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H67 vs H61 for I5 2500

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Anonymous
January 5, 2012 1:38:00 PM

Hey guys, I just bought a core i5 2500 and from what i read in reviews this CPU does not overclock very well (some say they have theirs at 4.2ghz+ so I'm not sure), anyway I'm not much into overclocking so no problem. My question is, since i won't overclock, is it worth to spend the extra money on a H67/P67 motherboard instead of the H61 chipset? I won't be using usb3/sata6 or sli/crossfire so it all comes down to the chipsets, will a H67 offer better GAMING performance over the H61? Thanks!

More about : h67 h61 2500

January 5, 2012 1:44:06 PM

h67 supports overclocking your graphics card, which you wont be able to do on H61.

So only if u r interested in GPU overclocking, u need to get h67. Otherwise, u can get a good quality H61 mobo, no problem.
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January 5, 2012 2:23:21 PM

honestly they both are are lack of performance. get p67 instead they are too much better at all.
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Anonymous
January 5, 2012 2:58:14 PM

gam0reily said:
h67 supports overclocking your graphics card, which you wont be able to do on H61.

So only if u r interested in GPU overclocking, u need to get h67. Otherwise, u can get a good quality H61 mobo, no problem.


I see, what if i buy a GPU that is already factory overclocked? like this one: http://www.gigabyte.com/products/product-page.aspx?pid=...
Will a H61 MoBo support it?
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Anonymous
January 5, 2012 3:04:09 PM

xtreme5 said:
honestly they both are are lack of performance. get p67 instead they are too much better at all.


Damn, I'm buying the parts from a local shop, I don't live in the usa, no newegg for me or any other big sellers so the prices here are ridiculous and all over the place, the difference in price between the H61 and P67 is about 60 american dollars -__- and i'm kinda on a budget, I might just go with an asus/gigabyte H61 chipset and just rely on my good CPU power and GPU, I just wan't to make sure the H61won't bottleneck the processor in any way, Thanks.
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January 5, 2012 3:18:51 PM

gam0reily said:
h67 supports overclocking your graphics card, which you wont be able to do on H61.

So only if u r interested in GPU overclocking, u need to get h67. Otherwise, u can get a good quality H61 mobo, no problem.


Were did yo hear that?? You can overclock your GPU no matter what motherboard you have. I'm going to assume you meant CPU, but as far as I know H67 does NOT support CPU overclocking.

I'm using the H61 and I love it, go for it.
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January 5, 2012 3:20:22 PM

xtreme5 said:
honestly they both are are lack of performance. get p67 instead they are too much better at all.


There is no performance difference between a H61 and P67. The cpu and gpu are going to run exactly the same.
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January 5, 2012 3:49:37 PM

srry bout that mistake earlier. dunno what i was thinking. @wanarchy, get any GPU u like. if u get the base model (unOCed), then u Oc it urself.
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January 5, 2012 4:04:07 PM

gam0reily said:
srry bout that mistake earlier. dunno what i was thinking. @wanarchy, get any GPU u like. if u get the base model (unOCed), then u Oc it urself.


I know exactly what you were thinking. You were thinking of overclocking the integrated graphics.
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January 5, 2012 4:11:26 PM

geekapproved said:
There is no performance difference between a H61 and P67. The cpu and gpu are going to run exactly the same.

any proof how??
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January 5, 2012 5:43:27 PM

xtreme5 said:
any proof how??


ANy proof to the contrary??? I don't need to explain, it's common knowledge a H61 with a i5-2500 and a GTX580 is going to throw the exact same framerates as a Z68 with a i5-2500 and a GTX580, why wouldn't it?

The main diff would be no sli/xfire support, some don't have 6gbps sata or usb3.0, no ssd caching and no cpu or integrated cpu graphics overclocking ability.
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January 5, 2012 5:49:50 PM

so these are the features which make the system faster and those two boards are lack of these features or if it for gaming then i recommend p67 chipset..
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January 5, 2012 5:50:30 PM

Nice comparison -> http://ark.intel.com/compare/52807,52806

The primary differences are: Price, SATA Ports, USB Ports, Intel RST aka RAID, and (sure there's an exception) number of DIMM Slots.

