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8 core i7 for workstation and future gaming build...

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April 24, 2012 5:01:02 PM

For me, Ivy Bridge right now looks pretty disappointing unless you need better on board graphics for a mobile setup. As I already have a GTX 580 and will continue to use high end gaming cards in the future I won't be jumping on the IB any time soon...

So while I gather the funds for an awesome new hybrid workstation/gaming rig I am looking to find out when Intel might be releasing i7 or i9 cpu's with 8 physical cores. I am happy to stick with SB unless intel release an IB CPU that really rocks.

I know that the idea of ANY game using that many cores is just ridiculous at this point but as I mentioned this build will be for various workstation tasks also and you can't blame a guy for dreaming right?

Anyway, getting to the point, has anyone heard anything about such a beast of a processor actually being available on the market any time soon? I have done a bit of research on the topic and some have said this might happen mid-2012 but that's about all I could find.

I appreciate any input or even speculation on the matter and will keep you guys posted as my build starts to manifest.

Thanks heaps.
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April 24, 2012 5:26:37 PM

I don't they're going to release an 8 core CPU until Haswell next year.
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April 24, 2012 5:31:16 PM

@Jim: Thx dude, that 10 core looks insane, hopefully overclockable. Can't imagine the price tag though.

@sk: Yea, just going through the official Haswell thread. I don't want to wait that long so I hope you're wrong...
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April 24, 2012 6:23:48 PM

Going to have to, unless you want to move to AMD. Ivy Bridge isn't slated to introduce anything different from what's out already. You could move to Xeon's which already have 10 Cores, but you will be paying close to $2.5k/processor (Intel® Xeon® Processor E7-2850 ), assuming you could even find a motherboard that supports them (LGA 1567).
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April 24, 2012 6:58:28 PM

Unfortunately at this point it is max gaming performance, or max workstation performance, not both. Xeons can be had with 8+ cores but they cannot be overclocked. Plus, they are incredibly expensive. Best chip today that straddles both horses is the i7 3860X. This offers hex core plus overclocking.

But that's really a money no object chip. I would argue that if you have a healthy budget and you want a chip that will excel in both categories, the 3830k is the best buy.
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April 24, 2012 7:57:31 PM

Trist_58 said:
For me, Ivy Bridge right now looks pretty disappointing unless you need better on board graphics for a mobile setup. As I already have a GTX 580 and will continue to use high end gaming cards in the future I won't be jumping on the IB any time soon...

So while I gather the funds for an awesome new hybrid workstation/gaming rig I am looking to find out when Intel might be releasing i7 or i9 cpu's with 8 physical cores. I am happy to stick with SB unless intel release an IB CPU that really rocks.

I know that the idea of ANY game using that many cores is just ridiculous at this point but as I mentioned this build will be for various workstation tasks also and you can't blame a guy for dreaming right?

Anyway, getting to the point, has anyone heard anything about such a beast of a processor actually being available on the market any time soon? I have done a bit of research on the topic and some have said this might happen mid-2012 but that's about all I could find.

I appreciate any input or even speculation on the matter and will keep you guys posted as my build starts to manifest.

Thanks heaps.


You have a pretty good GPU. Assuming you CPU is not very old and have a 4 gb (ideally 8) RAM, you are better of waiting for Haswell next year.
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April 24, 2012 8:04:31 PM

Nothing uses that many cores yet. Games now use 2-3, im not %100 sure if they use 4 yet but dont kill me if im wrong!!!
The 8 core is more of a sales number at this moment in time I would argue. However as you state it's not just for gaming otherwise i would have thrown into the hole point of hyper-threading tech and why you should go with AMD and not intel for gaming but that aside ;) 
If your after something for a more general use that doesnt include video editing which is what hyper-threading was invented for, go with AMD :D 
If you're wanting top of the top for no real reason, get out your wallet, shoot it a few times, scare the wife away and get an intel :p  hehe
As for processors "coming soon", theres nothing really there, Intel has it's Ivy Bridge and there's no news what so ever about the AMD's next generation of Bulldozers code-named: PileDriver!!!
But there's nothing on it, no leaks, price tags, info, zilcho.
For me im waiting for q2/3 this year, then upgrade CPU.
Hope this info helps :) 
Scorp
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April 24, 2012 10:23:30 PM

sk1939 said:
Going to have to, unless you want to move to AMD. Ivy Bridge isn't slated to introduce anything different from what's out already. You could move to Xeon's which already have 10 Cores, but you will be paying close to $2.5k/processor (Intel® Xeon® Processor E7-2850 ), assuming you could even find a motherboard that supports them (LGA 1567).


