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AA Nimh charger recommendations please

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January 2, 2005 4:44:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually, it
does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or less)
thanks.
Anonymous
January 2, 2005 4:44:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <41d831f7@news.greennet.net>,
"martin" <martin@rcflyers.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:

> I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually, it
> does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
> point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or less)
> thanks.

Ansmann UK can help you

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
Anonymous
January 2, 2005 4:44:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 13:44:01 -0000, in rec.photo.digital "martin"
<martin@rcflyers.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:

>I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually, it
>does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
>point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or less)
>thanks.

Maha MH-C401FS 100 Minute Cool Battery Charger
http://thomas-distributing.com/mhc401fs.htm

________________________________________________________
Ed Ruf Lifetime AMA# 344007 (Usenet@EdwardG.Ruf.com)
See images taken with my CP-990/5700 & D70 at
http://EdwardGRuf.com
Related resources
Can't find your answer ? Ask !
Anonymous
January 2, 2005 9:17:44 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"martin" <martin@rcflyers.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:41d831f7@news.greennet.net...
>I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually, it
>does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
>point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or
>less) thanks.
>

I use the Maha charger. It has four indidual charging ciruits. It will
fast or slow charge, then switch to trickle/maint. charge. It comes with a
12V DC adapter for automotive use, too.

Good shooting,
Bob Scott
Anonymous
January 2, 2005 10:42:28 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

martin wrote:
> I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell
> individually, it does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will
> be fine. Can anyone point me in the right direction for one of these
> please (prefer £30 or less) thanks.

GP chargers come in a set with 4 AA cells ...Smart2 is 1 hour charger and
has individual cell and temp monitor. Nice stuff, but GP has a few other
models. Check them out.
Anonymous
January 2, 2005 11:09:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Robert Scott" <desmobob@earthlink.net> writes:

> "martin" <martin@rcflyers.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:41d831f7@news.greennet.net...
>>I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually, it
>>does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
>>point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or
>>less) thanks.

> I use the Maha charger. It has four indidual charging ciruits. It will
> fast or slow charge, then switch to trickle/maint. charge. It comes with a
> 12V DC adapter for automotive use, too.

Sounds like you're describing the MH-C401FS, which I have and think is
a great charger.

And you can get it with an international AC adapter, that just needs
plug converters to work anywhere in the world.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, <mailto:D d-b@dd-b.net>, <http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/&gt;
RKBA: <http://noguns-nomoney.com/&gt; <http://www.dd-b.net/carry/&gt;
Pics: <http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/&gt; <http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/&gt;
Dragaera/Steven Brust: <http://dragaera.info/&gt;
Anonymous
January 3, 2005 7:26:43 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Sun, 02 Jan 2005 20:09:31 -0600, David Dyer-Bennet <dd-b@dd-b.net>
wrote:

>"Robert Scott" <desmobob@earthlink.net> writes:
>
>> "martin" <martin@rcflyers.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
>> news:41d831f7@news.greennet.net...
>>>I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually, it
>>>does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
>>>point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or
>>>less) thanks.
>
>> I use the Maha charger. It has four indidual charging ciruits. It will
>> fast or slow charge, then switch to trickle/maint. charge. It comes with a
>> 12V DC adapter for automotive use, too.
>
>Sounds like you're describing the MH-C401FS, which I have and think is
>a great charger.
>
>And you can get it with an international AC adapter, that just needs
>plug converters to work anywhere in the world.

I have a Maha charger for AA NiMH batteries. It's pretty good with
Maha batteries, but I was sorry to discover on our most recent journey
that it will *not* recharge my Panasonic NiMH batteries. The charger
simply refuses to recognize that there are batteries in it, when I
insert the Panasonics.

I don't know which model I have (and it's out in the caravan and I
have the flu :-( so I'm not going out there to check). But do be
aware of that potential issue ...


B
Anonymous
January 3, 2005 8:35:28 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"martin" <martin@rcflyers.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
news:41d831f7@news.greennet.net...
>I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually, it
>does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
>point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or
>less) thanks.

Check this out, http://www1.tpgi.com.au/users/p8king/rezap.htm

John Mares
Anonymous
January 3, 2005 12:24:28 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Sun, 02 Jan 2005 13:44:01 +0000, martin wrote:

> I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually, it
> does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
> point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or
> less) thanks.

Maplin have a bunch:
<http://www.maplin.co.uk/search.aspx?MenuNo=1256&MenuNam...;

I have one of these:
<http://www.maplin.co.uk/Module.aspx?ModuleNo=35352&TabI...;

If I was buying again, I would give extra consideration to chargers that
have a cover and a fan to cool the batteries as they are charged.

Best Regards,
Alex.
--
Alex Butcher Brainbench MVP for Internet Security: www.brainbench.com
Bristol, UK Need reliable and secure network systems?
PGP/GnuPG ID:0x271fd950 <http://www.assursys.com/&gt;
Anonymous
January 3, 2005 6:09:50 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Ed Ruf" <egruf_usenet@cox.net> wrote in message
news:r3ggt0psv81pdppnpehaket0crhrkvnjfg@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 2 Jan 2005 13:44:01 -0000, in rec.photo.digital "martin"
> <martin@rcflyers.fsnet.co.uk> wrote:
>
> >I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually,
it
> >does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
> >point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or
less)
> >thanks.
>
> Maha MH-C401FS 100 Minute Cool Battery Charger
> http://thomas-distributing.com/mhc401fs.htm
>
> ________________________________________________________
> Ed Ruf Lifetime AMA# 344007 (Usenet@EdwardG.Ruf.com)
> See images taken with my CP-990/5700 & D70 at
> http://EdwardGRuf.com

I also have the Maha 401 and love it. Note that it also
has a 5 hour charge mode (little switch on the side of the
charger selects 100 minute or 5 hour). If you get it with
the adapters, you can also use it in your car. Never
had a problem getting it to recognize any batteries, but
have not tried the Panasonic ones either that another
poster complained about.

mikey
Anonymous
January 3, 2005 7:32:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

<nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:j5iht0tivdnd4gilf89q5hdbn8s932aejk@4ax.com...
> On Sun, 02 Jan 2005 20:09:31 -0600, David Dyer-Bennet <dd-b@dd-b.net>
> wrote:
>
> >"Robert Scott" <desmobob@earthlink.net> writes:
> >
> >> "martin" <martin@rcflyers.fsnet.co.uk> wrote in message
> >> news:41d831f7@news.greennet.net...
> >>>I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually,
it
> >>>does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
> >>>point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or
> >>>less) thanks.
> >
> >> I use the Maha charger. It has four indidual charging ciruits. It
will
> >> fast or slow charge, then switch to trickle/maint. charge. It comes
with a
> >> 12V DC adapter for automotive use, too.
> >
> >Sounds like you're describing the MH-C401FS, which I have and think is
> >a great charger.
> >
> >And you can get it with an international AC adapter, that just needs
> >plug converters to work anywhere in the world.
>
> I have a Maha charger for AA NiMH batteries. It's pretty good with
> Maha batteries, but I was sorry to discover on our most recent journey
> that it will *not* recharge my Panasonic NiMH batteries. The charger
> simply refuses to recognize that there are batteries in it, when I
> insert the Panasonics.
>
> I don't know which model I have (and it's out in the caravan and I
> have the flu :-( so I'm not going out there to check). But do be
> aware of that potential issue ...

