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$1500 Gaming PC

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May 14, 2011 10:14:37 PM

Hi guys, I'm trying to build a $1500 PC for gaming,movies and internet but I'm so nerd to build it myself so i really need your help here. First i planned to build it with the Thanksgiving sale, but i just bought Brink , The Witcher 2 today and i tried to take a look in these games with max setting, just find out that my computer is so suck for them, and i can't live 6 months with these games until November. So If you think that i should wait until Thanksgiving sale to save money or i can build a new one now, please tell me.

This is my old PC's specs.
OS : Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium 64x
System Model Aspire X1301
Processor AMD Athlon(tm) II X2 215 Processor, 2700 Mhz, 2 Core(s), 2 Logical Processor(s)
BIOS Version/Date Phoenix Technologies, LTD P01-A0, 8/28/2009
RAM: 4Gb
VGA: ATI Readon HD 4650 ( yes, i upgraded my vga once)

And this is the new one requirements:

Approximate Purchase Date: like i said before it's from now to Thanksgiving :wahoo: 


Budget Range: about $1500 total ( not include about $100 for shipping)


System Usage from Most to Least Important: gaming,movies,internet , sometime i did encode few old movies .


Parts Not Required: mouse , speaker, case (i have a Thermaltake V9 BlacX Edition with Docking Station , ATX Mid Tower)

Preferred Website(s) for Parts:newegg.com ( most peple choose it so i will take this one)

Country of Origin: USA - California and zip code is 92843 if you need it. :D 


Parts Preferences:8Gb ram , 24" monitor, and of course SSD hard driver , i hope you can pick a quite VGA for me cuz i don't wanna play next to a saw machine, hope to hear suggestions from you guys.


Overclocking:no


SLI or Crossfire: is this for two or more monitors?? if I'm right so NO.

Monitor Resolution: 1920x1080


Additional Comments:As you see i will have some extra parts from the old PC , i want to build a $300-400 PC for my younger bro from these parts (he is 9grade so he just need a PC for study and play game like Starcraft or Warcraft). Btw i think i need to buy an OS ( window home).
That is all i can think of now, i will add info later if i need something else.
Thanks you.

More about : 1500 gaming

May 14, 2011 10:26:59 PM

Well, the first thing i should mention is that Amazon will almost always be cheaper than newegg in CA because Amazon doesnt charge sales tax. What is it now 9.5%? I still miss CA however, totally worth the tax. Best thing to do is to build at newegg because it has a better browser, and then see if amazon has the same parts.
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May 14, 2011 10:42:56 PM

genghiskron said:
Well, the first thing i should mention is that Amazon will almost always be cheaper than newegg in CA because Amazon doesnt charge sales tax. What is it now 9.5%? I still miss CA however, totally worth the tax. Best thing to do is to build at newegg because it has a better browser, and then see if amazon has the same parts.


What's shipping like to Canada from Amazon?

EDIT: I should clarify. I mean the shipping charges, not the packaging. Are the super-saver shipping items still free shipping?
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a b 4 Gaming
May 14, 2011 11:00:30 PM

Check out my siggy for the $400 build you wanna do, the 450$ build would run SC2 really well, though it is 50$ above your budget for him.

As for the 1500$ build, like genghis said, stick to Amazon. It's cheaper that way, Newegg is good too, you just pay taxes. Anywho... There is also a 1500$ build there too, you can always get SLI 560 Ti or 6950 2GB with that build so. Your choice.
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a b 4 Gaming
May 14, 2011 11:38:41 PM

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Corsair Enthusiast Series 650-Watt 80 Plus Bronze Certified Power Supply compatible with Intel Core i3, i5, i7 and AMD platforms 650TX v2

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ASRock H61M-VS Intel H61 Micro ATX DDR3 1333 Motherboard

http://www.amazon.com/Intel-Processor-i5-2500-LGA1155-B... $209.99 & this item ships for FREE with Super Saver Shipping
Intel Core i5 Processor i5-2500 3.3GHz 6MB LGA1155 CPU BOX80623I52500

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MSI GeForce GTX580 1536 MB DDR5 2DVI/Mini HDMI PCI-Express Video Card N580GTX TWIN FROZR II/OC

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a b 4 Gaming
May 14, 2011 11:44:11 PM

You suck Why_Me... You suck.
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May 15, 2011 8:14:34 AM

You can research monitors at TFT Central - google it. The ASUS monitor recommended above is recommended by Cnet. There is a review here: http://reviews.cnet.com/lcd-monitors/asus-vh236h/4505-3...

Corsair 850 HX is on sale at newegg for $119.00 right now - I know it is not Amazon

You may want to look at the ATI 6950 1 GB or 2 GB. It is about equal with the GTX 570 and it is cheaper. Two 6950 cards in crossfire outperform the GTX 580 by quite a bit and they are cheaper.

You may want to pay the extra $10.00 to go with DDR3 1600 or 1866 RAM (2 x 4gb). This seems to be the performance/price sweet spot
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May 15, 2011 3:35:50 PM

the 6950 is not about equal with the 570 and all h61 dont support cf or sli
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May 15, 2011 5:35:24 PM

As from your suggestions above i will make a build like this:

OS: Window 7 home premium - a friend just gifts me one when he heard i want to build a new PC:D 
PSU: http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Enthusiast-Certified-comp... Is this 650wt enough??
RAM: http://www.amazon.com/Patriot-Division-PC3-12800-9-9-9-... Is this company good? cuz i heard the best is Corsair.if it is , i will take this one http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Vengeance-240-Pin-Platfor... just need to pay $8 more.
MOBO: http://www.amazon.com/ASRock-H61M-VS-Intel-Micro-Mother... Some people told me to use the P67 but i stick with Why_Me .
Processor: http://www.amazon.com/Intel-Processor-i5-2500-LGA1155-B... What is the different of 2500 and 2500k?
Hard driver: i need a SSD.Any idea for this one? with Why_Me build i still have like $200-300 to pay on this SDD. My friend ( the one gave me the window 7 ) told me that i should choose a hitachi hard driver, anyone know why?
Reader: http://www.amazon.com/Lite--LightScribe-Layer-Drive-IHA...
VGA: yes i will take the GTX580 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004L9MBEY/ref=ox_sc_a...
Monitor: http://www.amazon.com/Viewsonic-VX2450WM-LED-23-6-Inch-... This one and Why_Me's Asus monitor, which is better ??
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a b 4 Gaming
May 15, 2011 5:54:12 PM

_Aries_ said:
As from your suggestions above i will make a build like this:

OS: Window 7 home premium - a friend just gifts me one when he heard i want to build a new PC:D 
PSU: http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-Enthusiast-Certified-comp... Is this 650wt enough??
RAM: http://www.amazon.com/Patriot-Division-PC3-12800-9-9-9-... Is this company good? cuz i heard the best is Corsair.
MOBO: http://www.amazon.com/ASRock-H61M-VS-Intel-Micro-Mother... Some people told me to use the P67 but i stick with Why_Me .
Processor: http://www.amazon.com/Intel-Processor-i5-2500-LGA1155-B... What is the different of 2500 and 2500k?
Hard driver: i need a SSD.Any idea for this one? with Why_Me build i still have like $200-300 to pay on this SDD. My friend ( the one gave me the window 7 ) told me that i should choose a hitachi hard driver, anyone know why?
Reader: http://www.amazon.com/Lite--LightScribe-Layer-Drive-IHA...
VGA: yes i will take the GTX580 http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B004L9MBEY/ref=ox_sc_a...
Monitor: http://www.amazon.com/Viewsonic-VX2450WM-LED-23-6-Inch-... This one and Why_Me's Asus monitor, which is better ??


