Which gives more bang for my bucks?

[Tradevman]

Hello,I have an LGA775 Asus P5G41-m LE w/E2160 dual core and 2 Gb ddr2 ram. Wondering if more ram (2 x 2gbs) or faster CPU (E6700) would be best for games? Or add a GPU card? Thanks for any help. Tradevman

 

[Emperus]

If you do not have a video card already then surely a dedicated GPU will fetch you significant gaming benefits.. However, your CPU is weak and you'd either require to overclock it significantly or get a better CPU to extract full performance out of your video card.. Btw, which games do you play and/or intent on playing and at what resolution(s).?

 

[adrimagnon]

* Edit: Until I saw Emperus' response I overlooked the question of a GPU so my new, much shorter response is below. *

Hi Tradevman,

Your P5G41 has onboard of Intel GMA X4500. According to the Tom's Hardware November 2010 Graphic Card chart it is about where a nVidia 6200 is. In that case, using Newegg for pricing, you can get Radeon HD 4650 for under $60 with a rebate. Ignore PowerColor and get an XFX, Gigabyte or Sapphire made board.

Without upgrading and overclocking the CPU I feel any more expensive video card would be a waste.

Good luck,

Adrian

 

[amdfangirl]

Indeed, it makes sense to upgrade the GPU.

Anything modern such as a GTS 450, HD 5750, HD 5770 are the sweet spots, although the HD 5670 and HD 5750 are only really the only GPUs you should buy that don't bottleneck the CPU.

 

[Tradevman]

OK, but if I upgrade the CPU to (E6700) 3.2gz couldn't I then go to a"modern" GPU without causing a "bottleneck"?
Not sure how do you recognize a bottleneck?

 

[Emperus]

There is no existing E6700 with 3.2 GHz stock clock speed.. The E6700 does exist with 2.66 GHz stock clock rate and can overclock to above levels easily.. However, I do not see it as an upgrade unless you are getting it for a very low bargain price..

 

[amdfangirl]

OK, but if I upgrade the CPU to (E6700) 3.2gz couldn't I then go to a"modern" GPU without causing a "bottleneck"?
Not sure how do you recognize a bottleneck?

Well, a bottleneck is characterised by an uneven increase in the performance of only one part of a computer, which holds back the scaling of performance in general.

Say your computer is an oil refinery, the pipeline towards the refinery is the CPU and the refinery itself is the GPU. If you increase the refinery to the biggest refinery ever, but kept the pipes the same, the refined oil output would not increase significantly.

Likewise, choosing a faster processor would not actually result in a notable performance increase.

 

[Tradevman]

Bear with me, I haven't built a new system for 6 years..just kept upgrading my old Asus P4P800 2.8 GHz.

Got an HP pavillion with a bad Foxconn type mobo and did not want to put alot of $$ into the LGA775 so turned to Toms for some learned advice.

Maybe that Wolfdale E6700 isn't worth putting in this new Asus mobo unless I up the ram from 2 gig to 4 gig? (Was going to try to get back to some FPS games....not into casting spells.)

I know what a bottleneck is, just not how I'd see it on the computer without running some kind of diags, unless the video hangs.

So right now I'm trying to see where to spend the $$? CPU or Ram or GPU ???

 

[Tradevman]

Emperus, is $82 a bargain for the E6700 core 2 dual CPU?

 

[Emperus]

82$ sounds like a good deal.. Though personally, i'll be happy to get it for around 70..

 

[Tradevman]

So I guess the addition of the faster CPU will be followed by more ram, then a pcie 1 x 16 GPU.
All for less than the cost of this years new processor? Will let you know if it all works.

 

[adrimagnon]

Hi Tradevman,

If you want the most bang for your buck with no overclocking and want to see an increase in games get the video card.

I feel, quite confidently, that your upgrades should go 1) video card 2) 2MB Processor 3) RAM (but only to support the processor)

I have a Gigabyte mobo, E2200 (1MB 2.2Ghz 800FSB Wolfdale) and 2GB (2x1 GB) Crucial 800 MHz DDR2 RAM and a nVidia GTS 250. I overclock so my RAM is running at almost 900 and my CPU at 3.1GHz. I play CoD4, AA3 (highest settings) and BioShock (medium quality). My next upgrade would definitely be the E5500 because the 2MB cache should add 5-10% more frame rates in my games. None of my games take more than 1GB of RAM so I am fine with 2GB.

My buddy has a Costco bought PC with 8GB RAM and 3GHz Quadcore AMD. He only had onboard graphics. He ended up getting a Radeon 5570 and when he turned on BorderLands he literally blurted "Oh my God!" as his system, which has the RAM and GHz, could not play it on high settings. He was amazed at how good it looked.

Please consider getting a $60-$80 video card first.

