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Ati Sapphire HD 5850 2 Gig Vs Nvidia GTX 470

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July 2, 2010 3:53:03 PM

Hiya folks, out of these two cards, Ati Sapphire HD 5850 2 Gig and Nvidia GTX 470, which one would folks reccomend and why?
Im buying a new card next week and i'd settled on the ati, but i keep hearing that the 470 is a better card, even comapred to the Ati5870, so could someone help me make up my mind please, im too unsure to make a final decision with out a little guidence.

Thanks in advance
July 2, 2010 4:02:50 PM

I'm one for value of experience. The 2gigs of DDR5 won't do any better than 1gig unless you're running an eyefinity setup. So to me, that's wasted money.

Pure FPS, ATI has better value.

But for gaming experience, I think nVidia has a better product. While you pay a premium for this, nVidia does more to work with software developers and driver support. They have a program called "The Way Its Meant To Be Played." TWIMTBP for short, sort of. Anyway, things like PhysX and 3D support show they are trying to advance the experience moreso than ATI.

ATI took a big step with eyefinity and does look nice to have 3 monitors for one card. But to run 3 monitors on just one card is pushing the card really hard, so needing two GPUs for 3 monitors isn't a deal breaker for me.

That's my take. I have a 4850 and love that I can max just about everything on my 1280x1024, but as I've learned more over the last few years, I'm sold for team green right now. I'd get the 470.
July 2, 2010 4:07:35 PM

not going to choose sides but what will you do with your PC, is it Strictly Gaming, then go with Nvidia, are you going online, watching movies, reading, writing (2D apps) then go with ATI. That would be my recommendations. I go with ATI because they are still known to run 2D applications better then any company., I still game but all around user. My cousin is pure gamer, has no apps or even internet on his desktop PC, has Nvidia and says he loves it (GTX 275) but when he is at my place he loves the graphic quality of my system in all aspects and said if he did what I do, he would change cards, but he thinks he still gets better FPS in games that we both play (he is unfortunately only running an E6300 not overclocked on some no name board that won't allow OC'ing).
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July 2, 2010 5:50:30 PM

thanks folks, just wanted some clear points as to why i should go Nvidia as its been a while, been team red for about 4 years now and Nvidia had priced themselves out of the reach of my pocket, but thats not so now!
Its for gaming, (why else would people be looking in this range unless theyre twitch freaks?), but some video conversion and net, so im looking for the best in my budget, and the 470 is looking right up my street.
PSU is good enough for it too, its an OCZ gamerXstream 850w, so its got legs longer than Adriana Sklenarikova so gaming shouldn't be a problem.

Once again, thanks peeps, you's done good!
July 2, 2010 7:37:45 PM

The only problem I would say on GTX470 is the heat that it generate
It reach up to 75 Celsius, sometimes even higher ~ unless you gotta put some water colling or else I don't think this card can live long
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 2, 2010 9:47:52 PM

I just put an MSI GTX 470 (reference model) in my system last night. Sucker hits 94C in Furmark/Unigine Heaven benchmarks with fan speed on auto (86% fan speed @ 94C). And yes, it's loud. :)  From my 24 hour experience with it, the hype about heat and noise isn't exaggerated.

This is with a Thermaltake Armor Full Tower case. 1 x 120mm exhaust fan, 1 x 90mm top exhaust fan, 2 x 120mm intake fans in front.
July 2, 2010 10:18:10 PM

@jerreece, thats where my problems stem from mostly.
I know the cards a good'en, but the heat at stock is very concearning, even though i use an NZXT Tempest so airflow is high in it, i still have worries about the heat.

With the 2Gig sapphire 5850 toxic, it overclocks like magic, its easy to hit 1000Ghz core and over 5000ghz memory, giving it insane performance in games and just about everything else you through at it.

Now i know a lot of people would be happy to go with that, knowing its gonna out perform a stock 5870 with ease, but you'll be saying BYE BYE to the warranty as soon as you hit the unlock in overdrive.

Is the stock 470 enough to cope with extended gaming sessions on BFBC2 for instance, the heat build up might be too much!
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 2, 2010 10:51:55 PM

I have not gotten to do any extended gaming with mine yet. It's been benched for 12,000ms setting in Furmark, has run a couple sessions of the Heaven Benchmark, 3dMark06, Crysis 1.2 (4 loops). But I haven't played it long term.

