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Bloody Jessops UK

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April 22, 2005 10:38:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

What a shower of arseholes!

THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different stores -
each one sold as brand new & unused.

Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53 and
112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered to
remove the battery!

Well, this latest one goes back in the morning, and then a fax to head
office pointing out that this sort of behaviour results in share price
dives, such as the one recently experienced by Jessops.

I know I'll never trust them again - I suppose this results from their 30
day satisfaction guarantee which means loads of used cameras needing to be
passed on to unsuspecting customers.

More about : bloody jessops

April 22, 2005 10:38:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
> What a shower of arseholes!
>
> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
stores -
> each one sold as brand new & unused.
>
> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
and
> 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered to
> remove the battery!
How do you know that these shots were not taken at the factory for test
purposes?
Jim
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 10:38:40 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Parker wrote:


> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different stores -
> each one sold as brand new & unused.
>
> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53 and
> 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered to
> remove the battery!

Just curious... What brand/models of DSLR camera ?
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Anonymous
April 22, 2005 10:38:41 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Jim" <j.n@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:1Iaae.1114$yd7.27@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com...
>
> "Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
> news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
>> What a shower of arseholes!
>>
>> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
> stores -
>> each one sold as brand new & unused.
>>
>> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
> and
>> 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered to
>> remove the battery!
> How do you know that these shots were not taken at the factory for test
> purposes?
> Jim
>
>

and leave the battery in, I think not.

reminds me of a friend who bought a new DVD player. The box had glued flaps
yet there was a DVD in the drive and the handset had the batteries installed
and did not return it................
April 22, 2005 10:38:41 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Hi, did you use the same CF card and did it contain images. If the CF card
contains images captured with the camera previously, the file number will
start at the highest number in that card. I don't know if this information
is of any use.

John

"Jim" <j.n@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:1Iaae.1114$yd7.27@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com...
>
> "Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
> news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
>> What a shower of arseholes!
>>
>> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
> stores -
>> each one sold as brand new & unused.
>>
>> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
> and
>> 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered to
>> remove the battery!
> How do you know that these shots were not taken at the factory for test
> purposes?
> Jim
>
>
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 10:38:42 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"John" <john59098@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:p 6bae.718$5A3.259@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...
> Hi, did you use the same CF card and did it contain images. If the CF card
> contains images captured with the camera previously, the file number will
> start at the highest number in that card. I don't know if this information
> is of any use.
>
> John
>
> "Jim" <j.n@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:1Iaae.1114$yd7.27@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com...
>>
>> "Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
>> news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
>>> What a shower of arseholes!
>>>
>>> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
>> stores -
>>> each one sold as brand new & unused.
>>>
>>> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
>> and
>>> 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered to
>>> remove the battery!
>> How do you know that these shots were not taken at the factory for test
>> purposes?
>> Jim
>>
>>
>
>

Maybe worth trying to recover the images off the CF card using a recover
prog, you never know..
Canon reset all cameras before leaving the site so the counter will start
from 1 so I am told.

Jessops do use new stock to demo as well, well they did when I went in to
try a camera before buying. I then bought it from a independant because of
the terrable service Jessops offered and I took a dislike to the patronising
member of staff I had to deal with at the time. I told the manager I was
taking my £2k elsewhere he tryed hard to get my money but it was to late.

Argos has been done for selling as new when it was realy returned stock.

The UK SpeedTrap Guide" @ www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk
The UK Weather Guide" @ www.ukstorms.com
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 10:42:21 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
> What a shower of arseholes!
>
> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
stores -
> each one sold as brand new & unused.
>
> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
and
> 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered to
> remove the battery!
>
> Well, this latest one goes back in the morning, and then a fax to head
> office pointing out that this sort of behaviour results in share price
> dives, such as the one recently experienced by Jessops.
>
> I know I'll never trust them again - I suppose this results from their 30
> day satisfaction guarantee which means loads of used cameras needing to be
> passed on to unsuspecting customers.
>
>
If you can prove it, then get onto trading standards. This is illegal.
April 22, 2005 11:27:08 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains (More info?)

"John" <john59098@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:p 6bae.718$5A3.259@newsfe4-win.ntli.net...
> Hi, did you use the same CF card and did it contain images. If the CF card
> contains images captured with the camera previously, the file number will
> start at the highest number in that card. I don't know if this information
> is of any use.
>
> John
>
> "Jim" <j.n@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:1Iaae.1114$yd7.27@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com...
>>
>> "Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
>> news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
>>> What a shower of arseholes!
>>>
>>> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
>> stores -
>>> each one sold as brand new & unused.
>>>
>>> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
>> and
>>> 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered to
>>> remove the battery!
>> How do you know that these shots were not taken at the factory for test
>> purposes?
>> Jim


-----------------


No, the flash card was clear (and, in any case, if it was counting the other
camera it would have registered 3,000 +)

I did wonder about factory test shots - but 53, 88 and 112 respectively?!

