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Windows 98 & modern gpu - 3D Accel & DX

Last response: in Graphics & Displays
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April 12, 2011 1:39:40 AM

Hello! :) 
Not long ago I found some of my old Win95/98 games and also discovered some very interesting ones on Abandonia, and wanted to give them a try. I took all the cautions as this was old software and Win7 doesn't get along too well with it, but most of them turned up to have compatibility issues with my current system. I played some anyway, though they had all kind of anoying quirks, even I couldn't get the most out of them graphically :/ 
About a year ago, I installed Win98 (just out of couriosity) and the first to come up were problems with modern hardware, especially with memory and the GPU. I eventually got around it all and I got my Win98 up and running, though I had to use some glitchy graphics driver to get some 3D acceleration (which didn't work well with games)- since I found my 9600gt was totally unsupported. I tried Virtual Machines but they didn't give good results, nor most of the hacks and "emulators" I found.
Now I'm about to get an AMD/ATI Card and the question arose again; Is there any way I could have good DirectX and other 3D acceleration capabilities if I install Win98 again?
Any ideas?
Thank you in advance!
a b U Graphics card
April 12, 2011 1:41:34 AM

Doubtful. I doubt you can even install current drivers in Win98.
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a b U Graphics card
April 12, 2011 2:11:58 PM

Really, really doubtful. System architecture is just too different.
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a b U Graphics card
April 12, 2011 6:37:21 PM

To be fair, Win98SE supports DX9.0c and SM 2.0. The main problem is lack of drivers (due to underlying differences with the OS)

Sadly enough, if you want a legacy OS, Windows ME/2000 is your best choice, because drivers are far more recent then are avaliable for 98.
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a b U Graphics card
April 12, 2011 9:36:31 PM

You mean 2000. ME had more glitches and issues than me. :lol: 
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April 12, 2011 10:28:26 PM

OK, guess i'd just have to build an old machine for that purpose. Thank you all! ;) 
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a b U Graphics card
April 13, 2011 12:49:35 AM

Pick up one at a yard sale or something.
I got a few thousand of them in my basement!
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April 13, 2011 4:53:43 PM

plznote said:
I got a few thousand of them in my basement!


lol :D  wanna spare a few hundred?? now i regret giving away my old pcs...

for those interested in win98, i found a discontinued VESA driver for win9x with some DX capabilities, its VERY hard to find so pm me and ill upload it somewhere. im testing it on vmware, it improves compatibility but i cant say it actually makes 3d acceleration possible...
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a c 172 U Graphics card
April 13, 2011 6:37:11 PM

Good luck :) 

I am interested to be honest in the vesa driver.
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a b U Graphics card
April 13, 2011 7:37:56 PM

plznote said:
You mean 2000. ME had more glitches and issues than me. :lol: 


True, but ME was DOS based, so you'll have a bit more luck with the old stuff.
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a b U Graphics card
April 13, 2011 9:03:23 PM

Yeah, But honestly I would rather keep my my old Win 95 than use ME.
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April 13, 2011 11:53:54 PM

Well, ill update the status on the thread in case you have any suggestions!

Looking around websites and forums dedicated to Win98/95/ME OSes on newer machines, i found that 3d accel is quite an unsolved subject, since people are already struggling to get these OSes to even boot on their machines (and finding drivers for Sound, Network, Chipset...).
But there have appeared a number of modded drivers for chipsets and, surprisingly, for graphic cards (!), but up to the Gf 8 series :p  So i think people with a gf8800 'could' have their D3D supported for older games (it'd be fun to see Quake or Kings Quest running on that gpu :D ). Newer Geforce or any PCIE AMD cards seem not supported. - f%"ing gf9600 of mine... Anyway, those threads/webs are already old and dont seem to be alive or supported..

Right now Im trying the driver I talked about earlier, it lets me acheive higher resolutions than any other - and as I said, now some 3d applications depending on D3D at least start. But apps and games encounter all kinds of problems: they look like they are software rendered and/or dont let me choose resolutions or other graphic options (limited 3d funcionality), or they just crash...
Its a real improvement over the other driver i used before (explorer/browsers/text processors now run lighting fast :D ), though 3d results are just not good. Not to mention that OpenGL apps crash no matter what. This last matter really screw up the last idea i got; using DXwnd to "transfer" D3D calculations to OpenGL.

I dont wanna give up just now, but this is already cosuming my brain!! And finding an old fully mounted win98 computer is not easy and would be too much. I dont know where i'd put it either :p  same happens with getting an 8series gf.

Ideas appreciated ;) 
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a b U Graphics card
April 14, 2011 12:00:55 PM

Out of curiosity, what games are you trying to run? Most DOS games can be run via Dosbox in most any OS; its the 95/98 era Windows games that are near impossible to get working these days...
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April 14, 2011 5:01:15 PM

I would get a old laptop with 2000 or xp on it. I am been thinking about doing, but I have not done it yet. Maybe I will get win7/8 pro and use xp mode. If I do that then should I put a vid called " useing a GTX 580 to play sim ant". Hope you find a way to play your good old games.
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a c 172 U Graphics card
April 14, 2011 5:01:16 PM

Stares at my decade old socket 7 rig loaded with win98 se ;) 

k6-2+ 550mhz
512mb ram
15gb wd drive 98se
40gb wd drive xp sp3
3dfx voodoo 5 5500 agp
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April 14, 2011 10:49:48 PM

gamerk316 said:
Out of curiosity, what games are you trying to run? Most DOS games can be run via Dosbox in most any OS; its the 95/98 era Windows games that are near impossible to get working these days...


Thats the problem, most of them are from that 95/98 era. Right now my primary concern are "King's Quest: Mask of Eternity" and "NFS3 Hot Pursuit", which look awful on Win7, and "Sonic R" which is a pain in the ass. All from 1998.
Had some problems with "Fury 3" (1995) but I made it work!
They're all playable, but If I'm gonna be several hours playing them I want them to look as good as they're supposed to, cause they're great games. And i dont mind spending days learning how to get them to work, its also part of the fun! ;) 

Anyway, its been easier to find hacks for newer OSes, and i guess that's the way im gonna take.
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a c 171 U Graphics card
April 14, 2011 11:16:30 PM

you can run win98 through a virtual machine.
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!