Could it be that your Panasonic NiMHs were completely discharged? Measure
their open-circuit voltage to verify. Some chargers do not detect cells
unless they show a certain minimum voltage. My workaround: Use any trickle
charger for an initial charge (usually half an hour is sufficient), then put
them into your Maha charger.
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 12:48:51 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

David Dyer-Bennet <dd-b@dd-b.net> wrote:
>
>> I use the Maha charger. It has four indidual charging ciruits. It will
>> fast or slow charge, then switch to trickle/maint. charge. It comes with
>> a 12V DC adapter for automotive use, too.
>
> Sounds like you're describing the MH-C401FS, which I have and think is
> a great charger.
>
> And you can get it with an international AC adapter, that just needs
> plug converters to work anywhere in the world.

Why does the MH-C401FS lack the "battery reconditioning" option,
which the less expensive MH-C204W provided?

Is it considered just as good to drain NiMHs with a flash or something?
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 5:29:48 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bill Tuthill <can@spam.co> writes:

> David Dyer-Bennet <dd-b@dd-b.net> wrote:
>>
>>> I use the Maha charger. It has four indidual charging ciruits. It will
>>> fast or slow charge, then switch to trickle/maint. charge. It comes with
>>> a 12V DC adapter for automotive use, too.
>>
>> Sounds like you're describing the MH-C401FS, which I have and think is
>> a great charger.
>>
>> And you can get it with an international AC adapter, that just needs
>> plug converters to work anywhere in the world.
>
> Why does the MH-C401FS lack the "battery reconditioning" option,
> which the less expensive MH-C204W provided?
>
> Is it considered just as good to drain NiMHs with a flash or something?

The literature with the C401FS seemed to claim that with the "pulse
charging" circuitry it was no longer useful or necessary to drain the
batteries.
--
David Dyer-Bennet, <mailto:D d-b@dd-b.net>, <http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/&gt;
RKBA: <http://noguns-nomoney.com/&gt; <http://www.dd-b.net/carry/&gt;
Pics: <http://dd-b.lighthunters.net/&gt; <http://www.dd-b.net/dd-b/SnapshotAlbum/&gt;
Dragaera/Steven Brust: <http://dragaera.info/&gt;
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 6:46:22 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

martin wrote:

> I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually, it
> does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
> point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or less)
> thanks.

Look at the Panasonic BQ-830. This is the best AA NiMH charger on the
market today, as well as being one of the least expensive, thanks to Costco.

Features:

-Individual charging circuits (1,2,3, or 4 cells at a time).

-Three input sources.

It comes with a car cord and an AC adapter. It also can be plugged into
a USB port (charging from the 5V/0.5A supplied by a USB port), though I
think it may charge slower on USB. USB cable is not included.

The USB input is a very thoughtful feature, since if you're travelling
with a notebook PC it means not carrying the heavy AC adapter. Also you
can buy a very small AC to USB converter and/or DC to USB converter and
accept the lower charge rate while travelling. I haven't seen any other
charger with this feature.

-LCD display which indicates charge status of each cell. I haven't seen
any other charger with this feature.

-Senses internal cell resistance, temperature, and voltage level, to
know when cells are fully charged.

In the U.S., it is $25 at Costco, and includes eight Panasonic 2300mA AA
cells and two Panasonic 780mA AAA cells.

Not sure if the UK Costco's carry it, but I've been in Costcos in
several countries, and the product selection (aside from the food) is
pretty similar.

"http://www.costco.com/Warehouse/Location.aspx?country=U..."

The Panasonic BQ-830 is much better than the Maha MH-C401FS ($59 with
twelve AA batteries, see
"http://thomas-distributing.com/mhc401fs_buy.php3").

One other good one is the Ansmann Powerline 4 Traveller Microcontrolled
Ultra Quick Charger, but this is much more expensive ($82 with 4 AA
batteries from Adorama, see
"http://www.adorama.com/ANC4T.html?searchinfo=ansmann&it..."), and
not widely available (at least in the U.S.). Also, in the U.S. there is
a general boycott of Ansmann products in the photographic community, due
to the behaviour of their U.S. distributor.
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 7:00:51 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Steven M. Scharf wrote:

> martin wrote:
>
>> I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell
>> individually, it does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will
>> be fine. Can anyone point me in the right direction for one of these
>> please (prefer £30 or less) thanks.
>
>
> Look at the Panasonic BQ-830. This is the best AA NiMH charger on the
> market today, as well as being one of the least expensive, thanks to
> Costco.

<snip>

You can see the BQ-830 at

"https://www.brandnamebatteries.com/product_info.php?man..."

though they are more expensive than Costco.
Anonymous
January 4, 2005 9:46:22 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bill Tuthill wrote:
> David Dyer-Bennet <dd-b@dd-b.net> wrote:
>
>>>I use the Maha charger. It has four indidual charging ciruits. It will
>>>fast or slow charge, then switch to trickle/maint. charge. It comes with
>>>a 12V DC adapter for automotive use, too.
>>
>>Sounds like you're describing the MH-C401FS, which I have and think is
>>a great charger.
>>
>>And you can get it with an international AC adapter, that just needs
>>plug converters to work anywhere in the world.
>
>
> Why does the MH-C401FS lack the "battery reconditioning" option,
> which the less expensive MH-C204W provided?
>
> Is it considered just as good to drain NiMHs with a flash or something?
>
Because the 401 is for NIMH batteries, where conditioning is not required.
January 5, 2005 7:19:45 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Steven M. Scharf wrote:
> martin wrote:
>
> > I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell
individually, it
> > does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can
anyone
> > point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer
£30 or less)
> > thanks.
>
> Look at the Panasonic BQ-830. This is the best AA NiMH charger on the

> market today, as well as being one of the least expensive, thanks to
Costco.
>
> Features:
>
> -Individual charging circuits (1,2,3, or 4 cells at a time).
>
> -Three input sources.
>
> It comes with a car cord and an AC adapter. It also can be plugged
into
> a USB port (charging from the 5V/0.5A supplied by a USB port), though
I
> think it may charge slower on USB. USB cable is not included.
>
> The USB input is a very thoughtful feature, since if you're
travelling
> with a notebook PC it means not carrying the heavy AC adapter. Also
you
> can buy a very small AC to USB converter and/or DC to USB converter
and
> accept the lower charge rate while travelling. I haven't seen any
other
> charger with this feature.
>
> -LCD display which indicates charge status of each cell. I haven't
seen
> any other charger with this feature.
>
> -Senses internal cell resistance, temperature, and voltage level, to
> know when cells are fully charged.
>
> In the U.S., it is $25 at Costco, and includes eight Panasonic 2300mA
AA
> cells and two Panasonic 780mA AAA cells.
>
> Not sure if the UK Costco's carry it, but I've been in Costcos in
> several countries, and the product selection (aside from the food) is

