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Enough of this Q9550. Upgrade Advices!

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December 8, 2011 9:57:26 PM

After having so much bottleneck issues with my Q9550 while playing games, i've decided to upgrade my systems major parts.

I own a HD5870, but after overclocking it with Asus SMART DOCTOR utility, it started to make a noise which is called Coil Whine and began to shut itself down after 30 minutes of gameplay (Skyrim on High Settings). So I RMA'ed the card.


I never liked the idea of Crossfire & SLI so, think i'm gonna go with a strong single GPU again. Maybe in the future i can place another identical GPU and go for the SLI.

I'm going go get these in Turkey, so some parts you suggest may not be available. :(  Like "ASUS P8Z68V Gen3". There is only non-Gen3 available.

So these are the parts i've chosen so far:

CPU : Intel® Core™ i5-2500K Processor (8M Cache, 3.40 GHz)
Zalman CNBS5X LGA775/1155/1156/ CPU Cooler (which i already own.)

MOBO: MSI Z68A-GD65 (G3) Z68 LGA1155 DDR3-2133 (Gen3 is a must because i may wanna buy an ivy bridge in the future)
(I'll definitely overclock so P67 or Z68?)

GPU: Zotac GTX580 AMP! 328 Bit 1528MB GPU (another GTX580 would be nice after a couple of years)
(if they repair the card its going to be a 5870 again)
or a reference GTX580 / MSI 6970 Lightning / MSI GTX 570 twin frozr

RAMS: G-Skillz RipJaws 2x4GB 1333Mhz CL7 Dual Kit Ram 1.5 V (I already own these, would they cause a bottleneck? I can make additions btw)

PSU: RS-700 Real Power M 700W PFC Power Supply (enough juice?)

HDD: WD 3.5'' 500GB + 320GB 32MB SATA II 7200RPM (which is also owned)

Case: Thermaltake VL200K1W2Z Element V BlackEdition Full Tower

And i have a SB0092 Sound Blaster Audigy sound card, which i also want to place. Is it unneccesary?

So what do you think guys?








More about : q9550 upgrade advices

December 8, 2011 10:19:45 PM

Make sure you purchase an aftermarket CPU cooler like the cooler master hyper 212 plus. The stock cooler for the 2500k sucks.

Definitely stick with the Z68, the P67 has a lower chance of being able to do a bios flash to use Ivy Bridge and supports quick sync and ssd caching.

The SB card is nice, but isn't necessary. If you like it and it fits your board then go for it.

I would upgrade the ram to the sniper series 1866, but that's just me.

The power supply has enough juice, but I always prefer a gold or platinum rated PSU. They have the lowest amount of current leakage so use less electricity and generate less heat. Even a kingwin 550 platinum should be fine as long as you don't go too aggressive on your overclocks. If you plan on overclocking your video card and your CPU and increasing the vcore, you will want something closer to 700w.
December 8, 2011 10:28:41 PM

Hmm my next move will be on my PSU and RAMS then. :)  Thanks for the advice.
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December 8, 2011 11:37:57 PM

*mod edit: removal of offensive post*

Hmmm...

My intensions were never to burn my cards, refund them and get new ones. Actually they were not even mistakes, like you call them "stupidities". I love my card and i will be more than happy to get it back, all working.

Probably you're not worth my time but still i am going to tell how those 2 got malfunctioning.

first one was a Sapphire overclocked addition 4890, which i never overclocked. I was suffering from a FPS loss in Fallout 3, so i applied a suggestion from one of the websites (a community which plays F3), which was telling 48xx series Radeon users to simply use a different Dx9.dll file. So i did, and after a day or two baam, my card goes off. I RMA'ed the card and they payed the full price. Yet I still don't even know if that was the real case.

5870 was a whole different case. I got the Asus EAH5870 Model which is a voltage tweak edition. Which means can be overclocked with the ASUS' utility softwares like SMART DOCTOR. When I researced how to overclock it from the web (I didn't just ignorantly played with the values as you implied) i found an instruction from a trustable Hardware website, who OC'ed the SAME CARD with the SMART DOCTOR and gained %20 performance. They had nearly the same specs as i did, so i said yeah why not? I paid for that Voltage Tweak function too haven't i?

I adjusted the values and card started malfunctioning. SO I RMA'ed the card. Shoot me.

I always use my stuff overclocked and monitor temperatures and most important of all i never apply them ignorantly. I always look for an experienced person who applied the overclock, and had no issues.

