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Whats the next best component to upgrade on my set-up?

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April 12, 2012 8:51:59 PM

Hello,

I am looking to upgrade my PC as currently it does not multi task as well as I would like.

I have a duel screen set-up and usually have multiple web browsers open, media players and voip clients at the same time as running ether Starcraft 2 or BF3.

SC2 takes it like a champ on MAX settings, BF3 however does not. Levels take allot longer to load than they should and gfx some times bug out even when I lower my gfx settings to low.

Because of all the applications I run at the same time I'm assuming that my 4GB's of ram is not enough. When I check my system when these problem occur its usually because im using max or close to max RAM. (My CPU seems to be fine)


Here is a summary of my PC specs:
www.jaynetdesign.com/images/Summary.png



The ram I am looking to upgrade to is 16gbs of the following.



"Kingston's KHX1600C9D3X2K2/8GX is a kit of two 512M x 64-bit 4GB DDR3-1600MHz CL9 SDRAM (Synchronous DRAM) memory modules, based on sixteen 128M x 8-bit DDR3 FBGA components per module. Each module kit supports Intel® XMP (Extreme Memory Profiles). Total kit capacity is 8GB. Each module kit has been tested to run at DDR3-1600MHz at a low latency timing of 9-9-9-27 at 1.65V. The SPDs are programmed to JEDEC standard latency DDR3-1333MHz timing of 9-9-9 at 1.5V. Each 240-pin DIMM uses gold contact fingers and requires +1.5V.

Model Name: KHX1600C9D3X2K2/8GX
Main Board: INTEL
System: DESKTOP
System Type: DDR3
M/B Chipset: INTEL P67
CAS Latency: 9-9-9-27 2N
Capacity: 8GB (4GBx2)
Speed: DDR3-1600 (PC3-12800)
Test Voltage: 1.50-1.65V
Registered/Unbuffered: Unbuffered
Error Checking: Non-ECC
Type: 240-pin DIMM
Master Pack Dimension: 8.5 x 5.5 x 0.62 In (L x W x H)
Master Pack Weight: 0.26 lbs
Black PCB
Warranty: Lifetime"


What would you guys recommend, I have considered a 60GB SSD but i'm not really upfor the hastle involved in setting it all up.

All suggestions welcome! (however I don't really want to upgrade my gfx card or MOBO as I'm happy with these as are.)

Thanks in advance for your help,

I'm a bit of a noob.

Thanks,

Jay.


EDIT: I'm over-clocked to 4.39Ghz. forgot to mention.
April 12, 2012 9:29:44 PM

Over 8GB of RAM is wasteful. But cheaper now that ever. I don' tlike Kingston, I'd get Corsair Vengance DDR3-1600.

An SSD will not speed up game play, only game loading (maps load faster during play).

But an SSD is well worth the "hastle." You'll never go back once you boot up in 20 seconds. The BIOS post takes the longest.
April 12, 2012 9:49:40 PM

foscooter said:
Over 8GB of RAM is wasteful. But cheaper now that ever. I don' tlike Kingston, I'd get Corsair Vengance DDR3-1600.

An SSD will not speed up game play, only game loading (maps load faster during play).

But an SSD is well worth the "hastle." You'll never go back once you boot up in 20 seconds. The BIOS post takes the longest.


Thank you for your reply,

Would getting more than 8GB's total give me any extra advantages or non at all? I'm willing to spend the extra to make the jump to 16GB for a small increase in speed but if there will be non at all.. there is no point.

Keep in mind I run 2 screen and many applications at once.


Thanks for your help!
Related resources
April 12, 2012 10:03:13 PM

Dual core processors are crap for BF3.



single player may work fine but they take a dump on multiplayer.

As he said, memory and an SSD will help loading but gameplay is limited to the cpu.

Intel pretty much screwed anyone over with the dead 1156 socket, best bet is to find a used I5 7xx or I7 8xx. Other than that its a new MB+CPU.
April 12, 2012 10:08:35 PM

Get rid of that dual core i3
Buy another 460 (or just upgrade to a higher performing single card solution)
An SSD

No 8GB is not wasteful, especially when you are having multi tasking isuues. Windows it's self snaggs 1.5GB on a typical install, a game like BF3 will pull another 2GB. What does that leave you with 512MB for all of the other tasks you would like to run ??
April 12, 2012 10:13:40 PM

cmi86 said:
Get rid of that dual core i3
Buy another 460
An SSD

No 8GB is not wasteful, especially when you are having multi tasking isuues. Windows it's self snaggs 1.5GB on a typical install, a game like BF3 will pull another 2GB. What does that leave you with 512MB for all of the other tasks you would like to run ??




What mobo ideally would you suggest? I'm not looking to spend a fortune, just enough to future proof my rig for a few major title releases and by another 460 to you mean crossfire?