Plus on all three cameras the language menu was set, various options were
not at default values, and on the first two the time and date had been set)

These must be demo models. The point is that, after the first one, I
specifically asked if the other two were brand spanking new, and was told
'yes - they've only just come into stock'

So you can imagine that I was a bit surprised to get home and discover a
sticker on one of the boxes for the £600 off accessories' promotion that
expired on 31/1304!.....

I tried another store for this last one, explained what had happened, and
was assured that 'this' one was bran new and unused.

Then I get home and find that the battery is in-situ, the language menu is
set, various menu items are not at default, and that the exif data showed 88
prior shots to the first one I took,

I know that it's almost fashionable to knock Jessops - but in this case they
really have been sharp buggers.
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 11:32:21 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

check the camera in the shop with the sales folk present then....
"Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
> What a shower of arseholes!
>
> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
> stores - each one sold as brand new & unused.
>
> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
> and 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered
> to remove the battery!
>
> Well, this latest one goes back in the morning, and then a fax to head
> office pointing out that this sort of behaviour results in share price
> dives, such as the one recently experienced by Jessops.
>
> I know I'll never trust them again - I suppose this results from their 30
> day satisfaction guarantee which means loads of used cameras needing to be
> passed on to unsuspecting customers.
>
April 22, 2005 11:34:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"MrJolly" <mrjollyhappymanNOSPAM@hotmail.co.uk> wrote in message
news:u-6cnT5Gs6So3vTfSa8jmA@karoo.co.uk...
> check the camera in the shop with the sales folk present then....


I made the mistake of assuming that Jessops were reputable traders who were
above this sort of deceit.

Plus, I could only get into the store shortly before closing, so I had no
time to check it (not that I should have to!!)
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 11:56:24 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

MrJolly wrote:
>
> check the camera in the shop with the sales folk present then....

Obviously you're only able to check content after having paid the item.
Then you check and find that it has been 'previously used'. No discussion,
it's there for all to see. Naturally you demand an alternative package,
but then the shop comes back with "Sorry Sir, this was the last one in stock"
Then what do you do?
Anonymous
April 22, 2005 11:57:14 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Parker" emitted :

>What a shower of arseholes!
>
>THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different stores -
>each one sold as brand new & unused.
>
>Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53 and
>112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered to
>remove the battery!
>
>Well, this latest one goes back in the morning, and then a fax to head
>office pointing out that this sort of behaviour results in share price
>dives, such as the one recently experienced by Jessops.
>
>I know I'll never trust them again - I suppose this results from their 30
>day satisfaction guarantee which means loads of used cameras needing to be
>passed on to unsuspecting customers.
>

Sorry to hear that. If I have to buy anything from them, I will bear
this in mind...


--
S i g n a l @ l i n e o n e . n e t
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 12:13:50 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 18:42:21 +0100, "w.g.s.hamm"
<fenlandfowlREMOVETHIS@talktalk.net> wrote:


> If you can prove it, then get onto trading standards. This is illegal.
And just what do you expect these stores to do with items that nice
customers " borrow" then return making some flimsy excuse for
returning the item throw them in the blasted river or something .
It is no use moaning after the event if I go to buy something it is
inspected before I leave the counter if the box or whatever gives the
slightest hint of it ever being opened before I got my hands on it
then I ask for a swap or money back . I want NEW goods not goods that
others have had their grubby hands on but if anyone walks out of a
store without first checking then they deserve all they get .
April 23, 2005 12:17:29 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

dexter@blueyonder.co.uk wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 18:42:21 +0100, "w.g.s.hamm"
> <fenlandfowlREMOVETHIS@talktalk.net> wrote:
>
>
>> If you can prove it, then get onto trading standards. This is
>> illegal.
> And just what do you expect these stores to do with items that nice
> customers " borrow" then return making some flimsy excuse for
> returning the item throw them in the blasted river or something .

It is illegal to sell used goods as new. If a company operates a no
'questions asked' refund policy, the onus is on them to support it.

> It is no use moaning after the event if I go to buy something it is
> inspected before I leave the counter if the box or whatever gives the
> slightest hint of it ever being opened before I got my hands on it
> then I ask for a swap or money back .

Ever heard of shrink wrap resealing?

> I want NEW goods not goods that
> others have had their grubby hands on but if anyone walks out of a
> store without first checking then they deserve all they get .