Unfortunately I spent much of last evening trying to download Resident Evil 5 (got a CD-Key along with my GTX 470) and dealing with having corrupt download files all 4 times (at 7GB download each try). Thankfully it was downloading at 1MB/sec. (waiting to hear from nVidia tech support who are the ones providing the download).

Perhaps tonight I'll have a chance to actually play BC2 with it. :)  I imagine it must survive though, as we haven't heard of a massive failure rate with the part. And nVidia says it was designed to run at such temperatures. *shrugs* Still, the fan has to crank up to keep it as cool as it can, and gets fairly loud.

I just saw a review the other day that specifically tested and OC'd an MSI GTX 470 (the one I have) and they were able to get some extremely impressive overclock out of it. Unfortunately, with mine peaking at 94C I don't even dare at this point until I can figure out how to get it cooled better without spending any money. :) 
a b U Graphics card
July 2, 2010 11:29:20 PM



Please don't cherry-pick benchmarks.
I wouldn't trust Anandtech and xbit a lot more, and you are posting basically the 3 games that favor Fermi's arch.

The GTX 470 performs 2-8% faster over AnandTech's suite.
http://www.anandtech.com/show/2977/nvidia-s-geforce-gtx...
Right now, if your PSU can power a 470 I would get that as on Newegg the cheapest GTX 470 is but $10 more, however I cannot say if you are outside of the US.

On the other hand, the 5850 is $10 cheaper, and with a very good cooler it reachs 950MHz easy, at which it easily ties the GTX 470 (if not exceed), if you overclock the 5850 to the max it will beat a stock GTX 470.

5850: Take your pick, both good, I have more experience with the HIS one but Sapphire has a better history.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

GTX 470:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
July 2, 2010 11:54:22 PM

Its done, its ordered, just got to wait for delivery.

In the end i did choose the Sapphire Toxic, i run an AMD crossfire board, so looking to the (hopefully near) future, i can add another one.

In the UK, the VID 470's are lot more expensive than the 5850's, though theyre only a few pence less than the toxic, and like i said, if im Crossfiring, then its this way ive got to go.

Its been a long couple of weeks trying to make up my fragile little brain, and thaks to everyone who's put forwad their thoughts, cheers guys!
a c 376 U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 3, 2010 12:14:13 AM

It's a good choice if you are going to crossfire. The 2gb wont really matter much with one HD5850 but once you double up it will have the speed to use that extra memory. I would look to add another and then use it in an Eyefinity setup. Eyefinity does look sweet;
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Mn9Hhh3awK0
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5UeHJEeuLc8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DaI2FRKSXwc&#t=140
and you will certainly have the cards to handle it properly.
a c 376 U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 3, 2010 4:34:17 AM

He said you cherry picked obviously, and it is true. It isn't what review you used it is that you picked out a handful of examples from the review that are among the most favorable towards what you are trying to say.
That said with the GTX 470 only $10 more on newegg at the moment it is a pretty compelling choice. As long as you are ok with the noise/heat/ect and have a PSU that can handle it. This guy doesn't live in the US though and has already ordered so the point is kind of moot for this thread at least.
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 3, 2010 5:40:02 AM

Last time I checked, when someone is trying to make a point, they post graphs from reviews that do that, not the opposite, lol. With the latest drivers, there are almost no games the 470 does not best the 5850, in min/avg fps.
a c 376 U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 3, 2010 5:52:27 AM

The point is the charts you presented, on their own, give a misleading picture as to how much of an advantage the GTX 470 has over the HD5850 because you handpicked the ones that show the most advantage rather than giving a representative sampling. That is what cherry picking is, choosing to present data that most favors what you are saying rather than data that fairly represents the reality of a situation.
July 3, 2010 7:36:47 AM

Ok, ive rewritten this a few times because im not looking for fanboy flames..

ATI is less power consumption (you dont have to buy a gigantic power supply if your planning on dual card later)
good performance
less heat runs cooler

NVIDIA is higher power consumption, a review showed two 480's pulling over 1000w which is pretty scary to me personally..
little better performance
runs pretty hot might need to add fans/etc


I know your asking about the 470s but this is what I got from asking for advice to get a 5870 or a 480 and I decided on a 5870

had to edit my son hit the submit somehow :) 

these are my observations don't hate me :) 
July 3, 2010 7:42:38 AM

lol should of read the thread better congrats on your decision I think it was wise especially when you get more monitors :) 
a b U Graphics card
July 3, 2010 3:11:26 PM

