firewire vs. IDE

[littleberry]

Over the weekend I heard two different discussions on PC talk shows concerning CD recorders (can't remember which shows). One indicated that the limiting factor for record
speed was the quality of the CD's you buy, up to the rated
speed of your recorder. The other said that the new firewire recorder from SONY (16x) had new techniques that
make reliable recording at 16x a reality - this host said
he had already achieved several 16x burns with no problems.
What is the real story here - is there something new here
under the sun with using the firewire port for burning
to an external CD?
I have a creative labs 6x/4x/24x, and I have found that is
will only record 6x about half the time. Recently, I tried
to record just under 600megs, with a large number of small
files, and it kept failing (each time another wasted cd),
until I finally had to reboot and burn it at 1x. Since
then, I have burned other cd's (200-300 megs with no problems at 6x (I always use cd's purchased in a 50 pack
at officemax).
What is the bottom line story here? Of course, I connect
the cd device to a dedicated secondary dma channel, and
I draw data from the master drive on the primary channel.
Can anyone back up the claims made about firewire?
Littleberry

 

[wapaaga]

you find that most of the newer dirves don't have as much as a problem with under run as the older drives do

heck with plextro you can sposedly paly a game and burn a cd a 16x

 

[littleberry]

(original poster) My original post is too wordy.
What I really want to know is if anyone has experience
with the FIREWIRE external CD recorders from SONY.
What is the advantage over a similar-spec'd IDE?
Can they really truly burn at 16x with ordinary CD's
that you get at Office Depot (no wasted disks)? Littleberry

 

[Guest]

I highly doubt it. You have to remember that Firewire is just the interface standard. Yes you will get a faster and more reliable transfer rate with Firewire over IDE. However, the real issue with the higher speed recorders isn't about data transfer, it has to do with the quality of the surface on the CD's. You should never have a problem if you use gold CD's but will always have an issue at higher speeds with the blue/green junk that OfficeMax and CompUSA sells.

John Garrett
System Admin - www.elementk.com
Editor - Exploring Windows NT Professional

 

[ejsmith2]

I'm not sure most of those disks can handle 16x. Probably 12x at the most, more likely 8x. I also don't know of any writers that won't burn those un-holy disks you can buy for $.10/disk. Whether the data is intact is another matter completely, as i've found out. Even if you burn strictly audio, the cracks and pops can be disconcerting. I usually buy the Memorex 80-min. disks (advanced phthalocyanine), which are around $.47/disk. I think they are starting to rate them for 16x, but i've chucked all my spindle labels so I don't know for certain.

 

[littleberry]

If it is really the surface (as one talk show host said),
then I should be able to keep using my current creative
labs 6x, but just start using the "gold" cd's.
I still have that 600mb image, so I am going to BigD
tomorrow and buy me a "gold" cd (whatever small package
they sell - I suppose at Fry's?), and then I will burn
it again. If it works, then I am a believer! If not,
then, well, blast. What I really want is avoid these
failed burns and I don't really mind the 6x speed if it
were truly reliable. I'll post here after I see what
happens. Littleberry

 

[wapaaga]

i've got few questions for you
first how fast is your computer
second how much ram do you have

lastly iwould say save the money form buying the gold and go buy yourself a better cd burner

 

[littleberry]

550 mhz PIII, 440bx, 256 meg cas3, 5200 udma-33 40gigs,
and I have burned probably over 20-30 so far.
Sometimes they go at 6x w/o problems. I *thought*
this was a good brand of cd-recorder (creative labs????).
So, figuring that what I really really want is NO WASTED
ATTEMPTS (I don't want to have to toss out a cd and
start all over again). What do you recommend? I am
running win98se. Littleberry

 

[littleberry]

