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Is there any camera on earth meeting 4 simple requirements..

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Anonymous
June 10, 2005 4:25:30 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

MY QUESTION:
Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
- AA batteries
- Good photo quality
- 7x to 10x optical zoom
- CF media

I ask for your help in that I've only found ONE camera which comes
close to meeting these 4 simple (and, I'd bet, pretty univerally held)
requirements:
- AA batteries (never again will I buy electronics with battery packs!)
- Excellent picture quality (I trust in Consumer Reports measurements)
- 7x - 10x optical zoom (equivalent to about 200 mm or more)
- Compact Flash media (I already have many CF cards & PCMCIA readers)

Searching endlessly, I can only find one camera coming close:
- Canon Powershot S1 IS (3.2 MP)
But I'd like a 5 megapixel or larger (for enlargements if needed).

Also this digital camera doesn't have a macro capability.
(Ad copy says it can focus at 4 inches so that seems like a built-in
macro non-macro to me ... what do you think)?

Is there any AA,CF,7x, camera with good photo quality on earth?

Susan Henderson
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 5:31:55 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

John Bean wrote:
> > Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
> > - AA batteries, quality photos, 7x zoom, CF media
>
> Minolta A2 with optional grip meets your requirements.
> Without the grip it can only use supplied Li-Ion battery but
> with grip it can use one or two Li-Ions or six AA.

Whoa! :)  I'm confused.

Do you mean the 8 MegaPixel $800 Konica Minolta DiMAGE A2?

Consumer Reports, in its future July 2005 online ratings gave it a "NO"
on the use of AA batteries (line 78 of the 79-line 7/2005 digital
camera ratings report). But, wait. That's not all. When I froogle, I
can see there is an optional BP-400 VERTICLE GRIP for the "Minolta A2"
for about $100 additional.

Am I wrong? Is Consumer Reports wrong?
Or are there multiple Minolta A2 cameras (like there are multiple Nikon
CoolPix cameras)?

What further confuses me is that the $550 5MP Nikon CoolPix 5700 (line
38 of the CR 7/2005 on-line ratings chart) is listed on Consumer
Reports as accepting AA batteries - but I have one and I know that not
to be the case without the optional Nikon MB-E5700 Battery Pack for
about $150 additional.

So, is this my new AA battery summary correct (if not, what is wrong)?
- $350, 3MP, 10x zoom, Canon PowerShot S1IS I takes AA batteries native
- $550, 5MP, 8x zoom, Nikon CoolPix 5700 is $150 more for AA batteries
- $800, 8MP, 7x zoom, DiMAGE Minolta A2 is maybe $100 more for AA?

Please help me as I am utterly amazed there are only three cameras
which even come close to these pretty universal simple 4 features.
- AA batteries
- Excellent photo quality
- 7x zoom
- Compact Flash

You will help others at the same time.
Susan Henderson
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 6:06:41 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Rod Speed wrote:
> Its terminally stupid to be limiting your choices with
> that silly requirement that it must use AA batterys.

I think I understand your point about AA batteries.
One the one hand, the battery has nothing to do with the pictures.
So, you are correct. I am an idiot for making AA a requirement.

On the other hand, when I vacation, I carry with me:
- a Nikon CoolPix 5700 (which needs at least 2 proprietary batteries)
- a JVC video camera (which needs at least 2 proprietary batteries)
- a Garmin GPS unit (which takes AA batteries)
- a Maglight flashlight (which takes AA batteries)
etc.

That means I have to carry additional batteries (one or two are never
enough as you well know) and of course I need to carry separate
additional battery chargers and I can't substitute one for the other
and (much worse) I can't stop at the local A&P to pick up an emergency
battery if I need to.

Add the fact that battery packs (by their electrical nature of
positive-minus butt-to-nose abutment) ALWAYS go bad (one cell reverse
polarizes) and, therefore, need to be constantly replaced at an
exhorbitant cost (NiMH cost about two bucks ... try to get a battery
pack for a camera for two bucks).

Add to that the waste to the earth's resources (personally I think the
government should mandate single-cell batteries in all electronics in a
save-the-landfill effort like they mandate the 5 cents per soda
waste-return program).

And the horrid cost!
Recently I paid over $75 dollars retail for the JVC replacement battery
(the only one in the store was the Everready Energizer ERC620 camcorder
battery).

Now for paying $75 for a stinkin' battery, you _can_ call me a
terminally stupid idiot! :) 

I could have purchased a fifty pound car battery for that much.

End result:
I am never again buying any electronics that does not take single-cell
rechargable batteries! I'm sure I'm not the only one so please come to
my defence if you agree, so we can get back to the photographic
equipment question at hand.

Are these really the only three digital cameras on earth that take
single-cell batteries and have decent picture quality, zoom, and
compact flash cards?

- $350, 3MP, 10x zoom, Canon PowerShot S1IS I takes AA batteries native
- $550, 5MP, 8x zoom, Nikon CoolPix 5700 is $150 more for AA batteries
- $800, 8MP, 7x zoom, DiMAGE Minolta A2 is maybe $100 more for AA?

Susan Henderson
Related resources
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 6:18:41 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

David J Taylor wrote:
> > Am I wrong? Is Consvmer Reports wrong?
>
> Do yov believe /everything/ yov read in CR?
>
> The poster was svggesting an add-on to the camera which converted it from
> Li-ion battery to AAs. A nvmber of cameras offer this.

I agree with yov. Consvmers Union is sometimes wrong.
That's why I asked this newsgrovp.
Becavse I believe this newsgrovp more than I believe Consvmer Reports.

In fact, I already pointed ovt where CR was wrong in the Nikon CoolPix
5700 taking AA batteries (as pvblished in the latest digital camera
ratings dated 7/2005). :) 

All I was confirming was whether I vnderstood the camera correctly
(Minolta DiMAGE A2 ???) and whether or not it trvly can take AA
batteries becavse there was an obviovs descrepancy (and I am not at all
familiar with that digital camera like I am with the Nikon eqvivalent).

Is it correct that these three and no other digital camera on earth
can:
- take AA batteries
- snap excellent photos
- at at least 7x zoom
- saving onto compact flash media

Svsan Henderson
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 7:12:43 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
....
> So, is this my new AA battery summary correct (if not, what is wrong)?
> - $350, 3MP, 10x zoom, Canon PowerShot S1IS I takes AA batteries native
> - $550, 5MP, 8x zoom, Nikon CoolPix 5700 is $150 more for AA batteries
> - $800, 8MP, 7x zoom, DiMAGE Minolta A2 is maybe $100 more for AA?
>
> Please help me as I am utterly amazed there are only three cameras
> which even come close to these pretty universal simple 4 features.
> - AA batteries
> - Excellent photo quality
> - 7x zoom
> - Compact Flash

I think the part you're not clear on is that these features are by no
means universal. If they were then every camera would have them. The
most limiting factors on your list are the AA batteries and Compact
Flash. I would focus more on the other features as it's easy enough
to work around memory and batteries.

