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Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 8, 2005 7:41:27 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
there needs?

With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.
How can you tell if you have enough?

More about : memory

Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 8, 2005 7:59:54 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

General rules for OSX are pretty easy-Give it as much RAM as you can
afford. Having said that, a reasonable amount of RAM depends greatly on
what you are doing. For simple Office/web browsing, 256-512Meg is
probably adequate. Throw in Photoshop/movie editing tasks, and you
probably want to go to a Gig. For what it is worth, I have a G5 with a
Gig, and often have a dozen programs open. I rarely see slowdowns from
too little RAM. Having said that, my image editing work is very light,
though I do quite a bit of DNA/protein sequence analysis. Others who do
more image editing could give better recommendations than I.

HTH

--
Dave Fritzinger
March 8, 2005 9:09:20 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

dfritzin@hotmail.com wrote:
> General rules for OSX are pretty easy-Give it as much RAM as you can
> afford. Having said that, a reasonable amount of RAM depends greatly on
> what you are doing. For simple Office/web browsing, 256-512Meg is
> probably adequate. Throw in Photoshop/movie editing tasks, and you
> probably want to go to a Gig. For what it is worth, I have a G5 with a
> Gig, and often have a dozen programs open. I rarely see slowdowns from
> too little RAM. Having said that, my image editing work is very light,
> though I do quite a bit of DNA/protein sequence analysis. Others who do
> more image editing could give better recommendations than I.
>
> HTH
>
> --
> Dave Fritzinger
>


A Gig is plenty for most tasks. For Apple Motion it is recommended that
the machine be equipped with 2 Gig for optimum performamce.
Related resources
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 8, 2005 10:48:19 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <1110328887.740811.11710@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
"-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:

> How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
> there needs?
>
> With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
> afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.
> How can you tell if you have enough?

Use 'Activity Monitor' in the Utilities Folder of the Applications
Folder.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 8, 2005 11:07:53 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <1110328887.740811.11710@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
"-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:

> How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
> there needs?

Use the machine for a few days. Open Terminal and type "ls -la /var/vm"
and count how many swap files you've got. Bonus points if you take a
look at the timestamps on the files.

G

--
There's nothing quite like the joy of first hearing an Alvin & the Chipmunks
cover of Pink Floyd's "The Final Cut." "Not Now John" is especially sublime.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 8, 2005 11:36:38 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-:
> How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
> there needs?

It's easy. Max out your ram.

> With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
> afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.
> How can you tell if you have enough?

See above.

Davoud
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 9, 2005 12:23:39 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <112smkrs8s1762c@news.supernews.com>,
John <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:

> dfritzin@hotmail.com wrote:
> > General rules for OSX are pretty easy-Give it as much RAM as you can
> > afford. Having said that, a reasonable amount of RAM depends greatly on
> > what you are doing. For simple Office/web browsing, 256-512Meg is
> > probably adequate. Throw in Photoshop/movie editing tasks, and you
> > probably want to go to a Gig. For what it is worth, I have a G5 with a
> > Gig, and often have a dozen programs open. I rarely see slowdowns from
> > too little RAM. Having said that, my image editing work is very light,
> > though I do quite a bit of DNA/protein sequence analysis. Others who do
> > more image editing could give better recommendations than I.
> >
> > HTH
> >
> > --
> > Dave Fritzinger
> >
>
>
> A Gig is plenty for most tasks. For Apple Motion it is recommended that
> the machine be equipped with 2 Gig for optimum performamce.

I have 2GB and it does make a difference with Motion.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 9, 2005 1:14:45 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

>>How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
>>there needs?
>
> It's easy. Max out your ram.

That's like saying the best way to know if you're getting enough Vitamin
C is to take as many pills as humanly possible throughout the day.

Like most other things, if you need it, you KNOW you need it. I know
the hype is that 256 MB is not adequate for OSX, but I can tell you it's
fine for basic use. 512 MB is even better, but more than that will only
really make a difference if you're doing some pretty high end tasks.

I just got a mini and am upgrading to 512 MB as soon as my DIMM comes in
the mail, but for now, 256 MB enough to keep Safari and Mail open, and
iTunes (running), and the only time I see swap files being written is
when I open web pages with LOTS of flash or graphics. I can even run
Photoshop, open a pic and start editing, and I'm still doing okay.

I'm not saying more RAM won't help, but you have to consider the cost
vs. the benefit. If you go over 1 GB in those Powerbooks, you're
looking at a pretty hefty price tag.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 9, 2005 6:49:04 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

On 8 Mar 2005 16:41:27 -0800, "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-"
<nomads_05@yahoo.com> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:

>How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
>there needs?
>
>With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
>afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.

Are you seriously claiming that most newer Windows machines can't take
two gigs of RAM?

>How can you tell if you have enough?

When it doesn't hit the swapfile all the time while you're using it.
That said, RAM is dirt cheap right now. Just go ahead and max it out.




--
"...I doubt that I would ever buy a Mac. I've seen
what owning one can do to people. And I don't want
any part of that."

Rich Brooks
columnist for the
Southwest Florida
Herald-Tribune
March 9, 2005 6:49:05 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

Mayor of R'lyeh wrote:
> On 8 Mar 2005 16:41:27 -0800, "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-"
> <nomads_05@yahoo.com> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>
>
>>How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
>>there needs?
>>
>>With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
>>afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.
>
>
> Are you seriously claiming that most newer Windows machines can't take
> two gigs of RAM?
>
>

Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
machine can top that?
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 9, 2005 6:49:06 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

John wrote:

> Mayor of R'lyeh wrote:
>> On 8 Mar 2005 16:41:27 -0800, "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-"
>> <nomads_05@yahoo.com> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>>
>>
>>>How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
>>>there needs?
>>>
>>>With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
>>>afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.
>>
>>
>> Are you seriously claiming that most newer Windows machines can't take
>> two gigs of RAM?
>>
>>
>
> Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
> machine can top that?

