I5 750 or I7 860

[CriticalError]

I was A+ many years ago, but I have not opened a computer in anger since the dark ages. I am not a gamer and the heaviest thing I do is spreadsheets so I know I am going with a little overkill but I am looking at 2 Dell systems.

1. 750 - 8 ram - 1TB HD - ATI Radeon HD 5670 and 20" monitor for $1100
2 860 - 6 ram - 750 HD - ATI Tadeon HD 5770 and 21.5 monitor for $1180

Also do you consider it wise to wait to the end of the quarter to purchase? Am I wrong in thinking I can't get this built cheaper locally? Is it worthwhile to go to Windows Ultimate over Home Premium, and since I only use Word and Excel, is the starter Office sufficient?

 

[bavman]

1) You can definitely get this built cheaper if your willing to build it yourself.
2) There's really no reason to get ultimate if that's all your doing, its just a waste of money.

There's definitely no reason to get the 860 over the 750 since you'll probably never use more than 2 cores with your usage anyways. If your interested in building your own to save money just say so and i'll be happy to help you. Its a great experience to learn how to. Also, if you check the new built section of the forums they have some tips on components for a basic office built, and you can always add on with things you'd prefer, like a quad core cpu, etc.

Also if you do with dell, i noticed that the computers offer 8 and 6gb of ram. If possible, knock it down to 4gb to save some money as 4gb will be more than enough to run any program you listed in multiple instances, even games.

 

[CriticalError]

1) You can definitely get this built cheaper if your willing to build it yourself.
2) There's really no reason to get ultimate if that's all your doing, its just a waste of money.

There's definitely no reason to get the 860 over the 750 since you'll probably never use more than 2 cores with your usage anyways. If your interested in building your own to save money just say so and i'll be happy to help you. Its a great experience to learn how to. Also, if you check the new built section of the forums they have some tips on components for a basic office built, and you can always add on with things you'd prefer, like a quad core cpu, etc.

Also if you do with dell, i noticed that the computers offer 8 and 6gb of ram. If possible, knock it down to 4gb to save some money as 4gb will be more than enough to run any program you listed in multiple instances, even games.

I am so far behind in the jargon that those guys lose me. The only time I have opened a case in the past 10 years was because of a noisy fan. I can't believe I passed the A+ test at one time, and I actually have an old grounding wrist strap. I am not totally against building my own machine I just don't know where to start anymore. I want a machine that won't go obsolete in 2 years

 

[wielander]

I was A+ many years ago, but I have not opened a computer in anger since the dark ages. I am not a gamer and the heaviest thing I do is spreadsheets so I know I am going with a little overkill but I am looking at 2 Dell systems.

1. 750 - 8 ram - 1TB HD - ATI Radeon HD 5670 and 20" monitor for $1100
2 860 - 6 ram - 750 HD - ATI Tadeon HD 5770 and 21.5 monitor for $1180

Also do you consider it wise to wait to the end of the quarter to purchase? Am I wrong in thinking I can't get this built cheaper locally? Is it worthwhile to go to Windows Ultimate over Home Premium, and since I only use Word and Excel, is the starter Office sufficient?

Notes:

1. Both of those are very capable processors. Despite the big difference in nomeclature, the only difference between the two is that the i7-860 is clocked just 140 MHz higher. Go with the i5-750 if it costs you more than $20 less than the i7-860.

2. You really don't need more than 4GB of ram for productivity work, and that should never change. You won't see any difference from adding more than that; any additional memory will just sit unused.

3. It won't benefit you any to have the HD 5770 instead of the HD 5670. Both have the same decoders for video so the GPU itself isn't stressed very much by processing even HD video. Unless you are rendering something the difference in performance won't matter.

4. A 1TB hard drive will actually perform better than a comparable 750GB or smaller hard drive. The platters are more dense, and data isn't stored as far apart physically.

5. In general productivity you will see more benefit from a solid state hard drive (SSD) than from a slightly faster processor (faster loading times, snappier in general).

