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power inverter to charge digital camera battery, maybe rec..

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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 24, 2005 12:38:56 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.

The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
inverter is on?

Can this be right?

I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?

Thanks
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 24, 2005 4:10:33 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

News Reader wrote:

> I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
> to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
> came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
> recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
> it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
>
> The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
> inverter is on?
>
> Can this be right?
>
> I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
> car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
> and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?

Well, try it without the ignition on and let us know how it works out. Pay
up your AAA first.

Hint--when the engine in the car is not running then the only electrical
power available is from the battery. If your car has a great big battery
and the weather's warm you probably won't have a problem. If it's got an
itty-bitty battery and the weather's cold you may find that you've used up
enough of its capacity that the car won't start. Personally unless there
was another car on the trip and you had jump-cables with you I wouldn't try
it.

> Thanks

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 24, 2005 7:25:45 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

The inverter draws too much power to safely use without the alternator
unless you have a second battery or a boost source.

Why not just get the automotive adapter that works off 12 volts DC and
plug it in to the lighter socket? That still can get dangerous, but it
draws 'way' less power than an inverter. The inverter is going to 120
AC, then back to 9 VDC or 6 VDC or what every you need, all those steps
eat power.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

News Reader wrote:
>
> I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
> to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
> came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
> recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
> it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
>
> The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
> inverter is on?
>
> Can this be right?
>
> I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
> car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
> and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?
>
> Thanks
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 24, 2005 8:33:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

"News Reader" <SLCUUVKKQKKI@spammotel.com> wrote in message news:1114357136.345668.32430@g14g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
Date: 24 Apr 2005 08:38:56 -0700

I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I
really want to do is recharge my digital camera battery using
the AC adapter that came with it (this is one of those Canon
S400s). I may also want to recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42)
but can probably live with recharging it while off and won't
need to use it while it's on the inverter.

The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when
the inverter is on?

Can this be right?

It depends a lot of the capacity of the car battery and the power
being drawn from it. If your car has a volt meter (or a multimeter),
just check it a lot at first. Most cars will still start when the
voltage drops down to around 11 volts. Although I'd never let it
drop below 12 volts until you know your car well.

I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be
running the car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to
turn on the ignition and let the car idle while I'm recharging
things? Thanks

My power inverter will turn itself off if the voltage drops around
10.8v I believe. And supposedly that will leave enough power to
restart the car. Your power inverter doesn't say anything about
this?

Got one of those jump start batteries? As that will jump start the
car if the battery drops too low. I use one and it has never failed
me yet.

I also have a Marine battery installed in my van instead of a
standard battery. As Marine batteries are designed to be discharged
and then recharged regularly. Regular car batteries don't like deep
discharges too well.




Cheers!


__________________________________________________
Bill (using a Toshiba 2595XDVD under Windows 2000)
-- written and edited within WordStar 5.0
April 24, 2005 11:20:26 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Mike Romain wrote:
> The inverter draws too much power to safely use without the alternator
> unless you have a second battery or a boost source.
>
> Why not just get the automotive adapter that works off 12 volts DC and
> plug it in to the lighter socket? That still can get dangerous, but it
> draws 'way' less power than an inverter.

I'll challenge that statement. My inverter draws 60mA at 12V unloaded.
Efficiency is over 80%. Yes there's loss, but very little practical
difference in whether your car will start when you're done.

It's still a bad idea to run ANYTHING off your car battery when you're
the only vehicle out in the boonies. I always take along a 12 pound
gas generator.
mike

The inverter is going to 120
> AC, then back to 9 VDC or 6 VDC or what every you need, all those steps
> eat power.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
> News Reader wrote:
>
>>I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
>>to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
>>came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
>>recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
>>it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
>>
>>The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
>>inverter is on?
>>
>>Can this be right?
>>
>>I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
>>car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
>>and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?
>>
>>Thanks
>



--
Return address is VALID but some sites block emails
with links. Delete this sig when replying.
..
Wanted, PCMCIA SCSI Card for HP m820 CDRW.
FS 500MHz Tek DSOscilloscope TDS540 Make Offer
Wanted, 12.1" LCD for Gateway Solo 5300. Samsung LT121SU-121
Wanted 12" LCD for Compaq Armada 7770MT.
Bunch of stuff For Sale and Wanted at the link below.
MAKE THE OBVIOUS CHANGES TO THE LINK
ht<removethis>tp://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Monitor/4710/
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 25, 2005 3:27:37 AM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

News Reader wrote:
>>
>>> I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
>>> to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
>>> came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
>>> recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
>>> it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
>>>
>>> The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
>>> inverter is on?
>>>
>>> Can this be right?
>>>
>>> I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
>>> car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
>>> and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?

