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Nintendo Revolution will use MoSys 1T-SRAM. any advantage?

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Anonymous
May 10, 2005 6:44:50 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846

(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)

Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will be using
MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.

it seems that Elpida lost out on the Revolution RAM deal.

Elpida is a major provider of RAM. they're one of the RAM providers of
Rambus XDR memory for the upcoming PlayStation3.

MoSys was first selected by Nintendo in the late 1990s to make the RAM for
Dolphin (Gamecube) because of their special low-latency (fast) 1T-SRAM.

It seems Nintendo liked it enough to keep MoSys in on the successor system.

now lets hope that there is *enough* RAM in -Revolution- to make developers
happy.

It was revealed at Nintendo's Spaceworld 2000 show in Japan that the amount
of RAM in Gamecube was cut dramatically, compared to how much it was
originally supposed to have when the system was called Project Dolphin.


http://rage3d.com/board/showthread.php?p=1333687339#pos...

"okay, you probably don't know or remember this, but, back in 1999 and upto
August 2000, the Nintendo Dolphin, which ARTX was the central hardware
developer of, was supposed to get 8 MB to 16 MB of embedded 1T-SRAM on that
Flipper GPU -- but by Spaceworld in Aug 2000, that amount was cut to 3.12
MB.

(the main system memory was changed from 32~64 MB of NEC DRAM to 24 MB of
MoSys 1T-SRAM)


Now we learn that MoSys is again back with Nintendo for the Gamecube's
successor, the Revolution. there is almost no doubt that ATI West Coast, the
Silicon Valley design center in Santa Clara, CA is working with MoSys and
NEC to embedded some next generation 1T-SRAM onto Revolution's GPU,
codenamed 'Hollywood'.

how much baby, that is the question! "
Anonymous
May 10, 2005 8:16:58 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

oh... I meant to say "last decades news"
Anonymous
May 10, 2005 8:54:39 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
> http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>
> (read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>
> Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will be
using
> MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>


Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an "advantage"
depends on the quality of games released for it.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 2:34:00 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 nintendog <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote:
> http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846

> (read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)

> Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will be using
> MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.

Does it really matter what sort of memory is being used? I mean, we
aren't talking about a standard PC here... So will this memory allow GC
to run at higher resolutions like XBox360? (that's one big area I think
Nintendo blew it with GCN - no commercially available component video
kits!) Better anti-aliasing? More pixels for Mario's over-sized nose?
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 9:23:59 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

And what makes a console different from a PC other than the fact that
the hardware is not standardized and that it runs a low level OS rather
than one you interact and manipulate with? Same basic architeture. RAM
can make a significant difference when it comes to performance, just as
with a PC.


Doug Jacobs wrote:
> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 nintendog
<nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote:
> > http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>
> > (read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>
> > Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will
be using
> > MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>
> Does it really matter what sort of memory is being used? I mean, we
> aren't talking about a standard PC here... So will this memory allow
GC
> to run at higher resolutions like XBox360? (that's one big area I
think
> Nintendo blew it with GCN - no commercially available component video

> kits!) Better anti-aliasing? More pixels for Mario's over-sized
nose?
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 3:22:30 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

I certainly did not realize that the paragraph I quoted entailed so
many things. My mere point is that developers will think closely what
RAM to use in the consoles. Does it matter to you? Probably not, but
then it probably also doesn't matter to you what kind of RAM is in your
PC. I agree that overall performance is what most people will see in
the end.

Your assumption that a console is a close system is wrong though. While
a console is not designed to be expanded, it very well can be expanded,
though most people would call this modding or hacking. For example,
consoles fall very much under the same hardware standards set by ISO or
ITU as PCs do. They use standard communication protocols among hardware
components and while physical connectors may differ their purpose is
the same. Indeed, with some expertise you could even "upgrade" your
washer and dryer MCU, though the benifits would of course be marginal
to zero. However, even the smallest MCUs work in much the same manner
as everything on your PC motherboard does.

Anyway, carry on...

Doug Jacobs wrote:
> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Christian Winter
<cwinter@gmail.com> wrote:
> > And what makes a console different from a PC other than the fact
that
> > the hardware is not standardized and that it runs a low level OS
rather
> > than one you interact and manipulate with? Same basic architeture.
RAM
> > can make a significant difference when it comes to performance,
just as
> > with a PC.
>
> While you are correct in that a PC and a console have a lot of
hardware in
> common, their purposes are very different.
>
> A PC is an open, general purpose device - more like a car. You can
tweak
> its performance by choosing your parts and software carefully.
>
> A console, however, has only one purpose - to play games. Unlike a
PC,
> you cannot open it up and start swapping parts in or out to enhance
its
> performance. A console is an appliance - it was designed to only do
one
> thing - and do it well. It's like your toaster.
>
> Now I don't know about you, but I don't decide which appliances to
buy
> based on their processors or RAM. I only care that the thing does
the
> job it was designed to do - be it toast my bread, or play games.
>
> Now, I know from an architecture point of view, the amount and specs
of the
> memory used will affect the console's overall performance. But none
of
> that really matters if the thing doesn't play interesting games.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 3:37:01 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

That's the funnies thing I've seen in a while. Because women do not
like the look of the XBOX 360 (who says that anyway?) and because they
hold the strings of the purse (maybe you oughta not marry or think
divorce), the XBOX 360 will fail as the center of the home
entertainment system.

Sounds scientifically sound to me...

Jim Campey wrote:
> On Wed, 11 May 2005 16:47:18 -0000, Doug Jacobs
> <djacobs@shell.rawbw.com> wrote:
>
> >As for Sony and Microsoft, they've both made grandiose speeches
about how
> >their console would be the center of your home entertainment unit,
>
> The problem with their vision is that they've fu**ed the whole idea
up
> by making it white (allegedly). If they truly wanted the Xbox360 to
be
> "the centre of your home entertainment" then they should have made it
> black or silver, to blend in with the rest of today's multimedia
> equipment.
>
> Like it or not, in the majority of households the women choose the
> decor. I can't see many women choosing a white box as "the centre of
> (their) home entertainment" :) 
>
> What it does is important to the majority of men, what it looks like
> is important to the majority of women (who usually hold the purse
> strings <lol>)
>
> Apologies for the sexist (but true) statements ;) 
>
> --
> Jim
>
> \\// ||) //\\ \\//
> GT: HedCase
> //\\ ||) \\// //\\
>
>
> And if one bad cluster should accidentally fail...
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 4:01:52 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>, nightsky421@yahoo.ca
says...
> "nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
> news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
> > http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
> >
> > (read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
> >
> > Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will be
> using
> > MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
> >
>
>
> Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an "advantage"
> depends on the quality of games released for it.
>
>
>


not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 4:01:53 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
> In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>, nightsky421@yahoo.ca
> says...
>
>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
>>
>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>>>
>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>>>
>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will be
>>
>>using
>>
>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>>>
>>
>>
>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an "advantage"
>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
> not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.

Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games. That
is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 4:03:02 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

For what reason is a mystery though. Do they want their games to run
really really fast? Especailly the older consoles, just like old
computers, rely heavily on the clock.

Fred Liken wrote:
> People overclock Segas and Nintendos.
>
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 4:30:23 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

I am not sure if this seems reasonable. From my understanding the NES
creates a vertical blank every 8 pixes, which is generated by the MCU.
Hence, overclocking will increase the frequency at which it does this
and should hence speed up games that normally ran fine. Of course, this
does entail what you said, that otherwise laggy games would speed up.

Fred Liken wrote:
> "Christian Winter" <cwinter@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1115838182.198540.282250@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> > Fred Liken wrote:
>
> >> People overclock Segas and Nintendos.
>
> > For what reason is a mystery though. Do they want their games to
run
> > really really fast? Especailly the older consoles, just like old
> > computers, rely heavily on the clock.
>
> Not true. They [NES/GEN] rely on the vertical blank, not the clock,
for
> game speed. It doesn't speed up the game beyond that, but it keeps
it from
> taking multiple blanks to render, therefore eliminating slow down,
etc.
>
> It makes otherwise laggy games run perfect.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 5:37:43 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>
>
> Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
> > In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>, nightsky421@yahoo.ca
> > says...
> >
> >>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
> >>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
> >>
> >>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
> >>>
> >>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
> >>>
> >>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will be
> >>
> >>using
> >>
> >>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
> >>>
> >>
> >>
> >>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an "advantage"
> >>depends on the quality of games released for it.
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>
> Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games. That
> is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
>
>


best change your way of thinking.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 5:37:44 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
> In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
> massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>
>>
>>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>>
>>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>, nightsky421@yahoo.ca
>>>says...
>>>
>>>
>>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>>>>>
>>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>>>>>
>>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will be
>>>>
>>>>using
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an "advantage"
>>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>>
>>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games. That
>>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
>>
>>
>
>
>
> best change your way of thinking.

And why is that?!?
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 5:52:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

People overclock Segas and Nintendos.

"Christian Winter" <cwinter@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1115835750.404492.151920@f14g2000cwb.googlegroups.com...
>I certainly did not realize that the paragraph I quoted entailed so
> many things. My mere point is that developers will think closely what
> RAM to use in the consoles. Does it matter to you? Probably not, but
> then it probably also doesn't matter to you what kind of RAM is in your
> PC. I agree that overall performance is what most people will see in
> the end.
>
> Your assumption that a console is a close system is wrong though. While
> a console is not designed to be expanded, it very well can be expanded,
> though most people would call this modding or hacking. For example,
> consoles fall very much under the same hardware standards set by ISO or
> ITU as PCs do. They use standard communication protocols among hardware
> components and while physical connectors may differ their purpose is
> the same. Indeed, with some expertise you could even "upgrade" your
> washer and dryer MCU, though the benifits would of course be marginal
> to zero. However, even the smallest MCUs work in much the same manner
> as everything on your PC motherboard does.
>
> Anyway, carry on...
>
> Doug Jacobs wrote:
>> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Christian Winter
> <cwinter@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > And what makes a console different from a PC other than the fact
> that
>> > the hardware is not standardized and that it runs a low level OS
> rather
>> > than one you interact and manipulate with? Same basic architeture.
> RAM
>> > can make a significant difference when it comes to performance,
> just as
>> > with a PC.
>>
>> While you are correct in that a PC and a console have a lot of
> hardware in
>> common, their purposes are very different.
>>
>> A PC is an open, general purpose device - more like a car. You can
> tweak
>> its performance by choosing your parts and software carefully.
>>
>> A console, however, has only one purpose - to play games. Unlike a
> PC,
>> you cannot open it up and start swapping parts in or out to enhance
> its
>> performance. A console is an appliance - it was designed to only do
> one
>> thing - and do it well. It's like your toaster.
>>
>> Now I don't know about you, but I don't decide which appliances to
> buy
>> based on their processors or RAM. I only care that the thing does
> the
>> job it was designed to do - be it toast my bread, or play games.
>>
>> Now, I know from an architecture point of view, the amount and specs
> of the
>> memory used will affect the console's overall performance. But none
> of
>> that really matters if the thing doesn't play interesting games.
>
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 6:22:01 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

"Christian Winter" <cwinter@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1115838182.198540.282250@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
> Fred Liken wrote:

>> People overclock Segas and Nintendos.

> For what reason is a mystery though. Do they want their games to run
> really really fast? Especailly the older consoles, just like old
> computers, rely heavily on the clock.

Not true. They [NES/GEN] rely on the vertical blank, not the clock, for
game speed. It doesn't speed up the game beyond that, but it keeps it from
taking multiple blanks to render, therefore eliminating slow down, etc.

It makes otherwise laggy games run perfect.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 6:59:02 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>
>
> Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
> > In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
> >
> >>
> >>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
> >>
> >>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>, nightsky421@yahoo.ca
> >>>says...
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
> >>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
> >>>>>
> >>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
> >>>>>
> >>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will be
> >>>>
> >>>>using
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an "advantage"
> >>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
> >>
> >>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games. That
> >>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > best change your way of thinking.
>
> And why is that?!?
>
>

Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 6:59:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1cec3c1d246f5855989b99@News.Individual.net...
> In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
> massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>>
>>
>> Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>> > In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
>> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>> >
>> >>
>> >>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>> >>
>> >>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>, nightsky421@yahoo.ca
>> >>>says...
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
>> >>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will
>> >>>>>be
>> >>>>
>> >>>>using
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an
>> >>>>"advantage"
>> >>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>> >>
>> >>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games. That
>> >>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > best change your way of thinking.
>>
>> And why is that?!?
>>
>>
>
> Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.