A number of AMD64 machines can take 16 or more. A few can take 64.

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 9, 2005 8:19:26 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

On Tue, 08 Mar 2005 19:52:50 -0800, John <nospam@nospam.com> chose to
bless us with the following wisdom:

>Mayor of R'lyeh wrote:
>> On 8 Mar 2005 16:41:27 -0800, "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-"
>> <nomads_05@yahoo.com> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>>
>>
>>>How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
>>>there needs?
>>>
>>>With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
>>>afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.
>>
>>
>> Are you seriously claiming that most newer Windows machines can't take
>> two gigs of RAM?
>>
>>
>
>Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
>machine can top that?

Almost all the AMD64 based ones can. Some of the XEON based ones can
take that much.



--
"...I doubt that I would ever buy a Mac. I've seen
what owning one can do to people. And I don't want
any part of that."

Rich Brooks
columnist for the
Southwest Florida
Herald-Tribune
March 9, 2005 9:39:20 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

in absolute truth, there's not really any such thing as too much memory
- although, admittedly, there's not a huge point to having more than
four Gb at the moment, unless you're doing vast (and i mean VAST) 3d
renders/high-end video work/huge A1+ poster design or so forth. i run
on 1.25 Gb in my G5 at the moment, and i do a lot of video editing and
3d rendering. it'd be nice to have ore, but there's no pressing need
for it, really.
if your computer is running slow, there are plenty of decent
optimisation applications out there, especially in sites like
sourceforge and versiontracker. always take care to read the feedback
though!
also, it does you good to occassionally run a script called applejack -
you can find it on both sourceforge and versiontracker; it gives you
the opportunity to cover the stuff that cron scripts don't often go
for, such as cache removal, permissions repairs, and page file
deletion. i believe the monthly cron script does that, but os x only
runs the daily one with any regularity.
another good app for cleaning your system and maintaining it is called
cocktail - you can get from apple's website; it's a shareware app that
just gives you access to more of the 'under-the-skin' features that
apple have (quite proficiently) hidden from plain view.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 9, 2005 2:37:31 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <uce-9902E5.20075308032005@comcast.dca.giganews.com>,
Gregory Weston <uce@splook.com> wrote:

> In article <1110328887.740811.11710@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
> "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
> > there needs?
>
> Use the machine for a few days. Open Terminal and type "ls -la /var/vm"
> and count how many swap files you've got. Bonus points if you take a
> look at the timestamps on the files.

A variation is to use top in terminal, and inspect the pageouts and
pageins numbers. If the numbers inside the brackets are frequently
non-zero, you need more memory.

e.g. top -u -s5 10 will produce a list of the top 10 cpu guzzlers
updated every 5 seconds.

Do not be swayed by the physmem numbers you see in the line above that.
OS X is a lazy reclaimer. It won't free up memory till something really
really needs it, so the 'free' number is almost always small, even if
you are wallowing in excess memory.

--
I thought I would be the last on earth to mung my e-mail address.
fsnospam$elliott$$
1A96 3CF7 637F 896B C810 E199 7E5C A9E4 8E59 E248
March 9, 2005 7:56:08 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue, 08 Mar
2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do comp.sys.mac.misc,
yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es bono tan
el:

>Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
>machine can top that?

My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...

deKay
--
+ Lofi Gaming - www.lofi-gaming.org.uk [Gamertag: deKay 01]
|- Gaming Diary - www.lofi-gaming.org.uk/diary/
|- My computer runs at 3.5MHz and I'm proud of that
|- Hurry up and go touch it.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 9, 2005 7:56:09 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>, deKay
<andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:

> Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue,
> 08 Mar 2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
> comp.sys.mac.misc, yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com>
> fornis do marikano es bono tan el:
>
> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
> >machine can top that?
>
> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
>
> deKay

Well, my dad's bigger than your dad! <g>
--
-Barb, <www.jamlady.eboard.com&gt; Sweet Potato Follies added 2/24/05.
"I read recipes the way I read science fiction: I get to the end and
say,'Well, that's not going to happen.'" - Comedian Rita Rudner,
performance at New York, New York, January 10, 2005.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 9, 2005 7:58:53 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>,
deKay <andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:

> Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue, 08 Mar
> 2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do comp.sys.mac.misc,
> yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es bono tan
> el:
>
> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
> >machine can top that?
>
> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
>
> deKay

There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
machine's RAM requirements.
March 9, 2005 11:42:53 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Wed, 09 Mar
2005 16:58:53 GMT, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do comp.sys.mac.misc,
yawatina tan reek esk TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com> fornis do marikano es
bono tan el:

>> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
>> >machine can top that?
>>
>> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
>>
>There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
>machine's RAM requirements.

I'm not disputing that. The question was "What Windows machine can top
that?", so I answered it.

deKay
--
+ Lofi Gaming - www.lofi-gaming.org.uk [Gamertag: deKay 01]
|- Gaming Diary - www.lofi-gaming.org.uk/diary/
|- My computer runs at 3.5MHz and I'm proud of that
|- Hurry up and go touch it.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 10, 2005 12:33:40 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <Nowhere-82C555.19481908032005@news.central.cox.net>,
TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com> wrote:

> In article <1110328887.740811.11710@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
> "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> > How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
> > there needs?
> >
> > With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
> > afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.
> > How can you tell if you have enough?
>
> Use 'Activity Monitor' in the Utilities Folder of the Applications
> Folder.

