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Sandy Bridge vs Phenom II x4 build

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January 6, 2011 3:56:27 AM

Alright, if any of you guys remember my last post i had a very slow pc bottlenecking my GPU, SO! I'm gonna build my first gaming pc (yay! XD)

My question is i want the best performance per dollar and noticed the new Sandy Bridge 2500k supposedly OC's to 4.6 ghz on air, needless to say i drooled.

But my question is, is it worth the extra money? Should i go with a phenom II x4 755BE instead? or are both of these CPU's bad choices?

Any comments are appreciated,

P.S. I don't whether i use intel or amd as long as it works well and the mobo can SLI
January 6, 2011 4:04:37 AM

Well, I already have a GPU so i was hoping to build something around 600$ Im still using a CRT monitor so...... XD wanna have some money left over in case i want to get a new monitor
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January 6, 2011 4:32:02 AM

To be honest, nothing current will touch Sandy Bridge. But when it releases, Phenom II will drop in price and look very good. Only problem is AM3 is dead as far as an upgrade path so you are stuck with Phenon II X6 and would have to upgrade your whole system to get anything better CPU wise.

While LGA1155 has a chance of supporting Intels 22nm next year.
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January 6, 2011 4:52:15 AM

jimmysmitty said:
To be honest, nothing current will touch Sandy Bridge. But when it releases, Phenom II will drop in price and look very good. Only problem is AM3 is dead as far as an upgrade path so you are stuck with Phenon II X6 and would have to upgrade your whole system to get anything better CPU wise.

While LGA1155 has a chance of supporting Intels 22nm next year.

^+1
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January 6, 2011 5:02:43 AM

Well, I don't really upgrade my pc a lot (or at all :p ) so anything i can use without upgrading for a very long time would be awesome

Starting to learn towards Sandy Bridge, by the way is there any set release date yet? i think its either coming tomorrow or sunday.
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January 6, 2011 5:08:05 AM

you could wait for new am3+ boards which will support the new bulldozer cpu's if you really want to go AMD. I would, just cause I dont like intel, although I own one.
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January 6, 2011 6:52:35 AM

wait for Sandy Bridge, or a am3+ socket motherboard. The Phenom II will soon be a thing of the past.

thats what I would do, but wwhat else do you need for your new build?? any parts (Case, ram, dvdburner etc) can be reused??
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January 6, 2011 8:11:58 AM

Sandy Bridge. There's no other choice.
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January 6, 2011 8:16:43 AM

I think there are still plenty of choices out there, there are some really good deals to be had.
Just decide what you really need and if you can pick it up nice and cheap without SB then do it.

Nothing died when SB arrived.
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January 6, 2011 8:18:06 AM

Just wait for the AMD price drops.
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January 6, 2011 8:23:34 AM

Well if you can wait then wait but i think it would be ok if you only want gaming..It wont be a great system in comparison to the to the SB.
I am still with the amd athlonII X4 and i still can play games and having a fun time with the games..The problem is that when it starts cluttering the harddrive you are going to have a slow system but in the best of your interest wait for bulldozer..
Much better to wait for bulldozer..
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January 6, 2011 12:06:26 PM

AMD X4 cpu is great for $500-$700 rigs, emphasis on GPU at decent resolutions, 1080P or above....

But they are usually at a slight framerate disadvantage with any i5/i7 quad core Intel rig, although the higher the resolution, the less noticeable the disadvantage....
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January 6, 2011 2:44:55 PM

Well,right now im using an old gateway e-6610d cant OC and its an old BTX form factor. specs are

core 2 duo 1.86ghz
4gb DDR1 memory
Asus gts 450 top (this is what im building my rig around think ill try to sli two)
160gb hard drive
400w PSU


yeah.... im not too picky and id rather not wait for bulldozer :p 

EDIT: as you can see its old, so the old things i could re use would be the hard drive and the GPU (of course). So ill need just about everything else.
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January 6, 2011 3:08:21 PM

