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AMD Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition at at 3.6ghz vs intel core i3 2100

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March 13, 2012 11:47:16 AM

when a AMD Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition is overclocked to 3.6ghz using this mobo asus M5A88-M on stock cooler will it give better performance than i3 2100 at gaming
a b à CPUs
March 13, 2012 12:33:36 PM

To many variables.

What speed (Ghz) would the i3 be running at?
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March 13, 2012 12:36:25 PM

I own the phenom II 955. You can clock it to a solid 4 Ghz without upping the voltage. I bought the 955 with the intent on putting as much power as I could through it, even to breaking point. It was a cheap, and fun experiment. I learned that after around 4.1-4.2Ghz of performance.The performance increases minimally, however the power required to overclock it isn't worth it. It usually becomes unstable after 4.2Ghz, even if it is running cooler temperatures.

I use a zalman 9900 aftermarket heat sink fan. Usually any of them are good with a push/pull design.

Keep the FSB at 200, and only overclock the multiplier. Pushing the FSB any higher doesn't help performance very much, or if it does it's minimal. Setting the multiplier at x20.0 should be sufficient.

I ran the passmark CPU mark to reach a score of 5700 on the performance test. Looking at the high end CPU list It's slightly better than a stock Core i5 2300.

http://www.cpubenchmark.net/high_end_cpus.html

All of the x6, and the 960T processors perform better.
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March 13, 2012 12:39:44 PM

lets make it duel vs duel, by dissabling 2 cores of 955 and ht of i3.

so you need around 4.7ghz on 955 with 2 cores disabled to beat a i3 at 3.1ghz.

but if a game can use all four threads effectively then 955@3.2 will be ~15% faster than i3@3.1
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March 13, 2012 1:38:07 PM

okay i3 is in 3.1ghz with stock cooler and phenom is also in stock cooler with above mentioned mobo overclocked to 3.6ghz because at this speed only the temp is good..now say which is better at gaming the gfx is amd 6770 for both cpu's
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March 13, 2012 4:05:33 PM

If you look at that Tom's link loneninja provided of average game performance an i3 2100 is slightly faster than an X4 980 (which is stock @ 3.7 Ghz). I think you have your answer.
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March 13, 2012 4:28:38 PM

^+1
:lol: 
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March 13, 2012 6:05:03 PM

Right, this has been done before, effectively AMD have nothing worthwhile, you should buy Intel that way in no time we will all be buying awesome i3's for $300. We have done the IPC and IMC debate to death, we can discuss the benchmarks validity to death but the one thing is overlooked, AMD tend to give you a lot more bells and whistles for a lot less, is the i3 really enough, is the i5 and i7 enough, is the Extreme range enough and the real honest answer is no, not for the premium shelled out. Some may be contented with this but for others its alarming it is killing of the desktop market, before no time everyone will be going back to console.
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March 13, 2012 7:00:45 PM

Also the i3 ivy bridge is due for release very soon and that is supposed to increase performance by 15% and is also supposed to be in the same price range.
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March 13, 2012 7:16:53 PM

Quote:
When Software uses all Four cores Intel i3 just cannot match it you cannot make up for something that is physically not there and i3 is not double the speed of an OCed 955 LOL


Where did anyone claim the i3 2100 is "double the speed" of an OC'd 955? Please stop exaggerating. The OP asked one question - is an i3 2100 faster than an X4 955 @ 3.6 Ghz for GAMING. That's all he asked. For today's games in general the i3 is faster, even with only two cores since most games make use of no more than that. By the time most games are make use of four or more cores the Phenom II line will be redundant anyway - much the way the Pentium D was by the time most games made use of two cores. The architecture is going to so old by then this argument will be moot. Right now the i3 is somewhat better than a Phenom II @ 3.6 Ghz. Sorry, that's just the way it is.

