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PCIe questions on new build.

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April 16, 2011 2:25:09 AM

Hello fellow builders!

It has been a long time since I have done any kind of build like this. The p3 933mhz with 8x agp that I last built was all the rave back in my day :p 

Approximate Purchase Date: Middle of may, 2011


Budget Range: $1000 (+) (may, 2011, + upgrade within 6 months)


System Usage from Most to Least Important: Gaming FR's (From pong to crysis 2, CGA (Maya 2011)


Parts Not Required: 1st Monitor, KB, Mouse


Preferred Website(s) for Parts: Newegg


Country of Origin: USA


Parts Preferences: AMD x6 3.2ghz cpu, Radeon 68xx or 69xx GPU, SATA III, USB 3.0


Overclocking: No/Maybe


SLI or Crossfire: No


Monitor Resolution: 1920x1080
ASUS VE247H Black 23.6" 2ms Full HD HDMI LED BackLight LCD Monitor
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


Additional Comments: Future upgradable to an internal SSD, sound card, and 3 monitor eyefinity (And possibly a 6990 GPU)


I really want to avoid the headaches of building A new machine myself. Thus i have been looking into prebuilt systems from newegg and TD and finally settled on this;

Option #1

CyberpowerPC Gamer Ultra 2068 Phenom II X6 1090T(3.2GHz) 8GB DDR3 1TB HDD Capacity AMD Radeon HD 6850 Windows 7 Home Premium 64-Bit
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...



My biggest concern here is the PCIe lane issue for future upgrades, at some future point this would be upgraded to a single 69xx PCIe x16 class 2GB or 4GB GPU, internal PCIe x4 SSD and PCIe x1 sound card.

I will want to upgrade to this configuration at some point this summer or fall. I'm not too interested in getting a prebuilt that cannot be upgraded as stated.

The motherboard in the cyberpower build is;
GIGABYTE GA-870A-UD3 AM3 AMD 870 SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
The PCIe lane issues confuse me greatly. Will this motherboard eventually support these 3 PCIe devices?
Are there lane restrictions that are going to decrease performance somehow if its *Spread out over these slots?*
I don't really understand it all.



The video card from the cyberpower build is;
VisionTek 900339 Radeon HD 6850 1GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
Is this card gonna perform well, on 3 monitors in eyefinity mode?


Pro's:
This machine would fit my needs for a while, as well as PnP out of the box (I hope).
Con's:
Don't know just how upgradable this is.


After poking around dreaming of building my own system I came across a (partial) build (barley) within my $1000 budget that would suit my needs better (I think). It would take me longer to get it together, I.E. orders placed over several weeks to get it going compared to PnP from the cyberpower build.


I could probably build this myself, but am going to leave it to the trusty pros at my local shop should I go this route.

Option #2

MOBO: $149.99
ASUS M4A89GTD PRO/USB3 AM3 AMD 890GX HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX AMD Motherboard.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

CPU, $229.99.
AMD Phenom II X6 1100T Black Edition Thuban 3.3GHz, AM3 125W Six-Core Desktop Processor HDE00ZFBGRBOX.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

CPU cooler: $34.99
COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus RR-B10-212P-G1
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Paste: $9.98.
Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound - OEM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

GPU. $274.99.
SAPPHIRE 100312SR Radeon HD 6950 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

RAM, $99.99
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

HDD , $69.95. (possibly 2x's in raid 1 later)
Western Digital Caviar Black 750GB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


PSU: $139.99
CORSAIR Enthusiast Series CMPSU-850TX 850W ATX12V v2.2 / EPS12V v2.91 SLI Certified CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Power Supply.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

!!!((( $1009.87 )))!!!


This route is not complete, as there is no case or OS included in the $1000 budget. The case, OS, optical drive, extra fans and possibly another HDD would be forthcoming 3-4 weeks after the inital order. The inital order would be bench

tested at my local shop.
_____________________________________________________________________________________________________
Case: $79.99.
COOLER MASTER Storm Scout SGC-2000-KKN1-GP Black Steel / Plastic ATX Mid Tower Computer Case
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

OS: $99.99
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Again, here the PCIe lane issues persists. Any help here would be greatly appreated



Pro's:
Probably much better for my needs.Much better video card and I will probably lose interest in a higher end video card (6990) this route, as I believe the 6950 would be more than adequate.