For instance, CF memory isn't any less expensive, or more expensive,
than any other digital camera memory. You might find it better to
buy the kind of camera you really desire and switch to using whatever
storage it takes. You can always sell the CF memory on ebay or the
like. Memory card readers usually read all the popular types of cards
anyhow so compatibility shouldn't be an issue.

You can also get external battery packs for digital cameras. I'm sure
one or more of these have the option to use AA batteries. The camera
would need an external power jack but with the way these things eat
batteries, I would be surprised if they didn't. Even so, I wouldn't
count on disposable AA's for anything except emergency use.

Anthony
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 9:11:29 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
> Rod Speed wrote:
>
>>Its terminally stupid to be limiting your choices with
>>that silly requirement that it must use AA batterys.
>
>
> I think I understand your point about AA batteries.
> One the one hand, the battery has nothing to do with the pictures.
> So, you are correct. I am an idiot for making AA a requirement.
>
> On the other hand, when I vacation, I carry with me:
> - a Nikon CoolPix 5700 (which needs at least 2 proprietary batteries)
> - a JVC video camera (which needs at least 2 proprietary batteries)
> - a Garmin GPS unit (which takes AA batteries)
> - a Maglight flashlight (which takes AA batteries)
> etc.
>
> That means I have to carry additional batteries (one or two are never
> enough as you well know) and of course I need to carry separate
> additional battery chargers and I can't substitute one for the other
> and (much worse) I can't stop at the local A&P to pick up an emergency
> battery if I need to.
>
> Add the fact that battery packs (by their electrical nature of
> positive-minus butt-to-nose abutment) ALWAYS go bad (one cell reverse
> polarizes) and, therefore, need to be constantly replaced at an
> exhorbitant cost (NiMH cost about two bucks ... try to get a battery
> pack for a camera for two bucks).
>
> Add to that the waste to the earth's resources (personally I think the
> government should mandate single-cell batteries in all electronics in a
> save-the-landfill effort like they mandate the 5 cents per soda
> waste-return program).
>
> And the horrid cost!
> Recently I paid over $75 dollars retail for the JVC replacement battery
> (the only one in the store was the Everready Energizer ERC620 camcorder
> battery).
>
> Now for paying $75 for a stinkin' battery, you _can_ call me a
> terminally stupid idiot! :) 
>
> I could have purchased a fifty pound car battery for that much.
>
> End result:
> I am never again buying any electronics that does not take single-cell
> rechargable batteries! I'm sure I'm not the only one so please come to
> my defence if you agree, so we can get back to the photographic
> equipment question at hand.
>
> Are these really the only three digital cameras on earth that take
> single-cell batteries and have decent picture quality, zoom, and
> compact flash cards?
>
> - $350, 3MP, 10x zoom, Canon PowerShot S1IS I takes AA batteries native
> - $550, 5MP, 8x zoom, Nikon CoolPix 5700 is $150 more for AA batteries
> - $800, 8MP, 7x zoom, DiMAGE Minolta A2 is maybe $100 more for AA?
>
> Susan Henderson
>
It would seem that way. Camera manufacturers are much more concerned
with profits than user convenience. They see the lithium ion batteries
as a profit opportunity, and a design convenience. CF cards aren't all
that big, so I see little advantage to the other types of cards unless
the camera is REALLY small, but the smaller components are another
design convenience, and smaller usually means cheaper. It seems you
will be forced to compromise, as I did, and buy something with AA
batteries and SD cards... Lots of options when you make the CF/SD card
compromise.


--
Ron Hunter rphunter@charter.net
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 11:13:56 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

ya..
ihave a fuji s3000 .. AAs 4 of them.. 6 X optical zoom.. with xD...
and I have been over impressed with it.. low light capture. is great..

http://www.pricegrabber.com/search_getprod.php/masterid...
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 11:31:40 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
[]
> Is there any AA,CF,7x, camera with good photo quality on earth?

We had similar requirements, but could not find a camera with enough
resolution. In the end I got a Panasonic FZ5 and my wife an FZ20,
changing to SD cards (which are smaller and probably more reliable because
of their better contact mechanism), and accepting the single-cell battery
(which is a lot easier to change in the field than having multiple AA
cells rolling about on the floor!). These cameras have an excellent Leica
zoom lens (12X 36 - 432mm, f/2.8 throughout the range on the FZ20) and
produce good quality 5MP images.

David
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 11:31:41 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

David J Taylor wrote:
> Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
> []
>
>>Is there any AA,CF,7x, camera with good photo quality on earth?
>
>
> We had similar requirements, but could not find a camera with enough
> resolution. In the end I got a Panasonic FZ5 and my wife an FZ20,
> changing to SD cards (which are smaller and probably more reliable because
> of their better contact mechanism), and accepting the single-cell battery
> (which is a lot easier to change in the field than having multiple AA
> cells rolling about on the floor!). These cameras have an excellent Leica
> zoom lens (12X 36 - 432mm, f/2.8 throughout the range on the FZ20) and
> produce good quality 5MP images.
>
> David
>
>
Those batteries may be easier to change, but they sure are EXPENSIVE!
NOt much battery flexibility either. Give me a camera with AA
batteries, and I will deal with the battery changes for the flexibility.


--
Ron Hunter rphunter@charter.net
June 10, 2005 11:48:58 AM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Pentax istD with battery grip
or
Pentax isdDS/DL (but they use SD)

Just add zoom/macro lens.

What I was looking for, when considering p&s digitals, was the hot
shoe.
All the other things seems superfluous -- they can be exchanged or
dealt with.
But the hot shoe provides a lighting interface. Few have it.

Colln
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 12:13:13 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 01:31:55 -0700, Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:

> So, is this my new AA battery summary correct (if not, what is wrong)?
> - $350, 3MP, 10x zoom, Canon PowerShot S1IS I takes AA batteries native
> - $550, 5MP, 8x zoom, Nikon CoolPix 5700 is $150 more for AA batteries
> - $800, 8MP, 7x zoom, DiMAGE Minolta A2 is maybe $100 more for AA?
>
> Please help me as I am utterly amazed there are only three cameras
> which even come close to these pretty universal simple 4 features.
> - AA batteries
> - Excellent photo quality
> - 7x zoom
> - Compact Flash

Does the new Canon S2 IS not meet your requirements? If it
doesn't, I imagine that it would be due to replacing CF with SD
cards. It replaces the 3mp sensor in the S1 IS with a 5mp sensor.