Absolute rubbish - do you expect 2nd hands goods in *every* store you visit?
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 12:21:03 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
> What a shower of arseholes!
>
> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
> stores - each one sold as brand new & unused.
>
> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
> and 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered
> to remove the battery!
>
> Well, this latest one goes back in the morning, and then a fax to head
> office pointing out that this sort of behaviour results in share price
> dives, such as the one recently experienced by Jessops.
>
> I know I'll never trust them again - I suppose this results from their 30
> day satisfaction guarantee which means loads of used cameras needing to be
> passed on to unsuspecting customers.
>

Seems to me that, when peeps nip in and have a look at a camera - to see how
it works etc, they pt batteries in and take a few shots. Then, not
unreasonably, the sell this camera.

You may call it a display model, but really it's a new camera, just had a
few demo pics taken.

Graybags
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 12:30:26 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

dexter@blueyonder.co.uk wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 18:42:21 +0100, "w.g.s.hamm"
> <fenlandfowlREMOVETHIS@talktalk.net> wrote:
>
>
> > If you can prove it, then get onto trading standards. This is
> > illegal.
> And just what do you expect these stores to do with items that nice
> customers " borrow" then return making some flimsy excuse for
> returning the item throw them in the blasted river or something .
> It is no use moaning after the event if I go to buy something it is
> inspected before I leave the counter if the box or whatever gives the
> slightest hint of it ever being opened before I got my hands on it
> then I ask for a swap or money back . I want NEW goods not goods that
> others have had their grubby hands on but if anyone walks out of a
> store without first checking then they deserve all they get .

Are you really that stupid? Do you really not see that even if it didn't
show a complete lack of knowledge of the law or standard retail practice
your argument is both flawed an floored.

You asked a rhetorical question. Perhaps if you stick a "?" on the end and
keep the rest of your blog to yourself you may get educated.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 1:26:33 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Parker wrote:

> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for
> between 53 and 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods
> hadn't even bothered to remove the battery!

Which Exif field is that information in, and how do you access it?

--
Chris Game

Artificial Intelligence usually beats real stupidity.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 1:26:34 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

I was checking out a 1DsII in a store the other day, and the salesman
was a little puzzled that there was no battery in the camera. Then he
remembered - it's store policy not to let people power up and play with
the pro cameras as the people buying them are more likely to check
things like the shutter release count.

So technically that demo model could still end up in a box and be sold
as new.

On a slightly different note, once I purchased a mobile (cell) phone,
and discovered that everything had already been opened, and the
warranty card had been filled out! Even though I was back within 15
minutes of purchase the people at the store seemed very unhappy that I
wanted an exchange. I don't think the serial number of the phone
matched the box so it probably wasn't 100% legal anyway. I got my
exchange but they made me sign a waiver that I had received the goods
in an acceptable condition. I checked veeerrryyy carefully before
signing that!
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 1:28:18 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Graybags wrote:

> You may call it a display model, but really it's a new camera,
> just had a few demo pics taken.

And if it can't handle that without falling to pieces, it's not much
of a camera!

--
Chris Game

To iterate is human; to recurse, divine.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 1:33:32 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <u-6cnT5Gs6So3vTfSa8jmA@karoo.co.uk>, MrJolly
<mrjollyhappymanNOSPAM@hotmail.co.uk> writes
>check the camera in the shop with the sales folk present then....

If I was the retailer I certainly wouldn't let a customer unseal and
check out a brand new product until they'd paid for it in full, at which
point it doesn't much matter whether they check it whilst still in the
shop or an hour later at home.
--
Toby
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 1:33:32 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <3ct15uF6p5tipU1@individual.net>, Graybags <gbas@lineone.net>
writes
>Seems to me that, when peeps nip in and have a look at a camera - to see how
>it works etc, they pt batteries in and take a few shots. Then, not
>unreasonably, the sell this camera.
>
>You may call it a display model, but really it's a new camera, just had a
>few demo pics taken.

Depends on what you mean by new. Let's take two examples.

When you buy clothes in a store, it's very possible that someone else
has previously tried them on, yet they are still sold as new and no-one
seems to question this.

When you buy a new car, if you take delivery only to find that it was
used as a demonstrator and loads of people took it for test drives then
you'd rightly be back on the dealer's door step in a flash and would
have a cast iron case in court.