1) That 650w psu is more than enough with plenty of juice to spare.

2) A P67 board a board that is primary purpose is over clocking and sometimes...dual vid cards. Seeing how you plan on doing neither... H61 is the obvious choice.

3) I would say G.Skill > Corsair. Anyways though...the H61 boards support 1333...there is no noticable difference between 1333 and 1600 in regards to gaming. What the manufacturers do recommend for these 1155 boards is low voltage RAM (1.5v or less) hence the reason I stuck that 1.5v Kingston RAM in that build.

4) In regards to the 2500K and 2500....the 2500K is an unlocked cpu that's intended for over clocking. No over clocking, no need to spend the extra $20+ on the 2500K.

4) As far as a h/d that Samsung is the most recommended h/d on this board for reasons as speed, quiet, price, and dependability.

5) No real difference between that Viewsonic and Asus monitor other than $10. Otherwise the specs are the same.

http://www.amazon.com/Crucial-Technology-RealSSD-Solid-... $237.49 & this item ships for FREE with Super Saver Shipping
Crucial Technology 128 GB Crucial RealSSD C300 Series Solid State Drive CTFDDAC128MAG-1G1
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May 15, 2011 9:05:01 PM

Best answer selected by _Aries_.
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May 15, 2011 9:08:18 PM

Thank you very much guys, I'm ordering those parts.
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May 16, 2011 6:57:21 AM

mjmjpfaff said:
the 6950 is not about equal with the 570 and all h61 dont support cf or sli


Depends on how you rate the two different cards. As far as fps for different games the 570 holds a slight edge but not much. The 570 is quieter than the 6950 but not much.

On the negative side for the 570 is that it costs a lot more for the slight performance edge in some not all games. It doesn't play HD video as well as the 6950 (as far as the quality of the picture). It doesn't scale as well in SLI as the 6950 does in crossfire. You can't run three monitors off of it via eyefinity if that is important to you.

The two cards are fairly equal, but the 570 costs $349 - $375. The 6950 1 GB can be purchased for $209 and it is nearly as fast. The 2 GB 6950 is around $240 after rebates. So is the 570 worth twice as much as the 6950? Most people don't think so, that is why Tom's Hardware and other computer websites recommend the 6950 over the 570.

Don't get me wrong, the 570 is an amazing card; but so is the 6950. If you like GTX and have the extra $150, the GTX is a great choice.
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May 16, 2011 7:03:52 AM

mjmjpfaff said:
the 6950 is not about equal with the 570 and all h61 dont support cf or sli


http://www.anandtech.com/show/4137/amds-gtx-560-ti-coun...

The 6950 does match the 570 in several benchmarks, depending on the resolution, and, of course, is defeated in others. Were they priced identically, I'd also choose the 570, but, given the 570's nearly 45-50% higher cost, suddenly the choice is less obvious.
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May 16, 2011 7:49:52 AM

BTW, I don't want to be argumentative, but I disagree that 650 W PSU is "plenty of juice to spare." The idea of buying a PSU with more than enough reserve is that if they run at 50% capacity they are most efficient and last longer. With a 750 W or 850 W you easily accomplish this even if you add another video card and several HDDs a TV card, etc. In other words it gives you plenty of room to upgrade and still not really tax your PSU over its highest efficiency parameters. Add to this that the cost difference is very little to go from a 650 to a 750 or an 850 on sale and it seems to me to be a better decision to choose the higher capacity.

The Corsair 750 HX and 850 HX have a seven year warranty and so a builder could easily use either for two or three builds while it they are still under warranty. Having the extra capacity is nice if in the future you need it and keep in mind it costs only $10 - $40 more. The alternative is that if a 650 is too small for your next build, you have to buy a whole new PSU.
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May 16, 2011 2:54:06 PM

well im talking about his resolution and 1 monitor because we are helping him and he says he will just be gaming so i did not take into mind the hd video and also he cant cf because he is using a h61 board. come on guys stick to the forum we are helping him not ourselves
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May 16, 2011 6:11:33 PM

I am not sure I follow your reasoning. I wouldn't waste my time if I was not trying to help him. This has nothing to do with "helping ourselves."

I also think that the P67 board or the Z68 board are by far better choices for this person - but I understand that other people have different opinions.
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May 16, 2011 7:02:56 PM

Flong, why dont you link a complete build and argue why its better than Why_Me's. What im hearing is that its very little to upgrade the PSU, and its very little to upgrade the mobo, and its very little to upgrade the CPU, and its not that much more to add in a cpu cooler. So show us.
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May 16, 2011 7:52:44 PM

genghiskron said:
Flong, why dont you link a complete build and argue why its better than Why_Me's. What im hearing is that its very little to upgrade the PSU, and its very little to upgrade the mobo, and its very little to upgrade the CPU, and its not that much more to add in a cpu cooler. So show us.


Again, I don't follow your reasoning. Many of the cost differences have already been listed.

2500K Approx $215
ASUS P67 $150 (could go with Z68 platform for approx $200)
Corsair 750 TX (or 850 TX) $75-$120 depending on sales and rebates
Altenate PSU - Corsair 850 HX was just on sale for $119.00 after rebates at newegg
A Noctua CPU cooler DH-14 $75-$90 depending on sales and rebates
A Hyper 212 CPU cooler approx $30 as a cheaper alternate to the Noctua
GPU XFX 6950 1GB on sale at newegg right now for $209

The rest of the build like the case, the RAM, etc. are all about the same cost for any build and so they are irrelevant.

You could go with Gskill / Corsair DDR3 1600 CL9 (2 x 4GB) - $75 on sale at newegg

Case cost would vary between $50 - $100 for low-end and approximately $200 for high-end. I prefer the CM HAF 942 ($180) or the Silverstone Fortress ($200) but there are plenty of good cases out there in the $75.00 range

DVD/CD approx. $20 for Asus

HDD Samsung Spinpoint F3 - $60

You might even be able to fit in a 120 GB SSD ($200 - $300) if you go with a cheaper case and CPU cooler.

Not really rocket science - all of these costs are readily available at Newegg and Amazon.

The point is that a P67 I-7 2500K system doesn't cost that much more than a cheaper AMD system in many cases and is a much more powerful system. This individual has a $1500 budget. The system listed above fits very well into that budget. Tom's Hardware picks several of these items in their monthly builds.

I understand that some people only have $500 to spend on a computer and that they need to go to cheaper components. Heck I am having to use my spare computer now which is a Pentium 4 because my I-7 920 was stolen. I know what it is to use a cheaper computer and that is fine if that is all you can afford. But in this case, Aries can afford a very good computer in their price range.
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May 16, 2011 8:12:27 PM

again you arent looking at what he wants he couldnt care less if he could overclock so why say this is best for him if he doesnt want to or know how to oc.
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May 16, 2011 9:19:16 PM

mjmjpfaff said:
again you arent looking at what he wants he couldnt care less if he could overclock so why say this is best for him if he doesnt want to or know how to oc.


I understand that overclocking is not important to him/her now but things change. When you consider that the 2500K is only $20 -$25 more than the 2500, it is the better buy. This gives Aries the opportunity to overclock later if his/her needs change for chump change. Overclocking the 2500K increases the speed for real-life applications by over 50% which is a tremendous increase in productivity. For $20 why wouldn't you allow yourself that option? It really is silly not to, especially now that the Z68 platform is out.

Conversely if Aries buys the 2500 CPU and later needs a faster computer his/her only choice will be to buy a new CPU and probably a new motherboard which will be a whole lot more money than $20.