Con's:
Over my budget by several hundred dollars by the time i add case, OS, Optical drive etc, as well as the local shop's fee to build it. Would have to be ordered in 2 parts.
__________________________________________________________________________
Sometime over the next 6 months this build would be upgraded as follows;

Monitor:
2x's ASUS VE247H Black 23.6" 2ms Full HD HDMI LED BackLight LCD Monitor (for a total of 3 in 5040x1050 eyefinity)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Audio: $99.99
Creative 30SB088200000 7.1 PCI Express x1 Interface SoundBlaster X-Fi Titanium Sound Card
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Internal SSD upgrade: $409.99
OCZ RevoDrive X2 OCZSSDPX-1RVDX0100 PCI-E 100GB PCI-Express x4 MLC Internal Solid State Drive
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
________________________________________________________________________________________________________

((Possible GPU upgrade, $724.99)) (This is possible only, I don't know if I really want or need this. But I would like the system to be able to support it should it happen in the future.)
MSI R6990-4PD4GD5 Radeon HD 6990 4GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.1 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card with Eyefinity
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


There it is in a nutshell, I hope I didn't leave anything out. It has been a long time since i have tried anything like this.
Any help, recommendations or criticism would be more than helpful, I have about a month to decide on which route i should go.

Thank you for your time.

More about : pcie questions build

April 16, 2011 2:39:08 AM

For a $1000, you can build your own which will be much better suited to your purposes.

You want an Intel CPU and Nvidia GPU for the best performance in this price range.

CUDA-accelerated softwares:
http://www.nvidia.com/object/cuda_app_tesla.html

Intel i7 2600k ($330)
Gigabyte UD3P ($160)
GTX 570 Superclocked ($310 after Rebate)
XFX 650 W ($59)
Samsung Spinpoint F3 1 TB ($65)
HAF 912 ($65)
Some DVD drive ($20)

TOTAL: $1009

Would be much better for MAYA and games alike.

Phenom II x6 1100T vs. i7 2600k
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/287?vs=203

Phenom II x6 1100T vs. i5 2500k
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/288?vs=203

EDIT: ***, i knew i was forgetting something.

Add this RAM: G.Skill Sniper Series 8 GB, 1600 MHz, CAS 8 ($120)

Then Windows 7 Home Premium 64 bit for $100

Brings total to $1229

If you decide to use an i5 2500k instead (which is still faster across the board than AMD's fastest 6 core), the total would be $1129
April 16, 2011 2:51:05 AM

Quote:
1 x PCI Express x16 slot, running at x16 (PCIEX16) 1 x PCI Express x16 slot, running at x4 (PCIEX4) Note: The PCIEX1_1 and PCIEX1_2 slots share bandwidth with the PCIEX4 slot. When PCIEX4 slot is populated with a x4 card, the PCIEX1_1 and PCIEX1_2 slots become unavailable


This means that the first light blue PCIe 2.0 x16 slot will run at full x16 bandwidth. The other light blue one will only run at x4.

The two smallest slots, the PCIe x1 slots, which are on either side of the first PCIe x16 slot (top light blue one), use the same bandwidth that the lowest light blue slot uses. So when you put some expansion card into the lowest light blue slot, you cannot use those two small slots on either side of the top light blue slot.

Also, the 6850 has 1 GB of VRAM and is a bit slower than the 5850, which itself is just a hair slower than the Radeon 4850x2. It will perform like *** on three 1080p monitors (a resolution of 5760 x 1080) at any decently high settings.
Related resources
April 17, 2011 7:30:50 PM

Ok, I think I have finally setteled on this...


MOBO: $132.99
GIGABYTE GA-H67A-UD3H-B3 LGA 1155 Intel H67 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 ATX Intel Motherboard
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

CPU: $314.99
Intel Core i7-2600K Sandy Bridge 3.4GHz (3.8GHz Turbo Boost) 4 x 256KB L2 Cache 8MB L3 Cache LGA 1155 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor BX80623I72600K
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

CPU cooler: $34.99
COOLER MASTER Hyper 212 Plus RR-B10-212P-G1
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Paste: $9.98.
Arctic Silver 5 Thermal Compound - OEM
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

RAM: $104.99
G.SKILL Ripjaws Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Desktop Memory Model F3-10666CL7D-8GBRH
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

HDD , $69.95. (possibly 2x's in raid 1 later)
Western Digital Caviar Black 750GB 7200 RPM 64MB Cache SATA 6.0Gb/s 3.5" Internal Hard Drive -Bare Drive.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

PSU: $109.99
CORSAIR CMPSU-750TX 750W ATX12V v2.2 SLI Certified CrossFire Ready 80 PLUS Certified Active PFC Compatible with Core i7 Power Supply
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

OS: $99.99
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64-bit
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

Case: $79.99
COOLER MASTER Storm Scout SGC-2000-KKN1-GP Black Steel / Plastic ATX Mid Tower Computer Case
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...