Those xeons are not worth the box/tray they come in considering the cheapest boards that I could find sell for $2000-2500 a pop. These xeons often go for as little as $200 on eBay for that socket but you will need to populate all four sockets for that rig to work due to the linked memory controllers. That is why Intel had no mainstream dual socket xeon platform since the end of 771 until recently. The base cost for a 1567 build is around $15,000-20,000 easily. Fully configured HP and Dell charge up to $250,000! :pt1cable:  So SBE is dirt cheap considering how much the old platform costs.
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April 25, 2012 4:25:05 AM

Thanks for all of the good advice, guys.

From what I can tell, Xeon is out of the question as this will be a gaming rig as well as for 3D and video editing work (and they are a bit pricey atm). The i7 3930K looks pretty great, just wondering if I would get a major performance boost upgrading from an i7 860 or should I hang on for Haswell and just overclock my existing CPU?

Also, besides the slight difference in GHz, what makes the 3960X worth the extra expense?
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April 25, 2012 4:26:32 AM

Why don't you just overclock?
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April 25, 2012 4:44:59 AM

nforce4max said:
Those xeons are not worth the box/tray they come in considering the cheapest boards that I could find sell for $2000-2500 a pop. These xeons often go for as little as $200 on eBay for that socket but you will need to populate all four sockets for that rig to work due to the linked memory controllers. That is why Intel had no mainstream dual socket xeon platform since the end of 771 until recently. The base cost for a 1567 build is around $15,000-20,000 easily. Fully configured HP and Dell charge up to $250,000! :pt1cable:  So SBE is dirt cheap considering how much the old platform costs.


Hah, don't I know it, we bought 2 servers with 4 of the things (R710 I believe), with quad 10Gig-E nics. Price tag? Something like $54,000 each.
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April 25, 2012 4:46:38 AM

amuffin: This is a bit of topic, but I have read somewhere that you can't have multi-threading enabled when you overclock as the CPU heats up really fast. If this is true would there be any advantage overclocking for 3D applications that need these threads to work at their optimal?

Would a good cooling solution fix this problem?

Or would I just set different profiles in BIOS for gaming or 3D work (for example) and switch between the two when needed?

...forgive the noob questions, still learning the technical stuff.
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April 25, 2012 5:02:17 AM

A better heatsink! Such as the cooler master hyper 212+! For an example, when I used Cinema4d before overclocking, render times took too long, about a day. However, when I overclocked to 4.5ghz render times took roughly half a day! Overclocking is great because you can have those cores/threads run at a higher frequency, which gives great performance in 3!
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April 25, 2012 5:06:07 AM

Excellent. Just wasn't sure about the threads part.

Thanks mate!

Now just have to do those annoying measurements to make sure it will fit next to my RAM.
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April 25, 2012 5:07:37 AM

The cooler master hyper 212+ fans can be elevated. It can accomodate any ram modules.
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April 25, 2012 5:25:10 AM

Actually it looks like the 212 is more suitable for my socket 1156 CPU despite the lower price tag so don't worry. I appreciate the trouble you have gone to :D 
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April 25, 2012 6:20:13 AM

Trist_58 said:
Thanks for all of the good advice, guys.

From what I can tell, Xeon is out of the question as this will be a gaming rig as well as for 3D and video editing work (and they are a bit pricey atm). The i7 3930K looks pretty great, just wondering if I would get a major performance boost upgrading from an i7 860 or should I hang on for Haswell and just overclock my existing CPU?

Also, besides the slight difference in GHz, what makes the 3960X worth the extra expense?


Overclock your existing CPU. Forget the i7 3960x. It is not worth the extra money over i7 3930K. I reckon that your current CPU would give i73960x a run for money after overclocking....Throw in a nice cooler Noctua NH-D14 or something similar from their brand or CM Hyper 212 plus/evo...another option is corsair H100 or corsair H80.
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April 25, 2012 6:30:11 AM

My overclocked i7 860 would give an i7 3960 a run for it's money? Wow, that's awesome news.