> pretty similar.
>
>
"http://www.costco.com/Warehouse/Location.aspx?country=U..."
>
> The Panasonic BQ-830 is much better than the Maha MH-C401FS ($59 with

> twelve AA batteries, see
> "http://thomas-distributing.com/mhc401fs_buy.php3").
>
> One other good one is the Ansmann Powerline 4 Traveller
Microcontrolled
> Ultra Quick Charger, but this is much more expensive ($82 with 4 AA
> batteries from Adorama, see
> "http://www.adorama.com/ANC4T.html?searchinfo=ansmann&it..."),
and
> not widely available (at least in the U.S.). Also, in the U.S. there
is
> a general boycott of Ansmann products in the photographic community,
due
> to the behaviour of their U.S. distributor.
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 10:29:16 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <1104927585.226525.17520@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com>,
bob@hpmarketingcorp.com wrote:

> Steven M. Scharf wrote:
> > martin wrote:
> >
> > > I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell
> individually, it
> > > does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can
> anyone
> > > point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer
> £30 or less)
> > > thanks.
> >
> > Look at the Panasonic BQ-830. This is the best AA NiMH charger on the
>
> > market today, as well as being one of the least expensive, thanks to
> Costco.
> >
> > Features:
> >
> > -Individual charging circuits (1,2,3, or 4 cells at a time).
> >
> > -Three input sources.
> >
> > It comes with a car cord and an AC adapter. It also can be plugged
> into
> > a USB port (charging from the 5V/0.5A supplied by a USB port), though
> I
> > think it may charge slower on USB. USB cable is not included.
> >
> > The USB input is a very thoughtful feature, since if you're
> travelling
> > with a notebook PC it means not carrying the heavy AC adapter. Also
> you
> > can buy a very small AC to USB converter and/or DC to USB converter
> and
> > accept the lower charge rate while travelling. I haven't seen any
> other
> > charger with this feature.
> >
> > -LCD display which indicates charge status of each cell. I haven't
> seen
> > any other charger with this feature.
> >
> > -Senses internal cell resistance, temperature, and voltage level, to
> > know when cells are fully charged.
> >
> > In the U.S., it is $25 at Costco, and includes eight Panasonic 2300mA
> AA
> > cells and two Panasonic 780mA AAA cells.
> >
> > Not sure if the UK Costco's carry it, but I've been in Costcos in
> > several countries, and the product selection (aside from the food) is
>
> > pretty similar.
> >
> >
> "http://www.costco.com/Warehouse/Location.aspx?country=U..."
> >
> > The Panasonic BQ-830 is much better than the Maha MH-C401FS ($59 with
>
> > twelve AA batteries, see
> > "http://thomas-distributing.com/mhc401fs buy.php3").
> >
> > One other good one is the Ansmann Powerline 4 Traveller
> Microcontrolled
> > Ultra Quick Charger, but this is much more expensive ($82 with 4 AA
> > batteries from Adorama, see
> > "http://www.adorama.com/ANC4T.html?searchinfo=ansmann&it... no=11"),
> and
> > not widely available (at least in the U.S.). Also, in the U.S. there
> is
> > a general boycott of Ansmann products in the photographic community,
> due
> > to the behaviour of their U.S. distributor.

"but eBay didn't care about the legalities
of it, nor did the poster from HP Marketing. For this reason I am always
warning people to avoid all products from HP Marketing, including Ansmann
batteries and chargers."

If you have a problem with Ebay regulations then you should discuss it
with Ebay. Not here.

If you have a problem with U.S. Customs and U.S. Trademark law discuss
it with your Senators or Congress representative.

"Also, in the U.S. there
> is
> > a general boycott of Ansmann products in the photographic community,
> due
> > to the behaviour of their U.S. distributor."

A one man crusade is far from a "general boycott"

And lastly read the post. The O.P. is asking about the U.K. not the U.S.
While we would be happy to have a U.S. camera store or Ansmann dealer
like Thomas Distributing or other internet dealer sell him an Ansmann
unit to a non U.S.A. customer it would be far more convenient for him to
simply buy one in the U.K. as that way it comes with the U.K. plug
rather then a U.S. plug.

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 11:26:17 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Ron Hunter <rphunter@charter.net> wrote:
>>
>> Why does the Maha MH-C401FS lack the "battery reconditioning" option,
>> which the less expensive MH-C204W provided?
>>
> Because the 401 is for NIMH batteries, where conditioning is not required.

On the contrary, most seemingly-reputable web sources recommend
conditioning once or several times at the beginning of NiMH lifecycle,
and towards end-of-life to revive them. Here's one such:

http://h50093.www5.hp.com/createuse/learning/batteries_...
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 7:03:41 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bob Salomon wrote:

<snip>

Bob, you took advantage of eBay's naievte regarding the sale of used
equipment. No one disputes that your company has the exclusive right to
sell new equipment in the U.S., but the sale of used equipment isn't
covered by this.
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 7:03:42 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <xdUCd.1021$v76.357@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
"Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:

> Bob Salomon wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
> Bob, you took advantage of eBay's naievte regarding the sale of used
> equipment. No one disputes that your company has the exclusive right to
> sell new equipment in the U.S., but the sale of used equipment isn't
> covered by this.

First Ebay is not naive. They have specific rules for sellers regarding
Trademarked goods. Not new or used. Trademarks. It is very easy for a
seller, anywhere in the world, to access the rules.

Ebay is not the only auction site/sales site that observes these rules.
AOL also has similar rules.

If you want to change the rules then you have to go to the people who
make them. That is, in this case, Ebay as the selling site, and
Washington as the people who write the Trademark laws.

All we do is report what appears to be a violation of our Trademark to
Ebay. Weather a listing is or is not cancelled is the decision of Ebay's
VERO department.

There have been listings that they have not cancelled. The decision does
not, repeat, involve the condition of the item. It is a question of the
Trademark on the item.

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 7:03:43 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Excuse me for my ignorance regarding the arcane Trademark laws, but just so
I don't ever try to sell something on eBay that violates those strictures,
can you please enlighten us about the issue being discussed. Under what
conditions can I not sell some used item?


"Bob Salomon" <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:bob_salomon-747420.13252705012005@news.isp.giganews.com...
> In article <xdUCd.1021$v76.357@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
> "Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:
>
>> Bob Salomon wrote:
>>
>> <snip>
>>
>> Bob, you took advantage of eBay's naievte regarding the sale of used
>> equipment. No one disputes that your company has the exclusive right to
>> sell new equipment in the U.S., but the sale of used equipment isn't
>> covered by this.
>
> First Ebay is not naive. They have specific rules for sellers regarding
> Trademarked goods. Not new or used. Trademarks. It is very easy for a
> seller, anywhere in the world, to access the rules.
>
> Ebay is not the only auction site/sales site that observes these rules.
> AOL also has similar rules.
>
> If you want to change the rules then you have to go to the people who
> make them. That is, in this case, Ebay as the selling site, and
> Washington as the people who write the Trademark laws.
>
> All we do is report what appears to be a violation of our Trademark to
> Ebay. Weather a listing is or is not cancelled is the decision of Ebay's
> VERO department.
>
> There have been listings that they have not cancelled. The decision does
> not, repeat, involve the condition of the item. It is a question of the
> Trademark on the item.
>
> --
> To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 7:12:35 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

martin wrote:

> I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell individually, it
> does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
> point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30 or less)
> thanks.

