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IWD 1/2 and NWN

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Anonymous
April 24, 2004 10:36:19 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Just curious how you all think these compare to BG 1/2. Are they similar
enough if you enjoyed BG? I've heard that they are more hack'n'slash
than BG, but are they still pretty deep games?

Also, anyone play Temple of Elemental Evil and have opinions on that one?

More about : iwd nwn

Anonymous
April 25, 2004 12:45:32 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Tag Plastic wrote:

Thanks for the comments you two!

> Obligatory "If you like story, have you played Planescape:Torment?"

No, I'm still searching for it. Supposedly one website gets in a few
each month, and I'm on the list, but I haven't heard from them.
Anonymous
April 25, 2004 4:24:07 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

"John Salerno" <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:408aebe5$0$28918$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
> Just curious how you all think these compare to BG 1/2. Are they
similar
> enough if you enjoyed BG? I've heard that they are more hack'n'slash
> than BG, but are they still pretty deep games?

IWD 1 was a lot more hack-n-slash - in fact IMHO it was too much so,
because one ended up with situations where you quite literally had to
rest after each and every fight. (Especially when dealing with the
Barrow Wights, Drowned Ones and Wailing Virgins in the expansion set.)
This is bad because it means you end up resting two or even three
times in the day - one should not have to rest more than once every 24
hours.

(Baldurs Gate 1 and 2 cope with this by putting greater emphasis on
exploring and role-playing: while in some cases you may find yourself
with a fight that leaves you completely depleted, out of spells,
injured, fatigued and forced to rest once or even twice afterwards,
the chances are that there won't *be* more than one of those forced on
you within 24 game hours, whereas in IWD you know that the very next
fight is going to be just as bad.

In BG1 and BG2, generally if you have to rest, it's because of fatigue
due to being awake too long, or having been twice under the influence
of a Haste spell. In IWD, if you have to rest, it's because you have
to heal up after getting badly beaten up in the fight you had three
minutes after waking up (and are possibly fatigued after ONE haste
spell).

IWD2 - I just do *not* like the changed system of AD&D 3rd Edition. I
got bored halfway through Chapter 1. It also suffers from the same
problem of IWD1, of making the characters rest for 8 hours after 2
hours of activity because they get so badly beat up in those two
hours. Role-playing goes completely out the window.

Both IWD1 and IWD2 have a backstory of sorts, but I think both would
have been that much better if they had actually concentrated more on
role-play and less on the fights.

> Also, anyone play Temple of Elemental Evil and have opinions on that
one?

No. Have heard it's extremely buggy, and besides it uses AD&D 3rd
edition which I hate. For the same reason I have not played
Neverwinter Nights.

Jonathan.
Anonymous
April 25, 2004 6:45:25 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Tag Plastic wrote:

> NWN is very different. You only have proper, fine control over your one
> character

That's fine with me, because I like when it's a single main character.
That's one reason I love Morrowind.

> samey and a lot of people can't stand the graphics. The HS/Roleplay
> level of the game, however, depends entirely on the module you are
> playing.

Would you say the campaign that comes with NWN is a good game to play on
its own?
Anonymous
April 25, 2004 4:43:00 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Hi,

As with the others in the newsgroup I agree the baldurs gate series has a
great story and is for a large part non-linear. You can do a lot of quests
in any order. Planescape torment has an unique story and a lot more
conversation than baldur's gate. If you liked BG then I think you like
planscape too.

IWDI/IWDII (I am still playing II for the first time). Very linear story
(there isn't much of a story anyway) lot's of hack and slash. I don't think
it is even near the quality of BG and planescape. Though I seem to like
IWDII a bit more than IWDI but that;s because the graphics are better
(higher res).

NWN is fun to play too. Only you can't create a party as in the other games.
Though you sometimes can ask somebody to tag along. Especially the expansion
'hordes of the underdark', which I am currently still playing, is very good
(better get NWN and the two expansions).

Regards, Ron AF Greve.