That is all it is about for me, I have never watched a DVD on my PS2, why?
Because it isn't for watching movies, I have a DVD player and a VCR for
that, the PS2 is for games plain and simple, if I owned an Xbox it would be
the same way. There is no way a console is ever going to do anything better
than another device other than play video games.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 6:59:04 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"Daniel G." <Danny73@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message
news:D 9KdnUHm7cUnAxzfRVn-iQ@wideopenwest.com...
>
> "Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
> news:MPG.1cec3c1d246f5855989b99@News.Individual.net...
> > In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
> >>
> >>
> >> Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
> >> > In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
> >> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>,
nightsky421@yahoo.ca
> >> >>>says...
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
> >> >>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it
will
> >> >>>>>be
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>using
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an
> >> >>>>"advantage"
> >> >>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
> >> >>
> >> >>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games.
That
> >> >>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > best change your way of thinking.
> >>
> >> And why is that?!?
> >>
> >>
> >
> > Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>
> That is all it is about for me, I have never watched a DVD on my PS2, why?
> Because it isn't for watching movies, I have a DVD player and a VCR for
> that, the PS2 is for games plain and simple, if I owned an Xbox it would
be
> the same way. There is no way a console is ever going to do anything
better
> than another device other than play video games.
>

I have the same opinion as you, but then that is just our opinions. There
are many people I know who bought a PS2 because it could play DVD's as
well - this was a major selling point for them. There are people who dont
see the point in spending extra money to have a standalone DVD player, or
whatever other standalone piece of hardware the console in question is
substituting for. I would probably say the majority of people think that
way, especially the younger generation who cannot afford to buy multiple
pieces of home entertainment hardware.

m0ns00n
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 7:09:02 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

>"Christian Winter" <cwinter@gmail.com> wrote in message

>> Fred Liken wrote:
>>
>> Not true. They [NES/GEN] rely on the vertical blank, not the clock,
> for
>> game speed. It doesn't speed up the game beyond that, but it keeps
> it from
>> taking multiple blanks to render, therefore eliminating slow down,
> etc.
>>
>> It makes otherwise laggy games run perfect.

>I am not sure if this seems reasonable. From my understanding the NES
> creates a vertical blank every 8 pixes, which is generated by the MCU.

The PPU handles the vertical blank throttling, not the CPU. Overclocking
the CPU won't change the vertical blank rate. It's perfectly "reasonable".

> Hence, overclocking will increase the frequency at which it does this
> and should hence speed up games that normally ran fine.

No, overclocking the CPU will not affect the game speed when the CPU is
waiting on the PPU. Overclocking the CPU, though, eliminates the instances
where the PPU is waiting on the CPU.

> Of course, this
> does entail what you said, that otherwise laggy games would speed up.

That's about all it does, except on the NES it does raise the pitch of the
sound effects, IIRC, because the NES uses the CPU for sound processing.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 7:40:48 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

m0ns00n wrote:
> "Daniel G." <Danny73@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:D 9KdnUHm7cUnAxzfRVn-iQ@wideopenwest.com...
>
>>"Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
>>news:MPG.1cec3c1d246f5855989b99@News.Individual.net...
>>
>>>In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
>>>massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>>>
>>>>
>>>>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
>>>>>massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>,
>>>>>>
> nightsky421@yahoo.ca
>
>>>>>>>says...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it
>>>>>>>>
> will
>
>>>>>>>>>be
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>using
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an
>>>>>>>>"advantage"
>>>>>>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games.
>>>>>
> That
>
>>>>>>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>best change your way of thinking.
>>>>
>>>>And why is that?!?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>>
>>That is all it is about for me, I have never watched a DVD on my PS2, why?
>>Because it isn't for watching movies, I have a DVD player and a VCR for
>>that, the PS2 is for games plain and simple, if I owned an Xbox it would
>
> be
>
>>the same way. There is no way a console is ever going to do anything
>
> better
>
>>than another device other than play video games.
>>
>
>
> I have the same opinion as you, but then that is just our opinions. There
> are many people I know who bought a PS2 because it could play DVD's as
> well - this was a major selling point for them. There are people who dont
> see the point in spending extra money to have a standalone DVD player, or
> whatever other standalone piece of hardware the console in question is
> substituting for. I would probably say the majority of people think that
> way, especially the younger generation who cannot afford to buy multiple
> pieces of home entertainment hardware.
>
> m0ns00n
>

Early on when the PS2 came out it made some sense to buy and use it for
the DVD function also as the price of DVD players was still up there.
Now it doesn't as you can get a DVD player for as little as $30 or less.

We are headed towards having all in one type media
centers/PC/gaming?etc.. unit for everything. It is still a little ways
off though before that really takes off and gets perfected.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 8:23:03 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

In article <d9KdnUHm7cUnAxzfRVn-iQ@wideopenwest.com>, Danny73
@columbus.rr.com says...
>
> "Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
> news:MPG.1cec3c1d246f5855989b99@News.Individual.net...
> > In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
> >>
> >>
> >> Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
> >> > In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
> >> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
> >> >
> >> >>
> >> >>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>, nightsky421@yahoo.ca
> >> >>>says...
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
> >> >>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will
> >> >>>>>be
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>using
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an
> >> >>>>"advantage"
> >> >>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
> >> >>
> >> >>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games. That
> >> >>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > best change your way of thinking.
> >>
> >> And why is that?!?
> >>
> >>
> >
> > Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>
> That is all it is about for me, I have never watched a DVD on my PS2, why?
> Because it isn't for watching movies, I have a DVD player and a VCR for
> that, the PS2 is for games plain and simple, if I owned an Xbox it would be
> the same way. There is no way a console is ever going to do anything better
> than another device other than play video games.
>
>
>


Then you haven't played with XBMC and are missing out on easily the best
multimedia system out there (for the price).

You'll eventually change your mind.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 8:23:04 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
news:MPG.1cec4fd59e80b50d989b9a@News.Individual.net...
> In article <d9KdnUHm7cUnAxzfRVn-iQ@wideopenwest.com>, Danny73
> @columbus.rr.com says...
>>
>> "Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
>> news:MPG.1cec3c1d246f5855989b99@News.Individual.net...
>> > In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
>> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>> >> > In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
>> >> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>,
>> >> >>>nightsky421@yahoo.ca
>> >> >>>says...
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
>> >> >>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it
>> >> >>>>>will
>> >> >>>>>be
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>using
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an
>> >> >>>>"advantage"
>> >> >>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games.
>> >> >>That
>> >> >>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > best change your way of thinking.
>> >>
>> >> And why is that?!?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> > Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>>
>> That is all it is about for me, I have never watched a DVD on my PS2,
>> why?
>> Because it isn't for watching movies, I have a DVD player and a VCR for
>> that, the PS2 is for games plain and simple, if I owned an Xbox it would
>> be
>> the same way. There is no way a console is ever going to do anything
>> better
>> than another device other than play video games.
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> Then you haven't played with XBMC and are missing out on easily the best
> multimedia system out there (for the price).
>
> You'll eventually change your mind.
>
>