Frankly, I think the 2500 chips are a waste of money compared to the 2500K but I understand that not everyone feels that way. if it was a matter that you had to have a computer science degree to OC the K chips then the 2500 might make sense because not everyone has that level of expertise. However, everyone I have read agrees that the K chips are dirt easy to overclock for a beginner who has never overclocked before. And so this option is something that anyone can take advantage even if they don't need it when they first buy the chip.

When you consider that a moderately overclocked 2500K out performs the $1000 I-7 990 in most benchmarks, it really is a no-brainer.

Before the K chips I would never have considered overclocking myself, but now I have grown to change my mind because of the ease of use and great potential benefits overclocking. The extra $20 gives you a whole world of options with the K chips that the non-K chips do not have. That is why I think they are the better buy.
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May 16, 2011 10:41:18 PM

Flong, the reason i wanted you to link a full build was so you could see how several small upgrade costs manifest as a significantly larger overall cost. The upgrade cost for an i5-2500k may be only $15, but overclocking also requires a p67 board and a cpu cooler. The cheapest p67 board on newegg is $108, and its certainly not one id recommend. Thats $36 more than Why_Me's recommended $72 H61 motherboard. A cheap cpu cooler like the hyper 212+ is gonna cost $30. Thats $81 BARE MINIMUM for overclocking an i5-2500k. You recommended a $150 asus p67, meaning that you have suggested that he spend at least $123 dollars more for the purpose of overclocking when he has indicated he does not want to OC.
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May 16, 2011 11:05:10 PM

genghiskron said:
Flong, the reason i wanted you to link a full build was so you could see how several small upgrade costs manifest as a significantly larger overall cost. The upgrade cost for an i5-2500k may be only $15, but overclocking also requires a p67 board and a cpu cooler. The cheapest p67 board on newegg is $108, and its certainly not one id recommend. Thats $36 more than Why_Me's recommended $72 H61 motherboard. A cheap cpu cooler like the hyper 212+ is gonna cost $30. Thats $81 BARE MINIMUM for overclocking an i5-2500k. You recommended a $150 asus p67, meaning that you have suggested that he spend at least $123 dollars more for the purpose of overclocking when he has indicated he does not want to OC.


You would have a logical point if Aries was building a $500 computer - that is not the case. We are looking at a $1500 budget. Therefore the question becomes, what is the best computer that can be built within this budget. I suggest you look at http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-hd-6950-unlo...'s Tom's Hardware Best builds located here:

This system is less than a $1000 and is nearly exactly what I have recommended.

Not enough to convince you? Well go here for Bit-Techs recommended build: http://www.bit-tech.net/hardware/buyers-guide/2011/05/1...

This system is again almost exactly the same as I have recommended except they go to an ATI 6850 and 4 GB of RAM. This system is $860.

You appear to just want to argue. I understand that Why_me may not agree with me and I in no way wish to disparage his choices. I just respectfully that his choices are the best for the budget and the needs of the person that started this thread.

We can disagree with one another without being rude or disagreeable and I hope that I have not come across with this spirit. My goal was to help Aries find the best system for the budget that was listed. Apparently Tom's Hardware and Bit Tech agree with my choices.
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May 17, 2011 12:13:14 AM

Correction: above should say I respectfully disagree with Why-me. The link to Tom's Hardware best build is here: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/build-a-pc-cpu-over...

The only real differences in the Tom's Hardware and Bit Tech build is that they use smaller PSUs and less RAM. For reasons already explained I disagree with that choice (the cost difference for a larger PSU is neglible). However, they are trying to fit their builds within a certain budget and so it is understandable. We have a larger budget to work with here.
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May 17, 2011 1:21:17 AM

You all gave me suggestions here and I greatly appreciate your kindness. But flong is right with his point, i have like $1500 to build a PC. I know you all want the best for me, but he was right when he said i can afford his build. If it gonna go up to $1600 or 1700, it still be ok with me.I have like $3000 to build a PC but i decide to spend half of it, i just don't wanna build a high-end. Sorry to make you guys go in an argue like this. Btw , why do i need alternate PSU here, flong? I can understand i need an alternate cooler but i never hear of alternate PSU?? where do you put it in your case?
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May 17, 2011 1:37:02 AM

MSI GeForce GTX580 1536 MB DDR5 2DVI/Mini HDMI PCI-Express Video Card N580GTX TWIN FROZR II/OC


Noctua 6 Dual Heatpipe with 140mm/120mm Dual SSO Bearing Fans CPU Cooler NH-D14 - Retail Noctua 6 Dual Heatpipe with 140mm/120mm Dual SSO Bearing Fans CPU Cooler NH-D14 - Retail

Corsair CMPSU-850TX 850-Watt TX Series 80 Plus Certified Power Supply compatible with Intel Core i7 and Core i5 Corsair CMPSU-850TX 850-Watt TX Series 80 Plus Certified Power Supply compatible with Intel Core i7 and Core i5

ASUS P8P67 PRO <REV 3.0> LGA 1155 SATA 6Gbps and USB 3.0 Supported Intel P67 DDR3 2400 ATX Motherboard ASUS P8P67 PRO LGA 1155 SATA 6Gbps and USB 3.0 Supported Intel P67 DDR3 2400 ATX Motherboard

Intel Core i5 Processor i5-2500K 3.3GHz 6MB LGA1155 CPU BOX80623I52500K Intel Core i5 Processor i5-2500K 3.3GHz 6MB LGA1155 CPU BOX80623I52500K
Crucial Technology 128 GB Crucial RealSSD C300 Series Solid State Drive CTFDDAC128MAG-1G1

Patriot Gamer 2 Series Division 2 Edition DDR3 8 GB PC3-12800 1600MHz 9-9-9-24 for Intel P67 Using Core i5 Core i7 Memory Modules PGD38G1600ELK Patriot Gamer 2 Series Division 2 Edition DDR3 8 GB PC3-12800 1600MHz 9-9-9-24 for Intel P67 Using Core i5 Core i7 Memory Modules PGD38G1600ELK

Crucial Technology 128 GB Crucial RealSSD C300 Series Solid State Drive CTFDDAC128MAG-1G1
Viewsonic VX2450WM-LED 24-Inch (23.6-Inch Vis) Widescreen LED Monitor with Full HD 1080p and Speakers - Black Viewsonic VX2450WM-LED 24-Inch (23.6-Inch Vis) Widescreen LED Monitor with Full HD 1080p and Speakers - Black
Total cost me almost $1800 :pt1cable:  , much more than the old build but hell i can afford this one. No more building new PC in 4 years for me... :??: 
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May 17, 2011 2:20:09 AM

Hi Aries, the alternate PSU was listed in case the 850 HX was too expensive for your budget. It is one of the highest rated PSUs and so you can't go wrong with it. In several reviews it remained stable and efficient while putting out over 1000 W and so you can push it if you need to. It also comes with 7-year warranty which is one of the best available. It has won many "editor choice" awards.

Question, do your really want to put out the money for the 580 GTX? Tom's Hardware lists two 6950s in crossfire as faster and about the same price here: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-graphics-card-...

Don't get me wrong, the 580 is a great card and so you can't go wrong either way.

Also you may want to add an 1 TB HDD like the Samsung spinpoint F3 or the Seagate Barracuda

You may want to consider the Z68 Asus or ASrock motherboard as the Z68 platform has some advantages over the P67. But either platform will make a great computer.

One last point, while I am going to buy an Asus mobo myself because of their quality the Asrock did really good in this review by Tom's Hardware: http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/asrock-z68-extreme4...
I still like the Asus mobo myself after reading the review.