More specifically: if the "Page outs" number is approximately the same
as the "Page ins" number, then you could use more memory. If the
"outs" is a lot smaller, then you have enough memory.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 10, 2005 8:50:15 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <112ssmudaad8e29@news.supernews.com>,
John <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:

> Mayor of R'lyeh wrote:
> > On 8 Mar 2005 16:41:27 -0800, "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-"
> > <nomads_05@yahoo.com> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
> >
> >
> >>How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
> >>there needs?
> >>
> >>With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
> >>afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.
> >
> >
> > Are you seriously claiming that most newer Windows machines can't take
> > two gigs of RAM?
> >
> >
>
> Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
> machine can top that?

I thought we were talkin' 'bout PowerBooks! When did the G5 PowerBook
come out? :) 
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 10, 2005 8:50:16 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

"Reginald Dwight" <regdwight@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:regdwight-5210BC.09501510032005@news.verizon.net...
> In article <112ssmudaad8e29@news.supernews.com>,
> John <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>> Mayor of R'lyeh wrote:
>> > On 8 Mar 2005 16:41:27 -0800, "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-"
>> > <nomads_05@yahoo.com> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
>> >
>> >
>> >>How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
>> >>there needs?
>> >>
>> >>With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
>> >>afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.
>> >
>> >
>> > Are you seriously claiming that most newer Windows machines can't take
>> > two gigs of RAM?
>> >
>> >
>>
>> Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
>> machine can top that?
>
> I thought we were talkin' 'bout PowerBooks! When did the G5 PowerBook
> come out? :) 

Some time ago, but they burst into flame the second they were switched on,
so Apple recalled all of them...
March 12, 2005 2:29:45 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:58:53 GMT, TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com>
wrote:

>In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>,
> deKay <andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:
>
>> Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue, 08 Mar
>> 2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do comp.sys.mac.misc,
>> yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es bono tan
>> el:
>>
>> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
>> >machine can top that?
>>
>> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
>>
>> deKay
>
>There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
>machine's RAM requirements.

Sure - on a desktop that much RAM tends to be silly and unnecessary,
whereas on a server I can clearly see needs and reasons for it.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 12, 2005 4:02:17 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

<foo@bar.com> wrote in message
news:mpr331hg8po7dtb3k0g9vt14u59d6idvk1@4ax.com...
> On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:58:53 GMT, TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com>
> wrote:
>
>>In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>,
>> deKay <andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:
>>
>>> Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue, 08
>>> Mar
>>> 2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
>>> comp.sys.mac.misc,
>>> yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es
>>> bono tan
>>> el:
>>>
>>> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
>>> >machine can top that?
>>>
>>> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
>>>
>>> deKay
>>
>>There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
>>machine's RAM requirements.
>
> Sure - on a desktop that much RAM tends to be silly and unnecessary,
> whereas on a server I can clearly see needs and reasons for it.

Video editing and 3D graphics and the like need large amounts of memory.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 12, 2005 10:15:13 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <1mxYd.71041$Tt.13735@fed1read05>,
"LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:

> <foo@bar.com> wrote in message
> news:mpr331hg8po7dtb3k0g9vt14u59d6idvk1@4ax.com...
> > On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:58:53 GMT, TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com>
> > wrote:
> >
> >>In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>,
> >> deKay <andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:
> >>
> >>> Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue, 08
> >>> Mar
> >>> 2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
> >>> comp.sys.mac.misc,
> >>> yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es
> >>> bono tan
> >>> el:
> >>>
> >>> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
> >>> >machine can top that?
> >>>
> >>> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
> >>>
> >>> deKay
> >>
> >>There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
> >>machine's RAM requirements.
> >
> > Sure - on a desktop that much RAM tends to be silly and unnecessary,
> > whereas on a server I can clearly see needs and reasons for it.
>
> Video editing and 3D graphics and the like need large amounts of memory.

Of course. I don't think it's reasonable for anyone to suggest the
'right' amount of RAM. It depends on too many factors. With OSX, the
'right' amount of RAM could be anywhere from 256 MB to 8 GB per system.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 12, 2005 11:06:31 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, Reginald Dwight wrote:

> In article <112ssmudaad8e29@news.supernews.com>,
> John <nospam@nospam.com> wrote:
>
> > Mayor of R'lyeh wrote:
> > > On 8 Mar 2005 16:41:27 -0800, "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-"
> > > <nomads_05@yahoo.com> chose to bless us with the following wisdom:
> > >
> > >>How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
> > >>there needs?
> > >>
> > >>With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as you can
> > >>afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of ram.
> > >
> > > Are you seriously claiming that most newer Windows machines can't take
> > > two gigs of RAM?
> >
> > Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
> > machine can top that?
>
> I thought we were talkin' 'bout PowerBooks! When did the G5 PowerBook
> come out? :) 

They haven't come out yet, but they're SO FAST they're available already!

tom

--
Things fall apart - it's scientific
March 13, 2005 1:19:20 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 01:02:17 -0700, "LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com>
wrote:

>
><foo@bar.com> wrote in message
>news:mpr331hg8po7dtb3k0g9vt14u59d6idvk1@4ax.com...
>> On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:58:53 GMT, TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>,
>>> deKay <andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue, 08
>>>> Mar
>>>> 2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
>>>> comp.sys.mac.misc,
>>>> yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es
>>>> bono tan
>>>> el:
>>>>
>>>> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
>>>> >machine can top that?
>>>>
>>>> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
>>>>
>>>> deKay
>>>
>>>There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
>>>machine's RAM requirements.
>>
>> Sure - on a desktop that much RAM tends to be silly and unnecessary,
>> whereas on a server I can clearly see needs and reasons for it.
>
>Video editing and 3D graphics and the like need large amounts of memory.

