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Is it my powersupply?

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May 24, 2011 9:39:16 PM

So I spent $1700 on a new rig and got everything new except my old PSU because I recently got it September of last year and it's a 850w, I thought it would do fine...
It's a TR2 RX 850w Black Widow ThermalTake PSU.

Here are my new comp specs:
Intel 2500k Sandy Bridge CPU
MSI P67a-g43 MB
GTX 570 SC
my old GTX 275
Intel SSD 120gb SDD (system)
1tb WD Black series HD (data)
2x4gb Patriot 1600mhz RAM
Frio CPU cooler
(all that wasn't 1700, I got some other stuff that I thought was irrelevant to post, let me know if you need any other specs)

So I got this rig set up two days ago and did some overclocking and had Prim95 running for 8hours+ with temps never exceeding 59c.
I also did some GPU overclocking and never had temps pass 85c.

But yesterday... some very weird things happened.
I was simply working on some Word documents and studying for finals when all of a sudden after LESS than 3 hours of being turned on, my computer froze. I restarted and began working again. In less than 2 hours, it happened again.
-I took out the GTX 275, since I only had it set up as a dedicated Physx card. I restarted again and left it on while I watched some TV - IDLE, nothing running at all. I'm pretty sure the time was 4:30 when I started it up. When I came back to check on it - at 6:10 or so, it was frozen and the time was stuck at 4:51... only 21 minutes had passed and yet it froze again.
I reset the GPU overclock back to stock settings and lowered my CPU multiplier from 45 to 40.
The computer ran from 8pm until 11:50pm or so when I turned it off and headed to bed.
It's only been on 30 minutes for now, and it seems okay so far.

I'm just trying to figure out if this PSU is total crap and is causing all this or not... it's really weird because everything was working when I set it up and I STRESS tested both the CPU and GPU for a LONG time (8 hours) and nothing ever crashed, but now that I'm not even using it... it's dieing on me. (freezing)

I burrowed 300 bucks from my dad so I can spend a good amount of money trying to fix this, but I don't want to buy a new PSU only to keep having the same problems... and to my knowledge, there is no way to stress test the PSU or something like that, so I'm trying to see what you guys think.

IF this problem is caused by the PSU, I was thinking of getting this:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
OR
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Price is the same because Corsair has the 10$ rebate + FREE shipping which makes it 125 and the XFX has a 5.99 shipping cost which makes it 126.

I'm really thinking it's the PSU mainly because when stuff like this happens, the freezing, it's a good indication the PSU is about to die and because of the fact now that I reset GPU back to stock and lowered the CPU multiplier from 45 to 40, it's working. (At least 4 hours)
I also read on some forums that the TR2 series from ThermalTake is a total piece of junk quality PSU that only really puts out 300-400w but is advertised as 850w.... which really makes me upset because I am pretty noob at this stuff and I went into Best Buy last September because my old PSU blew and I saw a Corsair which was maybe 5 bucks more and asked the guy working there which was better: the corsair or the ThermalTake, and he said the ThermalTake by a long shot... I REALLY don't ever want to go back to best buy again.. lol!

Any tips/suggestions/tips/thoughts would be nice.

More about : powersupply

a b ) Power supply
May 24, 2011 11:17:18 PM

Thermaltake? and you believed him? Shame on best buy. Corsair always tests better under load.
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a b ) Power supply
May 24, 2011 11:37:10 PM

You monitored your temps, did you also monitor your voltages??

You can download a program to monitor voltages. I use HWMonitor, It has worked great for temps - Not sure how well it is for voltages on the new SB motherboards. While it worked on my gigabyte P55, it did not work ASrock Z68. Worth a try.

But I would try to verify the voltages before declaring it to be the PSU. You could always spen $15 for a Digital multimeter (@ Walmart or auto store). Very easy to use (Just google "How to use a multimeter"). The +5 & +12 is very easy to measure - @ a Molex connector Black is common, or ground - Red is + 5 V and yellow or orange is +12 V.
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Related resources
a b ) Power supply
May 25, 2011 12:15:49 AM

That doesn't sound like a PSU problem to me.
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May 25, 2011 12:20:01 AM

The problem could still be your overclock. It doesn't seem like you've eliminated that. Is your system perfectly stable without the OC?

Did you make sure your RAM was set to its recommended timings and voltages? You might as well get Memtest86+ and make sure your RAM is ok. For best results, run Memtest for like 24 hours.
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May 25, 2011 12:41:59 AM

Perfectly stable? Not really sure, but when I OC'd the CPU to 4.5 - I stress tested it with Prim95 for 8 hours+ And 4.5 isn't really that high - at least I don't think so - especially with a CPU cooler and temps never passing 59c while 100% load.