6. There are few differences between Windows Home Premium and Windows Ultimate. I highly doubt you would ever notice a difference or need a feature from Windows Ultimate.

7. The prices you find locally will probably be similar to what Dell is charging, but I agree that you could get a much better deal if you can build the computer yourself. Aftermarket components are much higher quality than the generics ones dell uses and allow for upgrades later.

8. Intel is shipping their latest architecture "Sandy Bridge" Q1 2011. It appears to be a more of an incremental improvement than the last couple were; a performance increase of ~20% is expected for low to mid range processors. Higher power integrated graphics will be included in all of the new processors including the replacements for the processors you are looking at. If you waited and bought a "Sandy Bridge" processor, you wouldn't need a dedicated graphics card like the HD 5670 and HD 5770. Current generation dedicated graphics cards like those two will still be considerably more powerful than Intel's integrated graphics, though.

9. It isn't very hard to build a computer yourself. There are guides on this website and all over the internet (you can even find video guides). High end components include complete instructions for how to install components and to first start up the computer.

 

[wielander]

Here's what it would cost if you built it yourself:


Core i5-750
GIGABYTE GA-P55A-UD3 LGA 1156 Intel P55 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
$310 after a $10 rebate

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.501398


LIAN LI PC-8NWX Black Aluminum ATX Mid Tower Computer Case (You could save $80 here, but few cases are higher quality, solid aluminum, more professional looking)*
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium x64
$223

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.437504.11-112-263


OCZ ModXStream 500W Power Supply (High efficiency, 80 plus certified, modular)
4GB DDR3 1600 CL8
$95 after $40 in rebates

http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.492805


Lite-On 24X DVD Burner w/Lightscribe
$24

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827106333&cm_re=lite_on_dvd_burner-_-27-106-333-_-Product


Hitachi Deskstar 1TB
$70

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822145304&cm_re=1tb_hard_drive-_-22-145-304-_-Product


Sapphire HD 5670 Graphics Card
$66 after $15 rebate

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102871&cm_re=hd_5670-_-14-102-871-_-Product


Total: $788 after shipping and rebates (Again, with a case more comparable to the plastic monstrosities Dell ships, you could cut off ~$80)*

 

[CriticalError]

You guys actually have me contemplating building my own system, but I am reading a lot of horror stories from guys having problems getting their builds up and running. I will buy quality components, and I can handle a screwdriver, but all this talk about overclocking and such is beyond me. Is the list such as Weilander supplied complete, or are there more things that I will need. Of course I know I will need to buy Windows 7, but are there other non-software items that I will also need. Of course I know mouse and keyboard and monitor.

 

[wielander]

Is the list such as Wielander supplied complete, or are there more things that I will need. Of course I know I will need to buy Windows 7, but are there other non-software items that I will also need. Of course I know mouse and keyboard and monitor.

Yes, it is complete, and I have a copy of Windows in there somewhere.


You hear a lot of horror stories about things going wrong because few people speak up when everything goes the way it should. If you do decide to build it yourself, you can always come here for help and advice.

 

[CriticalError]

Thanks, that is the kind of info I need. Is NewEgg considered the place with the best price?

 

[wielander]

Thanks, that is the kind of info I need. Is NewEgg considered the place with the best price?

Yes, Newegg usually has the best prices on computer components online (especially when you take into account the combo deals). We also shop there because of their large selection, extensive catalog of customer reviews/feedback, and generally excellent customer service. Microcenter and Fry's electronics brick and mortar stores occasionally have better deals if you live nearby (Microcenter always has the lowest prices on Intel processors), though.

 

[CriticalError]

My IT guy at work said stepping up the video card will give me a lot of bang for the buck. I came in here with every intent of just buying a ready made computer, and now you guys have me looking at components. Heck I don't know a CPU from a UPC anymore, but if I can build a better puter for less money I am all ears. I am also thinking about buying Office 2010 so who has the best software prices.

 

[wielander]

My IT guy at work said stepping up the video card will give me a lot of bang for the buck. I came in here with every intent of just buying a ready made computer, and now you guys have me looking at components. Heck I don't know a CPU from a UPC anymore, but if I can build a better puter for less money I am all ears. I am also thinking about buying Office 2010 so who has the best software prices.