Of these two extremes, I'm thinking your camera scenario is closer to
the latter than the former.
--
Toby
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 1:36:56 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 20:17:29 +0100, " cupra"
<NOcupra.sSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:


>Absolute rubbish - do you expect 2nd hands goods in *every* store you visit?
I have been very untrusting of everything and everyone in this life
for some years now and being this way has done me nothing but GOOD.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 1:43:22 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 20:21:03 +0100, "Graybags" <gbas@lineone.net>
wrote:


>Seems to me that, when peeps nip in and have a look at a camera - to see how
>it works etc, they pt batteries in and take a few shots. Then, not
>unreasonably, the sell this camera.
If YOU want to buy secondhand goods you buy them I don't one thing I
have always wanted and will never have is a new car and it isn't money
that is preventing me from getting one its the thoughts of one of the
wankers you see at Motorway slip roads waving trade plates around
having their hands on" my" car that prevents me.
>You may call it a display model, but really it's a new camera, just had a
>few demo pics taken.
If it has been USED it just CANNOT be new CAN IT .
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 1:52:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

dexter@blueyonder.co.uk wrote:
> On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 20:17:29 +0100, " cupra"
> <NOcupra.sSPAM@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>> Absolute rubbish - do you expect 2nd hands goods in *every* store
>> you visit?
> I have been very untrusting of everything and everyone in this life
> for some years now and being this way has done me nothing but GOOD.

"And yes, I'm perfectly happy sitting here alone in my bedsit thank you!"

;) 

Si
April 23, 2005 3:19:17 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Chris Game" <chrisgame@example.net> wrote in message
news:vobm3ydme9m$.dlg@example.net...
> Parker wrote:
>
>> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for
>> between 53 and 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods
>> hadn't even bothered to remove the battery!
>
> Which Exif field is that information in, and how do you access it?

--

Use the freeware exif reader Opanda iexif www.opanda.com which reads a
great number of fields - including total number of shots (at least, it does
for Nikon - and also reads Nikons 'hidden' iso values)

It's a handy tool - especially in situations like this - Jessops had reset
the folder values so the images were starting 00001 - but the exif data
(which is accurate because I've checked total number of shots on another
camera) says that there were 88 preceding images taken.

The point is, Jessops lied, and they lied even after I had returned two
other cameras to another store because of the same issue and even after I
had explained the matter to the new store!

I don't know what's wrong with them! - they could have said that they only
had an ex-demo, but chose to tell me that it had only come into stock a
couple of days ago and had never been used. Obviously they were telling
porkies - but why?, is a customer return because of back or front
focussing?, or some other problem?

Bottom line - when I pay a lot of money for a new camera, I want a new
camera - not one with a dubious history.

Ah well - I'll have to let it lie until I can kick up a stink at their head
office on Monday.

Hope the exif reader proves useful to you.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 4:02:36 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Parker wrote:

>> Which Exif field is that information in, and how do you access
>> it?
>
> Use the freeware exif reader Opanda iexif www.opanda.com
> which reads a great number of fields - including total number of
> shots (at least, it does for Nikon - and also reads Nikons
> 'hidden' iso values)

Thanks for the reference!


--
Chris Game

"A little inaccuracy sometimes saves tons of explanation."
-- H. H. Munro (Saki)
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 4:30:26 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Toby Groves" <news@iconia.org.uk> wrote in message
news:TD1nZXAyyWaCFwBp@iconia.org.uk...
> In article <3ct15uF6p5tipU1@individual.net>, Graybags <gbas@lineone.net>
> writes
>>Seems to me that, when peeps nip in and have a look at a camera - to see
>>how
>>it works etc, they pt batteries in and take a few shots. Then, not
>>unreasonably, the sell this camera.
>>
>>You may call it a display model, but really it's a new camera, just had a
>>few demo pics taken.
>
> Depends on what you mean by new. Let's take two examples.
>
> When you buy clothes in a store, it's very possible that someone else has
> previously tried them on, yet they are still sold as new and no-one seems
> to question this.
>
> When you buy a new car, if you take delivery only to find that it was used
> as a demonstrator and loads of people took it for test drives then you'd
> rightly be back on the dealer's door step in a flash and would have a cast
> iron case in court.
>
> Of these two extremes, I'm thinking your camera scenario is closer to the
> latter than the former.

One that's taken 50 pics - that's like a car with 20 miles on the clock.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 5:14:21 AM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Toby Groves" <news@iconia.org.uk> wrote in message
news:JTZhdIADvWaCFwiq@iconia.org.uk...
> In article <u-6cnT5Gs6So3vTfSa8jmA@karoo.co.uk>, MrJolly
> <mrjollyhappymanNOSPAM@hotmail.co.uk> writes
>>check the camera in the shop with the sales folk present then....
>
> If I was the retailer I certainly wouldn't let a customer unseal and check
> out a brand new product until they'd paid for it in full, at which point
> it doesn't much matter whether they check it whilst still in the shop or
> an hour later at home.
> --
> Toby

Indeed - Watford Electronics wouldnt even unseal a box of £9.99 pc speakers
to see if the second speaker was fixed or on a plug (i wanted one that I
could extend). Naturally they lost the sale but it was there perogative to
keep the box sealed until it was bought.