I put together a little web site with four NiMH chargers.

See http://nordicgroup.us/chargers

Please e-mail me with any other recommended chargers, or if any of the
data in the table is incorrect, scharf.steven@linkearth.net, but change
linkearth.net to earthlink.net.
Anonymous
January 5, 2005 11:35:29 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <1104970015.fc7a6d32002941868141e665cae81cc8@teranews>,
"rhodo chrosite" <rhodochrosite@hot.mail.com> wrote:

> Excuse me for my ignorance regarding the arcane Trademark laws, but just so
> I don't ever try to sell something on eBay that violates those strictures,
> can you please enlighten us about the issue being discussed. Under what
> conditions can I not sell some used item?
>
>
> "Bob Salomon" <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote in message
> news:bob_salomon-747420.13252705012005@news.isp.giganews.com...
> > In article <xdUCd.1021$v76.357@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
> > "Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Bob Salomon wrote:
> >>
> >> <snip>
> >>
> >> Bob, you took advantage of eBay's naievte regarding the sale of used
> >> equipment. No one disputes that your company has the exclusive right to
> >> sell new equipment in the U.S., but the sale of used equipment isn't
> >> covered by this.
> >
> > First Ebay is not naive. They have specific rules for sellers regarding
> > Trademarked goods. Not new or used. Trademarks. It is very easy for a
> > seller, anywhere in the world, to access the rules.
> >
> > Ebay is not the only auction site/sales site that observes these rules.
> > AOL also has similar rules.
> >
> > If you want to change the rules then you have to go to the people who
> > make them. That is, in this case, Ebay as the selling site, and
> > Washington as the people who write the Trademark laws.
> >
> > All we do is report what appears to be a violation of our Trademark to
> > Ebay. Weather a listing is or is not cancelled is the decision of Ebay's
> > VERO department.
> >
> > There have been listings that they have not cancelled. The decision does
> > not, repeat, involve the condition of the item. It is a question of the
> > Trademark on the item.
> >
> > --
> > To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.

You can not offer to sell a Heliopan item to someone in the USA by
someone who is not in the USA without our written permission as the
owner of the Trademark in the USA.
US Customs has the authority to seize and destroy any Heliopan items
they may find being imported to the USA without our written permission.

Ebay will not allow any listings that would violate the Trademark by
offering to sell a Heliopan item that has to be imported to the USA.

Listings by people inside the USA to sell a Heliopan item are fine as
are listings by people outside the USA as long as the listings from
outside the USA are not offered to people in the USA.

There are similar restrictions on Ebay for other products protected by a
Trademark or Copyright. For full details on Ebay's policies see their
rules on selling Trademarked or Copyrighted materials on their web site.

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 6:39:29 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

rhodo chrosite wrote:

> Excuse me for my ignorance regarding the arcane Trademark laws, but
just so
> I don't ever try to sell something on eBay that violates those
strictures,
> can you please enlighten us about the issue being discussed. Under what
> conditions can I not sell some used item?

Sorry to have brought this up, but in doing a review of NiMH battery
chargers, I felt that I should enlighten buyers of some of the
photographic community's avoidance of all products marketed by HP
Marketing, one of which is Ansmann chargers (only in the U.S.).

Here’s the scoop. HPMarketing monitors eBay auctions. If anyone attempts
to sell something that contains a product distributed by HPMarketing,
they contact eBay and demand that the auction be cancelled. For example,
someone was selling a used lens, with a used hood, and the hood was a
Heliopan hood. HP Marketing is the exclusive U.S. importer for Heliopan.
HP Marketing complained to eBay, and eBay removed the listing. HP
Marketing would not even discuss the issue with the seller.

You can see the list of products imported by HP Marketing at
http://www.hpmarketingcorp.com/
January 6, 2005 6:39:30 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote in
news:Rp2Dd.1551$Pm6.598@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net:

>
> Sorry to have brought this up, but in doing a review of NiMH battery
> chargers, I felt that I should enlighten buyers of some of the
> photographic community's avoidance of all products marketed by HP
> Marketing, one of which is Ansmann chargers (only in the U.S.).
>
> Here's the scoop. HPMarketing monitors eBay auctions. If anyone
> attempts to sell something that contains a product distributed by
> HPMarketing, they contact eBay and demand that the auction be
> cancelled. For example, someone was selling a used lens, with a used
> hood, and the hood was a Heliopan hood. HP Marketing is the exclusive
> U.S. importer for Heliopan. HP Marketing complained to eBay, and eBay
> removed the listing. HP Marketing would not even discuss the issue
> with the seller.
>
> You can see the list of products imported by HP Marketing at
> http://www.hpmarketingcorp.com/

That sounds akin to Nikon USA blocking sales of used Nikon cameras. I'd be
really curious to find out how that was a trademark violation.

Bob

--
Delete the inverse SPAM to reply
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 6:39:30 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <Rp2Dd.1551$Pm6.598@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
"Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:

> rhodo chrosite wrote:
>
> > Excuse me for my ignorance regarding the arcane Trademark laws, but
> just so
> > I don't ever try to sell something on eBay that violates those
> strictures,
> > can you please enlighten us about the issue being discussed. Under what
> > conditions can I not sell some used item?
>
> Sorry to have brought this up, but in doing a review of NiMH battery
> chargers, I felt that I should enlighten buyers of some of the
> photographic community's avoidance of all products marketed by HP
> Marketing, one of which is Ansmann chargers (only in the U.S.).
>
> Here¹s the scoop. HPMarketing monitors eBay auctions. If anyone attempts
> to sell something that contains a product distributed by HPMarketing,
> they contact eBay and demand that the auction be cancelled. For example,
> someone was selling a used lens, with a used hood, and the hood was a
> Heliopan hood. HP Marketing is the exclusive U.S. importer for Heliopan.
> HP Marketing complained to eBay, and eBay removed the listing. HP
> Marketing would not even discuss the issue with the seller.
>
> You can see the list of products imported by HP Marketing at
> http://www.hpmarketingcorp.com/

We always discuss the issue with the seller. Every message from Ebay has
our phone number in it so they can discuss it.

In the example you gave they could have simply made 2 listings. One with
the complete lens less the hood for world wide sale and one for the hood
only for sale anywhere but the USA.

Apparently this individual did not call. Otherwise we would have
discussed it with them.

Had they Emailed us they would have been Emailed a snyopsis of the
requirements and a reference to Ebay's policies.

And, lastly, why are you involved?

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 6:46:08 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

martin wrote:
> I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell
individually, it
> does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will be fine. Can anyone
> point me in the right direction for one of these please (prefer £30
or less)
> thanks.

Since you're in the UK, take a look at
http://www.tantronics.co.uk/acatalog/GP_PowerBank_U_Sma... though
it's more than £30.

The Power Bank Smart 2 is also good at £34, see:
http://www.tantronics.co.uk/acatalog/GP_PowerBank_Smart...

