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20D Canon Battery pack with AA batteries

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Anonymous
January 20, 2005 8:27:22 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I find that standard rechargeable AA batteries in the battery pack for
the Canon 20D just don't cut it. Very short life. The 151 or whatever the
standard batteries (two in the pack) work fine. Is this just me? Do
non-rechargeable work better?

My real question here is I would like the ability to use some form a AA
battery, preferably non-rechargeable in a pinch.

--
Joseph Meehan

26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math
Anonymous
January 20, 2005 8:27:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Joseph Meehan" <sligojoe_Spamno@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:_RRHd.41627$re1.35163@fe2.columbus.rr.com...
> I find that standard rechargeable AA batteries in the battery pack for
> the Canon 20D just don't cut it. Very short life. The 151 or whatever
> the standard batteries (two in the pack) work fine. Is this just me? Do
> non-rechargeable work better?
>
> My real question here is I would like the ability to use some form a AA
> battery, preferably non-rechargeable in a pinch.
>
> --
> Joseph Meehan
>
> 26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math
>

Well, I tried Duracell Alkaline AAs in mine when I first got it, and got
zero shots with it. First press of the shutter button, and the battery
level went to nada.

--
Skip Middleton
http://www.shadowcatcherimagery.com
Anonymous
January 20, 2005 8:27:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

> I find that standard rechargeable AA batteries in the battery pack for
> the Canon 20D just don't cut it. Very short life. The 151 or whatever
the
> standard batteries (two in the pack) work fine. Is this just me? Do
> non-rechargeable work better?
>
> My real question here is I would like the ability to use some form a
AA
> battery, preferably non-rechargeable in a pinch.

It's going to depend on the battery types in question. In the
rechargeable camp, you have NiCads with around 1500 milliamp-hours or less
for AA (I've seen some very cheap brands with MUCH less), and NiMh AA
batteries with 1800-2300 milliamp-hours. There aren't any rechargeable AA
lithium cells that I'm aware of.

In the non-rechargeable camp, you have everything from low-grade AAs
(probably 1000 milliamp-hours or less) to lithium AAs at 2900(!)
milliamp-hours.

The standard BP-511 is rated at 1300 mAh, which is a bit deceiving - it's
at 7.4 volts, meaning the overall energy delivered would be about 9.6
watt-hours, whereas a pair of NiCads (2.4 volts, 1500 mAh) would be 3.6
watt-hours, a pair of NiMh cells (2.4 volts, 2000 mAh) would be 4.8
watt-hours, and a pair of lithium photos (3 volts, 2900 mAh) would be 8.7
watt-hours. As you can see, there's quite a variety!

Myself, I really despise using non-rechargeable batteries, they're just
too expensive. For the price of 8 lithium AA cells, you can pick up a
BP-511 clone that will be much easier to manage, hold a good amount of
current, and let you reuse it hundreds of times.

Of course, to each his own, and if you may find yourself where you just
can't charge your BP-511s, a backpack full of photo-lithiums would do you
well. (Of course, it could also be argued that a backpack full of BP-511
clones would be lighter, easier to manage, and in the long run, less
expensive.)

steve
Related resources
Anonymous
January 20, 2005 8:27:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Joseph Meehan wrote:
> I find that standard rechargeable AA batteries in the battery pack
> for the Canon 20D just don't cut it. Very short life. The 151 or
> whatever the standard batteries (two in the pack) work fine. Is this
> just me? Do non-rechargeable work better?
>
> My real question here is I would like the ability to use some form
> a AA battery, preferably non-rechargeable in a pinch.

Here's my post from Dec 27 or so:

"
At the original evaluation, I took a couple pictures in each
configuration. Now I have done this:

Duracell AA Alkalines:
Loaded right up again, took a dozen RAW picts, turned it off. Turned it
on, got the low battery flasher, turned it off, removed the battery
magazine, reinserted it, turned it on, got a half-battery picture on the
LCD, took forty Large Fine pictures (nearly all with flash), got the low
battery flasher, couldn't get anything else under any conditions.

Panasonic 2100 mAh rechargables, fresh from the chargers:
Loaded right up, took a dozen RAW pictures, turned it off. Turned it on,
got the half-battery picture, took six bursts of Large Fine pictures,
each burst running until it wouldn't take any more while it wrote 20 or
21 pictures to disk. Before the last burst got the low battery flasher,
turned it off, turned it on, got the half-battery picture, took the last
burst. Got the flasher, turned it off, turned it on, nothing. Removed
the magazine, reinserted it, got the half-battery sign, took three
pictures, got the flasher. Same routine three more times, nine more
pictures. Removed the magazine, reinserted, not enough power to get any
function. Inserted the 511As and the second picture filled the
plain-vanilla Sandisk 512meg card, using up 481 plus overhead, 212
pictures total (I may have miscounted the RAWs).

So, they both worked, albeit with a bit more hassle than the Canon
"Packs". I suspect the 2500mAh AAs will perform proportionately, perhaps
230-240 Large Fines before packing it in.