The 1 thing AMD still have going for them is you can get a AM3 board for around $40 while sandybridge ones are likely to be at least $100 more and a Phenom 955Be is at least $50 cheaper than a 2500K (the one to get on sandy bridge) and is as good as most gamers need. That said its hard to pass up the 2500K as when overclocked I think it beats anythying else on the market. If your budget is lower than the 955BE AMD offers a great choice of athlon & Phenom x3s which are still great for gaming and alot cheaper.
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January 6, 2011 5:41:41 PM

Actually, the 955BE was the amd processor i was looking at :p  either that or the 940 since i plan on OCing i think they would be pretty similar, im kinda scared of using a AM2+ processor though.


Here to hoping the 955BE prices drop! :D 
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January 6, 2011 6:06:47 PM

The 965 is only about $10 more han the 955, you can't use AM2+ if you are going AM3 board with DDR3.
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January 6, 2011 6:21:47 PM

beanoslim said:
I think there are still plenty of choices out there, there are some really good deals to be had.
Just decide what you really need and if you can pick it up nice and cheap without SB then do it.

Nothing died when SB arrived.

I couldn't agree more. Just because SB will be the undisputed performance winner doesn't mean that all those Athlon II X3 and Phenom II X4 machines out there will suddenly slow to a crawl and become unable to run all the games they've been handling with ease up until now. Most games are more dependent on the GPU.
One thing to consider though, if you are determined to re-use your GTS450 and may want to add another for SLI, Intel systems run SLI a lot better than AMD. I don't know whether or not that is true of Crossfire.
You might fit a single HD6850 into your $600 budget, IF you build AMD.
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January 6, 2011 6:25:32 PM

Actually Psycho you just about gave me all the info i was looking for :p , and bean i would rather stick with the gts 450 since mine was a Christmas present from my parents (im only 16 and lost my job due to the company I worked for going out of buisness :p  aka the budget, and yes im paying for this myself not my parents)

Also if i make a build cheap enough i might be able to buy something better than my old crt monitor :p  thanks for all the replies BTW
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January 6, 2011 6:45:32 PM

Quote:
...
.
.
.
2500K : 229.99
P67 UD4 : 150
4GB DDR3 1600 : 49.99

Total : 429.98


AMD X4: 100
770DE: 60
4GB DDR3 1333: 42

Total: 202

So, if your monitor's refresh rate is 60Hz, you will get nearly identical visual performance for $227 LESS if you buy AMD. //TILT//

Of course, what that chart does not show is minimum frame rates. They will also be different, and presumably lower with AMD, so you WILL see a difference. Will it matter to you? Is it worth $227 (plus extortion)? Only you can say. On a tight budget, I'd say it's not worth it.
No one is suggesting SB won't offer outstanding performance. There are, however, considerably less expensive alternatives that absolutely are "good enough."

Edit: And that $227 will buy a decent 22" 1920x1080 monitor.

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January 6, 2011 7:01:36 PM

Yeah, newegg is one of my favorite places, nice and cheap with good service, also id prefer buying new since open box is a bit of a gamble.

Well, I think its more of a waiting game now, I think that if the AMD CPUs go down in price quite a bit (like say the 955BE going from 150 to 100) then ill go that route otherwise its looking like SB
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January 6, 2011 7:13:56 PM

I'd be real careful of open box deals. They may be missing the I/O plate, drive cables, and/or driver CDs. Yes, they can be replaced or downloaded, but it does take the sweetness off any low price. Also, you don't want an AM2+ board, ESPECIALLY a nForce chipset, as those often run at only 1000MT/s or 2000MT/s. A brand new ASRock 770DE is only $60, and runs quite well.

Edit: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
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January 6, 2011 7:35:04 PM

Onus said:
I'd be real careful of open box deals. They may be missing the I/O plate, drive cables, and/or driver CDs. Yes, they can be replaced or downloaded, but it does take the sweetness off any low price. Also, you don't want an AM2+ board, ESPECIALLY a nForce chipset, as those often run at only 1000MT/s or 2000MT/s. A brand new ASRock 770DE is only $60, and runs quite well.