How about the Fuji S7000? It's zoom is a bit lower than you
specified, only 6x, but it uses AA batteries, CF cards, and has the
Super CCD 6mp sensor that's capable of being interpolated to a
bloated 12mp, but you don't have to use that feature if you don't
want to.
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 12:38:36 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Renato wrote:
> Fuji Finepix S7000.
> Renato

Hmmmn ... what is microdrive?

Consumer Reports lists the $515 6MP Fuji FinePix S7000 (#39 on the July
2005 ratings chart) as:
- AA batteries = YES
- excellent photo quality = YES
- 7x optical zoom = NO (6x might be acceptable though)
- Compact Flash media = NO (xD & microdrive - whatever that is)

However, DP Reviews ( http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilms7000 )
lists the $550 6MP Fuji FinePix S7000 (January 2004) as:
· Slot 1: xD-Picture Card
· Slot 2: Compact Flash Type I or Type II (IBM Microdrive compatible)

So, I'm confused again. Did I do the wrong initial research?
I passed over the Fuji Finepx S7000 because it was xD and microdrive
(but not CF); but it appears microdrive might be the SAME as CF so why
didn't CR say so?

I'm confused,
Susan Henderson
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 12:44:09 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
[]
> Am I wrong? Is Consumer Reports wrong?

Do you believe /everything/ you read in CR?

The poster was suggesting an add-on to the camera which converted it from
Li-ion battery to AAs. A number of cameras offer this.

David
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 12:44:10 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

David J Taylor wrote:
> Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
> []
>
>>Am I wrong? Is Consumer Reports wrong?
>
>
> Do you believe /everything/ you read in CR?
>
> The poster was suggesting an add-on to the camera which converted it from
> Li-ion battery to AAs. A number of cameras offer this.
>
> David
>
>
Many cameras have a jack for external power, and as long as polarity,
voltage, and current specs match, the power source can be ANY battery
that satisfies the requirements, from an old lantern battery, to a 3000
kilowatt generator.


--
Ron Hunter rphunter@charter.net
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 12:51:55 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 00:25:30 -0700, "Susan (Graphic Artist)"
<takenothingbutpics@yahoo.com> wrote:

>MY QUESTION:
> Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
> - AA batteries
> - Good photo quality
> - 7x to 10x optical zoom
> - CF media

Minolta A2 with optional grip meets your requirements.
Without the grip it can only use supplied Li-Ion battery but
with grip it can use one or two Li-Ions or six AA.

--
Regards

John Bean
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 12:55:25 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

"Susan (Graphic Artist)" wrote:
>
> Renato wrote:
> > Fuji Finepix S7000.
> > Renato
>
> Hmmmn ... what is microdrive?

It's a tiny hard drive.
http://www.dpreview.com/learn/?/Glossary/Camera_System/...

--
Cheers,
Bev
ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
If it ain't broke, fix it 'til it is.
June 10, 2005 12:55:43 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 00:25:30 -0700, "Susan (Graphic Artist)"
<takenothingbutpics@yahoo.com> wrote:

>MY QUESTION:
> Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
> - AA batteries
> - Good photo quality
> - 7x to 10x optical zoom
> - CF media
>
>I ask for your help in that I've only found ONE camera which comes
>close to meeting these 4 simple (and, I'd bet, pretty univerally held)
>requirements:
>- AA batteries (never again will I buy electronics with battery packs!)
>- Excellent picture quality (I trust in Consumer Reports measurements)
>- 7x - 10x optical zoom (equivalent to about 200 mm or more)
>- Compact Flash media (I already have many CF cards & PCMCIA readers)

Susan,

I hope you are able to find what you are looking for. Please let us
know how your search comes out. When I was looking for my digital
camera I had a similar set of requirements, but I had to relax them
considerably. After careful consideration of each, I'm very pleased
with my choice. The one major difference in our requirements was that
I was looking for a lens that was at least 28mm (35mm FOV equivalent)
at the wide end of the zoom but the tele extent was not a factor.

I went with a Canon S60 but that comes no where near your zoom
requirements.

I actually like the Canon battery for the S60 much better than AA's,
but I don't know the root of your requirement and I might just be
blowing smoke with the rest of this. I find the s60 battery life to be
entirely adequate for a day of touring (about 200 pictures), much
easier to change and smaller than a set of "replacement AA's. It comes
with a very compact charger that I can carry with me at all times (and
do), fits discretely in the wall socket with no cords and can be used
in hotel room "shaver" outlets throughout the world. I have three
batteries and find that I really need only two. For my needs, these
are really a better answer than AA's.

I trust DPreview http://www.dpreview.com image quality evaluations
much more than Consumer Reports. If you haven't used dpreview as a
resource, it might be able to help you fill in some holes in your
search.

As you know most Canon's and Nikons take CF, however there cameras in
each line that don't.

I know the Nikon D70 does not take AA's, but with the 28-200 it does
meet your other requirements. Battery life is excellent. A spare is a
reasonable cost for the function.

I kept track of my AA and rechargeable AA usage and I'm finding that
the LiIon rechargeable proprietary batteries are generating, by
volume, much less waste than all other batteries that I use. They are
much more efficient and useable (charge wise) than NiMH batteries. My
company provides a battery recycling service for everything so I'm
somewhat assured that the environmental impact is less with the
proprietary ones.


I hope your search comes to a fruitful and timely end.

Regards,
Roger
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 1:05:01 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Roger wrote:
> I had a similar set of requirements, but I had to relax them ...
I'm hoping not to. :) 

> I don't know the root of your [AA battery] requirement ...
Actually it doesn't have to be AA; just standard-size rechargable.
I have tons of CostCo Ni-MH (2 bucks each, Panasonic 2300 mAh AAs).

> I find the s60 battery life to be adequate for a day ...
I use fill flash on EVERY shot; I only do portraits; I snap about 25
photos a day on average but when I'm somewhere, I take upwards of 300 a
day, again, all with fill-flash on every single shot (to illuminate or
lessen harsh shadows).

> It comes with a very compact charger ...
I'm sick and tired of proprietary chargers, carrying them past snooping
airport screeners, bringing power strips into the hotel room just to
plug them all in, forgetting them and getting only 1 day of shots for a
two-week vacation, etc.

> I have three batteries and find that I really need only two ...
Yes. But every year an internal cell goes bad and we have to purchase
another $75 proprietary battery pack (throwing the old one in the
trash). I'm sick and tired of the battery-packs going dead on me within
a year. Of course, AA's go dead too, but, I have dozens of 'em and I
can easily replace it on the fly with alkalines whenever I'm in a
crush.

> I trust DPreview http://www.dpreview.com image quality evaluations ...
Very nice site! I did not know about that. If I combine the Consumer
Reports and DP Review reviews with this newsgroup's advice, that should
get us the correct answer (each one correcting for the others'
foibles).