$957.86
_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
The GPU will be ordered at a later date a few weeks after. most likely this one, but possibly even a GTX 580, I'll see what the $$$ situation is at a later date.


GPU: $369.99
EVGA SuperClocked 012-P3-1572-AR GeForce GTX 570 (Fermi) 1280MB 320-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support Video Card
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

_________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

The only thing im still not too clear on is the PCIe lanes, will this board support the GPU and an internal PCIe 4x SSD?
From what i can tell it will as long as the 2nd slot is populated with a 4x or lower. (the SSD is 4x)

And last, will it support a pci sound card? (regular PCI card) as it seems the x1 slots would not be available with both x16s populated.

Optical drive will be coming out of the old desktop.

The MOBO pictures and details show a vga/dvi/hdmi on board, but on the Gigabyte site it says there is no video support?
It would be nice to at least get it booted up with onboard video. if not i have a SAPPHIRE 100254HDMI Radeon HD 4650 1GB 128-bit DDR2 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card, http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168... that should go in this for a few weeks.

I have about 2 weeks to finally make up my mind.
April 17, 2011 8:08:30 PM

If you buy an H67 motherboard, you will be able to use the processor's on-die graphics, but you will never be able to do any overclocking of the processor. So I would stick with a P67 board since you plan to buy a 570 and have a 4650 as a spare.

The GTX 570 you linked is from EVGA, but it doesn't seem to have the same $50 mail-in rebate as the one I linked. That deal is good until 4/29, so you should have plenty of time to take advantage of it.

Maybe consider this motherboard:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

I couldn't find the UD3P, which was $160.

PCIe: With the motherboard you listed in your last post, you would be able to run your graphics card at x16 and your PCIe SSD at x4 in the second slot.

In the UD5, which I just linked, you'd be able to run your graphics card in the first PCIe x16 slot and your PCIe SSD in the second just fine.

Quote:
And last, will it support a pci sound card? (regular PCI card) as it seems the x1 slots would not be available with both x16s populated.


The sound card has a PCI interface or PCIe x1 interface? If it's just regular PCI, then you won't have any problem. You'd plug it into one of the longer white slots.
April 17, 2011 9:20:13 PM

https://secure.newegg.com/WishList/MySavedWishDetail.as...

There it is. I think I'm set on this setup. GPU later, and keep the little sapphire in the old desktop.
Do i really NEED to OC this? (as listed i cant OC CPU). Im not too savy on OC and dont think i will need to.

Will install at least a GTX 570 in the future.

And yes, the later sound card would be a regular PCI card to prevent issues with the PCIe slots.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
April 18, 2011 12:48:18 AM

On the k-series processors, all you have to do to overclock is change the multiplier. It's really easy and you won't have to worry about other system busses, just the processor will be overclocked. Also, the Sandy Bridge chips are only 95 Watts and generally run very cool. A Cooler Master Hyper 212+ should be sufficient to get to 4.4 GHz or so. If nothing else, it can't hurt to just have the option for the future. But i don't know. The chips are pretty fast at stock.
May 18, 2011 6:21:32 AM

As a follow up, I would like to say thanks to everyone!
Shop finished it 2 days ago, runs great as is.
I appreciate all the input.



Topcat X

ASUS P8P67 EVO
INTEL i5-2500K Sandy Bridge 3.3GHz
ZALMAN 9500A
G.SKILL Sniper Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800)
MSI N560GTX-Ti Hawk GeForce GTX 560 Ti (Fermi)
SAMSUNG Spinpoint F3 HD103SJ 1TB
CORSAIR Professional Series AX750W
COOLER MASTER Storm Scout

MS Windows 7 Professional 64-bit.
ASUS, VE247H 24" LED 2ms monitor
SONY BRAVIA 40" 1080p 120Hz LED-LCD HDTV

May 18, 2011 6:30:02 AM

That's awesome. Have fun with your new build.
!