No more Thinkpads?

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

<http://money.cnn.com/2004/12/03/technology/ibm_pc.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes>


NEW YORK (Reuters) - International Business Machines Corp. has put its
personal computing business up for sale in a deal that could be worth as
much as $2 billion, The New York Times reported Friday.

IBM (Research), now the No. 3 PC manufacturer behind Dell Inc.
(Research) and Hewlett-Packard Co. (Research), is likely to include all
of its desktop and laptop computers in the sale, which could bring $1
billion to $2 billion, people close to the negotiations told the newspaper.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

If someone wasn't going to continue to produce IBM product, exactly what
would they be buying?


"timeOday" <timeOday-UNSPAM@theknack.net> wrote in message
news:rdadnVNxIJ54Cy3cRVn-rQ@comcast.com...
> <http://money.cnn.com/2004/12/03/technology/ibm_pc.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes>
>
>
> NEW YORK (Reuters) - International Business Machines Corp. has put its
> personal computing business up for sale in a deal that could be worth as
> much as $2 billion, The New York Times reported Friday.
>
> IBM (Research), now the No. 3 PC manufacturer behind Dell Inc. (Research)
> and Hewlett-Packard Co. (Research), is likely to include all of its
> desktop and laptop computers in the sale, which could bring $1 billion to
> $2 billion, people close to the negotiations told the newspaper.

 

[john]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

>If someone wasn't going to continue to produce IBM product, exactly what
>would they be buying?

I'd cosider the DELL "Latitude" series.

Regards

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Whoever will buy IBM's PC business will obviously keep the Thinkpad
name, but its quality will most likely suffer. Currently Thinkpads are
the best notebooks in each class, far better than anything Dell, HP and
the others offer. But this quality comes at a premium price. My guess is
their quality will go down, as will their price.

But even if the quality will remain the same, they will still lack IBM's
global support network. There isn't a single company that comes even
close to IBM in terms of support (Compaq business class support was
amazing, but that was before Fiorina bought them)

I guess this is the end of an era in personal computing. Maybe it was
about time though...

Cosmin

Chip Orange wrote:
> If someone wasn't going to continue to produce IBM product, exactly what
> would they be buying?
>
>
> "timeOday" <timeOday-UNSPAM@theknack.net> wrote in message
> news:rdadnVNxIJ54Cy3cRVn-rQ@comcast.com...
>
>><http://money.cnn.com/2004/12/03/technology/ibm_pc.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes>
>>
>>
>>NEW YORK (Reuters) - International Business Machines Corp. has put its
>>personal computing business up for sale in a deal that could be worth as
>>much as $2 billion, The New York Times reported Friday.
>>
>>IBM (Research), now the No. 3 PC manufacturer behind Dell Inc. (Research)
>>and Hewlett-Packard Co. (Research), is likely to include all of its
>>desktop and laptop computers in the sale, which could bring $1 billion to
>>$2 billion, people close to the negotiations told the newspaper.
>
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"John" <jeshoemaker@aol.comNOSPAM> wrote in message
news:20041203183519.00362.00001433@mb-m17.aol.com...
> >If someone wasn't going to continue to produce IBM product, exactly what
>>would they be buying?
>
> I'd cosider the DELL "Latitude" series.
>
> Regards

Just to clarify my comment; I meant, I thought they would continue to
produce IBM product, including thinkpads, otherwise what would the buyer of
the IBM PC division be paying for (if not the IBM and Thinkpad brand names
as well as their design).

Chip

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Chip Orange wrote:
> "John" <jeshoemaker@aol.comNOSPAM> wrote in message
> news:20041203183519.00362.00001433@mb-m17.aol.com...
>
>>>If someone wasn't going to continue to produce IBM product, exactly what
>>>would they be buying?
>>
>>I'd cosider the DELL "Latitude" series.
>>
>>Regards
>
>
> Just to clarify my comment; I meant, I thought they would continue to
> produce IBM product, including thinkpads, otherwise what would the buyer of
> the IBM PC division be paying for (if not the IBM and Thinkpad brand names
> as well as their design).
>
> Chip

I really doubt whoever will buy IBM's PC division will be allowed to use
the IBM name. My guess is Thinkpad will become a brand of its own, with
no attachments to IBM. But at this point, it's just speculation,
although we'll find out soon enough.