Sure. I can see 2GB easy. Seeing more on a *desktop* is difficult.
Can you provide examples of times you've needed more?
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 13, 2005 1:19:21 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

<foo@bar.com> wrote in message
news:fmq631dus51v2kqr71a5tk0mh62616ciqf@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 01:02:17 -0700, "LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>><foo@bar.com> wrote in message
>>news:mpr331hg8po7dtb3k0g9vt14u59d6idvk1@4ax.com...
>>> On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:58:53 GMT, TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>,
>>>> deKay <andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue,
>>>>> 08
>>>>> Mar
>>>>> 2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
>>>>> comp.sys.mac.misc,
>>>>> yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es
>>>>> bono tan
>>>>> el:
>>>>>
>>>>> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
>>>>> >machine can top that?
>>>>>
>>>>> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
>>>>>
>>>>> deKay
>>>>
>>>>There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
>>>>machine's RAM requirements.
>>>
>>> Sure - on a desktop that much RAM tends to be silly and unnecessary,
>>> whereas on a server I can clearly see needs and reasons for it.
>>
>>Video editing and 3D graphics and the like need large amounts of memory.
>
> Sure. I can see 2GB easy. Seeing more on a *desktop* is difficult.
> Can you provide examples of times you've needed more?

The recommended *minimum* for real-time editing with Motion is 2GB.
March 13, 2005 3:48:13 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 16:13:04 -0700, "LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com>
wrote:

>
><foo@bar.com> wrote in message
>news:fmq631dus51v2kqr71a5tk0mh62616ciqf@4ax.com...
>> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 01:02:17 -0700, "LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>><foo@bar.com> wrote in message
>>>news:mpr331hg8po7dtb3k0g9vt14u59d6idvk1@4ax.com...
>>>> On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:58:53 GMT, TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>,
>>>>> deKay <andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue,
>>>>>> 08
>>>>>> Mar
>>>>>> 2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
>>>>>> comp.sys.mac.misc,
>>>>>> yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es
>>>>>> bono tan
>>>>>> el:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
>>>>>> >machine can top that?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> deKay
>>>>>
>>>>>There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
>>>>>machine's RAM requirements.
>>>>
>>>> Sure - on a desktop that much RAM tends to be silly and unnecessary,
>>>> whereas on a server I can clearly see needs and reasons for it.
>>>
>>>Video editing and 3D graphics and the like need large amounts of memory.
>>
>> Sure. I can see 2GB easy. Seeing more on a *desktop* is difficult.
>> Can you provide examples of times you've needed more?
>
>The recommended *minimum* for real-time editing with Motion is 2GB.

Actually, that's the recommended configuration (512M is minimum) but I
see your point - for the one out of every 50,000 or so people that
need that app, you'd want a workstation that does 2G. Fortunately,
every XP box on the planet does that if you can cram the RAM in there,
which most easily allow (ie does it have enough sockets, etc.) The OS
doesn't constrain that.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 13, 2005 6:03:33 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

nowhere wrote:
> in absolute truth, there's not really any such thing as too much memory
> - although, admittedly, there's not a huge point to having more than
> four Gb at the moment, unless you're doing vast (and i mean VAST) 3d
> renders/high-end video work/huge A1+ poster design or so forth.

Heh. I did quite a complex A0 poster in Omnigraffle last December, on my
15" Powerbook with 1GB. Everything was still fairly smooth until I was
almost finished, when I added one more item that must have hit some
internal limit and caused everything to go to ratshit. Taking twenty
seconds before moving the scrollbars - nice.

Pete
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 13, 2005 5:14:12 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

foo@bar.com wrote:
> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 01:02:17 -0700, "LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com>
> wrote:
>
>
>><foo@bar.com> wrote in message
>>news:mpr331hg8po7dtb3k0g9vt14u59d6idvk1@4ax.com...
>>
>>>On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:58:53 GMT, TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com>
>>>wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>,
>>>>deKay <andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue, 08
>>>>>Mar
>>>>>2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
>>>>>comp.sys.mac.misc,
>>>>>yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es
>>>>>bono tan
>>>>>el:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
>>>>>>machine can top that?
>>>>>
>>>>>My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
>>>>>
>>>>>deKay
>>>>
>>>>There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
>>>>machine's RAM requirements.
>>>
>>>Sure - on a desktop that much RAM tends to be silly and unnecessary,
>>>whereas on a server I can clearly see needs and reasons for it.
>>
>>Video editing and 3D graphics and the like need large amounts of memory.
>
>
> Sure. I can see 2GB easy. Seeing more on a *desktop* is difficult.
> Can you provide examples of times you've needed more?

I have 4GB in my G5 and I must say, most of the time its going to waste.
It usually looks something like

PhysMem: 300M wired, 415M active, 162M inactive, 877M used, 3.14G free

The only occasions i've used any significant amount was when printing
the full quality Firefox 1.0 release advertisement (from the EPS file)
and maybe when i've mucked around with Final Cut Pro HD or the demo of
Motion.

I'm not a video or multimedia person, i'm a network engineer. The
reason for the G5, we had a budget surplus and had to spend it. :-)

I'm probably going to end up running a Zope/Plone instance on it, only
because of all the available capacity that I leave behind.

