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A few hours with Jade Empire

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April 13, 2005 10:37:54 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

I'm not sure what to think about it just yet. It's reminiscent of
Fable. The combat, simplicity of mechanics and lush graphics are very
Fable-like. The writing and game flow are totally Bioware, though. It
still looks like the KOTOR engine (enhanced) and conversations work the
same.

You have three stats, Mind Body and Chi. All three stats work in
harmony (obviously, Eastern/kung-fu stuff) like no other game I can
remember. Unlike previous Bioware RPGs all three are important and
you'll be utilizing all three in combat regardless of what type of
character build you pursue. Basically, Body relates to health, Mind to
Focus, and Chi is magic essence. They also determine three conversation
skills - Intuition, Intimidation and Charm.

Combat is either hard or I'm just not used to it yet. I've died three
times in the first two hours of play. There is a basic light attack, a
heavy block-breaking attack, an area effect attack and block. They work
in a rock-paper-scissors fashion. Thirty combat styles can be mapped to
the d-pad and switched on the fly, which you'll be doing a lot of. For
example, I started with a support style that does no damage but slows
the enemy. So I'll open with that style, crippling my foe then switch
to a damaging style to take him down. Things can get hectic when there
are multiple enemies and I've found myself trapped in a corner a few
times. There is more to it than what I've described but early in the
game you don't have many options. Some creatures are immune to certain
styles, there are weapon styles, etc. Combat styles can be upgraded in
three ways when you level up.

There is no inventory at all. No armor, no accessories, no nothing. You
can find or buy 'techniques' that permanently modify your stats. "Iron
Belly", for example, will increase your Body by 3 while decreasing your
Mind by 1. There's also an amulet that you can affix gems to, I haven't
seen it yet.

So far the combat is fun even though I keep getting my ass handed to
me. The conversations and exploration are what I expected. However, the
lack of inventory and streamlined character building is a little
disappointing. To be fair, KOTOR had a lot of skills you'd end up
taking because there was nothing else to take. Jade Empire looks to be
more focused than that. You'll find followers (one can travel with you
at a time) but I don't think they level up at all, there probably is an
invisible scaling to keep up with your character as he/she becomes more
powerful.

I miss encumbrance rules, having to make camp at night so my party
wouldn't be fatigued, having five people following me around and I
liked loads of loot and gear that would change character's
appearances. Bioware has slowly trimmed all this down into
nonexistence. Baldur's Gate to Planescape to NWN/KOTOR, you could see
it coming. I guess that's just how things go. Jade Empire is a major
departure from the old games, which is fine, however Jade Empire is
more similar to current games whereas Bioware's older titles were
unique for their time.

More about : hours jade empire

Anonymous
April 13, 2005 4:36:33 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

very thoughtful insight, debaser... thanks. overall, though, would you
say it's a fun game? i considered renting it, but am wondering if
there's enough replay value upon finishing to buy it?
April 13, 2005 5:43:50 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Fizzlestix wrote:
> very thoughtful insight, debaser... thanks. overall, though, would
you
> say it's a fun game? i considered renting it, but am wondering if
> there's enough replay value upon finishing to buy it?

Did you purchase KOTOR1/2 and Fable? How many times did you play
through KOTOR1/2 and Fable?

Choose your own path, grasshopper, for it is unwise to trust in those
who don't know you as well as you know yourself. :) 

I'm having a blast with it and will play again without a doubt.
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Anonymous
April 13, 2005 8:21:02 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Quote:
From: debaserzero@yahoo.com (debaser)

There is no inventory at all. No armor, no accessories, no nothing...
There's also an amulet that you can affix gems to, I haven't seen it
yet. :Quote

Really. No other weapons (staff, knife, stars) at all. Do you mean just
so far as to what you have played or for the whole game? Is it just
hand combat then?
April 13, 2005 9:35:24 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

QUAKEnSHAKE wrote:
> Quote:
> From: debaserzero@yahoo.com (debaser)
>
> There is no inventory at all. No armor, no accessories, no nothing...
> There's also an amulet that you can affix gems to, I haven't seen it
> yet. :Quote
>
> Really. No other weapons (staff, knife, stars) at all. Do you mean
just
> so far as to what you have played or for the whole game? Is it just
> hand combat then?

As far as I can see, you are allowed only one weapon at a time. The
weapons fall under the styles catagory (Weapons, Martial, Magic,
Transformation, Support), so what I mean is weapons aren't items in the
traditional sense. You won't be collecting lots of arms and armors to
equip.

