Critique My Build Before I Pull The Trigger

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sciguy

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I am preparing to do my first build and want to be sure I dont do something stupid. :) Objectives for this computer are as follows:

1) Edit HD video taken by my 1080pm camcorder.
2) Serve that video through my Blu Ray player to my HD TV.
3) There will probably be some other minor word processing, internet browsing and "non-graphics intensive" games but I'm assuming any build that will accomplish 1 and 2 will do fine for #3.
4) Do it on a pretty limited budget. I don't need state-of-the-art but don't want it to lag for 5-10 seconds while it executes an edit - if you know what I mean.

After pulling together various opinions from these forums and elsewhere I've come up with the following build. Two big questions: Will it work (i.e. are all the parts compatible) and, secondly, am I doing anything silly?


MOBO MSI A75MA-G55 AMD A Series Socket FM1 Motherboard $85
Processor AMD HDT55TFBGRBOX Phenom II X6 1055T Processor - Six Core $160
RAM (need 2 - 8GB) Corsair CMX4GX3M1A1333C9 XMS3 4GB DDR3 RAM - PC10666, 1333MHz, 4096MB $80
SSD OCZ Vertex Plus 120GB 2.5" SATA II SSD $119
Case Thermaltake VM54521N2U V2 ATX Mid Tower Case $70

You'll note there's no HDD - I have a 1TB external drive I figure I'll use until HDD prices come back down. Also, no DVD burner - I have an old one I can install but don't see myself burning a lot of DVDs anyway.

Thanks for your thoughts!!
 
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SCIGuy:

Your mobo and processor doesn't seem to be compatible. Here's a link about your Mobo Socket: http://www.cpu-world.com/Sockets/Socket%20FM1.html

Your CPU is not on the list.

Also, why AMD?

It's been proven again and again that Intel processors dominate. From what I've calculated, your budget is just a bit over $500 correct?

If video editing is your primary objective, then based on the following reviews:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-z68-express-smart-response-technology-ssd-caching,2938.html

and

http://www.videoguys.com/Guide/E/Videoguys+System+recommendations+for+Video+Editing/0x4aebb06ba071d2b6a2cd784ce243a6c6.aspx

You would want an Intel CPU (i5 2500K for best bang for the buck) a Z68 or H67 mobo for...

g-unit1111

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I agree that the RAM is way overpriced - you should be able to get RAM for less than $50.

But if you're going to be editing video (and working with large files) you should skip the SSD for now and go for a 500GB mechanical drive - 120GB will not hold very much, and it will fill up pretty quickly and you'll regret not having the extra space.

You're also using a Llano motherboard with an X6 - the X6 won't work with the A75 chipset. Maybe go with a Phenom II X4 and a AMD 970 board, but then you'd also need a video card which would defeat the purpose of the budget.

Try something like this:

Motherboard: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157280
CPU: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103995
Video card: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150543

And then get this for the case: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811119233
 

sciguy

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Thanks for the helpful answers. I was wondering about the MOBO and CPU being compatable - I was doing a little mixing and matching. Thanks for straightening me out on that.

A few follow up questions for either or both of you if you have time If not then you've already been helpful and have my thanks:

- I've had some input from some that felt I should skimp a bit elsewhere and try to get 16GB of ram since I'd be doing a lot of video editing. Any thoughts?

- g-unit1111, you mentioned I should skip the SSD for now. I mentioned that I have an external 1TB drive I was planning on using for the time being (not sure if you saw that or not) so, to your point, I wouldn't be putting many files on the SSD. My thought was put Windows, the editing software, and, perhaps, the files that I am currently working with on the SSD. Move completed projects to the external HDD. Does that make sense or do you still feel I'd be better off with the 500GB mechanical drive than an SSD? (PS - thanks for the specific links for alternative components - looks good!)

- I've got mixed feedback on a video card. Some have said I don't need it for video editing (just for gamers mainly). Sounds like you feel I'll see much improvement with a graphics card, huh?

- Do I gain much incremental benefit from six cores vs. four?

Thanks so much!

 

Max1s

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Why do you have a socket FM1 for an AM3 Phenom 2? As far as I am aware that cpu and that mobo has different sockets, they need to have the same socket.
Also while Phenom 2s are great price/performance cpus, make sure you get an AM3+, so you can use an older phenom 2, while later being able to use future bulldozer cpus.
 

sciguy

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Thanks for the reply.