--
Bruce.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 20, 2005 2:16:45 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <fmq631dus51v2kqr71a5tk0mh62616ciqf@4ax.com>, foo@bar.com
wrote:

> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 01:02:17 -0700, "LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> ><foo@bar.com> wrote in message
> >news:mpr331hg8po7dtb3k0g9vt14u59d6idvk1@4ax.com...
> >> On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:58:53 GMT, TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>>In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>,
> >>> deKay <andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue, 08
> >>>> Mar
> >>>> 2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
> >>>> comp.sys.mac.misc,
> >>>> yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es
> >>>> bono tan
> >>>> el:
> >>>>
> >>>> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
> >>>> >machine can top that?
> >>>>
> >>>> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
> >>>>
> >>>> deKay
> >>>
> >>>There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
> >>>machine's RAM requirements.
> >>
> >> Sure - on a desktop that much RAM tends to be silly and unnecessary,
> >> whereas on a server I can clearly see needs and reasons for it.
> >
> >Video editing and 3D graphics and the like need large amounts of memory.
>
> Sure. I can see 2GB easy. Seeing more on a *desktop* is difficult.
> Can you provide examples of times you've needed more?

Sure. Take someone using Photoshop elements, not even the pro version.
You shoot some high-rez images with your digital camera and want to put
them together in a pano. Easily you can surpass the 2GB barrier with a
large image. And when you get there, that 8GB limit is a far better
thing to have, not to mention the faster FSB as well

--
Regards,
JP
"The measure of a man is what he will do while
expecting that he will get nothing in return!"
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 20, 2005 2:18:20 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <ud3731lette7b9pv5cogfkskga2oe6mhbq@4ax.com>, foo@bar.com
wrote:

> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 16:13:04 -0700, "LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> ><foo@bar.com> wrote in message
> >news:fmq631dus51v2kqr71a5tk0mh62616ciqf@4ax.com...
> >> On Sat, 12 Mar 2005 01:02:17 -0700, "LawsonE" <nospam@nospam.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>>
> >>><foo@bar.com> wrote in message
> >>>news:mpr331hg8po7dtb3k0g9vt14u59d6idvk1@4ax.com...
> >>>> On Wed, 09 Mar 2005 16:58:53 GMT, TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>>In article <pjau21d4g97j4fdd870bus047i8l53h27r@4ax.com>,
> >>>>> deKay <andyk@lofi-gaming.org.uk> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> Soni tempori elseu romani yeof helsforo nisson ol sefini ill des Tue,
> >>>>>> 08
> >>>>>> Mar
> >>>>>> 2005 19:52:50 -0800, sefini jorgo geanyet des mani yeof do
> >>>>>> comp.sys.mac.misc,
> >>>>>> yawatina tan reek esk John <nospam@nospam.com> fornis do marikano es
> >>>>>> bono tan
> >>>>>> el:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> >Most can. However my wonderful G5 can take EIGHT!!! What Windows
> >>>>>> >machine can top that?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> My Windows 2003 server at work has 12GB in it, and can take 32GB...
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> deKay
> >>>>>
> >>>>>There's just a little difference between a high end server and a desktop
> >>>>>machine's RAM requirements.
> >>>>
> >>>> Sure - on a desktop that much RAM tends to be silly and unnecessary,
> >>>> whereas on a server I can clearly see needs and reasons for it.
> >>>
> >>>Video editing and 3D graphics and the like need large amounts of memory.
> >>
> >> Sure. I can see 2GB easy. Seeing more on a *desktop* is difficult.
> >> Can you provide examples of times you've needed more?
> >
> >The recommended *minimum* for real-time editing with Motion is 2GB.
>
> Actually, that's the recommended configuration (512M is minimum) but I
> see your point - for the one out of every 50,000 or so people that
> need that app, you'd want a workstation that does 2G. Fortunately,
> every XP box on the planet does that if you can cram the RAM in there,
> which most easily allow (ie does it have enough sockets, etc.) The OS
> doesn't constrain that.

How about your cheapo Dells?and before you go there, we know the Mini is
limited to 1GB, but that;s not this.

--
Regards,
JP
"The measure of a man is what he will do while
expecting that he will get nothing in return!"
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 31, 2005 8:06:52 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

The Apple store still wants $500 per GB the Internet is now under $200
per GB

G5 Medic wrote:
> Mayor of R'lyeh at
> ev515o@hotmail.com wrote on 3/8/05 9:49 PM:
>
> >> How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory for
> >> there needs?
> >>
> >> With windows it was easy. Max out your ram. Put in as much as
you can
> >> afford. However, some of these power books can take two gigs of
ram.
>
> How To Determine Your Memory Needs
>
> http://g5support.com/group/viewtopic.php?t=1414
>
> -G5 Medic
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 31, 2005 10:22:31 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <1112270812.073569.168240@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
"-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:

> The Apple store still wants $500 per GB the Internet is now under $200
> per GB

Really? All I see are prices of $225 to $350 per GB on the Apple Store.
Where did you find $500 per GB?
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 31, 2005 4:17:49 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

It's worse on a PowerBook G4 because you have to take out 250 for
each gig stick you put in.

Reginald Dwight wrote:
>
> > Where did you find $500 per GB?
>
> Bumping up an iBook 1GB will cost you $500 at Apple. Ouch.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 31, 2005 7:05:55 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

What is the story with using Terminal?

When you type in Top It looks to me like "Activity Monitor," has
the same information plus graphics. It seems to have tons of display
options. You can put an active chart showing active Ram in your dock.

Why use Terminal at all?