Cosmin

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Cosmin N." <no@email.com> wrote in
newsa6dnZR_zo-KwC_cRVn-gQ@rogers.com:

> Chip Orange wrote:
>> Just to clarify my comment; I meant, I thought they would continue to
>> produce IBM product, including thinkpads, otherwise what would the
>> buyer of the IBM PC division be paying for (if not the IBM and
>> Thinkpad brand names as well as their design).
>>
>> Chip
>
> I really doubt whoever will buy IBM's PC division will be allowed to
> use the IBM name. My guess is Thinkpad will become a brand of its own,
> with no attachments to IBM. But at this point, it's just speculation,
> although we'll find out soon enough.
>
> Cosmin

Think of Hitachi Travelstar that was formerly IBM Travelsar brand. At
least with that former part of IBM business everthing seems to be good so
far...

Alexei

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Beyond that, it's not clear that the sale by IBM involved both laptops
and desktops, indeed I had the impression it was desktops only.
Contrary to what many believe, IBM does still make desktop PCs, they
just don't sell them through retail distribution channels.


Chip Orange wrote:

> If someone wasn't going to continue to produce IBM product, exactly what
> would they be buying?
>
>
> "timeOday" <timeOday-UNSPAM@theknack.net> wrote in message
> news:rdadnVNxIJ54Cy3cRVn-rQ@comcast.com...
>
>><http://money.cnn.com/2004/12/03/technology/ibm_pc.reut/index.htm?cnn=yes>
>>
>>
>>NEW YORK (Reuters) - International Business Machines Corp. has put its
>>personal computing business up for sale in a deal that could be worth as
>>much as $2 billion, The New York Times reported Friday.
>>
>>IBM (Research), now the No. 3 PC manufacturer behind Dell Inc. (Research)
>>and Hewlett-Packard Co. (Research), is likely to include all of its
>>desktop and laptop computers in the sale, which could bring $1 billion to
>>$2 billion, people close to the negotiations told the newspaper.
>
>
>

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Cosmin N. wrote:
> I really doubt whoever will buy IBM's PC division will be allowed to
> use the IBM name. My guess is Thinkpad will become a brand of its
> own, with no attachments to IBM. But at this point, it's just
> speculation, although we'll find out soon enough.

Lenovo has been granted the use the IBM name on Thinkpads for five
years. So we'll be seeing "IBM Thinkpads" made in China for another
five years, which is no different from the IBM Thinkpads of the last two
or three years.

After 2010, perhaps they'll be called "Le Thinkpad", which will most
certainly appeal to fashion designers and the French.

--
da
~~
"OE Quotefix"
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
to fix Outlook Express' broken quoting.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Donkey Agony" <root@[127.0.0.1]> writes:
> Lenovo has been granted the use the IBM name on Thinkpads for five
> years. So we'll be seeing "IBM Thinkpads" made in China for another
> five years, which is no different from the IBM Thinkpads of the last two
> or three years.

HP laptops used to be pretty good, but now they are junk, even though
they still say HP on them. Everyone's concern is whether Thinkpad
quality will go the same way. Whether they'll still say Thinkpad on
them is less important.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Paul Rubin wrote:

> "Donkey Agony" <root@[127.0.0.1]> writes:
>
>>Lenovo has been granted the use the IBM name on Thinkpads for five
>>years. So we'll be seeing "IBM Thinkpads" made in China for another
>>five years, which is no different from the IBM Thinkpads of the last two
>>or three years.
>
>
> HP laptops used to be pretty good, but now they are junk, even though
> they still say HP on them. Everyone's concern is whether Thinkpad
> quality will go the same way. Whether they'll still say Thinkpad on
> them is less important.

Yes, that's the bottom line from users standpoint. I read somewhere that
Lenovo's intent was to build computers for the Chinese market which as
we know is developing extremely fast. One question is, how important
will the western market be compared to the more easily reachable (and
presumably not as demanding yet)regional market?

If I had my say in a large corporation, I would put some heat on IBM.
They say they are keeping the servers production, but for how long ?
Will IBM become a shell company, like Dell? Whichever way you look at
this, this is sad. Global market seems to be a one-way concept ...

--
John Doue

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

John Doue wrote:

> Paul Rubin wrote:
>
>> "Donkey Agony" <root@[127.0.0.1]> writes:
>>
>>>Lenovo has been granted the use the IBM name on Thinkpads for five
>>>years. So we'll be seeing "IBM Thinkpads" made in China for another
>>>five years, which is no different from the IBM Thinkpads of the last two
>>>or three years.
>>
>>
>> HP laptops used to be pretty good, but now they are junk, even though
>> they still say HP on them. Everyone's concern is whether Thinkpad
>> quality will go the same way. Whether they'll still say Thinkpad on
>> them is less important.
>
> Yes, that's the bottom line from users standpoint. I read somewhere that
> Lenovo's intent was to build computers for the Chinese market which as
> we know is developing extremely fast. One question is, how important
> will the western market be compared to the more easily reachable (and
> presumably not as demanding yet)regional market?
>
> If I had my say in a large corporation, I would put some heat on IBM.
> They say they are keeping the servers production, but for how long ?
> Will IBM become a shell company, like Dell? Whichever way you look at
> this, this is sad. Global market seems to be a one-way concept ...