I actually have left a laptop plugged into the power inverter for days
at a time w/no problems. The total voltage used to charge the laptop
isn't that much, and my battery usually still have around 10.5-11V in
the morning -- enough to start the engine. Just as long as you start
the car each morning (to go to work or whatever), it should be fine.
But try it at home first before you go do it at the campsite.

Of course, this might be very bad for the battery in the long run.
/me shrugs
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 25, 2005 5:38:19 AM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

The only reason that the car should be running is to avoid having a dead
car battery. You don't have to run the car, but the power draw from the
inverter can be substantial, and it can run down the battery relatively
quickly. Not in minutes, probabably, but I certainly would not use it
overnight. However, charging the digital camera will use an almost
negligibe amount of power.

[Actually, for the digital camera, you can probably find a cigarette
lighter plug that will work directly (without the inverter). You can
find such a power supply for the laptop, also. But there is a big
difference: The camera charger will draw 5 to 10 watts, the computer
power adapater might draw as much as 150 watts. Major difference.]



News Reader wrote:

> I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
> to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
> came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
> recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
> it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
>
> The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
> inverter is on?
>
> Can this be right?
>
> I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
> car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
> and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?
>
> Thanks
>
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 25, 2005 2:08:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

mike wrote:
>
> Mike Romain wrote:
> > The inverter draws too much power to safely use without the alternator
> > unless you have a second battery or a boost source.
> >
> > Why not just get the automotive adapter that works off 12 volts DC and
> > plug it in to the lighter socket? That still can get dangerous, but it
> > draws 'way' less power than an inverter.
>
> I'll challenge that statement. My inverter draws 60mA at 12V unloaded.
> Efficiency is over 80%. Yes there's loss, but very little practical
> difference in whether your car will start when you're done.

Ok, that is all fine and dandy but only means with no draw (just plugged
in) you are already killing the battery. What you need to compare is
the AC adaptor draw on your inverter to the correct DC adapter drawing
on your battery.

Mike


>
> It's still a bad idea to run ANYTHING off your car battery when you're
> the only vehicle out in the boonies. I always take along a 12 pound
> gas generator.
> mike
>
> The inverter is going to 120
> > AC, then back to 9 VDC or 6 VDC or what every you need, all those steps
> > eat power.
> >
> > Mike
> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >
> > News Reader wrote:
> >
> >>I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
> >>to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
> >>came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
> >>recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
> >>it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
> >>
> >>The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
> >>inverter is on?
> >>
> >>Can this be right?
> >>
> >>I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
> >>car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
> >>and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?
> >>
> >>Thanks
> >
>
> --
> Return address is VALID but some sites block emails
> with links. Delete this sig when replying.
> .
> Wanted, PCMCIA SCSI Card for HP m820 CDRW.
> FS 500MHz Tek DSOscilloscope TDS540 Make Offer
> Wanted, 12.1" LCD for Gateway Solo 5300. Samsung LT121SU-121
> Wanted 12" LCD for Compaq Armada 7770MT.
> Bunch of stuff For Sale and Wanted at the link below.
> MAKE THE OBVIOUS CHANGES TO THE LINK
> ht<removethis>tp://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Monitor/4710/
April 25, 2005 7:50:00 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Mike Romain wrote:
> mike wrote:
>
>>Mike Romain wrote:
>>
>>>The inverter draws too much power to safely use without the alternator
>>>unless you have a second battery or a boost source.
>>>
>>>Why not just get the automotive adapter that works off 12 volts DC and
>>>plug it in to the lighter socket? That still can get dangerous, but it
>>>draws 'way' less power than an inverter.
>>
>>I'll challenge that statement. My inverter draws 60mA at 12V unloaded.
>>Efficiency is over 80%. Yes there's loss, but very little practical
>>difference in whether your car will start when you're done.
>
>
> Ok, that is all fine and dandy but only means with no draw (just plugged
> in) you are already killing the battery.