Elliott Roper wrote:
> In article <uce-9902E5.20075308032005@comcast.dca.giganews.com>,
> Gregory Weston <uce@splook.com> wrote:
>
> > In article <1110328887.740811.11710@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
> > "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > > How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory
for
> > > there needs?
> >
> > Use the machine for a few days. Open Terminal and type "ls -la
/var/vm"
> > and count how many swap files you've got. Bonus points if you take
a
> > look at the timestamps on the files.
>
> A variation is to use top in terminal, and inspect the pageouts and
> pageins numbers. If the numbers inside the brackets are frequently
> non-zero, you need more memory.
>
> e.g. top -u -s5 10 will produce a list of the top 10 cpu guzzlers
> updated every 5 seconds.
>

If OS X is reserving Ram for programs in the background, what about
free programs like www.macunicorn.com/turbomem/index.htm that will
reclaim unused RAM so that the application you are currently using has
more memory available.

Elliott Roper wrote:
> Do not be swayed by the physmem numbers you see in the line above
that.
> OS X is a lazy reclaimer. It won't free up memory till something
really
> really needs it, so the 'free' number is almost always small, even if
> you are wallowing in excess memory.
>
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 31, 2005 8:54:18 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <1112310355.846096.42950@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
"-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:

> What is the story with using Terminal?
>
> When you type in Top It looks to me like "Activity Monitor," has
> the same information plus graphics. It seems to have tons of display
> options. You can put an active chart showing active Ram in your dock.
>
> Why use Terminal at all?

Because there's a near-infinite number of things you can do with it
besides using "top", so this comparison to Activity Monitor is entirely
irrelevant. If you don't want to use it, don't, but some people find it
useful.

--
Tom "Tom" Harrington
Macaroni, Automated System Maintenance for Mac OS X.
Version 2.0: Delocalize, Repair Permissions, lots more.
See http://www.atomicbird.com/
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
March 31, 2005 9:12:20 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <Nowhere-40CF27.06223131032005@news.central.cox.net>,
TravelinMan <Nowhere@spamfree.com> wrote:

> Where did you find $500 per GB?

Bumping up an iBook 1GB will cost you $500 at Apple. Ouch.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 1, 2005 3:08:32 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <1112310355.846096.42950@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
"-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:

> What is the story with using Terminal?
>
> When you type in Top It looks to me like "Activity Monitor," has
> the same information plus graphics. It seems to have tons of display
> options. You can put an active chart showing active Ram in your dock.
>
> Why use Terminal at all?

Because Terminal provides a lot more information.

If you want to adjust priorities or kill processes, for example,
Terminal is probably better.

>
> Elliott Roper wrote:
> > In article <uce-9902E5.20075308032005@comcast.dca.giganews.com>,
> > Gregory Weston <uce@splook.com> wrote:
> >
> > > In article <1110328887.740811.11710@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com>,
> > > "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > How can a Power book user determine if they have enough memory
> for
> > > > there needs?
> > >
> > > Use the machine for a few days. Open Terminal and type "ls -la
> /var/vm"
> > > and count how many swap files you've got. Bonus points if you take
> a
> > > look at the timestamps on the files.
> >
> > A variation is to use top in terminal, and inspect the pageouts and
> > pageins numbers. If the numbers inside the brackets are frequently
> > non-zero, you need more memory.
> >
> > e.g. top -u -s5 10 will produce a list of the top 10 cpu guzzlers
> > updated every 5 seconds.
> >
>
> If OS X is reserving Ram for programs in the background, what about
> free programs like www.macunicorn.com/turbomem/index.htm that will
> reclaim unused RAM so that the application you are currently using has
> more memory available.

Doesn't seem like it's worth messing with. OS X pages out memory that
you're not using when it gets into a RAM crunch. Unused background apps
shouldn't be getting any RAM if your foreground apps need it.

It's hard to see how someone else is going to be able to this better
than Apple - considering that Apple knows the internals of the system so
much better.

>
> Elliott Roper wrote:
> > Do not be swayed by the physmem numbers you see in the line above
> that.
> > OS X is a lazy reclaimer. It won't free up memory till something
> really
> > really needs it, so the 'free' number is almost always small, even if
> > you are wallowing in excess memory.
> >
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 4, 2005 9:18:11 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

Following your logic no one should have written any software for
windows besides Bill Gates. If not for Netscape we might not even be
on the Internet by now.

Apple has an open source UNIX as its base. So you are saying no one
should learn or write programs for UNIX because Apple already does.

Maybe UNIX reserves Ram for each application, just as it reserved ram
for each user on the mainframes?

> Doesn't seem like it's worth messing with

TravelinMan do you have some kind of problem with authority?

TravelinMan wrote:
> In article <1112310355.846096.42950@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
> "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:
> >
> > If OS X is reserving Ram for programs in the background, what about
> > free programs like www.macunicorn.com/turbomem/index.htm that will
> > reclaim unused RAM so that the application you are currently using
has
> > more memory available.
>
> Doesn't seem like it's worth messing with. OS X pages out memory that

> you're not using when it gets into a RAM crunch. Unused background
apps
> shouldn't be getting any RAM if your foreground apps need it.
>
> It's hard to see how someone else is going to be able to this better
> than Apple - considering that Apple knows the internals of the system
so
> much better.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 4, 2005 1:53:01 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo- wrote:

> Following your logic no one should have written any software for
> windows besides Bill Gates. If not for Netscape we might not even be
> on the Internet by now.
>
> Apple has an open source UNIX as its base. So you are saying no one
> should learn or write programs for UNIX because Apple already does.

If it's a real improvement and they want to make it free then they should
make it open source and have the developers roll it into the source tree
for the version of Unix being used.

> Maybe UNIX reserves Ram for each application, just as it reserved ram
> for each user on the mainframes?

