Flash Compensation

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I recently obtained my first camera with this feature. When should I
apply flash compensation? Should it be applied when shooting a portrait,
a large room, or doing fill flash? Any feedback would be appreciated.




Cody,

Delight thyself also in the LORD; and he shall give thee the desires of
thine heart. Psalms 37:4

http://community-2.webtv.net/AnOvercomer02/PhotographyLinks
 
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"AnOvercomer 02" <AnOvercomer02@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:20841-4259BE5F-62@storefull-3155.bay.webtv.net...
>
> I recently obtained my first camera with this feature. When should I
> apply flash compensation? Should it be applied when shooting a portrait,
> a large room, or doing fill flash? Any feedback would be appreciated.

I'd use it if the histogram kept showing results shifted too far R or L.
Check your LCD moniter often
 
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Flash compensation is very useful when taking photographs of people
outdoors.

1) In the shade. Fill flash at -1.0 EV fills in the shadows and
brightens up the colors while keeping a natural look.

2) In the sun with the sun behind the subject. -.5 EV or -1.0 EV
usually work well.

Experiment with the flash. Take some photos outdoors of people with 1)
no flash 2) with flash but no compensation 3) with flash AND
compensation. You will quickly see the difference and appreciate what
fill flash can do to improve your pictures.
 
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roy

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"AnOvercomer 02" <AnOvercomer02@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:20841-4259BE5F-62@storefull-3155.bay.webtv.net...
>
> I recently obtained my first camera with this feature. When should I
> apply flash compensation? Should it be applied when shooting a portrait,
> a large room, or doing fill flash? Any feedback would be appreciated.
>
>
>
>
> Cody,
>
> Delight thyself also in the LORD; and he shall give thee the desires of
> thine heart. Psalms 37:4
>
> http://community-2.webtv.net/AnOvercomer02/PhotographyLinks
>

You use it when YOU want the flash to put out less light than it would, if
left set to Auto.

You need to know what sort of result you are envisaging, before you use it.

I know this is not a lot of help. BUT

If you have already been doing a lot of flash photography, you might already
have been taking steps to reduce Flash output. If you have not done enough
Flash work to know that you will need it, then don't bother with it, until
you suddenly discover that you do need it.

Roy G
 
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"[BnH]" <b18[at]ii[dot]net> wrote in message
news:4259f267$0$30535$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
> err .. what if the OP do not use digital camera ? :)
>
> =bob=
>
then he would be in the wrong group as this is rec.photo.DIGITAL ;)
 
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[BnH] wrote:
>err .. what if the OP do not use digital
> camera ? :)
>=bob=

(erics) wrote:
>then he would be in the wrong group as
> this is rec.photo.DIGITAL ;)

I am using a film SLR. I crossposted this post because I think that
flash compensation applies to digital and anolog cameras and because it
is a little slow around RPE35 these days.



Cody,

http://community-2.webtv.net/AnOvercomer02/PhotographyLinks
 
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AnOvercomer 02 wrote:
> I recently obtained my first camera with this feature. When should I
> apply flash compensation? Should it be applied when shooting a portrait,
> a large room, or doing fill flash? Any feedback would be appreciated.

Simply put, the TTL flash meter is fooled the same way your TTL
available light meter is fooled. Subjects that are light return more
light fooling your system into under expsosure; subjects that are dark
fool your system into over exposure. So for a very light colored
subject, set the flash comp higher; dark subject, set it lower.

If you're using it outdoor as a fill flash, then experiment at -1 to -2.

Cheers,
Alan


--
-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
-- slr-systems FAQ project: http://tinyurl.com/6m9aw
-- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
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OP did post to rec.photo.equipment.35mm =)

=bob=

"erics" <eric_NewsGrps@SpaMthe-stannards.co.ukTraP> wrote in message
news:425a0df9$0$295$cc9e4d1f@news-text.dial.pipex.com...
>
> "[BnH]" <b18[at]ii[dot]net> wrote in message
> news:4259f267$0$30535$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
>> err .. what if the OP do not use digital camera ? :)
>>
>> =bob=
>>
> then he would be in the wrong group as this is rec.photo.DIGITAL ;)
>
 
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"[BnH]" <b18@nsw.gov.au> wrote in message
news:xtq6e.7326$5F3.3837@news-server.bigpond.net.au...
> OP did post to rec.photo.equipment.35mm =)
>

so he either uses film and digital and the comment was applicable to one of
his choices, or he has incorrectly cross-posted to one of the groups.
 
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erics wrote:

> so he either uses film and digital and the comment was applicable to
> one of his choices, or he has incorrectly cross-posted to one of the
> groups.