Also see the FameArt which is £24 with no batteries, see:
http://www.tantronics.co.uk/acatalog/fameart_pc07.html, though I've
never heard of FameArt.
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 7:51:30 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

bob wrote:

> "Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote in

> That sounds akin to Nikon USA blocking sales of used Nikon cameras. I'd be
> really curious to find out how that was a trademark violation.

Especially because there was no way that HPMarketing knew one way or
another where the hood on that lens was purchased. eBay doesn't
investigate; they simply cancel the auction.

So stupid for HPMarketing to piss off their customer base for such a
non-issue. Now if someone was importing new product and trying to sell
in the U.S., they'd have something legitimate to complain about.
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 7:51:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <mt3Dd.1806$v76.975@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
"Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:

> Especially because there was no way that HPMarketing knew one way or
> another where the hood on that lens was purchased. eBay doesn't
> investigate; they simply cancel the auction.

Again.

The sale is stopped because a Heliopan branded item is being offered for
sale by importing it to the USA.

It is immaterial where it was originally purchased. The only fact know
absolutely is that it was not made in the USA it originated in Germany.

There is also no way of knowing, without inspecting, that all items
listed as new are in fact new or all listed as used, like new, never
used, demo, perfect, etc are not in fact new.

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 7:54:15 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Steven M. Scharf wrote:

> martin wrote:
>
>> I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell
>> individually, it does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will
>> be fine. Can anyone point me in the right direction for one of these
>> please (prefer £30 or less) thanks.
>
>
> I put together a little web site with four NiMH chargers.
>
> See http://nordicgroup.us/chargers

I added two more, so now there are six. The fastest one is not sold in
the U.S. yet.
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 7:54:16 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <Xv3Dd.1809$v76.1019@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
"Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:

> Steven M. Scharf wrote:
>
> > martin wrote:
> >
> >> I am looking for a AA Nimh charger that charges each cell
> >> individually, it does not have to be a rapid charger, 2-5 hours will
> >> be fine. Can anyone point me in the right direction for one of these
> >> please (prefer £30 or less) thanks.
> >
> >
> > I put together a little web site with four NiMH chargers.
> >
> > See http://nordicgroup.us/chargers
>
> I added two more, so now there are six. The fastest one is not sold in
> the U.S. yet.

You seemed to have missed the fan cooled one hour AC/DC Ansmann
Digispeed and the new 10 minute 4.3A output, fan cooled Ansmann
Digispeed Ultra.

Too bad the info on them to you bounced back yesterday.

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
January 6, 2005 9:18:59 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote in news:bob_salomon-
39B245.03204506012005@news.isp.giganews.com:

> In article <mt3Dd.1806$v76.975@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
> "Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:
>
>> Especially because there was no way that HPMarketing knew one way or
>> another where the hood on that lens was purchased. eBay doesn't
>> investigate; they simply cancel the auction.
>
> Again.
>
> The sale is stopped because a Heliopan branded item is being offered for
> sale by importing it to the USA.
>
> It is immaterial where it was originally purchased. The only fact know
> absolutely is that it was not made in the USA it originated in Germany.
>
> There is also no way of knowing, without inspecting, that all items
> listed as new are in fact new or all listed as used, like new, never
> used, demo, perfect, etc are not in fact new.
>

I guess I'm going to side with Steven on this issue. Based on your post,
you are assuming everyone is guilty. I mean, if you saw the same seller
selling the same item week after week, that would be one thing. Or one
seller with a whole bunch of stuff. Or something similar.

Out of curiosity, can you cite the relavant section of code that you imply
in your previous post? It seems really dubious that such protection would
actually exist.

I'll stick with B+W.

Bob

--
Delete the inverse SPAM to reply
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 10:33:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <Xns95D64A948AAA1bobatcarolnet@216.196.97.142>,
bob <usenetMAPS@2fiddles.com> wrote:

> Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote in news:bob_salomon-
> 39B245.03204506012005@news.isp.giganews.com:
>
> > In article <mt3Dd.1806$v76.975@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
> > "Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Especially because there was no way that HPMarketing knew one way or
> >> another where the hood on that lens was purchased. eBay doesn't
> >> investigate; they simply cancel the auction.
> >
> > Again.
> >
> > The sale is stopped because a Heliopan branded item is being offered for
> > sale by importing it to the USA.
> >
> > It is immaterial where it was originally purchased. The only fact know
> > absolutely is that it was not made in the USA it originated in Germany.
> >
> > There is also no way of knowing, without inspecting, that all items
> > listed as new are in fact new or all listed as used, like new, never
> > used, demo, perfect, etc are not in fact new.
> >
>
> I guess I'm going to side with Steven on this issue. Based on your post,
> you are assuming everyone is guilty. I mean, if you saw the same seller
> selling the same item week after week, that would be one thing. Or one
> seller with a whole bunch of stuff. Or something similar.
>
> Out of curiosity, can you cite the relavant section of code that you imply
> in your previous post? It seems really dubious that such protection would
> actually exist.
>
> I'll stick with B+W.
>
> Bob

Again. Ask Ebay. It is their rules.

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
January 6, 2005 10:33:32 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote in
news:bob_salomon-2B7E60.07333106012005@news.isp.giganews.com:

> In article <Xns95D64A948AAA1bobatcarolnet@216.196.97.142>,
> bob <usenetMAPS@2fiddles.com> wrote:
>
>> Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote in news:bob_salomon-
>> 39B245.03204506012005@news.isp.giganews.com:
>>
>> > In article <mt3Dd.1806$v76.975@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
>> > "Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:
>> >
>> >> Especially because there was no way that HPMarketing knew one way
>> >> or another where the hood on that lens was purchased. eBay doesn't
>> >> investigate; they simply cancel the auction.
>> >
>> > Again.
>> >
>> > The sale is stopped because a Heliopan branded item is being
>> > offered for sale by importing it to the USA.
>> >
>> > It is immaterial where it was originally purchased. The only fact
>> > know absolutely is that it was not made in the USA it originated in
>> > Germany.
>> >
>> > There is also no way of knowing, without inspecting, that all items
>> > listed as new are in fact new or all listed as used, like new,
>> > never used, demo, perfect, etc are not in fact new.
>> >
>>
>> I guess I'm going to side with Steven on this issue. Based on your
>> post, you are assuming everyone is guilty. I mean, if you saw the
>> same seller selling the same item week after week, that would be one
>> thing. Or one seller with a whole bunch of stuff. Or something
>> similar.
>>
>> Out of curiosity, can you cite the relavant section of code that you
>> imply in your previous post? It seems really dubious that such
>> protection would actually exist.
>>
>> I'll stick with B+W.
>>
>> Bob
>
> Again. Ask Ebay. It is their rules.
>

You said the Congress of the United States had passed laws. I have asked
which laws. Or are you just blowing smoke?

Since you've brought up Ebay, are you claiming that Ebay has a rule that
prohibits selling any goods with trademarked names? Can you cite the
rule?

The only thing I could find related to trademark was this:
http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/trademark.html

A small quote:

"Trademark laws are primarily designed to protect consumers from
confusing one company's goods or services with those of another."

It sounds like you're just abusing Ebay's overly conservative nature --
it's easier for them to pull the plug on an auction than to fight about
it.