I am researching coolers at the moment, a lot of people seem to like the Hyper 212's so I think I'll get an EVO. That is unless anyone has had a bad experience.

Another quick question - Would I have to take the mobo off the inside of the case to install a cooler like the Hyper 212?

Cheers.

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April 25, 2012 6:32:15 AM

Yes, because there is a base plate that goes on the bottom of the board.
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April 25, 2012 6:48:18 AM

Ok, thanks for that.
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April 25, 2012 7:34:27 AM

Trist_58 said:


Another quick question - Would I have to take the mobo off the inside of the case to install a cooler like the Hyper 212?

Cheers.


Your processor is still good. Please check if you can over clock the processor; if yes, you may want to check if it can be done with your existing mobo. If you can over clock it, I think you are good to wait for Haswell in 2013.

I have not used CM Hyper coolers. Please check with the manufacturing site if you have to take the mobo off. For example, the mobo has to come off to install the Noctua coolers.
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April 25, 2012 7:41:03 AM

Good points. I am looking into it currently.
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April 25, 2012 8:02:57 AM

All of the research I have done so far indicates that one can indeed OC an i7 860 on an ASUS P7P55D LE (my current mobo). In fact, people are getting up to 4GHz stable under load.

I don't think I would be that ambitious but there is definite potential with my setup.

So it looks like I'll just OC and wait for intel to do something revolutionary with Haswell in 2013.

Thanks guys!

..Oh yea, I have installed various parts in my computer before but never had to take the mobo out so if someone could recommend a good cooler that doesn't require dismantling the whole thing that would be great.
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April 25, 2012 10:39:26 AM

Trist_58 said:

..Oh yea, I have installed various parts in my computer before but never had to take the mobo out so if someone could recommend a good cooler that doesn't require dismantling the whole thing that would be great.


Verify your socket (LGA 1156).

Go to Tom's Hardware > All Reviews > Components > Cooling

Search "LGA 1156 compatible coolers" and go through them.

Please see this article (is is 2 years old) but probably good enough...Please check if you can find a cooler (caution: may not be the best) that does not require taking the mobo off.

http://www.tomshardware.co.uk/lga-1156-heatsink,review-...

Nevertheless, you should not have problems reinstalling everything....take a picture of the layout, repeat this for every part dismantle, and take it from there. You may use the pictures in reverse order after fitting the cooler on the CPU. Please take care of static electricity discharge though....
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April 25, 2012 11:10:54 AM

Thanks for the info, SSri. I have had a good look around on the net and really think I'll just go with a hyper 212 evo, despite the fact that I will have to take may system apart.

I figured that I should familiarize myself with the system some more as I will be putting together a build from the ground up eventually (probably next year with Haswell).

Good idea to take a photo before hand, I'll remember that.

About the only thing left to figure out is which thermal paste to use. I saw in a vid someone who said the stuff that comes with the Cooler Master isn't the best and I should use Arctic Cooler instead. Any thoughts on that?
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April 25, 2012 11:15:05 AM

* I meant Arctic Silver not cooler. Tom's won't let me edit the post :/ 
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April 25, 2012 11:35:55 AM

Nevermind, I'll start a thread on that issue in a more relevant section (CPU and Components > Cooler Master)

Cheers everyone!

:D 
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April 25, 2012 11:38:39 AM

Trist_58 said:
Nevermind, I'll start a thread on that issue in a more relevant section (CPU and Components > Cooler Master)

Cheers everyone!

:D 


Arctic Silver 5....
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April 25, 2012 11:41:10 AM

You just caught me before I started a new thread. Arctic Silver 5 it is then!

Thanks dude!
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April 25, 2012 11:41:58 AM

Trist_58 said:
You just caught me before I started a new thread. Arctic Silver 5 it is then!

Thanks dude!


Good luck!
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April 25, 2012 1:22:21 PM

Trist_58 said:
You just caught me before I started a new thread. Arctic Silver 5 it is then!

Thanks dude!