Can anyone clarify? I'm pretty sure one of the characters mentions this
but I can't remember.
Anonymous
April 14, 2005 1:15:55 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"QUAKEnSHAKE" <QUAKEnSHAKE@webtv.net> wrote in message
news:1369-425D8D3E-98@storefull-3151.bay.webtv.net...
> Quote:
> From: debaserzero@yahoo.com (debaser)
>
> There is no inventory at all. No armor, no accessories, no nothing...
> There's also an amulet that you can affix gems to, I haven't seen it
> yet. :Quote
>
> Really. No other weapons (staff, knife, stars) at all. Do you mean just
> so far as to what you have played or for the whole game? Is it just
> hand combat then?
>

This actually sounds like a refreshing change. I always got sick of having
a packed inventory and spending hours in the inv screen making sure all my
chars had the best/optimal equipment at any given time. Good for us anal
retentive bastards anyways.
Anonymous
April 14, 2005 6:47:59 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

On 13 Apr 2005 17:35:24 -0700, "debaser" <debaserzero@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>
>QUAKEnSHAKE wrote:
>> Quote:
>> From: debaserzero@yahoo.com (debaser)
>>
>> There is no inventory at all. No armor, no accessories, no nothing...
>> There's also an amulet that you can affix gems to, I haven't seen it
>> yet. :Quote
>>
>> Really. No other weapons (staff, knife, stars) at all. Do you mean
>just
>> so far as to what you have played or for the whole game? Is it just
>> hand combat then?
>
>As far as I can see, you are allowed only one weapon at a time. The
>weapons fall under the styles catagory (Weapons, Martial, Magic,
>Transformation, Support), so what I mean is weapons aren't items in the
>traditional sense. You won't be collecting lots of arms and armors to
>equip.
>
>Can anyone clarify? I'm pretty sure one of the characters mentions this
>but I can't remember.

I got the impression that you can have multiple weapons but only one
weapon in any particular class (staff, sword, etc.) so if you buy
another staff, you lose the one you currently have. I'm still very
early in the game so I haven't actually confirmed this, but I believe
the weapons master who gives you your 1st weapon tells you something
along those lines.
April 14, 2005 6:58:56 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"Imperium" <frankmelo@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:lplr51p4ako6lbm0f4sp0crc7vt4hc8p28@4ax.com...
> On 13 Apr 2005 17:35:24 -0700, "debaser" <debaserzero@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
>>
>>QUAKEnSHAKE wrote:
>>> Quote:
>>> From: debaserzero@yahoo.com (debaser)
>>>
>>> There is no inventory at all. No armor, no accessories, no nothing...
>>> There's also an amulet that you can affix gems to, I haven't seen it
>>> yet. :Quote
>>>
>>> Really. No other weapons (staff, knife, stars) at all. Do you mean
>>just
>>> so far as to what you have played or for the whole game? Is it just
>>> hand combat then?
>>
>>As far as I can see, you are allowed only one weapon at a time. The
>>weapons fall under the styles catagory (Weapons, Martial, Magic,
>>Transformation, Support), so what I mean is weapons aren't items in the
>>traditional sense. You won't be collecting lots of arms and armors to
>>equip.
>>
>>Can anyone clarify? I'm pretty sure one of the characters mentions this
>>but I can't remember.
>
> I got the impression that you can have multiple weapons but only one
> weapon in any particular class (staff, sword, etc.) so if you buy
> another staff, you lose the one you currently have. I'm still very
> early in the game so I haven't actually confirmed this, but I believe
> the weapons master who gives you your 1st weapon tells you something
> along those lines.
>

I never understood now RPG's let you carry 10 weapons and three healing
spells, and two potions, etc etc etc...

I mean how many weapons can one person rtealistic carry and still be
effective in combat? I'm thinking a staff and a sword or knife but it's
ridiculous to think one person could carry 10 weapons plus other stuff.
Anonymous
April 14, 2005 8:27:44 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"WJM" <wjmuldowney@NOearthlinkSPAM.net> wrote in message news:Q%k7e.6580

> I never understood now RPG's let you carry 10 weapons and three healing
> spells, and two potions, etc etc etc...
>
> I mean how many weapons can one person rtealistic carry and still be
> effective in combat? I'm thinking a staff and a sword or knife but it's
> ridiculous to think one person could carry 10 weapons plus other stuff.


Suspension of disbelief. If you can believe a person can cast beat up a
dragon, or cast magic, why balk at him carrying whatever he likes? Maybe it
comes and goes by magic as well.

Completely made-up games can get away with anything. Mario eats mushrooms,
grows, spits fireballs, beats up turtles, and flies, so do you care that he
can breathe underwater? Probably not.

