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General advice for buying a spare battery for my laptop?

Forum Laptops & Notebooks : General Laptops & Notebooks - General advice for buying a spare battery for my laptop?

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Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Hi, I was wondering if anyone could give me some basic info on how to
find a battery to fit my secondhand laptop.

I'm looking for a spare battery (new or used) to fit my Evesham Voyager
5000 (model 6133) laptop. On the back of the battery it says it is a
Toshiba TH-4000A.

Desciption: Its 12v 4000mAh 18cm long, 75cm wide rectangle shaped. The
release button for the laptop is on the 75cm wide end and the 6 copper
contacts are on the 18cm long side. Does that help?

This seems to be a link to a shop selling one for £115! But the picture
and description seem to be spot on...

http://www.computerbatteries.co.uk [...] -5000.html

I've heard evesham can get me one for £75 but does anyone know of a
source of secondhand or generic batteries for these? I live in the UK
if that helps... Will all TH-4000A's fit no matter what brand of
machine they go in?

Also on another note. Whats the best way to find out if its my battery
that wont hold the charge or if the charger inside the laptop is dead?
-Sorry I don't know anyone else with this machine so I can't swap it to
find out...

thanks for all the advice...

Add a reply

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Me wrote:
> Hi, I was wondering if anyone could give me some basic info on how to
> find a battery to fit my secondhand laptop.
>
> I'm looking for a spare battery (new or used) to fit my Evesham Voyager
> 5000 (model 6133) laptop. On the back of the battery it says it is a
> Toshiba TH-4000A.
>
> Desciption: Its 12v 4000mAh 18cm long, 75cm wide rectangle shaped. The
> release button for the laptop is on the 75cm wide end and the 6 copper
> contacts are on the 18cm long side. Does that help?
>
> This seems to be a link to a shop selling one for £115! But the picture
> and description seem to be spot on...
>
> http://www.computerbatteries.co.uk [...] -5000.html
>
> I've heard evesham can get me one for £75 but does anyone know of a
> source of secondhand or generic batteries for these? I live in the UK
> if that helps... Will all TH-4000A's fit no matter what brand of
> machine they go in?
>
> Also on another note. Whats the best way to find out if its my battery
> that wont hold the charge or if the charger inside the laptop is dead?
> -Sorry I don't know anyone else with this machine so I can't swap it to
> find out...
>
>
> thanks for all the advice...
>

Don't!
Of course, if you need the capacity of two batteries between charges,
you have no chioce. Having one as a SPARE is a bad idea. The damn
things go bad in a few years just sitting there. You'll probably break
or trade your laptop by the time you wear out one.

There are as many variables as there are batteries. There are a lot of
failure modes. But, if the battery charges at all, the charging circuit
probably works. If it doesn't charge any, you may have a bad charging
circuit or a bad battery.

On my battery, I measure 12.4V from pins 1 to 4. Pin 1 is the long one.
I was not able to get it to take any charge current, so there's
something else going on inside that's not enabled.

I looked for voltage on the battery pins inside the laptop. There's not
enough voltage between any of the pins to charge the battery. Takes
several seconds for the charge light to come on after inserting the
battery. Expect there's some communication required to turn things on.
This is gonna make troubleshooting difficult.

I'm CHEAP, so I'd pop the cover on the battery pack, charge the cells
individually then see what happens.
My battery is NiMH. It may be that they also make a LiIon pack in the
same configuration. In that case, be very careful not to overcharge the
cells if you take it apart.

My lawyer insists that I advise you to NEVER work on your laptop or it's
battery.
mike

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Reply to Mike

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

cool. Thanks for the info.

Actually, it seems that my batter is dead as it doesn't hold a charge
enough to power on, so if I got a spare it wouldn't go to waste. I'll
have to put a multimeter on the pins to see what it looks like though.

Interesting that you say there are cells inside the "battery" Are they
similar to remote control cars and the such? I've had cars who's
batteries were just 6 or so AA cells taped together with leads soldered
on. Would there be something similar inside my battery?

just curious as though I'm cheap, I'm probably too lazy to go monkeying
about...

