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System Builder Marathon, March 2012: $2600 Performance PC

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March 28, 2012 4:00:03 AM

At four times the budget of our cheapest PC, today's build minimizes compromise in the name of delivering unparalleled quality, performance, and features. Thomas takes the opposite approach as Paul and Don, beefing up on his CPU. Was it the right call?

System Builder Marathon, March 2012: $2600 Performance PC : Read more

More about : system builder marathon march 2012 2600 performance

March 28, 2012 4:22:56 AM

Just curious, did you guys purchase all these parts and right these articles before the GTX 680 was released? I really thought you guys would have gone with that, and if it wasn't because they weren't available at the time, then what makes the 7970 better in your opinion?
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-16
March 28, 2012 4:23:55 AM

Sorry, *write. It's late.
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-2
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March 28, 2012 4:32:52 AM

Not sure if I agree with that choice of cooler but I definitely like the rest of the setup!
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3
March 28, 2012 4:42:51 AM

llguitargr8Just curious, did you guys purchase all these parts and right these articles before the GTX 680 was released? I really thought you guys would have gone with that, and if it wasn't because they weren't available at the time, then what makes the 7970 better in your opinion?

Almost all these build articles are based on purchases that took place 2 months ago. Even if they were to have bought these parts today, it would be hard to purchase a 680, as stock is a major issue.
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13
March 28, 2012 4:51:00 AM

I like it a lot. I am glad you mixed it up and went with the x79 platform.
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12
March 28, 2012 5:04:39 AM

I like the build except the x79 adds like $500 extra that I see very little benefit from.
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10
March 28, 2012 5:04:42 AM

Love the build. Do want!
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3
March 28, 2012 5:05:37 AM

Dang I need to win this one!! I'm so happy they balanced the CPU with the GPU this time around.
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5
March 28, 2012 5:58:33 AM

Good job: Working through the details of the CPU cooler like that is half the fun of this hobby. Great build.
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3
March 28, 2012 7:09:40 AM

Good build . But there could be more improvement by replacing a $600 cpu and $320 mother board with a i7 2600k and a $200 z68 mother board . And also replacing the 7970($590) with 2x680 at 2x$500(from the money saved from cpu and motherboard and 7970). It may give better gaming result than this build.
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-8
March 28, 2012 7:22:53 AM

llguitargr8Just curious, did you guys purchase all these parts and right these articles before the GTX 680 was released? I really thought you guys would have gone with that, and if it wasn't because they weren't available at the time, then what makes the 7970 better in your opinion?

Look at Some of the previous articles in regards to the GTX 680 both as a single card and in SLI. I noticed that it just depends on the game (or application). Sometimes the GTX 680 outperforms the AMD 7970, and vice versa. As far as I'm concerned, if I was going to buy either one, I'd pick the GTX 680 because it is priced below the AMD 7970. The only possible caveat to that would be a driver issue, in relation to the OS or the motherboard. For instance, my motherboard (which is 5 years old) from what I've heard, only plays well with NVIDIA cards. I don't know if the same thing is true for PCI-e 3.0 compatible motherboards or not, if some are only compatible with NVIDIA or AMD cards or both.
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-6
March 28, 2012 7:23:44 AM

Is Ivy Bridge out yet...
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-14
March 28, 2012 7:24:41 AM

Quoting your CPU recommendations for March

"Although they sound impressive, those advantages don't necessarily translate into significant performance gains in modern titles. Our tests demonstrate fairly little difference between a $225 LGA 1155 Core i5-2500K and a $1000 LGA 2011 Core i7-3960X, even when three-way graphics card configurations are involved. It turns out that memory bandwidth and PCIe throughput don't hold back the performance of existing Sandy Bridge machines."

So, your argument doesn't sound reasonable in my very humble point of view. If you aim to get a good performance in games, choosing dual 7970s is a no-brainer. Also, the performance gain in multi monitor setups favors the 2 7970s.When you factor in the higher motherboard cost, the value and performance per dollar picture gets even worse.
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4
March 28, 2012 7:32:17 AM

This looks like a great build, glad you guys touched back onto the whole CPU heatsink and memory issue with the x79 boards. I'm actually looking into getting almost that identical board from asus for my x79 build, and am really glad to see the use of a different heatsink besides Noctua's. Cheers to a great build!
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7
March 28, 2012 7:36:51 AM

llguitargr8Just curious, did you guys purchase all these parts and right these articles before the GTX 680 was released?