"John Salerno" <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:408aebe5$0$28918$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
> Just curious how you all think these compare to BG 1/2. Are they similar
> enough if you enjoyed BG? I've heard that they are more hack'n'slash
> than BG, but are they still pretty deep games?
>
> Also, anyone play Temple of Elemental Evil and have opinions on that one?
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 1:48:30 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Tag Plastic wrote:
> John Salerno <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in
> news:408aebe5$0$28918$61fed72c@news.rcn.com:
>
>
>>Just curious how you all think these compare to BG 1/2. Are they
>>similar enough if you enjoyed BG? I've heard that they are more
>>hack'n'slash than BG, but are they still pretty deep games?
>>
>>Also, anyone play Temple of Elemental Evil and have opinions on that
>>one?
>

Extremely bug ridden - in fact a 5 star cockroach motel even with the
official patch.

would recommend the following

Planescape Torment

The might and magic series aren't too bad and Vampire:The Masquerade is
good for a change in style.

Kharsis
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 1:50:49 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

John Salerno wrote:

> Tag Plastic wrote:
>

>
> Would you say the campaign that comes with NWN is a good game to play on
> its own?

I wouldn't recommend the original campaign on its own. Shadows of
Undrentide and Hordes of the Underdark are so much better.
NWN Gold includes SoU - so the only extra purchase would be HotU.

Kharsis
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 1:50:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Kharsis wrote:

> I wouldn't recommend the original campaign on its own. Shadows of
> Undrentide and Hordes of the Underdark are so much better.
> NWN Gold includes SoU - so the only extra purchase would be HotU.

My only concern there, as I've learned with the BG bundle packs, is that
I'm sure NWN Gold doesn't include the original manuals and maps and
things like that, which I like to have. Besides, even if I got Gold,
wouldn't I have to play through the original game first before moving on
to SoU, or is it all integrated?
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 1:50:51 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Hi,

"John Salerno" <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:408be4a5$0$28930$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
> Kharsis wrote:
>
> > I wouldn't recommend the original campaign on its own. Shadows of
> > Undrentide and Hordes of the Underdark are so much better.
> > NWN Gold includes SoU - so the only extra purchase would be HotU.
>
> My only concern there, as I've learned with the BG bundle packs, is that
> I'm sure NWN Gold doesn't include the original manuals and maps and
> things like that, which I like to have. Besides, even if I got Gold,
> wouldn't I have to play through the original game first before moving on
> to SoU, or is it all integrated?

No, you can play all three of them seperately. They are independent modules
(luckily, since my harddisk crashed I wouldn't want to spend months playing
before reaching HoU again).

Regards, Ron AF Greve
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 1:50:52 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Moonlit wrote:

> No, you can play all three of them seperately. They are independent modules
> (luckily, since my harddisk crashed I wouldn't want to spend months playing
> before reaching HoU again).

Oh, that's interesting. So, is any one of the three modules affected at
all by any of the others? For example, installing ToB along with SoA
immediately raises the XP cap, adds Watcher's Keep, etc. Do the NWN
expansions add content (or anything at all) to the original game, or to
the other modules?
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 1:50:53 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

John Salerno wrote:

> Moonlit wrote:
>
>> No, you can play all three of them seperately. They are independent
>> modules
>> (luckily, since my harddisk crashed I wouldn't want to spend months
>> playing
>> before reaching HoU again).
>
>
> Oh, that's interesting. So, is any one of the three modules affected at
> all by any of the others? For example, installing ToB along with SoA
> immediately raises the XP cap, adds Watcher's Keep, etc. Do the NWN
> expansions add content (or anything at all) to the original game, or to
> the other modules?

Yes, they add prestige classes, improved AI in your companions, the
ability to manage your companions' inventories, some spells...lots of stuff.

Additionally...NWN itself expects you to start with a first-level
character, and end at level 15-20.
SoU expects you to start with a first-level character who has /not/ been
through the events of NWN.
HotU, however, expects you to start with a fifteenth-level character who
has been through the events of SoU--not NWN.
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 1:50:54 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Kish wrote:

> Yes, they add prestige classes, improved AI in your companions, the
> ability to manage your companions' inventories, some spells...lots of
> stuff.

So you'd recommend installing all three at once?

> Additionally...NWN itself expects you to start with a first-level
> character, and end at level 15-20.
> SoU expects you to start with a first-level character who has /not/ been
> through the events of NWN.
> HotU, however, expects you to start with a fifteenth-level character who
> has been through the events of SoU--not NWN.

