HP P6130F - Graphic Card & Power Supply inquiry

[RalphSky]

Hello,

My son have an HP P6130F machine. I'm looking for some insights to upgrade his machine's power supply and graphics card. He does some online gaming and sometimes he said he noticed repetitious lag but works fine when he watch movie, stream, download etc...when he alt tab from game. I'm thinking it's giving hints that it's time for an upgrade? I saw some recommendations like: http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/270560-28-express-grahpics-cards-p6130f but the post is quite outdated. I tried to look for parts that might work for the current machine but I'm scared I might mismatch and screw something up instead. From what I understand the current power supply won't be enough for most graphics card and I must get at least 400W type? As for graphics card, I saw some that says it's crossfire ready. Does it mean the motherboard must have this feature before the graphics card will work? It also list things like stream processor, OpenGL, xx pin/connectors, etc. All of these sounds greek to me. If someone can kindly suggest a relatively good priced graphics card/power supply, I would very much appreciate it. I'm hoping the total cost won't exceed more than 200 but I can take suggestions and put that into consideration. Thank you for your kind time.

-Ralph

 

[RalphSky]

Sorry for the double posting. It seemed like 2 threads got posted when only one was intended. I can't seem to locate the delete thread button. Can someone remove the duplicate? Much appreciated.

 

[aznshinobi]

Switch the power supply for this one: 35$ AR
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139017&Tpk=corsair%20430

Now you have 165$ left.
Get this motherboard for 70$
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131595

You now have 95$ left.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125341&cm_re=450_GTS-_-14-125-341-_-Product
100$ AR.

You'll get way more performance and the motherboard is upgraded as well since you know have a 16x 2.0 slot instead of a normal 16x slot.

 

[RalphSky]

Thanks for the reply. If I go with replacing the motherboard, would it still fit into the original casing? Would I require additional cablings, fans, etc.? Is it straightforward installation? I have never built a PC before.

 

[aznshinobi]

It's really easy to replace the motherboard. Just youtube some guides "How to remove a motherboard" for that matter, no you wouldn't need extra cables and such. Technically your not building a PC, you're just upgrading one.

 

[RalphSky]

It looks a lot more complicated than it sounds with so many wirings. If I accidentally plug into the wrong slot or flipped it, will it fry the machine/components?

 

[enforcer22]

Honestly if your replacing a motherboard your pretty much building a computer. There is more to it but that is really the same thing. Not to mention he has an OEM computer there is no telling if they use standard standoffs for their board or even a standard board. There are few things you can plug into the wrong spot but there are a couple that can either destroy the board or the thing you plugged in wrong. Though the power supply is nice The psu should work fine but i would research your system a lot more to see if the motherboard is even replaceable with none OEM parts. Also i haven't a clue how old your OEM HP is but the psu might need an adapter before you can even plug it in. Then there are things like from ports top ports ect. might not even plug into normal standard plugs on the motherboard so you might lose all functionality of those USB firewire and headset ports. Make sure the PSU in your machine has no proprietary plugs for power or anything else. And it has a standard power connector for motherboard power None OEM PSU's might not have any extra special plugs assuming your computer even uses them.

 

[RalphSky]

Hi Enforcer. Thanks for replying. I'm not sure how to even check all those things you mentioned. I bought it from bestbuy and everything was intact. Here's the spec for the machine I bought: http://h10010.www1.hp.com/wwpc/ca/e...46-3942799-3998970.html?jumpid=reg_R1002_CAEN. Can you tell if the motherboard can be replace by looking at that link? The machine was bought on Aug 2009. I'm not sure how long it had been out prior to buying.

Since you mention the possibility that I could end up destroying the motherboard, I started looking at the Canadian version of newegg.ca. I don't even know if the following would work:
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371023
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161315
This was a motherboard I encountered during searching:
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128394
It came up around 200 before tax and shipping got added on.

Any more information would be appreciated.

 

[aznshinobi]

Which ever country you shop in wouldn't really matter. They all use the same parts. The tricky thing about that computer is the case. HP does a real good job of keeping their cases un-upgradable.

PSU 40$
http://www.directcanada.com/products/?sku=11180AC5606&vpn=CMPSU-430CX&manufacture=CORSAIR

MOBO 60$
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157226

Case 30$
http://www.directcanada.com/products/?sku=11130AC7918&vpn=RC-360-KKN1-GP&manufacture=COOLERMASTER

GPU 75$
http://www.newegg.ca/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102871

 

[RalphSky]

That's a pity that the box is unusable. It seems such a waste since the machine is still practically usable. Since your recommendation is to rebuild a new PC with some usuable parts, will extra wiring be needed then?

 

[aznshinobi]

Uhh yes wiring may be needed. What do you mean by that though. Like pluggin in cables in cables? If so yes.

