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Next (the other next) Gen "DVD" storage

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Anonymous
May 27, 2005 2:10:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2005/05/27/Nanoscale_DVD/

Heading towards the Tera-byte...

Cheers,
Alan
--
-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
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-- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch.

More about : gen dvd storage

Anonymous
May 27, 2005 2:14:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

It would be great, if it works. I had to laugh at the idea that 800 GB
was more storage then normal people would need. I have 490 GB of hard
drive connected to my computer, they are not currently all full, but to
backup that amount of data would take over 100 DVDs.

For years now removable storage has not been keeping up with hard
drives. On my first computer, that had hard drive, I had 20 MB of hard
drive space, I could back this up with 17 5 1/4 floppys. Pretty soon
the hard drives were up to 500 MB and we could no longer backup the
whole drive with floppy, but then came CDs and life was good, for a
while. When hard drives started getting to the 20 GB range even CDs
were getting to be small for doing backups, then came DVDs, but 250 GB
drives where right behind them.

Blue Ray will help but we are going to be looking at 1000 GB hard
drives soon so even Blue Ray won't be enough.

Scott
Anonymous
May 27, 2005 2:16:14 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Alan Browne wrote:
> http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2005/05/27/Nanoscale_DVD/
>
> Heading towards the Tera-byte...
>
> Cheers,
> Alan
Interesting. Imagine the cost of the burner.
But then again, I said somthing similar when cassettes replaced 8 tracks!
Related resources
May 27, 2005 2:21:17 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

For may of us, our first hard drive was 5 or 10 meg.
No enough for a single raw image today.
And 1 gig of camera storage is roughly the same as 4 rolls of 135/24
film.
The changes are amazing.

Collin
Anonymous
May 27, 2005 7:46:31 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On Fri, 27 May 2005 10:10:31 -0400, in rec.photo.digital , Alan Browne
<alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> in <d779og$khu$1@inews.gazeta.pl>
wrote:

>
>http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2005/05/27/Nanoscale_DVD/
>
>Heading towards the Tera-byte...

An interesting notion. It would require extensive processing and so
would be slow. (Yes, with faster processors it would be faster, but
still slower than less complex systems.) I would not expect to see
this on the market particularly soon, particularly from a company with
no record of innovation.


--
Matt Silberstein

All in all, if I could be any animal, I would want to be
a duck or a goose. They can fly, walk, and swim. Plus,
there there is a certain satisfaction knowing that at the
end of your life you will taste good with an orange sauce
or, in the case of a goose, a chestnut stuffing.
Anonymous
May 27, 2005 7:46:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Matt Silberstein wrote:

> On Fri, 27 May 2005 10:10:31 -0400, in rec.photo.digital , Alan
> Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> in
> <d779og$khu$1@inews.gazeta.pl> wrote:
>
>
>> http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2005/05/27/Nanoscale_DVD/
>>
>> Heading towards the Tera-byte...
>
>
> An interesting notion. It would require extensive processing and so
> would be slow. (Yes, with faster processors it would be faster, but
> still slower than less complex systems.) I would not expect to see
> this on the market particularly soon, particularly from a company
> with no record of innovation.

eh? The zip drive system was, at the time quite innovative. They lost
that, and this is their leapfrog (if it comes to fruition, of course).

By the time this reaches the market (if), then processing will be
faster, memory will be larger, video requirements will be greater, etc. etc.

10 years ago, proposing something like DVD was considered a monumental
amount of storage. Today, it doesn't cover a few weeks worth of RAW
shooting.

Everything just keeps going and going (faster and more).

Cheers,
Alan.


--
-- r.p.e.35mm user resource: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpe35mmur.htm
-- r.p.d.slr-systems: http://www.aliasimages.com/rpdslrsysur.htm
-- [SI] gallery & rulz: http://www.pbase.com/shootin
-- e-meil: Remove FreeLunch.
Anonymous
May 27, 2005 7:46:32 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

"Scott W" <biphoto@hotmail.com> writes:

> It would be great, if it works. I had to laugh at the idea that 800 GB
> was more storage then normal people would need. I have 490 GB of hard
> drive connected to my computer, they are not currently all full, but to
> backup that amount of data would take over 100 DVDs.
>
> For years now removable storage has not been keeping up with hard
> drives.