The only thing I changed about the ram was to make it so that it could perform at 1600mhz - the advertised speed that it's SUPPOSED to be running at. For some reason, at stock it wasn't running at 1600 and I think all I changed was Dram Voltage which was at 1.456 - to 1.65. I also ran memory tests for a while, all passed.

What I'm thinking is the PSU can't handle the OC because instead of actually being able to provide 850w of power, it only really puts out 300-400. I read this somewhere on a forum post about my ThermalTake crap PSU.

EDIT: I mean I survived 8 hours of Prim95, my temps are amazing, and I don't get bluescreens - but freezes.
It just really seems to be a PSU problem. And I digged up some threads I read earlier:
http://www.overclock.net/power-supplies/796635-thermalt...
http://www.overclock.net/power-supplies/964363-thermalt...

and this one about 750w edition:
http://www.hardwaresecrets.com/article/Thermaltake-TR2-RX-750-W-Power-Supply-Review/902/9
Quote:
According to our methodology, Thermaltake TR2 RX 750 W cannot deliver its labeled wattage. It burned after one minute delivering 750 W at a room temperature a little bit above 45º C. Thinking that we may have got a defective unit, we asked Thermaltake another sample, which burned exactly the same way. In both units the component that burned was one of the +12 V rectifiers.
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a b ) Power supply
May 25, 2011 1:20:07 AM

The tolerances for the +5 and the +12 V are ± 5%
While that equates to a Min value of 11.4 for the +12 V, I ditch any PSU that drops below 11.6 V

Based on what you found, Even if the PSU was not causing the problem I would replace it with a better quallity one. Not sure if you really need a 850 W, a good corsair 750 may work.
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May 25, 2011 2:11:36 AM

I mean: do you have this freezing problem if you set your processor back to stock?

enterthecookie said:


What I'm thinking is the PSU can't handle the OC because instead of actually being able to provide 850w of power, it only really puts out 300-400. I read this somewhere on a forum post about my ThermalTake crap PSU.

[/QUOTE]


This could be the case. IMO you should rule stuff out before you buy a new part. Memtest will tell you if your RAM and RAM settings are stable. If your OC isn't stable with your current PSU then at least you know how to get your machine stable for now.
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May 25, 2011 2:36:25 AM

Yeah, I'm definitely getting a PSU anyways - the XFX I posted earlier:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
I need to have it for the future, I want to run 570s in SLI and I highly doubt this TR2 is going to be up to the challenge.

Quote:
The only thing I changed about the ram was to make it so that it could perform at 1600mhz - the advertised speed that it's SUPPOSED to be running at. For some reason, at stock it wasn't running at 1600 and I think all I changed was Dram Voltage which was at 1.456 - to 1.65. I also ran memory tests for a while, all passed.

But I already mentioned I tested the ram and it passed fine.
The only changes I made to it was to turn on XMP and change the Dram Voltage which was at 1.456 - to 1.65.

I was just trying to see if the PSU is really the cause, I mean everything points towards it, but just wanted to make sure.
Thanks a lot for the responses guy, I hope it all goes well!
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May 25, 2011 2:59:43 AM

Gotcha. Sorry, missed the bit about the RAM test. Let us know how it turns out.
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a c 1217 ) Power supply
May 25, 2011 3:36:20 AM

High ripple and noise produced by the power supply will cause the symptoms you have described. Thermaltake TR2 Series Black Widow Series are notorious for this.
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May 25, 2011 8:37:15 PM

Well a good and bad update.

I ordered a new PSU (the corsair I linked earlier) and it will be hopefully coming in Friday, if not then Monday.

Bad news is... last night my GPU blew. I was changing some wallpaper and all of a sudden... the computer turned off. Automatically started up again and POP... fried smell... turned it off ASAP - but it was too late obviously. I luckily got an exchange for it from Frys and asked them if it was caused by my PSU, but they didn't know much. They told me "I'll be safe" so I decided to plug in the new one and here I am...

I reset the BIOS to default so no overclocking at all and I'm just hoping this will make it through until Friday/Monday without happening again... I'm thinking the high ripple and noise was too much for the system to handle? Basing it off ko888's post...