Thanks for the help.
April 12, 2012 10:14:23 PM

seems like you should get a new cpu and motherboard first and then think about getting SLI or a more powerful gpu.
April 12, 2012 10:23:06 PM

Oh I'm over-clocked to 4.39Ghz. forgot to mention. Does that make a difference?
April 12, 2012 10:23:30 PM

SSD + 8GB + CPU or overclock i3
April 12, 2012 10:27:05 PM

das_stig said:
SSD + 8GB + CPU or overclock i3



I'm over-clocked to 4.39Ghz. Is that sufficient as far as the CPU goes? (I really don't want to have to replace my mobo if possible)(
April 12, 2012 10:38:06 PM

Jam00dle said:
What mobo ideally would you suggest? I'm not looking to spend a fortune, just enough to future proof my rig for a few major title releases and by another 460 to you mean crossfire?


Thanks for the help.


I did not suggest you buy a motherboard, I suggested a CPU. Intel kind of side railed everyone 1156 (go figure) Dual cores are on their way out the door, my advice would be to try and find a second hand i5 or i7 for that socket as they will be quad cores.

Crossfire is a term used to describe the configuration of more that one ATI/AMD Graphics processor being linked together as one more powerful processing unit. The Nvidia (applicable to you) version of this is known as SLI.
April 12, 2012 10:39:59 PM

Jam00dle said:
I'm over-clocked to 4.39Ghz. Is that sufficient as far as the CPU goes? (I really don't want to have to replace my mobo if possible)(


Not it is not sufficient. You are not running into issues because you lack clock speed, you are running into issues because you simply lack the cores needed to handle the applications you wish to run.
April 12, 2012 10:44:13 PM

cmi86 said:
I did not suggest you buy a motherboard, I suggested a CPU. Intel kind of side railed everyone 1156 (go figure) Dual cores are on their way out the door, my advice would be to try and find a second hand i5 or i7 for that socket as they will be quad cores.

Crossfire is a term used to describe the configuration of more that one ATI/AMD Graphics processor being linked together as one more powerful processing unit. The Nvidia (applicable to you) version of this is known as SLI.



I live in the UK, Any ideas on a trusted site to get an i5/i7 from? I don't want to get one a realise its being sold because its broken.
April 12, 2012 10:59:33 PM

don't buy another i3 if you upgrade. Its really not much of an upgrade since you'd have to buy a new motherboard.
Anonymous
April 12, 2012 11:06:35 PM

esrever said:
don't buy another i3 if you upgrade. Its really not much of an upgrade since you'd have to buy a new motherboard.

it IS an upgrade going from clarksdale to sandy . . a i5 would be better, yes. but to say it is a "side-grade" is not correct.

EDIT: oppsie :( 
April 12, 2012 11:07:59 PM

it is a sidegrade if he has his CPU OC'ed to 4.4ghz. I actually think his cpu is more powerful than the i3 2100 at that speed.
Anonymous
April 12, 2012 11:10:45 PM

esrever said:
it is a sidegrade if he has his CPU OC'ed to 4.4ghz. I actually think his cpu is more powerful than the i3 2100 at that speed.

If overclocking scaled linear, which it doesn't.
April 12, 2012 11:13:14 PM

and sandybridge is only 20% faster than clarkdale.
Anonymous
April 12, 2012 11:20:37 PM

*only*? :lol: 
however, it would be better if i did retract my statement about i3-2120 not being a side grade to the oc'd i3-540 @4.39Ghz. it is a close call.

though "best" option is to get off the 1156 platform.
April 13, 2012 12:03:29 AM

Jam00dle said:
I live in the UK, Any ideas on a trusted site to get an i5/i7 from? I don't want to get one a realise its being sold because its broken.


Yeah don't pay any attention to that looniam guy. He is just an i3 fanboi, look at his icon lol. Honestly I would look on ebay from a reputable seller that offers a guarantee and a refund process if the CPU doesn't work.

On ebay for the same price as a new i3 2100 I found an i5 750 quad core that is compatible with your current motherboard.
Even is stock trim the 750 will destroy the 2100 especially when it comes to more heavily threaded things like BF3 Multi.
If you decide to learn how to overclock i5 750's can hit 4+ Ghz, 2100 has a locked multi and would be lucky to +300Mhz.
April 13, 2012 12:34:30 AM

Anonymous said:
get a sandy/ivy bridge motherboard and a i3-2120. regardless of the "popular wisdom" many dual cores still suffice for gaming, a sandy dual core beats a clarksdale quad core.
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/289?vs=144
http://www.hardwarecanucks.com/forum/hardware-canucks-r...
it will cost you $150 US to upgrade your cpu, you might as well put that and a few bucks more towards getting a better platform.