Oh, yes, it has, but not in the price range we would like to have. There
are LTO tapes with 100GB, 200GB or 400GB _uncompressed_ (usually advertised
as 200GB/400GB/800GB tapes) storage. There are SDLT with similar
capacity. But the prices assume that you are at least a small business:
e.g. 4-5k for 10 LTO2 autoloader.

Or you can go with DLT drives with (up to) 160GB comporessed storage for
2-3K -- again an autoloader.

They both are SCSI devices. I am sure there are some IDE based backup
technologies as well.

Expensive? Maybe. How important is your data to you?

Bye, Dragan

--
Dragan Cvetkovic,

To be or not to be is true. G. Boole No it isn't. L. E. J. Brouwer

!!! Sender/From address is bogus. Use reply-to one !!!
Anonymous
May 27, 2005 9:56:41 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

On Fri, 27 May 2005 12:32:18 -0400, in rec.photo.digital , Alan Browne
<alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> in <d77i2b$kg6$1@inews.gazeta.pl>
wrote:

>Matt Silberstein wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 27 May 2005 10:10:31 -0400, in rec.photo.digital , Alan
>> Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> in
>> <d779og$khu$1@inews.gazeta.pl> wrote:
>>
>>
>>> http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2005/05/27/Nanoscale_DVD/
>>>
>>> Heading towards the Tera-byte...
>>
>>
>> An interesting notion. It would require extensive processing and so
>> would be slow. (Yes, with faster processors it would be faster, but
>> still slower than less complex systems.) I would not expect to see
>> this on the market particularly soon, particularly from a company
>> with no record of innovation.
>
>eh? The zip drive system was, at the time quite innovative. They lost
>that, and this is their leapfrog (if it comes to fruition, of course).

Let me re-state then, a company with a poor record of innovation. They
came up with a single poor product and done nothing since.

>By the time this reaches the market (if), then processing will be
>faster, memory will be larger, video requirements will be greater, etc. etc.

A point I made. But it will still require significant processing:

"The angles would be detected by analyzing light after it had bounced
off several ridges - calculating which combination of slopes would
have produced the result."

That looks like a non-trivial problem.

>10 years ago, proposing something like DVD was considered a monumental
>amount of storage. Today, it doesn't cover a few weeks worth of RAW
>shooting.

I agree that 1T storage will make sense at some point. The question is
how.

>Everything just keeps going and going (faster and more).

Which does not mean that all technologies are a good idea.

--
Matt Silberstein

All in all, if I could be any animal, I would want to be
a duck or a goose. They can fly, walk, and swim. Plus,
there there is a certain satisfaction knowing that at the
end of your life you will taste good with an orange sauce
or, in the case of a goose, a chestnut stuffing.
Anonymous
May 27, 2005 9:56:42 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Matt Silberstein wrote:
> On Fri, 27 May 2005 12:32:18 -0400, in rec.photo.digital , Alan
> Browne
> <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> in
> <d77i2b$kg6$1@inews.gazeta.pl>
> wrote:
>
>> Matt Silberstein wrote:
>>
>>> On Fri, 27 May 2005 10:10:31 -0400, in rec.photo.digital , Alan
>>> Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> in
>>> <d779og$khu$1@inews.gazeta.pl> wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>> http://www.bit-tech.net/news/2005/05/27/Nanoscale_DVD/
>>>>
>>>> Heading towards the Tera-byte...
>>>
>>>
>>> An interesting notion. It would require extensive processing and
>>> so
>>> would be slow. (Yes, with faster processors it would be faster,
>>> but
>>> still slower than less complex systems.) I would not expect to see
>>> this on the market particularly soon, particularly from a company
>>> with no record of innovation.
>>
>> eh? The zip drive system was, at the time quite innovative. They
>> lost that, and this is their leapfrog (if it comes to fruition, of
>> course).
>
> Let me re-state then, a company with a poor record of innovation.
> They
> came up with a single poor product and done nothing since.
>

<snip>

My wife has a polo shirt that proclaims proudly that the wearer was a
member of the uh, uh, I forget what Iomega product it was, but it was
well after the Zip things.