Hmm, how confusing. :)  So you should start anew with NWN, also with SoU,
and then import your SoU character into HotU?
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 1:50:54 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Kish wrote:

> Yes, they add prestige classes, improved AI in your companions, the
> ability to manage your companions' inventories, some spells...lots of
> stuff.

Sorry, for posting twice, but: can you use all of these additions in the
original NWN campaign, or only in the expansions?
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 2:33:17 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Hi,
"John Salerno" <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:408c191a$0$28923$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
> Kish wrote:
>
> > Yes, they add prestige classes, improved AI in your companions, the
> > ability to manage your companions' inventories, some spells...lots of
> > stuff.
>
> So you'd recommend installing all three at once?
>
> > Additionally...NWN itself expects you to start with a first-level
> > character, and end at level 15-20.
> > SoU expects you to start with a first-level character who has /not/ been
> > through the events of NWN.
> > HotU, however, expects you to start with a fifteenth-level character who
> > has been through the events of SoU--not NWN.
>
> Hmm, how confusing. :)  So you should start anew with NWN, also with SoU,
> and then import your SoU character into HotU?

Well, how I played it. I finished NWN then played a lot of user modules and
started SoU. However in SoU I imported the character I always played with,
this character was so strong that I could defeat any monster with one hand
while reading a book with the other (it spoilled the game a little for me).
In HotU you get the chance in the beginning to either use a predefined
character leveled up automatically to I believe 15 or so OR (what I did)
level the character up yourself to 15, before the game really starts.

Regards, Ron AF Greve
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 2:39:01 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Oh , ye,s as someone else mentioned, morrowind is pretty good too (not to
mention extremely large). Though the gameplay is quite different (first or
third person instead of an isometric view).

Regards, Ron AF Greve

"Moonlit" <news moonlit xs4all nl> wrote in message
news:408b9632$0$576$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl...
> Hi,
>
> As with the others in the newsgroup I agree the baldurs gate series has a
> great story and is for a large part non-linear. You can do a lot of quests
> in any order. Planescape torment has an unique story and a lot more
> conversation than baldur's gate. If you liked BG then I think you like
> planscape too.
>
> IWDI/IWDII (I am still playing II for the first time). Very linear story
> (there isn't much of a story anyway) lot's of hack and slash. I don't
think
> it is even near the quality of BG and planescape. Though I seem to like
> IWDII a bit more than IWDI but that;s because the graphics are better
> (higher res).
>
> NWN is fun to play too. Only you can't create a party as in the other
games.
> Though you sometimes can ask somebody to tag along. Especially the
expansion
> 'hordes of the underdark', which I am currently still playing, is very
good
> (better get NWN and the two expansions).
>
> Regards, Ron AF Greve.
>
> "John Salerno" <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:408aebe5$0$28918$61fed72c@news.rcn.com...
> > Just curious how you all think these compare to BG 1/2. Are they similar
> > enough if you enjoyed BG? I've heard that they are more hack'n'slash
> > than BG, but are they still pretty deep games?
> >
> > Also, anyone play Temple of Elemental Evil and have opinions on that
one?
>
>
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 2:39:02 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Moonlit wrote:

> Oh , ye,s as someone else mentioned, morrowind is pretty good too (not to
> mention extremely large). Though the gameplay is quite different (first or
> third person instead of an isometric view).

Yeah, not really comparable to the BG games, but Morrowind definitely is
one of the best (maybe the best) game I've every played. I had such a
blast with it.
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 9:05:01 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

John Salerno wrote:
> Kish wrote:
>
>> Yes, they add prestige classes, improved AI in your companions, the
>> ability to manage your companions' inventories, some spells...lots of
>> stuff.
>
>
> So you'd recommend installing all three at once?

Yes.

>
>> Additionally...NWN itself expects you to start with a first-level
>> character, and end at level 15-20.
>> SoU expects you to start with a first-level character who has /not/
>> been through the events of NWN.
>> HotU, however, expects you to start with a fifteenth-level character
>> who has been through the events of SoU--not NWN.
>
>
> Hmm, how confusing. :)  So you should start anew with NWN, also with SoU,
> and then import your SoU character into HotU?