We will see, what is XBMC, I have no clue what that is, have never heard of
it.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 8:23:05 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"Daniel G." <Danny73@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message
news:x-SdnfE5n4OuXRzfRVn-qA@wideopenwest.com...
>
> "Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
> news:MPG.1cec4fd59e80b50d989b9a@News.Individual.net...
>> In article <d9KdnUHm7cUnAxzfRVn-iQ@wideopenwest.com>, Danny73
>> @columbus.rr.com says...
>>>
>>> "Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
>>> news:MPG.1cec3c1d246f5855989b99@News.Individual.net...
>>> > In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
>>> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>>> >> > In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
>>> >> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>>> >> >
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>,
>>> >> >>>nightsky421@yahoo.ca
>>> >> >>>says...
>>> >> >>>
>>> >> >>>
>>> >> >>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
>>> >> >>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>>> >> >>>>>
>>> >> >>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>>> >> >>>>>
>>> >> >>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it
>>> >> >>>>>will
>>> >> >>>>>be
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>using
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>>> >> >>>>>
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an
>>> >> >>>>"advantage"
>>> >> >>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>>
>>> >> >>>
>>> >> >>>
>>> >> >>>
>>> >> >>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games.
>>> >> >>That
>>> >> >>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >>
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > best change your way of thinking.
>>> >>
>>> >> And why is that?!?
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >
>>> > Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>>>
>>> That is all it is about for me, I have never watched a DVD on my PS2,
>>> why?
>>> Because it isn't for watching movies, I have a DVD player and a VCR for
>>> that, the PS2 is for games plain and simple, if I owned an Xbox it would
>>> be
>>> the same way. There is no way a console is ever going to do anything
>>> better
>>> than another device other than play video games.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>> Then you haven't played with XBMC and are missing out on easily the best
>> multimedia system out there (for the price).
>>
>> You'll eventually change your mind.
>>
>>
>
> We will see, what is XBMC, I have no clue what that is, have never heard
> of it.
>

Nevermind did a google on it, I doubt that I will ever change my mind now.
I have no desire to to cram my entertainment center into one device and
highly doubt that an Xbox could take the place of everything in my
entertainment center.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 8:37:34 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Christian Winter <cwinter@gmail.com> wrote:
> And what makes a console different from a PC other than the fact that
> the hardware is not standardized and that it runs a low level OS rather
> than one you interact and manipulate with? Same basic architeture. RAM
> can make a significant difference when it comes to performance, just as
> with a PC.

While you are correct in that a PC and a console have a lot of hardware in
common, their purposes are very different.

A PC is an open, general purpose device - more like a car. You can tweak
its performance by choosing your parts and software carefully.

A console, however, has only one purpose - to play games. Unlike a PC,
you cannot open it up and start swapping parts in or out to enhance its
performance. A console is an appliance - it was designed to only do one
thing - and do it well. It's like your toaster.

Now I don't know about you, but I don't decide which appliances to buy
based on their processors or RAM. I only care that the thing does the
job it was designed to do - be it toast my bread, or play games.

Now, I know from an architecture point of view, the amount and specs of the
memory used will affect the console's overall performance. But none of
that really matters if the thing doesn't play interesting games.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 8:47:18 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia. <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:

> not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.

Bah, that's a whole other market. "Convergence" is an overhyped buzzword
from the 90s that has yet to produce a truly outstanding, viable product.

Nintendo stated they were only interested in creating a game system with
the Game Cube, and I believe they'll stick to that vision with the
Revolution.

As for Sony and Microsoft, they've both made grandiose speeches about how
their console would be the center of your home entertainment unit, but
very little in that direction has materialized.

We've heard how Xbox360 will be able to use WebTV, and possibly access
media stored on PCs in your home. But realistically now, how many average
consumers are going to be interested in features like that? Even those
who would be interested would probably be more interested in buying a
dedicated media box in addition to (or instead of) an all-in-one device.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 8:47:19 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

"Doug Jacobs" <djacobs@shell.rawbw.com> wrote in message
news:1184dom8n9bk579@corp.supernews.com...
> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia.
> <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:
>
>> not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>
> Bah, that's a whole other market. "Convergence" is an overhyped buzzword
> from the 90s that has yet to produce a truly outstanding, viable product.

lol. What about all those Camera Phones out there? Truly outstanding
adoption.

> We've heard how Xbox360 will be able to use WebTV, and possibly access
> media stored on PCs in your home. But realistically now, how many average
> consumers are going to be interested in features like that?

How many people have Tivo's? There's HUGE interest in features like that.

> Even those
> who would be interested would probably be more interested in buying a
> dedicated media box in addition to (or instead of) an all-in-one device.

Not when they aren't any better.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 8:49:53 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia. <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:

> Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.

Yeah, I always though the best console was the one I could use as a
backscratcher.

Seriously though, what are you talking about?

If you're thinking people will buy a *game* console based on how well it
plays DVDs, or streams audio from your PC - I've got news for you. There
are cheaper devices out there that do those tasks *better* than what a
console is going to cost.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 8:49:54 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

"Doug Jacobs" <djacobs@shell.rawbw.com> wrote in message
news:1184dthmembui1f@corp.supernews.com...

> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia.
> <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:
>
>> Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>
> Yeah, I always though the best console was the one I could use as a
> backscratcher.
>
> Seriously though, what are you talking about?
>
> If you're thinking people will buy a *game* console based on how well it
> plays DVDs, or streams audio from your PC

Streams video... silly goose!

> - I've got news for you. There
> are cheaper devices out there that do those tasks *better* than what a
> console is going to cost.

What does it better, son? Put a potatoes in it. You're making an ass of
yourself like last time.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 8:49:54 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Doug Jacobs wrote:
> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia. <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:
>
>
>>Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>
>
> Yeah, I always though the best console was the one I could use as a
> backscratcher.
>
> Seriously though, what are you talking about?
>
> If you're thinking people will buy a *game* console based on how well it
> plays DVDs, or streams audio from your PC - I've got news for you. There
> are cheaper devices out there that do those tasks *better* than what a
> console is going to cost.

Yep, it will happen down the road...the all in one thing. But that is a
ways off, or is as far as being popular and being perfected and totally
worth using. At this time better using different things for different
purposes still.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 9:25:29 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 m0ns00n <snarf@snarf.com> wrote:

> I have the same opinion as you, but then that is just our opinions. There
> are many people I know who bought a PS2 because it could play DVD's as
> well - this was a major selling point for them. There are people who dont
> see the point in spending extra money to have a standalone DVD player, or
> whatever other standalone piece of hardware the console in question is
> substituting for. I would probably say the majority of people think that
> way, especially the younger generation who cannot afford to buy multiple
> pieces of home entertainment hardware.

Well, I did buy a PS2 for both its gaming and DVD capabilities...but only
until I got a dedicated DVD player.

Today, DVD players have become so cheap and commonplace now that it'd be
silly to buy a PS2 or XBox just to play DVDs on it. Especially since you
can get a DVD player for $35-50, as compared to the price of XBxo360 which
is estimated to be $299 or $360 for the one with a small HD.
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 10:28:55 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

On Wed, 11 May 2005 16:47:18 -0000, Doug Jacobs
<djacobs@shell.rawbw.com> wrote:

>As for Sony and Microsoft, they've both made grandiose speeches about how
>their console would be the center of your home entertainment unit,

The problem with their vision is that they've fu**ed the whole idea up
by making it white (allegedly). If they truly wanted the Xbox360 to be
"the centre of your home entertainment" then they should have made it
black or silver, to blend in with the rest of today's multimedia
equipment.