Sincerely,

Adrian

 

[Tradevman]

Thanks Adrian, I'll look into that. Just wasn't sure if the processor (1.8ghz) would dictate my GPU type upgrade. Which was why I was leaning towards a faster CPU.

 

[amdfangirl]

well, right now your graphics are holding more you back than CPU.

 

[hell_storm2004]

On the LGA775 platform a decent quad core would be considered a decent upgrade, otherwise most other choices would be... what i would call horizontal shift rather than vertical growth. Consider the Q9550. Its a great CPU. Provided your motherboard supports it.

 

[w33dg0d]

Get a new cpu, cheap effective models would be anything like an i5. As for the card get a PSU upgrade and consider yourself an HD 5770 .

 

[Tradevman]

I know my mobo will support the Q8300 but it's almost twice the price as the Wolfdale E6700.
Too bad this Asus board does not O.C. as well as some others. (I wonder if Newegg would exchange it after 3 weeks?)

 

[Tradevman]

malmental, you're putting me on the spot! I've found a deal on a q8300 for $120 but will run out of money for the memory upgrade.
So am considering the cooler running (65w) core 2 duo (E7500) for less $$.
Would consider getting the OEM versions but the cost of a fan just bumps up the $$.
Any last minute suggestions? Will have to save for a better GPU after the holidays.

 

[hell_storm2004]

You cannot expect a mid range dual core to be close in pricing to the mid the quad core. E7500 is a great processor but still is only two cores. Some games like the Arma II, GTA IV which are woefully coded do benefit from a quad core. Man, my PC didn't even run Arma II! And i have a top line dual core, the E8400.

 

[Emperus]

@hell_storm2004 - Are you sure.? Coz I finished playing Arma II with by E6750.. And I do realise that the E8400 is a better processor.. I played GTA IV and Episodes from liberty city also without much problem.. Only SC2 gave me little worries..

 

[hell_storm2004]

Yeah, it crashed as soon as the game loaded. I had to OC it to 3.6GHz to make it run. At stock it was a no go. Not to mention i had all details in high. I expected some lag even at 1280x768 resolution. I have a HD4850 which is enough for a 17 inch monitor. But... i didn't even take off.

Even the Arma II website suggests a quad core is the recommended and dual core as the minimum.

 

[adrimagnon]

Hi Tradevman,

I'm getting the feeling that we haven't answered your question(s) or even had anything close to consensus.

So, will you please answer the questions below so we are all one the same page?

* Are you playing any games currently? If so, which games? Of those games, are they playing poorly, average, good in terms of quality?

* Are you looking for a way to maximize your gaming experience with no more than $80 being spent?

* Are you willing to overclock the CPU?

* How will you tell if the upgrade worked? Will games look prettier? Run smoother? I assume your logic would say that if a Q8300 showed an in game improvement of 5 FPS but a $100 video card showed an in game improvement of 10FPS you would consider the video card the Best Bang for the Buck of the two because we are, if the driving force is playing games, only considering gaming and not database work, Super Pi, etc.

* Your current system, which is a constraint to this discussion is a Asus P5G41-m LE with a Intel E2160 (Dual Core, 1.8GHz, 1MB L2 Cache, 9x multiplier, 800 FSB) and 2 GB of DDR2 Ram?

* So far, what are you considering spending your money on? CPU, RAM or Video Card?


Thanks,

Adrian

 

[Tradevman]

Hi Adrian, I'm not playing anything on the new build yet but would be looking at Halo, FarCry and Left4Dead type games.

Yes, maximize gaming for about $100 or so.

Will O.C. but have never tried it. Heard the Asus is not that good at it.

Well said re: my upgrade wishes.

New system being built is the Asus but I currently play with two working P4 systems. 1. A home built 2.8GHZ, 200 FSB, 1 Gb ram on an Asus p4p800 deluxe mobo. And 2. A stock HP Pavilion a815n 3.06GHZ, 800 FSB, 2 Gb ram.
Main monitor is Samsung SyncMaster 2233sw

This new system was another HP Pavilion (a6403) given to me dead to repair or salvage. I probably should have bought a better mobo to OC but l have always had good luck with Asus brand boards.

So to get to your last point, I was leaning towards the CPU first, then 2 X 2GB DDR2 and then later, some kind of PCIe GPU. But this is why I've come to this forum for advice from those who've gone thru all this. THANKS!

 

[Tradevman]

Malmental, I've re-thought the budget and should increase it another $100 or so. The deals I found were only good until 12/13/2010. But I'm sure there will be others and like I posted already, this build is use yet. So the budget will be about $250. OK?

 

[Tradevman]

Mal,
Like the choice of the E7500.
But will the PCIe 2.0 x16 run on my Asus P5G41-M LE/CSM mobo ? It says it takes a 1 x 16.
And I already have 1 Gb in each slot so would be uping it to 2GB in each.