Good luck with your build - I hope that you will be very happy with it.
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May 17, 2011 2:46:15 AM

i also think the p67 extreme4 is a better motherboard. i switched to it after my p8p67 pro b3 would not work. and it took me 5 calls over 4 days for asus to finally say it was their motherboard. i am extremely satisfied with my extreme4
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May 17, 2011 3:41:49 AM

Thank you mjmjpaff, I really appreciate your first-hand experience with motherboards as I have not yet purchased mine yet. The Asus mobos get high marks in reviews but really they are all about equal in performance. A lot of people seem to like ASrock
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May 22, 2011 6:25:31 AM

If one of you wanna build a pc like mine, you should have a 1200watt PSu cuz a techinical tested my pc and told me that 850watt just can stand for 3-5 months without Overclock :ouch:  . One of his customer had 1000 watt PSU on same build and that PSU burned up after a year used. So he told me that 1200watt PSU will be using with Overclock for about 2 years. :cry: 
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May 22, 2011 6:57:48 AM

Actually flong, i'd tend to disagree with you on many many many points.

Firstly, yes, OP has a budget of X money.
But all we are trying to do is help him pick out parts that will satisfy his needs for "Y" years - I.e. 3-4 years down the track, as best we can.

Now; Why_Me is consistently among the top 3 contributors in this section of the forum, and he obviously follows this principle; Give the guy what he requires and make sure it lasts as best as possible. The GTX 580 follows this principle. The 650W was specifically recommended because the OP wanted to not SLI or overclock. The 650W as specified, would have easily allowed for overclocking though, and only lost 2-5% efficiency according to jonnyguru. But you said the 650W didn't comfortably do it well enough. It does.

Now, the fact is, that you have recommended he buy a PSU that would 'allow for a future build.'
The most obvious 'future' build i can imagine is one including 2xGTX 580's in SLI.
You recommended an 850W PSU, and as an alternate if it was too expensive, a 750W PSU.
The fact is, no-one here would recommend 2x GTX 580s on a 750W PSU. You yourself recommended 650W for a single GTX 580. Recommending a 750 or 850W for 'the future' makes it seem as if 100-200 W is enough for a second GTX 580, plus overclocking the processor AND GPU which you intended. It doesn't leave enough headroom, especially if he buys that P67+i5 2500k that you recommended, and does overclock...

You obviously didn't think it through; even Nvidia recommend a 600W + for a single 580, and that includes covering their back heaps; a quality 550 watter is fine. But 2 for 750W and ocing is not 'fine.'

Secondly, theres a reason why there is a sticky for that template recommended for 'new builders' to show what they want. So we know IF they want to overclock or SLI. We then recommend on that; we don't say, Oh okay, you don't want to OC? TOO BAD IM MAKING AN OC BUILD. The fact is, the guy's paid $1800, without the W7 Os, and only included a 'k' version of the same processor, and some coolant and a bigger PSU. Why_Me's build came to $1350~ WITH an OS( So 1250). Hes paid 650 on your 'whim' and really gotten little; - same processor, same gpu, but overclocking potential, and thankfully he bought the 850W not the 750W, and has SLI 'potential.' If he buys that 2nd GPU, he would've spent $1100 on a build with SLI 580's and OCing ability. Great, lovely, he would've spent 90% more for 50% more performance that WE know he didn't need. If he doesn't SLI or overclock hes out $650 on stuff he didn't use. If he uses it, hes out $1100 for a bloody second card and lovely OC ability. Guess what? A 4.1GHZ i5 760 gained less than 0.5 fps on all games compared to a stock 2.8ghz. Wowies, im guessing that OC potential; on which so much was spend ($200??) really worked out yeah? He could've just gotten a GTX 590 for the same cost and REALLY gotten something.


Anyways, I'm just trying to ask you to really THINK IT THROUGH, and in the meantime, observe others like why_me who are experienced and respected; before you undermine a colleagues better build. These people come here to ask US for our knowledge, not so they can ask someone who knows about as much as them, but pretends to know more. Because if they agree with your logic, which they are likely to, they would've been better off doing it themselves.
Look, observe think and then recommend once you get the hang of it.

Until then, i'd really request you not to post builds...
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May 22, 2011 7:21:42 AM

flong said:
Depends on how you rate the two different cards. As far as fps for different games the 570 holds a slight edge but not much. The 570 is quieter than the 6950 but not much.

On the negative side for the 570 is that it costs a lot more for the slight performance edge in some not all games. It doesn't play HD video as well as the 6950 (as far as the quality of the picture). It doesn't scale as well in SLI as the 6950 does in crossfire. You can't run three monitors off of it via eyefinity if that is important to you.

The two cards are fairly equal, but the 570 costs $349 - $375. The 6950 1 GB can be purchased for $209 and it is nearly as fast. The 2 GB 6950 is around $240 after rebates. So is the 570 worth twice as much as the 6950? Most people don't think so, that is why Tom's Hardware and other computer websites recommend the 6950 over the 570.

Don't get me wrong, the 570 is an amazing card; but so is the 6950. If you like GTX and have the extra $150, the GTX is a great choice.


I'm sorry, in addition, lets not make virtual prices. On newegg, the cheapest GTX 570 is $290 AR. Not 350-375. http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...

The cheapest 6950 2gb is $233
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168... not $240.

Both are viable depending on needs, we need to use amazon as after taxes, both cards are more expensive at newegg.. the price is $255 for 2gb 6950 and $300 for 570 on amazon.



With the 6950 vs 570, you can see why theres a $40 difference, and the 1gb isn't even close dont even bother putting it within 2 tiers of the 570... one benchmark its at under 20fps and the 570 is 80...

69502gb vs 570

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/293?vs=306

pulls away after the first few. around 15-% more fps on average (adding all of em together).
Some big wins for the 570 include 90 vs 65 fps, and 80 vs 60 among many others.

The 6970 and 570 is 'close'.. and the 570 is still 5-8% better on average.. (Although the 6970 wins quite a few, depending on the game/resolution...)

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/292?vs=306

This is why i recommend you gain info and read before posting..
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May 22, 2011 9:17:38 AM

vibhas said:
Actually flong, i'd tend to disagree with you on many many many points.

Firstly, yes, OP has a budget of X money.
But all we are trying to do is help him pick out parts that will satisfy his needs for "Y" years - I.e. 3-4 years down the track, as best we can.

Now; Why_Me is consistently among the top 3 contributors in this section of the forum, and he obviously follows this principle; Give the guy what he requires and make sure it lasts as best as possible. The GTX 580 follows this principle. The 650W was specifically recommended because the OP wanted to not SLI or overclock. The 650W as specified, would have easily allowed for overclocking though, and only lost 2-5% efficiency according to jonnyguru. But you said the 650W didn't comfortably do it well enough. It does.

Now, the fact is, that you have recommended he buy a PSU that would 'allow for a future build.'
The most obvious 'future' build i can imagine is one including 2xGTX 580's in SLI.
You recommended an 850W PSU, and as an alternate if it was too expensive, a 750W PSU.
The fact is, no-one here would recommend 2x GTX 580s on a 750W PSU. You yourself recommended 650W for a single GTX 580. Recommending a 750 or 850W for 'the future' makes it seem as if 100-200 W is enough for a second GTX 580, plus overclocking the processor AND GPU which you intended. It doesn't leave enough headroom, especially if he buys that P67+i5 2500k that you recommended, and does overclock...

You obviously didn't think it through; even Nvidia recommend a 600W + for a single 580, and that includes covering their back heaps; a quality 550 watter is fine. But 2 for 750W and ocing is not 'fine.'