Dell is a hardware vendor, not a services and software vendor. IBM is
pushing services and software--they're seeing hardware as a losing
proposition. You're assuming that getting out of the hardware business
will make IBM a "shell company". You're forgetting that IBM's product has
_never_ been "computers". It has _always_ been "profits", and any
operation that wasn't producing them got pruned unmercifully. If computers
no longer make profits for IBM they'll move into a different industry.


--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Y'all might be interested in this interview with Steven Ward, the
CEO-to-be of Lenovo. For one, it looks like Thinkpads are gonna stay
Thinkpads:

http://tinyurl.com/46orh

--
da
~~
"OE Quotefix"
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
to fix Outlook Express' broken quoting.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

I wrote:
> Y'all might be interested in this interview with Steven Ward, the
> CEO-to-be of Lenovo. For one, it looks like Thinkpads are gonna stay
> Thinkpads:
>
> http://tinyurl.com/46orh

For another, it looks like IBM and not Lenovo will be doing Thinkpad
warranty and support.

It's gonna be interesting to see how this shakes out over the next two
years.

--
da
~~
"OE Quotefix"
http://home.in.tum.de/~jain/software/oe-quotefix/
to fix Outlook Express' broken quoting.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"Donkey Agony" <root@[127.0.0.1]> writes:
> For another, it looks like IBM and not Lenovo will be doing Thinkpad
> warranty and support.

Huh? IBM stopped doing Thinkpad warranty and support about 5 years
ago. It's been outsourced to some other company since then. By the
pathetic standards of most laptop vendors, it's still not bad, but
it's nowhere near as good as it used to be.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

OK< now you get a REAL reply, Hear this:
I sent in an A31P for PLASTICS REPLACEMENT:
The bottom had a stress crack near the UltraBay
The right LCD latch was broken off
The LCD Bezel was cracked
Not only was all this COVERED under WARRANTY
But when they put the machine back together they discovered that the
Ethernet did not work for some reason, so
THEY REPLACED THE SYSTEM BOARD FOR A FAULT I DID NOT SEND IT IN FOR
AND DID NOT KNOW EXISTED.
How on earth can you trash service like that?????????????????


On 10 Dec 2004 11:53:59 -0800, Paul Rubin
<http://phr.cx@NOSPAM.invalid> wrote:

>"Donkey Agony" <root@[127.0.0.1]> writes:
>> For another, it looks like IBM and not Lenovo will be doing Thinkpad
>> warranty and support.
>
>Huh? IBM stopped doing Thinkpad warranty and support about 5 years
>ago. It's been outsourced to some other company since then. By the
>pathetic standards of most laptop vendors, it's still not bad, but
>it's nowhere near as good as it used to be.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Bruce Markowitz wrote:

> OK< now you get a REAL reply, Hear this:
> I sent in an A31P for PLASTICS REPLACEMENT:
> The bottom had a stress crack near the UltraBay
> The right LCD latch was broken off
> The LCD Bezel was cracked
> Not only was all this COVERED under WARRANTY
> But when they put the machine back together they discovered that the
> Ethernet did not work for some reason, so
> THEY REPLACED THE SYSTEM BOARD FOR A FAULT I DID NOT SEND IT IN FOR
> AND DID NOT KNOW EXISTED.
> How on earth can you trash service like that?????????????????

Well, they didn't upgrade it to a 128 bit processor and a terabyte of RAM,
the blackguards.

> On 10 Dec 2004 11:53:59 -0800, Paul Rubin
> <http://phr.cx@NOSPAM.invalid> wrote:
>
>>"Donkey Agony" <root@[127.0.0.1]> writes:
>>> For another, it looks like IBM and not Lenovo will be doing Thinkpad
>>> warranty and support.
>>
>>Huh? IBM stopped doing Thinkpad warranty and support about 5 years
>>ago. It's been outsourced to some other company since then. By the
>>pathetic standards of most laptop vendors, it's still not bad, but
>>it's nowhere near as good as it used to be.

--
--John
Reply to jclarke at ae tee tee global dot net
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Well just imagine now that the Chinese have bought thewhole
pc business what you will have to look forward to. A slow
boat to China, and a reply probably written in chinese
characters which when translated would add up to
"no more support from us"
Kokomo Joe


****************************************************
* Ham KH6JF AARS/MARS ABM6JF QCWA WW2 VET WD RADIO *
* Army MARS State Coordinator for Hawaii *
****************************************************

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Paul Rubin <http://phr.cx@NOSPAM.invalid> wrote:
>
> Huh? IBM stopped doing Thinkpad warranty and support about 5 years
> ago. It's been outsourced to some other company since then. By the
> pathetic standards of most laptop vendors, it's still not bad, but
> it's nowhere near as good as it used to be.