One question I have... how can I turn off the ability for the computer to automatically restart? I found a option in the BIOS that says "Restore after AC Power Loss" but it's already on "Turned off" and the other two settings is "Turned on" and "Last state"
Could there be any other possible settings?
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a b ) Power supply
May 25, 2011 8:41:27 PM

and i was reading about your prime stress test did it happen to freeze during stress test?
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May 25, 2011 9:16:44 PM

enterthecookie said:

One question I have... how can I turn off the ability for the computer to automatically restart? I found a option in the BIOS that says "Restore after AC Power Loss" but it's already on "Turned off" and the other two settings is "Turned on" and "Last state"
Could there be any other possible settings?


I think what you are looking for is a Windows setting. For Windows 7 it's: control panel -> system and security -> system -> advanced system settings -> startup and recovery settings -> uncheck "automatic restart" This will prevent the automatic reboot after a BSOD.
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May 25, 2011 9:18:18 PM

Nope, I came back 8 hours later and found it was still running. Stopped it and continued using the computer... that was the first day/night and there were no problems, that's what really has me confused!

EDIT: thank you eightdrunken, I just did that right now.
Although, I never had a blue screen of death. The computer instantly shut down this time. It started up on it's own and then POP! the capacitor on the 570 blew.
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a b ) Power supply
May 25, 2011 9:20:40 PM

enterthecookie said:
Nope, I came back 8 hours later and found it was still running. Stopped it and continued using the computer... that was the first day/night and there were no problems, that's what really has me confused!

EDIT: thank you eightdrunken, I will try that right now!

you have tried changing psus right?Or would the psu come at monday?
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May 25, 2011 9:27:18 PM

It's coming in Friday or Monday - as they don't deliver weekends.
But I have just read something that makes me absolutely 100% sure that it's my PSU.
Quote:
Thermaltake TR2 RX 750 W is, according to our methodology, a flawed product that must be avoided at all costs. It can’t deliver its labeled wattage at high temperatures, but this is not the worst of it: ripple and noise level are way above the maximum allowed when you pull 80% or more from the unit’s labeled capacity (i.e. 600 W and above), overloading your components (especially electrolytic capacitors from the motherboard and video cards), which can cause your PC to present an erratic behavior (crashes and random resets) and, under extreme conditions, damage components.

I know that's for the 750w series, but still. That's exactly what is going on...

The only thing that's odd is that I was only changing my wallpaper... not "extreme condition" kind of stuff going on... but yeah almost sure that it's the problem.
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a b ) Power supply
May 25, 2011 10:26:34 PM

i still suggest you use the corsair to avoid more tradegy..
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May 25, 2011 10:51:55 PM

enterthecookie said:


What do you suggest?

I'm still thinking Corsair because I just hate ThermalTake now... but thought it would be worth it to get your guys opinion as well.


Whatever you do: Get your ThermalTake replaced. Even if you keep the Corsair, you can eBay the unopened ThermalTake and help recoup the price of the Corsair.
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a c 1217 ) Power supply
May 26, 2011 1:16:47 AM

The Thermaltake Toughpower XT 875W (TPX-875M) uses the same design and OEM (i.e. CWT) as the Corsair Enthusiast Series TX950 (CMPSU-950TX).

It's one of the very few Thermaltake PSUs that are any good.

The Corsair TX850 V2 850W (CMPSU-850TXV2) that you've linked to is made by Seasonic. Personally I would stick with this one over the replacement Thermaltake.

Yes you should still get the low end Thermaltake replaced with the better model.
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May 26, 2011 1:23:23 AM

why are you still using the computer when it already fried one component lol. they will only replace a gpu so many times
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May 26, 2011 1:42:32 AM

Yeah, I definitly am getting the thermaltake replaced. I ordered the Corsair yesterday - I just got word today that ThermalTake is going to replace my TR2 with their XT875W. I just wanted to know what you guys think. Thank you for the great detailed information ko888.

I am going to go ahead and take ko888 and ghnader's advice and stick with the corsair.
I am just done with ThermalTake. I will just be selling the new one they send me and try to get some extra cash.

@cbrunnem yeah I know.. hahah. But the person who was doing my return happened to be the manager and when I asked him about my powersupply being the culprit, he assured me that I will be "safe" So I'm pretty sure if I go back there and tell him that my PSU was the problem and I have gotten it replaced, he will be forced to give me a new one... god forbid it happen again, but I'm sure they will do it at least one more time since the manager himself told me I'd be safe. I even told him it was a 850w ThermalTake. Also... I'm just an impatient mofo, hahah. I spent 1700 bucks I want to play!! lol, anyways, Thank you so much everyone!!
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