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Extended Desktop?

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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 23, 2004 11:49:37 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Hey, everyone...

I have a question, perhaps those who know more about laptops can offer
a bit of assistance here!

My question: I'd like to know how to add a monitor to my laptop, and
use both the laptop display and the external monitor as an extended
desktop.

I had it working on Windows XP, but I can't seem to get it going on
Windows 2000 professional.

I'm currently using a Toshiba Satellite 2100CDS laptop. In the display
menu, under settings, there's something that says "Display: (Multimple
Monitors) on S3 ViRGE MX" -- which gives me the idea that it can be
done.

So...can anyone suggest anything? Thank you very, very much!

-S

More about : extended desktop

Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 23, 2004 9:25:00 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

StevieKay <steviekay@gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey, everyone...
>
> I have a question, perhaps those who know more about laptops can offer
> a bit of assistance here!
>
> My question: I'd like to know how to add a monitor to my laptop, and
> use both the laptop display and the external monitor as an extended
> desktop.
>
> I had it working on Windows XP, but I can't seem to get it going on
> Windows 2000 professional.
>
> I'm currently using a Toshiba Satellite 2100CDS laptop. In the display
> menu, under settings, there's something that says "Display: (Multimple
> Monitors) on S3 ViRGE MX" -- which gives me the idea that it can be
> done.
>
> So...can anyone suggest anything? Thank you very, very much!

Not supported under W2K without a second video card installed.

Checkout: http://www.margi.com/products/prod_dtg.htm

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 23, 2004 11:03:59 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

JHEM wrote:

> StevieKay <steviekay@gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hey, everyone...
>>
>> I have a question, perhaps those who know more about laptops can offer
>> a bit of assistance here!
>>
>> My question: I'd like to know how to add a monitor to my laptop, and
>> use both the laptop display and the external monitor as an extended
>> desktop.
>>
>> I had it working on Windows XP, but I can't seem to get it going on
>> Windows 2000 professional.
>>
>> I'm currently using a Toshiba Satellite 2100CDS laptop. In the display
>> menu, under settings, there's something that says "Display: (Multimple
>> Monitors) on S3 ViRGE MX" -- which gives me the idea that it can be
>> done.
>>
>> So...can anyone suggest anything? Thank you very, very much!
>
> Not supported under W2K without a second video card installed.
>
> Checkout: http://www.margi.com/products/prod_dtg.htm

That's funny, I have a number of 2K boxent that have no trouble with the
extended desktop with a single video board. It just has to be a dual-head
board with dual DACs. Of course the S3 Virge chip may not support that
capability.
>

--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Related resources
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 24, 2004 5:04:01 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

J. Clarke <jclarke@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>
> That's funny, I have a number of 2K boxent that have no trouble with
> the extended desktop with a single video board. It just has to be a
> dual-head board with dual DACs. Of course the S3 Virge chip may not
> support that capability.

You're not going to find many laptops, which is what the question was about,
with dual-head video cards.

And a dual-head video card witrh dual DACs _IS_ two video cards, they just
take up one PCI slot.

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 24, 2004 5:04:02 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"JHEM" <James@ESAD_SPAMMERS.thinkpads.com> wrote in
news:l_Rod.6677$0k1.2078@trnddc08:

> J. Clarke <jclarke@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>>
>> That's funny, I have a number of 2K boxent that have no trouble with
>> the extended desktop with a single video board. It just has to be a
>> dual-head board with dual DACs. Of course the S3 Virge chip may not
>> support that capability.
>
> You're not going to find many laptops, which is what the question was
> about, with dual-head video cards.
>
> And a dual-head video card witrh dual DACs _IS_ two video cards, they
> just take up one PCI slot.
>
Two video cards are seen by the system as two PCI devices. There were
some desktop cards (I still have one with two huge S3 chips on it) that
implemented two chips on one card seen as two video cards. Windows 2k
has no problems with such cards for extended desktop.

For single-chip cards with multiple DACs it is up to driver to do
virtualization and trick OS into seeing it as two devices.

Dual monitor support in W2k is a lot like in WinNT, while in WinXP it is
a lot like in Win98/ME.

So it's a matter of finding if the proper driver exists and obtaining it.
Or following the advice to buy a second card for laptop like Margi (there
are a couple more vendors making similar stuff).

BTW, S3 Virge in Satellite has only 2MB on board, which means you can
only have 16-bit color when running extended desktop. And that almost
does not leave any spare video RAM on card. I doubt S3 ever planned this
card to be used in that mode so don't expect to find the driver that
would do that. You are getting away with it in WinXP because there OS
does it, not driver.

Alexei
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 24, 2004 5:04:03 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

I really don't mind running in 16bit colour mode if using the extended
desktop, should it be doable that way -- the obly reason I really
require it is for work; so I can run my editing and word processing
software on one screen and have all IMs and whatever else from clients
and co-workers on another.