BTW, I'm gaming right now with a Phenom II X4 955 C2 @ 3.6 Ghz (with a CPU/NB of 2.4 Mhz) so its not like I'm completely ignorant on the subject. Its O.K. for now, but I can see its starting to strain a bit with more modern games (and I plan on replacing it this summer with an Ivy Bridge). Its had a good three year run, but there's no way in hell I'd build a PC today with it.
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March 13, 2012 7:25:56 PM

Well if you have no rebutal post a Picard pic to try to save face. Pretty much sums things up.
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March 13, 2012 7:29:48 PM

I think the through put of the Intel processor would be faster than the AMD. the Intel would lose because of lack of cores when more cores are needed. an aged stock 2.8 775 quad core is faster than anything amd has right now..... at stock......... and maybe over clocked too. but if you judge by fps in gaming, depending on res and settings they may seem similar yet. but having both I think the Intel is quicker reacting.
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March 13, 2012 7:38:39 PM

I've been sorely disappointed with the products AMD has released... and they are too, they just can't admit to it because it will make their stock prices dump. They are selling their APU's hand over fist to the OEM market, and that's the only reason they haven't noticed the fact that Intel will outperform them right now with 3 year old hardware...
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March 13, 2012 7:48:16 PM

I am curious if Longpast can provide supporting links of documented "real world" GAMING performed by a reputable company that show there little difference discernable between C2Q and Phenom II x4 and up?
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March 13, 2012 7:55:05 PM

kelthic said:
I am curious if Longpast can provide supporting links of documented "real world" GAMING performed by a reputable company that show there little difference discernable between C2Q and Phenom II x4 and up?


+1
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March 13, 2012 8:17:03 PM

This is a low quality setting benchmark, nor does it include any of the "and up" that you mentioned in your post. Keep fishing.
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March 13, 2012 8:44:46 PM

Quote:
In the real world there is little difference at all discernible between any decent modern CPU Phenom II and up. EDIT C2Quad and Phenom II x4 and up


That's exactly what you said. Where is the AND UP on your benchmark? I would like you to show me a benchmark you found where a difference could not be found between a Sandy Bridge i5 and a Core 2 Quad/Penom II x4 for gaming. There are many CPU-bound titles today that you can use to show that, such as Skyrim and BF3 multiplayer. This has been documented on articles here on Tom's.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/skyrim-performance-... Here is a benchmark to show that there is a discernable difference between an i5-2500k and the Phenom II x4 you discussed. As a side note, there is a second chart there that shows there is a discernable difference between the dual core i3 and a 6 core Phenom II, and it's in the favor of the Dual Core.

I believe your points on this thread are disproved by this link.
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March 13, 2012 10:20:29 PM



its pretty even.
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March 14, 2012 1:11:31 PM

jeffredo said:

BTW, I'm gaming right now with a Phenom II X4 955 C2 @ 3.6 Ghz (with a CPU/NB of 2.4 Mhz) so its not like I'm completely ignorant on the subject. Its O.K. for now, but I can see its starting to strain a bit with more modern games (and I plan on replacing it this summer with an Ivy Bridge). Its had a good three year run, but there's no way in hell I'd build a PC today with it.


Similar specs here, and i see no reason to change CPU. Maybe retiring my 4850 CF is one thing, retiring CPU is another ballgame. I honestly can't see the point. Rigth now, my 955 is running stock. For SCII and now ME3 is more than enough with all maxed out on both games @ 1680x1050.

EDIT: nice chart esrever. They are mostly tied.
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March 14, 2012 5:13:16 PM

esrever said:


its pretty even.


Yea, performance is even, but the i3 uses half as much power to be 'even' with the 125W part.