If your argument has any teeth at all, then why does Nikon USA allow B&H
and others to sell grey market Nikon cameras?

Bob

--
Delete the inverse SPAM to reply
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 12:26:30 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote:
>> Steven M. Scharf wrote:
>> >
>> > See http://nordicgroup.us/chargers
>>
>> I added two more, so now there are six. The fastest one is not sold
>> in the U.S. yet.
>
> You seemed to have missed the fan cooled one hour AC/DC Ansmann
> Digispeed and the new 10 minute 4.3A output, fan cooled Ansmann
> Digispeed Ultra.

Don't those cost more than $70, which Steven's web page clearly says
is the cut-off point? Froogle says $99 for the non-Ultra.
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 12:37:15 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <Xns95D64FBA4F6D2bobatcarolnet@216.196.97.142>,
bob <usenetMAPS@2fiddles.com> wrote:

> Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote in
> news:bob_salomon-2B7E60.07333106012005@news.isp.giganews.com:
>
> > In article <Xns95D64A948AAA1bobatcarolnet@216.196.97.142>,
> > bob <usenetMAPS@2fiddles.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote in news:bob_salomon-
> >> 39B245.03204506012005@news.isp.giganews.com:
> >>
> >> > In article <mt3Dd.1806$v76.975@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net>,
> >> > "Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote:
> >> >
> >> >> Especially because there was no way that HPMarketing knew one way
> >> >> or another where the hood on that lens was purchased. eBay doesn't
> >> >> investigate; they simply cancel the auction.
> >> >
> >> > Again.
> >> >
> >> > The sale is stopped because a Heliopan branded item is being
> >> > offered for sale by importing it to the USA.
> >> >
> >> > It is immaterial where it was originally purchased. The only fact
> >> > know absolutely is that it was not made in the USA it originated in
> >> > Germany.
> >> >
> >> > There is also no way of knowing, without inspecting, that all items
> >> > listed as new are in fact new or all listed as used, like new,
> >> > never used, demo, perfect, etc are not in fact new.
> >> >
> >>
> >> I guess I'm going to side with Steven on this issue. Based on your
> >> post, you are assuming everyone is guilty. I mean, if you saw the
> >> same seller selling the same item week after week, that would be one
> >> thing. Or one seller with a whole bunch of stuff. Or something
> >> similar.
> >>
> >> Out of curiosity, can you cite the relavant section of code that you
> >> imply in your previous post? It seems really dubious that such
> >> protection would actually exist.
> >>
> >> I'll stick with B+W.
> >>
> >> Bob
> >
> > Again. Ask Ebay. It is their rules.
> >
>
> You said the Congress of the United States had passed laws. I have asked
> which laws. Or are you just blowing smoke?
>
> Since you've brought up Ebay, are you claiming that Ebay has a rule that
> prohibits selling any goods with trademarked names? Can you cite the
> rule?
>
> The only thing I could find related to trademark was this:
> http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/trademark.html
>
> A small quote:
>
> "Trademark laws are primarily designed to protect consumers from
> confusing one company's goods or services with those of another."
>
> It sounds like you're just abusing Ebay's overly conservative nature --
> it's easier for them to pull the plug on an auction than to fight about
> it.
>
> If your argument has any teeth at all, then why does Nikon USA allow B&H
> and others to sell grey market Nikon cameras?
>
> Bob
http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/listing-copyrights....
http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/trademark.html

Our Heliopan Trademark is registered with the Intellectual Property
Rights Branch of the US Customs Service under registration number
1,650,631 dated 1/4/2002.

" why does Nikon USA allow B&H
> and others to sell grey market Nikon cameras?

You did not read fully and understand my post.

We are not a subsidiary of the foreign factory that manufactures the
product. We are not owned by and Heliopan has no financial interest in
our company. As such we are allowed to register the Trademark we own
(Heliopan) with US Customs.

If the official US importer is owned by the foreign factory, or is a
subsidiary of that company, they can not register their name with US
Customs in order to control "gray" market products bearing their name.

That means that most camera companies importing 35mm, digital or medium
format products are not able to stop parallel imports by utilizing US
Customs. Some camera companies that are subsidiaries of their foreign
owned factories are: Nikon, Canon, Minolta-Konica, Pentax, Hasselblad,
Sinar, Broncolor, Foba. If a parallel importer can find a source for
these items they can import them and offer them as "gray" market items.

On the other hand there are product lines that are imported by companies
that are not subsidiaries of the factories that manufacture the products
AND the US importer owns the trademark on these items. Some of these are
Heliopan, Mamiya, Sekonic, Toyo.

Then there are products that are imported by companies that are neither
a subsidiary of the factory that made them and whose importer either
does not own the trademark or has decided not to register the trademark
or there are multiple importers for products from that factory for
different markets so one company in the US would normally not own the
Trademark.

These items may be offered on the "gray" market.

In the case of Trademarks that are owned by a US company and registered
with US Customs parallel imports would be called "black" market as
opposed to "gray" market.

Following is an excerpt from an IP attorney regarding this particular
subject which he posted last time this was brought up.

"trademark owners are forced to take what look like unreasonable steps
to preserve their position in the controversy. They feel they must take
a strong stand on every apparent instance of unauthorized importation,
lest they be accused of ³waiving² the protection that they have spent
millions trying to get the courts to recognize. It unfortunate that
people like the Photo.net contributor get entangled in this stuff,
especially since I personally agree with the Customs Service on the
issue. But, life does have its speed bumps, and this one hardly seems
worth the emotion that it has generated. "

In other words we must use our Trademark rights and protect them so we
do not lose them.

No one is stopping anyone from selling Heliopan on Ebay. At the moment
there are at least 35 Heliopan sales or sales of equipment that include
a Heliopan item being offered on Ebay in the USA from people in the USA.

What is stopped are people from outside the USA offering a Heliopan to
the USA. Those people are free to offer their item anywhere else on Ebay.

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
Anonymous
January 6, 2005 3:41:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <41dd74c5@news.meer.net>, Bill Tuthill <can@spam.co> wrote:

> Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote:
> >> Steven M. Scharf wrote:
> >> >
> >> > See http://nordicgroup.us/chargers
> >>
> >> I added two more, so now there are six. The fastest one is not sold
> >> in the U.S. yet.
> >
> > You seemed to have missed the fan cooled one hour AC/DC Ansmann
> > Digispeed and the new 10 minute 4.3A output, fan cooled Ansmann
> > Digispeed Ultra.
>
> Don't those cost more than $70, which Steven's web page clearly says
> is the cut-off point? Froogle says $99 for the non-Ultra.

The retail price is set by the retailer. It varies. So it all depends on
whom you buy it from. The new Digispeed Ultra will actually slightly
less expensive.