Ad
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 12:58:52 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Parker wrote:
> What a shower of arseholes!
>
> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
> stores - each one sold as brand new & unused.
>
> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between
> 53 and 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even
> bothered to remove the battery!
>
> Well, this latest one goes back in the morning, and then a fax to head
> office pointing out that this sort of behaviour results in share price
> dives, such as the one recently experienced by Jessops.
>
> I know I'll never trust them again - I suppose this results from
> their 30 day satisfaction guarantee which means loads of used cameras
> needing to be passed on to unsuspecting customers.

I am disappointed to hear of your problems. Your experience does not
reflect my own of Jessops in Edinburgh, where the staff carefully check
the contents of boxes, and are quite open about selling models which have
been demonstrated to other customers. I have also visited the central
Leicester branch and found the staff helpful and informative.

Personally, providing the camera is still in pristine condition, with a
full warranty, the fact that someone other than me had taken a few photos
with the camera to prove that it worked OK would probably outweigh my
disappointment on getting a camera home and finding that it was faulty and
had to be taken back. Apart from a few shots, were the goods otherwise in
"as new" condition?

However, you should certainly have been informed that you were buying a
shop-demonstrator model (or whatever). What part of the country was this?
Perhaps the staff in the Jessops you visited are not as well motivated as
those I have met.

Cheers,
David
April 23, 2005 1:43:41 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Chris Game" <chrisgame@example.net> wrote in message
news:rgpafc0oj6ui.dlg@example.net...
> Parker wrote:
>
>>> Which Exif field is that information in, and how do you access
>>> it?
>>
>> Use the freeware exif reader Opanda iexif www.opanda.com
>> which reads a great number of fields - including total number of
>> shots (at least, it does for Nikon - and also reads Nikons
>> 'hidden' iso values)
>
> Thanks for the reference!
>
>
> --
> Chris Game
>
> "A little inaccuracy sometimes saves tons of explanation."
> -- H. H. Munro (Saki)

I bought a Canon D300 from jessops a month or so ago and when I got home and
had a look in the box there was only the battery grip and charger in there
along with the manuals and cdroms etc. The really annoying thing was when I
went back to complain one of the sales people had a right laugh, I didn't
see the funny side of it to be honest. I nearly had an heart attack when I
saw the body and lenses were missing.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 2:07:27 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

> One that's taken 50 pics - that's like a car with 20 miles on the clock.

That is also possibly feasible to believe given that the engine has to be
factory tuned and tested then driven out of the assembly line to the factory
forecourt then driven again onto a delivery lorry and then off at the other
end or indeed driven directly from the factory to a dealership.

Steve
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 2:31:47 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

> If you can prove it, then get onto trading standards. This is illegal.

Trouble is, will Trading Standards be interested. I've had similar
experiences myself and all TS do is tell you to take the goods back. If
trading Standards had any real teeth then Jessops and a good many other
retailers would not dream of behaving in this way in the first place. Well
done to the OP for not putting up with it and posting his experiences here.
I dare say that their 30 day money back promise has a large part to play in
this, but that is their problem, no one else's.I think it's a shame as I've
had good service from Jessops in the past. I would hope that the OP's
complaint to their HO has a real effect, otherwise Jessops will degrade into
something like Dixons

John D
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 2:38:53 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Mad Ad wrote:
>
> Naturally they lost the sale but it was there perogative to
> keep the box sealed until it was bought.
>
> Ad

This is understandable; how would they sell a box that had been unsealed?

You should check that any seal is the manufacturer's seal and that the box
hasn't been re-sealed. But beware, some shops have their own shrink wrap
machines.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 2:49:45 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
> What a shower of arseholes!
>
> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
> stores - each one sold as brand new & unused.
>
> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
> and 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered
> to remove the battery!
>
> Well, this latest one goes back in the morning, and then a fax to head
> office pointing out that this sort of behaviour results in share price
> dives, such as the one recently experienced by Jessops.
>
> I know I'll never trust them again - I suppose this results from their 30
> day satisfaction guarantee which means loads of used cameras needing to be
> passed on to unsuspecting customers.

Personally i think you are over reacting. 53-112 shots is nothing and at
least proves the camera has worked when it has either been shown to another
potential customer or for all you know tested by Jessop staff.

