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Nikon RAW Beginner's Question / Dilemma

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Anonymous
January 12, 2005 8:46:51 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Nikon RAW Beginner's Question / Dilemma
I'm looking to finally make the move from 35 mm to a digital SLR
(probably the Nikon D70).
I want relatively immediate good prints AND the ability to play around
with the RAWs in Nikon Capture and/or the Photoshop CS RAW plugin.
Unfortunately, the D70 only allows for simultaneous RAW / "basic" JPEG settings
(which I've seen and note are overly compressed). If the D70 made simultaneous
RAW / "fine" JPEGs, I wouldn't have a problem.
I have very little experience and skills in using Nikon Capture and
Photoshop CS's RAW plug-in...that will take me a long time to acquire. Is
there any RAW editing software that has "presets" (portrait, landscape, vivid,
etc.) that would allow me to do a decent (although not perfect) job initially
until I pick up editing skills later on? Perhaps there is software that would
approximately equal the D70's algorithmic presets for making jpegs (in
portrait, landscape, vivid, etc.)?? Thanks for any advice.
Anonymous
January 12, 2005 8:46:52 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 12 Jan 2005 17:46:51 GMT, in rec.photo.digital xtx99@aol.com
(Xtx99) wrote:
> I have very little experience and skills in using Nikon Capture and
>Photoshop CS's RAW plug-in...that will take me a long time to acquire. Is
>there any RAW editing software that has "presets" (portrait, landscape, vivid,
>etc.) that would allow me to do a decent (although not perfect) job initially
>until I pick up editing skills later on? Perhaps there is software that would
>approximately equal the D70's algorithmic presets for making jpegs (in
>portrait, landscape, vivid, etc.)?? Thanks for any advice.

All the raw processing software allows for quick processing using the
camera settings as they were enabled at the time of the shot. I
believe you could use Capture to process batches of photos this way.
________________________________________________________
Ed Ruf Lifetime AMA# 344007 (Usenet@EdwardG.Ruf.com)
See images taken with my CP-990/5700 & D70 at
http://EdwardGRuf.com
Anonymous
January 12, 2005 9:15:25 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 12 Jan 2005 17:46:51 GMT, xtx99@aol.com (Xtx99) wrote:

>Nikon RAW Beginner's Question / Dilemma
> I'm looking to finally make the move from 35 mm to a digital SLR
>(probably the Nikon D70).

Good choice.

> I want relatively immediate good prints AND the ability to play around
>with the RAWs in Nikon Capture and/or the Photoshop CS RAW plugin.
>Unfortunately, the D70 only allows for simultaneous RAW / "basic" JPEG settings
>(which I've seen and note are overly compressed).

Yes, they are great for quickly previewing (identifying which NEF file
you should be editing basically) but not good enough to make a print
from.

> If the D70 made simultaneous
>RAW / "fine" JPEGs, I wouldn't have a problem.

This should be fixed in the hacked firmware.

> I have very little experience and skills in using Nikon Capture and
>Photoshop CS's RAW plug-in...that will take me a long time to acquire. Is
>there any RAW editing software that has "presets" (portrait, landscape, vivid,
>etc.) that would allow me to do a decent (although not perfect) job initially
>until I pick up editing skills later on? Perhaps there is software that would
>approximately equal the D70's algorithmic presets for making jpegs (in
>portrait, landscape, vivid, etc.)?? Thanks for any advice.

I don't have any experience of that sort of software, but what I did
(and recommend you do) is shoot Fine JPEG until you've got your RAW
workflow sorted out.