> I know the Nikon D70 does not take AA's ...
Then it's out of the picture. :) 
There's a reason I list AA above image quality. It's not negotiable. :) 
Neither is image quality, mind you ... my first four requirements are:
- standard batteries
- image quality
- reasonable zoom (stabilization was a factor I unknowingly omitted)
- compact flash (I'm still unsure why CR lists microdrive and not CF
for some cameras as the help on DP Review says they are basically the
same thing in the one direction I want to go).

I'd assume these are pretty common requirements as there is nothing
wierd or out of the ordinary about this. Notice I didn't even mention
megapixels (obviously the more the better the enlargement) or cost
(obviously the lower the better) or other features (which are important
too but it's just too difficult to compare more than 4 requirements
when all the cameras in the world are in the running for the first
cut). I'm still amazed that only three (now maybe four with the 6x Fuji
S7000 with microdrive addition) cameras on earth meet these four very
simple (and very common, I'd guess) needs. :( 

> I hope your search comes to a fruitful and timely end.
Thank you (and everyone!). It is sad to say there is only one or two
(maybe s many as four) cameras which even come close to meeting these
four very simple requirements (standard batteries, excellent quality,
7x zoom, & CF media).

Susan Henderson






Roger wrote:
> Susan,
>
> I hope you are able to find what you are looking for. Please let us
> know how your search comes out. When I was looking for my digital
> camera I had a similar set of requirements, but I had to relax them
> considerably. After careful consideration of each, I'm very pleased
> with my choice. The one major difference in our requirements was that
> I was looking for a lens that was at least 28mm (35mm FOV equivalent)
> at the wide end of the zoom but the tele extent was not a factor.
>
> I went with a Canon S60 but that comes no where near your zoom
> requirements.
>
> I actually like the Canon battery for the S60 much better than AA's,
> but I don't know the root of your requirement and I might just be
> blowing smoke with the rest of this. I find the s60 battery life to be
> entirely adequate for a day of touring (about 200 pictures), much
> easier to change and smaller than a set of "replacement AA's. It comes
> with a very compact charger that I can carry with me at all times (and
> do), fits discretely in the wall socket with no cords and can be used
> in hotel room "shaver" outlets throughout the world. I have three
> batteries and find that I really need only two. For my needs, these
> are really a better answer than AA's.
>
> I trust DPreview http://www.dpreview.com image quality evaluations
> much more than Consumer Reports. If you haven't used dpreview as a
> resource, it might be able to help you fill in some holes in your
> search.
>
> As you know most Canon's and Nikons take CF, however there cameras in
> each line that don't.
>
> I know the Nikon D70 does not take AA's, but with the 28-200 it does
> meet your other requirements. Battery life is excellent. A spare is a
> reasonable cost for the function.
>
> I kept track of my AA and rechargeable AA usage and I'm finding that
> the LiIon rechargeable proprietary batteries are generating, by
> volume, much less waste than all other batteries that I use. They are
> much more efficient and useable (charge wise) than NiMH batteries. My
> company provides a battery recycling service for everything so I'm
> somewhat assured that the environmental impact is less with the
> proprietary ones.
>
>
> I hope your search comes to a fruitful and timely end.
>
> Regards,
> Roger
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 1:21:48 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

"Susan (Graphic Artist)" <takenothingbutpics@yahoo.com> writes:
> Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
> - AA batteries
> - Good photo quality
> - 7x to 10x optical zoom
> - CF media

I still have an Olympus E-100RS that has all those.

> But I'd like a 5 megapixel or larger (for enlargements if needed).

Oh, you mean 5 simple goals.

> Also this digital camera doesn't have a macro capability.

Make that six simple goals.
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 1:25:23 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

Anthony Matonak wrote:
> The limiting factors are AA batteries and Compact Flash.
I was wonderin' why there was only 1 or 3 cameras on earth which
satisfied what I thought was a very simple and universally held set of
4 needs ...

> it's easy enough to work around memory and batteries ...
I'm sick and tired of proprietary battery packs going bad or forgetting
them or forgetting the charger or carrying them all around or plugging
them in or bringing european adaptors or buying hugely expensive
75-dollar batteries in a rush without being able to shop for price ...

Same thing with the memory cards (although not as vehement :)  ... I
already have the CF PCMCIA adapters (albeit these are inexpensive) in
all my laptops (I never use wires or software to transfer photos to the
laptop hard drive) and I already have a huge investment in 8Mbyte, 32
Mbyte, 128 Mbyte, 256 Mbyte, 512 Mbyte and now 1 Gbyte compact flash
cards (which have served me well over the years for a variety of
electronic needs). I have no desire to change formats just like I don't
switch from the PC to Linux to the MAC (and all that entails) for ever
piece of software I download to edit photos.

> For instance, CF memory isn't any less expensive, or more expensive,
> than any other digital camera memory.
I should have made it clear that the only reason for CF is that I chose
CF and it has served me well over the years and I don't want to have to
mix media all over again. Funny ... in a way it's the same as the
battery problem. I wish the manufacturers would just standardize on a
single format and be done with it. Like with PC USB 2.0 compatibility,
if someone wanted a secondary format, they could support BOTH and we'd
all benefit from a little bit of engineering. As stated, CF isn't that
BIG compared to the other formats.

> Memory card readers usually read all the popular types of cards
> anyhow so compatibility shouldn't be an issue.
I use PCMCIA adapters for the Compact Flash media (all laptops in my
house).
(Yes, I *know* they use proprietary batteries!)
Do they even make a PCMCIA adaptor that handles all card types?

> I wouldn't count on disposable AA's for anything except emergency use.
Agreed. I use Ni-MH batteries from CostCo.
I only count on disposable alkaline AAs for emergency use.
That's the fundamental beauty of the AA batteries in the first place!

Susan Henderson
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 1:30:16 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
> MY QUESTION:
> Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
> - AA batteries
> - Good photo quality
> - 7x to 10x optical zoom
> - CF media
>
> I ask for your help in that I've only found ONE camera which comes
> close to meeting these 4 simple (and, I'd bet, pretty univerally held)
> requirements:
> - AA batteries (never again will I buy electronics with battery packs!)
> - Excellent picture quality (I trust in Consumer Reports measurements)
> - 7x - 10x optical zoom (equivalent to about 200 mm or more)
> - Compact Flash media (I already have many CF cards & PCMCIA readers)
>
> Searching endlessly, I can only find one camera coming close:
> - Canon Powershot S1 IS (3.2 MP)
> But I'd like a 5 megapixel or larger (for enlargements if needed).
>
> Also this digital camera doesn't have a macro capability.
> (Ad copy says it can focus at 4 inches so that seems like a built-in
> macro non-macro to me ... what do you think)?
>
> Is there any AA,CF,7x, camera with good photo quality on earth?
>
> Susan Henderson

I understand your frustration but I have 2 comments.
The AA battery thing, yes you can find them everywhere BUT they are
generally alkalines or worse standard carbon cells, both having
terrible battery life with digital cameras . The propritaary batteries
on my Nikon 995 last 300-400 shots, the off brand ones I got at B&H
being better than the Nikon ones.
The second comment is on 7X zooms, there is a good chance to get aa
lens with lens distortion at either end. P&S cameras never have a wide
enough wide either (yes that is my opinion).
What would I do, a low end DSLR with a kit lens (Nikons are better
here) and a 70 to 200 (maybe 300) zoom. Better pics, less noise at high
ISO (even noticable at ISO 200 on most 8mp zooms), RAW or jpg options.
Hope you find something that makes you happy.