> Don't!
> Of course, if you need the capacity of two batteries between charges,
> you have no chioce. Having one as a SPARE is a bad idea. The damn
> things go bad in a few years just sitting there. You'll probably break
> or trade your laptop by the time you wear out one.
>
> There are as many variables as there are batteries. There are a lot of
> failure modes. But, if the battery charges at all, the charging circuit
> probably works. If it doesn't charge any, you may have a bad charging
> circuit or a bad battery.
>
> On my battery, I measure 12.4V from pins 1 to 4. Pin 1 is the long one.
> I was not able to get it to take any charge current, so there's
> something else going on inside that's not enabled.
>
> I looked for voltage on the battery pins inside the laptop. There's not
> enough voltage between any of the pins to charge the battery. Takes
> several seconds for the charge light to come on after inserting the
> battery. Expect there's some communication required to turn things on.
> This is gonna make troubleshooting difficult.
>
>
> I'm CHEAP, so I'd pop the cover on the battery pack, charge the cells
> individually then see what happens.
> My battery is NiMH. It may be that they also make a LiIon pack in the
> same configuration. In that case, be very careful not to overcharge the
> cells if you take it apart.
>
> My lawyer insists that I advise you to NEVER work on your laptop or it's
> battery.
> mike
>

Reply to ME

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Me wrote:

> cool. Thanks for the info.
>
> Actually, it seems that my batter is dead as it doesn't hold a charge
> enough to power on, so if I got a spare it wouldn't go to waste. I'll
> have to put a multimeter on the pins to see what it looks like though.
>
> Interesting that you say there are cells inside the "battery" Are they
> similar to remote control cars and the such? I've had cars who's
> batteries were just 6 or so AA cells taped together with leads soldered
> on. Would there be something similar inside my battery?
>
> just curious as though I'm cheap, I'm probably too lazy to go monkeying
> about...

If it's lithium ion go monkeying about. If you make a mistake with
lithium-ion batteries they occasionally go "bang". I'm not talking a
little leak, I'm talking about an explosion big enough to bring down a
light airplane or knock a hole in the side of an airliner.

>> Don't!
>> Of course, if you need the capacity of two batteries between charges,
>> you have no chioce. Having one as a SPARE is a bad idea. The damn
>> things go bad in a few years just sitting there. You'll probably break
>> or trade your laptop by the time you wear out one.
>>
>> There are as many variables as there are batteries. There are a lot of
>> failure modes. But, if the battery charges at all, the charging circuit
>> probably works. If it doesn't charge any, you may have a bad charging
>> circuit or a bad battery.
>>
>> On my battery, I measure 12.4V from pins 1 to 4. Pin 1 is the long one.
>> I was not able to get it to take any charge current, so there's
>> something else going on inside that's not enabled.
>>
>> I looked for voltage on the battery pins inside the laptop. There's not
>> enough voltage between any of the pins to charge the battery. Takes
>> several seconds for the charge light to come on after inserting the
>> battery. Expect there's some communication required to turn things on.
>> This is gonna make troubleshooting difficult.
>>
>>
>> I'm CHEAP, so I'd pop the cover on the battery pack, charge the cells
>> individually then see what happens.
>> My battery is NiMH. It may be that they also make a LiIon pack in the
>> same configuration. In that case, be very careful not to overcharge the
>> cells if you take it apart.
>>
>> My lawyer insists that I advise you to NEVER work on your laptop or it's
>> battery.
>> mike
>>

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Reply to Anonymous

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"mike" <spamme0@netscape.net> wrote in message news:426A426C.6020302@netscape.net...
Date: Sat, 23 Apr 2005 05:41:16 -0700

Having one as a SPARE is a bad idea. The damn things go bad in
a few years just sitting there. You'll probably break or trade
your laptop by the time you wear out one.

Hi Mike... Well I have to take exception to your battery lifetime.
As I have 30 years of experience with rechargeable batteries (Pb and
Ni-Cads) and about 10 years with Ni-MH and Li-Ion batteries.

And a few of my Ni-Cads are still kicking after 30 years. I have one
Pb (lead-acid) last about 10 years (and I learned from one mistake
that would have pushed that one longer). And many Li-Ion and Ni-MH
pushing 10 years now and are still fine. And it is all about the
proper care and feeding of them. And I continue to learn all of the
time and getting more and more of them to last longer and longer.

... On my battery, I measure 12.4V from pins 1 to 4. Pin 1 is
the long one. I was not able to get it to take any charge
current, so there's something else going on inside that's not
enabled.

It's pretty odd that a Ni-MH won't take any charge current. Although
the charger has to put out higher than the battery voltage before it
will even begin to charge. The higher the voltage, the more amps the
battery should take.

I looked for voltage on the battery pins inside the laptop.
There's not enough voltage between any of the pins to charge
the battery. Takes several seconds for the charge light to come
on after inserting the battery. Expect there's some
communication required to turn things on. This is gonna make
troubleshooting difficult.

Yes, these are called smart chargers. And depending on the
engineering, many of them check for a decent battery voltage first,
sometimes checks for reverse polarity, may check battery
temperature, etc.