Secondly, theres a reason why there is a sticky for that template recommended for 'new builders' to show what they want. So we know IF they want to overclock or SLI. We then recommend on that; we don't say, Oh okay, you don't want to OC? TOO BAD IM MAKING AN OC BUILD. The fact is, the guy's paid $1800, without the W7 Os, and only included a 'k' version of the same processor, and some coolant and a bigger PSU. Why_Me's build came to $1350~ WITH an OS( So 1250). Hes paid 650 on your 'whim' and really gotten little; - same processor, same gpu, but overclocking potential, and thankfully he bought the 850W not the 750W, and has SLI 'potential.' If he buys that 2nd GPU, he would've spent $1100 on a build with SLI 580's and OCing ability. Great, lovely, he would've spent 90% more for 50% more performance that WE know he didn't need. If he doesn't SLI or overclock hes out $650 on stuff he didn't use. If he uses it, hes out $1100 for a bloody second card and lovely OC ability. Guess what? A 4.1GHZ i5 760 gained less than 0.5 fps on all games compared to a stock 2.8ghz. Wowies, im guessing that OC potential; on which so much was spend ($200??) really worked out yeah? He could've just gotten a GTX 590 for the same cost and REALLY gotten something.


Anyways, I'm just trying to ask you to really THINK IT THROUGH, and in the meantime, observe others like why_me who are experienced and respected; before you undermine a colleagues better build. These people come here to ask US for our knowledge, not so they can ask someone who knows about as much as them, but pretends to know more. Because if they agree with your logic, which they are likely to, they would've been better off doing it themselves.
Look, observe think and then recommend once you get the hang of it.

Until then, i'd really request you not to post builds...


Interesting points Vibhas, some of them I agree with and some of them I do not. BTW do you always "request that someone not post builds" when they disagree with you? If you do then this forum will get pretty boring quick. I see people recommending what I would consider to be poor choices all the time on this forum but that is their opinion, even if it may be a incorrect. I don't ask them not to post - at least they care enough to try to help someone.

I do agree with you about the 580s. Probably going with a 1000 W or 1200 X PSU would be the best choice for an SLI setup. Keep in mind that several professional reviewers found that the 850 HX put out over 1000 W and remained stable. That is one of the reasons it is

The difference in your philosophy and mine is that you are very wound up about $200 or $300 in cost. I have found some of the people that post on this forum will argue endlessly over a component that may cost $20 more - I just don't see the value of this. If an OP lists a budget, I purposely will work to stay within that budget and list the best components for THEIR needs. It is not a failure if an OP spends a few hundred dollars more for better components to meet THEIR needs. You get what you pay for most of the time.

I disagree with you about the recommended PSU size because the cost difference between the 650 and the 850 is minimal and PSUs are most efficient, quiet and cool when they run at 50% capacity - thus the 850 recommendation. You seem to think the world would have collapsed if they bought the 750 HX because it is not "SLI certified." Remember the 650 is not SLI certified and they cost about the same and so the OP would not have been injured in any way.

I understand your point about the "future build" of two 580s, but in that case the OP would be making the jump to a whole new level by purchasing $1000 worth of video cards. If they have that amount of money available, I doubt that purchasing a $250 AX 1200 PSU would break their bank. The 850 HX will run most of today's cards in SLI and it is a great value. I own it, and I own the 750 HX and so I speak from first-hand experience - do you?

I just took another look at the OPs build and I have seen most of the regular posters on the forum recommend every component on this build over and over again. It is a quality build and you pay for quality - even the world of computers. So it seems that your all wound up about one component of the OPs build the PSU and I guess that we will just have to agree to disagree about this.

One final point vibhas, most (nearly all) of the components in the OP's build WERE NOT MY RECOMMENDATION, if you are so upset, I suggest that you chase down the other posters who made these "terrible" recommendations and order them not to post to the "builds" section anymore. The components that I did recommend can be purchased for around $400 - $450 and so my recommendations did not jack up the price of this build.

Perhaps vibhas, you should think through your responses a little more before you post them. Remember, I invested my time to try to help the OP - I had no selfish motive.
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May 22, 2011 11:30:54 AM

flong said:
Interesting points Vibhas, some of them I agree with and some of them I do not. BTW do you always "request that someone not post builds" when they disagree with you? If you do then this forum will get pretty boring quick. I see people recommending what I would consider to be poor choices all the time on this forum but that is their opinion, even if it may be a incorrect. I don't ask them not to post - at least they care enough to try to help someone.

I do agree with you about the 580s. Probably going with a 1000 W or 1200 X PSU would be the best choice for an SLI setup. Keep in mind that several professional reviewers found that the 850 HX put out over 1000 W and remained stable. That is one of the reasons it is
Theres no reason not to buy an 850HX when SLIing 580's. Why you'd recommend it over the HCG900W, a $50 cheaper psu that got 0.1/10 worse from jonnyguru and is rated higher, or why you'd recommend a 750W HX blows my mind. A 750W HX will not give anything a 650W psu won't give in terms of a single card setup, and it certainly won't provide SLI for 580's. It would just be throwing out $60 (over a decent XFX 650W), when the OP clearly stated 'NO SLI' 'NO OCING'




The difference in your philosophy and mine is that you are very wound up about $200 or $300 in cost. I have found some of the people that post on this forum will argue endlessly over a component that may cost $20 more - I just don't see the value of this. If an OP lists a budget, I purposely will work to stay within that budget and list the best components for THEIR needs. It is not a failure if an OP spends a few hundred dollars more for better components to meet THEIR needs. You get what you pay for most of the time.
People argue over components costing $20 more because we have pride here, we want to give the best info, and costs stack up. 10-15 components in that pc, so thats $200-300 gone there. Seeing as some people ask for builds for $300-400 here... If the OP Lists a budget that is seen as the sky limit. He followed some of your recommendations, and he ended up $300 over budget. If they can meet their needs for less, most will do so, and thats all we want to do, as why_me did for $200~ below his budget. Your recommendations were based on your needs, and clearly went against what the OP specified- and the costs of going against the OP's specs were that he paid $600 more for a system that will yield nothing more except mild OCing (Which does very little in gaming, it wont allow you to step up your resolution, nor give you an appreciable fps difference, nor step up game settings). and SLI capabilities, which he didn't want.



I disagree with you about the recommended PSU size because the cost difference between the 650 and the 850 is minimal and PSUs are most efficient, quiet and cool when they run at 50% capacity - thus the 850 recommendation. You seem to think the world would have collapsed if they bought the 750 HX because it is not "SLI certified." Remember the 650 is not SLI certified and they cost about the same and so the OP would not have been injured in any way.
Minimal as in a $70 after TAX (59AR) XFX 650W that exceeded his needs, compared to a now $182 after-tax-HX850. $112 is not little, on a single part. Basically, the cost of SLIing you see is not just the 2nd card; its the $70 more for the 'decent' P67 mobo, the $110 for the beefier PSU, the extra cooling fans and better case to keep the system cool ($30-100~) and the actual $500 card. Thats $750 just to get an SLI 580 i5 2500k system. Crysis 2, on enthusiast (highest settings) on his full HD monitor will give him 41 fps. Metro 2033 on highest will give him 43 on his full hd (1920x1080) monitor. His 2nd 580 will take him to 60-70-80 whatever. But its not needed, and the card could be upgraded to a $350~ card in 2 years time and possibly outperform the 2 x 580s. He even said hes not buying for 4 years - He's stuck now. Either waste $500 more cause hes alraedy spent $250 getting it SLI ready... or spend $350-400 getting a really good card to REPLACE the 580, and wasting the $250 you spent to ready the sli. The nvidia ceo or w/e said that his cards are going to be 10x faster within 4 years. 2.5 x faster per year (as in the top end cards will be that faster). So an SLI will give what... 1.6x the performance of a single 580. In a year, that 580 will be beaten by a single card thats 2.5 x faster than a GTX 590.