Tom
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 1:32:14 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Joseph Meehan wrote:
> [Proprietary camera] batteries are not that expensive

I just paid $75 for a camcorder battery (Everready Energizer ER-C620)
for my JVC camcorder and I'm on my fourth or fifth $60 battery for my
Nikon CoolPix 5700 so I just might beg to differ with you on that
point. :)  Multi-cell battery packs are highly unreliable (so are AAs
but you can easily swap a bad cell out), especially due to reverse
polarity issues killing the entire pack within a year or two.

Besides the cost, there's the fact that I'm way more likely to be stuck
without juice with the proprietary batteries than with standard-size
batteries.

And, besides the cost and fact my camera is useless for lack of juice,
there's the wide assortment of chargers, wires, and plugs I have to
deal with (as a camera isn't my only electronic stowaway when I
frequently travel).

I just can't believe there are from 1 to 4 cameras on earth which
satisfy these simple requirements (standard batteries, quality photos,
decent zoom, and standard media).

But, I do appreciate all the advice ... you're helping me ... and
others.
Susan Henderson
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 1:34:38 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

BTW,, u can get the fuji s3000 for 150 -200 .. BRAND NEW to
refurbished.. try matching that BANG for your buck

- AA batteries = YES
- excellent photo quality = YES
- 7x optical zoom = NO (6x might be acceptable though)
- Compact Flash media = NO .. xD..( which is superfast in
processing data).
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 1:37:02 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

ASAAR wrote:
> Does the new Canon S2 IS not meet your requirements?
I didn't even KNOW it existed! Maybe this is the ticket.
Especially since the 3MP S1 IS is kind'a limited on enlargements.

> I imagine that it would be due to replacing CF with SD cards.
Oh. Oh. Bummer. It loses. SD is not acceptable for the reasons stated
prior.

> How about the Fuji S7000? It's zoom is a bit lower than you
> specified, only 6x, but it uses AA batteries, CF cards
Now 'yer talking!
Let me check this out.
For some reason, Consumer Reports lists this camera as xD & microdrive
but not compact flash. I'll need to check up on that as this confuses
me as I see on DPreview that it takes SD and microdrive.

If I use CF, will it fit in something labeled as "microdrive" but not
CF?

Confused,
Susan Henderson
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 1:44:40 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Ron wrote:
> The propietary batteries I buy on e-Bay for about seven bucks each
Wow. Can you get me a handful of those seven-dollar proprietary
batteries for my Nikon CoolPix 5700 and my JVC DVL-805U camcorder?

I paid upwards of 50 to 75 dollars for MY proprietary batteries.
And, they always go dead within a year or two; so I'm constantly buying
more, typically in an emergency situation where I drive all day in
Germany to find a battery to fit.

Amazed,
Susan Henderson
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 2:01:07 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Ken Burns wrote:
> > - AA batteries (never again will I buy electronics with battery packs!)
> That means that you will never again buy electronics.

I understand your point.

In fact, I wish my laptops and cell phones would use standard-size
batteries.

In double fact, I'll pay MORE for a laptop or cell phone which used
standard-sized batteries.

If we ALL did this, the price would go down as we'd have MANY suppliers
for batteries, and we'd be able to re-use our batteries for more than
one electronic device and there would be LOWER COST BETTER EQUIPMENT
ALWAYS USABLE in the end, for all of us, for all our electronics.

Am I the ONLY one who sees this enchanting possibility of progress? :) 

Wondering aloud,
Susan Henderson
June 10, 2005 2:02:11 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

I must say I was very devoted to AA's until getting Oly 5060 and E-300
which take (the same) proprietary battery. It isn't just the added
punch, but the ease with which I can exchange batteries, and the tiny
charger which, with another I carry for flashlight AA's, would easily
fit in a coat pocket or shaving kit. And, the propietary batteries I buy
on e-Bay for about seven bucks each work just fine as backups. Where I
do like AA's is with a small camera that takes two of them. My sense is
that in this case one gets a lot more for one's money, particularly if
the camera will take CRV3 rechargeables. As for CF, I'm among those who
had pin problems and had to return a camera for repair. They strike me
as overly delicate. I'm much more comfy with xD or even my old Smart Media.

Just a couple more thoughts from someone who has been going around the
block for a long time. Good luck! Let us know what you do.

Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
> MY QUESTION:
> Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
> - AA batteries
> - Good photo quality
> - 7x to 10x optical zoom
> - CF media
>
> I ask for your help in that I've only found ONE camera which comes
> close to meeting these 4 simple (and, I'd bet, pretty univerally held)
> requirements:
> - AA batteries (never again will I buy electronics with battery packs!)
> - Excellent picture quality (I trust in Consumer Reports measurements)
> - 7x - 10x optical zoom (equivalent to about 200 mm or more)
> - Compact Flash media (I already have many CF cards & PCMCIA readers)
>
> Searching endlessly, I can only find one camera coming close:
> - Canon Powershot S1 IS (3.2 MP)
> But I'd like a 5 megapixel or larger (for enlargements if needed).
>
> Also this digital camera doesn't have a macro capability.
> (Ad copy says it can focus at 4 inches so that seems like a built-in
> macro non-macro to me ... what do you think)?
>
> Is there any AA,CF,7x, camera with good photo quality on earth?
>
> Susan Henderson
>
June 10, 2005 2:24:48 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Fuji Finepix S7000.
Renato

"Susan (Graphic Artist)" <takenothingbutpics@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118388330.369297.139440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> MY QUESTION:
> Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
> - AA batteries
> - Good photo quality
> - 7x to 10x optical zoom
> - CF media
>
> I ask for your help in that I've only found ONE camera which comes
> close to meeting these 4 simple (and, I'd bet, pretty univerally held)
> requirements:
> - AA batteries (never again will I buy electronics with battery packs!)
> - Excellent picture quality (I trust in Consumer Reports measurements)
> - 7x - 10x optical zoom (equivalent to about 200 mm or more)
> - Compact Flash media (I already have many CF cards & PCMCIA readers)
>
> Searching endlessly, I can only find one camera coming close:
> - Canon Powershot S1 IS (3.2 MP)
> But I'd like a 5 megapixel or larger (for enlargements if needed).
>
> Also this digital camera doesn't have a macro capability.
> (Ad copy says it can focus at 4 inches so that seems like a built-in
> macro non-macro to me ... what do you think)?
>
> Is there any AA,CF,7x, camera with good photo quality on earth?
>
> Susan Henderson
>
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 2:56:20 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 08:38:36 -0700, "Susan (Graphic Artist)"
<takenothingbutpics@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Renato wrote:
>> Fuji Finepix S7000.
>> Renato
>
>Hmmmn ... what is microdrive?