Some people and their off topic posts. Average game performance is not BF3. Sure, single player works fine, but join an intense multiplayer session and watch it struggle. Considering that is his main problem game, talking about all other games is 100% irrelivant.
Anonymous
April 13, 2012 1:14:01 AM

noob2222 said:
Some people and their off topic posts. Average game performance is not BF3. Sure, single player works fine, but join an intense multiplayer session and watch it struggle. Considering that is his main problem game, talking about all other games is 100% irrelivant.

and he mentioned multiplayer where??

try being helpful to the topic instead of trying to take people to task for posting against your point of view.
not the whole world plays the on a 64 player map nor are all benchmarks meant to satisfy your needs/wants.

seriously when tom's is honored to have you as a moderator would you then have the privileged of judgement, until then stfu.
Anonymous
April 13, 2012 1:25:34 AM

cmi86 said:
Yeah don't pay any attention to that looniam guy. He is just an i3 fanboi, look at his icon lol.

the quad core is not an end all do all processor. quite a few dual cores can perform at a sufficient enough level.
quad cores have been around for over 7 years and still not much software has be developed to make use all the cores. all the kids come around and say quad core, quad core. build a few systems and help others with different components first. then maybe you can have a valid opinion.
April 13, 2012 1:38:49 AM

If he already has the I3 running at 4.39 ghz, I seriously doubt he is talking about single player since its been proven on every website that it runs as fast as any other cpu. If he is talking about single player then the issue is somewhere else.

Besides that, suggesting upgrading from an i3 to an i3 makes no sense in itself.
April 13, 2012 1:47:01 AM

Anonymous said:
the quad core is not an end all do all processor. quite a few dual cores can perform at a sufficient enough level.
quad cores have been around for over 7 years and still not much software has be developed to make use all the cores. all the kids come around and say quad core, quad core. build a few systems and help others with different components first. then maybe you can have a valid opinion.


I do have a valid opinion as I am a computer repair tech and an IT administrator not to mention a system builder for over a decade. Your argument applies to most games in single player mode where as most of the games themselves have not been optimized past dual core architecture but when multiplayer situations are in question this will always be the responsibility of the CPU and there for CPU's with more cores will yield higher results. However the software market outside of single player gaming is becoming very optimized for quad core CPU's (such as media editing applications)
The OP is complaining of a lack of multi tasking ability, more cores more multi task, i think even you can understand this concept.
No the i5 is not an "end all" CPU, however dual cores are exiting the market and the i5 750 is a very substantial upgrade in most every way shape and form over any 2X cpu available and is cost effective and compatible with his current mobo. I know you have an i3 and want to defend your product but the facts are what they are and you coming in here with unsubstantiated claims and arguments does nothing other than make you look like an uneducated fanboi.

Do not bother responding to me with anything other than verifyable links to data that backs up you claims as I will continue trying to help the poster and we don't need your i3 trolling to accomplish that.
Anonymous
April 13, 2012 1:58:03 AM

http://forums.electronicarts.co.uk/pc-build-upgrade-for...

now kindly post your links, unless you do have the habit of demanding something that you yourself cannot provide.
(btw, it is difficult to get any mp map bench because it cannot be replicated and therefore cannot be validated) :) 
and i have been building systems for 15 years, started with a socket 7 board; i understand multi tasking thank you very much. do you understand hyperthreading?
so unless you can provide the data, your opinion, however educated, is a guess.

really i am not "i3 trolling" nor do i disagree that an i5 would be better but with the personal attacks i will respond.
April 13, 2012 2:23:36 AM

Anonymous said:
http://forums.electronicarts.co.uk/pc-build-upgrade-for...

now kindly post your links, unless you do have the habit of demanding something that you yourself cannot provide.
(btw, it is difficult to get any mp map bench because it cannot be replicated and therefore cannot be validated) :) 
and i have been building systems for 15 years, started with a socket 7 board; i understand multi tasking thank you very much. do you understand hyperthreading?
so unless you can provide the data, your opinion, however educated, is a guess.

really i am not "i3 trolling" nor do i disagree that an i5 would be better but with the personal attacks i will respond.


So you send me a link to some random ass forum and expect me to believe some home made graphs none of which are even in reference to any title the OP mentioned from a person bearing zero credentials ? No benchmarks, no testing, no nothing except for home made graphs lol nice try. Hypethreading is about 50% of a physical core in a best case scenario, nice try again. Why do I have to provide you links for you to understand the basic concept that CPU's with more cores are going to excel at CPU intensive tasks ? Why do I need to give you a link to prove to you that his CPU is all ready trying its little heart out to even play the game let alone multi task outside of it and that 2 more cores would help that situation ? That seems like some pretty basic knowledge to me man.
Anonymous
April 13, 2012 2:54:21 AM

like i said, show that an i3 2100 will bog down in a BF3 64 MP map.

back pedaling to "the basic concept that CPU's with more cores are going to excel at CPU intensive tasks " isn't it.
(which bulldozer failed at doing; its architecture, not cores, that is the performance determinant)

so until you do, all you have is conjecture.