It is good stuff, been using it for almost 4 years now. It doesn't take long to set in and improve temps.
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April 25, 2012 1:32:09 PM

Ahh good. I think I'll get some ArctiClean to go with it. Easier to just order it all from the same place online rather than find rubbing alcohol at the shops.

Really looking forward to experiencing better performance in games like The Witcher 2 @ 1440p. Rendering speeds should be improved also but I know it's a bit different OC'ing with hyper threading enabled.

Much to learn have I....
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April 25, 2012 2:33:48 PM

Trist_58 said:
Ahh good. I think I'll get some ArctiClean to go with it. Easier to just order it all from the same place online rather than find rubbing alcohol at the shops.

Really looking forward to experiencing better performance in games like The Witcher 2 @ 1440p. Rendering speeds should be improved also but I know it's a bit different OC'ing with hyper threading enabled.

Much to learn have I....


I do not think you need to buy Arctic Clean to go with it. It is convenient as they are in one place but expensive. You would need a 99% spirit (get that in pharmacy I suppose), some cotton buds (to scarp it first), coffee filter bag (to wipe it) and a pair of clean hands (with no static electricity). There is an article on the Tom's to read and a plenty of videos on the youtube to watch. This is my opinion any way. You must do what you think is good and convenient to you.

good luck
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April 25, 2012 2:43:02 PM

Ok, thanks for your opinion SSri. I havn't ordered anything just yet - doing a last minute dimensions test. The height of the Evo heat sink is 159mm and the width of my case is about 185mm so I should be ok, just don't want any nasty surprises when it comes to installing the thing.

Is there anything else I should be aware of? Perhaps I should open up the case and have a look...
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April 25, 2012 3:03:43 PM

Trist_58 said:
Ok, thanks for your opinion SSri. I havn't ordered anything just yet - doing a last minute dimensions test. The height of the Evo heat sink is 159mm and the width of my case is about 185mm so I should be ok, just don't want any nasty surprises when it comes to installing the thing.

Is there anything else I should be aware of? Perhaps I should open up the case and have a look...


You appear to have covered all bases...if you are happy, go ahead. if you want to open the case and check, just in case...it is up to you..just make ensure that Evo would fit into your case on top of the CPU and would not interfere/obstruct anything. that's important...If in doubt, you may go to their site, ask online or send an email with the details of your system.
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April 25, 2012 3:05:58 PM

Righto, think I'll have a look inside now. Fingers crossed!
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April 25, 2012 3:06:45 PM

The thing is, you dont' need AS5. The cooler master stock paste performs 1-3C hotter than AS5. Plus as5 takes forever to burn in. Which case do you have?

In order to achieve the best temps, get 2 fans for a push pull configuration!
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April 25, 2012 3:24:06 PM

I have noticed that the as5 takes a while to burn in (although I have also heard you can OC straight away and in time you will see a drop of only 3 degrees C anyway).

As for the case, this is the best online description I could find, as I believe it has been discontinued. http://au.shopping.com/AOpen-AOpen-G528-Aluminum-Panel-...

Thanks for your continued help.
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April 25, 2012 5:25:11 PM

Taking a closer look inside the box it might be a tight fit. As this setup was put together in a hurry I think there could be improvements in the way the case/mobo and components were put together.

I don't think a second fan on the proposed heat sink would be possible.

Would it help if I posted a photo?
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April 25, 2012 7:54:16 PM

Have to sleep now so I thought I'd just post this in the event that someone takes a look while I'm gone. Forgive the mess, I wasn't expecting company...

http://img803.imageshack.us/img803/819/201204260212401....

Does this setup of mine look like it will work with the 212 Evo?

This heatsink should in theory fit if I just tidy up the mass of cables.

Anyway, I'll do some more research when I rise. Hopefully I can figure it all out myself and come up with a plan but if anyone can give me a clue it would be appreciated.

Also any comments on the airflow (or lack thereof) and how I can improve it are welcomed.

Cheers.
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April 25, 2012 8:49:53 PM

Trist_58 said:
Have to sleep now so I thought I'd just post this in the event that someone takes a look while I'm gone. Forgive the mess, I wasn't expecting company...

http://img803.imageshack.us/img803/819/201204260212401....

