too hard to parse the text and pick out
    all the patterns of text smileys and replace them with emoticon
    bitmaps for the user. I also thought about making a request to
    Microsoft about fixing OE so it will work ( YeeeHaawww! Yeah Right! )
    but the former sounds way easier! Nine times out of ten when I am
    looking for something M$ related I either run into a brick wall or
    a broken link.

    --
    J

    "Best?? Only a fool will assume they're the best."

    Mr.K
  21. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    JHall <jhall@playmlec.net> wrote in
    news:Xns94E6C296E6A57uppariscopeDiveDive.@199.171.54.214:

    > I really do miss those cute little smiley face emoticons that came
    > with the OE Quotefix after switching to Xnews.

    Yeah, that's the one thing in web forums I miss when looking at newsgroups.
    But the biggest problem is settling on some kind of standard. Every web
    forum I visit has a different collection of smilies and is often missing
    the one I want.

    At least Luu added support for X-Face. Do the OE users miss out on those?
    (I see you've got it enabled in your post.) It's a rather fun graphical
    feature with minimal bandwidth cost.
  22. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    Klaus Bregel enlightened us with:
    > uhm, u just lost 50 points doing a re- as a top post... ;-)

    Que? What part of my post was top-posted???

    MeltDown
    --
    !For all your UT99/2k3/2k4 questions visit UnrealTower's FAQ section:
    ! http://www.unrealtower.org/faq
    !Home of the FAQs for agut and agut2003.
  23. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    ScratchMonkey <ScratchMonkey.blacklist@sewingwitch.com> Blessed us
    with news:Xns94E6DB973B53Fscratchmonkey@216.196.97.136:

    > JHall <jhall@playmlec.net> wrote in
    > news:Xns94E6C296E6A57uppariscopeDiveDive.@199.171.54.214:
    >
    >> I really do miss those cute little smiley face emoticons that
    >> came with the OE Quotefix after switching to Xnews.
    >
    > Yeah, that's the one thing in web forums I miss when looking at
    > newsgroups. But the biggest problem is settling on some kind of
    > standard. Every web forum I visit has a different collection of
    > smilies and is often missing the one I want.

    You must be talking about HTML/HTTP web forums here. I believe they
    are somewhat different to an NNTP forum which is what this is. I
    have also noticed that the HTTP forums all have different types of
    smiley faces and emoticons. I believe the OE Quotefix was for NNTP
    text forums only and all it does is to change text like this *:-)*
    without the asterisks to an interesting little smiley bitmap.

    > At least Luu added support for X-Face. Do the OE users miss out
    > on those?

    Why most certainly OE users completely miss out on all of the fun
    little X-Faces that are out there like yours for a good example!.
    Mr.K also has an interesting yet simple X-Face for another good
    example of bigfoot's foot print I think. Actually I got mine from
    a person named 'Boomer' in news.software.readers and he had PG-13
    written on it and it was a lot less risque than mine is. I added
    the breasts and the XXX to the bitmap is all I did.

    > (I see you've got it enabled in your post.) It's a rather fun
    > graphical feature with minimal bandwidth cost.
    >

    Yeah it's really small and WinFace does a pretty good job of
    converting it to text too. I also like the fact that Xnews can
    use an X-Face that is more than 255 characters in length. Some
    newsreaders like Microplanet's Gravity can't do that.

    --
    J

    "Best?? Only a fool will assume they're the best."

    Mr.K
  24. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    JHall <jhall@playmlec.net> wrote in
    news:Xns94E7284A3592uppariscopeDiveDive.@199.171.54.213:

    > You must be talking about HTML/HTTP web forums here. I believe they
    > are somewhat different to an NNTP forum which is what this is.

    Right, by web forum I mean like my team's forums:

    http://matureasskickers.net/wbb2/

    (You'll note we have a UT2004 section.)

    Web forums are quite different technically from NNTP, and historically I
    despised them for their slow speed and lack of threading, but our server is
    beefy enough to address the speed issue. It's possible to view thread
    relationships but I find it clumsy and not very useful, so I just use the
    conventional linear view.
  25. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    ScratchMonkey <ScratchMonkey.blacklist@sewingwitch.com> Blessed us
    with news:Xns94E6D8E345C1Cscratchmonkey@216.196.97.136:

    > Manually?! With Xnews I can select a block of badly-formatted
    > text (including quoted paragraphs), right-click, and select
    > Rewrap and Join Lines, and it gets automagically reformatted. I
    > won't consider any replacement that lacks this feature.