Like it or not, in the majority of households the women choose the
decor. I can't see many women choosing a white box as "the centre of
(their) home entertainment" :) 

What it does is important to the majority of men, what it looks like
is important to the majority of women (who usually hold the purse
strings <lol>)

Apologies for the sexist (but true) statements ;) 

--
Jim

\\// ||) //\\ \\//
GT: HedCase
//\\ ||) \\// //\\


And if one bad cluster should accidentally fail...
Anonymous
May 11, 2005 10:56:59 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"m0ns00n" <snarf@snarf.com> wrote in message
news:uolge.2037$hn5.120@newsfe2-win.ntli.net...
>
> "Daniel G." <Danny73@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:D 9KdnUHm7cUnAxzfRVn-iQ@wideopenwest.com...
>>
>> "Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
>> news:MPG.1cec3c1d246f5855989b99@News.Individual.net...
>> > In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
>> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>> >> > In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
>> >> > massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>> >> >
>> >> >>
>> >> >>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>> >> >>
>> >> >>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>,
> nightsky421@yahoo.ca
>> >> >>>says...
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
>> >> >>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it
> will
>> >> >>>>>be
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>using
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>> >> >>>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an
>> >> >>>>"advantage"
>> >> >>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>
>> >> >>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>> >> >>
>> >> >>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games.
> That
>> >> >>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
>> >> >>
>> >> >>
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > best change your way of thinking.
>> >>
>> >> And why is that?!?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>> > Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>>
>> That is all it is about for me, I have never watched a DVD on my PS2,
>> why?
>> Because it isn't for watching movies, I have a DVD player and a VCR for
>> that, the PS2 is for games plain and simple, if I owned an Xbox it would
> be
>> the same way. There is no way a console is ever going to do anything
> better
>> than another device other than play video games.
>>
>
> I have the same opinion as you, but then that is just our opinions. There
> are many people I know who bought a PS2 because it could play DVD's as
> well - this was a major selling point for them. There are people who dont
> see the point in spending extra money to have a standalone DVD player, or

So you can watch other media on it, Im not certain but I doubt a PS2 can
play DIVX files that were burned onto a DVD, or many other video formats.

> whatever other standalone piece of hardware the console in question is
> substituting for. I would probably say the majority of people think that
> way, especially the younger generation who cannot afford to buy multiple
> pieces of home entertainment hardware.
>
> m0ns00n
>
>
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 1:14:32 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

On 2005-05-11 19:28:55 +0100, Jim Campey <ugvx@no.jfcsoft.spam.co.uk> said:
>
> Like it or not, in the majority of households the women choose the
> decor. I can't see many women choosing a white box as "the centre of
> (their) home entertainment" :) 

Jesus, mate - it's not like you to talk such a load of bollocks! Sure,
women choose the decor - paint, wallpaper, sofas, that kind of thing -
mostly because men generally don't give a toss. Start talking about
"home entertainment centres", dual input loudspeakers and seperate pre-
and power amps, however, and their eyes quickly glaze over. Show me one
man whose hi-fi was chosen by his missus and I'll show you a divorce
waiting to happen ;-)

Choobs

--
Sir Chewbury Gubbins <chewbury.gubbins@nelefa.org>
Knight of the Wholly Gnarly Widget
http://www.nelesoft.com
http://www.nelefa.org
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 1:14:33 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

"Sir Chewbury Gubbins" <chewbury.gubbins@nelefa.org> wrote in message
news:3ef7d8F2pqf7U1@individual.net...
> On 2005-05-11 19:28:55 +0100, Jim Campey <ugvx@no.jfcsoft.spam.co.uk>
> said:
>>
>> Like it or not, in the majority of households the women choose the
>> decor. I can't see many women choosing a white box as "the centre of
>> (their) home entertainment" :) 
>
> Jesus, mate - it's not like you to talk such a load of bollocks! Sure,
> women choose the decor - paint, wallpaper, sofas, that kind of thing -
> mostly because men generally don't give a toss. Start talking about "home
> entertainment centres", dual input loudspeakers and seperate pre- and
> power amps, however, and their eyes quickly glaze over. Show me one man
> whose hi-fi was chosen by his missus and I'll show you a divorce waiting
> to happen ;-)

Dude, you're talking about some of the most pussy whipped guys on the face
of the earth, here. loll. Total limps, they are.
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 1:44:22 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

In alt.games.video.xbox Fred Liken <fredliken@toocool4school.com> wrote:

> > Bah, that's a whole other market. "Convergence" is an overhyped buzzword
> > from the 90s that has yet to produce a truly outstanding, viable product.

> lol. What about all those Camera Phones out there? Truly outstanding
> adoption.

The camera in the camera phone isn't nearly as good or feature-rich as a
dedicated camera. Personally, I'd rather trade the "camera" part of my
phone for better reception and coverage - I never use the camera.

> > We've heard how Xbox360 will be able to use WebTV, and possibly access
> > media stored on PCs in your home. But realistically now, how many average
> > consumers are going to be interested in features like that?

> How many people have Tivo's? There's HUGE interest in features like that.

Ok, there's been a lot of talk about shoving a DVR into a game console,
but let's think about the reality of such a device. You're going to end
up with a device that will cost more than a console + Tivo, or you're
going to end up with sub-standard device that doesn't really have the
horsepower the play games and record your shows.

Realtime MPEG encoding of a video signal that Tivo and other DVRs do
requires quite a bit of dedicated processing power, not to mention the
system memory and huge HD.

> > Even those
> > who would be interested would probably be more interested in buying a
> > dedicated media box in addition to (or instead of) an all-in-one device.

> Not when they aren't any better.

Better than what, the XBox? Microsoft's Media Center? The set-top boxes
are either dedicated streaming boxes - which makes them cheaper than the
upcoming XBox360 - or have a larger HD than the XBox360 for the same price.
Either way, I'd consider one of these dedicated boxes before trying to get
my game machine to play music.
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 1:44:23 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

"Doug Jacobs" <djacobs@shell.rawbw.com> wrote in message
news:1184v5mnqfjvje5@corp.supernews.com...
> In alt.games.video.xbox Fred Liken <fredliken@toocool4school.com> wrote:
>
>> > Bah, that's a whole other market. "Convergence" is an overhyped
>> > buzzword
>> > from the 90s that has yet to produce a truly outstanding, viable
>> > product.
>
>> lol. What about all those Camera Phones out there? Truly outstanding
>> adoption.
>
> The camera in the camera phone isn't nearly as good or feature-rich as a
> dedicated camera. Personally, I'd rather trade the "camera" part of my
> phone for better reception and coverage - I never use the camera.