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
January 7, 2005 1:08:25 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Bill Tuthill" <can@spam.co> wrote in message news:41dd74c5@news.meer.net...
> Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote:
> >> Steven M. Scharf wrote:
> >> >
> >> > See http://nordicgroup.us/chargers
> >>
> >> I added two more, so now there are six. The fastest one is not sold
> >> in the U.S. yet.
> >
> > You seemed to have missed the fan cooled one hour AC/DC Ansmann
> > Digispeed and the new 10 minute 4.3A output, fan cooled Ansmann
> > Digispeed Ultra.
>
> Don't those cost more than $70, which Steven's web page clearly says
> is the cut-off point? Froogle says $99 for the non-Ultra.
>
>
Why not the RayOVac I-C3 15 Minute Charger? Charges four of their I-C3
NiMH (2000mAH) batteries in 15 minutes and will also charge standard NiMH
batteries in their standard charge time. I think I paid about $25 for mine
(with
2 AA batteries included) while they were running a promotion that got me a
free
car adapter for it as well. It works great...what does the extra $$$ for
the chargers
you are recommending get you? BTW, the car adapter IS a handy
feature...don't
know what it normally sells for.

George
Anonymous
January 7, 2005 2:07:05 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> writes:

>You can not offer to sell a Heliopan item to someone in the USA by
>someone who is not in the USA without our written permission as the
>owner of the Trademark in the USA.
>US Customs has the authority to seize and destroy any Heliopan items
>they may find being imported to the USA without our written permission.

>There are similar restrictions on Ebay for other products protected by a
>Trademark or Copyright. For full details on Ebay's policies see their
>rules on selling Trademarked or Copyrighted materials on their web site.

But it's up to individual trademark owners how this is enforced.
Trademark owners register with ebay and report violations; ebay itself
does not scan listings for trademarks.

It seems that many trademark owners are ready to pounce on people
selling fake items under a trademarked name (e.g. fake Rolex watches)
because that dilutes their trademark. They may also complain about
dealers importing goods for sale by unauthorized channels (grey
market). But forbidding a private individual outside the USA from
selling a single used Heliopan filter to someone inside the USA is
quite draconian; do you really do this?

If all distributors enforced this, it would be almost impossible to sell
used items outside their country of original sale, since you'd have to
have a laundry list of countries that the goods could not be shipped to
because the official distributor for that country objected.

It may be legal to do this, but I don't think it's good public policy.

Dave
Anonymous
January 7, 2005 2:13:54 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> writes:

>The sale is stopped because a Heliopan branded item is being offered for
>sale by importing it to the USA.

Is it used or new? It may not matter to you, or to the law as written,
but it *does* matter to some of us. If you're blocking commercial sales
of new items that bypass the official import channel, you'll get support
from a lot of people. Blocking the sale of a used item by a private
seller isn't going to make you any friends.

>It is immaterial where it was originally purchased.
>There is also no way of knowing, without inspecting, that all items
>listed as new are in fact new or all listed as used, like new, never
>used, demo, perfect, etc are not in fact new.

It's pretty easy to check for repeated sales of Heliopan items by the
same seller. If they sell the same items over and over, they're a
dealer and you have grounds for complaint. A single sale should be
treated as a non-commercial seller. If you're already doing automated
scans of ebay to look for violators, this can't be very difficult to
keep track of.

Dave
Anonymous
January 7, 2005 9:27:13 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Dave Martindale wrote:

> But forbidding a private individual outside the USA from
> selling a single used Heliopan filter to someone inside the USA is
> quite draconian; do you really do this?

He does this.

> If all distributors enforced this, it would be almost impossible to sell
> used items outside their country of original sale, since you'd have to
> have a laundry list of countries that the goods could not be shipped to
> because the official distributor for that country objected.
>
> It may be legal to do this, but I don't think it's good public policy.

Which is why I referred to the general boycott by the U.S. photographic
community, of all products imported and distributed by HPMarketing.
Anonymous
January 7, 2005 9:31:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

George wrote:

> Why not the RayOVac I-C3 15 Minute Charger? Charges four of their I-C3
> NiMH (2000mAH) batteries in 15 minutes and will also charge standard NiMH
> batteries in their standard charge time. I think I paid about $25 for mine
> (with
> 2 AA batteries included) while they were running a promotion that got me a
> free
> car adapter for it as well. It works great...what does the extra $$$ for
> the chargers
> you are recommending get you? BTW, the car adapter IS a handy
> feature...don't
> know what it normally sells for.

I don't believe that the Ray-O-Vac has individual charging circuits (can
it charge one or three batteries, or must you do two or four?).

The extra $ doesn't get you much, which is why the BQ-830 is the best
option, as it is very cheap.
January 7, 2005 10:12:39 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Bob Salomon <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote in
news:bob_salomon-B0D8FC.09371506012005@news.isp.giganews.com:

> In article <Xns95D64FBA4F6D2bobatcarolnet@216.196.97.142>,
> bob <usenetMAPS@2fiddles.com> wrote:

>> >
>> > Again. Ask Ebay. It is their rules.
>> >
>>
>> You said the Congress of the United States had passed laws. I have
>> asked which laws. Or are you just blowing smoke?
>>
>> Since you've brought up Ebay, are you claiming that Ebay has a rule
>> that prohibits selling any goods with trademarked names? Can you cite
>> the rule?
>>
>> The only thing I could find related to trademark was this:
>> http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/trademark.html
>>
>> A small quote:
>>
>> "Trademark laws are primarily designed to protect consumers from
>> confusing one company's goods or services with those of another."
>>
>> It sounds like you're just abusing Ebay's overly conservative nature
>> -- it's easier for them to pull the plug on an auction than to fight
>> about it.
>>
>> If your argument has any teeth at all, then why does Nikon USA allow
>> B&H and others to sell grey market Nikon cameras?
>>
>> Bob
> http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/listing-copyrights....
> http://pages.ebay.com/help/policies/trademark.html

That's nice. I quote you a url and tell you there doesn't seem to be
anything on it in support of your position and you quote the same url
back to me.

> Our Heliopan Trademark is registered with the Intellectual Property
> Rights Branch of the US Customs Service under registration number
> 1,650,631 dated 1/4/2002.
>
> " why does Nikon USA allow B&H
>> and others to sell grey market Nikon cameras?
>
> You did not read fully and understand my post.
>
> We are not a subsidiary of the foreign factory that manufactures the
> product. We are not owned by and Heliopan has no financial interest in
> our company. As such we are allowed to register the Trademark we own
> (Heliopan) with US Customs.
>
> If the official US importer is owned by the foreign factory, or is a
> subsidiary of that company, they can not register their name with US
> Customs in order to control "gray" market products bearing their name.
>
> That means that most camera companies importing 35mm, digital or
> medium format products are not able to stop parallel imports by
> utilizing US Customs. Some camera companies that are subsidiaries of
> their foreign owned factories are: Nikon, Canon, Minolta-Konica,
> Pentax, Hasselblad, Sinar, Broncolor, Foba. If a parallel importer can
> find a source for these items they can import them and offer them as
> "gray" market items.
>
> On the other hand there are product lines that are imported by
> companies that are not subsidiaries of the factories that manufacture
> the products AND the US importer owns the trademark on these items.
> Some of these are Heliopan, Mamiya, Sekonic, Toyo.
>
> Then there are products that are imported by companies that are
> neither a subsidiary of the factory that made them and whose importer
> either does not own the trademark or has decided not to register the
> trademark or there are multiple importers for products from that
> factory for different markets so one company in the US would normally
> not own the Trademark.
>
> These items may be offered on the "gray" market.
>
> In the case of Trademarks that are owned by a US company and
> registered with US Customs parallel imports would be called "black"
> market as opposed to "gray" market.
>
> Following is an excerpt from an IP attorney regarding this particular
> subject which he posted last time this was brought up.
>
> "trademark owners are forced to take what look like unreasonable steps
> to preserve their position in the controversy. They feel they must
> take a strong stand on every apparent instance of unauthorized
> importation, lest they be accused of ³waiving² the protection that
> they have spent millions trying to get the courts to recognize. It
> unfortunate that people like the Photo.net contributor get entangled
> in this stuff, especially since I personally agree with the Customs
> Service on the issue. But, life does have its speed bumps, and this
> one hardly seems worth the emotion that it has generated. "
>
> In other words we must use our Trademark rights and protect them so we
> do not lose them.
>
> No one is stopping anyone from selling Heliopan on Ebay. At the moment
> there are at least 35 Heliopan sales or sales of equipment that
> include a Heliopan item being offered on Ebay in the USA from people
> in the USA.
>
> What is stopped are people from outside the USA offering a Heliopan to
> the USA. Those people are free to offer their item anywhere else on
> Ebay.