I agree completely. If you're too stupid to turn off the inverter when
it's not in use, you'll run your 60AH battery flat in only 1,000 hours.
Sure wish I had that much time to spend camping.

What you need to compare is
> the AC adaptor draw on your inverter to the correct DC adapter drawing
> on your battery.

We've alredy done that, but I'll spell it out...
Refer to the paragraph above. The drain is
60ma + (correct DC adapter drain)/0.8
That means you'll have to start the engine to recharge
25% more often.


mike


>
> Mike
>
>
>
>>It's still a bad idea to run ANYTHING off your car battery when you're
>>the only vehicle out in the boonies. I always take along a 12 pound
>>gas generator.
>>mike
>>
>>The inverter is going to 120
>>
>>>AC, then back to 9 VDC or 6 VDC or what every you need, all those steps
>>>eat power.
>>>
>>>Mike
>>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>>>
>>>News Reader wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
>>>>to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
>>>>came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
>>>>recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
>>>>it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
>>>>
>>>>The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
>>>>inverter is on?
>>>>
>>>>Can this be right?
>>>>
>>>>I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
>>>>car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
>>>>and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?
>>>>
>>>>Thanks
>>>
>>--
>>Return address is VALID but some sites block emails
>>with links. Delete this sig when replying.
>>.
>>Wanted, PCMCIA SCSI Card for HP m820 CDRW.
>>FS 500MHz Tek DSOscilloscope TDS540 Make Offer
>>Wanted, 12.1" LCD for Gateway Solo 5300. Samsung LT121SU-121
>>Wanted 12" LCD for Compaq Armada 7770MT.
>>Bunch of stuff For Sale and Wanted at the link below.
>>MAKE THE OBVIOUS CHANGES TO THE LINK
>>ht<removethis>tp://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Monitor/4710/
>



--
Return address is VALID but some sites block emails
with links. Delete this sig when replying.
..
Wanted, PCMCIA SCSI Card for HP m820 CDRW.
FS 500MHz Tek DSOscilloscope TDS540 Make Offer
Wanted, 12.1" LCD for Gateway Solo 5300. Samsung LT121SU-121
Wanted 12" LCD for Compaq Armada 7770MT.
Bunch of stuff For Sale and Wanted at the link below.
MAKE THE OBVIOUS CHANGES TO THE LINK
ht<removethis>tp://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Monitor/4710/
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 25, 2005 10:36:45 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

mike wrote:

> Mike Romain wrote:
>> mike wrote:
>>
>>>Mike Romain wrote:
>>>
>>>>The inverter draws too much power to safely use without the alternator
>>>>unless you have a second battery or a boost source.
>>>>
>>>>Why not just get the automotive adapter that works off 12 volts DC and
>>>>plug it in to the lighter socket? That still can get dangerous, but it
>>>>draws 'way' less power than an inverter.
>>>
>>>I'll challenge that statement. My inverter draws 60mA at 12V unloaded.
>>>Efficiency is over 80%. Yes there's loss, but very little practical
>>>difference in whether your car will start when you're done.
>>
>>
>> Ok, that is all fine and dandy but only means with no draw (just plugged
>> in) you are already killing the battery.
>
> I agree completely. If you're too stupid to turn off the inverter when
> it's not in use, you'll run your 60AH battery flat in only 1,000 hours.
> Sure wish I had that much time to spend camping.

You don't have to draw the battery flat to take it low enough that the car
won't start. And if the battery is marginal to begin with then a few hours
might take it down just enough that it won't go.

> What you need to compare is
>> the AC adaptor draw on your inverter to the correct DC adapter drawing
>> on your battery.
>
> We've alredy done that, but I'll spell it out...
> Refer to the paragraph above. The drain is
> 60ma + (correct DC adapter drain)/0.8
> That means you'll have to start the engine to recharge
> 25% more often.