That's a straw man argument and moot as all hell. The fact is that A) it is
convergence and B) it has caught on like wildfire. Moving the goal posts
hardly makes for good debate, my friend.

>> > We've heard how Xbox360 will be able to use WebTV, and possibly access
>> > media stored on PCs in your home. But realistically now, how many
>> > average
>> > consumers are going to be interested in features like that?
>
>> How many people have Tivo's? There's HUGE interest in features like
>> that.
>
> Ok, there's been a lot of talk about shoving a DVR into a game console,
> but let's think about the reality of such a device.

lol.

> You're going to end
> up with a device that will cost more than a console + Tivo, or you're
> going to end up with sub-standard device that doesn't really have the
> horsepower the play games and record your shows.

That's pure ignorance.

It's not apples and oranges, my friend. There is quite a bit of hardware
overlap between a game console and a DVR, for example the video decoder,
etc.

Since they share much of the same architecture (well actually a DVR would be
a subset of a game console for the most part) you don't have to do your
little "Adding of the Costs". You'd have to add an encoder, ASSUMING it
wasn't spec'ed already for the game console.

And, a Tivo is basically a console to begin with. One that has a FRACTION
of the power of a 360. You don't seem to understand the a Tivo is nothing
more than a weak linux box.

> Realtime MPEG encoding of a video signal that Tivo and other DVRs do
> requires quite a bit of dedicated processing power,

I can only assume by "quite a bit of dedicated processing power" you mean of
the CPU, or this statement is moot. It takes hardly any CPU to encode a
video signal. It uses subsystems. For example,
http://products.sel.sony.com/semi/PDF/CXD1922Q.pdf

It makes lots of sense since you already have all the parts to a DVR there,
just need one little CHEAP chip.

> not to mention the system memory

Man you need to keep up with the times, my friend. Honestly. The Tivo only
has 16 megs of ram. Hardly worth mentioning.

> and huge HD.

Again, get with the times. How much do you think an OEM 40-80GB drive costs
wholesale?

>> > Even those
>> > who would be interested would probably be more interested in buying a
>> > dedicated media box in addition to (or instead of) an all-in-one
>> > device.
>
>> Not when they aren't any better.
>
> Better than what, the XBox?

360?

> Microsoft's Media Center? The set-top boxes
> are either dedicated streaming boxes - which makes them cheaper than the
> upcoming XBox360 - or have a larger HD than the XBox360 for the same
> price.
> Either way, I'd consider one of these dedicated boxes before trying to get
> my game machine to play music.

Of course YOU would. You're hardly tech savvy.
May 12, 2005 1:48:52 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Christian Winter wrote:
> I certainly did not realize that the paragraph I quoted entailed so
> many things. My mere point is that developers will think closely what
> RAM to use in the consoles. Does it matter to you? Probably not, but
> then it probably also doesn't matter to you what kind of RAM is in your
> PC. I agree that overall performance is what most people will see in
> the end.
>
> Your assumption that a console is a close system is wrong though. While
> a console is not designed to be expanded, it very well can be expanded,
> though most people would call this modding or hacking. For example,
> consoles fall very much under the same hardware standards set by ISO or
> ITU as PCs do. They use standard communication protocols among hardware
> components and while physical connectors may differ their purpose is
> the same. Indeed, with some expertise you could even "upgrade" your
> washer and dryer MCU, though the benifits would of course be marginal
> to zero. However, even the smallest MCUs work in much the same manner
> as everything on your PC motherboard does.
>
> Anyway, carry on...
>

Xbox is overclockable to 1.4 Tulatatin PIII and 128MB or RAM. Biggest
advantage in doing so is native HD support with the right software. As
it stands the xbox can upscale DVDs and .avis beautifully to 720p or
1080i..... you're very right in stating a console is very much NOT a
closed system. Some system architecutures are VERY different from a
standard PC as well.
May 12, 2005 1:52:44 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Doug Jacobs wrote:
> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 m0ns00n <snarf@snarf.com> wrote:
>
>
>>I have the same opinion as you, but then that is just our opinions. There
>>are many people I know who bought a PS2 because it could play DVD's as
>>well - this was a major selling point for them. There are people who dont
>>see the point in spending extra money to have a standalone DVD player, or
>>whatever other standalone piece of hardware the console in question is
>>substituting for. I would probably say the majority of people think that
>>way, especially the younger generation who cannot afford to buy multiple
>>pieces of home entertainment hardware.
>
>
> Well, I did buy a PS2 for both its gaming and DVD capabilities...but only
> until I got a dedicated DVD player.
>
> Today, DVD players have become so cheap and commonplace now that it'd be
> silly to buy a PS2 or XBox just to play DVDs on it. Especially since you
> can get a DVD player for $35-50, as compared to the price of XBxo360 which
> is estimated to be $299 or $360 for the one with a small HD.
>


dont be so sure of yourself. They are few, if any DVD players on the
market today that can compare to what the Xbox can bench. Can you say...
720p/1080i upscaling?
May 12, 2005 1:58:24 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Doug Jacobs wrote:
> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia. <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:
>
>
>>Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>
>
> Yeah, I always though the best console was the one I could use as a
> backscratcher.
>
> Seriously though, what are you talking about?
>
> If you're thinking people will buy a *game* console based on how well it
> plays DVDs, or streams audio from your PC - I've got news for you. There
> are cheaper devices out there that do those tasks *better* than what a
> console is going to cost.


Doug, you really must stop.....you're sounding sillier as you progress.
Perhaps because you haven't cracked the box, you have no idea of its
capabilities.. I'll eat my shoe if you can point me to a product that
both plays dvds and streams better with all the bellls and whistles
(ambiguous aren't we?).... BTW, we're not talking about HTPCs....there
is NOTHING on the consumer market that comes even....slightly......close
to the feature set that XBMC offers.
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 1:58:25 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

"theOne" <theOneOne@dodgeit.com> wrote in message
news:4evge.1279$j17.8@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...
> Doug Jacobs wrote:

> Doug, you really must stop.....you're sounding sillier as you progress.