 

[cpatel1987]

I'm in severe disagreement with the replies. I checked the manuals, and even the specs for the motherboard itself, there really is no reason why he should have trouble replacing the power supply and the video card. HP Motherboard specs link. You have a 24 pin power supply, which is a standard. And also, from what I've googled, there's nothing proprietary about the size of the power supply. You should be just fine in installation. Now granted, if you don't feel comfortable, get help on the power supply, but the graphics card is cake. HP PROVIDES a step by step manual on how to put in a graphics card WITH pictures: PDF to the Service Manual (careful, its almost a 14 MB file). The only issue I worry about is the length of the card itself, but when I looked at page 4 of the service manual, it looks like HP actually did something intelligent by doing a 180 on the motherboard and then putting the door on the right side of the tower (usually the door on an ATX tower is on the left). by doing so, the PCI Express x16 slot is above, and they made clearance for a video card of long length (usually the issue with long cards is they hit the hard drive bays).

Now granted, your clockspeed on the processor is not something I would desire much, but it should be just fine regardless running some good games. It boils down to that though. What games do you want to play?

But lets assume for a minute we max out your $200 budget:

Video Card Radeon HD 5770 $129.99

Power Supply, OCZ 600W $79.99

Now granted, I didn't choose the cheapest option on either. You may be able to go cheaper on the power supply, but I didn't see one that got above a 4 egg average. Video card I chose the one that looked the shortest and skinniest. As for the crossfire, don't even worry about it. You board doesn't have that capability anyway.

 

[RalphSky]

Sorry for sounding dumb... I have never built/assemble a PC before. So I'm not sure what additional things I would need. I'm talking about the components to hook up the parts inside the PC. Initially I've only thought about replacing graphics card/power supply as it seems less complicated and lesser chances of me screwing up when I put it together.

 

[RalphSky]

I'm in severe disagreement with everyone's replies. I checked the manuals, and even the specs for the motherboard itself, there really is no reason why he should have trouble replacing the power supply and the video card. HP Motherboard specs link. You have a 24 pin power supply, which is a standard. And also, from what I've googled, there's nothing proprietary about the size of the power supply. You should be just fine in installation. Now granted, if you don't feel comfortable, get help on the power supply, but the graphics card is cake. HP PROVIDES a step by step manual on how to put in a graphics card WITH pictures: PDF to the Service Manual (careful, its almost a 14 MB file).

Now granted, your clockspeed on the processor is not something I would desire much, but it should be just fine regardless running some good games. It boils down to that though. What games do you want to play?

I don't think I'll have difficulties replacing power supply and video card. I was referring to the replacing of the motherboard and assembling it onto a new case. If there is a power supply/graphics card that will work wonderfully with the current system and decently priced, that would be great. My son is playing a few games. WoW, Rift, PWI and I don't remember the last one. I also know nothing about clockspeed. It's something to increase the performance of the machine but at the risk of it breaking sooner?

 

[cpatel1987]

Sorry for sounding dumb... I have never built/assemble a PC before. So I'm not sure what additional things I would need. I'm talking about the components to hook up the parts inside the PC. Initially I've only thought about replacing graphics card/power supply as it seems less complicated and lesser chances of me screwing up when I put it together.

I can't tell if my reply wasn't read or not, but basically what I told you is all you need. Now there will be a 4 pin connector that needs to go from the power supply to the video card. Again, I don't have step by step instructions on the power supply, but the card itself there are pictures in the service manual.

 

[cpatel1987]

I don't think I'll have difficulties replacing power supply and video card. I was referring to the replacing of the motherboard and assembling it onto a new case. If there is a power supply/graphics card that will work wonderfully with the current system and decently priced, that would be great. My son is playing a few games. WoW, Rift, PWI and I don't remember the last one. I also know nothing about clockspeed. It's something to increase the performance of the machine but at the risk of it breaking sooner?

Umm gain I don't reccomend you getting a new case at all. Nor a new motherboard. Thats where I disagree with previous repliers.

 

[RalphSky]

Yes, I read your message and I also so you edited it. I was checking out the graphics card you had mentioned. It says crossfire. I don't believe I came across that when I was looking at the computer specification. Is it required to have before the graphics card feature can be used? I actually have no clue what is a 4 pin connector. But I think replacing the power supply/graphics card is alot easier and straightforward than replacing than the motherboard. Then again, it might be but I just don't feel comfortable after someone said I can possibly destroy the board if I plugged it in incorrectly.

 

[cpatel1987]

Oh lol now I see where the confusion lies. Sorry I edit my posts also, didn't realize you were on the boards already. Read above and/or refresh the page, I reccomended the two things you need.

 

[aznshinobi]

Cpatel, do you realize that OEM cases such as cases from HP do not use the same stand off placements as other manufacturers? That is where the new case comes in.

The new motherboard is because his motherboard doesn't have a PCI Express 16x 2.0, granted 16x is backwards compatible, however it's much slower and he wouldn't be getting all the perf he'd could be getting with that bandwidth restriction of 16x to 16x 2.0

Replacement for the PSU is needed not because the one from the HP unit does not have cables, but because it would supply enough power, OEM PSUs suck.