    I use this feature of Xnews all the time and I also have grown
    quite accustomed to it and refuse like you do to be without it. I
    have to rewrap and join lines especially when someone has set
    their newsreader to wrap at 72 characters or more and when I see
    what they have posted it is wrapped badly kind of like the way OE
    wraps the text and some lines don't have the > before the quoted
    text. I think I have Xnews set to wrap at 70 characters and I
    haven't heard any complaints from anyone to set it lower or I
    will. I love Xnews and I will most probably stick with it but
    I also love another newsreader called 40tude Dialog which also
    has the X-Face feature and it's just as easy to use but for
    some odd reason it hangs/crashes sometimes but I think that
    is only due to user/news server error. :-)


    --
    J

    "Best?? Only a fool will assume they're the best."

    Mr.K
  26. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    JHall <jhall@playmlec.net> wrote in
    news:Xns94E74B93AC45uppariscopeDiveDive.@199.171.54.213:

    > I love Xnews and I will most probably stick with it but
    > I also love another newsreader called 40tude Dialog which also
    > has the X-Face feature and it's just as easy to use but for
    > some odd reason it hangs/crashes sometimes but I think that
    > is only due to user/news server error. :-)

    Now you just need a feature to break up run-on sentences!

    ;) ;) ;)
  27. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> Blessed us with news:2gdkcmF1mi0pU1@uni-
    berlin.de:

    > Please consider using an alternative, for all our sakes.

    and I second this motion and I will quote MeltDown that
    "OE is also a very useful virus distribution center"!.
    I didn't realize that Mr.K's post even had an attatchment
    of any kind as Xnews isn't showing any and I can't see it
    if it does. I'm for sure not firing up OE and trying to
    look at it as Mr.K might jump out of it and ring my neck!
    :O LOL

    --
    J

    "Best?? Only a fool will assume they're the best."

    Mr.K
  28. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    JHall <jhall@playmlec.net> wrote in
    news:Xns94E77443497FuppariscopeDiveDive.@199.171.54.213:

    > and I second this motion and I will quote MeltDown that
    > "OE is also a very useful virus distribution center"!.

    Here's another one I just saw on a mail server filter mailing list:

    http://secunia.com/virus_information/9323/

    > I didn't realize that Mr.K's post even had an attatchment
    > of any kind as Xnews isn't showing any and I can't see it
    > if it does.

    Nope, no attachment, just the first line of a uunencode body with a
    provocative filename. (It's the line that reads "begin JDSS433L.EXE.VBS".)
    OE attempts to treat the remainder of the message as the attachment,
    effectively hiding the last few paragraphs of Mr. K's message. The fact
    that it's so willing to parse and open a malformed attachment is what's so
    scary.
  29. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    JHall enlightened us with:
    > I didn't realize that Mr.K's post even had an attatchment of any kind
    > as Xnews isn't showing any and I can't see it if it does.

    It didn't. It just had a line "BEGIN filename.exe" in there, which OE
    sees as an attachment.

    MeltDown
    --
    !For all your UT99/2k3/2k4 questions visit UnrealTower's FAQ section:
    ! http://www.unrealtower.org/faq
    !Home of the FAQs for agut and agut2003.
  30. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    ScratchMonkey enlightened us with:
    > Manually?! With Xnews I can select a block of badly-formatted text
    > (including quoted paragraphs), right-click, and select Rewrap and Join
    > Lines, and it gets automagically reformatted. I won't consider any
    > replacement that lacks this feature.