Dude, that's Doug Jacobs' MO. Silly foolishness.
May 12, 2005 2:00:09 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

massivegrooves wrote:
>
>
> Doug Jacobs wrote:
>
>> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia.
>> <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>>
>>
>>
>> Yeah, I always though the best console was the one I could use as a
>> backscratcher.
>>
>> Seriously though, what are you talking about?
>>
>> If you're thinking people will buy a *game* console based on how well
>> it plays DVDs, or streams audio from your PC - I've got news for you.
>> There are cheaper devices out there that do those tasks *better* than
>> what a console is going to cost.
>
>
> Yep, it will happen down the road...the all in one thing. But that is a
> ways off, or is as far as being popular and being perfected and totally
> worth using. At this time better using different things for different
> purposes still.
>
long way off? xbox does mostly everything now (less capture video and
burn DVDs). If MS knows what's up, they include a MCE 360 at a premium
price. or as a latter software upgrade.
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 2:00:10 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

theOne wrote:
> massivegrooves wrote:
>
>>
>>
>> Doug Jacobs wrote:
>>
>>> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia.
>>> <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yeah, I always though the best console was the one I could use as a
>>> backscratcher.
>>>
>>> Seriously though, what are you talking about?
>>>
>>> If you're thinking people will buy a *game* console based on how well
>>> it plays DVDs, or streams audio from your PC - I've got news for
>>> you. There are cheaper devices out there that do those tasks
>>> *better* than what a console is going to cost.
>>
>>
>>
>> Yep, it will happen down the road...the all in one thing. But that is
>> a ways off, or is as far as being popular and being perfected and
>> totally worth using. At this time better using different things for
>> different purposes still.
>>
> long way off? xbox does mostly everything now (less capture video and
> burn DVDs). If MS knows what's up, they include a MCE 360 at a premium
> price. or as a latter software upgrade.

It does a fair amount, but to do some stuff one must hack it. I am
talking about straight out of the box ready to do it all right then. We
are not quite there yet, not a "long way off" but a few more years
likely till the all in one media/entertainment/PC thing really takes
hold and takes over. It is coming and going to happen...not quite there
yet though.
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 2:00:11 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

"massivegrooves" <massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net> wrote in message
news:4282A92B.7090904@massivegrooves.net...
>
>
> theOne wrote:
>> massivegrooves wrote:
>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Doug Jacobs wrote:
>>>
>>>> In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia.
>>>> <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, I always though the best console was the one I could use as a
>>>> backscratcher.
>>>>
>>>> Seriously though, what are you talking about?
>>>>
>>>> If you're thinking people will buy a *game* console based on how well
>>>> it plays DVDs, or streams audio from your PC - I've got news for you.
>>>> There are cheaper devices out there that do those tasks *better* than
>>>> what a console is going to cost.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yep, it will happen down the road...the all in one thing. But that is a
>>> ways off, or is as far as being popular and being perfected and totally
>>> worth using. At this time better using different things for different
>>> purposes still.
>>>
>> long way off? xbox does mostly everything now (less capture video and
>> burn DVDs). If MS knows what's up, they include a MCE 360 at a premium
>> price. or as a latter software upgrade.
>
> It does a fair amount, but to do some stuff one must hack it. I am talking
> about straight out of the box ready to do it all right then. We are not
> quite there yet, not a "long way off" but a few more years likely till the
> all in one media/entertainment/PC thing really takes hold and takes over.
> It is coming and going to happen...not quite there yet though.

You don't think the 360 will be it?
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 2:01:05 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

Fred Liken wrote:
> "massivegrooves" <massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net> wrote in message
> news:4282A92B.7090904@massivegrooves.net...
>
>>
>>theOne wrote:
>>
>>>massivegrooves wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>>Doug Jacobs wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia.
>>>>><tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Yeah, I always though the best console was the one I could use as a
>>>>>backscratcher.
>>>>>
>>>>>Seriously though, what are you talking about?
>>>>>
>>>>>If you're thinking people will buy a *game* console based on how well
>>>>>it plays DVDs, or streams audio from your PC - I've got news for you.
>>>>>There are cheaper devices out there that do those tasks *better* than
>>>>>what a console is going to cost.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>Yep, it will happen down the road...the all in one thing. But that is a
>>>>ways off, or is as far as being popular and being perfected and totally
>>>>worth using. At this time better using different things for different
>>>>purposes still.
>>>>
>>>
>>>long way off? xbox does mostly everything now (less capture video and
>>>burn DVDs). If MS knows what's up, they include a MCE 360 at a premium
>>>price. or as a latter software upgrade.
>>
>>It does a fair amount, but to do some stuff one must hack it. I am talking
>>about straight out of the box ready to do it all right then. We are not
>>quite there yet, not a "long way off" but a few more years likely till the
>>all in one media/entertainment/PC thing really takes hold and takes over.
>>It is coming and going to happen...not quite there yet though.
>
>
> You don't think the 360 will be it?
>

It won't be "it", it will likely be a start towards moving people closer
and closer to the concept of the all-in-one media/entertainment/Pc. But
I don't see it as being the one that does it all, and all of it well.
When that happens it is likely IMO to be much closer to a PC type unit
than a console. It is on the way and only a matter of time though till
we will have everything in one unit and it will be worth having and do
all of it well. Not quite there yet from everything I have seen out
there up to this point.
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 2:01:06 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

"massivegrooves" <massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net> wrote in message
news:4282B8E1.2080602@massivegrooves.net...

>> You don't think the 360 will be it?
>
> It won't be "it", it will likely be a start towards moving people closer
> and closer to the concept of the all-in-one media/entertainment/Pc. But I
> don't see it as being the one that does it all, and all of it well. When
> that happens it is likely IMO to be much closer to a PC type unit than a
> console. It is on the way and only a matter of time though till we will
> have everything in one unit and it will be worth having and do all of it
> well. Not quite there yet from everything I have seen out there up to this
> point.

D'oh, I missed the PC part. No, the 360 won't have any meaningful "PC"
(kind of a vague comment, let's say Word Processing and Financials as a
litmus test for that?) functionality, I doubt, and therefore wouldn't fit
the bill... Well, unless they give it .NET and have it use Application
Service Providers... But, even then, it wouldn't be a full blown PC, but
that's not the discussion, is it? A trimmed down "PC" would be the all in
one deal, not a powerhouse PC, no?

I doubt that will be the case for the 360, but it wouldn't surprise me if it
turned out to be, especially with the .NET CLR, etc.
May 12, 2005 2:02:35 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

Fred Liken wrote:
> "Doug Jacobs" <djacobs@shell.rawbw.com> wrote in message
> news:1184dom8n9bk579@corp.supernews.com...
>
>>In alt.games.video.sony-playstation2 Fish! - of Arcadia.
>><tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>>
>>Bah, that's a whole other market. "Convergence" is an overhyped buzzword
>>from the 90s that has yet to produce a truly outstanding, viable product.
>
>
> lol. What about all those Camera Phones out there? Truly outstanding
> adoption.
>
>
>>We've heard how Xbox360 will be able to use WebTV, and possibly access
>>media stored on PCs in your home. But realistically now, how many average
>>consumers are going to be interested in features like that?
>
>
> How many people have Tivo's? There's HUGE interest in features like that.
>
>
>>Even those
>>who would be interested would probably be more interested in buying a
>>dedicated media box in addition to (or instead of) an all-in-one device.
>
>
> Not when they aren't any better.
>
>
Exactly.
May 12, 2005 2:08:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony (More info?)