On the other hand, games that strive for too much realism often look all the
more ridiculous for it. Once given a dose of realism--say limited inventory
(Sam Fisher can only carry 2 guns), you expect realism in other or all
areas. But Sam Fisher can verbally interrogate someone 2 inches from a
searching guard without being discovered, and walk around in the dark with 3
big glowing lights on his head (and one on his back) without being seen.
That bugs me.
Or another example--Gran Turismo. Real cars, real physics, real racing
techniques, etc, everything's real, no need to suspend disbelief--and it all
falls down when you realize the cars are indestructible, and the CPU cars
are unmovable. In an arcade racer with impossible things going on already
(super acceleration, ridiculous jumps, 100mph hairpins), it's not
remarkable. But in a sim, it's jarring.
April 14, 2005 8:45:02 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Imperium wrote:
> On 13 Apr 2005 17:35:24 -0700, "debaser" <debaserzero@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
>
> >
> >QUAKEnSHAKE wrote:
> >> Quote:
> >> From: debaserzero@yahoo.com (debaser)
> >>
> >> There is no inventory at all. No armor, no accessories, no
nothing...
> >> There's also an amulet that you can affix gems to, I haven't seen
it
> >> yet. :Quote
> >>
> >> Really. No other weapons (staff, knife, stars) at all. Do you mean
> >just
> >> so far as to what you have played or for the whole game? Is it
just
> >> hand combat then?
> >
> >As far as I can see, you are allowed only one weapon at a time. The
> >weapons fall under the styles catagory (Weapons, Martial, Magic,
> >Transformation, Support), so what I mean is weapons aren't items in
the
> >traditional sense. You won't be collecting lots of arms and armors
to
> >equip.
> >
> >Can anyone clarify? I'm pretty sure one of the characters mentions
this
> >but I can't remember.
>
> I got the impression that you can have multiple weapons but only one
> weapon in any particular class (staff, sword, etc.) so if you buy
> another staff, you lose the one you currently have. I'm still very
> early in the game so I haven't actually confirmed this, but I believe
> the weapons master who gives you your 1st weapon tells you
something
> along those lines.


Yeah, Quojin. In regards to upgrading the Weapon style, I wonder if
that applies to all weapons? I just got to chapter 2 and ought to be
finding another weapon soon. I have lots of techniques, styles and gems
but so far just the starter sword. Tien's spade was too slow.

Has anyone figured out harmonic combos?
Anonymous
April 14, 2005 9:05:01 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"Leon Dexter" <leondexterNOSPAM@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:4jm7e.6193$An2.6187@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> "WJM" <wjmuldowney@NOearthlinkSPAM.net> wrote in message news:Q%k7e.6580
>
>> I never understood now RPG's let you carry 10 weapons and three healing
>> spells, and two potions, etc etc etc...
>>
>> I mean how many weapons can one person rtealistic carry and still be
>> effective in combat? I'm thinking a staff and a sword or knife but it's
>> ridiculous to think one person could carry 10 weapons plus other stuff.
>
>
> Suspension of disbelief. If you can believe a person can cast beat up a
> dragon, or cast magic, why balk at him carrying whatever he likes? Maybe
> it
> comes and goes by magic as well.

Well in ancient Chinese folklore, that stuff is just as realistic to them as
George Washington and his cherry tree.

>
> Completely made-up games can get away with anything. Mario eats
> mushrooms,

Happens all the time

> grows,

That too

>spits fireballs,

Halitosis

>beats up turtles,

PETA would be pissed.

> and flies, so do you care that he
> can breathe underwater? Probably not.
>
> On the other hand, games that strive for too much realism often look all
> the
> more ridiculous for it. Once given a dose of realism--say limited
> inventory
> (Sam Fisher can only carry 2 guns), you expect realism in other or all
> areas. But Sam Fisher can verbally interrogate someone 2 inches from a
> searching guard without being discovered, and walk around in the dark with
> 3
> big glowing lights on his head (and one on his back) without being seen.
> That bugs me.

Night Vision Goggles don't actually glow. That is Ubisoft's way of showing
what they are (very poorly I might say).