Edit: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


I hear thats an awesome mobo but i was looking for something that can SLI
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January 6, 2011 7:40:09 PM

Wait till the i5-2500K is available, don't buy any PII X4 CPU. At this moment only buy AMD if you want the mobo+cpu to cost 200$. (low end builds)
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January 6, 2011 7:44:27 PM

AMD may not SLI so well. If that is a requirement, then you're looking at Intel; not necessarily Sandy Bridge though, considering your budget. People will moan about LGA1156 (and AM3) being dead-ends, but a system built with one of those sockets has YEARS of useful life ahead of it.
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January 6, 2011 7:46:10 PM

Hmmm, have not really though of that, i have kept current I5s and I7s out of question since the performance per dollar is pretty bad but after SB comes out im sure they will go down in price.
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January 6, 2011 7:49:09 PM

Onus said:
AMD may not SLI so well. If that is a requirement, then you're looking at Intel; not necessarily Sandy Bridge though, considering your budget. People will moan about LGA1156 (and AM3) being dead-ends, but a system built with one of those sockets has YEARS of useful life ahead of it.


Of course, it's just like the situation was in 2009: any Core 2 Quad paired with a nice P45 would've provide great performance for at least 2 years.

But the point was, the 32nm i5/i7 have much greater OC potential, much more energy efficient and faster clock-per-clock and you'll be able to upgrade to 22nm mainstream Ivy Bridge's next year/Q1 of 2013.
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January 6, 2011 7:50:17 PM

By all means wait for SB; not because you will necessarily buy one, but because prices of older tech will almost certainly decrease, at least a little.
What games do you intend to play?
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January 6, 2011 7:52:14 PM

Onus said:
By all means wait for SB; not because you will necessarily buy one, but because prices of older tech will almost certainly decrease, at least a little.
What games do you intend to play?


Well I have a pretty low goal of just being able to play crysis on highest while keeping about 30fps 70% for the time
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January 6, 2011 7:56:09 PM

Hmmm, can a GTS450 pull that off with any CPU? What resolution?
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January 6, 2011 8:06:24 PM

Onus said:
I'd be real careful of open box deals. They may be missing the I/O plate, drive cables, and/or driver CDs. Yes, they can be replaced or downloaded, but it does take the sweetness off any low price. Also, you don't want an AM2+ board, ESPECIALLY a nForce chipset, as those often run at only 1000MT/s or 2000MT/s. A brand new ASRock 770DE is only $60, and runs quite well.

Edit: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


Hmmm, thought I'd put the AM3 filter in, anyways I was looking at the Crosshair IV. :D 
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January 6, 2011 8:58:27 PM

Onus said:
Hmmm, can a GTS450 pull that off with any CPU? What resolution?


Oh forgot say that the max resolution ill be playing at is 1280x1080 :p  i have a crt monitor XD
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January 6, 2011 9:33:35 PM

jorn978 said:
Well,right now im using an old gateway e-6610d cant OC and its an old BTX form factor. specs are

core 2 duo 1.86ghz
4gb DDR1 memory
Asus gts 450 top (this is what im building my rig around think ill try to sli two)
160gb hard drive
400w PSU


yeah.... im not too picky and id rather not wait for bulldozer :p 

EDIT: as you can see its old, so the old things i could re use would be the hard drive and the GPU (of course). So ill need just about everything else.

You can try to overclock like this:
Open your computer case,and search for your clock generator on your mainboard.
That (the clock generator) should usually be near the 14.3 crystal oscilator chip.
Here is a page where you can look for about how to find your clock generator.
http://www.cpu-cool.de/FSB.HTM
After you found your clock generator,go here:
http://www13.plala.or.jp/setfsb/
And download setfsb,the freeware version.
See if the clock generator is in the list there,and if it is set it and after try to up your fsb with 1-2 mhz to see if it working.
If it working,than you can overclock.