So I ordered another 511A and the dual-charger. If you use two 511As in
the grip-pack, I reckon when they quit neither will be useful until
charged, and you'll never get back in phase unless you can charge both
at once, while using the single Pack until they catch up.

Anyone know how many Large Fines you can get from a 511 or a pair? Mine
still show "full" after about 400 total pictures."


Last weekend I shot about 500 from a pair of Stirlingtek 511s and the
full-battery picture is still rampant on a field of grey.

Resp'y

--
Frank ess
Anonymous
January 21, 2005 4:00:44 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

My limited experience has been about the same, maybe fewer per charge.

I had not tried the non-rechargables but your information does indicate
that they are an alternative for any time my 511's give out.

I am guessing the voltage required is just a tad high for the AA's.
They may have the capacity, but drop below the voltage threshold too soon.

Thanks




Frank ess wrote:
> Joseph Meehan wrote:
>> I find that standard rechargeable AA batteries in the battery pack
>> for the Canon 20D just don't cut it. Very short life. The 151 or
>> whatever the standard batteries (two in the pack) work fine. Is this
>> just me? Do non-rechargeable work better?
>>
>> My real question here is I would like the ability to use some form
>> a AA battery, preferably non-rechargeable in a pinch.
>
> Here's my post from Dec 27 or so:
>
> "
> At the original evaluation, I took a couple pictures in each
> configuration. Now I have done this:
>
> Duracell AA Alkalines:
> Loaded right up again, took a dozen RAW picts, turned it off. Turned
> it on, got the low battery flasher, turned it off, removed the battery
> magazine, reinserted it, turned it on, got a half-battery picture on
> the LCD, took forty Large Fine pictures (nearly all with flash), got
> the low battery flasher, couldn't get anything else under any
> conditions.
> Panasonic 2100 mAh rechargables, fresh from the chargers:
> Loaded right up, took a dozen RAW pictures, turned it off. Turned it
> on, got the half-battery picture, took six bursts of Large Fine
> pictures, each burst running until it wouldn't take any more while it
> wrote 20 or 21 pictures to disk. Before the last burst got the low
> battery flasher, turned it off, turned it on, got the half-battery
> picture, took the last burst. Got the flasher, turned it off, turned
> it on, nothing. Removed the magazine, reinserted it, got the
> half-battery sign, took three pictures, got the flasher. Same routine
> three more times, nine more pictures. Removed the magazine,
> reinserted, not enough power to get any function. Inserted the 511As
> and the second picture filled the plain-vanilla Sandisk 512meg card,
> using up 481 plus overhead, 212 pictures total (I may have miscounted
> the RAWs).
> So, they both worked, albeit with a bit more hassle than the Canon
> "Packs". I suspect the 2500mAh AAs will perform proportionately,
> perhaps 230-240 Large Fines before packing it in.
>
> So I ordered another 511A and the dual-charger. If you use two 511As
> in the grip-pack, I reckon when they quit neither will be useful until
> charged, and you'll never get back in phase unless you can charge both
> at once, while using the single Pack until they catch up.
>
> Anyone know how many Large Fines you can get from a 511 or a pair?
> Mine still show "full" after about 400 total pictures."
>
>
> Last weekend I shot about 500 from a pair of Stirlingtek 511s and the
> full-battery picture is still rampant on a field of grey.
>
> Resp'y

--
Joseph Meehan

26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math
January 23, 2005 1:41:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

> So I ordered another 511A and the dual-charger. If you use two 511As
in
> the grip-pack, I reckon when they quit neither will be useful until
> charged, and you'll never get back in phase unless you can charge
both
> at once, while using the single Pack until they catch up.

If running out of batteries is a legitimate concern, and would cause
you anxiety if it happened, then you could buy some cheap 511 clones,
if you watch around, you could pick up four of them for under $50
total. Charge them before you leave, and you've got PLENTY of reserve
in your bag.

steve
Anonymous
January 23, 2005 2:11:44 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Steve-O wrote:
>> So I ordered another 511A and the dual-charger. If you use two 511As
>> in the grip-pack, I reckon when they quit neither will be useful
>> until charged, and you'll never get back in phase unless you can
>> charge both at once, while using the single Pack until they catch up.
>
> If running out of batteries is a legitimate concern, and would cause
> you anxiety if it happened, then you could buy some cheap 511 clones,
> if you watch around, you could pick up four of them for under $50
> total. Charge them before you leave, and you've got PLENTY of reserve
> in your bag.
>

I can't imagine a circumstance when running out of batteries in a
digital camera is not a legitimate concern.

On January 15, in a "20D battery question" thread, I posted:
"I bought two
"For BP511 Replacement
Li-ion Battery 7.4V 1800mAh"
From Sterlingtek via Amazon.com

The order was for 1390mAh batteries, but 1800 was what Sterlingtek
delivered. They were $11.99 each, and arrived a week or so after the
order was placed. Shipping and handling was $9.98, pretty much at the
upper limit, my view, but the cost for each battery was $16.98.