A microdrive is an electromechincal device that when you drop it you
loss all the data on it. An obsolete technology best forgotten.

http://www.dcresource.com/forums/showthread.php?t=7008

Microdrive R.I.P.


************************************************************
"Give me the liberty to know, to utter, and to argue freely,
according to conscience, above all liberties."

Milton
from
"The Liberty of Unlicensed Printing"
1644
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 3:07:12 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living, (More info?)

"Susan (Graphic Artist)" <takenothingbutpics@yahoo.com> wrote:

> Searching endlessly, I can only find one camera coming close:
> - Canon Powershot S1 IS (3.2 MP)
> But I'd like a 5 megapixel or larger (for enlargements if needed).

The newer Powershot S2 IS ($480 at B&H Photovideo) is 5 Mp, 12x zoom, but
uses SD card rather than CF. To my mind, the biggest digital bang for the
buck.


--
Anti-Spam address: my last name at his dot com
Charles Gillen -- Reston, Virginia, USA
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 3:09:42 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 09:05:01 -0700, "Susan (Graphic Artist)"
<takenothingbutpics@yahoo.com> wrote:

snipped
>> I know the Nikon D70 does not take AA's ...
>Then it's out of the picture. :) 
>There's a reason I list AA above image quality. It's not negotiable. :) 
>Neither is image quality, mind you ... my first four requirements are:
>- standard batteries

The Canon 20D when fitted with a BG-E2 grip will take AA batteries.


************************************************************
"Give me the liberty to know, to utter, and to argue freely,
according to conscience, above all liberties."

Milton
from
"The Liberty of Unlicensed Printing"
1644
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 3:15:26 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
> Ron wrote:
> > The propietary batteries I buy on e-Bay for about seven bucks each
> Wow. Can you get me a handful of those seven-dollar proprietary
> batteries for my Nikon CoolPix 5700 and my JVC DVL-805U camcorder?
>
> I paid upwards of 50 to 75 dollars for MY proprietary batteries.
> And, they always go dead within a year or two; so I'm constantly buying
> more, typically in an emergency situation where I drive all day in
> Germany to find a battery to fit.


A quick eBay search for EN-EL1 turned up hundreds for around $9 with
shipping. They go bad on the shelf, though my experience has been it
takes about two years for that to happen, so you might just buy new
ones once a year. Lenmar's LIJ-408 for your JVC camcorder is a little
rarer, so runs around $30 from many suppliers.

That said, I've personally chosen to standardize on Canon products
which will take a BP-511. I've got two cameras and a video camera now,
so with a dual-bay charger I don't really need to carry much to run
several devices. The batteries have had good life (my nearly four year
old ones are getting about half their original life, newer ones better)
and are common, cheap, and high capacity. I'm done with AA batteries.
The flashlight gets a set of NiMHs that I swap out with the set on the
charger every month regardless of use.

-Keith
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 3:26:39 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
> MY QUESTION:
> Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
> - AA batteries
> - Good photo quality
> - 7x to 10x optical zoom
> - CF media

The Canon 20D w/ battery grip and a good zoom will fit all of your
requirements and more. It will be expensive.

Frankly I think you are too stuck in the past. CF media is fine, but I
would not and did not choose a camera based on a specific media.

AA batteries are fine, but don't knock other sizes. Batteries are just
not that expensive and with a small charger and a few batteries your are
set.

As expensive as they are, I have to consider digital cameras of today as
disposable, just as I consider my computer that way. Times change too fast.


--
Joseph Meehan

Dia duit
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 3:39:37 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

"Susan (Graphic Artist)" wrote:
>
> On the other hand, when I vacation, I carry with me:
> - a Nikon CoolPix 5700 (which needs at least 2 proprietary batteries)
> - a JVC video camera (which needs at least 2 proprietary batteries)
> - a Garmin GPS unit (which takes AA batteries)
> - a Maglight flashlight (which takes AA batteries)

You can save more space than the extra batteries if you leave the video
camera at home, and replace the GPS unit with a map, a compass, and a
willingness to ask locals for directions.

As far as your 4 requirements for a camera, you can go even simpler by
selecting a camera that does not use batteries, and uses the most common
type of media there is: film. Going to this lower common denominator
means that you can buy lenses with excellent optics, fulfilling your the
other two requirements easily and at a lower cost.
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 4:18:28 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

> - AA batteries (never again will I buy electronics with battery packs!)

That means that you will never again buy electronics.

KB
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 4:18:37 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

On 10 Jvn 2005 02:18:41 -0700, "Svsan (Graphic Artist)"
<takenothingbvtpics@yahoo.com> wrote:

>I agree with yov. Consvmers Union is sometimes wrong.
>That's why I asked this newsgrovp.
>Becavse I believe this newsgrovp more than I believe Consvmer Reports.

Yov might want to broaden yovr reading a little beyond CU.
Dpreview, Steve's, even the manvfactvrers themselves, are all on the
Web, with free professional (biased, on the part of the manvfactvrers,
possibly, albeit technically correct) reviews of most cameras being
recently marketed.
There's certainly nothing wrong with vsing newsgrovps for this, bvt,
IMO, restricting yovrself to CU for technical reviews of digital
cameras means yov are missing a *LOT*.

--
Big Bill
Replace "g" with "a"
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 4:27:00 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 09:25:23 -0700, "Susan (Graphic Artist)"
<takenothingbutpics@yahoo.com> wrote:

>Anthony Matonak wrote:
>> The limiting factors are AA batteries and Compact Flash.
>I was wonderin' why there was only 1 or 3 cameras on earth which
>satisfied what I thought was a very simple and universally held set of
>4 needs ...

It w3ould seem to be reasonable to think that if they were indeed
"universally held" set of needs, there would be more cameras meeting
them. That there aren't means that either most makers are stupid, or
these aren't really "universally held".
I go for the latter. :-)
>
>> it's easy enough to work around memory and batteries ...
>I'm sick and tired of proprietary battery packs going bad or forgetting
>them or forgetting the charger or carrying them all around or plugging
>them in or bringing european adaptors or buying hugely expensive
>75-dollar batteries in a rush without being able to shop for price ...