The starter version of Microsoft Office that comes with Dell PCs is just a 3 month demo. You can get Microsoft Office from Newegg; their software prices are also good. Here are your options:

Office 2010 Home & Student
Includes 2010 versions of Word, Excel, PowerPoint and OneNote.

Product Key Card for 1 Computer (this is just a serial number; you download the software over the internet) $110
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116861&nm_mc=OTC-Froogle&cm_mmc=OTC-Froogle-_-Software+-+Licenses-_-Microsoft-_-32116861

Retail Box with DVD Install Disk for up to 3 different Computers $122
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116856&nm_mc=OTC-Froogle&cm_mmc=OTC-Froogle-_-Software+-+Business+++Personal+Finance-_-Microsoft-_-32116856


Office 2010 Home & Business
Includes 2010 versions of Word, Excel, PowerPoint, OneNote and Outlook.

Product Key Card for 1 Computer $167
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116860&nm_mc=OTC-Froogle&cm_mmc=OTC-Froogle-_-Software+-+Licenses-_-Microsoft-_-32116860

Retail Box with DVD Install Disk for up to 3 different Computers $222
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116857&nm_mc=OTC-Froogle&cm_mmc=OTC-Froogle-_-Software+-+Business+++Personal+Finance-_-Microsoft-_-32116857


Office 2010 Professional
Includes 2010 versions of Word, Excel, PowerPoint, OneNote, Outlook, Publisher and Access.

Product Key Card for 1 Computer $312
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116859&nm_mc=OTC-Froogle&cm_mmc=OTC-Froogle-_-Software+-+Licenses-_-Microsoft-_-32116859

Retail Box with DVD Install Disk for up to 3 different Computers $411
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116858&nm_mc=OTC-Froogle&cm_mmc=OTC-Froogle-_-Software+-+Business+++Personal+Finance-_-Microsoft-_-32116858

 

[CriticalError]

Wielander, thanks again for your input. Have you seen this build on Tom's?
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/build-a-pc-overclock-components,2735.html
I am a raw rookie, but I question this video card being extreme overkill for a non-gamer. I understand the whole concept of the I5 is probably overkill, but I try to get a lot of years out of my computers.

 

[wielander]

Wielander, thanks again for your input. Have you seen this build on Tom's?
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/build-a-pc-overclock-components,2735.html
I am a raw rookie, but I question this video card being extreme overkill for a non-gamer. I understand the whole concept of the I5 is probably overkill, but I try to get a lot of years out of my computers.

Believe me, it is very much overkill for a non-gamer. If you aren't playing games, doing 3D design, or using GPU compute, the only thing that will stress your graphics card is video. All of the latest video cards have dedicated hardware for video decoding. So even entry level graphics cards like the Radeon HD 5670 can play back any standard video format at any standard resolution without struggling, and that's the way you want it to be.

Outside of those applications (games, 3D design, and GPU compute) you don't want to be stressing your graphics card. It just doesn't make sense; it's a waste. For example, you can play back HD h.264 video on an old HD 2900xt graphics card (ancient by graphics card standards but actually only 3 1/2 year old) because it has the brute strength to process it even without optimizations, but it will consume an inordinate amount of power doing it (it will probably be loud as well). If in the future there is a new video format that isn't supported by the hardware decoders of your entry level graphics card or there is some similar new feature that you need more graphics power for, you would be better off just buying and installing a new entry level graphics card in your system.

The low level graphics cards three years from now will be as good as the high end cards of today. In your situation you will benefit more from the features of new graphics cards than the power of them. Buy a low end graphics card now; it will have everything you need. If you ever feel the need for a more powerful graphics in the future, go buy a new low end graphics card (you should never need anything better). Three low end graphics cards purchased over the life of your computer would still cost less than one high end graphics card today not even considering how much you will save on your electricity bills.