Personally, like I said before, I'd test it in the driveway. Better to find
out for sure up front than to get stuck in the boonies with a dead battery.
>
>
> mike
>
>
>>
>> Mike
>>
>>
>>
>>>It's still a bad idea to run ANYTHING off your car battery when you're
>>>the only vehicle out in the boonies. I always take along a 12 pound
>>>gas generator.
>>>mike
>>>
>>>The inverter is going to 120
>>>
>>>>AC, then back to 9 VDC or 6 VDC or what every you need, all those steps
>>>>eat power.
>>>>
>>>>Mike
>>>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>>>>
>>>>News Reader wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
>>>>>to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
>>>>>came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
>>>>>recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
>>>>>it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
>>>>>
>>>>>The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
>>>>>inverter is on?
>>>>>
>>>>>Can this be right?
>>>>>
>>>>>I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
>>>>>car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
>>>>>and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?
>>>>>
>>>>>Thanks
>>>>
>>>--
>>>Return address is VALID but some sites block emails
>>>with links. Delete this sig when replying.
>>>.
>>>Wanted, PCMCIA SCSI Card for HP m820 CDRW.
>>>FS 500MHz Tek DSOscilloscope TDS540 Make Offer
>>>Wanted, 12.1" LCD for Gateway Solo 5300. Samsung LT121SU-121
>>>Wanted 12" LCD for Compaq Armada 7770MT.
>>>Bunch of stuff For Sale and Wanted at the link below.
>>>MAKE THE OBVIOUS CHANGES TO THE LINK
>>>ht<removethis>tp://www.geocities.com/SiliconValley/Monitor/4710/
>>
>
>
>

--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 26, 2005 12:32:04 AM

Archived from groups: comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

On 24 Apr 2005 08:38:56 -0700, "News Reader"
<SLCUUVKKQKKI@spammotel.com> wrote:

>I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
>to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
>came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
>recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
>it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
>
>The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
>inverter is on?


Yes, unless you want a dead battery. If the camera doesn't draw much
and you don't leave it connected all that long and your battery is
good and large, you may not have a problem. Another issue is not
mentioned, though, if the inverter is a modified sign wave, it may not
work well with your camera charger, I've heard that some drill
chargers do not work off of inverters.
Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 26, 2005 2:16:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

mike wrote:
>
> Mike Romain wrote:
> > mike wrote:
> >
> >>Mike Romain wrote:
> >>
> >>>The inverter draws too much power to safely use without the alternator
> >>>unless you have a second battery or a boost source.
> >>>
> >>>Why not just get the automotive adapter that works off 12 volts DC and
> >>>plug it in to the lighter socket? That still can get dangerous, but it
> >>>draws 'way' less power than an inverter.
> >>
> >>I'll challenge that statement. My inverter draws 60mA at 12V unloaded.
> >>Efficiency is over 80%. Yes there's loss, but very little practical
> >>difference in whether your car will start when you're done.
> >
> >
> > Ok, that is all fine and dandy but only means with no draw (just plugged
> > in) you are already killing the battery.
>
> I agree completely. If you're too stupid to turn off the inverter when
> it's not in use, you'll run your 60AH battery flat in only 1,000 hours.
> Sure wish I had that much time to spend camping.
>
> What you need to compare is
> > the AC adaptor draw on your inverter to the correct DC adapter drawing
> > on your battery.
>
> We've alredy done that, but I'll spell it out...
> Refer to the paragraph above. The drain is
> 60ma + (correct DC adapter drain)/0.8
> That means you'll have to start the engine to recharge
> 25% more often.
>
> mike

No no, you are missing the point totally.

You need to compare a DC to DC voltage regulator's draw on the car
battery to an AC adapter and inverter's draw on the car battery.

The 'proper' DC to DC regulator used to charge up the digital camera
batteries will/should use a whole pile less power than an AC adapter and
inverter setup.

Mike
86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's



> >>It's still a bad idea to run ANYTHING off your car battery when you're
> >>the only vehicle out in the boonies. I always take along a 12 pound
> >>gas generator.
> >>mike
> >>
> >>The inverter is going to 120
> >>
> >>>AC, then back to 9 VDC or 6 VDC or what every you need, all those steps
> >>>eat power.
> >>>
> >>>Mike
> >>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >>>
> >>>News Reader wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
> >>>>to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
> >>>>came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
> >>>>recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
> >>>>it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
> >>>>
> >>>>The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
> >>>>inverter is on?
> >>>>
> >>>>Can this be right?
> >>>>
> >>>>I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
> >>>>car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
> >>>>and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?
> >>>>
> >>>>Thanks
> >>>
> >>--
April 26, 2005 9:14:53 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