Yes, the parts were ordered around five weeks ago. Tom's Hardware didn't even have a preview sample of the GTX 680 at that time.
e56imfgDang I need to win this one!! I'm so happy they balanced the CPU with the GPU this time around.

Thanks, it was one of the most requested changes from our previous high-priced build.
youssef 2010So, your argument doesn't sound reasonable in my very humble point of view. If you aim to get a good performance in games, choosing dual 7970s is a no-brainer. Also, the performance gain in multi monitor setups favors the 2 7970s.When you factor in the higher motherboard cost, the value and performance per dollar picture gets even worse.

First and formost, this isn't a gaming machine yet you refer to "Best Gaming CPUs for the Money".

Second, even if someone wanted to call this a gaming machine they'd be left with the realization that 70% of the benchmarks are not games.

Third, the decision to use a six-core SB-E was heavily influenced by the complaints of your fellow readers in the last high-end build, which lacked it. I could have easily picked either CrossFire (to boost around 30% of the benchmarks) or SB-E (for a bigger boost in fewer benchmarks) based on reader requests.

So you're officially nominated to rebut any favorable reader comments concerning the use of an SB-E.
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30
March 28, 2012 8:04:40 AM

MonolithicYou fail ^ You sted quote "First and formost, this isn't a gaming machine" and yet you put a $550 Flagship "GAMING" GPU onboard a motherboard I might add that was an additional overpriced waste of resources. Do you guy's not undertand common logic here on TH or are you just into getting people to friviously spend all there money on really what it amounts to is needles things. This build could have be done miles better than it was and if I were your boss you would no longer be my employee in fact you would not have even been hired so take heed this build is trash.


As Crashman said, this isn't a gaming orientated machine. It was said in the introduction that "Games account for 30% of our evaluation", which is why they put the SB-E processor in it. Putting more money into a better CPU would yield higher overall performance than putting in another 7970 would.
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4
March 28, 2012 8:31:53 AM

pardon me monolithic, but are you dense? this rig would be a beastly workstation, do you even know anything about gpgpu applications? high end graphics cards today are not just eyecandy for games
not much of an enthusiast are you

on topic: i just wish they would put popular video editing/encoding software in their benchmarks such as sony vegas which has the option to render videos using just cpu or cpu+gpu which reduces the strain on cpu by alot and makes the night and day difference in encoding speed with mainconcept's avc encoder (my puny gtx460 cuts encoding time off 4ghz i5 760 by 70%, so i can only imagine what happens with a $500+ gpu)

i'm effing tired of people who religiously preach how sufficient i3/i5 is, you know, not everyone uses pc to play mw3
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11
March 28, 2012 9:05:20 AM

Crashman

You're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't, it seems.

May I point out to some people that the SB-E is a decent step up on the 990X for a good deal cheaper? I could understand the rationale by wanting to go with an overclocked 920 over the 980 and 990 in the past especially considering the $1,000 price tag, but here we're talking a $400 cheaper CPU inside a $2,600 machine which isn't destined to be used only for gaming. Is spending a quarter of the budget on an exceptionally fast CPU which benefits 95% of your work such a waste of money?
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14
March 28, 2012 9:33:57 AM

For those that KEEP mentioning the damn 680's, they WERE NOT OUT when they bought the parts, FFS! They also said they did NOT want to keep using the 2500Ks.
If they keep using the same s*** over and over, what is the point? I just dont get how hard a concept that is for some of the people around here. Read the damn articles before commenting...
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17
March 28, 2012 9:37:20 AM

My PC usage is %50 browsing, %30 gaming and %20 drawing or rendering. Among my friends I am the most moderate gamer so I was expecting Tom to get his butt whooped for spending more than $800 on the CPU/Mobo. The majority of hard-core PC gamers will not only compromise their PC parts for better graphics, but their biological parts and social life as well.

Intel Core i5-2550K $230 The money saved from buying this CPU can be put in a 120hz monitor. More GPU processing required, less CPU bottle-neck to worry about.

ASUS P8P67 PRO $160 if you don't mind the rebate.

Noctua NH-D14 $95 (Zalman lol)

SAMSUNG 8GB $48 is a game changer. Once everyone uses 30nm, everything else will be obsolete.