It's not for games. :-)

Alexei Boukirev <aboukirev@blah.ameritech.net> wrote in message news:<Xns95AAD3517DDB4aboukirevblahamerite@216.196.97.131>...
> "JHEM" <James@ESAD_SPAMMERS.thinkpads.com> wrote in
> news:l_Rod.6677$0k1.2078@trnddc08:
>
> > J. Clarke <jclarke@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> >>
> >> That's funny, I have a number of 2K boxent that have no trouble with
> >> the extended desktop with a single video board. It just has to be a
> >> dual-head board with dual DACs. Of course the S3 Virge chip may not
> >> support that capability.
> >
> > You're not going to find many laptops, which is what the question was
> > about, with dual-head video cards.
> >
> > And a dual-head video card witrh dual DACs _IS_ two video cards, they
> > just take up one PCI slot.
> >
> Two video cards are seen by the system as two PCI devices. There were
> some desktop cards (I still have one with two huge S3 chips on it) that
> implemented two chips on one card seen as two video cards. Windows 2k
> has no problems with such cards for extended desktop.
>
> For single-chip cards with multiple DACs it is up to driver to do
> virtualization and trick OS into seeing it as two devices.
>
> Dual monitor support in W2k is a lot like in WinNT, while in WinXP it is
> a lot like in Win98/ME.
>
> So it's a matter of finding if the proper driver exists and obtaining it.
> Or following the advice to buy a second card for laptop like Margi (there
> are a couple more vendors making similar stuff).
>
> BTW, S3 Virge in Satellite has only 2MB on board, which means you can
> only have 16-bit color when running extended desktop. And that almost
> does not leave any spare video RAM on card. I doubt S3 ever planned this
> card to be used in that mode so don't expect to find the driver that
> would do that. You are getting away with it in WinXP because there OS
> does it, not driver.
>
> Alexei
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 24, 2004 3:35:50 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"JHEM" <James@ESAD_SPAMMERS.thinkpads.com> wrote in message
news:l_Rod.6677$0k1.2078@trnddc08...
> J. Clarke <jclarke@nospam.invalid> wrote:
> >
> > That's funny, I have a number of 2K boxent that have no trouble with
> > the extended desktop with a single video board. It just has to be a
> > dual-head board with dual DACs. Of course the S3 Virge chip may not
> > support that capability.
>
> You're not going to find many laptops, which is what the question was
about,
> with dual-head video cards.
>
> And a dual-head video card witrh dual DACs _IS_ two video cards, they just
> take up one PCI slot.
>

Dual head video is now quite common in laptops.

A dual head video card is *not* two video cards. Some of the logic is
shared - for example, only monitor can show overlaid video. There are other
limitations.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 24, 2004 6:49:29 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Joe Davis <davisexpREMOVE@attglobal.net> wrote:
>
> Most of the laptops with dedicated video memory now support dual
> monitors. If it has an ATI or nVidia video card with at least 64MB of
> dedicated VRAM, they probably support dual monitors. If it has
> integrated video and shared memory, it probably doesn't. This is not
> just a function of cost, but also size-- the really small laptops use
> integrated video to save on space. The IBM T40 line and the Dell
> Latitude line also have a docking station that has room for a
> half-length PCI card, so any laptop that can dock with those can use
> an additional PCI video card.

Yes, but as I said the function is not supported natively under W2K without
having a second PHYSICAL video card installed.

This drove me nuts when I first upgraded to the W2K Beta on my beloved
Thinkpad 600X. I was giving presentations weekly with the machine under
W98SE, using my projector to show my powerpoint show while having my notes
open on the laptop's display, all of which was natively supported by 98 with
the unit's NeoMagic video chip with 4MB VRAM.

So you can imagine my surprise to find that the function was no longer
natively supported under W2K and the resolution to the problem necessitated
the purchase of the Margi Display-to-Go card.

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 24, 2004 6:49:30 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

JHEM wrote:

> Joe Davis <davisexpREMOVE@attglobal.net> wrote:
>>
>> Most of the laptops with dedicated video memory now support dual
>> monitors. If it has an ATI or nVidia video card with at least 64MB of
>> dedicated VRAM, they probably support dual monitors. If it has
>> integrated video and shared memory, it probably doesn't. This is not
>> just a function of cost, but also size-- the really small laptops use
>> integrated video to save on space. The IBM T40 line and the Dell
>> Latitude line also have a docking station that has room for a
>> half-length PCI card, so any laptop that can dock with those can use
>> an additional PCI video card.
>
> Yes, but as I said the function is not supported natively under W2K
> without having a second PHYSICAL video card installed.

That's odd. It works fine on the machine I'm sitting at right now. Which
has one and only one PHYSICAL video card installed.