Does this setup of mine look like it will work with the 212 Evo?

This heatsink should in theory fit if I just tidy up the mass of cables.

Anyway, I'll do some more research when I rise. Hopefully I can figure it all out myself and come up with a plan but if anyone can give me a clue it would be appreciated.

Also any comments on the airflow (or lack thereof) and how I can improve it are welcomed.

Cheers.


I see a plenty of space between the mobo, PSU and optical drives. Is it not possible to mount a hook or something else to tidy the cables to keep them horizontal to the PSU. There is also a plenty of open space below the optical drive. I am sure that you can tidy that up.

Please measure the h x w x d from the case to the CPU. Also measure the same from the base of the mobo and compare it with your Evo.

A general rule of thumb for the fan is:

Front Intake
Side Intake
Back Exhaust
Top Exhaust


good luck
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April 26, 2012 7:24:40 AM

Grrrr. Upon closer investigation it looks like the Hyper 212 Evo won't fit in my case. It's hard to get a perfectly accurate measurement without taking the mobo out but it looks like the clearance would be a matter of a few mm either way. Too close to call so I'm not taking the risk...

So it looks like I'm back to the drawing board. I'm hoping there is a more compact solution that performs as well as the 212 Evo. I'm willing to pay up to around 70 AUD if it's really worth the expense.

Any suggestions?

Thanks everyone.
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April 26, 2012 7:56:34 AM

Trist_58 said:
Grrrr. Upon closer investigation it looks like the Hyper 212 Evo won't fit in my case. It's hard to get a perfectly accurate measurement without taking the mobo out but it looks like the clearance would be a matter of a few mm either way. Too close to call so I'm not taking the risk...

So it looks like I'm back to the drawing board. I'm hoping there is a more compact solution that performs as well as the 212 Evo. I'm willing to pay up to around 70 AUD if it's really worth the expense.

Any suggestions?

Thanks everyone.


did you try measuring after tidying the cables?

what about noctua NH-D14. They have a few series up their sleeves. Please go to their site and send them an email with full spec of your system include the case. They are based out in Austria and would usually reply in 24 hours.

Another choice is coolermaster h80 or h100. They might be an overkill but if they fit..so be it...
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April 26, 2012 8:05:53 AM

Actually the issue wasn't with the cables but the length of the heatsink from the CPU to the other inner side of the case. 159mm is just too tight a fit.

Funny you should mention the NH-14, I'm watching a review right now. It looks the goods, if a bit pricey. Thanks for the tip on emailing Noctua, I'll try to figure it out myself first.

I think it will fit, but hard to tell before having a proper look as it's a different design to the Cooler Master.

Will keep you posted.
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April 26, 2012 8:11:38 AM

Trist_58 said:
Actually the issue wasn't with the cables but the length of the heatsink from the CPU to the other inner side of the case. 159mm is just too tight a fit.

Funny you should mention the NH-14, I'm watching a review right now. It looks the goods, if a bit pricey. Thanks for the tip on emailing Noctua, I'll try to figure it out myself first.

I think it will fit, but hard to tell before having a proper look as it's a different design to the Cooler Master.

Will keep you posted.


Infact, I am in the process of procuring a noctua myself for my hp xw8600. The responded in 24 hours after taking a good look at the Hp xw8600 dimensions themselves and made a recommendation.
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April 26, 2012 11:33:07 AM

I'm not having any more luck with the Noctua. The height is fine but it looks way too wide/deep for my setup (166x140 mm will not work in any configuration).

Last time I let someone else build me a computer (but I'm probably to blame for that).

I spose I could email Noctua but I don't have high hopes.

Process of elimination I spose.

There MUST be a decent solution here, my case and mobo arn't tiny, just not what you would call ideal for expansion.

Anyway I'll keep looking around.
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April 26, 2012 11:40:22 AM

Trist_58 said:

I spose I could email Noctua but I don't have high hopes.

Anyway I'll keep looking around.


Sorry to hear about troubles....Best to wait for their email. Please provide all the details of your system (case dimension, may be a picture, dimension around CPU, etc). They might recommend something else.

In the mean time, try coolermaster.....
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April 26, 2012 11:42:06 AM

Righto, thanks for all of your help man.
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