Please read about the heap, the stack, and malloc(). Unix does now and has
always provided RAM on request by the application code. This is why C has
a function to request memory.

>> Doesn't seem like it's worth messing with
>
> TravelinMan do you have some kind of problem with authority?

Huh? This is America--we're _supposed_ to have a problem with authority.

> TravelinMan wrote:
>> In article <1112310355.846096.42950@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
>> "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> >
>> > If OS X is reserving Ram for programs in the background, what about
>> > free programs like www.macunicorn.com/turbomem/index.htm that will
>> > reclaim unused RAM so that the application you are currently using
> has
>> > more memory available.
>>
>> Doesn't seem like it's worth messing with. OS X pages out memory that
>
>> you're not using when it gets into a RAM crunch. Unused background
> apps
>> shouldn't be getting any RAM if your foreground apps need it.
>>
>> It's hard to see how someone else is going to be able to this better
>> than Apple - considering that Apple knows the internals of the system
> so
>> much better.

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 4, 2005 6:35:16 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <1112617091.608327.38660@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
"-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Following your logic no one should have written any software for
> windows besides Bill Gates. If not for Netscape we might not even be
> on the Internet by now.
>
> Apple has an open source UNIX as its base. So you are saying no one
> should learn or write programs for UNIX because Apple already does.
>
> Maybe UNIX reserves Ram for each application, just as it reserved ram
> for each user on the mainframes?
>
> > Doesn't seem like it's worth messing with
>
> TravelinMan do you have some kind of problem with authority?
>
> TravelinMan wrote:
> > In article <1112310355.846096.42950@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
> > "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > If OS X is reserving Ram for programs in the background, what about
> > > free programs like www.macunicorn.com/turbomem/index.htm that will
> > > reclaim unused RAM so that the application you are currently using
> has
> > > more memory available.
> >
> > Doesn't seem like it's worth messing with. OS X pages out memory that
>
> > you're not using when it gets into a RAM crunch. Unused background
> apps
> > shouldn't be getting any RAM if your foreground apps need it.
> >
> > It's hard to see how someone else is going to be able to this better
> > than Apple - considering that Apple knows the internals of the system
> so
> > much better.

I'm not saying anything of the sort.

What I said (before you started to distort it) is that Apple knows the
internals of the system better than anyone. It's not likely that anyone
is going to be able to hack around and improve the memory management -
at least not without rewriting major parts of the system. There would be
unknown consequences to such a change - most of them likely to be
negative.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 4, 2005 6:35:17 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

TravelinMan wrote:

> In article <1112617091.608327.38660@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
> "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>> Following your logic no one should have written any software for
>> windows besides Bill Gates. If not for Netscape we might not even be
>> on the Internet by now.
>>
>> Apple has an open source UNIX as its base. So you are saying no one
>> should learn or write programs for UNIX because Apple already does.
>>
>> Maybe UNIX reserves Ram for each application, just as it reserved ram
>> for each user on the mainframes?
>>
>> > Doesn't seem like it's worth messing with
>>
>> TravelinMan do you have some kind of problem with authority?
>>
>> TravelinMan wrote:
>> > In article <1112310355.846096.42950@l41g2000cwc.googlegroups.com>,
>> > "-oo0-GoldTrader-0oo-" <nomads_05@yahoo.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > If OS X is reserving Ram for programs in the background, what about
>> > > free programs like www.macunicorn.com/turbomem/index.htm that will
>> > > reclaim unused RAM so that the application you are currently using
>> has
>> > > more memory available.
>> >
>> > Doesn't seem like it's worth messing with. OS X pages out memory that
>>
>> > you're not using when it gets into a RAM crunch. Unused background
>> apps
>> > shouldn't be getting any RAM if your foreground apps need it.
>> >
>> > It's hard to see how someone else is going to be able to this better
>> > than Apple - considering that Apple knows the internals of the system
>> so
>> > much better.
>
> I'm not saying anything of the sort.
>
> What I said (before you started to distort it) is that Apple knows the
> internals of the system better than anyone. It's not likely that anyone
> is going to be able to hack around and improve the memory management -
> at least not without rewriting major parts of the system. There would be
> unknown consequences to such a change - most of them likely to be
> negative.

If Apple is starting with open source they may in fact not know the
internals as well as whoever wrote the memory manager--with open source
that person is probably _not_ an Apple employee.

That does not mean, however, that I believe this particular product to be of
any real utility with OS X.

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 27, 2005 7:46:59 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

Bill Gates did the same thing. People went out and developed programs
on their own. The most popular ones Microsoft/Apple copy and puts in
there operating systems. Now Tiger is including international iclocks,
iweather, and a way to email web pages among its 200 new bells &
whistles.

http://www.apple.com/macosx/features/safari/ Now I can email the
contents of the current web page without the hassle of cutting and
pasting into a message.

It's a good thing that "someone else," thought they could do it
better than Apple.

Nothing mentioned on Ram management. Ram prices have fallen 25% on gig
sticks ($150). Its a good thing that "someone else," thought
they could do it better than Apple.