I understand your point about the "future build" of two 580s, but in that case the OP would be making the jump to a whole new level by purchasing $1000 worth of video cards. If they have that amount of money available, I doubt that purchasing a $250 AX 1200 PSU would break their bank. The 850 HX will run most of today's cards in SLI and it is a great value. I own it, and I own the 750 HX and so I speak from first-hand experience - do you? So then why recommend an SLI psu if you aren't even planning on him SLIing? You want him to buy a 850W psu, for about $100 more, just so he can have 300W headroom for his OCing? WTF?! By suggesting such a beefy PSU, you are saying he needs to SLI basically, sometime cause no card takes up more than 600W with his processor, not even the HD 6990..which is 2 cards (or 590)



I just took another look at the OPs build and I have seen most of the regular posters on the forum recommend every component on this build over and over again. It is a quality build and you pay for quality - even the world of computers. So it seems that your all wound up about one component of the OPs build the PSU and I guess that we will just have to agree to disagree about this. Again, no proof of this; Why_me and genghiskron and i all disagreed with you. Why_Me is the most respected here out of all of us; hes also the most active out of all of us... you may think those parts are recommended, and they may be, but only at a certain price relative to other parts, and depending on the guys needs. He say no SLI or OC, thats why why_me said get an h61...



One final point vibhas, most (nearly all) of the components in the OP's build WERE NOT MY RECOMMENDATION, if you are so upset, I suggest that you chase down the other posters who made these "terrible" recommendations and order them not to post to the "builds" section anymore. The components that I did recommend can be purchased for around $400 - $450 and so my recommendations did not jack up the price of this build. Again read above, the sli and oc will end up costing him in excess of 1000 after all taxes etc compared to a single 2500 and 580. The components in his pc may be sound, but they are not for him, or at least what he said he wanted, and most definitely out of his initial $1500 budget. Im not saying a corsair psu is bad, or noctua or w/e coolant is bad. Im saying any coolant is bad for his build, for his needs. Thats what im disagreeing with.. adding cost that doesnt give him what he wanted..



Perhaps vibhas, you should think through your responses a little more before you post them. Remember, I invested my time to try to help the OP - I had no selfish motive.
Theres nothing worse than misdirected help. I have no doubt you had good intentions, but disagreeing with what 3 of us say, without really even deeply considering it, and disregarding what the OP initially said, instead convincing him the 'bigger, better' psu will make his build better, the 'k' processor is definite value at '$20' more, when the real value is considered after adding in cpu coolant, mobo and 'k' version AND tanker psu.. same with the bigger pSu... Of course a 'newb' parts builder like the OP will go for the 'bigger' thing.. or the most 'balanced' system.. He didn't want ocing, he didnt NEED IT FOR A SINGLE 1920x1080P monitor, and i still have no idea why you recommended the 850W psu if you didnt want him to SLI...
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May 22, 2011 12:52:56 PM

vibhas said:
Theres nothing worse than misdirected help. I have no doubt you had good intentions, but disagreeing with what 3 of us say, without really even deeply considering it, and disregarding what the OP initially said, instead convincing him the 'bigger, better' psu will make his build better, the 'k' processor is definite value at '$20' more, when the real value is considered after adding in cpu coolant, mobo and 'k' version AND tanker psu.. same with the bigger pSu... Of course a 'newb' parts builder like the OP will go for the 'bigger' thing.. or the most 'balanced' system.. He didn't want ocing, he didnt NEED IT FOR A SINGLE 1920x1080P monitor, and i still have no idea why you recommended the 850W psu if you didnt want him to SLI...


Unfortunately vibhas, you are irrational which makes my answering somewhat of a waste of time.

1. I did not recommend anything the Tom's Hardware's builds has not recommended as far as SLI/Crossfire. Here is the quote:

"Recent tests performed by our very own Thomas Soderstrom confirm that the Radeon HD 6900-series has vastly improved scaling performance in CrossFire compared to previous-generation boards. As such, a pair of these cards represents a realistic pinnacle for our recommendations. At $550, two Radeon HD 6950s handily beat the GeForce GTX 580,"

Actually the pricing is wrong here because two 2GB 6950s can be purchased for $500 right now which is about the same price as a 580, and as Mr. Sodertrom from Tom's Hardware notes, they will handily beat a 580. The cost is about the same so it shows that you are irrational. 2 +2 still equal 4 vibhas

2. You say, "A 750W HX will not give anything a 650W psu won't give in terms of a single card setup, and it certainly won't provide SLI for 580's. It would just be throwing out $60 (over a decent XFX 650W), when the OP clearly stated 'NO SLI' 'NO OCING' "

This is incorrect because a user can and do attach any number of power consuming components to a single GPU and what should be obvious to any rational thinker is that a 750 W PSU has 100 W more capacity than a 650 W PSU. You could argue that a person with a single GPU will not need more than 650 W, but you don't know that. Everyone changes and evolves as they find new products that can improve their computing experience.

Really the main point I made is that the 750 HX is about the same price as most quality 650 PSUs. The Antec 650 is $90, the Seasonic 650 is $140 (silver rated). The 750 HX hovers around $110 - $120. I don't see where you are getting your numbers unless you are comparing a less efficient PSU which is not an apples to apples comparison. But let's assume that someone does spend $50 (they didn't but let's assume it for the discussion) for a better PSU - they got better quality and more capacity and it cost a little more. Really, $50 - give me a break! Keep in mind the numbers above are directly off of newegg.

3. You seem to think that I was personally insulting Why me and kahn by disagreeing with them. You need to grow up. People disagree all the time without it being some kind of insult. I respect both of those individuals for trying to help someone. If I disagree with them I try to do it in a respectful manner. Different posters disagree with me all the time and I don't think that it is some kind of personal insult.

4. You said, "Again read above, the sli and oc will end up costing him in excess of 1000 after all taxes etc compared to a single 2500 and 580."

Really? Are you on drugs? I just showed you above that the GPU setup is recommended by Tom's Hardware and the cost for a single 580 or two 6950s is about the same. They are both floating around $500. For example, the XFX 2gb 6950 is $245 after rebates on Newesgg right now. That puts two of them at less than $500 (you can only get one rebate per household).

As far as additional overclocking costs I can only guess that you are referring to the cost of a K-chip compared to a non-K-chip. In this case what is the difference between a 2500 and a 2500K, $20?

5. Concerning overall cost Vibhas, I want you to try and focus on the next sentence. BY FAR MOST OF THE COMPONENTS THE OP CHOSE ARE NOT MY RECOMMENDATIONS. Sorry for the caps but evidently it is not getting through to you. Go hunt down the people that made those recommendations and yell at them for the overall cost.

I personally am not a fan of the C300, I am not a viewsonic fan (monitor), I am a fan of the Z68 boards not the P67, etc. Most of those items are NOT what I would have chosen but that is OK. Other people have different needs and likes than me.

Once again, the overall cost is driven mostly by the components I didn't recommend.

6. The components I did recommend were the Noctua NH-D14 and 2500K CPU and I suggested that as Tom's Hardware says in its GPU reviews that two 6950 in crossfire are a better value than a single 580. I should have just printed the Tom's Hardware quote and then you would be telling Thomas Soderstrom not to post right now. I wonder how he would take it when you confronted him and said he made a "misguided" recommendation.