As stated, neither the H67 nor H61 OC, just allows for Intel's Turbo Boost even on the SB 'K'.
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Anonymous
January 5, 2012 6:00:48 PM

Umm I'll just go with an Asus H61 Board then since I won't be overclocking or needing the extra features, and i'll use the money saved to put into a better GPU.. Thanks everyone for all the helpful info, much appreciated.
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January 5, 2012 6:10:50 PM

december's $600 gaming pc:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i5-overclock-p...
compared to higher end builds:
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/core-i5-fx-6100-ove...
the $600 pc uses a core i5 2400 with an h61 motherboard. it performed very well.
btw, you can overclock a core i5 2500 non k. it is partially unlocked, so you can oc it a few hundred mhz over it's base clockspeed. a z68 motherboard is recommended for oc (among other advantages that might come in handy later). you can even set maximum single core turbo with a z68 motherboard. if you want to get one on budget, you can cut cost by getting a micro atx motherboard with 2 ram slots.
h61, h67, z68 all of them allow use of at least a single discreet gfx card. compared to h67 and z68, h61'a biggest limitation is 2 ram slots and less ports compared to the other two.
for a pure gaming machine, an h61 motherboard would be fine.
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January 5, 2012 8:00:02 PM

xtreme5 said:
so these are the features which make the system faster and those two boards are lack of these features or if it for gaming then i recommend p67 chipset..


Umm...no they don't, and even if he wanted and enthusiest board will all the gimmicks, I certainly wouldn't recommned P67, I would recommend Z68.
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January 5, 2012 8:13:45 PM

P67 vs Z68 - SATA and USB speeds -> http://www.anandtech.com/show/4330/asus-p8z68v-review/5 the upside to Z68 is Intel RST (SSD Caching) and Quick Sync that's about it. Some benches have illustrated a slight frame rate (FPS) loss on the Z68.

There are great examples of both the P67 and Z68, P67 unfortunately got the B2 bug so folks feel 'safer' on the Z68. For OC'ing I'm pretty picky about either P67 or Z68. However, in reality few folks actually OC so it really doesn't matter. I do agree with overt 'doodad' MOBO's; less is often more -- so port/components unused I recommend in the BIOS they're disabled to reduce 'shared' bottlenecks.
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January 5, 2012 8:33:48 PM

SSD caching, Quick sync, but you forgot about the ability to use your cpu's graphics core.

The ability to use the integrated graphics on your cpu is great, it comes in handy for troubleshooting video card issues and you can use it if your video card fails while your waiting for a rma.
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January 5, 2012 9:09:26 PM

Yep, you're right IF you don't have a discrete GPU. The e.g. IntelĀ® HD Graphics 2000 or 3000 is perfectly fine for anything 2D.

I can tell if I blow a GPU, but sure it's a back-up :) 
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January 5, 2012 11:09:41 PM

yeah, SSD caching is quite important if u r going to get an SSD later, but not necessary for a budget rig.
Although, SSD's have a bright future I believe :-).
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Anonymous
January 6, 2012 8:53:02 AM

uhh with the price of SSDs currently at the shop I'm buying from I think I'll just stick to HDD, and maybe 1 year from now I'll just upgrade the Mobo and hopefully get a cheap SSD.
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January 6, 2012 11:56:01 AM

gam0reily said:
So SSD caching does not appreciably boost boot times?

Booting is indeed a repeated task so obviously booting is SSD speed.

The problem is everything else. A 'pure' SSD with OS, Apps and Working data will ALWAYS be at SSD speeds. My 'ideal' arrangement is a 128GB+ SSD (OS, Apps and Working data) and RAID 1 HDD (Data: Music, Photos, Docs, etc) with periodic snapshot backups on a third/backup drive/Windows Home Server/NAS/etc.
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January 6, 2012 8:33:13 PM

get a cheap z68
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January 7, 2012 6:15:29 AM

jaquith said:
Booting is indeed a repeated task so obviously booting is SSD speed.

The problem is everything else.


What?
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January 7, 2012 11:24:16 AM

worst z68 is still better than best h61, h67 only has sata 3 support as extra...

I wanted to get h67 but between z68 and h67 the price difference was just 20 euros so I went for z68...

If you can find this... and want a budget build this is what I use.. an entry level z68 with overclock potential and PCIE 3.0... usb 3 and sata 3

MSI Z68MA-G43
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January 7, 2012 1:14:29 PM

or a gigabyte Z68AP-D3
or another gigabyte Z68A-D3H-B3

both support PCI 3.0,
but the first one doesn't have SLI support.
But since you are keeping it in budget, U wont need an SLI I think. CrossfireX for future expandability might be enough for you.
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Anonymous
January 7, 2012 1:18:59 PM

The difference between H61 and Z68 is around 30 euros here, I'm on a budget but i can still afford a z68 board but that means i will have to cut down on the GPU and get a 6770 instead of a 6870 and I'm not sure if that's a good idea,what do you guys think? Z68 + HD 6770 OR H61 + HD 6870 ? btw it's a gaming rig.
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January 7, 2012 1:26:11 PM

Anonymous said:
The difference between H61 and Z68 is around 30 euros here, I'm on a budget but i can still afford a z68 board but that means i will have to cut down on the GPU and get a 6770 instead of a 6870 and I'm not sure if that's a good idea,what do you guys think? Z68 + HD 6770 OR H61 + HD 6870 ? btw it's a gaming rig.

strictly for gaming with single gfx card and no cpu overclocking - h61+6870.
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January 7, 2012 2:03:53 PM

gam0reily said:
What?

