LiIon Life????

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Ron <rgood@netzero.com> writes:

>- what can one expect from today's batteries in terms of life span (eg.,
>mainly the prioritory ones that come with cameras like my 5060)? Is it
>true that these batteries really are only good for a couple of years
>under the best of circumstances.

>- is there an appreciable loss of capacity over a one or two year period
>when (a) the battery is used frequently; (b) it is kept pretty much in
>reserve or used infrequently?

From what I've read, LiIon batteries are good for about 2 years. They
degrade with time even if you aren't charging or discharging them.
You can make them die even faster by using them a lot, since they are
also limited to a few hundred charge/discharge cycles. But you can't
make them last a long time in storage.

>- are there specific guidelines to storage (eg., keep them in a
>refridgerator, keep them partially discharged, etc.)?

For LiIon, apparently storing them at about 40% charge is best.
Fully-charged ones age faster. On the other hand, you don't want to
store a fully discharged cell, because it will slowly discharge further
in storage, and once the voltage drops below a certain level the cell is
permanently damaged.

>- is it wise to have multiple batteries (I have four for very long trips
>and outings where I may not want to recharge) or to just use one or two?

It is wise to have as many as you need, and no more.

In this respect, NiMH batteries seem to be superior. They will give
more charge/discharge cycles when used heavily, last longer if you use
them only infrequently, and they're cheaper to replace when they die.

Dave

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I've owned a couple IBM ThinkPads over the years, and would not hesitate
to get another as they are IMHO among the best laptops available, but my
one complaint about them is the battery life - it doesn't seem to take
long at all before the battery will no longer take a charge (couple
years at best).

The irony of it all is that the best rechargeable life I've ever seen BY
FAR was from NiCads... specifically, the pair of 2.4V NiCad packs that
came with my Milwaukee screwgun (http://tinyurl.com/3pu3c - I post this
link only because I so highly recommend these things; these are NOT your
little toy Black & Decker Power Driver!). The original kit I bought in
1990 for just over $200 (Milwaukee sells the exact same unit today, for
just slightly less) included two batteries and a quick-charger. The
first one stopped taking a charge after about eight years, the second
only a couple years ago. The first replacement battery (now 6 years
old) is still holding out fine. The driver itself still churns along
nicely, and this thing sees a LOT of heavy use.

Ron wrote:

> Anyone who has owned a laptop with lithium ion batteries for a couple of
> years or so notices that battery life goes down. It may be that there
> is something about the technology that impacts the accuracy of the power
> meter on the computer when using them, but I find that in my subnote I
> have lost about 35-40% in three years.
>
> The one that came with my daughter's Canon digicam pretty well died
> after two years of moderate use. So, here are my questions:
>
> - what can one expect from today's batteries in terms of life span (eg.,
> mainly the prioritory ones that come with cameras like my 5060)? Is it
> true that these batteries really are only good for a couple of years
> under the best of circumstances.
>
> - is there an appreciable loss of capacity over a one or two year period
> when (a) the battery is used frequently; (b) it is kept pretty much in
> reserve or used infrequently?
>
> - are there specific guidelines to storage (eg., keep them in a
> refridgerator, keep them partially discharged, etc.)?
>
> - is it wise to have multiple batteries (I have four for very long trips
> and outings where I may not want to recharge) or to just use one or two?
>
> I am mainly interested in practical hands on knowledge and experience.
> There are pros and cons of putting proprietary batteries in cameras (I
> generally prefer NiMh's, though I must say I do like the convenience of
> a single small battery). The marketeers say they can be charged and
> discharged many hundreds of times but this become pretty insignificant
> if the lifespan and usuable camera time is shrinking all the while. And,
> if the batteries can simply die after sitting on the shelf for a couple
> of years one must surely approach the eBay type sales (in which the
> battery costs far less than the postage) without knowing the date of
> manufacturing.
>
> Thanks.
>
> /ron
>

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Hi,
My understanding of Li-Ion/LiPo is that it has a limited recharge
life. about 500 cycles.
So let it run flat. ( I know that sounds daft, but most (if not all)
LiPo/li-ion controllers cut off before it reaches 0v. ( from memory I think
it's 1.3v).I think for digi camera useNiMh's. cheaper, and longer lasting.
li-ion/LiPo are lighter,so a real advantage in remote control models( I fly
planes) and dv cameras.. Also LiPo/Li-ion are more likely to catch fire if
your charger goes a bit wobbly) anyhow lots and lots of info on
batteries/chargers ect at rc groups website, this is the link

http://www.rcgroups.com/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=129
"Ron" <rgood@netzero.com> wrote in message
news:jdeEd.55885$m45.20278@fe05.lga...
> Anyone who has owned a laptop with lithium ion batteries for a couple of
> years or so notices that battery life goes down. It may be that there is
> something about the technology that impacts the accuracy of the power
> meter on the computer when using them, but I find that in my subnote I
> have lost about 35-40% in three years.
>
> The one that came with my daughter's Canon digicam pretty well died after
> two years of moderate use. So, here are my questions:
>
> - what can one expect from today's batteries in terms of life span (eg.,
> mainly the prioritory ones that come with cameras like my 5060)? Is it
> true that these batteries really are only good for a couple of years under
> the best of circumstances.
>
> - is there an appreciable loss of capacity over a one or two year period
> when (a) the battery is used frequently; (b) it is kept pretty much in
> reserve or used infrequently?
>
> - are there specific guidelines to storage (eg., keep them in a
> refridgerator, keep them partially discharged, etc.)?
>
> - is it wise to have multiple batteries (I have four for very long trips
> and outings where I may not want to recharge) or to just use one or two?
>
> I am mainly interested in practical hands on knowledge and experience.
> There are pros and cons of putting proprietary batteries in cameras (I
> generally prefer NiMh's, though I must say I do like the convenience of a
> single small battery). The marketeers say they can be charged and
> discharged many hundreds of times but this become pretty insignificant if
> the lifespan and usuable camera time is shrinking all the while. And, if
> the batteries can simply die after sitting on the shelf for a couple of
> years one must surely approach the eBay type sales (in which the battery
> costs far less than the postage) without knowing the date of
> manufacturing.
>
> Thanks.
>
> /ron
>