TravelinMan wrote:

> Doesn't seem like it's worth messing with. OS X pages out memory that

> you're not using when it gets into a RAM crunch. Unused background
apps
> shouldn't be getting any RAM if your foreground apps need it.
>
> It's hard to see how someone else is going to be able to this better
> than Apple - considering that Apple knows the internals of the system
so
> much better.
>
> >
> > Elliott Roper wrote:
> > > Do not be swayed by the physmem numbers you see in the line above
> > that.
> > > OS X is a lazy reclaimer. It won't free up memory till something
> > really
> > > really needs it, so the 'free' number is almost always small,
even if
> > > you are wallowing in excess memory.
> > >
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 27, 2005 12:46:15 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.advocacy,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

Don't worry about how much is reported as free. What matters is page
ins and page outs. If after using your machine for a while the page
outs number is smaller than page ins, then you have enough memory. If
page outs is about the same as or larger than page ins, then you could
use more memory.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 27, 2005 5:53:19 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <no-spam-019920.08461527042005@news.isp.giganews.com>,
richard schumacher <no-spam@invalid.com> wrote:

> Don't worry about how much is reported as free. What matters is page
> ins and page outs. If after using your machine for a while the page
> outs number is smaller than page ins, then you have enough memory. If
> page outs is about the same as or larger than page ins, then you could
> use more memory.

You could still need memory with pageouts being less - even much less -
than pageins. A better indicator is to check the number of swap files
you've got and how quickly they've accumulated by looking in /var/vm.

--
There's nothing quite like the joy of first hearing an Alvin & the Chipmunks
cover of Pink Floyd's "The Final Cut." "Not Now John" is especially sublime.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 27, 2005 10:11:47 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

Gregory Weston <uce@splook.com> wrote:

> In article <no-spam-019920.08461527042005@news.isp.giganews.com>,
> richard schumacher <no-spam@invalid.com> wrote:
>
> > Don't worry about how much is reported as free. What matters is page
> > ins and page outs. If after using your machine for a while the page
> > outs number is smaller than page ins, then you have enough memory. If
> > page outs is about the same as or larger than page ins, then you could
> > use more memory.
>
> You could still need memory with pageouts being less - even much less -
> than pageins. A better indicator is to check the number of swap files
> you've got and how quickly they've accumulated by looking in /var/vm.

My MemoryStick app can help with this; it shows the number of swapfiles,
and if you turn on logging it will record an entry in the Console every
time a new swapfile gets generated so you can see the history. m.


--
matt neuburg, phd = matt@tidbits.com, http://www.tidbits.com/matt/
AppleScript: The Definitive Guide
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0596005571/somet...
Read TidBITS! It's free and smart. http://www.tidbits.com
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 28, 2005 11:29:58 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

Gregory Weston <uce@splook.com> writes:

> You could still need memory with pageouts being less - even much less -
> than pageins. A better indicator is to check the number of swap files
> you've got and how quickly they've accumulated by looking in /var/vm.

How quickly they've accumulated is certainly useful information, but the
number of swapfiles on a system with significant uptime and many
different apps used over time is not. You may have only parts of all
swapfiles in use and while the amount of *used* swap space (over all
files) may be tiny the system won't (and can't) get rid of any of them.
Or can do that only when the used amount of a swapfile is below some
limit and the file can be discarded, which seems to happen only rarely.
In most cases having many (and large) swapfiles just means that this
swapspace has been needed at some point.

Anyway, on the Mac mini I'm sitting at right now (512MB) I often have
1GB of swapfiles. If the system would really *need* 1.5GB of memory,
having only a third of that available as real RAM, it would have to be
unusable slow and constantly paging in and out. Which it isn't.

"A system that does not swap has too much RAM or is seriously underused"
-- there's a point in that. Except for machines running off batteries of
course ;-)


Jochem

--
"A designer knows he has arrived at perfection not when there is no
longer anything to add, but when there is no longer anything to take away."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 28, 2005 11:29:59 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

In article <m27jimajxl.fsf@marvin.revier.com>,
Jochem Huhmann <joh@gmx.net> wrote:

> Gregory Weston <uce@splook.com> writes:
>
> > You could still need memory with pageouts being less - even much less -
> > than pageins. A better indicator is to check the number of swap files
> > you've got and how quickly they've accumulated by looking in /var/vm.
>
> How quickly they've accumulated is certainly useful information, but the
> number of swapfiles on a system with significant uptime and many
> different apps used over time is not. You may have only parts of all
> swapfiles in use and while the amount of *used* swap space (over all
> files) may be tiny the system won't (and can't) get rid of any of them.
> Or can do that only when the used amount of a swapfile is below some
> limit and the file can be discarded, which seems to happen only rarely.
> In most cases having many (and large) swapfiles just means that this
> swapspace has been needed at some point.

But a large number of swap files would indicate that under the user's
usage patterns that memory was needed at (roughly) the same time.

> Anyway, on the Mac mini I'm sitting at right now (512MB) I often have
> 1GB of swapfiles. If the system would really *need* 1.5GB of memory,
> having only a third of that available as real RAM, it would have to be
> unusable slow and constantly paging in and out.

That's not true. That would only be true if a large subset of the
processes were not only loaded but actively manipulating memory. In an
event driven model, most apps spend a lot of time blocked.

G

--
There's nothing quite like the joy of first hearing an Alvin & the Chipmunks
cover of Pink Floyd's "The Final Cut." "Not Now John" is especially sublime.
Anonymous
a b } Memory
a b D Laptop
April 28, 2005 11:44:53 PM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.mac.portables,comp.sys.laptops,comp.sys.mac.system,comp.sys.mac.misc (More info?)

matt@tidbits.com (matt neuburg) writes:

> My MemoryStick app can help with this; it shows the number of swapfiles,
> and if you turn on logging it will record an entry in the Console every
> time a new swapfile gets generated so you can see the history. m.

While I don't mean to say your app useless, in a hurry

ls -lh /var/vm/swapfile*

in a Terminal window tells you quite the same.


Jochem

--
"A designer knows he has arrived at perfection not when there is no
longer anything to add, but when there is no longer anything to take away."
- Antoine de Saint-Exupery
!