Above all these, if you have a suggestion for my build, go for it, otherwise **** *** **** **.
December 9, 2011 12:09:57 AM

Bam. Wish I could have seen what whoever said.
December 9, 2011 12:18:48 AM

I noticed you mentioned going gtx580. Check out todays aricle Best GPU's for dec 2011 on toms hdwr home page

the 570 is very compareable and is $100 cheaper as well Possible future sli= another$100 cheaper.
December 9, 2011 12:40:47 AM

Yes raptor, sometimes I wonder just WTF happened when I was sleeping. You just have to rest assured however that someone got an article of their clothes twisted and the mods came in like they should and dealt with it. Move along, nothing more to see.

To the OP, what "bottleneck issues" do you have with a 9550? You even stated this was for game play, so I'm at a loss. You are probably better off keeping your CPU, board and ram and just upgrading the GPU and PSU.
December 9, 2011 1:45:11 AM

Why waste money on an upgrade when you play at 1440 x 900? thats like buying a ferrari and only being able to drive in first gear! Upgrade your monitor before your computer otherwise you will always be bottlnecked by processor!!!!
December 9, 2011 2:08:34 AM

mightymaxio said:
Why waste money on an upgrade when you play at 1440 x 900? thats like buying a ferrari and only being able to drive in first gear! Upgrade your monitor before your computer otherwise you will always be bottlnecked by processor!!!!


What does one really get out of a bigger monitor besides eye strain that is. If you are happy with a smaller display and can max out your graphics, you will not see more on a larger display, only cost yourself allot more to equal the graphics you already had on smaller display, not to mention tylenol for the headaches.

In no way is this meant to cut down those who are interested in larger screens but I'm just saying it doesn't make him a dummie for not doing so.
December 9, 2011 2:15:47 AM

mightymaxio said:
Why waste money on an upgrade when you play at 1440 x 900? thats like buying a ferrari and only being able to drive in first gear! Upgrade your monitor before your computer otherwise you will always be bottlnecked by processor!!!!


What? What does a lower resolution has got anything to do with bottleneck issues?

You say that it won't be bottlenecking with a higher load of pixels? Does that sound logical to you?

I might have been using my 5870 on a 1280 x 1024 monitor too. Well then guess i should have been expecting even less FPS ?

I have a 1080p samsung monitor which i don't use for gaming because i like to play on big screens. I get the same crappy FPS on that one too. When the time is right, I'll upgrade my screen to a 1080p. Since then, I'm stuck with 1440x900. But does that mean i should get a 550 Ti instead of a GTX580?
December 9, 2011 2:20:03 AM

You should get a 550 ti because at lower resolutions such as your 1440 x 900 it wont make a difference at all if you had a 580 gtx or a 550 ti. All im saying is you would be wasting money trying to get better performance at a low resolution because then its almost entirely a cpu bottleneck at that point. Graphics cards dont really shine until you up the resolution. So if you want to be stuck in the stone ages continue with that resolution.
December 9, 2011 2:29:14 AM

any ways I have upgraded my gpu froma gt520 to a 550ti like the one I linked and on my 22" widescreen I have increased my gaming graffix considerably. I can play skyrim and bf3 and crysis2 on nearly max settings now, so yes It will help you a little and it will help on your larger monitor as well.
December 9, 2011 2:37:01 AM

mightymaxio said:
You should get a 550 ti because at lower resolutions such as your 1440 x 900 it wont make a difference at all if you had a 580 gtx or a 550 ti. All im saying is you would be wasting money trying to get better performance at a low resolution because then its almost entirely a cpu bottleneck at that point. Graphics cards dont really shine until you up the resolution. So if you want to be stuck in the stone ages continue with that resolution.


Let me put it this way;

1) I'll upgrade my big screen to a 1080p soon later on.

2) I already tried the same **** on my 1900x1080p monitor @1900x1080 resolution. Still got that crappy FPS and %60 load of GPU.

3) Since I already own a 5870 I'm looking for an upgrade not downgrade. Since 5870 > 550Ti

And I don't think getting a better CPU/MOBO/GPU combination won't make any difference on a 1400x900 resolution either. It's not like i'm playing on 800x600.
December 9, 2011 2:37:29 AM

Quote:
oddly enough the CPU usage is around %50 as i'm playing...And my GPU usage never passes %60.


You've got something going on. CPU at 50%, and GPU at 60%? Something is holding BOTH the CPU and GPU back. My first guess would be a power issue. Another issue could be your P41 board/incorrect bios settings. I still feel like more digging is needed before you toss what you have.

rmiirusty, headaches because the monitor is large? WTF are you talking about?
December 9, 2011 2:46:48 AM

Skyrim uses only 2 cores, thats for sure. I believe thats why the %50 usage is all about like the wolfram23 explained. And that means game is using 2 cores %100 potential and still lacking performance. GPU usage however is another issue. I guess on high settings 5870 only uses %60 of its potential ?
December 9, 2011 2:50:30 AM

4745454b said:
Quote:
oddly enough the CPU usage is around %50 as i'm playing...And my GPU usage never passes %60.