Yes.

> Sorry, for posting twice, but: can you use all of these additions in the original NWN campaign, or only in the expansions?

In the original NWN campaign.
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 5:04:45 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

John Salerno <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in <408b0a2e$0$28898
$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>:

>Tag Plastic wrote:
>
>Thanks for the comments you two!
>
>> Obligatory "If you like story, have you played Planescape:Torment?"
>
>No, I'm still searching for it. Supposedly one website gets in a few
>each month, and I'm on the list, but I haven't heard from them.

Another "if you like story" plug:

Star Wars: Knights of the Old Republic

It uses a core engine similar to neverwinter nights, although the graphics are
better. The ruleset is a modified version of the 3d-edition D&D rules,
translated to the Star Wars universe. I think the rules set work better
outside of the fantasy setting (fewer, streamlined skill and feat choices, and
the envisioned world feels more like a *world* than a collection of rules).

There's NPC interaction on par with BG2, some interesting side-quests, and
different good and evil story arcs (and the story, in general, is better put
together than Episode 1 or 2).

If you're not married to fantasy, and if you like Star Wars, check it out.

Hound
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 5:04:46 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Hound of Cullen wrote:

> If you're not married to fantasy, and if you like Star Wars, check it out.

Yeah, that one's definitely on my list too. I'm looking forward to it.
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 5:07:19 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

John Salerno <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in <408c1c52$0$28896
$61fed72c@news.rcn.com>:

>Kish wrote:
>
>> Yes, they add prestige classes, improved AI in your companions, the
>> ability to manage your companions' inventories, some spells...lots of
>> stuff.
>
>Sorry, for posting twice, but: can you use all of these additions in the
>original NWN campaign, or only in the expansions?
>

You get *some* of the additons in the original campaign. You can't manage your
hireling's inventory, some crafting abilities aren't available, and some
prestige classes aren't available.

Hound
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 6:36:51 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Hound of Cullen wrote:
> John Salerno <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in <408c1c52$0$28896
> $61fed72c@news.rcn.com>:
>
>
>>Kish wrote:
>>
>>
>>>Yes, they add prestige classes, improved AI in your companions, the
>>>ability to manage your companions' inventories, some spells...lots of
>>>stuff.
>>
>>Sorry, for posting twice, but: can you use all of these additions in the
>>original NWN campaign, or only in the expansions?
>>
>
>
> You get *some* of the additons in the original campaign. You can't manage your
> hireling's inventory,

You can't? I can. Might be another mod I have installed, then.

> and some
> prestige classes aren't available.

Hmm? Which?
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 9:55:06 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Hi,



Regards
"Kish" <Kish_K@pacbell.net> wrote in message
news:789jc.1636$XL7.226@newssvr27.news.prodigy.com...
> Hound of Cullen wrote:
> > John Salerno <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in <408c1c52$0$28896
> > $61fed72c@news.rcn.com>:
> >
> >
> >>Kish wrote:
> >>
> >>
> >>>Yes, they add prestige classes, improved AI in your companions, the
> >>>ability to manage your companions' inventories, some spells...lots of
> >>>stuff.
> >>
> >>Sorry, for posting twice, but: can you use all of these additions in the
> >>original NWN campaign, or only in the expansions?
> >>
> >
> >
> > You get *some* of the additons in the original campaign. You can't
manage your
> > hireling's inventory,
>
> You can't? I can. Might be another mod I have installed, then.

You are right, you can.

With HotU you can modify your hirelings inventory. click on hireling->(Click
somwhere at 11'o clock in the radial menu (forgot the name )->(Click at 3'o
clock in the radial menu)->Inventory. You can also open you own inventory
and exchange items.

>
> > and some
> > prestige classes aren't available.
>
> Hmm? Which?