EVGA GTX 680 SLI 508x2= $1,016 when it's available. HD 7970 CF for now. You can add a third just by upgrading the mobo to P67 WS rev for $255

Mushkin Enhanced Chronos SSD 240GB $249 Did tom's pay more for the extra 1 year warranty?

Western Digital Caviar Black 1.5TB $158 although I like your idea that slower RPM is more quite.

LITE-ON 24X DVD Writer $27 As a gamer I don't care for Blue-ray.

SeaSonic Platinum Platinum-860 860W $220 We agree on something :) 

Rosewill THOR V2 $130. 140mm rear Fan, 230mm front fan, 230mm top fan, 230mm side Fan. This case with this config. does not even need dampening to make it quite and it can't be beat cooling-wise. Just have to go through hell building in it :) 

Total: $2,333
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-6
March 28, 2012 9:43:10 AM

Luay - you're taking away two cores and 8GB RAM from a workstation build. This isn't solely a gaming machine; the 7970 is here just as much for compute as it is for gaming.
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6
March 28, 2012 9:56:06 AM

2600K on cheaper motherboard to save money for more GPU power would be a lot better option if you ask me.
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-5
March 28, 2012 9:56:47 AM

DarkersonFor those that KEEP mentioning the damn 680's, they WERE NOT OUT when they bought the parts, FFS! They also said they did NOT want to keep using the 2500Ks. If they keep using the same s*** over and over, what is the point? I just dont get how hard a concept that is for some of the people around here. Read the damn articles before commenting...

Well they should have said "we wouldn't build a PC right now" rather than shoe-horning together old parts. Because, really, no one is building a new PC right now with IB coming out and 680 supply issues still being resolved.
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-14
March 28, 2012 9:58:43 AM

silverblueLuay - you're taking away two cores and 8GB RAM from a workstation build. This isn't solely a gaming machine; the 7970 is here just as much for compute as it is for gaming.

It isn't really a "workstation" unless it's Quadro or Firepro. If you need more than 8 gb of ram then chances are you're doing something that would benefit from real workstation gfx cards.
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-11
March 28, 2012 10:02:43 AM

iamtheking123Well they should have said "we wouldn't build a PC right now" rather than shoe-horning together old parts. Because, really, no one is building a new PC right now with IB coming out and 680 supply issues still being resolved.
They went with what was available almost 2 months ago. So, no, they didnt build a new PC "right now"...
Also, supply issues being resolved and is resolved are two different things. If you cant find the stupid card in stock to purchase, its not really much of an option, is it?
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5
March 28, 2012 10:06:15 AM

And in a few months, Haswell would be out, along with the follow-up to Kepler. You can't wait forever.

People aren't building new PCs right now? Really? You may not be, but I bet somebody out there spies a cheap SB quad as the basis for a very effective system.

This is a workstation build, hence the hexacore CPU and the 7970 which, let's face it, offers the best of both worlds with good performance in games and compute, thus meaning you can use it for either instead of spending even more on a compute card which may not necessarily perform better but wouldn't play games too well.
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8
March 28, 2012 10:14:25 AM

silverblue said:
And in a few months, Haswell would be out, along with the follow-up to Kepler. You can't wait forever.

People aren't building new PCs right now? Really? You may not be, but I bet somebody out there spies a cheap SB quad as the basis for a very effective system


I know I did just that and I coudnt be happier. Im especially glad I passed on building a new system last year right after they came out , you know, considering that whole pesky defective chipset ordeal and then Intel waiting to launch the Z68 until they made a lot of people choose between H67 and P67. Jumping on the latest and greatest isnt always the best choice. Or at least, some of us are willing to let others work out all the kinks before we take the plunge. ;P
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4
March 28, 2012 10:25:23 AM

iamtheking123It isn't really a "workstation" unless it's Quadro or Firepro. If you need more than 8 gb of ram then chances are you're doing something that would benefit from real workstation gfx cards.