When I received them I measured their voltages out of the package:
7.64 and 7.67

I charged them in the
"Canon
COMPACT POWER ADAPTER
CA-PS400"
which is like the regular charger, except it has two receptacles
side-by-side, and an outlet for the power cord allowing use of the
camera in an AC environment.

They charged one after the other, left to right: one light blinked;
changing batteries from one receptacle to the other, the blinking light
did not follow the battery. After charging (and the at-least-an-hour at
no-blink recommended for the second battery; meaning the first battery
got its own charge and the additional time-in-receptacle corresponding
to the charge time for the second battery and its subsequent hour), I
measured their voltages:
8.33 and 8.11, respectively.

After five days on the shelf:
8.30 and 8.10


That's it. Science marches on."

Now I can report a week's use of those two batteries has passed 1100
images and the full-battery symbol is still full. After 500 images they
were at 7.96 and 8.00 volts.

If I were prone to anxiety, it would be assuaged.

I wonder why the use of "pick up" as a euphemism for "acquired" or
"bought" or "stole" or "obtained" or "procured" has gained such
currency.

--
Frank ess

"Because of the Swiss Cheese nature of everyone's life experience and
education, the Whoosh Bird can drop a load on anyone's head, without
warning." -Albrecht Einstein
Anonymous
January 23, 2005 5:42:49 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Sun, 23 Jan 2005 11:11:44 -0800, "Frank ess" <frank@fshe2fs.com>
wrote:


>Now I can report a week's use of those two batteries has passed 1100
>images and the full-battery symbol is still full. After 500 images they
>were at 7.96 and 8.00 volts.


That may or may not be meaningful.

To be more meaningful, you'd need to
know the output voltage with some
reasonable current flowing.

When batteries "get weak" it's often
not so much from output voltage
decreasing, but from internal
resistance increasing.

That said -- I've had good luck
with NiMH batteries holding charge
(open circuit) for a good long time.


rafe b.
http://www.terrapinphoto.com
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 3:23:48 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

> I can't imagine a circumstance when running out of batteries in a
> digital camera is not a legitimate concern.

Well, it depends on what you're doing. When I shoot, I'll typically take
a few hundred shots over a couple of hours, and with the single battery
pack, the battery usually isn't even half-way spent. But hey, there's still
an occasional trip where I need lots more, so I do have more than one.

My main point was just that with the capacity and inexpensiveness of the
BP-511 clones, it doesn't make much sense to use AA batteries.

> I wonder why the use of "pick up" as a euphemism for "acquired" or
> "bought" or "stole" or "obtained" or "procured" has gained such
> currency.

You're not trying to start ANOTHER debate on language, are you?

steve
Anonymous
January 24, 2005 3:23:49 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Steve Wolfe wrote:
>> I can't imagine a circumstance when running out of batteries in a
>> digital camera is not a legitimate concern.
>
> Well, it depends on what you're doing. When I shoot, I'll typically
> take a few hundred shots over a couple of hours, and with the single
> battery pack, the battery usually isn't even half-way spent. But
> hey, there's still an occasional trip where I need lots more, so I do
> have more than one.
>

Such is the dividend of investing in experience. I prefer to piggy-back
on others', but it's not always available.

> My main point was just that with the capacity and inexpensiveness of
> the BP-511 clones, it doesn't make much sense to use AA batteries.
>

I agree; however, my secondary camera is a Nikon CP8700, notoriously
voracious battery-eater, so the accumulation is not entirely in vain.

>> I wonder why the use of "pick up" as a euphemism for "acquired" or
>> "bought" or "stole" or "obtained" or "procured" has gained such
>> currency.
>
> You're not trying to start ANOTHER debate on language, are you?
>

Why yes. How could you tell?

Resp'y,


--
Frank ess

Forecasting is difficult. Particularly about the Future.
—Deepak Gupta
Anonymous
January 25, 2005 4:53:21 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Steve Wolfe wrote:
>> I can't imagine a circumstance when running out of batteries in a
>> digital camera is not a legitimate concern.
>
> Well, it depends on what you're doing. When I shoot, I'll typically
> take a few hundred shots over a couple of hours, and with the single
> battery pack, the battery usually isn't even half-way spent. But
> hey, there's still an occasional trip where I need lots more, so I do
> have more than one.
>
> My main point was just that with the capacity and inexpensiveness of
> the BP-511 clones, it doesn't make much sense to use AA batteries.
>
As a regular thing, I would agree. However I am traveling and if I get
unexpectedly stuck and need some additional power, AA are easy to find
anywhere. The 511 I don't happen to have will not be easy to find. No
matter how many I bring, you know something will happen. After doing
weddings way back in the 60's, I know that anything that can happen will.


>> I wonder why the use of "pick up" as a euphemism for "acquired" or
>> "bought" or "stole" or "obtained" or "procured" has gained such
>> currency.
>
> You're not trying to start ANOTHER debate on language, are you?
>
> steve

--
Joseph Meehan

26 + 6 = 1 It's Irish Math
!