    I use GVim as my editor for Slrn, which has the same feature. And I
    agree with you: I won't use any other news client that doesn't have
    this. As a matter of fact, I won't use any news client that can't use
    (G)Vim ;-)

    MeltDown
    --
    !For all your UT99/2k3/2k4 questions visit UnrealTower's FAQ section:
    ! http://www.unrealtower.org/faq
    !Home of the FAQs for agut and agut2003.
  31. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "ScratchMonkey" <ScratchMonkey.blacklist@sewingwitch.com> wrote in
    message news:Xns94E6DB2D634E4scratchmonkey@216.196.97.136...
    | "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote in
    news:2gclqlF16s1sU1@uni-berlin.de:
    |
    | > since you've gone to the trouble to find a web site with a
    bottom-post
    | > religious zealot's commentary and analysis, I've located for your
    | > review, some comments from top-posting zealots.
    |
    | Funny, he didn't seem like a zealot. It looked to me like he was
    making
    | valid arguments about how interleaved posting with proper trimming
    helped
    | all involved in expediting communication, which I think is our
    objective
    | here. Can you point out the zealot part? I musta missed it.

    My use of the term "zealot" was a tongue-in-cheek usage attached to an
    ongoing argument that continues to wane in real value. People do as
    they please when posting, whether they are aware of proper ettiquete
    or not. If you choose to attempt to educate the masses to your way of
    thinking, good luck to you.

    |
    | > http://www.lionsgrove.com/topposting.html
    | > http://www.newsservers.co.uk/thugs.php
    | > http://www.abpsp.fsworld.co.uk/umb/
    |
    | I checked these out. The 3rd has some cartoons that make
    ad-hominems but
    | no arguments. The 2nd whines about bottom-posting bullies, but still
    | makes no argument explaining why anyone would want to top-post. The
    1st
    | tries to claim that interleaved posting is bad by showing a poor
    attempt
    | by people who don't seem to understand the point, and also whines
    that
    | bottom posters don't trim, totally missing the point. (I think we
    all
    | agree that trimming is good, but top-posting makes it easy to not do
    it.
    | Xnews will properly bitch at me if my post is more than 60% quoted
    | material.)
    |
    | > There is no real standard, or those posting in alternative styles,
    | > contrary to the style you advocate, would have their accounts
    blocked
    | > from usenet access.
    |
    | Laws can dictate conformance with standards, but standards are not
    laws.
    | They are simply agreements to facilitate interoperability. If you
    violate
    | a standard, thugs don't come knocking on your door to take you away,
    but
    | the services you seek may not be able to respond to you.

    I believe the "agreement" you are referring to is nothing more than a
    group of persons or "adherents to an old style" attempting to enforce
    conformity with their idea of what usenet "used to be" and "should
    always be".

    I think you missed the point of the links I posted. The comments by
    the person advocating top-posting are reasons I tend to believe are
    quite valid. IOW, I understand the arguments of both sides, do you?
    The last 2 sites were a bit of humor, and it appears you misunderstood
    their value to the conversation.

    |
    | Similarly, top-posting on Usenet works in groups where that's the
    norm
    | (usually because the group is dominated by people ignorant of the
    value-
    | add of interleaved posting). More technical groups tend to recognize
    the
    | value of combining good trimming with interleaved responses, and may
    find
    | a top-poster too painful to reply to and provide help.

    You show me a newsgroup where most of the users adhere to a particular
    posting style, and I'll bet you the "norm" for that group is that
    which the group's self-anointed policeman have created. It is your
    suggestion that top posting has induced pain that I find most amusing
    and rather absurd. I suppose you also believe the use of html is
    anathema? At first, I thought html in emails and usenet was just not
    right, plain text seemed to work ok for so long, why not continue?
    The more I consider the value thereof, the more I like the thought of
    "real" formatting of text, so I now am in favor of html in both emails
    and usenet posts, or at least if someone uses such, I'll be the last
    to complain.

    |(Had you not
    | "juiced up" your post with a mention of Linux, I probably would have
    | ignored any question you asked, and so would most here.)


    LOL, so the mere mention of Linux is considered additional "juice"? I
    rarely ask for comment/feedback on a technical issue unless such
    problem is very unusual. To suggest that the use of a particular
    operating system piques your interest tells me quite a bit about you.

    |
    | Note that my objective is not to berate you or drive you out of the
    | group, but to try to help you make your communication more effective
    and
    | improve the likelihood of a good response. If you can point me to
    | resources that show how top-posting can accomplish the same, we'll
    all
    | rush to them with open arms. It's all about getting good value, esp.
    from
    | limited time to read many groups and lists.