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January 6, 2011 9:46:19 PM

Onus said:
I'd be real careful of open box deals. They may be missing the I/O plate, drive cables, and/or driver CDs. Yes, they can be replaced or downloaded, but it does take the sweetness off any low price. Also, you don't want an AM2+ board, ESPECIALLY a nForce chipset, as those often run at only 1000MT/s or 2000MT/s. A brand new ASRock 770DE is only $60, and runs quite well.

Edit: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


The actual HTT bus wont make enough of a difference to really get angry over. Its mainly for the memory link which alone is still very fast (not as fast as QPI but still more than fast enough for a gaming machine).

As for SLI, nvidias chipsets just have never been on the same level as Intel nor AMDs. The main reason being that Intel and AMD design the CPUs therefore they have knowledge that cannot be gained from schematics. So while they can design the CPU and chipset around each other, nVidia has to design their chipset around the CPU and that in the end causes the instability, lower performance and overclocking and just bugginess that has been seen in nVidia chipsets.

To say AMD doesn't do SLI well, its not that. Its that they are forced to use nVidias chipsets for it since nVidia doesn't want to license it to anyone so they could sell their own chipsets. I was actually happy to hear that Intel got a SLI license for the X58 chipset and I think AMD should have one too because the only reason why nvidia sold chipsets during the Core 2 / Athlon X2 era was because of SLI and the 8800 series was just better in overall performance than the HD2900/3800 series.

I think in the end if its able to be bugeted, go for the Sandy Bridge. Unless you want to wait for Bulldozer to hit but whos to say what that will do except well, just replace Phenom II for now. We have no idea what its going to do and your system is pretty old and not as able to upgrade the CPU. If you could drop a Core 2 Quad in it, I would say do it because a quad is by no means slow, even a C2Q. But since it is OEM I would go with the best your budget allows.

As for the monitor, sorry about the CRT. heavy, huge and hot. But for the resolution, 1280x1080.... that would be a strange CRT. Most CRTs were 4:3 so I think you might actually be running 1280x1024 resolution. If not then its a strange CRT. But none the less, I used to run a 4:3 flat panel monitor at 1280x1024 resolution with my Q6600 and a HD2900Pro 1GB. Suffice to say it ran Crysis at that resolution with mixed high - max settings at 30FPS. I would expect a GTS 450 should be capable of pulling it off somewhat happily by turning down a few settings:

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/180?vs=179

I can't find a GTS 450 bench nor a HD2900Pro but the HD3870 was pretty much on par with a HD2900Pro and the GTX 460 isn't that much better than the GTS 450.

Even if you go with a Phenom II X4 955BE you will be happy but if this is the last time you will be able to build a system for a while, I think Sandy Bridge will be the best route since it will probably last longer than the Phenom II. Especially considering that you will be going to college soon and most college students don't have money. I know. I was one of them once.
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January 6, 2011 9:54:13 PM

I couldn't find a GTS450 bench either.
This really does come down to budget, and priorities. Is there a hottie up the street the OP (who is 16) might like to take out a few times? What are the near-term job prospects? There's a lot going on here. Sticking to the cheaper AM3 would be lame in the face of easily affording SB, but if that's all the budget allows, AM3 can be used to build a quite competent gamer.
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January 6, 2011 10:28:17 PM

If I had a choice been Sandy Bridge on an old CRT, or Phenom II X4 on a new flat panel (even if 1680x1050 or 1600x900), I'd take the flat panel Every Time.
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January 6, 2011 10:31:30 PM

Onus said:
I couldn't find a GTS450 bench either.
This really does come down to budget, and priorities. Is there a hottie up the street the OP (who is 16) might like to take out a few times? What are the near-term job prospects? There's a lot going on here. Sticking to the cheaper AM3 would be lame in the face of easily affording SB, but if that's all the budget allows, AM3 can be used to build a quite competent gamer.