--
Owamanga!
Related resources
Anonymous
January 12, 2005 9:51:08 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 13:20:12 -0500, Ed Ruf <egruf_usenet@cox.net>
wrote:

>On 12 Jan 2005 17:46:51 GMT, in rec.photo.digital xtx99@aol.com
>(Xtx99) wrote:
>> I have very little experience and skills in using Nikon Capture and
>>Photoshop CS's RAW plug-in...that will take me a long time to acquire. Is
>>there any RAW editing software that has "presets" (portrait, landscape, vivid,
>>etc.) that would allow me to do a decent (although not perfect) job initially
>>until I pick up editing skills later on? Perhaps there is software that would
>>approximately equal the D70's algorithmic presets for making jpegs (in
>>portrait, landscape, vivid, etc.)?? Thanks for any advice.
>
>All the raw processing software allows for quick processing using the
>camera settings as they were enabled at the time of the shot. I
>believe you could use Capture to process batches of photos this way.

Eh?

I use the Photoshop plugin, and there is nothing quick about going
through 130 NEF's and saving them as JPEGs. (I guess that's a plugin
rather than software, but anyway). Yes the camera settings are the
default ones, but you still need to manually adjust shadow/exposure to
your preference, no presets or 'auto' button available there.

I did play with a DOS program that can batch convert NEF to JPEG, but
it won't do auto levels or presets like the OP wants.

I think it was this one, DCRAW:

http://www.insflug.org/raw/

--
Owamanga!
Anonymous
January 12, 2005 9:51:09 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 18:51:08 GMT, in rec.photo.digital Owamanga
<nomail@hotmail.com> wrote:

>Eh?
>
>I use the Photoshop plugin, and there is nothing quick about going
>through 130 NEF's and saving them as JPEGs. (I guess that's a plugin
>rather than software, but anyway). Yes the camera settings are the
>default ones, but you still need to manually adjust shadow/exposure to
>your preference, no presets or 'auto' button available there.
>
>I did play with a DOS program that can batch convert NEF to JPEG, but
>it won't do auto levels or presets like the OP wants.


I read/"If the D70 made simultaneous
RAW / "fine" JPEGs, I wouldn't have a problem."
The end result of what I suggested is just this, no?
________________________________________________________
Ed Ruf Lifetime AMA# 344007 (Usenet@EdwardG.Ruf.com)
See images taken with my CP-990/5700 & D70 at
http://EdwardGRuf.com
Anonymous
January 12, 2005 10:32:19 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 14:18:40 -0500, Ed Ruf <egruf_usenet@cox.net>
wrote:

>On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 18:51:08 GMT, in rec.photo.digital Owamanga
><nomail@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>>Eh?
>>
>>I use the Photoshop plugin, and there is nothing quick about going
>>through 130 NEF's and saving them as JPEGs. (I guess that's a plugin
>>rather than software, but anyway). Yes the camera settings are the
>>default ones, but you still need to manually adjust shadow/exposure to
>>your preference, no presets or 'auto' button available there.
>>
>>I did play with a DOS program that can batch convert NEF to JPEG, but
>>it won't do auto levels or presets like the OP wants.
>
>
>I read/"If the D70 made simultaneous
>RAW / "fine" JPEGs, I wouldn't have a problem."
>The end result of what I suggested is just this, no?

Yes.

I was just questioning the 'quick' part, but if you are correct, and
Nikons Capture software can do bulk unattended conversion from NEF to
Fine JPEG, then speed really isn't an issue.

I know I can't do this with Photoshop and the PS RAW importer.

--
Owamanga!
Anonymous
January 12, 2005 10:32:20 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 19:32:19 GMT, in rec.photo.digital Owamanga
<nomail@hotmail.com> wrote:

>On Wed, 12 Jan 2005 14:18:40 -0500, Ed Ruf <egruf_usenet@cox.net>
>wrote:

>>I read/"If the D70 made simultaneous
>>RAW / "fine" JPEGs, I wouldn't have a problem."
>>The end result of what I suggested is just this, no?
>
>Yes.
>
>I was just questioning the 'quick' part, but if you are correct, and
>Nikons Capture software can do bulk unattended conversion from NEF to
>Fine JPEG, then speed really isn't an issue.