    You just set forth the best reason for top posting in your last
    comment above, that is, the limited time to read messages, and my
    ongoing lack of time to scroll to the bottom of every reply post to
    see the response once I've already read the OP of the thread.
    Granted, some judicious snippage will render quoted posts less
    bothersome to digest, but that simply does not happen.

    I'm all for getting the most out of usenet also.
  32. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "ScratchMonkey" <ScratchMonkey.blacklist@sewingwitch.com> wrote in
    message news:Xns94E6DE4D2BD90scratchmonkey@216.196.97.136...
    | "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote in
    news:2gdkcmF1mi0pU1@uni-berlin.de:
    |
    | > This was the end of your worthless reply post in my newsreader
    client.
    | > I did not see any more of your less than polite comments until I
    | > examined the actual message source.
    |
    | Ouch, I didn't think OE was that broken. I had to compare your quote
    to his
    | message to see what OE was seeing. Xnews was smart enough (or
    perhaps dumb
    | enough) not to try to parse and run a broken uuencoded attachment.

    OE simply stopped rendering the message at the error. Xnews failed to
    recognize the script attachment problem and thus ignored it,
    continuing on to render the remainder of the post. It appears OE did
    not parse and run anything beyond the error, an intuitive approach to
    prevent problematic scripting errors. What you see as an error I see
    as

    |
    | > But, I guess you are a real god of computers, and already know how
    | > your lil VBS script failed to achieve its intended purpose.
    |
    | I didn't see any hostile script, just the header for one that OE
    tried to
    | parse and run. Yet another reason I avoid OE, as it's just too
    willing to
    | run any hostile content one gives it. We no longer live in the age
    of the
    | "scientific" Internet, when malicious traffic was almost unheard of
    and
    | programs did their best to deal with broken input. It's now
    necessary to
    | treat all input as hostile and act accordingly, but MS seems to find
    that
    | hard to grasp. And when it does fix the gaping holes, users don't
    apply the
    | patches, leading to a rise in infected "zombies" that malicious
    users
    | (notably spammers) use to attack the rest of the Net.

    The only suggestion of a hostile purpose is that which you suggest
    above. If you need help, I can show you how to prevent OE from
    running any hostile scripts, attachments, etc.

    Try rereading my post for content, you'll note that no code attached
    to emails or posts is executed on any of my machines running OE.
    You're preaching to the choir.

    | Please consider using an alternative, for all our sakes. There are
    several
    | free alternatives (Mozilla, Opera, and Eudora come to mind) and
    several
    | low-priced commercial ones. I like Mulberry for IMAP mail, Xnews for
    news,
    | and Mozilla for web. Try them all. I'm betting you'll find that OE
    is *not*
    | the best thing out there, even if what you settle on isn't the same
    mix
    | that I chose.

    I agree OE is not the best thing out there, but it works ok for the
    most part considering my needs/wants. I have mozilla installed and
    found it's email client to be ok, but there were some features I
    disliked, so I ceased using it almost immediately.

    |
    | (Oh, and since this started as a Linux thread, take note that
    Mulberry,
    | Mozilla, and Opera are all available for both Win32 and Linux. I use
    | Mulberry and Moz on both platforms.)

    I use Mozilla on my mandrake 9.2 box. Tried Opera a while back also,
    it was ok (Linux version), but Mozilla is better, imho.
  33. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    ScratchMonkey <ScratchMonkey.blacklist@sewingwitch.com> Blessed us
    with news:Xns94E796D3F732scratchmonkey@216.196.97.136:

    > Now you just need a feature to break up run-on sentences!

    Sorry about that!. It was one long sentence wasn't it? Hey an
    integrated spell checker would be nice too. I can use the
    external edit function and use UltraEdit to spell check it though.
    Sometimes after I have read a few posts and surfed the groups a
    bit I get tired, my eyes start to get crossed, and sometimes I
    miss spelling and grammar mistakes. It would be nice if we lived
    in a world where everyone didn't always pick on little stuff like
    spelling and grammar though.

    --
    J

    "Best?? Only a fool will assume they're the best."