You've got something going on. CPU at 50%, and GPU at 60%? Something is holding BOTH the CPU and GPU back. My first guess would be a power issue. Another issue could be your P41 board/incorrect bios settings. I still feel like more digging is needed before you toss what you have.

rmiirusty, headaches because the monitor is large? WTF are you talking about?



To me it is like sitting in front of the TV about a foot or two away, who needs to do that anyway. I can see my game just fine with 1600x900 res. and the big monitors like a couple of friends of mine have only give me headaches trying to focus back and forth on gameplay. The graphics seem worse to me on the larger screens despite the gtx 570ti sli , to the tune of enough to build a whole second computer in price comparison to my 550 ti

I tried it , dont like it and have saved much in the lining of my pockets , thanx anyway and feel free!!!
December 9, 2011 2:51:32 AM

If a CPU isn't using all of its resources, then it can't send data fast enough to the GPU. In this case, it will report less then 100% usage. This isn't the CPUs fault, its a software issue in this case. I'd suggest OCing your CPU to help with the problem, but G41 boards aren't known for their OCing ability. You could buy a new board for your current system, but then your back to it making more sense (budget allowing) to buy a new system instead.

Is skyrim and GTA4 (both known as "bad console ports") the only games you have issues with? A 9550 and 5870 on a 1440x900 monitor should be able to power through anything. Bad console ports excepting of course...
December 9, 2011 3:11:39 AM

Yeah G41 doesn't allow me to overclock any higher than 3.352 Ghz. That was the starting point of a new upgrade actually. Sooner later, my GPU started malfunctioning.

Yeah Skyrim and GTAIV were the worst among them, I don't recall having issues with other games. BF3 at high settings can be a problem sometimes at large maps. When that happens, i lower some of the specs in order to make it playable. At Ultra, it's unplayable.

I think i'm gonna go with the i5 2500k / MSI GD65 / GTX580 build. :)  It was about time.
December 9, 2011 12:53:27 PM

4745454b said:
In case you haven't seen this. This is why I say spending this kind of money isn't worth it. There just isn't a big enough jump in gaming performance.

http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/50?vs=288


out of curiosity ,is there an overclocked performance chart comparing the 3.3g o.c. he can now achieve to the i5 @4.5g for instance that he might achieve with the new setup he's considering?
December 9, 2011 1:03:08 PM

audicted said:
What? What does a lower resolution has got anything to do with bottleneck issues?

You say that it won't be bottlenecking with a higher load of pixels? Does that sound logical to you?

I might have been using my 5870 on a 1280 x 1024 monitor too. Well then guess i should have been expecting even less FPS ?

I have a 1080p samsung monitor which i don't use for gaming because i like to play on big screens. I get the same crappy FPS on that one too. When the time is right, I'll upgrade my screen to a 1080p. Since then, I'm stuck with 1440x900. But does that mean i should get a 550 Ti instead of a GTX580?



The lower the resolution, the less GPU resources your computer will use, and the more CPU resources it will use.

Example: So if say at your resolution, the resources the application is using is 60% CPU and 40% GPU, that is more strain on the CPU and it is not utilizing the GPU. That would be bottlenecking. Now if you upgraded to say 1920x1080 or higher, those numbers will switch and be even better. So at 1080p your resource load may be like 70% GPU, and 30% CPU therefore reducing bottlenecking and upping your fps.
December 9, 2011 2:11:57 PM

moto nack said:
The lower the resolution, the less GPU resources your computer will use, and the more CPU resources it will use.

Example: So if say at your resolution, the resources the application is using is 60% CPU and 40% GPU, that is more strain on the CPU and it is not utilizing the GPU. That would be bottlenecking. Now if you upgraded to say 1920x1080 or higher, those numbers will switch and be even better. So at 1080p your resource load may be like 70% GPU, and 30% CPU therefore reducing bottlenecking and upping your fps.



he is correct in saying the lower rez you use, the less you will be taxing your gpu, but he clearly doesn't know what he's talking about with the cpu. If you increase your graphics/rez, your framerate at best will stay the same (highlighting your cpu bottleneck). if you increase your graphics/rez to the point where your framerates suffer, that is the only time you will lower the cpu load.
December 9, 2011 2:34:02 PM

I think he was talking about a 100% split between the CPU and GPU. I was going to mention that if the CPU is at 60%, if you increase the res it will still stay at 60%. But then looking at his post again I think he was dividing the "100% work load" between the CPU and GPU and in that context he would be right.
December 11, 2011 10:11:58 PM

Due to your opinions I upgraded my screen to a 1080p LED TV. It seemed to me as a higher priority :)  Now i'm gonna get aZotac GTX580 AMP! since i cannot upgrade my CPU&Mobo at the time. Guess i'm gonna wait for Ivy, then upgrade again. Thank you guys.
December 12, 2011 2:50:08 AM

Just understand there will be some times where the games coding isn't the best and you'll have some issues. For the most part you should be more then fine.
December 12, 2011 3:17:22 AM

Will i need another GTX580 AMP! for a possible SLI in the future or just a standard GTX580 is enough?