>
> Which does not mean that all technologies are a good idea.

Ya got that right, Pilgrim.

--
Frank ess
Anonymous
May 27, 2005 9:56:42 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Matt Silberstein wrote:

>>By the time this reaches the market (if), then processing will be
>>faster, memory will be larger, video requirements will be greater, etc. etc.
>
>
> A point I made. But it will still require significant processing:
>
> "The angles would be detected by analyzing light after it had bounced
> off several ridges - calculating which combination of slopes would
> have produced the result."
>
> That looks like a non-trivial problem.

I do agree...

But, quadrature phase (QPSK) modems would have been considered a
non-trivial problem 25 years ago. They're already well behind us. Some
military radios have had dramatic increases in effective bandwidth
through complex modulation schemes... and so on.

It is non-trivial to do thses things at first; once they're done, they
become standard very quickly.


>>Everything just keeps going and going (faster and more).
>
>
> Which does not mean that all technologies are a good idea.


The marketplace arbitrates that. Cruelly.

(Whether the marketplace rewards silliness is another matter. People
are silly and buy silly things).

Cheers,
Alan.
Anonymous
May 28, 2005 1:28:31 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

<snip>
> (Whether the marketplace rewards silliness is another matter. People are
> silly and buy silly things).
>
> Cheers,
> Alan.

Like Sigma SLRs..?
Anonymous
May 28, 2005 1:12:54 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

The one thing I have a problem with is that much data on one disk, knowing
the reliability of media with a far less granular storage method.

As more and more data is stored on disk, the medium needs to be more and
more accurate.


Imagine after 10 years going to find a years worth of photos on your disk
and it being unreadable..


$ for $, I think you would still be better of with the linear mag tape or HD
storage with one of these as a secondary backup.


I read an article not that long ago about a guy from a computer magazine
that burnt a stack of cd's about 4 years ago. He burnt them and then put
them in the dark of a cupboard in the office and then 4 years later he got
them out and checked how they fared.

40% of the disks were unreadable.....


I think the same is true of compactflash cards. I used 512mb cards to spread
the risk. Considering the alternative with 35mm was a change of roll every
36 exposures to change a card every 145 exposures is hardly an inconvenience
and reduces the possibility of loss to just 145 pics and not say 600 with a
1Gb card.
Anonymous
May 28, 2005 4:54:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.digital.slr-systems (More info?)

Steve Franklin wrote:
>
> I read an article not that long ago about a guy from a computer magazine
> that burnt a stack of cd's about 4 years ago. He burnt them and then put
> them in the dark of a cupboard in the office and then 4 years later he got
> them out and checked how they fared.
>
> 40% of the disks were unreadable.....
>

One swallow does not a summer make. We don't know how good his burner
was; the quality of the media used; how good was the reader he used to
evaluate the disks (did he try more than one reader?); we don't even
know if he verified them at the time of writing.

I use a reputable CD/DVD burner, and phthalocynanine CD's. Some of my
disks are years old, and I haven't found a duff one yet. The DVD's are
too new so far to form any idea of their life.

Colin
Anonymous
May 31, 2005 9:53:04 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

In article <1117214080.743803.205370@g43g2000cwa.googlegroups.com>,
biphoto@hotmail.com (Scott W) wrote:

> Blue Ray will help but we are going to be looking at 1000 GB hard
> drives soon so even Blue Ray won't be enough.
IOmega already do a 35Gb cartridge based backup device.

Iain
!