    Mr.K
  34. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    MeltDown <meltdownUSE@YOURunrealtower.imagination.org> Blessed us
    with news:slrnca3m3j.4je.meltdownUSE@sybren.thirdtower.com:

    > It didn't. It just had a line "BEGIN filename.exe" in there,
    > which OE sees as an attachment.
    >

    Ah I see what you are saying. This must be the format that OE uses
    to handle message attachments and it can be fooled into thinking that
    there is an attachment when there is none. Just something little
    like that would most likly require a complete rewrite of the entire
    program but do you think Micro$oft is going to rewrite it? Erm...
    I think not!. Even if they did it would either be a HUGE download
    or wouldn't be free to registered Windows users even.


    --
    J

    "Best?? Only a fool will assume they're the best."

    Mr.K
  35. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    On Tue, 11 May 2004 23:16:22 -0500, ScratchMonkey wrote:

    > Manually?! With Xnews I can select a block of badly-formatted text
    > (including quoted paragraphs), right-click, and select Rewrap and Join
    > Lines, and it gets automagically reformatted.

    With Vim, visually select the area to be reformatted and press gq. :)

    > I won't consider any replacement that lacks this feature.

    Come to Slrn... and Vim. :)

    --
    "A riot is unt ugly thing, unt it's about time we had one!"
    R.L.U. #300033, running WM 0.80.1 under MDK9.1
  36. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    On Wed, 12 May 2004 12:50:01 +0100, Mr K <duffstuff@hotmail.com>
    wrote:

    >On Tue, 11 May 2004 23:16:22 -0500, ScratchMonkey wrote:
    >
    >> Manually?! With Xnews I can select a block of badly-formatted text
    >> (including quoted paragraphs), right-click, and select Rewrap and Join
    >> Lines, and it gets automagically reformatted.
    >
    >With Vim, visually select the area to be reformatted and press gq. :)
    >
    >> I won't consider any replacement that lacks this feature.
    >
    >Come to Slrn... and Vim. :)

    "Think about it for a few minutes. What would happen if this group
    became a dumping ground for all manner of problems?"

    You mean like this one? Consider taking this off-topic discussion to
    another forum.
  37. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    On Tue, 11 May 2004 22:44:32 -0500, ScratchMonkey wrote:

    > Technical error. The double-slash introduces a host name, but you've not
    > supplied a host, just the newsgroup name on a host (which would go after
    > another slash following the hostname). If you don't want to specify a host,
    > the newsgroup should immediately follow the colon delimiting the protocol
    > field.

    Oops. :(

    > Examples:
    >
    > news://news.lokigames.com
    >
    > Connects to a news server that used to be operated by Loki. No newsgroup
    > specified.
    >
    > news://news.lokigames.com/loki.games.tribes2
    >
    > Connects to the loki.games.tribes2 group on the aforementioned server.
    >
    > news:alt.games.unreal.tournament
    >
    > Connects to this group on the default server.

    Thanks for the correction.

    --
    "A riot is unt ugly thing, unt it's about time we had one!"
    R.L.U. #300033, running WM 0.80.1 under MDK9.1
  38. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    On Tue, 11 May 2004 23:48:18 -0500, ScratchMonkey wrote:

    > Ouch, I didn't think OE was that broken. I had to compare your quote to his
    > message to see what OE was seeing. Xnews was smart enough (or perhaps dumb
    > enough) not to try to parse and run a broken uuencoded attachment.

    Oops... silly me... I forgot to put an 'end' in the post, so "Kylesb"
    would be able to read the rest of the post.

    *snigger*

    > I didn't see any hostile script, just the header for one that OE tried to
    > parse and run. Yet another reason I avoid OE, as it's just too willing to
    > run any hostile content one gives it.

    "Kylesb" can be thankful I have a conscience, or I'd have happily used the
    html-input-crash code instead.