I have always found Jessop staff and indeed Jessops service to be 100%.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 2:51:46 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Time Teamer" <btc@yobtinternet.com> wrote in message
news:D 4be26$o13$1@nwrdmz01.dmz.ncs.ea.ibs-infra.bt.com...
>
> "Jim" <j.n@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:1Iaae.1114$yd7.27@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com...
>>
>> "Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
>> news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
>>> What a shower of arseholes!
>>>
>>> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
>> stores -
>>> each one sold as brand new & unused.
>>>
>>> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
>> and
>>> 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered to
>>> remove the battery!
>> How do you know that these shots were not taken at the factory for test
>> purposes?
>> Jim
>>
>>
>
> and leave the battery in, I think not.
>

There was a battery in my camera when baught new. So it does happen, Minolta
7D.



> reminds me of a friend who bought a new DVD player. The box had glued
> flaps yet there was a DVD in the drive and the handset had the batteries
> installed and did not return it................
>
April 23, 2005 4:15:04 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Piemanlager" <simon.nospamevans2@ntlworld.com> wrote in message
news:D Lpae.2090$395.41@newsfe5-gui.ntli.net...
>
> "Parker" <nothing@whatsoever.net> wrote in message
> news:3csr5jF6ibu6vU1@individual.net...
>> What a shower of arseholes!
>>
>> THREE 'brand new' DSLR cameras (supposedly 'new'!) from 2 different
>> stores - each one sold as brand new & unused.
>>
>> Exif data revealed that they had ALL been previously used for between 53
>> and 112 shots - and, on the last one, the lying sods hadn't even bothered
>> to remove the battery!
>>
>> Well, this latest one goes back in the morning, and then a fax to head
>> office pointing out that this sort of behaviour results in share price
>> dives, such as the one recently experienced by Jessops.
>>
>> I know I'll never trust them again - I suppose this results from their 30
>> day satisfaction guarantee which means loads of used cameras needing to
>> be passed on to unsuspecting customers.
>
> Personally i think you are over reacting. 53-112 shots is nothing and at
> least proves the camera has worked when it has either been shown to
> another potential customer or for all you know tested by Jessop staff.
>
> I have always found Jessop staff and indeed Jessops service to be 100%. <



the number of shots was fairly minimal when compared to the life expectancy
of the camera, agreed.

However, it's not as simple as that. A lot of DSLR's have problems with
back or front focussing (where the focal point it either in front, or
behind, the spot indicated by the AF markers) It's quite feasible that this
would be noted within, say, 50 shots and the camera returned to the store.

One would hope that such a camera would be returned to the manufacturer -
but I have no doubt that many are simply resold to customers who might be
less discerning.

That's why I specifically asked for a brand new, unused camera - which is
what I was assured I was getting. This has happened 3 times - and, quite
apart from possible quality issues, I strongly object to being lied to by
Jessops staff.

Of course, if I do manage to extract an unused camera from them and it too
proves to be faulty - back it goes! (presumably to join the seemingly huge
pile of 'pre-used' units filling up Jessops shelves. I appreciate the
problem for Jessops - but it's something that they need to take up with the
manufacturers. Passing such cameras on to other customers is simply not on.

Some posters have mentioned shrink wrapping. I know of no camera
manufacturer who despatches their products in sealed boxes - and it's ironic
that a £25.00 accessory will be sold in wrapping that almost defies attempts
to open it, but an expensive camera can be taken out, used, and replaced
with no immediately visible evidence.

If cameras 'were' supplied in sealed boxes it would force the store to keep
one of each model for demonstration purposes and supply only products at
point of sale. I suppose that it's cheaper for the stores to just fish out
new cameras and let customers play around with them, putting them back in
the box 'as new' if the potential customer walks away.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 4:31:37 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Parker wrote:
[]
> Some posters have mentioned shrink wrapping. I know of no camera
> manufacturer who despatches their products in sealed boxes - and it's
> ironic that a £25.00 accessory will be sold in wrapping that almost
> defies attempts to open it, but an expensive camera can be taken out,
> used, and replaced with no immediately visible evidence.

Ah, yes. How does everyone open those plastic packs with CF or SD cards
or other small accessories? Impossible to open by hand, and unless you
are /very/ careful with the knife you cut through the goods or the
instructions!

David
April 23, 2005 4:50:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"David J Taylor"
<david-taylor@blueyonder.co.not-this-bit.nor-this-part.uk> wrote:

>Parker wrote:
>[]
>> Some posters have mentioned shrink wrapping. I know of no camera
>> manufacturer who despatches their products in sealed boxes - and it's
>> ironic that a £25.00 accessory will be sold in wrapping that almost
>> defies attempts to open it, but an expensive camera can be taken out,
>> used, and replaced with no immediately visible evidence.
>
>Ah, yes. How does everyone open those plastic packs with CF or SD cards
>or other small accessories? Impossible to open by hand, and unless you
>are /very/ careful with the knife you cut through the goods or the
>instructions!
>
>David

Table saw!
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 4:57:25 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Toby Groves <news@iconia.org.uk> wrote:

>If I was the retailer I certainly wouldn't let a customer unseal and
>check out a brand new product until they'd paid for it in full, at which
>point it doesn't much matter whether they check it whilst still in the
>shop or an hour later at home.