> Or another example--Gran Turismo. Real cars, real physics, real racing
> techniques, etc, everything's real, no need to suspend disbelief--and it
> all
> falls down when you realize the cars are indestructible, and the CPU cars
> are unmovable. In an arcade racer with impossible things going on already
> (super acceleration, ridiculous jumps, 100mph hairpins), it's not
> remarkable. But in a sim, it's jarring.
>
>
April 14, 2005 10:05:22 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"Leon Dexter" <leondexterNOSPAM@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:4jm7e.6193$An2.6187@newsread2.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> "WJM" <wjmuldowney@NOearthlinkSPAM.net> wrote in message news:Q%k7e.6580
>
>> I never understood now RPG's let you carry 10 weapons and three healing
>> spells, and two potions, etc etc etc...
>>
>> I mean how many weapons can one person rtealistic carry and still be
>> effective in combat? I'm thinking a staff and a sword or knife but it's
>> ridiculous to think one person could carry 10 weapons plus other stuff.
>
>
> Suspension of disbelief. If you can believe a person can cast beat up a
> dragon, or cast magic, why balk at him carrying whatever he likes? Maybe
> it
> comes and goes by magic as well.
>

Um, maybe. And if that's the case then fine but I don't believe that's how
it comes across. I'd be all for a magic spell that allows someone to change
whatever weapon is being carried to something else and the inventory shows
the various spells obtained and which weapons the main weapon could alter
to.


> Completely made-up games can get away with anything. Mario eats
> mushrooms,
> grows, spits fireballs, beats up turtles, and flies, so do you care that
> he
> can breathe underwater? Probably not.
>
> On the other hand, games that strive for too much realism often look all
> the
> more ridiculous for it. Once given a dose of realism--say limited
> inventory
> (Sam Fisher can only carry 2 guns), you expect realism in other or all
> areas. But Sam Fisher can verbally interrogate someone 2 inches from a
> searching guard without being discovered, and walk around in the dark with
> 3
> big glowing lights on his head (and one on his back) without being seen.
> That bugs me.
> Or another example--Gran Turismo. Real cars, real physics, real racing
> techniques, etc, everything's real, no need to suspend disbelief--and it
> all
> falls down when you realize the cars are indestructible, and the CPU cars
> are unmovable. In an arcade racer with impossible things going on already
> (super acceleration, ridiculous jumps, 100mph hairpins), it's not
> remarkable. But in a sim, it's jarring.
>
>
Anonymous
April 14, 2005 11:20:28 PM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"debaser" <debaserzero@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1113438924.801453.304530@o13g2000cwo.googlegroups.com...
>
> QUAKEnSHAKE wrote:
>> Quote:
>> From: debaserzero@yahoo.com (debaser)
>>
>> There is no inventory at all. No armor, no accessories, no nothing...
>> There's also an amulet that you can affix gems to, I haven't seen it
>> yet. :Quote
>>
>> Really. No other weapons (staff, knife, stars) at all. Do you mean
> just
>> so far as to what you have played or for the whole game? Is it just
>> hand combat then?
>
> As far as I can see, you are allowed only one weapon at a time. The
> weapons fall under the styles catagory (Weapons, Martial, Magic,
> Transformation, Support), so what I mean is weapons aren't items in the
> traditional sense. You won't be collecting lots of arms and armors to
> equip.
>
> Can anyone clarify? I'm pretty sure one of the characters mentions this
> but I can't remember.


The reviews indicated that anytime you pick up a new weapon it replaces your
old one automatically if the new one is better.
Anonymous
April 15, 2005 3:52:57 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"Mattinglyfan" <Estoscacahuates@comcast.net (deez nuts)> wrote in message
news:tP-


> >spits fireballs,
>
> Halitosis

Ha ha.



> Night Vision Goggles don't actually glow. That is Ubisoft's way of
showing
> what they are (very poorly I might say).

I know they don't. They're also not red or blue, like they are in SC
multiplayer. I understand what they're trying to do--look cool--but it just
looks stupid. And it doesn't explain the big light on his back, either. Or
his ability to interrogate people without going somewhere he won't be heard.
Anonymous
April 15, 2005 4:05:48 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

"WJM" <wjmuldowney@NOearthlinkSPAM.net> wrote in message news:Chy7e.5563

> Um, maybe. And if that's the case then fine but I don't believe that's how
> it comes across. I'd be all for a magic spell that allows someone to
change
> whatever weapon is being carried to something else and the inventory shows
> the various spells obtained and which weapons the main weapon could alter
> to.

No, I agree. Some simple explanation, no matter how trivial, can justify
the largest of what would otherwise be glaring flaws. Like Star Trek--oh,
we have a universal translator. Okay, stupid explanation, but it allows us
to forget about language and watch the story.