Yes, one of the earlier responders also caught that issue about the sockets. That's the kind of problems I was hoping someone would catch.

.....and thanks for the thought on the AM3+ motherboard and the upgrade potential.

I posted a few followup questions (earlier in the string) to some earlier comments. I'd appreciate any input on those questions you might have if you have the time.

Thanks again!
 

sciguy

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Thanks! I've heard some wonderful things about SSDs!
 

Cripple13

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Yes they are at the point where if you don't get one you're already behind the rest of the world haha. It all comes down to budget though because they are expensive. If you can afford one it is stupid not to get one, but if you can't, you should still try to get one later on down the road
 

Petrofsky

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First, where is your power supply?

If money's tight, try it with 8G of RAM and see if it drags. Just try to get sticks that will allow you to add more, in other words, don't fill your DIMM slots with the 8.

I think your plan for the SSD is good. It just speeds things up in general and makes the whole PC experience sexier.

As for video cards, many video editing programs, like Adobe Premiere Pro, use the CUDA in Nvidia cards to great advantage. Here is an article from 2009. Google is your friend.

There are applications that use six cores. Here's what a hexi does for Premiere Pro CS4.
 

sciguy

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Thanks! I think I'll try to squeeze it in if I can. I just want to try to avoid "budget bloat" - I'm already tempted!! LOL
 

Cripple13

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Yes it's very hard to resist, especially on here when everyone is giving you suggestions of how to pinch every last dollar, but they all list different components so you end up thinking about an entire new build lol
 

sciguy

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Thanks for the input.

Unless I'm missing something the case comes with a 450W PSU. You might argue that it's not a GOOD PSU but I believe it's at least there.

I get your point about the RAM. I was thinking about the same strategy - i.e. seeing how it goes and then going for another 8GB when money becomes available or if the 8GB just isn't doing it.

I followed your link to elitebastards. Pretty technical for me but I think I get the point - sounds like a GPU takes over a lot of the work from the CPU, thus, improving performance (just like in the old days). Would it stand to reason that I might do better with a 4 core CPU and a lower end graphics card then 6 cores without one?

And, by the way, I'm thinking I'll be using a simpler editing program - probably something like a Premiere Elements 10. That's probably more my speed than something like a Premiere Pro. Maybe that makes a difference in your thinking?

Thanks again!
 

sciguy

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Yes, I'm already in quite a different place than I was 2 hours ago when I first posted! LOL

 

djridonkulus

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SCIGuy:

Your mobo and processor doesn't seem to be compatible. Here's a link about your Mobo Socket: http://www.cpu-world.com/Sockets/Socket%20FM1.html

Your CPU is not on the list.

Also, why AMD?

It's been proven again and again that Intel processors dominate. From what I've calculated, your budget is just a bit over $500 correct?

If video editing is your primary objective, then based on the following reviews:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/intel-z68-express-smart-response-technology-ssd-caching,2938.html

and

http://www.videoguys.com/Guide/E/Videoguys+System+recommendations+for+Video+Editing/0x4aebb06ba071d2b6a2cd784ce243a6c6.aspx

You would want an Intel CPU (i5 2500K for best bang for the buck) a Z68 or H67 mobo for QuickSync capability for boosted video encoding processing speed, and a NVIDIA graphics card for CUDA video editing capability.

So a better build would be this (I'm choosing the cheapest options keeping your budget in mind)

Mobo: ASUS P8Z68 V-LX $120
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131781

CPU: Intel i5-2320 $190
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115091

GPU: Geforce GTS 450 $110
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814125397

RAM: 8GB Corsair Vengeanch $40
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820233144

SSD: Any SSD that fits your budget will do. Z68 mobos should provide better performance with SSDs. Make sure it is SATA III for 6gb/s transfer speed to take advantage of your mobo's capabilities. It is said that Intel SSDs are more reliable but not as fast as the other Sandforce based SSDs. I have an OCZ Vertex 2 that I had to RMA 3 times in 6 months. The other 2 died on me randomly. I would say to stay away from OCZ but their customer service was prompt and nice and they never charged me a penny (i live near their warehouse so i picked up the replacements myself).