Film cameras typically measure the flash light reflecting off of the
film during exposure (TTL-OTF).

Digital cameras typically pre-flash and measure the light using the
viewfinder meter (some film cameras do this as well). It appears that
the OTF method does not work with digital.

Given the differences above, what works for film might behave
differently with digital. At least with digital you can peek.

As to the x-posting, fine by me this case.

Cheers,
Alan

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On 11 Apr 2005 05:32:19 -0700, "Bill Doyle" <pitchinvasion@attbi.com>
wrote:

>I found the following article from Popular Photography to be the best
>reference on fill flash/exposure comp that I have read.
>
>http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/821200311318.pdf

Interesting link, thanks. A quick hack on google (gave up on their own
index) also uncovered these that may be of interest:

Mat Cutting How To:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/PP1104_MatHowTo.pdf

One Light, 10 Different Looks:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/PP1204_10differentlooks.pdf

Five Advanced Flash Techniques:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/PP1004_FlashTechniques.pdf

FX Feature: Filters:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/PP1104_FXFEATURE.pdf

Perfect Portrait Exposure:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/52020031417.pdf

Portraits Made Easy:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/6162003153239.pdf

The Proof Is In The Prints: Is Your Lab Using Digital?:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/7222003124559.pdf

Assignment: Still Life:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/316200415359.pdf

Assignment: Nude:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/3162004153348.pdf

Assignment: Landscape:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/3162004153417.pdf

Assignment: Portrait:
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/3162004153441.pdf

Wheel Your Way To Vibrant Color
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/5202003131315.pdf

Adobe Photoshop Cheat Sheet (Bit basic):
http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/PP0205_CheatSheet.pdf

Now, someone buy me a beer.

--
Owamanga!
http://www.pbase.com/owamanga
 
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More when you are doing portrait work. I normally - 0.5 EV ... but the
result varies with make ups, skin color etc.

For large room , weddings etc .. you might want to use bounce flash.

=bob=

"AnOvercomer 02" <AnOvercomer02@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:20841-4259BE5F-62@storefull-3155.bay.webtv.net...
>
> I recently obtained my first camera with this feature. When should I
> apply flash compensation? Should it be applied when shooting a portrait,
> a large room, or doing fill flash? Any feedback would be appreciated.
 
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"[BnH]" <b18[at]ii[dot]net> wrote in message
news:4259f2ba$0$30513$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
> More when you are doing portrait work. I normally - 0.5 EV ... but the
> result varies with make ups, skin color etc.
>
> For large room , weddings etc .. you might want to use bounce flash.
>
> =bob=
>
> "AnOvercomer 02" <AnOvercomer02@webtv.net> wrote in message
> news:20841-4259BE5F-62@storefull-3155.bay.webtv.net...
>>
>> I recently obtained my first camera with this feature. When should I
>> apply flash compensation? Should it be applied when shooting a portrait,
>> a large room, or doing fill flash? Any feedback would be appreciated.
>


From what the OP said, I suspect that it was an Built In Flash.

I am not too aware of any of them which have Bounce Facilities, or even
sufficient Power to be used to Bounce.

If someone is doing Flash Portraits then they should be using something
other than an On Camera Flash, or at the very least doing something to
modify the "Shape" of the Flash Lighting.

Roy G
 
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Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreeLunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

>Digital cameras typically pre-flash and measure the light using the
>viewfinder meter (some film cameras do this as well). It appears that
>the OTF method does not work with digital.

It's funny that. You'd think they could pop in a few direct
pixel outputs to a real-time averaging circuit to make a nice
on-the-fly system. Pre-flash can sometimes be a hassle,
including reducing overall flash power. Does preflash still
apply for the dSLRs? (Can't say as I've noticed it, but perhaps
it's extremely quick).

--
Ken Tough
 
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Ken Tough wrote:

> Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreeLunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>
>>Digital cameras typically pre-flash and measure the light using the
>>viewfinder meter (some film cameras do this as well). It appears that
>>the OTF method does not work with digital.
>
>
> It's funny that. You'd think they could pop in a few direct
> pixel outputs to a real-time averaging circuit to make a nice
> on-the-fly system. Pre-flash can sometimes be a hassle,
> including reducing overall flash power. Does preflash still
> apply for the dSLRs? (Can't say as I've noticed it, but perhaps
> it's extremely quick).

CCD is a 'charge up' device. You can't read them while they're
charging. (I'm not sure about CMOS). They could have just put in a
couple dozen pixels dedicated to TTL flash metering, but the read design
of the chip probably precludes single pixel reads.