Just checked and in batch mode you have the option to use:

1. the current settings in Capture
2. the settings in the file (camera's as shot setup)
3. any saved setting files for Capture you have.
----------
Ed Ruf Lifetime AMA# 344007 (Usenet@EdwardG.Ruf.com)
See images taken with my CP-990/5700 & D70 at
http://edwardgruf.com/Digital_Photography/General/index...
Anonymous
January 13, 2005 12:56:52 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Xtx99" <xtx99@aol.com> wrote in message
news:20050112124651.01052.00000086@mb-m23.aol.com...
> Nikon RAW Beginner's Question / Dilemma
> I'm looking to finally make the move from 35 mm to a digital SLR
> (probably the Nikon D70).
> I want relatively immediate good prints AND the ability to play
around
> with the RAWs in Nikon Capture and/or the Photoshop CS RAW plugin.
> Unfortunately, the D70 only allows for simultaneous RAW / "basic" JPEG
settings
> (which I've seen and note are overly compressed). If the D70 made
simultaneous
> RAW / "fine" JPEGs, I wouldn't have a problem.

Just use the RAW picture files and get Polyview, which prints directly from
them in batches. Actually, so does Picture Project, which is included with
the camera, but Polyview is much nicer. Those two programs also have good
automated level adjustments routines. You can also do it in Photoshop CS,
though you need to create an action that does that.

Either Polyview or Picture Project will also export your batched RAW files
to any kind of JPEG you like. It takes only a couple minutes to export 50 or
more RAW files to JPEG.

Given the existence of these two programs, the RAW+JPEG setting is not only
redundant, but it needlessly slows down your shooting and takes up memory
card space. It is less than worthless in that context.

Nikon Capture is not worth screwing around with. The RAW conversion utility
in Photoshop CS is far better and more versatile. Capture will replace the
Adobe utility, so if you install Capture you have to delete it out of your
Photoshop plug-ins.
Anonymous
January 13, 2005 1:02:18 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

We do have a D70 and a D100, using them mostly for professional sports
photos an horse portraits.

Two wall calenders were made from the pictures.

This said, note that we did not (yet) use RAW but just the best JPG
quality available.

If you don't to much editing, IMHO there is not much point in using RAW.
We do very few editing, just cropping is usual.

I do intend to switch to shooting RAW some day, as I do see that the
color dynamic is greater (3*12 Bit instead of 3*8 Bit).

My intended work flow then is to convert the RAW files to 16 bit JP2
with a compression rate according to the ISO value the picture was taken
with. This will reduce the file size greatly, will not do considerable
damage to the picture details and preserve the color dynamic.

I use Thumbs Plus 2000 as a picture database. Same can load NEF and can
load and save JP2 (and many commonly used picture formats).