Regards, Ron AF Greve
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 9:55:07 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

"Moonlit" <news moonlit xs4all nl> wrote in <408d30d6$0$574
$e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl>:

>Hi,
>
>
>
>Regards
>"Kish" <Kish_K@pacbell.net> wrote in message
>news:789jc.1636$XL7.226@newssvr27.news.prodigy.com...
>> Hound of Cullen wrote:
>>> John Salerno <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in <408c1c52$0$28896
>>> $61fed72c@news.rcn.com>:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Kish wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Yes, they add prestige classes, improved AI in your companions, the
>>>>> ability to manage your companions' inventories, some spells...lots of
>>>>> stuff.
>>>>
>>>> Sorry, for posting twice, but: can you use all of these additions in
>>>> the original NWN campaign, or only in the expansions?
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> You get *some* of the additons in the original campaign. You can't
>>> manage your hireling's inventory,
>>
>> You can't? I can. Might be another mod I have installed, then.
>
>You are right, you can.
>
>With HotU you can modify your hirelings inventory. click on hireling->(Click
>somwhere at 11'o clock in the radial menu (forgot the name )->(Click at 3'o
>clock in the radial menu)->Inventory. You can also open you own inventory
>and exchange items.

I do that (with NWN gold ed. installed) get 'you cannot modify this
character's inventory' when playing the original campaign.

Hound
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 10:06:53 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

John Salerno wrote:
> Moonlit wrote:
>
>> Oh , ye,s as someone else mentioned, morrowind is pretty good too (not to
>> mention extremely large). Though the gameplay is quite different
>> (first or
>> third person instead of an isometric view).
>
>
> Yeah, not really comparable to the BG games, but Morrowind definitely is
> one of the best (maybe the best) game I've every played. I had such a
> blast with it.
I found exactly the opposite with Morrowind - boring and tedious.

Actually took it back to the shop and got a refund.

Kharsis
Anonymous
April 26, 2004 10:06:54 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

Kharsis wrote:

>> Yeah, not really comparable to the BG games, but Morrowind definitely
>> is one of the best (maybe the best) game I've every played. I had such
>> a blast with it.
>
> I found exactly the opposite with Morrowind - boring and tedious.

Wow, that's too bad. I found that game to be so impressive. I'm
beginning to see why everyone thinks BG2 is one of the best RPGs, but
for a while I was underwhelmed by it. There are many gameplay decisions
the developers made that I don't like, and that I think BG1 does better.
Anonymous
April 27, 2004 12:23:25 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.baldurs-gate (More info?)

"Hound of Cullen" <s2szalbxro001@sneakemail.com> wrote in message
news:Xns94D77F815D0D2pziselbergerinamecom@130.133.1.4...
> "Moonlit" <news moonlit xs4all nl> wrote in <408d30d6$0$574
> $e4fe514c@news.xs4all.nl>:
>
> >Hi,
> >
> >
> >
> >Regards
> >"Kish" <Kish_K@pacbell.net> wrote in message
> >news:789jc.1636$XL7.226@newssvr27.news.prodigy.com...
> >> Hound of Cullen wrote:
> >>> John Salerno <johnjsalNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote in <408c1c52$0$28896
> >>> $61fed72c@news.rcn.com>:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> Kish wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> Yes, they add prestige classes, improved AI in your companions, the
> >>>>> ability to manage your companions' inventories, some spells...lots
of
> >>>>> stuff.
> >>>>
> >>>> Sorry, for posting twice, but: can you use all of these additions in
> >>>> the original NWN campaign, or only in the expansions?
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> You get *some* of the additons in the original campaign. You can't
> >>> manage your hireling's inventory,
> >>
> >> You can't? I can. Might be another mod I have installed, then.
> >
> >You are right, you can.
> >
> >With HotU you can modify your hirelings inventory. click on
hireling->(Click
> >somwhere at 11'o clock in the radial menu (forgot the name )->(Click at
3'o
> >clock in the radial menu)->Inventory. You can also open you own inventory
> >and exchange items.
>
> I do that (with NWN gold ed. installed) get 'you cannot modify this
> character's inventory' when playing the original campaign.
>
Does that include Hordes of the Underdark?. Only with that expansion I could
(ex)change equipment, at least I didn't try it with the NWN or NWN/SoU so it
might or might not be possible with that.

But it sure works if you start HotU anew like I did. I just changed some
armor of my hireling an hour ago. That's one of the improvements I like with
the latest expansion.

> Hound


Regards, Ron AF Greve.
!