Mike Romain wrote:
> mike wrote:
>
>>Mike Romain wrote:
>>
>>>mike wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>Mike Romain wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>The inverter draws too much power to safely use without the alternator
>>>>>unless you have a second battery or a boost source.
>>>>>
>>>>>Why not just get the automotive adapter that works off 12 volts DC and
>>>>>plug it in to the lighter socket? That still can get dangerous, but it
>>>>>draws 'way' less power than an inverter.
>>>>
>>>>I'll challenge that statement. My inverter draws 60mA at 12V unloaded.
>>>>Efficiency is over 80%. Yes there's loss, but very little practical
>>>>difference in whether your car will start when you're done.
>>>
>>>
>>>Ok, that is all fine and dandy but only means with no draw (just plugged
>>>in) you are already killing the battery.
>>
>>I agree completely. If you're too stupid to turn off the inverter when
>>it's not in use, you'll run your 60AH battery flat in only 1,000 hours.
>>Sure wish I had that much time to spend camping.
>>
>>What you need to compare is
>>
>>>the AC adaptor draw on your inverter to the correct DC adapter drawing
>>>on your battery.
>>
>>We've alredy done that, but I'll spell it out...
>>Refer to the paragraph above. The drain is
>>60ma + (correct DC adapter drain)/0.8
>>That means you'll have to start the engine to recharge
>>25% more often.
>>
>>mike
>
>
> No no, you are missing the point totally.
>
> You need to compare a DC to DC voltage regulator's draw on the car
> battery to an AC adapter and inverter's draw on the car battery.

OK, put your multimeter where your point is...totally...

My multimeter says this:
IBM 02K7010 AC adapter for laptop computer
NoName PC-140 AC Inverter. About 15 year old technology.
Trygon Regulated DC supply.
Constant current active load.

Load on AC adapter 16.08V X 2.00A = 32.16W
Power into Inverter 12.37V X 3.54A = 43.78W

Efficiency 73.4%

I don't have a direct DC-DC converter, but since you
are adamant, I'm sure you have personal experience and can
"totally" back up your point with an efficiency measurement.

Publish your efficiency number for the direct
DC-DC charger, compare it to 73.4%, and let's talk about the size
of that "whole pile" of difference. Compare your numbers to my original
back-of-the-enveloppe estimate of,
"The drain is 60ma + (correct DC adapter drain)/0.8".

Your move,
mike

>
> The 'proper' DC to DC regulator used to charge up the digital camera
> batteries will/should use a whole pile less power than an AC adapter and
> inverter setup.
>
> Mike
> 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>
>
>
>
>>>>It's still a bad idea to run ANYTHING off your car battery when you're
>>>>the only vehicle out in the boonies. I always take along a 12 pound
>>>>gas generator.
>>>>mike
>>>>
>>>>The inverter is going to 120
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>AC, then back to 9 VDC or 6 VDC or what every you need, all those steps
>>>>>eat power.
>>>>>
>>>>>Mike
>>>>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
>>>>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
>>>>>
>>>>>News Reader wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
>>>>>>to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
>>>>>>came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
>>>>>>recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
>>>>>>it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
>>>>>>inverter is on?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Can this be right?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
>>>>>>car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
>>>>>>and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Thanks
>>>>>
>>>>--
>>>



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Anonymous
a b D Laptop
April 28, 2005 9:12:22 PM

Archived from groups: rec.autos.misc,comp.sys.laptops (More info?)