You need to understand 'How SSD Cashing' or Caching in general works. By definition Caching is placing frequently used (R/W) data into a file, folder or in this case SSD (cloned data). The data MUST be first accessed to be Cached then using a algorithms (a program software/firmware) if the data is deemed Cache worthy it will be placed on the SSD and when the 'call' for (now cached) data comes the algorithm knows to (R/W) it from the SSD which in turn is faster. So in the case of booting the OS (Apps, DLL, etc) that data is read from the faster SSD in this example.

The example would be to benchmark, since the data is not repeated use the algorithm has not written (Cached) the data to the SSD so the R/W from the benchmark is only available from the slower HDD. Next, say you have a 20GB~40GB etc SSD but you're randomly opening up e.g. a variety of Apps/Games/Game data/or other data then 'SSD Caching' will NOT improve speeds so you're stuck to the slower HDD or in some instances partially faster -- App on SSD but large data not on the SSD.

On the other hand if the consistent data accessed exceeds the SSD size then you get a mixture of fast and slow. Therefore, if ALL the data is simply stored on a 'Dedicated SSD' then you'll ALWAYS have a consistent and fast SSD speed.

Got it now?
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January 7, 2012 3:33:05 PM

jaquith said:
You need to understand 'How SSD Cashing' or Caching in general works. By definition Caching is placing frequently used (R/W) data into a file, folder or in this case SSD (cloned data). The data MUST be first accessed to be Cached then using a algorithms (a program software/firmware) if the data is deemed Cache worthy it will be placed on the SSD and when the 'call' for (now cached) data comes the algorithm knows to (R/W) it from the SSD which in turn is faster. So in the case of booting the OS (Apps, DLL, etc) that data is read from the faster SSD in this example.

The example would be to benchmark, since the data is not repeated use the algorithm has not written (Cached) the data to the SSD so the R/W from the benchmark is only available from the slower HDD. Next, say you have a 20GB~40GB etc SSD but you're randomly opening up e.g. a variety of Apps/Games/Game data/or other data then 'SSD Caching' will NOT improve speeds so you're stuck to the slower HDD or in some instances partially faster -- App on SSD but large data not on the SSD.

On the other hand if the consistent data accessed exceeds the SSD size then you get a mixture of fast and slow. Therefore, if ALL the data is simply stored on a 'Dedicated SSD' then you'll ALWAYS have a consistent and fast SSD speed.

Got it now?


I know what caching means buddy. I just wanted to know what u meant when u said "The problem is everything else." That was what I meant to understand.
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January 7, 2012 3:36:44 PM

One thing I also needed to know.
If I get an SSD on a Z68,a and then install a game on my SATA II, and frequently open it, so would those files that are vital for it's startup etc. be stored on the SSD, or I have to manually install the complete game on the SSD.??
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January 7, 2012 3:45:19 PM

Hmm the 'WHAT?' is kinda vague buddy -- so to guess Q was "The problem is everything else" this is not in the physic network.

Then since you know what SSD Caching is -- the everything else is ALL of the non-Cached or booted-out non-Cached data. See -> http://www.anandtech.com/show/4329/intel-z68-chipset-sm...
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January 8, 2012 10:44:04 AM

well, frm the review on anandtech, I feel SSD caching is quie god actually for users lyk me. I dont use a bunch of apps, just some games, video players and occasionally video converters and DVD burners.

ANy way, even a 64 GB SSD is quite enough for anybody.
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January 8, 2012 10:45:31 AM

and @wanarchy, please close the thread if u got ur ans. If not, please ask.
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Anonymous
January 8, 2012 12:38:54 PM

gam0reily said:
and @wanarchy, please close the thread if u got ur ans. If not, please ask.