good luck with that :) 
April 13, 2012 2:51:09 PM

Facepalm, deep exhasperated sigh.. It's not my job to be obligated to prove common knowledge to someone who is too ignorant to accept the truth. My job is to help the OP select a cost effective compatible upgrade for his system that would best address the issues he is describing in his post. Not trading one dual core for another and adding a motherboard to boot. If you would like to be a constructive part of this conversation please provide documentation of the i3 2100 being a more viable cost effective/higher performing upgrade for the OP vs. the i5 750 and then and only then you can have an opinion.
Anonymous
April 13, 2012 10:57:35 PM

<broken record>
if it is so much common knowledge than you ought not have a problem validating it with data. it is bad form to demand proof when you can't provide your own.
</broken record>
i gave you a link of someone who claims to be able to play BF3 64 MP map with an i3 on the steam forums. to say something is "common knowledge" does not make it valid. it use to be common knowledge that the earth was flat and was the center of the universe. so i will always be a skeptic and ask for the facts, thank you :) 

to suggest one dual core for another would not be a waste:
http://www.anandtech.com/bench/Product/289?vs=143

however i did make the mistake and overlooked that the i3-540 was greatly overclocked and stated so. though that does not give license to anyone for personally criticizing mine or anyone's point of view or for making a mistake.

your "job" is costing the OP by staying with a socket that will 2 generations old soon and 3 in a short time. my point of view is to get him up to speed with a more contemporary platform. the difference being if he only has $150 then fine get a clarksdale which is about as far as he can go. but if he can afford $250+ then he is better off going with a sandy/ivy platform that will continue to give him options for the next 18 months.

its not all "Remove and Replace" like in the IT world.
(yeah that was a shot, sorry couldn't help it :lol:  )

by now the OP has probably seen two people getting into a pissing match and ran for the hills. so the next time you want to "do your job" by helping; it might not be a good idea to thrash on the other expressed ideas but spend the time validating your own; the proof is in the pudding.

have a good day.
April 15, 2012 1:17:18 AM

Sooooo.. I bought the RAM. Bringing my total to 12GB.

I can now play BF3 Multiplayer while having another game stream in my internet browser without any lag.


Thanks for the help!


I play on high gfx.

ty.
Anonymous
April 15, 2012 1:24:36 AM

so your doing that with a dual core?
AMAZING!
:lol: 
thanks for the update.
April 15, 2012 1:45:03 PM

Anonymous said:
so your doing that with a dual core?
AMAZING!
:lol: 
thanks for the update.



I wont pretend to understand the very intersting "descusion" that been going on while iv been away buying/installing my new ram.


But I would just like to say that with my i3 I can play bf3 full screen on high gfx at 1920 x 1080 on one screen and on my second have pandora radio playing while streaming some SC2 live streams while on skype and downloading.

all of this with programs such as steam and xfire running in the background without any problem.

oh and when I alt tab.. its almost instant now.

Thanks again for the help guys, i hope this helped.
Anonymous
April 15, 2012 3:27:45 PM

i do owe you an apology for "hijacking" your thread by getting involved in a "spirited discussion".

i am glad for you that at a small cost you were able to resolve your issue. you may have proven 2 popular theories wrong; A) that there is no need for more than 8 gigs of RAM unless you are using media creation B) that you need a quad core to multitask.

the first one i will have to admit that i am surprised myself. but the proof is in the pudding.

my main point was/is dual cores are very capable to multi task; a person does NOT have need quad core to do it. but popular wisdom dictates a person HAS have one. i was on a budget when i bought my system or i would have gotten an i5. but i was happy to see what an i3 is still capable of doing.

it is a shame when people would rather bury their head in the sand than do any investigating; common misconceptions will not change. and i'll stop before i start talking about world peace. :lol: 

glad your problem got resolved.

April 15, 2012 6:40:10 PM

OK Guys, on to my second project!

where can i buy some cheap second hand DDR2 ram. I refuse to pay the same price as I did for my DDR3 as even tho it was cheap, DDR2 is not as good and sshould be cheaper.


Where can I buy some cheap DDR2 Ram online?


(its for my old pc that im referbishing into a secondary gaming pc for when friends come round.)
April 15, 2012 7:13:54 PM

ddr2 ram is ussually 2x as expensive as ddr3 unless you buy second hand.
April 15, 2012 7:56:32 PM

Get at least 8gb ram for BF3, my system with 12gb uses up to 5.2gb of ram with browser open (battle log) and a IRC client. My friend that only has 3.2gb ram (32bit wind) gets errors constantly at high graphics and his got a gtx 560ti.
April 15, 2012 8:00:14 PM

O I see you got the RAM (only started reading after lol) good buy! And nice to see it helped.
!