True, but many retailers like that are also such tight bastards
that they won't put out for a demo model on the shop floor. (I
reckon the mfgrs should fund demo models, anyway).

--
Ken Tough
April 23, 2005 4:57:26 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

"Ken Tough" <ken@objectech.co.uk> wrote in message
news:JoQxWfDVoiaCFwBQ@objectech.co.uk...
> Toby Groves <news@iconia.org.uk> wrote:
>
>>If I was the retailer I certainly wouldn't let a customer unseal and
>>check out a brand new product until they'd paid for it in full, at which
>>point it doesn't much matter whether they check it whilst still in the
>>shop or an hour later at home.
>
> True, but many retailers like that are also such tight bastards
> that they won't put out for a demo model on the shop floor. (I
> reckon the mfgrs should fund demo models, anyway).


Absolutely!

Oddly, I tried a demo model of the first camera in the store, liked it, and
they then produced a box containing what I assumed was a brand new unit,
while putting the demo model back in the window.

The box wasn't closed perfectly - but I assumed that had just opened it to
check the contents (in case I claimed that bits were missing?) but, in fact,
I later discovered that the camera had been used for over 100 shots
previously.

It all seems a bit sharp to me - obviously a customer return, but re-sold as
a brand new unit.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 6:10:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

clutch@lycos.com wrote:
> "David J Taylor"
> <david-taylor@blueyonder.co.not-this-bit.nor-this-part.uk> wrote:
>
>> Parker wrote:
>> []
>>> Some posters have mentioned shrink wrapping. I know of no camera
>>> manufacturer who despatches their products in sealed boxes - and
>>> it's ironic that a £25.00 accessory will be sold in wrapping that
>>> almost defies attempts to open it, but an expensive camera can be
>>> taken out, used, and replaced with no immediately visible
>>> evidence.
>>
>> Ah, yes. How does everyone open those plastic packs with CF or SD
>> cards or other small accessories? Impossible to open by hand, and
>> unless you are /very/ careful with the knife you cut through the
>> goods or the instructions!
>>
>> David
>
> Table saw!

Domestic staff.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 6:47:02 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <Njhae.1849$wu2.1643@newsfe1-gui.ntli.net>, Mad Ad
<gobbleDgook@invalidinvalid.com> writes
>Indeed - Watford Electronics wouldnt even unseal a box of £9.99 pc speakers
>to see if the second speaker was fixed or on a plug (i wanted one that I
>could extend). Naturally they lost the sale but it was there perogative to
>keep the box sealed until it was bought.

Indeed it was and I have to say that I'd have done the same in their
position.

This type of thing is what some people expect the DSR to provide when
ordering online. They want to open, inspect and make use of a brand new
product, then have the option of returning it a day later for no reason
other than they changed their minds, and expect the retailer to provide
a full refund.

The DSR was intended to offer "distance purchasers" the same rights and
abilities as those who would purchase in a shop. Try walking into PC
World and asking them to open a brand new and sealed HP printer box,
then set it all up and let you run a test page off to check, knowing
full well that after this you can just say you don't want it and walk
out.
--
Toby
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 6:47:02 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <kkf96fk9vuhj.dlg@example.net>, Chris Game
<chrisgame@example.net> writes
>Johannes wrote:
>
>>> So you'll buy a car that's never been started up?
>>
>> No, but I wouldn't buy a new car that had been driven by a
>> customer. That's not a new car.
>
>What about one with delivery mileage?

Talk about splitting hairs! Have you won prizes for being pendantic?
--
Toby
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 6:47:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <3ctfpgF6lcj25U1@individual.net>, Graybags <gbas@lineone.net>
writes
>One that's taken 50 pics - that's like a car with 20 miles on the clock.

Only if both were done by the manufacturer or retailer and were
necessary in order to test and/or deliver the product.
--
Toby
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 7:13:08 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 22 Apr 2005 15:35:27 -0700, googlegroups@sensation.net.au wrote:

>On a slightly different note, once I purchased a mobile (cell) phone,
>and discovered that everything had already been opened, and the
>warranty card had been filled out! Even though I was back within 15
>minutes of purchase the people at the store seemed very unhappy that I
>wanted an exchange. I don't think the serial number of the phone
>matched the box so it probably wasn't 100% legal anyway. I got my
>exchange but they made me sign a waiver that I had received the goods
>in an acceptable condition. I checked veeerrryyy carefully before
>signing that!

I purchased a freeview box from BT Online.