> This drove me nuts when I first upgraded to the W2K Beta on my beloved
> Thinkpad 600X. I was giving presentations weekly with the machine under
> W98SE, using my projector to show my powerpoint show while having my notes
> open on the laptop's display, all of which was natively supported by 98
> with the unit's NeoMagic video chip with 4MB VRAM.
>
> So you can imagine my surprise to find that the function was no longer
> natively supported under W2K and the resolution to the problem
> necessitated the purchase of the Margi Display-to-Go card.

The problem is that you simply don't have the necessary driver support for
the feature you want. Has nothing to do with "second PHYSICAL video card".

--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 24, 2004 6:58:59 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Electrik Fan Club <ian.shorrocks@baeyourclothessystems.com> wrote:
>
> Dual head video is now quite common in laptops.

The ability to extend a desktop to a second display on a laptop is not the
same as having dual head video, which requires having two VGA or DVI
outputs. Or am I being too literal?

> A dual head video card is *not* two video cards. Some of the logic is
> shared - for example, only monitor can show overlaid video. There
> are other limitations.

Under Windoze, the card is seen as having two separate and distinct devices
attached.

Sorry for my poorly worded response.

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 24, 2004 7:07:54 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

StevieKay <steviekay@gmail.com> wrote:
> I really don't mind running in 16bit colour mode if using the extended
> desktop, should it be doable that way -- the obly reason I really
> require it is for work; so I can run my editing and word processing
> software on one screen and have all IMs and whatever else from clients
> and co-workers on another.

If you're married to W2K then your best bet is to use the Margi
Display-to-Go card (or similar). I've used one under W2K on my Thinkpad
600X, T21, T23 and T30.

If you can possibly upgrade to XP, then I strongly urge you do so. XP
provides native support for an extended desktop and many of the laptop
manufacturers have utilities available for making the most of your
presentations, e.g. IBM's Presentation Director for Thinkpads:
http://www-306.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?...

> It's not for games. :-)

Why, the thought never entered my head! ;-)

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 25, 2004 2:04:03 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"JHEM" <James@ESAD_SPAMMERS.thinkpads.com> wrote in message
news:7d2pd.9678$1B2.3067@trnddc02...
> Electrik Fan Club <ian.shorrocks@baeyourclothessystems.com> wrote:
> >
> > Dual head video is now quite common in laptops.
>
> The ability to extend a desktop to a second display on a laptop is not the
> same as having dual head video, which requires having two VGA or DVI
> outputs. Or am I being too literal?
>

The graphics chips fitted to most modern laptops support a second external
display as well as the internal LCD panel. You have the option to use the
LCD panel only; the external display only; the same display on both (nothing
new so far). The new bit is that you can have an extended desktop on either
display with the primary display on the other.

The same graphic cards for desktop computers do indeed have 2 connectors on
them.

> > A dual head video card is *not* two video cards. Some of the logic is
> > shared - for example, only monitor can show overlaid video. There
> > are other limitations.
>
> Under Windoze, the card is seen as having two separate and distinct
devices
> attached.
>

Not quite. Although they do appear in device manager as 2 graphic devices,
the secondary device has no resources allocated or (depending on the
driver), shows a duplicated set of resources.

Although windows has always supported extended desktops on multiple graphic
cards, the dual head cards usually require a dedicated driver to use the
facility. Although the windows generic drivers will drive the cards (even
if only in VGA mode), the extended desktop is not supported. This is a
result of the shared logic of the two graphic systems and that they are
accessed through common resources.

The dual head cards are intelligent enough that if a display device is only
connected to one port, then the card functions as a single display. True
dual graphic cards will not do this, and windows attempts to display its
start up screens on the extended desktop created, even if you can only see
half of it.

Windows will support more than 2 graphic cards extending the desktop over
however many you care to provide. I do not know what the limit is (quite
apart from the availability of AGP and PCI slots in which to physically
insert the cards). We operate a PC here with 3 graphic cards.

Ian.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
November 25, 2004 2:06:14 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"JHEM" <James@ESAD_SPAMMERS.thinkpads.com> wrote in message
news:ul2pd.2516$TG2.941@trnddc01...
> StevieKay <steviekay@gmail.com> wrote:
> > I really don't mind running in 16bit colour mode if using the extended
> > desktop, should it be doable that way -- the obly reason I really
> > require it is for work; so I can run my editing and word processing
> > software on one screen and have all IMs and whatever else from clients
> > and co-workers on another.
>
> If you're married to W2K then your best bet is to use the Margi
> Display-to-Go card (or similar). I've used one under W2K on my Thinkpad
> 600X, T21, T23 and T30.
>
> If you can possibly upgrade to XP, then I strongly urge you do so. XP
> provides native support for an extended desktop and many of the laptop
> manufacturers have utilities available for making the most of your
> presentations, e.g. IBM's Presentation Director for Thinkpads:
> http://www-306.ibm.com/pc/support/site.wss/document.do?...
>

Powerpoint also natively works with dual displays, putting the presentation
on one display and the speaker's notes on the other.

Ian.
!