I am a believer! I got a small pack of GOLD cd disks
(5 for $4 at Fry's) and reburned that same image with
NO PROBLEMS. None at all. I didn't even do the sim
first, just plunged right into the burn - 'took about
9 minutes (540 megs). Ok, so it IS the quality of the
cd disks, because it failed over a half dozen times
with those cheap officemax 50-packs, and it even failed
a 2X with the cheapies! So I don't have to buy a better
burner, just use the pricier disks (less than a buck, not
all that bad, really).
BUT,...
While I was at Fry's, I read the box for a new 12x/10x/32x
TDK internal IDE, and it said they had new technology and
new software that prevented underruns absolutely. Is that
what you get with the newer burners? They wanted $250 for
this new TDK, but it looks like this might be worth it
at upgrade time, if these new technology burners will
burn onto the cheap disks. Has anyone got experience
using the newer "no-underrun" burners with the cheap
disks for pure backup data (not sound, just mega files)?
I don't plan on ugrading anytime soon, now that I see
what I need to do to get reliable burning, but I
would like to hear your experiences for later reference.
Littleberry

 

[Guest]

I'm glad you are a believer. Imation silvers I've had no problems with, but I also haven't had problems with the blue ones either. The quality of the media is definitely a factor. I think I read that the better quality media, the faster that the material can change from raw material to digitally stored ones and zeros. It has to do with the reaction time of the media when it is bombarded with the laser. Something like that... The faster rated media has a better reaction time with the laser.


- Every private citizen has a public responsibility

 

[Hobbit]

Please dont waste a 100 dollars by getting the TDK. Get a Teac 512EB Eide which has Burn Proof, fully supports CloneCD, Overburns and has a 4mb Buffer. This drive is 12x10x32 and sells for about 160 dollars shipped. It is the best burner you can buy right now for the money bar none. Some will say plextors same speed model is what they recommend but it is about 60 dollars more expensive and only has a 2mb buffer, cant overburn and doesnt support write simulation with Clonecd which the teac does. You can thank me later.

Balls, said the Queen if I had them I would be king!

 

[littleberry]

(original poster)

BLAST!

I just tried to burn a big big directory tree (just under
600mb) and IT FAILED! Even with the GOLD disks!

What does this mean?

ONE: My Creative Labs 6x/4x/24x burner
is a "hit or miss" proposition.

TWO: Using "gold" disks may not help, after all.

THREE: It is time to upgrade, provided this
hype about the new "no-underruns"
technology is for real.

Question: Does anyone have one of these newer burners
that can reliable burn deep directory trees
of 600 mbs and lots of files, with NO FAILURES?
If so, please specify brand and model? ok?

Littleberry

 

[Hobbit]

I already told you.

Balls, said the Queen if I had them I would be king!

 

[Crashman]

Go SCSI, problem solved. That's what I did with the burner, my other drives are IDE. Or get a Burn-Proof (R) drive.

Suicide is painless...........

 

[rfh1234]

My personal experience is TDK cd's work the best, even though they are blue. I have never, ever had a problem with them. They are the ONLY ones I've found that work with Playstation backups EVERY time and I have tried them ALL. The Memorex & Kodak "golds" in my experience,work pretty good but not perfectly EVERY time. I use a Plextor 16/10/40 with "Burn Proof" so only having a 2 mb buffer doesn't really matter. I can listen to a cd audio, while surfing the net, while burning a disc from an image, and not have ANY problems, of course while doing so many different things at the same time my burn doesn't sustain 16x but I don't care cause it's not tying up my computer. If I want to wait and do nothing while I copy a disc I can burn at 16x and be done between 4-6 minutes, disc to disc. I use Disc Dupe alot now because it came with the Plextor and it works the balls. I got mine for $242 with no shipping charge from Z-buy.com along with a bunch of other things, (they don't charge for shipping on most stuff, they use FedEx saver so you get it in about 3 days, and have ballsy prices) I found them through pricewatch and was happy to get the retail boxed version, not OEM. But enough plugging them, I was just happy to get a good deal as everywhere local wanted at least $300. My old HP8100 4/2/24 was pretty reliable too but "Burn Proof" kicks. No more coasters! I personally have had excellent luck with it. It will burn 80 minute discs but no more as this can potentially ruin a burner but at 50 cents apiece why would I want to overburn anyway? Plextor rules !
PS. "Burn Proof" technology comes with other burners, I think Yamaha and maybe others, it's a very good feature