-Michael
Anonymous
January 13, 2005 11:05:21 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Owamanga wrote:
> On 12 Jan 2005 17:46:51 GMT, xtx99@aol.com (Xtx99) wrote:
>
>
>>Nikon RAW Beginner's Question / Dilemma
>> I'm looking to finally make the move from 35 mm to a digital SLR
>>(probably the Nikon D70).
>
>
> Good choice.
>
>
>> I want relatively immediate good prints AND the ability to play around
>>with the RAWs in Nikon Capture and/or the Photoshop CS RAW plugin.
>>Unfortunately, the D70 only allows for simultaneous RAW / "basic" JPEG settings
>>(which I've seen and note are overly compressed).
>
>
> Yes, they are great for quickly previewing (identifying which NEF file
> you should be editing basically) but not good enough to make a print
> from.
>
>
>>If the D70 made simultaneous
>>RAW / "fine" JPEGs, I wouldn't have a problem.
>
>
> This should be fixed in the hacked firmware.
>
>
>> I have very little experience and skills in using Nikon Capture and
>>Photoshop CS's RAW plug-in...that will take me a long time to acquire. Is
>>there any RAW editing software that has "presets" (portrait, landscape, vivid,
>>etc.) that would allow me to do a decent (although not perfect) job initially
>>until I pick up editing skills later on? Perhaps there is software that would
>>approximately equal the D70's algorithmic presets for making jpegs (in
>>portrait, landscape, vivid, etc.)?? Thanks for any advice.
>
>
> I don't have any experience of that sort of software, but what I did
> (and recommend you do) is shoot Fine JPEG until you've got your RAW
> workflow sorted out.
>
> --
> Owamanga!
Hi there, any ideas where one may be able to DL the D70 hacked firmware.
Has anyone any comments ?
Thanks.
Bernard.
January 13, 2005 3:02:19 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Michael Schnell" <mschnell_at_bschnell_dot_de@aol.com> wrote in message
news:cs438r$nus$00$1@news.t-online.com...
> We do have a D70 and a D100, using them mostly for professional sports
> photos an horse portraits.
>
> Two wall calenders were made from the pictures.
>
> This said, note that we did not (yet) use RAW but just the best JPG
> quality available.
>
> If you don't to much editing, IMHO there is not much point in using RAW.
> We do very few editing, just cropping is usual.
>
> I do intend to switch to shooting RAW some day, as I do see that the
> color dynamic is greater (3*12 Bit instead of 3*8 Bit).
>
> My intended work flow then is to convert the RAW files to 16 bit JP2
> with a compression rate according to the ISO value the picture was taken
> with. This will reduce the file size greatly, will not do considerable
> damage to the picture details and preserve the color dynamic.
>
> I use Thumbs Plus 2000 as a picture database. Same can load NEF and can
> load and save JP2 (and many commonly used picture formats).
>
> -Michael

I have to concur with this view, anyone who is thinking of auto-levels
correction on a Raw-->jpeg would be btter off shooting in fine Jpeg to
start.
Anonymous
January 13, 2005 4:27:05 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Thu, 13 Jan 2005 08:05:21 +0200, Bernard P Rother
<bprother_REMOVE_THIS1_@intekom.co.za> wrote:

>Hi there, any ideas where one may be able to DL the D70 hacked firmware.

Join this yahoo group, then you'll be the first to know when they get
the firmware to do something interesting:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/nikond70hak/

--
Owamanga!
Anonymous
January 13, 2005 5:17:46 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In message <a8sau0p0ugls90ust9jold0ph9dkhjc5k3@4ax.com>,
Owamanga <nomail@hotmail.com> wrote:

>I did play with a DOS program that can batch convert NEF to JPEG, but
>it won't do auto levels or presets like the OP wants.
>
>I think it was this one, DCRAW:

That's not a DOS program. It won't run in DOS because it calls 32-bit
Windows libraries.

It is a 32-bit "console mode" program, which runs in VGA text video
mode.
--

<>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<>
John P Sheehy <JPS@no.komm>
><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> <>>< ><<> ><<> <>><
Anonymous
January 13, 2005 5:25:05 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In message <cs438r$nus$00$1@news.t-online.com>,
Michael Schnell <mschnell_at_bschnell_dot_de@aol.com> wrote:

>I do intend to switch to shooting RAW some day, as I do see that the
>color dynamic is greater (3*12 Bit instead of 3*8 Bit).

An 8-bit gamma2.2-adjusted file actually has more potential dynamic
range than a 12-bit linear file. The ratio of intensity in the former,
for the max value divided by the minimum non-zero value is 196,964.7:1.
The ratio for the latter is only 4095:1.

The only reason that the RAW has more dynamic range is that in
converting to JPEG, the camera drops some of the highlights, and clouds
the shadows with JPG artifacts.
--

<>>< ><<> ><<> <>>< ><<> <>>< <>>< ><<>
John P Sheehy <JPS@no.komm>
><<> <>>< <>>< ><<> <>>< ><<> ><<> <>><
!