Understood, however workstation cards are extraordinarily expensive.
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4
March 28, 2012 10:26:25 AM

Funny how everyone who is against LGA 2011 gets thumbs down.
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-6
March 28, 2012 10:30:13 AM

sublime2kFunny how everyone who is against LGA 2011 gets thumbs down.
Yes, it appears that the MAJORITY wanted it, so I guess it was the correct choice.
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6
March 28, 2012 10:34:38 AM

I agree the 7970 better option for anyone who does do some compute, folding etc... people need to get a grip on the GTX 680 hype / frenzy, lots of ppl seem to be swept up in a whirlwind of Nvidia marketing hype for a gimmicky card only (remember Kepler was supposed to be mind blowing) 10-15% faster in gaming if that.
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2
March 28, 2012 10:35:04 AM

Well after yesterday's disapointment this one is at least refreashing. I'd like to point out that at this price point you guys need to stop bitching about gtx 680 first because of its availability by the time this was written and more important because it virtually stands for no chance in produtivy against the 7970. Again it's about balancing a build that in this price range will never be a "exclusively for gaming machine". You must defenetly go for premium stuff, best processor, best motherboard, best cooling... regardless of the 30/50 dollar you pay for premium stuff...spending money on the looks is very advisable in this budget.

Personally i'd change a couple of things because although it isn't necessary i'd defently would like to see 2x7970 there.

For that i'd change the case (which is cool but very expensive).
I'd buy a agility 3 128gb ssd instead of that because i dont the point of going more than 120gb on ssd.
And i'd go for a diferent power supply. But thats just me...

Very good build overall, i really love that awesome looking beat of a cpu cooler...



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2
March 28, 2012 12:07:35 PM

sam_fisherAs Crashman said, this isn't a gaming orientated machine. It was said in the introduction that "Games account for 30% of our evaluation", which is why they put the SB-E processor in it. Putting more money into a better CPU would yield higher overall performance than putting in another 7970 would.
Clicking the "Read the comments in the Forums" link brings up the forum thread where edits and deletions can be made: I've deleted my response to the "mono" guy because it occurred to me that he's probably here to cause disruptions on behalf of a competing site.
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1
March 28, 2012 12:15:50 PM

CrashmanClicking the "Read the comments in the Forums" link brings up the forum thread where edits and deletions can be made: I've deleted my response to the "mono" guy because it occurred to me that he's probably here to cause disruptions on behalf of a competing site.


He was just trollin'... good build, Thomas!

I, too, would like to see twin 7970s (or 7950s if budget does not permit) next round. I think twin 680s would be trumped on the productivity suites although they'd have the gaming wins, OCed or not.
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2
March 28, 2012 12:30:08 PM

Corrections:

Produtivity
Beast
I don't see...
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-1
March 28, 2012 12:32:35 PM

productivity LOL
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-3
March 28, 2012 12:39:15 PM

They say the motherboard supports 3way graphics, so anybody know what that 4th PCIe lane is for?
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-1
March 28, 2012 12:41:17 PM

CrashmanFirst and formost, this isn't a gaming machine yet you refer to "Best Gaming CPUs for the Money". Second, even if someone wanted to call this a gaming machine they'd be left with the realization that 70% of the benchmarks are not games.Third, the decision to use a six-core SB-E was heavily influenced by the complaints of your fellow readers in the last high-end build, which lacked it. I could have easily picked either CrossFire (to boost around 30% of the benchmarks) or SB-E (for a bigger boost in fewer benchmarks) based on reader requests.So you're officially nominated to rebut any favorable reader comments concerning the use of an SB-E.


Thank you for taking the time to reply. I didn't mean to sound rude so don't be offended by my words. I was merely providing my opinion, just like any of the readers who requested SB-E last quarter. Please understand that I mostly use my system for gaming so, I tend to focus more on gaming performance. Also, I've been reading the SBM articles for about 3 years and the highest priced PC always had a complex graphics setup that allowed it to excel in games more than anything else. Again, I apologize if my words sounded rude, that was totally unintended.
Score
3
March 28, 2012 12:43:27 PM

I loved this build; absolutely loved it. If money were no object, it is the sort of system I'd build for myself. It is excessive for my current needs without being a power-sucking waste; no 1KW monstrosity just to play games or surf the web. The added capacity and high-end features make it wonderfully future-resistant as well. The case says "quality," not "toy." This is a professional's PC, that can also pwn n00bs on off hours.
If I win this one, my biggest problem will be to not get too much drool on it (especially during the build).