 

[cpatel1987]

Yes, I read your message and I also so you edited it. I was checking out the graphics card you had mentioned. It says crossfire. I don't believe I came across that when I was looking at the computer specification. Is it required to have before the graphics card feature can be used? I actually have no clue what is a 4 pin connector. But I think replacing the power supply/graphics card is alot easier and straightforward than replacing than the motherboard. Then again, it might be but I just don't feel comfortable after someone said I can possibly destroy the board if I plugged it in incorrectly.

Look, if you don't feel comfortable, even after reading the service manual, then I simply wouldn't do it on your own. Get somebody whos done these things before to do it. Let me repeat though, I really don't think you need a new motherboard or a new case. That is again, where me and the previous poster disagree. You just need the two things I recommended, aka the power supply and the graphics card. The power supply has that 6 pin connector i was talking about. But again, there are even videos to help you out out there. Heres an example: How to Video. I think its from AMD themselves.

 

[cpatel1987]

Cpatel, do you realize that OEM cases such as cases from HP do not use the same stand off placements as other manufacturers? That is where the new case comes in.

The new motherboard is because his motherboard doesn't have a PCI Express 16x 2.0, granted 16x is backwards compatible, however it's much slower and he wouldn't be getting all the perf he'd could be getting with that bandwidth restriction of 16x to 16x 2.0

Replacement for the PSU is needed not because the one from the HP unit does not have cables, but because it would supply enough power, OEM PSUs suck.

Sir, I'm fully aware of the x16 1.0 limitation, and to be honest its not that big of a deal, especially for what his application is. And yes, I clearly understand a PSU replacement is needed, I've done graphics card upgrades for many people, and hence why I reccomended one.

Am I missing a key piece of info here? We are assuming the computer is intact? Who cares where the standoffs are? I'm looking at an image of this actual computer's motherboard, including the placement of all the components, and I am again seeing no issues here. Thus, if it is in one piece, why do we need to recommend a new case AND a new motherboard? And quite frankly, 430W is the bare minimum for the card you reccomended, and could cause issues down the road.

I really don't like getting into arguments here. Sir the choice is yours at this point, and I don't want to confuse you any further than this debate between us has.

 

[RalphSky]

I didn't even realize there are more things I have to look out for... How would the performance differ if the graphics card is on a board that supports 16x 2.0 vs 16x 1.0? Or even vice versa? The graphics looks bad? The system lags?

 

[cpatel1987]

I didn't even realize there are more things I have to look out for... How would the performance differ if the graphics card is on a board that supports 16x 2.0 vs 16x 1.0? Or even vice versa? The graphics looks bad? The system lags?

The difference is bandwidth communication. An analogy would be like USB 2.0 vs USB 1.1, only its not 8x of a bandwidth difference. Its twice as much. Hence why I didn't want to mention that because in my opinion, it doesn't matter for your application. The other poster believes otherwise. Again, the choice is yours, mine requires a lot less work, however, I will agree that the other poster's recommendation would allow for further future upgrades.

Basically you wouldn't take full advantage of the bandwidth capabilities of the card I reccomended. You can honestly go his route if you want (in terms of the GTS 450 he chose in his first reply), MINUS the motherboard and case upgrade and, in my opinion, his power supply recommendation. That would still work for the games your playing. You would have extra cash leftover.

If you are going to go that route though, put a 500W power supply to save money instead of the 600W one I paired with my card reccomendation: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817182044

Oh, and just to prove my claim that x16 2.0 vs 1.0 isn't relevant for the situation we are talking about: http://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/HD_5870_PCI-Express_Scaling/4.html. They tested cards even more powerful then what we're recommending. Although they are still working off the 2.0 slot, again, the equivalent would be x8 anyway.

 

[RalphSky]

Thank you for the insights. Honestly it's a lot to absorb. I suppose if I just upgrade the power supply and graphics card, in the future, if the component still work, I can still get a motherboard and case as suggest by Shinobi. I will re-read and think this over with my son and see how he feels about it. I really thank you all for the kind replies.

 

[aznshinobi]

Dead link for me.

Also I defiantly think that PSU is not even fully up to the 500w it suggests. If you can a more solid high efficicent 430w from Corsair I'd take it. Plus they are actually good with their MIRS which would bring it down to 35$ cheaper than the rosewill.

Just a warning, I've heard many Rosewill units are faulty and have exploded within cases, frankly I payed more to be safe.

I also have a friendly forum member, ScrewySquirrel, He's running the i5 2400 with a 6850 on that 430w I recommended so I honestly don't see the problem. I've recommended to many a 430w and it's fine powering their system. Don't believe me eh?
http://www.jonnyguru.com/modules.php?name=NDReviews&op=Story4&reid=214

Also I've tried to do the same upgrade Raplh is doing with his build for my HP before. And needless to say, a new MicroATX board did not even fit into the case. None of the standoffs even aligned. So we bought a new case, didn't fit our budget, we ended up going overboard. But meh.

So it's your choice really. If you find you can handle the bottleneck, you know it's your choice. You probably could to be honest, but I just find that if you can upgrade all in one budget. Why not just do it. You'll have the AM3 socket available to you when you want to the upgrade the CPU later.