    --
    "A riot is unt ugly thing, unt it's about time we had one!"
    R.L.U. #300033, running WM 0.80.1 under MDK9.1
  39. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Mr K" <duffstuff@hotmail.com> wrote in message
    news:c7tfb1$qeu$1@inews.gazeta.pl...
    | On Tue, 11 May 2004 23:48:18 -0500, ScratchMonkey wrote:
    |
    | "Kylesb" can be thankful I have a conscience, or I'd have happily
    used the
    | html-input-crash code instead.
    |


    interestingly, the "input bug" appears to be fixed as none of the
    pages all over the net that claim to crash IE cause any problem with
    my very recent version of IE. Then again, you knew that, right?

    --
    Best regards,
    Kyle
  40. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    On Wed, 12 May 2004 12:15:50 -0400, Folk wrote:

    > "Think about it for a few minutes. What would happen if this group
    > became a dumping ground for all manner of problems?"
    >
    > You mean like this one?

    Would you like to address the instigator of this topic in this thread
    then, as opposed to having a pop at anyone you choose?

    > Consider taking this off-topic discussion to another forum.

    Duly noted. Now patiently awaiting newsgroup to dry up.

    --
    "A riot is unt ugly thing, unt it's about time we had one!"
    R.L.U. #300033, running WM 0.80.1 under MDK9.1
  41. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> Blessed us with news:2gf3ahF22sc3U1@uni-
    berlin.de:

    > nterestingly, the "input bug" appears to be fixed as none of the
    > pages all over the net that claim to crash IE cause any problem
    > with my very recent version of IE. Then again, you knew that,
    > right?

    Fixed? I seriously doubt it! Patched temporarily is more like it
    as far as Microsoft is concerned. Please do us all a favor and
    ditch that virus distribution center and at least get a 'real'
    newsreader. These are just some suggestions so please don't
    take them personally but please do take them seriously!.

    --
    J

    "Best?? Only a fool will assume they're the best."

    Mr.K
  42. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> Blessed us with news:2geuiiF1u7rfU1@uni-
    berlin.de:

    > The only suggestion of a hostile purpose is that which you suggest
    > above. If you need help, I can show you how to prevent OE from
    > running any hostile scripts, attachments, etc.

    This is easy to do by just going into folder options -> file types
    -> select file types like JS, JSE, VBS, VBE etc. and click
    advanced -> New -> in the 'action' text field type 'Run' -> in the
    'application used to perform action' text field type
    'C:\WINDOWS\Notepad.exe %1' click OK then the 'set default' button
    so that anytime the computer tries to 'Run' a script it merely
    just opens on the desktop in notepad!. This is how it is with
    Windows but I don't know how it would be with Linux or any other
    platform.

    --
    J

    "Best?? Only a fool will assume they're the best."

    Mr.K
  43. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> Blessed us with news:2geugeF200p7U1@uni-
    berlin.de:

    {A Judicious Snip}

    > It is your suggestion that top posting has induced pain that I
    > find most amusing and rather absurd.

    Pain??? no more pain than what you mentioned here and I find that
    just as "amusing and rather absurd" quote is as follows:

    "I hate scrolling to the bottom of a 100 line post to see "yup, I
    agree"."

    For me it really doesn't make a bit of damn difference if someone
    top posts or bottom posts but if someone posts in html all I see
    is html code wrapped around the text and then it makes it real
    hard to pick out the text in the message. HTML also uses up a lot
    more space on the server ( 'bandwidth' I never have figured out why
    it's called 'bandwidth' as far as storage space but it's easy to see
    why it's called 'bandwidth' when the server has to stay busy while
    someone sets for long periods of time downloading html code. ).
    How much time does it take to scroll down to the bottom of a 100
    line post? Hmmm...let's see reach over, grab the vertical scroll
    bar and slide it all the way down, altogether takes about 1/20th
    of a second!.


    --
    J

    "Best?? Only a fool will assume they're the best."

    Mr.K
  44. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    On Wed, 12 May 2004 17:16:41 +0100, Mr K <duffstuff@hotmail.com>
    wrote:

    >On Wed, 12 May 2004 12:15:50 -0400, Folk wrote:
    >
    >> "Think about it for a few minutes. What would happen if this group
    >> became a dumping ground for all manner of problems?"
    >>
    >> You mean like this one?
    >
    >Would you like to address the instigator of this topic in this thread
    >then, as opposed to having a pop at anyone you choose?

    No.

    That's your quote up there. It was your rationalization for flaming
    the piss out of a poster here the other day for being "off-topic".