Dry
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March 14, 2012 11:12:39 PM

I had a Phenom II X4 980 in one machine and a i3-2100 in another. With identical graphic cards/ memory, the i3 always slightly edged the Phenom II at frame rate in gaming benchmarks.
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March 15, 2012 4:50:13 AM

Cuz you know how dang awesomez the i3 iz, it iz the shizniz.
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March 15, 2012 6:24:34 AM

vishalaestro said:
when a AMD Phenom II X4 955 Black Edition is overclocked to 3.6ghz using this mobo asus M5A88-M on stock cooler will it give better performance than i3 2100 at gaming


me personally i would go with a phenom II quad core or fx 4100 or fx 4170. the i3 really isnt a killer at gaming despite what you might hear. having 2 cores isnt enough for skyrim, BF3 and deffintley not the future. check out this link of skyrim with an i3 and gtx 550 ti http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALhBnmAhtfk hes not getting very good fps. i have a fx4100 clocked to 4 ghz and a radeon 6790 and i blow away his fps. hes outside in the video. in the world of skyrim and hes getting around 40 fps, thats reallllly bad. in towns i could understand that but in the outside world of skyrim its much easier to obtain good fps. i have it on max and i never go below 60 fps. infact i usually get 75 fps at all time. in towns it can be tricky tho i get between 45-60 fps
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March 15, 2012 3:10:39 PM

diablo34life said:
me personally i would go with a phenom II quad core or fx 4100 or fx 4170. the i3 really isnt a killer at gaming despite what you might hear. having 2 cores isnt enough for skyrim, BF3 and deffintley not the future. check out this link of skyrim with an i3 and gtx 550 ti http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ALhBnmAhtfk hes not getting very good fps. i have a fx4100 clocked to 4 ghz and a radeon 6790 and i blow away his fps. s


Clock for clock an i3 will walk all over a similarly priced FX4100, and you have a massively different video card, which namely, has a 256-bit memory interface which can handle massive amounts of texture bandwidth better than the 550ti and your CPU is clocked 15% higher, its comparing apples to oranges

Dry
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March 15, 2012 5:09:50 PM

DryCreamer said:
Clock for clock an i3 will walk all over a similarly priced FX4100, and you have a massively different video card, which namely, has a 256-bit memory interface which can handle massive amounts of texture bandwidth better than the 550ti and your CPU is clocked 15% higher, its comparing apples to oranges

Dry


you joking my video card is not massivley better. its a small amount better. the fx4100 and quad cores from amd will spread out games equally throughout there cores. the i3 gets choppy fps maxing out its only 2 cores. 256 bit memory doesnt do anything in modern games now for performance compared to 128. ive messed around with my oc and ive tried it at 3.6 theres no noticable difference intel fanboy.
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March 16, 2012 11:09:55 AM

i have a problem on tom's hardware Gaming CPU Hierarchy Chart on October 26, 2011 amd Phenom II X4 Black Edition 975 was placed above i3 2100 suddenly on Gaming CPU Hierarchy Chart March 7, 2012 amd Phenom II X4 Black Edition 975 was placed below i3 i can't understand how it can happen ?pls see these links
March 7, 2012
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-cpu-review-o...
October 26, 2011
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-cpu-overcloc...
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March 16, 2012 11:45:29 AM

Go to some of their benchmarks and see if it really gets out performed. I'm thinking it will on most except for incredibly threaded ones.
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March 16, 2012 1:39:58 PM

DryCreamer said:
Go to some of their benchmarks and see if it really gets out performed. I'm thinking it will on most except for incredibly threaded ones.

can't find any convincing benchmark
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March 16, 2012 2:14:54 PM

vishalaestro said:
i have a problem on tom's hardware Gaming CPU Hierarchy Chart on October 26, 2011 amd Phenom II X4 Black Edition 975 was placed above i3 2100 suddenly on Gaming CPU Hierarchy Chart March 7, 2012 amd Phenom II X4 Black Edition 975 was placed below i3 i can't understand how it can happen ?pls see these links
March 7, 2012
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-cpu-review-o...
October 26, 2011
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/gaming-cpu-overcloc...