 

[bavman]

If your looking to save some money buying a cheaper case as long as it has 2 fans or so. At stock cpu speed, even with the stock cooler it wont be producing that much heat. Also cutting back on the power supply is another way to cut your bill. The 650W psu recommended in that build would be a little overkill, as the 5670 only requires a decent 400w psu.

 

[CriticalError]

I am taking a good hard look at Wielander's configuration, and my one question is about the power supply, and if I should wait for the Sandy Bridge to ship. The Tom's build shows a Cosair CMPSU-650TX for $90. Also NewEgg always says combos may not be compatable, but why would they sell a combo that wouldn't work together? I am narrowing down my options.

 

[CriticalError]

Best answer selected by CriticalError.

 

[wielander]

I am taking a good hard look at Wielander's configuration, and my one question is about the power supply, and if I should wait for the Sandy Bridge to ship. The Tom's build shows a Cosair CMPSU-650TX for $90. Also NewEgg always says combos may not be compatable, but why would they sell a combo that wouldn't work together? I am narrowing down my options.

That is a good power supply, but it's more than you will need. Even with the high power consumption graphics card in that Tom's hardware build, your computer would use less than 400W at load (250W with the graphics card at idle); with an HD5670 or HD5770 it would use less than 250W at load. This XFX 650W power supply is a dollar cheaper after you add up all of the discounts for each, and it has a higher efficiency rating.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817207007&cm_re=xfx_650w-_-17-207-007-_-Product

Sandy Bridge will bring some interesting changes. New processors will be ~20% faster than the ones they replace, but overclocking will not be possible on any of the standard retail processors. There will be a couple enthusiast class processors that will be unlocked for overclocking, but they will likely be priced higher because of the exclusivity of that feature. The main thing that Sandy Bridge brings to the table is improved integrated graphics, but these integrated graphics will still be far worse than any current generation dedicated graphics card (performance comparable to a Radeon HD4350).

If you want to overclock, you will get a much better value out of an LGA1156 i5-750 build (perhaps even better if you wait until after Sandy Bridge has been released).

Newegg puts items that they are trying to move more quickly in combo deals. I've never seen incompatible components together in a combo deal, but the components in combo deals aren't necessarily well matched. For example, there frequently are combo deals with extremely high output power supplies and low end, low power consumption video cards. There are also combo deals containing IDE drives that have no place in a new system (they use an old interface and are only normally used to upgrade older systems without SATA). That disclaimer is there just to protect them from any liability.

 

[CriticalError]

Thank you again for your informative reply. I just pulled this up for Sandy Bridge. I don't forsee overclocking, and frankly I don't know anything about that, so the question now is whether to wait for Sandy Bridge. Anandteck seems to think it is worth the wait.

Sandy Bridge CPU Comparison
Base Frequency L3 Cache Cores/Threads Max Single Core Turbo Intel HD Graphics Frequency/Max Turbo Unlocked TDP
Intel Core i7 2600K 3.4GHz 8MB 4 / 8 3.8GHz 850 / 1350MHz Y 95W
Intel Core i7 2600 3.4GHz 8MB 4 / 8 3.8GHz 850 / 1350MHz N 95W
Intel Core i5 2500K 3.3GHz 6MB 4 / 4 3.7GHz 850 / 1100MHz Y 95W
Intel Core i5 2500 3.3GHz 6MB 4 / 4 3.7GHz 850 / 1100MHz N 95W
Intel Core i5 2400 3.1GHz 6MB 4 / 4 3.4GHz 850 / 1100MHz N 95W
Intel Core i3 2120 3.3GHz 3MB 2 / 4 N/A 850 / 1100MHz N 65W
Intel Core i3 2100 3.1GHz 3MB 2 / 4 N/A 850 / 1100MHz N 65W

 

[wielander]

It's a tougher decision if you don't plan to overclock, but it is probably worth it to wait. The price/performance ratio may be slightly better after Sandy Bridge is released, but nobody knows how the processors will compare at retail. With the system you're looking at you won't notice any of the other changes (integrated graphics, better PCI-E implementation) except for the improved turbo modes (which will simulate an automatic overclock).