Now here we go! you have the right mind set :p  but sadly no i live in the middle of no where so the nearest girl is 30 miles away lol that goes for all of my friends, but your right its good if i have left over money to go hang out with my friends and the such.
Also pretty sure ill be jobless until this summer, that is if i can find a job

EDIT: uh yeah i ment my max resolution would be 1280x1024 :p  i forget the common resolutions
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January 7, 2011 12:26:44 AM

Onus said:
I couldn't find a GTS450 bench either.
This really does come down to budget, and priorities. Is there a hottie up the street the OP (who is 16) might like to take out a few times? What are the near-term job prospects? There's a lot going on here. Sticking to the cheaper AM3 would be lame in the face of easily affording SB, but if that's all the budget allows, AM3 can be used to build a quite competent gamer.


Thats my thoughts. As long as you can afford it go for it. Thats how I always go for it.

If he can get the SB setup for $450 he would still have $150 for a monitor and I know of a good Samsung monitor (1600x900, 5ms response and 50K:1 contrast raito) thats sexy as all get out. But then again sticking with a GTS 450 would probably not want a much higher resolution than what he has.

Its still hard to suggest for you. We can give the pros and cons of each such as Phenom II will perform lower, has a dead socket but SB is a bit more expensive. Phenom II is cheaper but SB performs better overall. In the end its up to you.

Do you want the latest and greatest or can you settle for something a bit older that will suffice for a while and saving a bit of money that can be used for a bigger monitor or a second GPU. Well a second GPU would be pointless at 1280x1024. You really want 2 GPUs at 1920x1080+.
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January 7, 2011 1:57:24 AM

Hmm, you think i could make a Sandy Bridge PC for 450$?
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January 7, 2011 2:11:07 AM

Quote:
Amd is now overpriced garbage now that the 2500K beats down on the 1100T X6. Wait 3 days till sandy bridge is released and YES it is worth it.

Do you see the X3 even on this list?

http://images.anandtech.com/graphs/graph4083/35041.png




You honestly have no idea WTF you're talking about.

2500K : 229.99
P67 UD4 : 150
4GB DDR3 1600 : 49.99

Total : 429.98


^According to him it would be around $430. Thats assuming the pricing is correct (for mobo and CPU, memory is probably dead on), if you have to pay taxes and shipping.

Unfortunatley neither Newegg nor Tiger have their prices up, yet. Only Micro center does but normally Newegg and Tiger do seem to price near Micro so we will have to wait and see. But I don't think its impossible plus you could get some nice combos from Newegg.
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January 7, 2011 2:20:02 AM

Ohhhh:D  thats just about perfect then since ideally i wanted to build one around 400-500 I put put my budget as 600 because thats as high as ill go
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January 7, 2011 2:05:19 PM

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January 7, 2011 3:03:29 PM

Thanks for the links! and there is no sand on that bridge just around it XD
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January 7, 2011 3:12:37 PM

Well, next time I'm there I'll sprinkle some sand onto it.
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January 7, 2011 3:24:07 PM

lol :p 
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January 7, 2011 4:09:00 PM

would be awesome if there were a bulldozer there trying to destroy that "sandy" bridge :) 
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January 7, 2011 4:14:46 PM

:lol:  Why has it got such a cr*p name anyway, or am I going to get slaughtered for asking that?

I mean just a few examples of cpu sounding cpu's.

Athlon, Celeron, Pentium, Opteron, Xeon, Phenom, Core i7 you know sort of techno futurism, and then.

Sandy Bridge!
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January 7, 2011 4:22:57 PM

Lol, talk about getting off topic XD
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January 7, 2011 4:50:29 PM

Quote:
Be happy if BD even comes close to SB. Knowing amd it'll take an 8 core bulldozer to beat a 4 core 2600K :lol: 


yeah im amazed at sandy bridge myself especially theire OC ability. im not an AMD fanboy just because my avatar is an AMD pic ;) 

it would just be awesome if AMD could compete with intel in the highend.

EDIT: damn i forgot that 1155 is just a mainstream socket lol. bulldozer have to be a mircale if they are gonna beat the socket 2011 CPUs :) 
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