The Phenom II X4 975 BE wasn't above the i3-2100 in the Oct chart; it was in the same tier. That means roughly equal. As game benchmarks were added and new games tested (and new processors tested), they bumped the i3-2100 up a tier. Remember, these charts are constantly in flux depending on the changing nature of gaming code.
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March 16, 2012 2:31:02 PM

diablo34life said:
you joking my video card is not massivley better. its a small amount better. the fx4100 and quad cores from amd will spread out games equally throughout there cores. the i3 gets choppy fps maxing out its only 2 cores. 256 bit memory doesnt do anything in modern games now for performance compared to 128. ive messed around with my oc and ive tried it at 3.6 theres no noticable difference intel fanboy.


Your card is typically 10-20% faster. If he is using fraps or any other recording software, yes, his system is going to be slower without the extra actual 2 cores. And to disprove your youtube video, http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/fx-4100-core-i3-2100-gaming-benchmark,3136-7.html shows no "choppy fps"
and
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/amd-fx-8120-6100-4100_6.html
and
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/cpu/display/amd-fx-8120-6100-4100_7.html
and I could go on and on.

The i3 at most times is equal to, and when you get to high resolutions, totally blows the 4100 out of the water. An i3-2100 runs at 3.1Ghz, vs a 4100 which runs between 3.6 and 3.8. Plus the 4100 is SLOWER at everything else. The i3 has ONLY 2 cores, runs at 65W instead of 95W, and does any day to day office/surfing/etc FASTER than the 4100. Exactly who is a fanboy?
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March 16, 2012 2:35:19 PM

clutchc said:
The Phenom II X4 975 BE wasn't above the i3-2100 in the Oct chart; it was in the same tier. That means roughly equal. As game benchmarks were added and new games tested (and new processors tested), they bumped the i3-2100 up a tier. Remember, these charts are constantly in flux depending on the changing nature of gaming code.


Does your I3 have VM instructions ? Nope. That for me for example is a big no-no. There are more points than just gaming "bang per buck", witch i consider silly, because games are "mostly" GPU bound. And not all games behave equal anyway.

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March 16, 2012 3:43:02 PM

Why in the hells name do you need VM instructions? On a dual core... By a ordinary user that plays games. And surfs the net. listens to music. Sometimes converts a movie. VM is just not used by the targeted usergroup.

I too am iritated by intel locking its cpus to create artificial gap where there is none, just for the sake of price difference. but that doesnt change the fact that their architecture is fast enough in specific areas that are a performance hog, like games.
Face it, games are one of the few things that a normal person can do to push a processor to 100%.
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March 16, 2012 5:19:58 PM

radnor said:
Does your I3 have VM instructions ? Nope. That for me for example is a big no-no. There are more points than just gaming "bang per buck", witch i consider silly, because games are "mostly" GPU bound. And not all games behave equal anyway.

What does that have to do with my statement about Tom's Hierarchy chart of Gaming CPUs?
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March 16, 2012 11:00:41 PM

Not much, just saying that intel in the lower tier models, usually plays dirty.
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March 17, 2012 3:01:08 AM

for gaming rigs under say 600-700AMD is a very viable option right now. Once you reach 800 you can fit an i5 2500k in, and AMD cant compete with that.
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March 17, 2012 3:21:23 AM

The i3 is the cpu amd can't compete with. Even systems for 600 the i3 is a better choice. Also isn't longlastpnr the amd troll?
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March 17, 2012 3:22:49 AM