Forgetting the charger will not go away with AAs.
A rush may be an emergency for you, but...
$75 batteries? CU can't show you how to buy something other than OEM?
Adapters for foreign countries will still be required for that AA
charger. And AA chargers still need to be arried around.
And AAs go bad, too.
It would seem that you've not really thought this one through well.
>
>Same thing with the memory cards (although not as vehement :)  ... I
>already have the CF PCMCIA adapters (albeit these are inexpensive) in
>all my laptops (I never use wires or software to transfer photos to the
>laptop hard drive) and I already have a huge investment in 8Mbyte, 32
>Mbyte, 128 Mbyte, 256 Mbyte, 512 Mbyte and now 1 Gbyte compact flash
>cards (which have served me well over the years for a variety of
>electronic needs). I have no desire to change formats just like I don't
>switch from the PC to Linux to the MAC (and all that entails) for ever
>piece of software I download to edit photos.

No problem. CF is very popular, and will continue to be so.
Although, that "huge" investment in your CF cards below 512 MB is
gone; they are dirt cheap now.
>
>> For instance, CF memory isn't any less expensive, or more expensive,
>> than any other digital camera memory.
>I should have made it clear that the only reason for CF is that I chose
>CF and it has served me well over the years and I don't want to have to
>mix media all over again. Funny ... in a way it's the same as the
>battery problem. I wish the manufacturers would just standardize on a
>single format and be done with it. Like with PC USB 2.0 compatibility,
>if someone wanted a secondary format, they could support BOTH and we'd
>all benefit from a little bit of engineering. As stated, CF isn't that
>BIG compared to the other formats.
>
>> Memory card readers usually read all the popular types of cards
>> anyhow so compatibility shouldn't be an issue.
>I use PCMCIA adapters for the Compact Flash media (all laptops in my
>house).
>(Yes, I *know* they use proprietary batteries!)
>Do they even make a PCMCIA adaptor that handles all card types?
>
>> I wouldn't count on disposable AA's for anything except emergency use.
>Agreed. I use Ni-MH batteries from CostCo.
>I only count on disposable alkaline AAs for emergency use.
>That's the fundamental beauty of the AA batteries in the first place!
>
>Susan Henderson

--
Big Bill
Replace "g" with "a"
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 4:45:15 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

"Susan (Graphic Artist)" <takenothingbutpics@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1118388330.369297.139440@g44g2000cwa.googlegroups.com...
> MY QUESTION:
> Can there not be a camera on earth that meets these 4 simple goals?
> - AA batteries
> - Good photo quality
> - 7x to 10x optical zoom
> - CF media
>

<snip>


Check out http://www.steves-digicams.com . This guy has reviews and specs
with sample pics from tons of cameras!
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 5:15:44 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 09:44:40 -0700, "Susan (Graphic Artist)"
<takenothingbutpics@yahoo.com> wrote:

>
>
>Ron wrote:
>> The propietary batteries I buy on e-Bay for about seven bucks each
>Wow. Can you get me a handful of those seven-dollar proprietary
>batteries for my Nikon CoolPix 5700 and my JVC DVL-805U camcorder?
>
>I paid upwards of 50 to 75 dollars for MY proprietary batteries.
>And, they always go dead within a year or two; so I'm constantly buying
>more, typically in an emergency situation where I drive all day in
>Germany to find a battery to fit.
>
>Amazed,
>Susan Henderson

Google is your friend!
Here's one for under $25 for the 5700:
http://www.ebatts.com/nikon_coolpix-5700_digital-camera...

For the 805U:
http://www.ebatts.com/jvc_gr-dvl805u_camcorder_batterie...


--
Big Bill
Replace "g" with "a"
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 5:30:57 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 09:37:02 -0700, Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:

>> How about the Fuji S7000? It's zoom is a bit lower than you
>> specified, only 6x, but it uses AA batteries, CF cards
> Now 'yer talking!
> Let me check this out.
> For some reason, Consumer Reports lists this camera as xD & microdrive
> but not compact flash. I'll need to check up on that as this confuses
> me as I see on DPreview that it takes SD and microdrive.
>
> If I use CF, will it fit in something labeled as "microdrive" but not
> CF?

The Fuji S7000 is has two card slots. One is for xD cards and the
other is for Compact Flash Type I/II cards.. Microdrives are CF
cards that use a tiny hard drive instead of flash memory, so you
have the option of using either standard CF cards or microdrives.
You'd probably be better off using standard CF cards as they're
probably more rugged, but either should work well. I don't know
where you saw only xD and microdrive on dpreview.com, but they do
list the full description in at least two places:

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilms7000/

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/fujifilms7000/page3.asp
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 5:45:13 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 07:48:58 -0700, Cheesehead wrote:

> What I was looking for, when considering p&s digitals, was the hot
> shoe.
> All the other things seems superfluous -- they can be exchanged or
> dealt with.
> But the hot shoe provides a lighting interface. Few have it.

The Fuji S7000 mentioned elsewhere also has a flash hotshoe. Wish
my camera had one.
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 5:58:37 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
[]
> All I was confirming was whether I understood the camera correctly
> (Minolta DiMAGE A2 ???) and whether or not it truly can take AA
> batteries because there was an obvious descrepancy (and I am not at
> all familiar with that digital camera like I am with the Nikon
> equivalent).

I would normally credit the information here:

http://www.dpreview.com/reviews/konicaminoltaa2/

> Is it correct that these three and no other digital camera on earth
> can:
> - take AA batteries
> - snap excellent photos
> - at at least 7x zoom
> - saving onto compact flash media
>
> Susan Henderson

As I said before, although I tried a similar set of criteria, I ended up
allowing SD rather than CF, and abandoning the clumsy multiple AA cells.
So I can't directly answer yes or no to your question. Having a camera
which worked well and was easily available was more important. I also
feel that if you want 7X zomm, you should include image stabilisation in
your criteria. I wish you luck in your search.

Cheers,
David
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 5:59:24 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 09:30:16 -0700, tomm101 wrote:

> I understand your frustration but I have 2 comments.
> The AA battery thing, yes you can find them everywhere BUT they are
> generally alkalines or worse standard carbon cells, both having
> terrible battery life with digital cameras . The propritaary batteries
> on my Nikon 995 last 300-400 shots, the off brand ones I got at B&H
> being better than the Nikon ones.

Cameras have evolved considerably since the near-prehistoric days
of the Nikon 995. :)  I say that because many of the new cameras
that use two AA alkaline batteries are able to take about 200 shots
(half with flash, half without) with them. I normally use 4 NiMH AA
cells in own Fuji S5100, but the first time I tried using alkaline
AAs in it they lasted for more than 600 shots. I'll continue using
NiMH for the most part, but if for some reason I had to use alkaline
batteries it wouldn't be that bad. And alkalines don't lose their
charge by sitting unused on a shelf for a month or two. They're
more like lithium-ion rechargeables in this respect, not having the
high self-discharge rates of NiCad and NiMH batteries.
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 6:02:57 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Ron Hunter wrote:
[]
> Those batteries may be easier to change, but they sure are EXPENSIVE!
> NOt much battery flexibility either. Give me a camera with AA
> batteries, and I will deal with the battery changes for the
> flexibility.