7. You said, "He didn't want ocing, he didnt NEED IT FOR A SINGLE 1920x1080P monitor, and i still have no idea why you recommended the 850W psu if you didnt want him to SLI..."

I never said he needed overclocking for a 1920 x 1080 monitor - I am sure why you even say that. My point was that for the grand sum of $20 if he or she bought the 2500K and they needed more performance in the future IT WOULD BE AVAILABLE TO THEM BY A SIMPLE OVERCLOCK AT NO EXTRA COST.

Really? You come across as just dimwitted. Did you even read what I said or did you just react with an ill-informed post?

You are the one so wound up about cost. If the OP wants to improve his computer's performance in the future he can OC and it WON'T COST HIM ANY MORE THAN THE $20 extra that the 2500K costs compared to the 2500. Since you appear to be on the border of an epileptic fit over cost I thought I would capitalize the above point to show you how it will probably save the OP money in the future. Focus vibhas, focus - breath deeply.

8. So to drive home the point, my recommendations cost the OP about $20 extra for the K-chip and about $40 extra (and that's being generous) for the Noctua NH-D14 for A GRAND TOTAL OF $60 EXTRA DOLLARS. Damn that's a lot of money - not. To be fair on this point whyme was talking about the H61 - which would be a greater difference but not much. The 2500K is pretty cheap and the P67 mobos are also very cheap.

For this $60 extra dollars he got what is arguably the best air cooler on the market (when noise is important) and what Tom's Hardware calls a best buy in CPUs and once again ladies and gentlemen - the 2500K is a recommended choice by Tom's Hardware as the best gaming chip and the OP listed gaming as his first use of this build. So go yell at Tom's Hardware vibhas.

9. You said, "Thats what im disagreeing with.. adding cost that doesnt give him what he wanted.."

I couldn't disagree with you more. The OP has chosen a solid, cost efficient system that actually follows most of Tom's Hardware's recommendations. I am not sure how you can argue with that??? Even though most of the choices are not what I would have chosen, he/she has chosen very high quality components that have the best price/performance ratios.

10. You said, "Again read above, the sli and oc will end up costing him in excess of 1000 after all taxes etc compared to a single 2500 and 580."

Aside from the FACT that your numbers are delusional, the OP is the one who mentioned possible SLI in his/her description at the start of this thread. The OP's question is "is this for two or more monitors?? if I'm right so NO."
Well considering that the OP listed gaming as his/her first use of this computer they were not right. SLI or crossfires primary use is TO IMPROVE GAMING PERFORMANCE. Vibhas did YOU read the OP's requirements carefully? The OP did not understand what crossfire/SLI actually are and that they could potentially help his/her gaming experience. That is why it was important to point out the option of going to SLI or crossfire, which, once again ladies and gentlemen is recommended by Tom's Hardware as the better choice for GPUs in this range.

11. It would have been more professional and in decorum to have emailed me privately instead of spewing out your irrational criticisms all over this forum which I greatly admire. You are a discredit to Tom's Hardware. I could go on but if you continue to be irrational, it is a waste of everyone's time.
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a b 4 Gaming
May 22, 2011 7:17:26 PM

^ The 750HX hovers @ $140 NOT $120. No 750w rebranded Seasonic hovers below $140.
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May 23, 2011 12:34:21 AM

Hi Shinobi

I found the 750 HX for $125 after rebates here: http://www.amazon.com/Corsair-CMPSU-750HX-Professional-...

This special is on Amazon. You are right that before rebates the price hovers around $140. The good news is that both the 750 HX and and 850 HX frequently go on sale for much less. Last week the 850 HX was on sale at newegg for $119 after rebates. Corsair has been very good at competitively pricing these items in the PSU market.
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a b 4 Gaming
May 23, 2011 3:05:43 AM

Ohhhh I was referring to before rebates. But I suppose if you account for after rebates, I usually like to know the price BR since AR is just money coming in later.
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May 23, 2011 3:15:01 AM

last time i checked, $125 is not between $110 and $120.

you can also get an antec 650 for $65
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
Its pretty frustrating how you fudge numbers in most of your posts, but I do agree with the basis of your argument. Yes, there is an antec 650 currently available for $90, but its simply misleading to give a higher than average price for one part and a lower than low price for another in a price comparison. There may very well be a good reason to spend $60 more for a $125 750HX over a $65 antec 650w, but a $65 difference is not "about the same price", and claiming that a 750hx is about the same price as any quality 650w psu is simply ridiculous. i cant believe im responding to this. im sorry
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May 23, 2011 4:15:22 AM

flong said:
Unfortunately vibhas, you are irrational which makes my answering somewhat of a waste of time.

1. I did not recommend anything the Tom's Hardware's builds has not recommended as far as SLI/Crossfire. Here is the quote:

"Recent tests performed by our very own Thomas Soderstrom confirm that the Radeon HD 6900-series has vastly improved scaling performance in CrossFire compared to previous-generation boards. As such, a pair of these cards represents a realistic pinnacle for our recommendations. At $550, two Radeon HD 6950s handily beat the GeForce GTX 580,"

Actually the pricing is wrong here because two 2GB 6950s can be purchased for $500 right now which is about the same price as a 580, and as Mr. Sodertrom from Tom's Hardware notes, they will handily beat a 580. The cost is about the same so it shows that you are irrational. 2 +2 still equal 4 vibhas


How about we add in the cost of the beefier PSU ($50-100), P67 mobo ($100 more), fans/better case, and what. $700 vs $475? Plus, the fact that a dual card setup will always beat the single card set up.. and the fact the OP stated as you said '1 card'...
2. You say, "A 750W HX will not give anything a 650W psu won't give in terms of a single card setup, and it certainly won't provide SLI for 580's. It would just be throwing out $60 (over a decent XFX 650W), when the OP clearly stated 'NO SLI' 'NO OCING' "

This is incorrect because a user can and do attach any number of power consuming components to a single GPU and what should be obvious to any rational thinker is that a 750 W PSU has 100 W more capacity than a 650 W PSU. You could argue that a person with a single GPU will not need more than 650 W, but you don't know that. Everyone changes and evolves as they find new products that can improve their computing experience.
No, they arent going to keep increasing the power reqs indefinitely. They have been decreasing them in the last 5 years too.. not increasing.



Really the main point I made is that the 750 HX is about the same price as most quality 650 PSUs. The Antec 650 is $90, the Seasonic 650 is $140 (silver rated). The 750 HX hovers around $110 - $120. I don't see where you are getting your numbers unless you are comparing a less efficient PSU which is not an apples to apples comparison. But let's assume that someone does spend $50 (they didn't but let's assume it for the discussion) for a better PSU - they got better quality and more capacity and it cost a little more. Really, $50 - give me a break! Keep in mind the numbers above are directly off of newegg.

On the contrary, i see antecs for $60-70~ for 650W, 750 HX for $145 after taxes on newegg. Thats the whole reason for b uying on amazon.. avoid taxes.



3. You seem to think that I was personally insulting Why me and kahn by disagreeing with them. You need to grow up. People disagree all the time without it being some kind of insult. I respect both of those individuals for trying to help someone. If I disagree with them I try to do it in a respectful manner. Different posters disagree with me all the time and I don't think that it is some kind of personal insult.No, im saying that you need to actually consider their opinion



4. You said, "Again read above, the sli and oc will end up costing him in excess of 1000 after all taxes etc compared to a single 2500 and 580."

Really? Are you on drugs? I just showed you above that the GPU setup is recommended by Tom's Hardware and the cost for a single 580 or two 6950s is about the same. They are both floating around $500. For example, the XFX 2gb 6950 is $245 after rebates on Newesgg right now. That puts two of them at less than $500 (you can only get one rebate per household).