Also isn't the 980 and phenom 955 use the same cpu architecture? So a 3.8ghz 980 can't really top an i3 at stock clocks, so the 955 at 3.6 shouldn't be able to either.
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March 17, 2012 6:25:15 AM

are u having some benchmarks if u pls show them ..
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March 17, 2012 7:13:29 AM

see these are the things i will do with my system ..watch hi-def movies,decompression,hearing musics,importantly playing games(at 1080p)currently using a 1600x900p monitor ,copying and pasting of files,heavy internet user ,programming with .NET,video conversion..from this i want a fast decompression of files ,good support for gaming at least for 2 years and the card should be able to support all games at-least at low settings after 2 years,the system should be able to respond very quickly and very important the system should serve me well for a maximum of 4 years as i will change the system usually once in 4years.. tell me the video card,processor,board and also the ram..i know that ivy bridge is coming at end of April so tell me what type of cpu do i need for these works done quickly..the budget will be 650 $ it should be bang for the buck..i know this is much for the budget i told u but under this budget is there a cpu that can do these things..
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March 17, 2012 7:59:18 AM

so you want a full and final rig for atleast 4 years?
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March 17, 2012 8:18:16 AM

YES...things that i don't need for the cpu is dvd drive and hdd i already have it..i don't include monitor ,speakers ,mouse and keyboard i already have those..im asking only cpu..
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March 17, 2012 12:04:59 PM

1. do you have a good quality psu, if not then add it to your budget too?
2. how much is your budget for cpu+gpu+mobo+ram?
one more question.

(i3-2120 will use 65w, but phenom2 960t use 95w at base clock.
960t on 4ghz will use about ~120-130w (to become stable, including voltage) and when unlocked to 6 then it will use ~140-150w@3ghz.
960t@3ghz (4core) is 10% faster in aida64 zlib benchmark than i3@3.3ghz+ht.
but 960t@3ghz (6core) is 65% faster than i3@3.3ghz+ht in zlib.)

3. so will you be happy with more power consumption?
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March 17, 2012 12:29:55 PM

truegenius said:
1. do you have a good quality psu, if not then add it to your budget too?
2. how much is your budget for cpu+gpu+mobo+ram?
one more question.

(i3-2120 will use 65w, but phenom2 960t use 95w at base clock.
960t on 4ghz will use about ~120-130w (to become stable, including voltage) and when unlocked to 6 then it will use ~140-150w@3ghz.
960t@3ghz (4core) is 10% faster in aida64 zlib benchmark than i3@3.3ghz+ht.
but 960t@3ghz (6core) is 65% faster than i3@3.3ghz+ht in zlib.)

3. so will you be happy with more power consumption?

including psu my budget is 650$ ..here is the site i'm going to purchase www.deltapage.com..i will be happy if im geeting a power equal to i5 2320
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March 17, 2012 1:18:57 PM

intel build
Asus MotherBoard - P8Z68-M PRO (Rs ~9.5k)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Asus-MotherBoard-%252...
Intel® Core™ i5 2500K Processor - 3.3 GHz, 6 MB Cache, Socket 1155 (Rs ~12.5k)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Intel%C2%AE-Core%E2%8...
with 2 sticks of Corsair RAM Desktop DDR3 4GB 1333 MHz Value Select (Rs ~2.5k)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Corsair-RAM-Desktop-D...
XFX SMPS ProSeries 450W PSU (Rs 3k)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/XFX-SMPS-ProSeries-45...

(9.5k+12.5k+2.5k+3k=27.5k)

so you are left with around 6-7k (price of hd6750, seriously that site is charging too much for this gpu, as hd6790 is available at 6.5k in Nehru place) for gpu, but do not buy any gpu now as you will see a huge price drop with the launch of nvidia gtx6 series.

will be posting a amd build that will be equal to i5-2500k@3.3ghz in heavily threaded tasks, but not in gaming.
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March 17, 2012 1:48:24 PM

amd build
AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition (3.2GHz, 9MB Cache) (Rs 9.3k) (only this cpu is available at that site)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/AMD-Phenom-II-X6-1090...
Asus MotherBoard - M5A88-M (Rs ~5.2k)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Asus-MotherBoard-%252...
with 2 sticks of Corsair RAM Desktop DDR3 4GB 1333 MHz Value Select (Rs ~2.5k)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Corsair-RAM-Desktop-D...
XFX SMPS ProSeries 650W PSU (Rs ~4.6)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/XFX-SMPS-ProSeries-65...
Asus NVidia Geforce GTX560 - 1GB DDR5 (Rs 11.2k)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Asus-NVidia-Geforce-G...