If you buy recent 3rd party Li-ion batteries, they are not /that/
expensive, compared to the total cost of a good camera and a reasonable
amount of storage.

I would like to see a standard range of Li-ion cells, though, like AA, D
cells etc., so that the batteries were interchangeable between brands a
much larger alternative market could develop. Would bring costs right
down, I suspect!

Cheers,
David
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 6:37:21 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

On 10 Jun 2005 10:01:07 -0700, Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:

> In double fact, I'll pay MORE for a laptop or cell phone which used
> standard-sized batteries.
> . . .
> Am I the ONLY one who sees this enchanting possibility of progress? :) 

No, I agree with you. But I don't think that cell phones using
standard sized D cells would sell very well. :) 
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 7:49:15 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital (More info?)

Susan (Graphic Artist) wrote:
[]
> · Slot 1: xD-Picture Card
> · Slot 2: Compact Flash Type I or Type II (IBM Microdrive compatible)
>
> So, I'm confused again. Did I do the wrong initial research?
> I passed over the Fuji Finepx S7000 because it was xD and microdrive
> (but not CF); but it appears microdrive might be the SAME as CF so why
> didn't CR say so?

A CF slot will accept a compact flash card, and a type II CF slot which is
a little thicker, and the norm these days, will accept both a CF (memory
card) and a microdrive (miniature hard disk, with moving parts).

David
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 8:23:54 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

Big Bill wrote:
>
> <takenothingbvtpics@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
> >I agree with yov. Consvmers Union is sometimes wrong.
> >That's why I asked this newsgrovp.
> >Becavse I believe this newsgrovp more than I believe Consvmer Reports.
>
> Yov might want to broaden yovr reading a little beyond CU.
> Dpreview, Steve's, even the manvfactvrers themselves, are all on the
> Web, with free professional (biased, on the part of the manvfactvrers,
> possibly, albeit technically correct) reviews of most cameras being
> recently marketed.
> There's certainly nothing wrong with vsing newsgrovps for this, bvt,
> IMO, restricting yovrself to CU for technical reviews of digital
> cameras means yov are missing a *LOT*.

CU is OK for mainstream consvmer goods (what do yov REALLY expect from a
toaster?), bvt anything involving enthvsiast-level or above is beyond their
reach. I get really tired of hearing abovt possible shock hazards, too. "If
yov straighten ovt a coat hanger and stick it into this hole right here yov
will probably receive a lethal shock."

I vsed to read the car evalvations in the annval book, bvt then I realized
that "electrical problems" can mean either a fvse replacement or yovr entire
wiring harness catching fire.

--
Cheers,
Bev
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Of covrse "õŽl has fovr seasons:
Earthqvake, Mvdslide, Brvshfire, and Riot
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 8:27:29 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,misc.consumers.frugal-living,rec.photo.marketplace (More info?)

"Susan (Graphic Artist)" wrote:
>
> Anthony Matonak wrote:
> > The limiting factors are AA batteries and Compact Flash.
> I was wonderin' why there was only 1 or 3 cameras on earth which
> satisfied what I thought was a very simple and universally held set of
> 4 needs ...
>
> > it's easy enough to work around memory and batteries ...
> I'm sick and tired of proprietary battery packs going bad or forgetting
> them or forgetting the charger or carrying them all around or plugging
> them in or bringing european adaptors or buying hugely expensive
> 75-dollar batteries in a rush without being able to shop for price ...

My husband made a battery pack for his walkman out of a double D-size battery
holder from radio shack, some wire and a plug. D batteries are way cheaper to
use than AAs.

--
Cheers,
Bev
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Of course SoCal has four seasons:
Earthquake, Mudslide, Brushfire, and Riot
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 8:36:57 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

"Susan (Graphic Artist)" wrote:
>
> Joseph Meehan wrote:
> > [Proprietary camera] batteries are not that expensive
>
> I just paid $75 for a camcorder battery (Everready Energizer ER-C620)
> for my JVC camcorder and I'm on my fourth or fifth $60 battery for my
> Nikon CoolPix 5700 so I just might beg to differ with you on that
> point. :)  Multi-cell battery packs are highly unreliable (so are AAs
> but you can easily swap a bad cell out), especially due to reverse
> polarity issues killing the entire pack within a year or two.
>
> Besides the cost, there's the fact that I'm way more likely to be stuck
> without juice with the proprietary batteries than with standard-size
> batteries.
>
> And, besides the cost and fact my camera is useless for lack of juice,
> there's the wide assortment of chargers, wires, and plugs I have to
> deal with (as a camera isn't my only electronic stowaway when I
> frequently travel).
>
> I just can't believe there are from 1 to 4 cameras on earth which
> satisfy these simple requirements (standard batteries, quality photos,
> decent zoom, and standard media).

"Decent" zoom is 3x optical, which is common and decent. My Coolpix 800 which
I bought at Thanksgiving 2000 fits your other criteria, so you want
exceptional zoom. You forgot to mention write speed, which I would consider
more important than the zoom. If you get a huge number of megapixels you can
just crop out the middle and there you are.

I'd like the 800 to be faster and I'd especially like it if they'd spent the
extra dime to put a second eyelet on it so I could wear it around my neck like
normal people do. Carrying a camera on your wrist is an open invitation to
smash it against something hard just by unthinkingly turning around quickly.

No, hanging it around my neck using the single eyelet is NOT the same.

--
Cheers,
Bev
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Of course SoCal has four seasons:
Earthquake, Mudslide, Brushfire, and Riot
Anonymous
June 10, 2005 8:41:56 PM

Archived from groups: rec.photo.digital,rec.photo.marketplace,misc.consumers.frugal-living (More info?)

"Susan (Graphic Artist)" wrote:

> There's a reason I list AA above image quality. It's not negotiable. :) 
> Neither is image quality, mind you ... my first four requirements are:
> - standard batteries
> - image quality
> - reasonable zoom (stabilization was a factor I unknowingly omitted)
> - compact flash (I'm still unsure why CR lists microdrive and not CF
> for some cameras as the help on DP Review says they are basically the
> same thing in the one direction I want to go).

You can use an ordinary CF card in a microdrive hole, but you can't stuff a
microdrive into an ordinary CF hole.

--
Cheers,
Bev
++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
Of course SoCal has four seasons:
Earthquake, Mudslide, Brushfire, and Riot
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