My last post was a question and I only got 1 answer for it because of these 2 guys arguing about SSDs -_-
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January 8, 2012 12:40:55 PM

Then -- the next thing you're forgetting is the extreme need for 'Over Provisioning'; Wear Leveling. The 'SSD Cache' drive gets the crap Written out of it, and the good 'SSD Cache' drives are double sized with near double price; meaning e.g. a 64GB 'SSD Cache' drive is actually a 128GB SSD with 1/2 the space reserved for the SSD's Write failures. In contrast a typical boot SSD for (OS, Apps, and Data) which gets a Fraction of Writes in comparison to a constantly re-written 'SSD Cache' drive.

The 'safety' is as I mentioned above, the data is cloned to the HDD so when the 'SSD Cache' drive fails no data loss -- BUT a destroyed aka useless 'SSD Cache' drive is left. SSD's suffer no harm from Reads it's the Writes that kill them.

Again, SSD Caching is a bad long-term solution. Next if you factor in an over provisioned and Good 'SSD Cache' drive you're MUCH better of simply getting a good 128GB+ SSD.

Trust me. I don't/hate writing books, arguing, on topics that I know.

Nice video, it explains Wear Leveling:

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January 8, 2012 12:44:44 PM

Anonymous said:
My last post was a question and I only got 1 answer for it because of these 2 guys arguing about SSDs -_-

Sorry, I just don't want the wrong or 1/2 truths out there. I and others first answered your questions. The the SSD issue came up. I tried to keep the SSD a simple 1 Q/A.
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Anonymous
January 8, 2012 1:15:43 PM

jaquith said:
Sorry, I just don't want the wrong or 1/2 truths out there. I and others first answered your questions. The the SSD issue came up. I tried to keep the SSD a simple 1 Q/A.


Ok no problem, so regarding my last question, any thoughts? H61 + 6870 or Z68 + 6770 ? and thanks.
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Best solution

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January 8, 2012 1:29:53 PM

My solo concern of H61 is the DIMM slots but if you're okay with only 2 then -- clearly the H61 + HD 6870 + 8GB RAM. See -> http://www.guru3d.com/article/radeon-hd-6850-6870-cross...

The HD 6850 on many games can get choppy, and what's the point of looking at faster blur with lower details.
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Anonymous
January 8, 2012 1:47:52 PM

2 DIMMs is fine, 8GB is more than enough for me and I don't think I'll ever need more than that, at least in the next year or two, cheers.
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Anonymous
January 8, 2012 1:48:16 PM

Best answer selected by wanarchy.
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January 8, 2012 2:48:22 PM

srry for the SSD garb. Nyc solution BTW.
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August 12, 2012 9:01:35 PM

This topic should not be closed, I have hard evidence contradicting the conclusion that there is no performance difference between H6X/P6X VS Z68 on the same hardware. I've had an i3-2105/H61M-DS2/GTX480/4GB RAM for almost a year now and decided to order a 2500k/Z68XP-UD3 to better match my GPU. The motherboard showed up a few days early (2500k is still in the mail) so I decided to do some benchmarks before switching to the Z68 to find out for sure if the chipset itself would make any performance difference in an otherwise identical hardware setup. The answer is yes, up to 20% in this case. That plus the robust feature set and full compliment of ports makes it hard for me to recommend anything but Z68 if you can afford it (I got mine for $70 out the door on Amazon), regardless of K or non-K series CPU. Nothing was changed in this machine, this is an apples to apples comparison. All hardware is the same, only the motherboard was swapped and benchmarks were given multiple runs in the exact same environment. Here are passmark logs from both chipsets. H61 first, followed by Z68.

PassMark(TM) PerformanceTest 7.0 Evaluation Version (http://www.passmark.com)
Results generated on: Saturday, August 11, 2012


Benchmark Results

Test Name: This Computer
CPU - Integer Math: 1130.1
CPU - Floating Point Math: 1374.1
CPU - Find Prime Numbers: 703.7
CPU - SSE: 15.5
CPU - Compression: 4160.9
CPU - Encryption: 11.3
CPU - Physics: 178.8
CPU - String Sorting: 2160.0
Graphics 2D - Solid Vectors: 1.4
Graphics 2D - Transparent Vectors: 1.2
Graphics 2D - Complex Vectors: 98.6
Graphics 2D - Fonts and Text: 225.1
Graphics 2D - Windows Interface: 105.6
Graphics 2D - Image Filters: 293.4
Graphics 2D - Image Rendering: 535.2
Graphics 3D - Simple: 3429.9
Graphics 3D - Medium: 1981.8
Graphics 3D - Complex: 78.6
Graphics 3D - DirectX 10: 59.0
Memory - Allocate Small Block: 5639.4
Memory - Read Cached: 2445.1
Memory - Read Uncached: 2304.0
Memory - Write: 2247.9
Memory - Large RAM: 2348.6
Disk - Sequential Read: 56.6
Disk - Sequential Write: 59.0
Disk - Random Seek + RW: 4.1
CPU Mark: 3650.9
2D Graphics Mark: 345.8
Memory Mark: 1348.7
Disk Mark: 433.2
3D Graphics Mark: 3492.0
PassMark Rating: 1374.9