mike wrote:
>
> Mike Romain wrote:
> > mike wrote:
> >
> >>Mike Romain wrote:
> >>
> >>>mike wrote:
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Mike Romain wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>The inverter draws too much power to safely use without the alternator
> >>>>>unless you have a second battery or a boost source.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Why not just get the automotive adapter that works off 12 volts DC and
> >>>>>plug it in to the lighter socket? That still can get dangerous, but it
> >>>>>draws 'way' less power than an inverter.
> >>>>
> >>>>I'll challenge that statement. My inverter draws 60mA at 12V unloaded.
> >>>>Efficiency is over 80%. Yes there's loss, but very little practical
> >>>>difference in whether your car will start when you're done.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>Ok, that is all fine and dandy but only means with no draw (just plugged
> >>>in) you are already killing the battery.
> >>
> >>I agree completely. If you're too stupid to turn off the inverter when
> >>it's not in use, you'll run your 60AH battery flat in only 1,000 hours.
> >>Sure wish I had that much time to spend camping.
> >>
> >>What you need to compare is
> >>
> >>>the AC adaptor draw on your inverter to the correct DC adapter drawing
> >>>on your battery.
> >>
> >>We've alredy done that, but I'll spell it out...
> >>Refer to the paragraph above. The drain is
> >>60ma + (correct DC adapter drain)/0.8
> >>That means you'll have to start the engine to recharge
> >>25% more often.
> >>
> >>mike
> >
> >
> > No no, you are missing the point totally.
> >
> > You need to compare a DC to DC voltage regulator's draw on the car
> > battery to an AC adapter and inverter's draw on the car battery.
>
> OK, put your multimeter where your point is...totally...
>
> My multimeter says this:
> IBM 02K7010 AC adapter for laptop computer
> NoName PC-140 AC Inverter. About 15 year old technology.
> Trygon Regulated DC supply.
> Constant current active load.
>
> Load on AC adapter 16.08V X 2.00A = 32.16W
> Power into Inverter 12.37V X 3.54A = 43.78W
>
> Efficiency 73.4%
>
> I don't have a direct DC-DC converter, but since you
> are adamant, I'm sure you have personal experience and can
> "totally" back up your point with an efficiency measurement.
>
> Publish your efficiency number for the direct
> DC-DC charger, compare it to 73.4%, and let's talk about the size
> of that "whole pile" of difference. Compare your numbers to my original
> back-of-the-enveloppe estimate of,
> "The drain is 60ma + (correct DC adapter drain)/0.8".
>
> Your move,
> mike

Ok... I couldn't find any numbers even close to what you are reporting
so here is what I have on hand.

I have an AC/DC adapter here, an "Omega" model PWA223, that according to
the label uses 120V and 7 watts to put out 12 volts at 300 ma or 3.6
watts out which will run my HP200LX palmtop PC. That is a poor 51%
efficiency and runs fairly hot for that 49% loss.

I have a second bunch my tenant is selling new, Wellson model W88's,
that says it uses 12 watts at 120 V to put out the same 300 ma which
translates to an insane 30% efficient..... (cheap puppy must get really
hot, haven't tried one)

Then you take the 7 W and put it through your inverter at say an
'amazing' 80% even efficiency and you have 8.75 watt battery draw to get
3.6 watts which is now 41% efficiency! Or you have the 15 watt one
that is 21% when used with the inverter...

I also believe my cheap 350W inverter is closer to 70%, but haven't
checked.

Then if you take the cigarette lighter DC to DC converter for his
thinkpad say, it/most of them is/are advertised at 82% efficient!

http://store.l-f-l.com/cgi-bin/cp-app.cgi?rrc=N&pg=prod...

So I am seeing a direct DC to DC connection being 82% efficient and a DC
to AC to DC setup being a power pig big time, blowing it off in heat.

In either case they aren't safe to use out in the bush without a backup
battery or the vehicle running mostly because you cannot tell the state
of you battery after the trip and you only have a volt or two to 'play'
with before the engine won't start....

Mike

>
> >
> > The 'proper' DC to DC regulator used to charge up the digital camera
> > batteries will/should use a whole pile less power than an AC adapter and
> > inverter setup.
> >
> > Mike
> > 86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> > 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >>>>It's still a bad idea to run ANYTHING off your car battery when you're
> >>>>the only vehicle out in the boonies. I always take along a 12 pound
> >>>>gas generator.
> >>>>mike
> >>>>
> >>>>The inverter is going to 120
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>AC, then back to 9 VDC or 6 VDC or what every you need, all those steps
> >>>>>eat power.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Mike
> >>>>>86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00
> >>>>>88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's
> >>>>>
> >>>>>News Reader wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>>I just picked up a Linksys Power2Go power inverter. All I really want
> >>>>>>to do is recharge my digital camera battery using the AC adapter that
> >>>>>>came with it (this is one of those Canon S400s). I may also want to
> >>>>>>recharge my laptop (Thinkpad T42) but can probably live with recharging
> >>>>>>it while off and won't need to use it while it's on the inverter.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>The Linksys instructions say that the car must be running when the
> >>>>>>inverter is on?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Can this be right?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>I'm going to be at a campsite for a few days and won't be running the
> >>>>>>car (it will just be parked). Do I really have to turn on the ignition
> >>>>>>and let the car idle while I'm recharging things?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>Thanks
> >>>>>
> >>>>--
> >>>
>
!