I was thinking that a simple way would simply be to have little
reflectors in between the pixels on the CCD/CMOS to reflect light out to
the classic OTF TTL detectors. However the glass over the sensor would
probably prevent this from working well and would result in light spill.
Kabosh that idea.

There is nothing wrong with the pre-flash other than integration with
slaves is difficult (There are slaves that will fire on the 2nd (or nth)
flash in a series).

I'm not sure how much energy is lost on the preflash pop. Not much I
would guess, eg: if they use 1/32 for the pre-flash, that much missing
energy would not be noticeable when shooting at 1/1, and at other levels
there would be plenty of power in reserve.

Cheers,
Alan

--
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-- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
-- slr-systems FAQ project: http://tinyurl.com/6m9aw
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In rec.photo.equipment.35mm erics <eric_NewsGrps@spamthe-stannards.co.uktrap> wrote:
>
> "[BnH]" <b18[at]ii[dot]net> wrote in message
> news:4259f267$0$30535$5a62ac22@per-qv1-newsreader-01.iinet.net.au...
> > err .. what if the OP do not use digital camera ? :)
> >
> > =bob=
> >
> then he would be in the wrong group as this is rec.photo.DIGITAL ;)
>

well no, this is rec.photo.equipment.35mm :p

--
Sander

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Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreeLunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

>CCD is a 'charge up' device. You can't read them while they're
>charging. (I'm not sure about CMOS). They could have just put in a
>couple dozen pixels dedicated to TTL flash metering, but the read design
>of the chip probably precludes single pixel reads.

Yeah, probably way too much more complicated for what it's worth.

>I'm not sure how much energy is lost on the preflash pop. Not much I
>would guess, eg: if they use 1/32 for the pre-flash, that much missing
>energy would not be noticeable when shooting at 1/1, and at other levels
>there would be plenty of power in reserve.

So they sortof 'scale up' the reading for a proper exposure I guess.
Would be sensible. Now it begs the question; does 'charge up' and
'read out' of the pre-flash noticably extend the shutter lag on
flash shots?
--
Ken Tough
 
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Ken Tough wrote:

> So they sortof 'scale up' the reading for a proper exposure I guess.

Sure. The sensitivity of the metering system is high enough to detect a
return at fairly low level. Further, of course, the lens is wide open
at that time.

> Would be sensible. Now it begs the question; does 'charge up' and
> 'read out' of the pre-flash noticably extend the shutter lag on
> flash shots?

It must. There is a noticeable double flash when it goes off (on my
camera, IAC). I see the first flash via the VF, and at best the camera
does 100 msec shutter delay (Max 7D). So all of that is in the sequence.

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-- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
-- slr-systems FAQ project: http://tinyurl.com/6m9aw
-- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
-- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch.
 
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AnOvercomer 02 wrote:
>
> I recently obtained my first camera with this feature. When should I
> apply flash compensation? Should it be applied when shooting a portrait,
> a large room, or doing fill flash? Any feedback would be appreciated.
>

The flippant, but fundamentally true, response would be "when you have
too much flash". Whenever you're shooting with mixed flash and other
light, you're balancing the amount of flash versus ambient light. With
modern electronic SLR's and fancy computer flashes, this is done
automatically for you. But you may not agree with how the automation
does the adjustment. And that's when you would use the FEC to correct
the automation.

I find that whenever there is significant ambient light of reasonable
color balance, I seldom shoot without reducing the amount of flash to
give more emphasis to the ambient light. My "normal" setting for FEC is
-1/3 to -2/3 stop , the setting that I leave my cameras set to.

You've been given a number of concrete examples, but ultimately, your
guide is your slides/prints/LCD.

Lisa
 
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On Mon, 11 Apr 2005 13:17:20 GMT, Owamanga
<owamanga(not-this-bit)@hotmail.com> wrote:

> Now, someone buy me a beer.

Not now. You've had enough to drink. :)
 
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On Mon, 11 Apr 2005 13:17:20 GMT
In message <vetk51hd371b63s0t0gcm0vh0u77idafur@4ax.com>
Owamanga <owamanga(not-this-bit)@hotmail.com> wrote:

> >http://www.popphoto.com/assets/download/821200311318.pdf
>
> Interesting link, thanks. A quick hack on google (gave up on their own
> index) also uncovered these that may be of interest:
>
> <SNIP informative PDF links>

PopPhoto.com's HOW TO index of online articles:
http://www.popphoto.com/default.asp?section_id=4

If that link breaks, click on "HOW TO" on the home page:
http://www.popphoto.com

Jeff
 
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