I'm just saying that it's not a big deal, first because we've seen unlimited
inventory for years, so we should be fairly used to it--and developers most
likely assume nobody cares. And second, because recent games that limit
your inventory in "realistic" ways fall flat in other areas of "realism".
It's nigh-impossible to have a 100% realistic game without ruining it. It's
better to use shortcuts and suspension of disbelief in a lot of areas, but
make an enjoyable game.
Anonymous
April 15, 2005 7:53:19 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

On 14 Apr 2005 04:45:02 -0700, "debaser" <debaserzero@yahoo.com>
wrote:

>
>Imperium wrote:
>> On 13 Apr 2005 17:35:24 -0700, "debaser" <debaserzero@yahoo.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >
>> >QUAKEnSHAKE wrote:
>> >> Quote:
>> >> From: debaserzero@yahoo.com (debaser)
>> >>
>> >> There is no inventory at all. No armor, no accessories, no
>nothing...
>> >> There's also an amulet that you can affix gems to, I haven't seen
>it
>> >> yet. :Quote
>> >>
>> >> Really. No other weapons (staff, knife, stars) at all. Do you mean
>> >just
>> >> so far as to what you have played or for the whole game? Is it
>just
>> >> hand combat then?
>> >
>> >As far as I can see, you are allowed only one weapon at a time. The
>> >weapons fall under the styles catagory (Weapons, Martial, Magic,
>> >Transformation, Support), so what I mean is weapons aren't items in
>the
>> >traditional sense. You won't be collecting lots of arms and armors
>to
>> >equip.
>> >
>> >Can anyone clarify? I'm pretty sure one of the characters mentions
>this
>> >but I can't remember.
>>
>> I got the impression that you can have multiple weapons but only one
>> weapon in any particular class (staff, sword, etc.) so if you buy
>> another staff, you lose the one you currently have. I'm still very
>> early in the game so I haven't actually confirmed this, but I believe
>> the weapons master who gives you your 1st weapon tells you
>something
>> along those lines.
>
>
>Yeah, Quojin. In regards to upgrading the Weapon style, I wonder if
>that applies to all weapons? I just got to chapter 2 and ought to be
>finding another weapon soon. I have lots of techniques, styles and gems
>but so far just the starter sword. Tien's spade was too slow.
>
>Has anyone figured out harmonic combos?

The harmonic combo system seems to be fairly basic and not nearly as
twitchy as I initially thought.

You can look in the style description screen to find out which styles
can initiate and which ones can end a harmonic combo. Basically some
magic or support styles can start a combo and a martial style ends it.

To start a combo all you need to do is hard hit an opponent with a
style than can start a combo. After you hit your opponent, you'll
see a timer of bars around the enemy highlight start to count down.
If you hard hit the opponent before the timer ends with a technique
that can end a combo, you'll pull off a special attack that usually
kills the enemy and you'll receive one of those balls that will return
some of your health, chi or focus.

With my character, Heavenly Wave will start the combo and Legendary
fist will end it and give me a health power up. Ice Shard and
Legendary Fist results in a chi power up. There are probably some
hidden combos that will give you other power ups but they all probably
work the same way.

The OXM review of Jade Empire said they never used harmonic combos. I
don't think they're necessary but after I widdle down a group to one
or two, I try to use a combo to replenish my health or chi if I'm low.
April 15, 2005 8:11:38 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

Imperium wrote:
> On 14 Apr 2005 04:45:02 -0700, "debaser" <debaserzero@yahoo.com>
> wrote:
> >Has anyone figured out harmonic combos?
>
> The harmonic combo system seems to be fairly basic and not nearly as
> twitchy as I initially thought.
>
> You can look in the style description screen to find out which
styles
> can initiate and which ones can end a harmonic combo. Basically some
> magic or support styles can start a combo and a martial style ends
it.
>
> To start a combo all you need to do is hard hit an opponent with a
> style than can start a combo. After you hit your opponent, you'll
> see a timer of bars around the enemy highlight start to count down.
> If you hard hit the opponent before the timer ends with a technique
> that can end a combo, you'll pull off a special attack that usually
> kills the enemy and you'll receive one of those balls that will
return
> some of your health, chi or focus.
>
> With my character, Heavenly Wave will start the combo and Legendary
> fist will end it and give me a health power up. Ice Shard and
> Legendary Fist results in a chi power up. There are probably some
> hidden combos that will give you other power ups but they all
probably
> work the same way.
>
> The OXM review of Jade Empire said they never used harmonic combos.
I
> don't think they're necessary but after I widdle down a group to one
> or two, I try to use a combo to replenish my health or chi if I'm
low.

Last night I tried that at the tea house but couldn't get it to work. I
used both Heavenly Wave and Dire Flame heavy attacks and no timers
appeared.
April 15, 2005 8:24:14 AM

Archived from groups: alt.games.video.xbox (More info?)

>
>
>>beats up turtles,
>
>
> PETA would be pissed.
>
LOL, that reminds me of the PETA south park episode.
!