Fred Liken wrote:
> "Christian Winter" <cwinter@gmail.com> wrote in message
> news:1115838182.198540.282250@z14g2000cwz.googlegroups.com...
>
>>Fred Liken wrote:
>
>
>>>People overclock Segas and Nintendos.
>
>
>>For what reason is a mystery though. Do they want their games to run
>>really really fast? Especailly the older consoles, just like old
>>computers, rely heavily on the clock.
>
>
> Not true. They [NES/GEN] rely on the vertical blank, not the clock, for
> game speed. It doesn't speed up the game beyond that, but it keeps it from
> taking multiple blanks to render, therefore eliminating slow down, etc.
>
> It makes otherwise laggy games run perfect.
>
food for thought:
there are alot of xbox games that heavily rely on the current PIII 733
architecture. 1.4 PIII Xboxes have problems with some games causing them
to run too fast and stutter. This is even in speed step 733mhz compliant
mode. I think a larger part has to do with the extra L2 too. Kinda of a
tradeoff really. If you want the box to natively play 720p and 1080i
video, it's a must.
May 12, 2005 2:11:17 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Daniel G. wrote:
> "Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
> news:MPG.1cec3c1d246f5855989b99@News.Individual.net...
>
>>In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
>>massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>>
>>>
>>>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>>>
>>>>In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
>>>>massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>, nightsky421@yahoo.ca
>>>>>>says...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it will
>>>>>>>>be
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>using
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an
>>>>>>>"advantage"
>>>>>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>>>>>
>>>>>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games. That
>>>>>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>best change your way of thinking.
>>>
>>>And why is that?!?
>>>
>>>
>>
>>Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>
>
> That is all it is about for me, I have never watched a DVD on my PS2, why?
> Because it isn't for watching movies, I have a DVD player and a VCR for
> that, the PS2 is for games plain and simple, if I owned an Xbox it would be
> the same way. There is no way a console is ever going to do anything better
> than another device other than play video games.
>
>
you really have to step outside that narrow square box you live
in.....it isn't 1985 anymore :) 
Anonymous
May 12, 2005 2:11:18 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"theOne" <theOneOne@dodgeit.com> wrote in message
news:9qvge.1286$j17.942@newssvr33.news.prodigy.com...
> Daniel G. wrote:
>> "Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
>> news:MPG.1cec3c1d246f5855989b99@News.Individual.net...
>>
>>>In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
>>>massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...

SNIP

>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>best change your way of thinking.
>>>>
>>>>And why is that?!?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>>
>>
>> That is all it is about for me, I have never watched a DVD on my PS2,
>> why? Because it isn't for watching movies, I have a DVD player and a VCR
>> for that, the PS2 is for games plain and simple, if I owned an Xbox it
>> would be the same way. There is no way a console is ever going to do
>> anything better than another device other than play video games.
> you really have to step outside that narrow square box you live in.....it
> isn't 1985 anymore :) 

No, it isn't but I do not want a game system that plays music, records TV or
lets me watch DVDs, I want a game system that plays games, I have a Tivo,
DVD player, MP3 Player, stereo and PC already, I don't need a game system
that does these things halfassed, because it will be overpriced and cost too
much for features I dont want or need. I refuse to buy and will never buy a
TV/VCR or DVD/VCR combo, I have tried them in the past and generally they
break then you have to replace both of them just because one of them quit
working. Why not just keep it all seperate, it is much easier to upgrade
your individual pieces of equipment rather than ending up replaced this "all
in one wonder unit" eveyrone seems to like. They and you can have it, I
want no part of it.
May 12, 2005 2:13:53 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.sony-playstation2,alt.games.video.xbox,microsoft.public.xbox,rec.games.video.sony,uk.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Daniel G. wrote:
> "Daniel G." <Danny73@columbus.rr.com> wrote in message
> news:x-SdnfE5n4OuXRzfRVn-qA@wideopenwest.com...
>
>>"Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
>>news:MPG.1cec4fd59e80b50d989b9a@News.Individual.net...
>>
>>>In article <d9KdnUHm7cUnAxzfRVn-iQ@wideopenwest.com>, Danny73
>>>@columbus.rr.com says...
>>>
>>>>"Fish! - of Arcadia." <tastyfish@fugu.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:MPG.1cec3c1d246f5855989b99@News.Individual.net...
>>>>
>>>>>In article <428182FF.50108@massivegrooves.net>,
>>>>>massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>In article <4281715D.8040608@massivegrooves.net>,
>>>>>>>massivegrooves@massivegrooves.net says...
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Fish! - of Arcadia. wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>In article <1182etlorvm60c2@corp.supernews.com>,
>>>>>>>>>nightsky421@yahoo.ca
>>>>>>>>>says...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>"nintendog" <nintendogs@revolution.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>>>>>news:UJednQSluZSzkhzfRVn-2g@comcast.com...
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>http://gc.advancedmn.com/article.php?artid=4846
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>(read the article there, it is *not* pasted below)
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>Revolution is apparently going to be released in mid 2006. it
>>>>>>>>>>>will
>>>>>>>>>>>be
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>using
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>MoSys 1T-SRAM for memory, like the Gamecube.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>Whether a system from Nintendo (or anyone else) can claim an
>>>>>>>>>>"advantage"
>>>>>>>>>>depends on the quality of games released for it.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>not anymore when these consoles are becoming media centers.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Those types of things are secondary, the main focus is the games.
>>>>>>>>That
>>>>>>>>is what people buy them for. Best games, best console...
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>best change your way of thinking.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>And why is that?!?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>Because the assumption that a console is all about games is wrong.
>>>>
>>>>That is all it is about for me, I have never watched a DVD on my PS2,
>>>>why?
>>>>Because it isn't for watching movies, I have a DVD player and a VCR for
>>>>that, the PS2 is for games plain and simple, if I owned an Xbox it would
>>>>be
>>>>the same way. There is no way a console is ever going to do anything
>>>>better
>>>>than another device other than play video games.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Then you haven't played with XBMC and are missing out on easily the best
>>>multimedia system out there (for the price).
>>>
>>>You'll eventually change your mind.
>>>
>>>
>>
>>We will see, what is XBMC, I have no clue what that is, have never heard
>>of it.
>>
>
>
> Nevermind did a google on it, I doubt that I will ever change my mind now.
> I have no desire to to cram my entertainment center into one device and
> highly doubt that an Xbox could take the place of everything in my
> entertainment center.
>
>
well vcr no...but than why would you want a replacement for that hideous
thing. DVD player YES...price for performance (inc. games) best thing on
the market....Likewise no DRM. All xbox's successor needs is a DVD or
Blu Ray burner, capture card, and the right software and it would be all
set. I'd pay a G note for that rig :) 
!