(9.3k+5.2k+2.5k+4.6k+11.2k=32.8k)

without gpu you will be left with around 12-13k for gpu (which is around the price of asus gtx560), but in my opinion you should wait for gtx6.

this amd build is equal to i5@3.2-3.3ghz in heavily threaded tasks like compressing, and can overclock upto 4ghz easily, and 1090t@3.75ghz will be equal to i7@3.4ghz in heavily threaded tasks.

but that intel build will be better in gaming (when paired with a good gpu), and can overclock to 4.5ghz which make it 35-40% faster than a 1090t@3.2ghz in heavily threaded tasks.

so in my opinion, as you want it for 4 years then waiting for some weeks will not hurt, and thus intel build is better.
but if you are in a hurry then you can go with amd build
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March 17, 2012 2:03:04 PM

truegenius said:
amd build
AMD Phenom II X6 1090T Black Edition (3.2GHz, 9MB Cache) (Rs 9.3k) (only this cpu is available at that site)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/AMD-Phenom-II-X6-1090...
Asus MotherBoard - M5A88-M (Rs ~5.2k)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Asus-MotherBoard-%252...
with 2 sticks of Corsair RAM Desktop DDR3 4GB 1333 MHz Value Select (Rs ~2.5k)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Corsair-RAM-Desktop-D...
XFX SMPS ProSeries 650W PSU (Rs ~4.6)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/XFX-SMPS-ProSeries-65...
Asus NVidia Geforce GTX560 - 1GB DDR5 (Rs 11.2k)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Asus-NVidia-Geforce-G...

(9.3k+5.2k+2.5k+4.6k+11.2k=32.8k)

without gpu you will be left with around 12-13k for gpu (which is around the price of asus gtx560), but in my opinion you should wait for gtx6.

this amd build is equal to i5@3.2-3.3ghz in heavily threaded tasks like compressing, and can overclock upto 4ghz easily, and 1090t@3.75ghz will be equal to i7@3.4ghz in heavily threaded tasks.

but that intel build will be better in gaming (when paired with a good gpu), and can overclock to 4.5ghz which make it 35-40% faster than a 1090t@3.2ghz in heavily threaded tasks.

so in my opinion, as you want it for 4 years then waiting for some weeks will not hurt, and thus intel build is better.
but if you are in a hurry then you can go with amd build

in summer days my room temp will get hotter so with a best cooler overclocking will be very tough..and i prefer a atx mobo and a 1600mhz ram can that be done under this budget and is overclocking feature necessary and also im not sure i require 650w psu why do i?surely i'm not in a hurry i want the best for the money
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March 17, 2012 2:25:05 PM

if you want a cooler and quieter system then intel build got a +point,
as i5 use only 95w and thus less heat with same cooler.

atx board,
so what about this rs10.3k board Asus MotherBoard - P8Z68-V-LE (costs rs800 more than previous one) for intel
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Asus-MotherBoard-%252...

or if going with amd then
Asus MotherBoard - M5A97 rs6k (costs rs800 more)
http://www.deltapage.com/products/Asus-MotherBoard-%252...

those 1333mhz ram in duel channel will provide bandwidth equal to single 2666mhz ram and thus you will have more than enough bandwidth., also they can be overclocked to ~1600mhz at timings 9,9,9,24,34,1t@1.6v (negligible heat will produce)

the other option is corsair vengeance, but that site is charging too much for that stick, also timings of that 1600mhz corsair vengeance ram are 9,9,9,24,41,2t@1.5v@1600mhz while 9,9,9,24,34,1t@1.5v@1333mhz which is equal to corsair value ram sticks, so that is why i considered 2 sticks of that corsair value ram over corsair vengeance
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