Yes, depot level warranty repairs are outsourced to Solectron in Memphis,
but they're almost as good as when IBM performed all repairs in-house.

Support is still performed in-house. When you call phone support for
hardware or software issues, you'll be speaking with an IBM employee in one
of their support centers in either the US or Canada if you call from
anywhere in North America.

--
Regards,

James

Checkout the NEW Thinkpad Forums: http://forum.thinkpads.com

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

JHEM wrote:

> Paul Rubin <http://phr.cx@NOSPAM.invalid> wrote:
>
>>Huh? IBM stopped doing Thinkpad warranty and support about 5 years
>>ago. It's been outsourced to some other company since then. By the
>>pathetic standards of most laptop vendors, it's still not bad, but
>>it's nowhere near as good as it used to be.
>
>
> Yes, depot level warranty repairs are outsourced to Solectron in Memphis,
> but they're almost as good as when IBM performed all repairs in-house.
>
> Support is still performed in-house. When you call phone support for
> hardware or software issues, you'll be speaking with an IBM employee in one
> of their support centers in either the US or Canada if you call from
> anywhere in North America.
>
Not hard to guess what it's in store for us ... ! (pun intended).

--
John Doue

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"JHEM" <James@ESAD_SPAMMERS.thinkpads.com> writes:
> > Huh? IBM stopped doing Thinkpad warranty and support about 5 years
> > ago. It's been outsourced to some other company since then. By the
> > pathetic standards of most laptop vendors, it's still not bad, but
> > it's nowhere near as good as it used to be.
>
> Yes, depot level warranty repairs are outsourced to Solectron in Memphis,
> but they're almost as good as when IBM performed all repairs in-house.

They are not. They go to much greater lengths to find ways to
avoiding repairing stuff. IBM used to fix stuff that they could have
gotten out of fixing, since it led to selling more Thinkpads, which
was good for IBM. Solectron or whoever it is has no incentive to fix
more than the minimum necessary to fulfill their IBM contracts, since
it doesn't matter to them whether IBM sells more Thinkpads or not.

I'm still steamed about Solectron refusing to fix the obviously
malfunctioning hard drive from my A20p, which was making noises like
fingernails down a blackboard, because despite the noises the drive
still passed the SMART fitness test. The noise made the computer
practically unbearable to use and I had to replace the drive at my own
expense.

> Support is still performed in-house. When you call phone support for
> hardware or software issues, you'll be speaking with an IBM employee
> in one of their support centers in either the US or Canada if you
> call from anywhere in North America.

No, I don't think so. Sometimes I've reached a support call center in
Ireland, though that experience was perfectly nice.

 

[Guest]

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

The few times I called support they were in Atlanta.

Jim





On 17 Dec 2004 22:37:07 -0800, Paul Rubin
<http://phr.cx@NOSPAM.invalid> wrote:

>"JHEM" <James@ESAD_SPAMMERS.thinkpads.com> writes:
>> > Huh? IBM stopped doing Thinkpad warranty and support about 5 years
>> > ago. It's been outsourced to some other company since then. By the
>> > pathetic standards of most laptop vendors, it's still not bad, but
>> > it's nowhere near as good as it used to be.
>>
>> Yes, depot level warranty repairs are outsourced to Solectron in Memphis,
>> but they're almost as good as when IBM performed all repairs in-house.
>
>They are not. They go to much greater lengths to find ways to
>avoiding repairing stuff. IBM used to fix stuff that they could have
>gotten out of fixing, since it led to selling more Thinkpads, which
>was good for IBM. Solectron or whoever it is has no incentive to fix
>more than the minimum necessary to fulfill their IBM contracts, since
>it doesn't matter to them whether IBM sells more Thinkpads or not.
>
>I'm still steamed about Solectron refusing to fix the obviously
>malfunctioning hard drive from my A20p, which was making noises like
>fingernails down a blackboard, because despite the noises the drive
>still passed the SMART fitness test. The noise made the computer
>practically unbearable to use and I had to replace the drive at my own
>expense.
>
>> Support is still performed in-house. When you call phone support for
>> hardware or software issues, you'll be speaking with an IBM employee
>> in one of their support centers in either the US or Canada if you
>> call from anywhere in North America.
>
>No, I don't think so. Sometimes I've reached a support call center in
>Ireland, though that experience was perfectly nice.