System information: This Computer
CPU Manufacturer: GenuineIntel
Number of CPU: 1
Cores per CPU: 2
CPU Type: Intel Core i3-2105 @ 3.10GHz
CPU Speed: 3093.2 MHz
Cache size: 256KB
O/S: Windows 7 (64-bit)
Total RAM: 4079.3 MB.
Available RAM: 2821.9 MB.
Video settings: 1920x1200x32
Video driver:
DESCRIPTION: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 480
MANUFACTURER: NVIDIA
BIOS: Version 70.0.35.0.80
DATE: 6-28-2012
Drive Letter: C
Total Disk Space: 298.0 GBytes
Cluster Size: 4.0 KBytes
File system: NTFS

_________________________________________________________________

....and the Z68...

PassMark(TM) PerformanceTest 7.0 Evaluation Version (http://www.passmark.com)
Results generated on: Sunday, August 12, 2012


Benchmark Results

Test Name: This Computer
CPU - Integer Math: 1190.6
CPU - Floating Point Math: 1384.9
CPU - Find Prime Numbers: 749.0
CPU - SSE: 18.1
CPU - Compression: 4955.9
CPU - Encryption: 14.0
CPU - Physics: 209.6
CPU - String Sorting: 2701.5
Graphics 2D - Solid Vectors: 1.6
Graphics 2D - Transparent Vectors: 1.5
Graphics 2D - Complex Vectors: 138.9
Graphics 2D - Fonts and Text: 234.0
Graphics 2D - Windows Interface: 108.4
Graphics 2D - Image Filters: 368.5
Graphics 2D - Image Rendering: 639.8
Graphics 3D - Simple: 3268.2
Graphics 3D - Medium: 1969.7
Graphics 3D - Complex: 78.5
Graphics 3D - DirectX 10: 59.9
Memory - Allocate Small Block: 6076.6
Memory - Read Cached: 2484.3
Memory - Read Uncached: 2334.3
Memory - Write: 2282.0
Memory - Large RAM: 2453.3
Disk - Sequential Read: 80.8
Disk - Sequential Write: 82.5
Disk - Random Seek + RW: 4.1
CPU Mark: 4116.2
2D Graphics Mark: 405.9
Memory Mark: 1402.6
Disk Mark: 605.3
3D Graphics Mark: 3460.5
PassMark Rating: 1640.2

System information: This Computer
CPU Manufacturer: GenuineIntel
Number of CPU: 1
Cores per CPU: 2
CPU Type: Intel Core i3-2105 @ 3.10GHz
CPU Speed: 3109.6 MHz
Cache size: 256KB
O/S: Windows 7 (64-bit)
Total RAM: 3949.1 MB.
Available RAM: 2988.4 MB.
Video settings: 1920x1200x32
Video driver:
DESCRIPTION: NVIDIA GeForce GTX 480
MANUFACTURER: NVIDIA
BIOS: Version 70.0.35.0.80
DATE: 6-28-2012
Drive Letter: C
Total Disk Space: 298.1 GBytes
Cluster Size: 4.0 KBytes
File system: NTFS

As you can see, there are a few things the H61 does better, and a few things the Z68 does better but the overall performance difference of nearly 20% is undeniable. H61: 1,374pts Z68: 1,640pts.
Case closed.


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August 12, 2012 9:35:08 PM

@Pantheon85

Did u perform a clean install when u swapped the HDD?

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August 12, 2012 10:05:36 PM

nikorr said:
@Pantheon85

Did u perform a clean install when u swapped the HDD?


There was no HDD swap, only the motherboard was swapped.
Yes, both H61 and Z68 benchmarks were conducted on clean installs on the same day to keep the playing fields equal.
Both boards were also running the latest BIOS version as noted in the benchmark log.

I went in this order:

1. Backed up personal files
2. Wiped and reloaded Win7
3. Ran all updates/drivers
4. Ran H61 benchmarks
5. Swapped MB to Z68
6. Wiped and reloaded Win7
7. Ran all updates/drivers
8. Ran Z68 benchmarks
9. Restored personal files after all tests were conducted.

I'm now enjoying a noticeable 20% overall performance increase and my 2500K hasn't even arrived yet. :sol: 
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August 12, 2012 10:08:32 PM

OK : )
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