    Your posts are rarely *on* topic, so where do you get off flaming
    people and in essence driving away potentially good posters?
  45. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    Folk <Folk@folk.com> Blessed us with
    news:f8m5a0l1808p7qogcemu9a7qkpoeffj4pk@4ax.com:

    > No.
    >
    > That's your quote up there. It was your rationalization for
    > flaming the piss out of a poster here the other day for being
    > "off-topic".
    >
    > Your posts are rarely *on* topic, so where do you get off
    > flaming people and in essence driving away potentially good
    > posters?

    No one is really flaming anyone that I can see in this thread
    but abusing I can see happening by the OP. We were pretty much
    just finishing up all discussions in this thread so we can move
    on to more interesting things like UT for a change!. I agree
    about this off topic nonsense so that's why I'm ending my part
    in this thread here and because I have no answers for the OP.

    I haven't seen you post here in a while Folk and I almost figured
    maybe you had abandoned the group and quit reading it or maybe
    UT2k4 was keeping you busy but it's nice to see ya back!.

    :)

    --
    J

    "Best?? Only a fool will assume they're the best."

    Mr.K
  46. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    JHall <jhall@playmlec.net> wrote in
    news:Xns94E74A9805E9AuppariscopeDiveDive.@199.171.54.214:

    > It would be nice if we lived
    > in a world where everyone didn't always pick on little stuff like
    > spelling and grammar though.

    Sorry, for me it's almost compulsive. I can spot them from miles away, and
    it's like acid in the eyes. But I usually refrain from pointing them out.
    This was just a case of silliness, not trying to heckle you. ;)
  47. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    JHall <jhall@playmlec.net> wrote in
    news:Xns94E74BE5E4BAEuppariscopeDiveDive.@199.171.54.214:

    > This must be the format that OE uses
    > to handle message attachments

    No, actually it long pre-dates OE. It's uuencoding, a way to encode binary
    files for travel through 7-bit modems that was used in the early days of
    email. (Modern systems use MIME.) Any sensible modern client would either
    ignore it or parse it only a a matching "end" line were found. OE happily
    parses it anyway, and presumably also tries to execute it if possible.
  48. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    JHall <jhall@playmlec.net> wrote in
    news:Xns94E7AA5435F99uppariscopeDiveDive.@199.171.54.213:

    > ( 'bandwidth' I never have figured out why
    > it's called 'bandwidth' as far as storage space but it's easy to see
    > why it's called 'bandwidth' when the server has to stay busy while
    > someone sets for long periods of time downloading html code. ).

    Most US readers now have the luxury of unlimited broadband. Many Europeans
    are still on metered dialup. Every downloaded byte counts.
  49. Archived from groups: alt.games.unreal.tournament (More info?)

    "Kylesb" <me@privacy.net> wrote in news:2geugeF200p7U1@uni-berlin.de:

    > The last 2 sites were a bit of humor, and it appears you misunderstood
    > their value to the conversation.

    I guess you had to be there. For comparison, here's a Taxonomy of Flamers:

    http://www.winternet.com/~mikelr/flame1.html

    > I suppose you also believe the use of html is anathema? At first, I
    > thought html in emails and usenet was just not right, plain text
    > seemed to work ok for so long, why not continue? The more I consider
    > the value thereof, the more I like the thought of "real" formatting of
    > text, so I now am in favor of html in both emails and usenet posts, or
    > at least if someone uses such, I'll be the last to complain.

    If the HTML were limited to visible markup, and the syntax were strictly
    defined to limit the list of valid tags, I'd agree with you. But I'm also
    an email server admin, and I have to deal with the ton of spam masquerading
    inside of HTML with invalid tags. And it's programs like OE with highly
    unpredictable parsing of arbitrary HTML that allows spammers to get away
    with this and continue to slide past vigilant server filters concealed in
    broken HTML. As others have repeatedly said, get a real client that doesn't
    let the spammers and virus writers get away with it.

    And take pity on the European readers still on metered dial-up who pay by
    the byte. If you don't need garish ugly fonts to hide the lack of content,
    stay with plain text.
Ask a new question

Read More

Servers Linux Video Games Product