I'm CHEAP, so I'd pop the cover on the battery pack, charge the
cells individually then see what happens. My battery is NiMH.
It may be that they also make a LiIon pack in the same
configuration. In that case, be very careful not to overcharge
the cells if you take it apart.

Well yes, Li-Ion batteries are really dangerous if you don't know
what you are doing. Some people actually place the Li-Ion battery on
a metal tray just in case it burst into flames. Some even go further
and put them in a big steel box while charging them. And yes, you
should never leave them alone while charging either. But if you
trickle charge them, it is really pretty safe. But who has time?

Ni-MH batteries don't explode, but they don't like fast and
overcharging either. As you can charge them really fast until they
start reaching a full charge and then they start heating up really
badly if the charging isn't stopped. Usually they won't start a
fire, but they can burn things.

My lawyer insists that I advise you to NEVER work on your
laptop or it's battery.

Dang lawyers are always taking the fun out of everything! <sigh>

Cheers!

__________________________________________________
Bill (using a Toshiba 2595XDVD under Windows 2000)
-- written and edited within WordStar 5.0

Reply to Anonymous

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

J. Clarke wrote:

> Me wrote:
>
>> cool. Thanks for the info.
>>
>> Actually, it seems that my batter is dead as it doesn't hold a charge
>> enough to power on, so if I got a spare it wouldn't go to waste. I'll
>> have to put a multimeter on the pins to see what it looks like though.
>>
>> Interesting that you say there are cells inside the "battery" Are they
>> similar to remote control cars and the such? I've had cars who's
>> batteries were just 6 or so AA cells taped together with leads soldered
>> on. Would there be something similar inside my battery?
>>
>> just curious as though I'm cheap, I'm probably too lazy to go monkeying
>> about...
>
> If it's lithium ion go monkeying about.

That should have been DON'T go monkeying about.

> If you make a mistake with
> lithium-ion batteries they occasionally go "bang". I'm not talking a
> little leak, I'm talking about an explosion big enough to bring down a
> light airplane or knock a hole in the side of an airliner.
>
>>> Don't!
>>> Of course, if you need the capacity of two batteries between charges,
>>> you have no chioce. Having one as a SPARE is a bad idea. The damn
>>> things go bad in a few years just sitting there. You'll probably break
>>> or trade your laptop by the time you wear out one.
>>>
>>> There are as many variables as there are batteries. There are a lot of
>>> failure modes. But, if the battery charges at all, the charging circuit
>>> probably works. If it doesn't charge any, you may have a bad charging
>>> circuit or a bad battery.
>>>
>>> On my battery, I measure 12.4V from pins 1 to 4. Pin 1 is the long one.
>>> I was not able to get it to take any charge current, so there's
>>> something else going on inside that's not enabled.
>>>
>>> I looked for voltage on the battery pins inside the laptop. There's not
>>> enough voltage between any of the pins to charge the battery. Takes
>>> several seconds for the charge light to come on after inserting the
>>> battery. Expect there's some communication required to turn things on.
>>> This is gonna make troubleshooting difficult.
>>>
>>>
>>> I'm CHEAP, so I'd pop the cover on the battery pack, charge the cells
>>> individually then see what happens.
>>> My battery is NiMH. It may be that they also make a LiIon pack in the
>>> same configuration. In that case, be very careful not to overcharge the
>>> cells if you take it apart.
>>>
>>> My lawyer insists that I advise you to NEVER work on your laptop or it's
>>> battery.
>>> mike
>>>
>

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Reply to Anonymous

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

You can get a replacement LiIon battery from
http://www.pioneer-electronics.co. [...] /4748/6033
for about £80. I have not tried this, but I suspect that this is a
better solution than a NiMH battery, as it has a higher output voltage.
Personally, I wouldn't buy a secondhand battery; they don't last
forever and the chance of buying a lemon must be pretty high.

I took my original (NiMH) battery apart (the top of the case is glued
on - I levered it off with a craft knife, still have most of my
fingers) and it contains 10 cells, size 67mm x 17mm, type 4/3A (or
7/5AF - there seem to be two names for the same thing). If you are
handy with a soldering iron, you can buy these from
http://www.eurobatteries.com/sitep [...] teries.asp for £3.46
each, so you could 'refurbish' your battery pack for about £35. This
is what I planned to do, but the cells themselves seem OK, so I fear
that the circuitry may be damaged :-(.

Hope this helps.

I know this is a bit of a longshot, but if anyone out there has a dead
TH-4000A battery that they are thinking of throwing in the bin, I would
like to have it (will pay P&P).

Reply to Anonymous

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