Since you declined to provide any citation, I did some research--

19 U.S. C. § 1526 Merchandise bearing American trade-mark

"unlawful to import into the United States any merchandise of foreign
manufacture if such merchandise ... bears a trademark owned by a citizen
of ... the United States"

Things would have been much clearer if you had just cited the law in the
first place.

From what I gather though, that bit about the affiliation between the
manufaturer and the distributor was a Customs ruling that was struck down
by the Supreme Court -- The only issue seems to be who owns the
trademark.

So if Nikon (the Japanese company) registered the tradmark in the United
States, then Nikon, Inc., the US distributor (which I dont think is a
subsidary -- they are not the first US distributor of Nikon) would have
no recourse, simply because they don't hold the trademark.

Bob


--
Delete the inverse SPAM to reply
January 7, 2005 11:41:23 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote in message
news:71qDd.2669$Pm6.683@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> George wrote:
>
> > Why not the RayOVac I-C3 15 Minute Charger? Charges four of their I-C3
> > NiMH (2000mAH) batteries in 15 minutes and will also charge standard
NiMH
> > batteries in their standard charge time. I think I paid about $25 for
mine
> > (with
> > 2 AA batteries included) while they were running a promotion that got me
a
> > free
> > car adapter for it as well. It works great...what does the extra $$$
for
> > the chargers
> > you are recommending get you? BTW, the car adapter IS a handy
> > feature...don't
> > know what it normally sells for.
>
> I don't believe that the Ray-O-Vac has individual charging circuits (can
> it charge one or three batteries, or must you do two or four?).
>
> The extra $ doesn't get you much, which is why the BQ-830 is the best
> option, as it is very cheap.
>

You must do 2 or 4. I don't have anything in the house that requires 1 or
3 AA batteries.
Anonymous
January 7, 2005 12:29:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <Xns95D753AE52533bobatcarolnet@216.196.97.142>,
bob <usenetMAPS@2fiddles.com> wrote:

> So if Nikon (the Japanese company) registered the tradmark in the United
> States, then Nikon, Inc., the US distributor (which I dont think is a
> subsidary -- they are not the first US distributor of Nikon) would have
> no recourse, simply because they don't hold the trademark.

The foreign subsidiary can own the trademark. They can't register it -
hence the gray market.

Nikon USA is most definately a subsidiary of Nikon Japan. The former
distributor of Nikon, for whom I was an employee, we Ehrenreich Photo
Optical. They could own the trademark as they were not owned by the
Japanese company.

The Nikon distributors before them were first a partnership between Joe
Ehrenreich on the East Coast and another importer on the West Coast.
Those companies them became Ehrenreich Photo Optical Inc. or EPOI.

Prior to that the importer for Nikon after the Korean War was Adolf
Gasser the camera store in San Francisco. None of those were factory
owned.

--
To reply no_ HPMarketing Corp.
Anonymous
January 7, 2005 7:30:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

George wrote:

> You must do 2 or 4. I don't have anything in the house that requires 1 or
> 3 AA batteries.

But many people do. I have several items in the house that use 3AAA or
1AA battery.

Since the BQ-830 is so cheap, and since it has 4 independent channels,
it's the baseline in terms of low cost high-function chargers.
January 7, 2005 8:27:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote in
news:o OyDd.259$Ii4.97@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net:

> George wrote:
>
>> You must do 2 or 4. I don't have anything in the house that requires
>> 1 or 3 AA batteries.
>
> But many people do. I have several items in the house that use 3AAA or
> 1AA battery.
>
>

Mini Disc recorders have run off of single AA cells for a long time. I'd
hate to have to charge in pairs.

Bob
January 7, 2005 8:27:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"bob" <Jwx1.nothing@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:Xns95D77F09E32BFj123w123x123@216.77.188.18...
> "Steven M. Scharf" <scharf.steven@linkearth.net> wrote in
> news:o OyDd.259$Ii4.97@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net:
>
> > George wrote:
> >
> >> You must do 2 or 4. I don't have anything in the house that requires
> >> 1 or 3 AA batteries.
> >
> > But many people do. I have several items in the house that use 3AAA or
> > 1AA battery.
> >
> >
>
> Mini Disc recorders have run off of single AA cells for a long time. I'd
> hate to have to charge in pairs.
>
> Bob

I realize that it might make a difference to some people (though you have to
BUY
the batteries in 2's or 4's, so what's the diff as far as I am concerned).
I'm sure I do
have something that uses 1 or 3 batteries...just nothing that is such a
battery hog that
I'd bother with rechargeable in. I found the ready availability of the
charger and the
car adapter (don't have to buy a power inverter) very attractive...just
mentioning
what I bought and like...I'm not at all familiar with the BQ-830 as once I
buy, I stop
shopping but if it has similar features and is less than $25 w/2 batteries,
I would've
gone for it, too, had it been around last year when I bought.

George
January 7, 2005 11:16:20 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Bob Salomon" <bob_salomon@mindspring.com> wrote in message
news:bob_salomon-3C50D0.09290107012005@news.isp.giganews.com...
> In article <Xns95D753AE52533bobatcarolnet@216.196.97.142>,
> bob <usenetMAPS@2fiddles.com> wrote:
>
> > So if Nikon (the Japanese company) registered the tradmark in the United
> > States, then Nikon, Inc., the US distributor (which I dont think is a
> > subsidary -- they are not the first US distributor of Nikon) would have
> > no recourse, simply because they don't hold the trademark.
>
> The foreign subsidiary can own the trademark. They can't register it -
> hence the gray market.
>
Please expand on this...I am not quite sure what you are saying. It sounds
(to me) like you are saying that there are two different things going on,
ability
to register a trademark and trademark ownership. Are you saying that since
Nikon Japan owns Nikon USA, that neither can register the trademark in the
U.S. though Nikon Japan owns the trademark? Isn't this the situation with
Nikon, Canon, Pentax, and Konica-Minolta?

TIA,
George

<<<SNIP>>>
!