Not only had the box been opened, the batteries and one of the leads
had been opened (The plastic bags were in the bottom of the box, the
batteries in the remote). The remote control was scratched on the
rear.

The protective strip had been removed from the window of the unit,
which was covered in fingerprints. One of the rubber feet was missing
from the bottom of the unit.

On top of this someone had been through the instruction manual ticking
things off, writing comments and underlining various bits of text!

BT promised to replace the box with a new one and refund an additional
£25 by way of apology. Whilst they replaced the box they never
credited me with the £25. Calling their customer services department
it seems they had 'lost' all details of the entire transaction!

I won't be shopping there again!

sponix
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 7:54:10 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <u3oi61hb1b0ijt6c6iu60n9mke7c5v7l4t@4ax.com>,
dexter@blueyonder.co.uk wrote:

> On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 20:21:03 +0100, "Graybags" <gbas@lineone.net>
> wrote:
>
>
> >Seems to me that, when peeps nip in and have a look at a camera - to see how
> >it works etc, they pt batteries in and take a few shots. Then, not
> >unreasonably, the sell this camera.
> If YOU want to buy secondhand goods you buy them I don't one thing I
> have always wanted and will never have is a new car and it isn't money
> that is preventing me from getting one its the thoughts of one of the
> wankers you see at Motorway slip roads waving trade plates around
> having their hands on" my" car that prevents me.
> >You may call it a display model, but really it's a new camera, just had a
> >few demo pics taken.
> If it has been USED it just CANNOT be new CAN IT .

So you'll buy a car that's never been started up?
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 7:54:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Stewy wrote:
>
> In article <u3oi61hb1b0ijt6c6iu60n9mke7c5v7l4t@4ax.com>,
> dexter@blueyonder.co.uk wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 20:21:03 +0100, "Graybags" <gbas@lineone.net>
> > wrote:
> >
> >
> > >Seems to me that, when peeps nip in and have a look at a camera - to see how
> > >it works etc, they pt batteries in and take a few shots. Then, not
> > >unreasonably, the sell this camera.
> > If YOU want to buy secondhand goods you buy them I don't one thing I
> > have always wanted and will never have is a new car and it isn't money
> > that is preventing me from getting one its the thoughts of one of the
> > wankers you see at Motorway slip roads waving trade plates around
> > having their hands on" my" car that prevents me.
> > >You may call it a display model, but really it's a new camera, just had a
> > >few demo pics taken.
> > If it has been USED it just CANNOT be new CAN IT .
>
> So you'll buy a car that's never been started up?

No, but I wouldn't buy a new car that had been driven by a customer. That's
not a new car. If you want to save money by buying a demonstrator or the
'Directors car' as they are often called, then good and well, but that
wasn't the deal.
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 7:54:11 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Stewy wrote:
> In article <u3oi61hb1b0ijt6c6iu60n9mke7c5v7l4t@4ax.com>,
> dexter@blueyonder.co.uk wrote:
>
>
>>On Fri, 22 Apr 2005 20:21:03 +0100, "Graybags" <gbas@lineone.net>
>>wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>>>Seems to me that, when peeps nip in and have a look at a camera - to see how
>>>it works etc, they pt batteries in and take a few shots. Then, not
>>>unreasonably, the sell this camera.
>>
>>If YOU want to buy secondhand goods you buy them I don't one thing I
>>have always wanted and will never have is a new car and it isn't money
>>that is preventing me from getting one its the thoughts of one of the
>>wankers you see at Motorway slip roads waving trade plates around
>>having their hands on" my" car that prevents me.
>>
>>>You may call it a display model, but really it's a new camera, just had a
>>>few demo pics taken.
>>
>>If it has been USED it just CANNOT be new CAN IT .
>
>
> So you'll buy a car that's never been started up?
Of course not. They all have been run at the factory, and the dealer.
What a bizarre idea!


--
Ron Hunter rphunter@charter.net
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 7:54:12 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Johannes wrote:

>> So you'll buy a car that's never been started up?
>
> No, but I wouldn't buy a new car that had been driven by a
> customer. That's not a new car.

What about one with delivery mileage?

--
Chris Game

Calm down -- it's only ones and zeroes
Anonymous
April 23, 2005 7:54:13 PM

Archived from groups: alt.consumers.uk-discounts.and.bargains,rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Chris Game wrote:
>
> Johannes wrote:
>
> >> So you'll buy a car that's never been started up?
> >
> > No, but I wouldn't buy a new car that had been driven by a
> > customer. That's not a new car.
>
> What about one with delivery mileage?

Then driven by authorised technicians. These people work for, and are
responsible to the car company.

There may have been stories about irresponsible delivery drives, but I'm
sure the companies will clamp down hard if discovered.
!