Again, $100 more for better PSU, case... $100 for mobo... Thats $250~ excess right there.

As far as additional overclocking costs I can only guess that you are referring to the cost of a K-chip compared to a non-K-chip. In this case what is the difference between a 2500 and a 2500K, $20?
Additional overclocking costs LIKE THE BLOODY H61 MOBO COMPARED TO A P67? Im not the first person to tell you this, and for about the 30th time too..

5. Concerning overall cost Vibhas, I want you to try and focus on the next sentence. BY FAR MOST OF THE COMPONENTS THE OP CHOSE ARE NOT MY RECOMMENDATIONS. Sorry for the caps but evidently it is not getting through to you. Go hunt down the people that made those recommendations and yell at them for the overall cost. Do you know why builds here aren't the same, even at the same budget and same needs? Because prices CHANGE. At a particular price a gpu is great, at another its terrible. Same for other parts. Id be shouting at you for recommending a GOOD part at a BAD price. The people recommending on toms even say that its for 'THIS MONTH' and ~Best graphics at ~XXX. Because price is the discerning factor every time. And needs.



I personally am not a fan of the C300, I am not a viewsonic fan (monitor), I am a fan of the Z68 boards not the P67, etc. Most of those items are NOT what I would have chosen but that is OK. Other people have different needs and likes than me. He said no OC and no SLI, so you picked a P67 or Z68, 850W psu. Nice.



Once again, the overall cost is driven mostly by the components I didn't recommend.

6. The components I did recommend were the Noctua NH-D14 and 2500K CPU and I suggested that as Tom's Hardware says in its GPU reviews that two 6950 in crossfire are a better value than a single 580. I should have just printed the Tom's Hardware quote and then you would be telling Thomas Soderstrom not to post right now. I wonder how he would take it when you confronted him and said he made a "misguided" recommendation. Duh, they dont count the overall costs, and also they clearly state that whilst performance is better a single card setup is always preferable and a less hassle. They are talking purely abuot the price of cards, because they cant also tell you what mobo to buy with each product..THey make YOU factor in additional costs, not least psu/mobo/power bill/additional cooling



7. You said, "He didn't want ocing, he didnt NEED IT FOR A SINGLE 1920x1080P monitor, and i still have no idea why you recommended the 850W psu if you didnt want him to SLI..."

I never said he needed overclocking for a 1920 x 1080 monitor - I am sure why you even say that. My point was that for the grand sum of $20 if he or she bought the 2500K and they needed more performance in the future IT WOULD BE AVAILABLE TO THEM BY A SIMPLE OVERCLOCK AT NO EXTRA COST.

Really? You come across as just dimwitted. Did you even read what I said or did you just react with an ill-informed post?No you didnt read what i said. An H61 board was recommended, and you drove up the cost by adding sli/oc potential. Just for oc you need a P67 mobo for $100 more, a 2500 'k' and $50-70 in coolant. Nice. Thats the 'real' cost of ocing here..



You are the one so wound up about cost. If the OP wants to improve his computer's performance in the future he can OC and it WON'T COST HIM ANY MORE THAN THE $20 extra that the 2500K costs compared to the 2500. Since you appear to be on the border of an epileptic fit over cost I thought I would capitalize the above point to show you how it will probably save the OP money in the future. Focus vibhas, focus - breath deeply. As i said, the mobo/psu/cooolant etc all make your post useles..



8. So to drive home the point, my recommendations cost the OP about $20 extra for the K-chip and about $40 extra (and that's being generous) for the Noctua NH-D14 for A GRAND TOTAL OF $60 EXTRA DOLLARS. Damn that's a lot of money - not. To be fair on this point whyme was talking about the H61 - which would be a greater difference but not much. The 2500K is pretty cheap and the P67 mobos are also very cheap.About $150. And thats all i was saying.. why H61 / no oc vs $160 more for oc.. If you read my posts youd realize thats what i was saying ALL along....$160 for Ocing. Gratz.



For this $60 extra dollars he got what is arguably the best air cooler on the market (when noise is important) and what Tom's Hardware calls a best buy in CPUs and once again ladies and gentlemen - the 2500K is a recommended choice by Tom's Hardware as the best gaming chip and the OP listed gaming as his first use of this build. So go yell at Tom's Hardware vibhas.

9. You said, "Thats what im disagreeing with.. adding cost that doesnt give him what he wanted.."

I couldn't disagree with you more. The OP has chosen a solid, cost efficient system that actually follows most of Tom's Hardware's recommendations. I am not sure how you can argue with that??? Even though most of the choices are not what I would have chosen, he/she has chosen very high quality components that have the best price/performance ratios. Toms also recommends a 100 billion parts. Guess what. They all are valid at the time of print, at thhat cost when it was printed. If the i5 2500k went up to $300 overnight, he'd recommend the currently unrecommended i7 2600k. We are here so that we can recommend whats NOW>


10. You said, "Again read above, the sli and oc will end up costing him in excess of 1000 after all taxes etc compared to a single 2500 and 580."

Aside from the FACT that your numbers are delusional, the OP is the one who mentioned possible SLI in his/her description at the start of this thread. The OP's question is "is this for two or more monitors?? if I'm right so NO."
Well considering that the OP listed gaming as his/her first use of this computer they were not right. SLI or crossfires primary use is TO IMPROVE GAMING PERFORMANCE. Vibhas did YOU read the OP's requirements carefully? The OP did not understand what crossfire/SLI actually are and that they could potentially help his/her gaming experience. That is why it was important to point out the option of going to SLI or crossfire, which, once again ladies and gentlemen is recommended by Tom's Hardware as the better choice for GPUs in this range.

11. It would have been more professional and in decorum to have emailed me privately instead of spewing out your irrational criticisms all over this forum which I greatly admire. You are a discredit to Tom's Hardware. I could go on but if you continue to be irrational, it is a waste of everyone's time.

I actually think its your thinking thats irrational. The OP selected a 1920x1080P monitor. Unless you are including a $1000 monitor (1600P) in the budget... then anything he buys will be for that monitor. The GPU selected was a GTX 580. Not a 6950. Thats why in terms of SLI, the 650W does nothing less than the 750W- Neither will power an sli 580, both will power it single card. I agree the i5 2500k is the best processor on toms, but the 2500 non 'k' is better if the OP said hes not ocing. Theres a reason why they offer the 2500, and for cheaper - Some people dont want to OC. Same with the H61 boards - They are cheaper because they offer what you need. I'm not saying toms is wrong, im saying it DEPENDS ON YOUR NEEDS. If he says NO OC, you dont pay extra for an OC chip that doesn't give extra stock performance...
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May 23, 2011 4:36:01 AM

genghiskron said:
last time i checked, $125 is not between $110 and $120.

you can also get an antec 650 for $65
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E168...
Its pretty frustrating how you fudge numbers in most of your posts, but I do agree with the basis of your argument. Yes, there is an antec 650 currently available for $90, but its simply misleading to give a higher than average price for one part and a lower than low price for another in a price comparison. There may very well be a good reason to spend $60 more for a $125 750HX over a $65 antec 650w, but a $65 difference is not "about the same price", and claiming that a 750hx is about the same price as any quality 650w psu is simply ridiculous. i cant believe im responding to this. im sorry

No, i love how he doesnt read my criticisms, and instead just proceeds to argue against single sentences without reading the argument behind them. He still thinks the cost difference between an i5 2500 + h61 and i5 2500k + p67 + better case + noctua is "$20"
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a b 4 Gaming
May 23, 2011 5:30:52 AM

This topic has been closed by Jbakerlent
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