+1 470
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 3, 2010 4:02:27 PM

jryan388 said:
+1 470


The OP Already ordered the ATI 5850 2GB :bounce: 
July 3, 2010 4:32:35 PM

Jerreece, I find that score in futuremarks a little low, my system got 16000 in futuremark and nothing is overclocked, don't know why mine is high, but not complaining. And yes, ATI does run cooler, on idle and 2D applications my GPU temp is 35C, and when gaming I finally got it to 51C, the fan increases at 50C so I seen fan speed jump on GPU for first time, cleaning my fan today just in case, has been running for last 2 months at only 46C underload, but then again, just started a new game (Medal Of Honor Online Beta) so that may be the reason for the little increase in temp.
a b U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 3, 2010 5:09:19 PM

rattman169 said:
Jerreece, I find that score in futuremarks a little low, my system got 16000 in futuremark and nothing is overclocked, don't know why mine is high, but not complaining. And yes, ATI does run cooler, on idle and 2D applications my GPU temp is 35C, and when gaming I finally got it to 51C, the fan increases at 50C so I seen fan speed jump on GPU for first time, cleaning my fan today just in case, has been running for last 2 months at only 46C underload, but then again, just started a new game (Medal Of Honor Online Beta) so that may be the reason for the little increase in temp.


Are you talking about Futuremark 3dMark06 or are you talking about Furmark? I'm sort of assuming you're talking about the results I posted in my Benchmark thread perhaps?

My 3dMark06 Scores with the GTX 470
GTX 470 = 23,820 Marks Forceware 257.21 Drivers
SM 2.0 Score = 9,907
SM 3.0 Score = 11,258
CPU Score = 6,089

Furmark Scores
GTX 470 = 8,327 Points Forceware 257.21 Drivers
GTX 470 = 8,339 Points Forceware 258.69 Drivers

I have noticed a bug with the Unigine benchmarks. Although MSI Afterburner confirms that my GTX 470 is being used, and my PhysX card (GTX 260) is NOT being used, Unigine's benchmark results say "GTX 260" as the GPU. Now, before folks assume Afterburner is reporting the wrong GPU in it's graphs, I've self checked by feeling the furnace like heat coming out of the GTX470, and the cool air coming out of the GTX 260 during benchmark.

If I have time, I might remove the GTX 260 this evening and benchmark without it, in case there's some bug making the 470 run slower or something. But Afterburner is showing all the stock speeds properly. I've tried the two latest nVidia drivers, and changed PhysX from Auto to Manually selecting the GTX 260 for PhysX. That has made no difference.

I can say, that I played Bad Company 2 last night for 2-3 hours with the GTX 470. I manually set the settings.ini file to force DX11 use. Playing @ 1920x1080 with all the settings turned up, and using Fraps during game play I was mostly showing the 60/61FPS cap due to VSync. So obviously the card is in fact performing properly.

And Metro 2033 in DX11 on High (not very high) was showing about 30FPS during the first intro level. Although that obviously fluctuated up and down.
July 4, 2010 3:58:03 PM

@rattman, its BLOOY sweet! that was what was making me hessitate with my purchase, knowing in the the long term im better off getting the 5850 Toxic "gig edition, and knowing the out right performance of the 470 would be perfect in the short term for gaming.
Damn shame i cant afford both, but thats like init?!!?

I wonder how a 470 would perform as a physx card along side the radeon?
Dont suppose theres a nutter out there thats tried is there? lol
a c 376 U Graphics card
a b Î Nvidia
July 4, 2010 5:34:49 PM

The GTX 470 would be WAY overpowered(and overpriced) to consider as a dedicated Physx card. Something like a GTS 250 would be more appropriate but personally I wouldn't consider it worth the cost, extra power usage and hassle of using hacked drivers. GPU accelerated Physx is only a particularly useful advantage in a handful of games.
As for the temps of the ATI vs Nvidia cards that wouldn't so much be my concern but rather the heat given off by the cards. The heat given off is directly related to power usage and is the more significant factor imo, especially when considering a crossfire/SLI setup.
July 4, 2010 6:30:39 PM

since blowing up my 4890, ive been using GT220. when my 5850 arrives on tuesday, its going back to taking the place of physx processing.
Yes, theres not a great deal of apps out there that use it, but the ones that do, (BM-AA) look so much better for it!

Plus, you dont need to use hacked drivers, grab the Nvidia 257.15 driver pack, they forgot to lock down the level of code to stop physx when an ATI card is present
!