And would it matter if the manufacturer brands are different? I really don't know much about these multiple GPU things. They are all still new to me.
December 12, 2011 5:48:59 AM

If you need to SLI, any other (current) GTX580 will do. They don't need to be from the same company, and clock speeds can be different. The faster should downlock to the slower cards speed, though I believe you can OC both cards together once you have SLI enabled.
December 12, 2011 5:55:01 AM

audicted said:
Will i need another GTX580 AMP! for a possible SLI in the future or just a standard GTX580 is enough?

And would it matter if the manufacturer brands are different? I really don't know much about these multiple GPU things. They are all still new to me.


You should always if going with a sli conf. use identical cards to avoid possible issues. Even if from same manufacturer one is amp, the other not then probably some different settings in the cards.memory, digi power etc. even if you managed to get them to work together, would have a hard time maintaining stability. Besides, the driver may be different and confuse the cards.
Another problem would be, what if your sli bridge connector didn't bridge right because located in different spots on the card.
If you are getting a card that big, IMO, you should just try one anyway. Chances are it will suit your needs, Then if you decide to sli, get the exact same card.

QUOTE: If you don't have time to do it right the first time ..How will you ever find time to go back and fix it?!?!
December 12, 2011 8:30:50 AM

Quote:
Another problem would be, what if your sli bridge connector didn't bridge right because located in different spots on the card.


What I find scary is I think you are serious.
December 12, 2011 8:54:15 AM

4745454b said:
Quote:
Another problem would be, what if your sli bridge connector didn't bridge right because located in different spots on the card.


What I find scary is I think you are serious.


Have had many customers trying to sli sme cards but different brand and come to me looking for flexible 4 or 5 in sli bridge. Have also found more problems like mentioned before more often than not. I am serious!!!
December 12, 2011 10:03:32 AM

Sorry, its like saying your going to buy a PCIe card but the PCIe pins might be in the wrong spot. The connectors are in the correct place unless you have a SERIOUSLY messed up card.
December 12, 2011 2:51:28 PM

4745454b said:
Sorry, its like saying your going to buy a PCIe card but the PCIe pins might be in the wrong spot. The connectors are in the correct place unless you have a SERIOUSLY messed up card.


Hey ,your right as far as the sli bridge. I got online and checked a few brands out and they are all in the same spot.
I have installed allot of smaller cards too small to sli and only a few sli set ups which were either evga or asus brand cards and while those sli setups bridged in the same location I wasn't aware it was an industry standard. Which prompted my curiosity as to why the customers had been looking for longer flex bridges. So I looked up the most recent two and called them today. As it turns out, one guy was trying to work around his 8 pin cpu plug cable which he said was pulled tight in his case and ran right in his way , and the other guy said he was trying to sli from slot1 to slot3 on his board.

however I did try to sli an evga 550ti with a Asus 550ti TOP card and it would not work.
Could get it to seem like working but crashed and cut off and back on continuously.
Talked the guy into another Asus top card since I had it in stock and it worked right away.
I just thought it was good advice to steer a new builder away from what may be a potential problem for him. But I was wrong about the bridge positioning :o 
December 12, 2011 7:33:57 PM

Actually bridge positions differ per company per card, ive owned 4 8800 gt's from different companies and each one had the connectors at a slightly different spot on the card.
December 12, 2011 7:59:45 PM

mightymaxio said:
Actually bridge positions differ per company per card, ive owned 4 8800 gt's from different companies and each one had the connectors at a slightly different spot on the card.


I thought that but 47574b seemed to want to argue the point and I didn't see the productivity in it and wasn't really sure so I agreed because all I could find online seemed relatively similar.
December 12, 2011 8:47:58 PM

It HAS to be an standard. As I mentioned above, it's like buying a card and finding the pins in the wrong spot. Customers would be up in arms if the SLI bridges weren't in the right spot. I could see some horribly warped card, but all new cards should be fine.
December 12, 2011 9:35:40 PM

4745454b your wrong, SLI bridges are flexible these days so it doesnt matter anymore. Back in the 6 series of nvidia they were all the same and then in the 7 and then 8 they changed to different positions. Consumers who buy sli buy the same cards most of the time and the other times they just use a flexible SLI bridge which can fit any SLI card.

For example a 8800 gt akimbo edition with the extended board is different than a stock 8800 gt. What about low profile cards vs. the full profile? What about the dual slot cards vs single slot? Your logic is off.
!