Oh and your questions...

6 cores vs 4 cores... really depends. Cores are mostly for multitasking and many software are not programmed to take advantage of more than one core. iTunes for example only uses a single core. The answer to your question depends on what video editing software you're using, but again, tests have shown that even though AMD has 6 cores, they still can't beat Intel's i5/i7 4 cores in processing speed and power. They're just that much more efficient.

Video cards are for gamers and you don't NEED it for video editing but you would WANT it lol. A decent video card will handle the video processing faster than your onboard video but if you want to save the +$100 of the video card, the onboard can do it.

Don't skip the SSD. It makes everything so much faster. Seriously faster. It's the way of the future... now. Especially with video editing and all of the loading of big files involved, it makes work so much more... enjoyable? No more annoying wait times? It's only advantageous if you put your OS on the SSD, so if you get it later, you will have to reinstall Windows on it again... the pain in that itself is good enough reason to get the SSD now. Use it as your "work bench" per se, edit the videos on it, then transfer the final product to your external HDD. Make sure you have a USB 3.0 External too to take advantage of the double speed that the mobo can do.

With regards to RAM, the more the merrier in your case since you'll have many big files loaded but budget is always a concern. You can get the 8GB now and then get another 8GB later. You should have 64bit Windows where 8GB is now the new "sweet spot" of RAM capacity to have. I had to upgrade from 6GB because my BF3 was a RAM whore.


Hope this helps a bit.

 
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g-unit1111

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- g-unit1111, you mentioned I should skip the SSD for now. I mentioned that I have an external 1TB drive I was planning on using for the time being (not sure if you saw that or not) so, to your point, I wouldn't be putting many files on the SSD. My thought was put Windows, the editing software, and, perhaps, the files that I am currently working with on the SSD. Move completed projects to the external HDD. Does that make sense or do you still feel I'd be better off with the 500GB mechanical drive than an SSD? (PS - thanks for the specific links for alternative components - looks good!)

I didn't see the part about the 1TB hard drive.

If you're going to get an SSD you should definitely not get the Vertex 3 - OCZ is really hit or miss when it comes to SSDs and I wouldn't trust your data to that drive just for that reason. The mechanical drives are far more reliable and they'll need fewer replacements. If you insist on getting the SSD I'd definitely recommend doing a bit of research before settling on the brand that's the cheapest.

You would want an Intel CPU (i5 2500K for best bang for the buck) a Z68 or H67 mobo for QuickSync capability for boosted video encoding processing speed, and a NVIDIA graphics card for CUDA video editing capability.

I think a lot of posters in this thread didn't realize that OP was on a budget - if that's the case then the 2500K would NOT be the best choice as it's quite a bit more expensive than the comparable AMD CPU is (and Newegg has been jacking the price to astronomical levels for some reason). If you insist on Intel then maybe go with an H67 and an i3-2120 - that would be a better bang-for-your-buck solution and it would enable you to use the onboard video until you're able to afford a dedicated GPU like a 6850.

Video cards are for gamers and you don't NEED it for video editing but you would WANT it lol. A decent video card will handle the video processing faster than your onboard video but if you want to save the +$100 of the video card, the onboard can do it.

I'll actually disagree with this one as the onboard video puts a huge strain on your CPU. If you were going with something like, say a Llano which has dedicated cores for graphics proccessing, yeah, you would benefit there. But You don't want to spend money replacing your CPU every year by overloading it to the max it can handle.

Yes it's very hard to resist, especially on here when everyone is giving you suggestions of how to pinch every last dollar, but they all list different components so you end up thinking about an entire new build lol

Yeah it's very tempting, I'll agree with that. :lol:
 

Petrofsky

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Ah. I clicked on the one recommended by our illustrious friend and member g-unit1111. If you do get a graphics card, we'll have to circle back to this.

Would it stand to reason that I might do better with a 4 core CPU and a lower end graphics card then 6 cores without one?

Good question. I don't know, but that never stopped me from offering an opinion before. Depends on the program, I guess, and exactly what you end up doing with it, but, probably. But from what I could find out by briefly googling without caring very much, Elements doesn't use CUDA.
 

djridonkulus

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I'll actually disagree with this one as the onboard video puts a huge strain on your CPU. If you were going with something like, say a Llano which has dedicated cores for graphics proccessing, yeah, you would benefit there. But You don't want to spend money replacing your CPU every year by overloading it to the max it can handle.