Very well done!
Score
7
March 28, 2012 1:02:03 PM

jtt283I loved this build; absolutely loved it. If money were no object, it is the sort of system I'd build for myself. It is excessive for my current needs without being a power-sucking waste; no 1KW monstrosity just to play games or surf the web. The added capacity and high-end features make it wonderfully future-resistant as well. The case says "quality," not "toy." This is a professional's PC, that can also pwn n00bs on off hours.If I win this one, my biggest problem will be to not get too much drool on it (especially during the build).Very well done!
Ah, finally someone who completely understands the mindset.
Score
5
March 28, 2012 1:12:16 PM

Best build of the series!!!!! I would love to have this machine :) 
Score
3
March 28, 2012 1:16:19 PM

Beautiful build, and I really like the case choice. Can you include the decibel chart in the article? How noisy was it compared to your last machine?
Score
2
March 28, 2012 1:39:14 PM

Onus said:
I loved this build; absolutely loved it. If money were no object, it is the sort of system I'd build for myself. It is excessive for my current needs without being a power-sucking waste; no 1KW monstrosity just to play games or surf the web. The added capacity and high-end features make it wonderfully future-resistant as well. The case says "quality," not "toy." This is a professional's PC, that can also pwn n00bs on off hours.
If I win this one, my biggest problem will be to not get too much drool on it (especially during the build).

Very well done!


Couldn't agree more! :bounce: 
Score
0
March 28, 2012 1:55:18 PM

Just wanted to say I also appreciate the build and the willingness to test out different configurations. I remember there was a lot of complaining about trying out an FX processor in the previous SBM, but it's that type of experimentation that makes SBM informative. It's a little sad that the 7970 was a weak OCer. The Zalman cooler is way sharper than Noctua, which seems to have some (well-earned) cult following.

A question about the benchmarks: Which would be most informative for performance in a monstrous Excel spreadsheet (I've heard Excel handles threads relatively well, though I don't know how many)? What about data analysis that does not use more than 4 threads (e.g., monte carlo simulations, other iterative statistical procedures)?

And if anyone happens to have a clue about how threaded LibreOffice Calc (the less-dysfunctional OpenOffice), that would be great :D  .
Score
1
March 28, 2012 2:03:50 PM

I wonder if Skyrim's results were included in the overall score? I don't think they should be, given the patch.

Nice build. Personally, I would have kept the 2600k, and cut back in a few other places (RAM) to get another 7970 in crossfire... I would wager that the gains from an extra 7970 would outweigh the losses of giving away two processing cores.

Still the 6-core monster is nice, and I do understand that this isn't just a gaming PC...
Score
1
March 28, 2012 2:33:53 PM

I really like this build. It is probably the most well balanced jack-of-all trades build I have seen on sbm in a long time.
Score
2
March 28, 2012 3:04:26 PM

Why did they have to use an ugly case? If it costs that much you dont want a plain black case, you want a window and some LED fans!
Score
-11
March 28, 2012 3:14:15 PM

Nice Article! Thanks Thomas :) 

Wrong OC'ing :( 
Wrong installation of the Intel RST Enterprise drivers :( 

I'm fine with all of the components except the HSF, but I 'get' the budget limitations. So it 'is' what it is. There are plenty of benchmarks and applications that do indeed benefit from the 6-core SB-E CPUs, so yep I like the i7-3930K.

This OC is ALL bad, don't do this OC! No wonder you don't like vCore's >1.38v and neither would I if I did (had to) that OC. Never, exceed 120% or (Medium/High or Optimized)! If you need to then raise the vCore +0.01v~+0.02v. If you want to disagree with me then simply know we agree to disagree. I don't publish my OC's other than end results (my SQL testing rig) -> http://valid.canardpc.com/show_oc.php?id=2261309 all with much lower LLC, Optimized, nothing >120%, all Enabled power savings, etc and rock solid.

Intel RST Enterprise to properly work the driver must be installed (F6) during the install process of Windows, otherwise the MBR will become corrupt. An easy test is to change the SATA -> RAID and the resulting boot BSOD will make it apparent you did it wrong. Doing it correctly AND using the latest Intel drivers from Intel's site significantly improves performance. Thereby all benches having anything to do with SSD performance are indeed hampered. The fix (re-install the OS)-> http://www.tomshardware.com/forum/303873-30-wont-resume...

Don't use:
Score
0
March 28, 2012 3:15:14 PM

if i were spending $2600 on a rig, i would definitely have gotten 7970 cfx or 680 sli
a single 7970 is underpowered in a $2600 rig imho
but then again, i don't do any video editing or anything that will benefit from hyperthreading, all i'm interested is gaming
Score
-5
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