And I'll have to disagree with that... but not out of spite. You make CPUs sound really delicate and fragile when they really aren't. My old 486 computer still boots (I can't bring myself to throw it away... memories...). I've been running my i7 920 overclocked to 3.6GHz for over a year and it's fine (knock on wood). You don't need to fear having to replace CPUs every year because you make it "work". They're designed to "work". If by "strain" you mean that your system may lag a bit, or be a little slower... then I may agree a little bit, but of course it will be slower than if you were using a dedicated graphics card.

Bottom line: Onboard graphics are put there to be used. If they kill CPU's.. they wouldn't put them there.
 

g-unit1111

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That's why I generally tend to recommend even a low cost GPU. You don't want to drop even $1K on a new system and then have it lag anywhere. I try to build my systems as lag-free as possible with the budgets I'm given.
 

sciguy

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Thanks!! Sorry for the delay in responses - I've been reading all of the links and trying to process the info and opinions everyone is so graciously providing (apparently my brains needs an upgrade to an Core i7 too! LOL)

A million questions/comments are running around in the brain but let me try to limit them to a few and address them somewhat in the order of your comments:

- yes, a couple of folks have already pointed out the incompatability in the MOBO and CPU but I still appreciate that you confirmed the concern. :)

- I hear you on Intel vs. AMD. I have never seen much disagreement with your point of view of Intel superiority but was going with AMD for budgetary concerns (value for the $). Thanks for your alternative suggestions (FYI - I don't see a case suggestion - I'll need to add that cost in there too)! If I were to bite the bullet and go with Intel how do you feel about this build - seems like it might be a little cheaper and gets your preferred CPU?? I hope the link works! (I'd switch out the 500GB HDD for a 120GB SSD and also forego the DVD writer):

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=1241992&CatId=333

My guess is that you'll feel the MOBO is the weak link. I know I'm asking for a value judgement but is spending the extra $40 for the board you're suggesting going to make a noticeable difference?

- Your thoughts are right in line with what I was thinking about how to use the SSD. I'm glad that it seems I'm at least thinking about that right. :)

- Sounds like there is "loose consensus" among all who have responded that a video card is helpful - some just seem to feel the boost will be more noticeable than others. FYI - I'm just planning on using Adobe Premiere Elements 10 (unless someone has a better suggestion for the same price point) so I'm not going high end on software either.

- I haven't reach hard resolutions on direction yet but, based on everyone's feedback, I AM pretty sure I'm going with 8GB RAM and no graphics card to begin with and reserving the option of adding them if I'm not happy with the performance.

Thanks so much for the input! If you don't have time for these questions I COMPLETELY understand!! I know everyone has day jobs! LOL
 

sciguy

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I appreciate the additional input!

Sounds like most are in agreement about OCZ. Even assuming I get something from a more reliable supplier it sounds like the tradeoff one makes for an SSD is some reliability in exchange for vastly increased speed, right?

And per the comment I just made above it sounds like everyone agrees that graphics cards are a good thing - some may just feel more valuable than others for video editing. :)
 

sciguy

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Thanks!!

Soooooooo, a program that doesn't take advantage of CUDA means less value in having a graphics card? Is that how I should interpret that? :)
 

Petrofsky

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That's what I was driving at in an attempt to answer your question when I don't really know. I'm a gamer type. We all have mammoth graphics cards and don't grok other byteforms. You maybe should post in a video editing forum on the relative importance of CPU and GPU, and study the available software to determine whether CUDA cores will speed things up for you.
 

g-unit1111

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Yes. On SSDs you pretty much have to factor in reliability vs. capacity vs. drive longevity. Some SSD vendors are really great (Intel, Samsung, Crucial, Kingston Hyper X, Mushkin, and Plextor). Some are decent (Corsair, G.Skill, ADATA, Sandisk) and others are questionable reliability at best (OCZ, Wintec, Zalman, and the rest).

Graphics cards are indeed a good thing but even a smaller one will more likely to assist with your overall system performance vs. not having one at all. Even something like a 6450 will take some of the load off of your CPU without putting a massive strain on it.
 
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